Trip report on the C&TS
Jim Stover
narrow gauge railroad. It runs between Chama NM and Antonito CO. There are
trips from either end for the full distance or to the middle and back. We rode
from Chama to the mid-point and back.
The rail yard at Chama contains the remains of the Rio Grande railroad and has
a large amount of equipment you can explore, including 2 snow plows, 2 crane cars,
lots of rolling stock, box cars, tank cars, etc. All is readily accessable. The
actual train consists of two steam engines, 6 passager cars, snack car, 4 box
cars with windows and plastic seats and one open car. The station has no water,
so bring your own! We boarded the train and pulled out at 10:30.
Just outside of the station, the front engine went ahead over a trestle that
is too weak for two engines. We rejoined on the other side and started up a
4% grade. The view is beautiful as we climbed through aspens. The best view is from
between cars or the open car. There are a number of switch backs where you can
see the whole train.
Along the way we saw another engine, a few cars, a flat car with a polished
and painted Gatling gun and a caboose on the siding. There was also a "movie
set" station, "settlers", cowboys and a film crew making a video or commercial.
This is also the section where "Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade" was filmed.
At the highest point (10,016 feet) at Cumbres, we took on 3,500 gallons of water.
The coal car holds 5,000. We dropped the front engine off at a siding and were
on our own. There is a turn-around for the engine and the remains of a snow
cover over the track. At one time the whole area was covered, but the track is
all exposed now.
There is one more trestle before the mid-point. At Osier we met the other
train and exchanged engines. No turn around here! You can bring your lunch or
eat lunch in a large hall. After an hour we reboarded and were on our way
home. The movie crew was still there going strong.
There are lots of beautiful views and a number of interesting sights along the
way. Four cows ran across the track and we almost had steak for lunch. Another
group of cows ran along side the train for a while. We also saw one deer.
On the half of the trip that we did not take there is a tunnel and
another trestle to cross. All along the way were people taking pictures of us.
The steam engines were unusual in that there were counter weights on the wheels
where the connecting rods attach. Is this normal? We also saw several water tanks
that were filled from mountain streams. On a later part of our vacation we went to
a museum that has a collect of wind mills, including a 22 1/2 foot "railroad"
wind mill. The largest "railroad" wind mills were 30 foot across. Are there
any "railroad" wind mills still running? Any remains? Where were they used and
how much could they pump? Does anybody model them? What's the net wisdom on them?
The trip is great and the C&TS is expecting 60,00 passengers this year. Make your
reservations early and bring jacket, water and lunch. I would suggest that C&TS move
some of the equipment out where people can see it better. As it was there were only
4 or 5 of us who ventured back to see the old equipment. Also it would be nice if
there were a good railroad museum with memorabilia. That might take some big bucks.
All in all a **** experience! (:-).
James T. Stover
sto...@asl.dl.nec.com
--
-- jim, sto...@asl.dl.nec.com (x3501)
Joke captioning for the humor impaired by Jokes-R-Us (Previously We-B-Jokes)!
BRANDT_JOBS...@hplomg.hpl.hp.com
> Just outside of the station, the front engine went ahead over a trestle that
> is too weak for two engines. We rejoined on the other side and started up a
> 4% grade. The view is beautiful as we climbed through aspens. The best view
> is from between cars or the open car. There are a number of switch backs
> where you can see the whole train.
I think you mean S-bends. I don't recall any switchbacks on this route. A
switchback consists of pair of switches at the ends of a piece of track on
which the train backs up and then reverses again to continue when climbing
steep terrain where there is no room for sweeping turns.
I think it is worth mentioning that the train climbs along the rim of Toltec
Gorge where it goes through a short tunnel before going on to Cumbres Pass
where there is an old station and wye for turning helpers and snow plows.
The gorge is apparently bottomless because, although one can see far down,
the bottom is not visible from the train. I am glad to hear that the rail
equipment has found its way to Chama. When I last saw it, this stuff was lying
around Alamosa and much of it (heaps of axles and trucks) went to the scrap
yard by the pound.
BRANDT_JOBS...@hplomg.hpl.hp.com
Nick Leverton
<920723073...@hplomg.hpl.hp.com> :-) BRANDT_JOBST/HP19...@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM
wrote:
>I think you mean S-bends. I don't recall any switchbacks on this route. A
>switchback consists of pair of switches at the ends of a piece of track on
>which the train backs up and then reverses again to continue when climbing
>steep terrain where there is no room for sweeping turns.
Interesting linguistic difference. A switchback in non-US usage is a
very hilly road, which gives a ride like one receives on a roller
coaster (I bet that's different in the US too :-)). What you describe,
we would probably call a reversing station or a Z (pron. zed :-))
I can't remember seeing any references to this sort of setup in the UK,
but it was not uncommon in colonial railways, for instance the Darjeeling
Himalaya line in India and Aliwal North to Barkly East in South Africa,
both of which are still in use and both with revenue-earning steam !
Nick Leverton
______________________________________________________________________
<nlev...@cix.compulink.co.uk> <lev...@warren.demon.co.uk>
X400: I=NJ; S=Leverton; OU=mdn0402; O=ICL; PRMD=ICL; ADMD=Gold 400; C=GB
Mark Brader
> > on which the train backs up and then reverses again to continue when
> > climbing steep terrain where there is no room for sweeping turns.
>
> Interesting linguistic difference. A switchback in non-US usage is a very
I agree with the first definition, but not the second. I think a switchback
road refers specifically to one which climbs a hillside by a series of sharp
"hairpin" turns. Traveling along this road, you will see the hill going
steeply down to your left for a while, then to your right, then left and
so on -- all the same hill. This sort of road, which is common wherever
there are mountains, is effectively a direct "translation to the road idiom"
of the switchback railway, replacing the reversing switches by hairpins.
I think it's obvious that the term originates with the railway.
Some railways follow a similar path, though the curves are necessarily
less sharp than would typically be used on roads. Although switches are
not involved, it doesn't seem a totally unreasonable usage to accept the
term "switchback" for these.
> What you describe, we would probably call a reversing station or a Z
> (pron. zed :-))
I believe the standard term for a railway switchback outside North America
is zigzag. At least, I've heard of specific examples in Australia and India
that were so named.
--
Mark Brader "... there is no such word as 'impossible' in
SoftQuad Inc., Toronto my dictionary. In fact, everything between
utzoo!sq!msb 'herring' and 'marmalade' appears to be missing."
m...@sq.com -- Douglas Adams: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency
This article is in the public domain.
Nick Leverton
> > Interesting linguistic difference. A switchback in non-US usage is a very
> > hilly road, which gives a ride like one receives on a roller coaster ..
>
> I agree with the first definition, but not the second.
I stand by my description as far as British usage goes :-) It refers to
an up-and-down ride, not an upwards-by-means-of-zig-zags one.
However I agree with zig-zag as a term for what we were discussing: it
just slipped my mind the other night.
John Hurst
>> > A switchback consists of pair of switches at the ends of a piece of track
>> > on which the train backs up and then reverses again to continue when
>> > climbing steep terrain where there is no room for sweeping turns.
>>
>> Interesting linguistic difference. A switchback in non-US usage is a very
>> hilly road, which gives a ride like one receives on a roller coaster ..
>I agree with the first definition, but not the second. I think a switchback
> ...
>Some railways follow a similar path, though the curves are necessarily
>less sharp than would typically be used on roads. Although switches are
>not involved, it doesn't seem a totally unreasonable usage to accept the
>term "switchback" for these.
>> What you describe, we would probably call a reversing station or a Z
>> (pron. zed :-))
>I believe the standard term for a railway switchback outside North America
>is zigzag. At least, I've heard of specific examples in Australia and India
>that were so named.
>--
>Mark Brader "... there is no such word as 'impossible' in
>SoftQuad Inc., Toronto my dictionary. In fact, everything between
>utzoo!sq!msb 'herring' and 'marmalade' appears to be missing."
>m...@sq.com -- Douglas Adams: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency
The term used in Australia is indeed Zig-Zag, and there were two on the main
western line out of Sydney, but were replaced by re-alignments around the turn
of the century. The more remote one has recently been restored, and has a
regular steam service running up and down it.
John Hurst
ComSci, Monash U.
--
John Hurst a...@bruce.cs.monash.edu.au
Department of Computer Science +61 3 565 5192
Monash University
BRANDT_JOBS...@hplomg.hpl.hp.com
> Some railways follow a similar path, though the curves are necessarily
> less sharp than would typically be used on roads. Although switches are
> not involved, it doesn't seem a totally unreasonable usage to accept the
> term "switchback" for these.
It seems to me that in the context of rec.railroad the term switchback be
used to mean a zig zag up a grade with switches at the ends. For the non
railroader the general meaning that the path, whether road or rail, has
tight turns at the ends of the traverses may convey the meaning but
then that's what happens to English. We have innumerable words that by
such vagueness have lost their definition such as "momentarily" which
means of short duration but is used to mean "any moment" as in soon.
Bimonthly and semimonthly now carry the same definition in American
dictionaries although "semi" means half (two weeks) and "bi" means two
as in two months. The list is long and we on rec.railroad need not toss
in more words that have clear and specific origins. The term switchback
certainly conjures up a specific picture to me. Maybe that is because I
have traveled on such track. It is after all a railroad term that has
been applied to roads.
Mark Brader
> > > hilly road, which gives a ride like one receives on a roller coaster ..
> > I agree with the first definition, but not the second.
> I stand by my description as far as British usage goes :-) It refers to
> an up-and-down ride, not an upwards-by-means-of-zig-zags one.
And indeed, I just happened to notice in John Glover's "London's Underground"
an example of this usage in a rail context. On the deep-level tube lines
it is often arranged that the line goes downhill and then uphill between
stations, and Glover calls this a "switchback profile".
--
Mark Brader "Doing the wrong thing is worse than doing nothing."
SoftQuad Inc., Toronto "Doing *anything* is worse than doing nothing!"
utzoo!sq!msb, m...@sq.com -- Lynn & Jay: YES, PRIME MINISTER
BRANDT_JOBS...@hplomg.hpl.hp.com
< I can't remember seeing any references to this sort of setup in the UK,
< but it was not uncommon in colonial railways, for instance the Darjeeling
< Himalaya line in India and Aliwal North to Barkly East in South Africa,
< both of which are still in use and both with revenue-earning steam !
On that note, what do you know about this legendary Darjeeling RR. Is it
still running? is it 2 foot gauge? I have heard rumors that it is dead or
near death.
Nick Leverton
BRANDT_JOBST/HP19...@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM wrote:
> On that note, what do you know about this legendary Darjeeling RR. Is it
> still running? is it 2 foot gauge? I have heard rumors that it is dead or
> near death.
My most recent info information is a couple of years old, and my visit
was 6 years ago, but as such here it is:
The Darjeeling Himalaya Line of India's North West Frontier division is
indeed 2' gauge, and as far as I know it is still running.
The death of the DHR has been predicted every year since I can remember.
Each year it suffers a track wash-out during heavy rain, which leads to
its temporary closure for a few days or weeks. So far it has always
recovered. When I visited it in 1986, it was closed due to one such, but
re-opened whilst our party was in Darjeeling. We hired Land Rover taxis
and went thundering down to meet the first uphill train.
This was very worthwhile indeed, because there had been no rail traffic
for six weeks and the track was covered with mud. It was possible to
walk in front of the train, filming the fireman sanding the rails from
the front bufferbeam, and taking close-up shots of the frantically
spinning wheels and connecting rods. When the track cleared up you
simply hopped on the guard's van as it passed you by at about 4mph.
The normal service is better regulated, I believe, and you can't hop on
and off like this. But you can still chase the trains in Land Rovers
because the track runs parallel to the mountain road for most of its
length, and road traffic usually achieves a much higher speed (at some
risk to life and limb ;-)) I also have some wonderful film from the
front of a Landie of a train weaving backwards and forwards in front of
us as the line crossed and recrossed the road. And that's not to mention
lineside shots of all descriptions, filming from the train, the several
zig-zags and circular loops where the line crosses over itself, etc etc.
The most disturbing rumour I've heard about the DHR was the possibility
that most of the steam might be replaced by diesel railbuses. These
would work the majority of services, leaving only one or two through
trains from the plains to be worked by steam for the benefit of
tourists.
I would thoroughly recommend a visit. I don't know the best time to go,
though: we went in May and found lowland India unbearably hot, whilst
the mountains, though cool, were almost permanently cloud-covered so we
saw very little of the scenery for which the Darjeeling line is famous.
But go, please go. You won't regret it. Darjeeling itself is worth a
visit as a typical relic of the British Raj, too.
P.S. The lower terminus of the line, New Jalpaiguri, has (or had when we
were there) steam workings on three gauges: 2', metre and 4' 8 1/2". It
is also the dirtiest and smelliest station on Indian Railways, and
believe me that is saying something .....
Nick Leverton
--
Nick Leverton
BRANDT_JOBST/HP19...@HPLOMG.HPL.HP.COM wrote:
> ... We have innumerable words that by
> such vagueness have lost their definition such as "momentarily" which
> means of short duration but is used to mean "any moment" as in soon.
That's another word which seems to have become corrupted in American
usage. When in the States I found it very jarring to be told that our
flight would be departing momentarily. Departure is by definition a
momentary condition ...
Nick Leverton (Eng.Lang. A-grade, Distinction in Use of English, and
Honourable Mention in Blowing Own Trumpet :-)
Test
>
[Lots of good stuff deleted]
>
My girlfriend used to live in Darjeeling, so I thought I would pass on
some additional information.
~
The trip from the base of the mountains (Siliguri) to Darjeeling takes
7 to 8 hours to cover roughly 75 kilos. The train completes a 360
degree loop near the top of the line in what is known as the "Batasia
Loop".
>I would thoroughly recommend a visit. I don't know the best time to go,
>though: we went in May and found lowland India unbearably hot, whilst
>the mountains, though cool, were almost permanently cloud-covered so we
>saw very little of the scenery for which the Darjeeling line is famous.
>But go, please go. You won't regret it. Darjeeling itself is worth a
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>visit as a typical relic of the British Raj, too.
^^^^^
They also make the best tea in the world!
Chuck McCormick (chu...@wam.umd.edu)
"Cast a cold eye on life, on death. Horseman, pass by!" W.B. Yeats