Jamboree Merit Badges
Stan
a question (actually a follow-up from a discussion we had a few months
about the Scoutmaster telling the Scouts who the merit badge counselor
will be for a badge they want to earn) about the "white sheets" or
"yellow sheets" the boys got from the Jamboree.
First, I'm a Merit Badge counselor, and in any reasonable source of
information (like Scouting Magazine or any notification from my
Council), I have seen NOTHING about these Yellow Sheets and what's
expected of me if a boy comes to me with a "partial".
Second, this absence of "procedures for Merit Badge counselors"
affects, and more so, what we're supposed to do if a boy comes back
with a completed Yellow Sheet. Nobody has told us that they are the
"same thing" as Blue Cards; meaning, that "officially", we don't know
if we're to honor them as signed off Blue Cards or tell the boy to see
a local counselor and get him to sign a Blue Card.
Now, in the absence of such information, what my Troop will do is-
1. For any merit badge that we really don't care who the merit badge
counselor is, we'll honor a completed Yellow Sheet as a signed Blue
Card.
2. For the seven MB's that we will explicitly choose the counselor
whom the boy is to see (these are the 3 Citizenships, the 2 Personals,
Family Life, and Communications), we're going to tell the boy that he's
going to need to call the local counselor and, one way or another, get
the Blue Card signed by him, and that the boy should expect at least a
partial retest and discussion of the requirements.
So, have Merit Badge Counselors, Troop Committee Chairs, and
Scoutmasters ever been "officially" told by any "official" BSA source
that the Yellow Sheets are "official" Blue Cards, and that a completed
sheet doesn't require a Blue Card, and that a partial sheet are areas
the boy shouldn't be retested on?
Thanks,
Stan Krieger
Eagle Advisor
Paul S. Wolf
Stan, how many times do you have to be told that you and your troop
cannot adopt rules stricter than BSA's?
We were told by BSA AT THE JAMBOREE that the yellow sheets were to be
considered as "Applications for Merit Badges" just as if they were "Blue
cards", and that, for the duration of the Jamboree, the rule about
getting the SM's approval in advance was waived. The same rules were
used in each of the preceding Jambos I've staffed (1985, 1989, 2001, &
2005) although the forms were different.
All Yellow sheets are to be considered as completed or partial merit
badges, as indicate on the forms. The Scout had tacit approval given by
his JAMBO Scoutmaster, who, for that period, had such authority.
All Yellow sheets were signed by REGISTERED Merit Badge Counselors.
(i.e registered as such in their home councils.)
You may NOT deny the Scout the badge simply because YOU have adopted a
rule that contradicts BSA's rules. If he has a completed merit badge
application (and that's what the form is), he has earned the badge.
If you want official confirmation of this, I'd suggest you call or write
Terry Lawson, Director of Boy Scout Advancement, at BSA HQ - 972-580-2436.
--
Yours in Scouting,
Paul S. Wolf, P.E. mailto:pw...@usscouts.org
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Traffic Safety Merit Badge Staff 2001-2005 Jamborees
Bruce E. Cobern
"Paul S. Wolf" <paul....@alum.wpi.edu> wrote in message
news:5IqdneixrJg...@adelphia.com...
> We were told by BSA AT THE JAMBOREE that the yellow sheets were
> to be considered as "Applications for Merit Badges" just as if
> they were "Blue cards", and that, for the duration of the
> Jamboree, the rule about getting the SM's approval in advance
> was waived. The same rules were used in each of the preceding
> Jambos I've staffed (1985, 1989, 2001, & 2005) although the
> forms were different.
You, as a merit badge counselor, were told that, and MAYBE the
people attending the Jamboree were also told that, but where did
national say that OFFICIALLY and communicate that to all of the
home troop SM's who, it appears, are now stuck accepting
performance that they would prefer not to accept? It can't be a
rule until you communicate it to those who are going to be
expected to abide by it. How does that support the system that
was designed to allow the SM who knows the Scout best to be the
gatekeeper on the quality of the advancement in his troop?
> All Yellow sheets are to be considered as completed or partial
> merit badges, as indicate on the forms. The Scout had tacit
> approval given by his JAMBO Scoutmaster, who, for that period,
> had such authority.
So, now tacit approval is acceptable for merit badges? Where, in
writing, in official material available to ALL leaders, does it
say that? And where does it say that the Jamboree SM has the
authority to approve a Scout to take a mb? I've heard here that
councils actually charter their Jamboree troops for the week, but
have never seen that here, just like a summer camp provisional
troop is never chartered.
Frankly, there is absolutely no reason for national to do all of
this (if in fact they have) and it is absolutely reprehensible,
IMO, for them to decide that all of the rules that they have
carefully crafted don't apply when THEY run an event, just
because the CAN. The real solution is to go back to the
situation as it was before 1989 (or maybe it was 85) when the
merit badge midway served only to introduce Scouts to the mb
subjects and there was no such thing as earning merit badges or
partials at Jamboree.
If, as a SM, I had specifically told my Jamboree Scouts that they
could NOT take certain (or any) merit badges at the Jamboree, and
they came back with those badges, they wouldn't get them awarded
from me, because my specific denial of approval would trump the
Jamboree SM's tacit approval, as far as I was concerned, and I'd
be prepared to fight that one all the way up to Terry and beyond.
If there was no communication to the Scouts going to the Jamboree
about what I, as SM, was willing to accept, then the issue is
less clear.
Time to get off my soapbox.
--
Bruce E. Cobern
Advancement Chairman, Founders District
Queens Council, NY
mailto:b...@pipeline.com
Stephen Henning
> So, have Merit Badge Counselors, Troop Committee Chairs, and
> Scoutmasters ever been "officially" told by any "official" BSA source
> that the Yellow Sheets are "official" Blue Cards, and that a completed
> sheet doesn't require a Blue Card, and that a partial sheet are areas
> the boy shouldn't be retested on?
Your procedure sounds completely acceptable. Since the yellow sheet was
not signed by the troop Scoutmaster, it is not the same as a completed
Blue Card. For more information on the yellow sheets, contact the
jamboree contingent Scoutmaster that took your Scouts to the Jamboree.
That is just proper Scoutmaster to Scoutmaster communication. They will
be more than happy to help you out.
--
Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to rhod...@earthlink.net
Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA USA
http://home.earthlink.net/~rhodyman
Stan
a Troop Rank Advancement Coordinator, was never told this by BSA, and
I'm sure of all the thousands of MB Counselors, Scoutmasters, and Troop
Advancement people in the U.S.A., I'm not the only one who wasn't told
about this through any official BSA channel. Even the sources that
people provided in the earlier thread that say that the Scoutmaster
selects the MB Counselor doesn't say "except for those boys attending
the National Jamboree".
What this is like, using an industrial parallel, is the boss appointing
someone as a "Team Leader", not telling anyone except the person being
appointed, and then taking action against those who told the "Team
Leader" where he could go when he started "acting as though he were the
boss".
Incidentally the way I found out about this, and as far as I'm
concerned, both are unofficial channels, were-
1. Your postings on news:rec.scouting.usa, and
2. A very nasty letter from our District Commissioner, after we
reiterated our Troop policy on the 7 non-camp Eagles to the boy who
went to Camp MeritBadgeMill 2 years ago for 3 of these badges (and this
person is simply not a credible source; I've previously caught him
quoting "BSA policy" on the fly).
In any event, thanks for the clarification. At least I now know what
Jambo attendees were told.
Stan Krieger
Eagle Advisor
Stan
hour on www.scouting.org trying to find an official BSA statement about
Jambo yellow sheets overriding Troop-issued blue cards.
The only thing I found about the Merit Badge Midway was that only
registered Jamboree attendees, and not any visiting Scouts, were
allowed to participate. None of my various searches yielded any info
whatsover about these Yellow Sheets (and even as late as June, our
District Commissioners nastygram to us called them "White Sheets"), not
even a mention of them, let alone any sort of "Troop and MB Counselors
must accept these" statement.
I'm more upset as to why BSA is keeping such a fundamental advancement
policy such a big secret.
Stan Krieger
Eagle Advisor
Sohn
JohnO
As an afterthought, if the Jambo troop SM signed off on all this, shouldn't
the Jambo troop finish the process, too? Give the yellow sheet to their
advancement chair, (that would be the key to my thought here) let them
submit it to council. I mean, they want the authority to start the badge but
won't take the responsibility to present it. Doesn't sound right to me.
I too don't like the idea of earning anything other than elective merit
badges at Jambo.
-John O
Stan
> Both my sons attended the National Jamboree but, chose not to earn any
> Merit Badges. We were told at contingent planning meeting about the
> Merit Badge policy. I informed our Scoutmaster of the policy. In my
> opinion it was not only the responsibility of the BSA to inform
> Scoutmasters but, also the responsibility of Scouts and parents to
> inform their Scoutmasters.
First of all, it's more than just Scoutmasters. In my role as an MB
Counselor for the three Citizenships, I have "officially" received no
information whatsoever about what I'm supposed to do or "allowed" to do
if a boy comes to me with a Jambo Yellow Sheet that's a "partial", and
as I already said, I can't even get this info from BSA's own website!
As far as "Yellow Sheet = Blue Card", based ONLY on what I got from
this newsgroup, I had to explain to our Scoutmaster, Advancement
Chairman, and Troop Committee Chairman that we can record, based on
only the Yellow Sheets (which up until our Troop Committee Mtg a few
days ago, I thought were White Sheets) the elective badges that one of
our Eagle Scouts got at Jambo. As far as the other Scout from our
Troop, even before the end of the school year, he accepted the reality
that for any Eagle-required badges, the only document we're going to
accept from him is the Blue Card signed by the MB Counselor whose name
we wrote on that card (and if he has a Yellow Sheet, work it out with
the MB Counselor, who like me, probably received ZERO direction from
BSA on how he's supposed to handle it).
On top of this, I had previously received assurances from our Council
Advancement Chairman that Troops can assign the MB Counselor (this was
an answer to my question about my own Council's Trail-to-Eagle
program).
Stan Krieger
Eagle Advisor
Paul S. Wolf
The forms, BTW, were two part NCR forms. The top sheet, which was
retained and turned in to MBM HQ, was white, and the second sheet, which
was given to the Scouts, was yellow.
Stephen Henning
> First of all, it's more than just Scoutmasters. In my role as an MB
> Counselor for the three Citizenships, I have "officially" received no
> information whatsoever about what I'm supposed to do or "allowed" to do
> if a boy comes to me with a Jambo Yellow Sheet that's a "partial", and
> as I already said, I can't even get this info from BSA's own website!
This is not true. As a registered merit badge counselor it is left to
your judgment to accept what you think the Scout has done to earn the
merit badges you council. That has always been true. If the Scout
submits evidence that he has done the work, it is up to you to either
accept or reject this. It is your responsibility to make this decision.
--
Pardon my spam deterrent; send email to scou...@earthlink.net
Cheers, Steve Henning in Reading, PA USA
Stephen Henning
> As an afterthought, if the Jambo troop SM signed off on all this, shouldn't
> the Jambo troop finish the process, too? Give the yellow sheet to their
> advancement chair, (that would be the key to my thought here) let them
> submit it to council. I mean, they want the authority to start the badge but
> won't take the responsibility to present it. Doesn't sound right to me.
You are correct in this. If a Scout earns a rank or merit badge in
another troop, the troop he transfers to need not accept work done in
the other troop unless they are satisfied themselves that the work was
completed satisfactorily unless the rank was submitted on an advancement
form and recorded. This should fall under that procedure unless spelled
out differently.
Stan
> I too don't like the idea of earning anything other than elective merit
> badges at Jambo.
This now opens up an entirely new discussion.
I just finished Cit/World with a Scout from a Troop in a neighboring
town. To say he was well-prepared and knowledgable understates his
performance, but there were a few things that bothered me about his
Troop. His buddy was one of his parents, who is also his Troop's
Advancement Chairman, so I was able to have some sort of policy
discussion.
First, the boy was not in uniform. When I mentioned it to him, parent
replied that "in our Troop, 'our' counselors don't require the boys to
be in uniform."
Second, the reason the boy was seeing me was that 'their' counselor,
who 'normally' does the 3 Citizenships for their Troop, has been
unavailable for a while due to known personal reasons. When I
mentioned that in my Troop, we limit the number of Eagle-req'd badges
we'll let a boy get from an in-Troop counselor to 2 or 3 (and went on
about making the boy use the phone and meet new people), parent told me
that they have registered counselors in-Troop for all of them, and
that's whom their boys usually see (at which point, I started getting
sick).
So, is there now a trend, that I'm missing, from making the boys work
on their own for most of their non-camp Eagle badges (which was
indoctrinated into me 18 years ago, when I was thrust into the Troop
Advancement Chairman role) to providing classes and programs for them,
where they just need to be good students to get those badges?
Stan Krieger
Eagle Advisor
Advancement Chairman Emeritus
clkel...@msn.com
This way we can ensure the quality of the teaching. Yes, the counselors
hold classes, (one required badge per quarter, and one fun badge per
quarter, (the troop chooses these at their annual planning meeting)).
However, the counselors set things up where not everything can be done
just by attending class (usually 3 classes, one each month), and the
Scouts have to do work on their own and contact the counselor on their
own to finish things up.
We have taken the "meet knew folks" out of the equation, but the
instruction is top notch, and we also require the Scouts to take lots
of their own iniative in completing the badges. For example, on the
Citizenship badges, we don't hold a group trip to the Council meeting.
We don't sit down with them to write a letter to their Congressman.
Anything they have to look up, we don't tell them where specifically to
find the information.