ok who made texas stars?
shadow u
ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?
Ramrod
<HTML>
Galaxy may want to make claim to building Texas Star amps to make points,
but just look inside any T.S. amp and it will be obvious to a blind man.
Just compare to two in workmanship and this thread is dead. You must be
that guy that bought all those bridges and that swamp land in Florida.
Don't listen to some voice on a phone telling you bullshit and then reprint
it on the newsgroups. Get the facts first.
<P>shadow u wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think
did?</BLOCKQUOTE>
</HTML>
Ramrod
Ramrod
Ramrod
Professor
Texas Star is a "black market" company... They setup production until they
are discovered by the authorities(FCC) and then they get shut down and
fined. They lay low for a while and then resurface in another city. Their
operation has little or no quality control... and their products show it!
But since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.
--
Professor
"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
_________________________________________
shadow u wrote in message <346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...
Ramrod
<HTML>
Right here is more evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks from
the knowledge of "I heard this from" and " This is what I was told
" instead of any factual backround. Tell me Mr. P,
<BR>What cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in?
<BR>Just how does their operation work?
<BR>What in their products show little or no Q.C.?
<BR>I have owned many T.S. amps which I have sent back for repair. These
amps are refurbished to new condition right down to the plastic bag and
box. This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your future postings.
I would like to hear from any other Texas Star owners that have had good
or bad experiences with there amps.
<P>Professor wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Texas Star is a "black market" company... They setup
production until they
<BR>are discovered by the authorities(FCC) and then they get shut down
and
<BR>fined. They lay low for a while and then resurface in another city.
Their
<BR>operation has little or no quality control... and their products show
it!
<BR>But since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.
<P>--
<BR>Professor
<BR>"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
<BR>_________________________________________
<BR>shadow u wrote in message <346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...
<BR>>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?</BLOCKQUOTE>
</HTML>
SEAN / BIGFOOT
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texas star produced excellent quality products (once they got their =
feet wet). the earlier versions way back when, such as the old =
outcomm's and early models did have some poor points, but they were =
overall pretty solid units. the more current models were great little =
boxes, but had the potential for even more power. this of course would =
sacrifice some of the reliability factor. the distributor that i deal =
with used to give me a one year factory warranty on these units. the =
only other company that i knew of that gave a factory warranty on =
linears was tnt, but they didn't cover finals. from what i know of =
texas star, they have only had two different places of production. from =
what my sources say, texas star is terminally bye-bye. just mark me as =
another satisfied texas star owner. you should get yours while they are =
still available and maybe even reasonably priced. Sean aka Bigfoot
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<P><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3DArial size=3D2> texas star produced =
excellent=20
quality products (once they got their feet wet). the earlier =
versions way=20
back when, such as the old outcomm's and early models did have some poor =
points,=20
but they were overall pretty solid units. the more current models =
were=20
great little boxes, but had the potential for even more power. =
this of=20
course would sacrifice some of the reliability factor. the =
distributor=20
that i deal with used to give me a one year factory warranty on these=20
units. the only other company that i knew of that gave a factory =
warranty=20
on linears was tnt, but they didn't cover finals. from what i know =
of=20
texas star, they have only had two different places of production. =
from=20
what my sources say, texas star is terminally bye-bye. just mark =
me as=20
another satisfied texas star owner. you should get yours while =
they are=20
still available and maybe even reasonably priced. Sean aka=20
Bigfoot</FONT></P></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BCF3BB.7C5F8540--
Professor
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OK ramrod, if they are a legitimate company as you say what is their =
address?
Professor
"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
_________________________________________
Ramrod wrote in message <34711523...@lords.com>...
Right here is more evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He =
speaks from the knowledge of "I heard this from" and " This is what I =
was told " instead of any factual backround. Tell me Mr. P,=20
What cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in?=20
Just how does their operation work?=20
What in their products show little or no Q.C.?=20
I have owned many T.S. amps which I have sent back for repair. These =
amps are refurbished to new condition right down to the plastic bag and =
box. This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your future postings. =
I would like to hear from any other Texas Star owners that have had good =
or bad experiences with there amps.=20
Professor wrote:=20
=20
Texas Star is a "black market" company... They setup production =
until they=20
are discovered by the authorities(FCC) and then they get shut =
down and=20
fined. They lay low for a while and then resurface in another =
city. Their=20
operation has little or no quality control... and their products =
show it!=20
But since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.=20
--=20
Professor=20
"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"=20
_________________________________________=20
shadow u wrote in message =
<346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...=20
>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?
=20
=20
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.71.1712.3"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#c0c0c0>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D5><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans =
MS">OK ramrod, if=20
they are a legitimate company as you say what is their=20
address?</FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"><FONT =
size=3D5><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D5><FONT=20
face=3D"Comic Sans MS"><BR></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans =
MS"><FONT=20
size=3D5><FONT color=3D#0000ff>Professor<BR>"Swinging from 1 to 114 =
Watts(RMS)=20
in=20
Chicago"<BR>_________________________________________</FONT></FONT><=
/FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: =
5px">
<DIV>Ramrod<RAM...@LORDS.COM> wrote in message <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:34711523...@lords.com">34711523...@lords.com</=
A>>...</DIV>Right=20
here is more evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks from =
the=20
knowledge of "I heard this from" and " This is =
what I=20
was told " instead of any factual backround. Tell me Mr. P, =
<BR>What=20
cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in? <BR>Just how does their =
operation work?=20
<BR>What in their products show little or no Q.C.? <BR>I have owned =
many=20
T.S. amps which I have sent back for repair. These amps are =
refurbished to=20
new condition right down to the plastic bag and box. This Mr. P, is =
a FACT=20
that you can reprint in your future postings. I would like to hear =
from any=20
other Texas Star owners that have had good or bad experiences with =
there=20
amps.=20
<P>Professor wrote:=20
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE =3D CITE>Texas Star is a "black market"=20
company... They setup production until they <BR>are discovered =
by the=20
authorities(FCC) and then they get shut down and <BR>fined. They =
lay low=20
for a while and then resurface in another city. Their =
<BR>operation has=20
little or no quality control... and their products show it! =
<BR>But=20
since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.=20
<P>-- <BR>Professor <BR>"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) =
in=20
Chicago" <BR>_________________________________________ =
<BR>shadow u=20
wrote in message =
<346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...=20
<BR>>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think=20
did?</P></BLOCKQUOTE> </BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_004D_01BCF3FF.31B8DCA0--
AMer
Ramrod wrote:
>
> Mr. P. please re-read the the post and hi-light the area that states I
> said anything about them being a legal company. This is exactly what I
> people are constantly riding your ass. You come up with shit that
> nobody has ever said or done. Instead of using this newsgroup for
> spreading rumors and sarcasm, maybe try helping others with your
> knowledge and background in electronics.
>
> Professor wrote:
>
> OK ramrod, if they are a legitimate company as you say what
>
> Professor
> "Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
> _________________________________________
>
> Ramrod wrote in message
> evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks
> backround. Tell me Mr. P,
> condition right down to the plastic bag and box.
> This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your
> other Texas Star owners that have had good or bad
> experiences with there amps.
>
> Professor wrote:
>
> Texas Star is a "black market"
> they
> are discovered by the authorities(FCC)
> fined. They lay low for a while and then
> operation has little or no quality
> But since they don't have to offer any
> warranty, who cares.
>
> Professor
> "Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in
> Chicago"
> _________________________________________
>
>
> >ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did?
> who do u think did?
>
>
>
>
use there basic 2 pill board over and over. This is smart but there
quaility is lacking from there relays to there wire in side tefflon wire
and bigger relays woould be better.
As far as 1 to 114 watts rms well I hope you like to sound whooshy you
Swing is not the key to having a good sounding station. To much swing
will sound bad swinging from 1-114 hell I can swing from 1 to 2k if I
want to. If you want to get real I can run a 30 watt dead key and swing
114 rms Bird watts and beat the hell out of that much swing. The 1-114
swing will be no louder than my 30 to 114 nither.
Professer Please leave the teaching to real Teeachers not someone still
in school. I know a real Tech in your town Professor Bluegill Please do
not take this the wrong way your still learning but your not a athority.
To all Newbees this professor is a nice guy who is tring to help. You
might get a lession or you might get bad advice. Take it for what is
worth
Amer
shadow
Ramrod <ram...@lords.com> wrote:
><HTML>
>Right here is more evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks from
>the knowledge of "I heard this from" and " This is what I was told
>" instead of any factual backround. Tell me Mr. P,
><BR>What cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in?
><BR>Just how does their operation work?
><BR>What in their products show little or no Q.C.?
><BR>I have owned many T.S. amps which I have sent back for repair. These
>amps are refurbished to new condition right down to the plastic bag and
>box. This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your future postings.
>I would like to hear from any other Texas Star owners that have had good
>or bad experiences with there amps.
>
><P>Professor wrote:
><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Texas Star is a "black market" company... They setup
>production until they
><BR>are discovered by the authorities(FCC) and then they get shut down
>and
><BR>fined. They lay low for a while and then resurface in another city.
>Their
><BR>operation has little or no quality control... and their products show
>it!
><BR>But since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.
>
><P>--
><BR>Professor
><BR>"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
><BR>_________________________________________
><BR>shadow u wrote in message <346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...
><BR>>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?</BLOCKQUOTE>
> </HTML>
>
from my resources......galaxy.........I have been informed from the
little loose mouthed so&so who works there.....that galaxy made texas
stars......she is a hot little number who will spill her guts for any
smooth talking man(like myself) just try her out for yourself.....I
swear she told me that galaxy made texas stars.....she also said
galaxy was under a million dollar fine from the fcc,i believe.and
thats why they have had to stop making them. This is from her
mouth,not mine.She will tell all kinds of things to the right man.Ive
gotten other friends to do this.If she a REALLY likes you,she will
email you from her little juno account so that galaxy wont find out
she is leaking secrets!!! This is what all i know about the texas
stars...from her.She might be lieing,but she told me all this.
Ramrod
<HTML>
<BODY BGCOLOR="#C0C0C0">
Mr. P. please re-read the the post and hi-light the area that states I
said anything about them being a legal company. This is exactly what I
people are constantly riding your ass. You come up with shit that nobody
has ever said or done. Instead of using this newsgroup for spreading rumors
and sarcasm, maybe try helping others with your knowledge and background
<P>Professor wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> <FONT FACE="Comic Sans MS"><FONT COLOR="#0000FF"><FONT SIZE=+2>OK
ramrod, if they are a legitimate company as you say what is their address?</FONT></FONT></FONT>
<P><FONT FACE="Comic Sans MS"><FONT COLOR="#0000FF"><FONT SIZE=+2>Professor</FONT></FONT></FONT>
<BR><FONT FACE="Comic Sans MS"><FONT COLOR="#0000FF"><FONT SIZE=+2>"Swinging
from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"</FONT></FONT></FONT>
<BR><FONT FACE="Comic Sans MS"><FONT COLOR="#0000FF"><FONT SIZE=+2>_________________________________________</FONT></FONT></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Ramrod<RAM...@LORDS.COM>
wrote in message <<A HREF="mailto:34711523...@lords.com">34711523...@lords.com</A>>...Right
here is more evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks from the
knowledge of "I heard this from" and " This is what I was told "
instead of any factual backround. Tell me Mr. P,
<BR>What cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in?
<BR>Just how does their operation work?
<BR>What in their products show little or no Q.C.?
<BR>I have owned many T.S. amps which I have sent back for repair. These
amps are refurbished to new condition right down to the plastic bag and
box. This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your future postings.
I would like to hear from any other Texas Star owners that have had good
or bad experiences with there amps.
<P>Professor wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE = CITE>Texas Star is a "black market" company... They
setup production until they
<BR>are discovered by the authorities(FCC) and then they get shut down
and
<BR>fined. They lay low for a while and then resurface in another city.
Their
<BR>operation has little or no quality control... and their products show
it!
<BR>But since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.
<P>--
<BR>Professor
<BR>"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
<BR>_________________________________________
<BR>shadow u wrote in message <346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...
<BR>>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?</BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
</BODY>
</HTML>
Alan Anderson
I'll bet my money on Gill anyday....I don't think the "Professor" will be
heard......
See ya
Alan
AMer wrote in message <347221...@juno.com>...
>Ramrod wrote:
>>
>> Mr. P. please re-read the the post and hi-light the area that states I
>> said anything about them being a legal company. This is exactly what I
>> people are constantly riding your ass. You come up with shit that
>> nobody has ever said or done. Instead of using this newsgroup for
>> spreading rumors and sarcasm, maybe try helping others with your
>> knowledge and background in electronics.
>>
>> Professor wrote:
>>
>> OK ramrod, if they are a legitimate company as you say what
>> is their address?
>>
>> Professor
>> "Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
>> _________________________________________
>>
>> Ramrod wrote in message
>> <34711523...@lords.com>...Right here is more
>> evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks
>> from the knowledge of "I heard this from" and "
>> This is what I was told " instead of any factual
>> backround. Tell me Mr. P,
>> What cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in?
>> Just how does their operation work?
>> What in their products show little or no Q.C.?
>> I have owned many T.S. amps which I have sent back
>> for repair. These amps are refurbished to new
>> condition right down to the plastic bag and box.
>> This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your
>> future postings. I would like to hear from any
>> other Texas Star owners that have had good or bad
>> experiences with there amps.
>>
>> Professor wrote:
>>
>> Texas Star is a "black market"
>> company... They setup production until
>> they
>> are discovered by the authorities(FCC)
>> and then they get shut down and
>> fined. They lay low for a while and then
>> resurface in another city. Their
>> operation has little or no quality
>> control... and their products show it!
>> But since they don't have to offer any
>> warranty, who cares.
>>
>> --
>> Professor
>> "Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in
>> Chicago"
>> _________________________________________
>>
>> shadow u wrote in message
>> <346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...
>>
>> >ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did?
>> who do u think did?
>>
>>
>>
>>
LDD7777
ok professor if your such a expert who makes the best dc amp out there? i think
texas star was a good dc unit . you can run ssb and am clean , it runs a good
swr, and most important , it's reliable.not that i'am not saying it was the
best but it works day to day.oh by the way , i don't think they are coming
back . it was the irs that nailed them,so don't look for them soon. 73's
The CB Guy
On Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:11:30 GMT, shadow u...@spy.com (shadow u) wrote:
>Ramrod <ram...@lords.com> wrote:
>
>><HTML>
>>Right here is more evidence that the Professor is a BAFOON. He speaks from
>>the knowledge of "I heard this from" and " This is what I was told
>>" instead of any factual backround. Tell me Mr. P,
>><BR>What cities has T.S. ever resurfaced in?
>><BR>Just how does their operation work?
>><BR>What in their products show little or no Q.C.?
>><BR>I have owned many T.S. amps which I have sent back for repair. These
>>amps are refurbished to new condition right down to the plastic bag and
>>box. This Mr. P, is a FACT that you can reprint in your future postings.
>>I would like to hear from any other Texas Star owners that have had good
>>or bad experiences with there amps.
>>
>><P>Professor wrote:
>><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Texas Star is a "black market" company... They setup
>>production until they
>><BR>are discovered by the authorities(FCC) and then they get shut down
>>and
>><BR>fined. They lay low for a while and then resurface in another city.
>>Their
>><BR>operation has little or no quality control... and their products show
>>it!
>><BR>But since they don't have to offer any warranty, who cares.
>>
>><P>--
>><BR>Professor
>><BR>"Swinging from 1 to 114 Watts(RMS) in Chicago"
>><BR>_________________________________________
>><BR>shadow u wrote in message <346f6289...@news.mindspring.com>...
>><BR>>ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?</BLOCKQUOTE>
>> </HTML>
>>
>from my resources......galaxy.........I have been informed from the
>little loose mouthed so&so who works there.....that galaxy made texas
>stars......she is a hot little number who will spill her guts for any
>smooth talking man(like myself) just try her out for yourself.....I
>swear she told me that galaxy made texas stars.....she also said
>galaxy was under a million dollar fine from the fcc,i believe.and
>thats why they have had to stop making them. This is from her
>mouth,not mine.She will tell all kinds of things to the right man.Ive
>gotten other friends to do this.If she a REALLY likes you,she will
>email you from her little juno account so that galaxy wont find out
>she is leaking secrets!!! This is what all i know about the texas
>stars...from her.She might be lieing,but she told me all this.
What a wonderful way to totally screw up any source of info you may
have gotten. Thanks to you, she know stands the chance of losing her
job, and at the least ....she's gonna stop telling you 'secrets"
All this, whether or not what she says is true.
can't believe you folks actually believe in a "texas star"..you
probably believe in Santa and the Easter Bunny tooo...
Crack any mobile amp of the same wattage open, and 90% of them are all
made on the same pc board....only different silk-screening on the
front label.
Not to say they don't work......but the basement manufacturers of
theses amps are pulling one over on all of you.
Professor
AM'er
I got news for you... I have been an electrical engineer for almost 20
years. I am hardly still in school as you say... Take that for what it's
worth.
--
Professor
"Super Swing Mobile in Chicago"
_________________________________________
AMer wrote in message <347221...@juno.com>...
snip >>>
SEAN / BIGFOOT
the professor probably doesn't even know who Bluegill is or what he does.
he is just a shit talker. if texas stars are so weak, why won't you come
out and play, professor ???? Sean aka Bigfoot
Alan Anderson
Oh, he talks SSB. That explains it, doesn't have enough to talk AM....
Alan (EE as well)
Professor wrote in message <64uufp$8nv$1...@nntp0.chicago.il.ameritech.net>...
Alan Anderson
I don't think so, there is not another amp that uses the same PC Board as a
Texas Star, except the old Outcom (which was a Texas Star). TNT was
originally a Gray 300 and Gray 150 copy, but now they are different. Dave's
are a "lick and stick" board, Pac-Man makes his own boards. Spyder makes his
own boards. Even Maco had their own board. In fact, I don't know of anybody
that is exactly copying someone elses board. Even Billy Wards Palomar copies
are not a copy of a real Palomar.....
Transistor amps are for drivers anyway, and a Texas Star is a damn good
driver.
See ya
Alan
The CB Guy wrote in message
<3472e834...@news.detroit.mi.ameritech.net>...
Speedracer
Ok, I just started reading this group and I'm not going to start laughing
about someone being proud of a 1-114 swing (chuckle,laugh, snort). I will
say that I have had a few texas stars over the years and they all have
given me and the people I have sold them to good service. My current linear
is a Texas Star 400 (don't remember the exact model and its too cold to go
outside and look). It has been slightly modified for reliability and power
(600 watts if I push it) for about 3 years now and I love it. Also, since
I'm only about an hour outside of Chicago, maybe I'll try to look up the
Professor and listen to his swing (more laughing).
Just havin' fun
Speedracer
nq9220700-Ostrowski
I used to live on the south side of Chicago and I am pretty sure I
have heard his unit and even talked to him a number of times. This was
at least 10 years ago and I believe he was using a different 'handle' at
that time (Something to do with lots of audio I think). If it was the
same person I am thinking of, his equipment really sounded good and had
lots of 'swing' to it. I had a different 'handle' at that time also.
At that time, he and I were the only ones in the area that were touting
modulation as the way to go while everyone else was going for the
highest dead key and the subsequent distorted and clipped audio.
Even though we never had an 'eyeball' there was a certain bonding that
occurred because we were both considered 'nuts'!
Thanks for listening,
#12 (Currently residing in Frankfort, Il.)
tracy glenn
shadow u wrote:
>
> ok if Galaxy didnt make them..who did? who do u think did?
Bill Eitner
That's the closest thing we've gotten to an answer so far.
--
----------------------------------------
\ /
___ | ___
A
/ | \
-=[Bill Eitner]=- III
III
III
_________III_________
Bill Eitner
nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote:
>
> Professor wrote:
> >
> > I am also amused by your statement about getting 600W out of a Texas Star
> > 400...
> >
> > --
> > Professor
> > "Super Swing Mobile in Chicago"
> > _________________________________________
> > >Ok, I just started reading this group and I'm not going to start laughing
> > >about someone being proud of a 1-114 swing (chuckle,laugh, snort). I will
> > >say that I have had a few texas stars over the years and they all have
> > >given me and the people I have sold them to good service. My current linear
> > >is a Texas Star 400 (don't remember the exact model and its too cold to go
> > >outside and look). It has been slightly modified for reliability and power
> > >(600 watts if I push it) for about 3 years now and I love it. Also, since
> > >I'm only about an hour outside of Chicago, maybe I'll try to look up the
> > >Professor and listen to his swing (more laughing).
> > >
> > > Just havin' fun
> > > Speedracer
>
> What about if 'slightly modified for reliability' meant the same as
> replacing the 2sc2290's with 2sc2879's and the other associated
> component changes required to turn it into a DX500? I ALWAYS see more
> out of a DX500 then I do out of a DX667. (assuming there is adequate
> drive for the DX500).
>
> Thanks for listening,
>
> #12
It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages.
The CB Guy
>I don't think so, there is not another amp that uses the same PC Board as a
>Texas Star, except the old Outcom (which was a Texas Star). TNT was
>originally a Gray 300 and Gray 150 copy, but now they are different. Dave's
>are a "lick and stick" board, Pac-Man makes his own boards. Spyder makes his
>own boards. Even Maco had their own board. In fact, I don't know of anybody
>that is exactly copying someone elses board. Even Billy Wards Palomar copies
>are not a copy of a real Palomar.....
Then I suggest you stop reading what people tell you and open up a few
amps........
I'm not offering hearsay....I have seen this with my own eyes.
And, by the way Grey amps are by far the worst I've ever seen.
nq9220700-Ostrowski
Bill Eitner wrote:
>
> nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > What about if 'slightly modified for reliability' meant the same as
> > replacing the 2sc2290's with 2sc2879's and the other associated
> > component changes required to turn it into a DX500? I ALWAYS see more
> > out of a DX500 then I do out of a DX667. (assuming there is adequate
> > drive for the DX500).
> >
> > Thanks for listening,
> >
> > #12
> It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages.
> ___ | ___
> A
> / | \
> -=[Bill Eitner]=- III
> III
> III
> _________III_________
Sorry Bill, but I am using 14VDC, Teflon Coax, a Barker and Williamson
dummy load (or) a Bird 30kw dummy load which is large and cumbersome so
I don't like to use it much, and your choice of any one of (6) Bird
Wattmeters. Come on out if in the Frankfort area and I will "enlighten"
you! Bring your own meter, slugs, and dummy load if you wish. I can even
hook up the spectrum analyzer,(your choice of 3 HP's or a Tektronix),if
you want to verify the spectral 'purity' of the signal.
If you don't believe the above, you can verify it with Bigfoot...
I have had some email asking me if I talk on the radio in the
Naperville, IL. area. Yes I do.. I run about 25 watts and use an
old Midland Power Max (just to be different). I will be at Big Blue's
radio shop in Naperville some time after 7:30pm tonight, as I am just
about EVERY Friday night. You will usually find me at the pool table
defending my title. I'm easy to spot.... I'm the one who looks like the
Fat Ex-biker!
By the way Bill; What do I get if I prove you are wrong??
If you need directions to Big Blue's place (Acorn Ridge Electronics)
call this number (630) 983-1724..................
One of your favorite targets to FLAME,
#12
Professor
Bill, you got that right!
--
Professor
"Super Swing Mobile in Chicago"
_________________________________________
Bill Eitner wrote in message <347535...@earthlink.net>...
>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> What about if 'slightly modified for reliability' meant the same as
>> replacing the 2sc2290's with 2sc2879's and the other associated
>> component changes required to turn it into a DX500? I ALWAYS see more
>> out of a DX500 then I do out of a DX667. (assuming there is adequate
>> drive for the DX500).
>>
>> Thanks for listening,
>>
>> #12
>
> It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages.
>--
>----------------------------------------
MC Turner
I have seen a 667 texas star dead key 600 and swing to 750. I have also
seen 2 others that only made 500w. Who knows!
MC Turner
JeffHR2510
I agree #12, I have seen a Texas Star DX500v swing to 750 watts on a regular
basis. It's not hard to believe-the amp uses 4 Toshiba 2sc2879's. This
transistor is rated at 120 watts maximum for cw (25% duty cycle I think). For
AM it is possible to swing to @750 watts PEP. SSB may be slightly higher, and
much kinder to the transistors I might add!
Bill wrote: > It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages
nq9220700-Ostrowski
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for the positive reinforcement Jeff, Bill Eitner has really been
beating me up lately and I was beginning to wonder if everyone really
believed what he said or if there were some other folks out there
besides me who had practical, real-world, experiences that were in
direct contrast to what he was preaching.
Thanks for listening,
#12
Alan Anderson
(4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave mades" -
claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will cruise
around 700 watts.....
Alan
nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in message <347AEB02...@lucent.com>...
nq9220700-Ostrowski
Alan Anderson wrote:
>
> (4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
> at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
> bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
> Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave mades" -
> claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
>
> My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
>
> I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will cruise
> around 700 watts.....
>
> Alan
Thanks for the positive reinforcement Alan, Bill Eitner has really been
Bill Eitner
The most I've ever seen one do is 700 PEP with about 17 volts
at the collectors--and that's driven to saturation. I have
alot of trouble believing claims of anything much higher than
that out of four 2879s. Fiddling with the design may get you
5 to 10 percent more, but that's it. The rest is bullshit,
happy meters and/or voltages and drive levels that defy breakdown.
As for beating you up, I don't feel that that's what I'm doing.
You can't just come out here as a newbie and jump into a bunch
of threads with disagreeing opinions expecting total agreement
and an open-armed welcome. In your little corner of the world
you may have earned a reputation and be considered all-knowing
by those in your orbit, but out here you're nothing but another
author of opinion-filled posts. I don't see you as deserving
of any special treatment. You were treated as anyone would be
who did what you did.
Professor
I don't believe a word of it... 1200W from four 2879's, come on...
--
Professor
_________________________________
Alan Anderson wrote in message ...
>(4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
>at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
>bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
>Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave
mades" -
>claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
>
>My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
>
>I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will cruise
>around 700 watts.....
>
>Alan
>
>nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in message <347AEB02...@lucent.com>...
>>JeffHR2510 wrote:
>>>
>>> I agree #12, I have seen a Texas Star DX500v swing to 750 watts on a
>regular
>>> basis. It's not hard to believe-the amp uses 4 Toshiba 2sc2879's.
This
>>> transistor is rated at 120 watts maximum for cw (25% duty cycle I
think).
>For
>>> AM it is possible to swing to @750 watts PEP. SSB may be slightly
higher,
>and
>>> much kinder to the transistors I might add!
>>>
>>> Bill wrote: > It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>Thanks for the positive reinforcement Jeff, Bill Eitner has really been
SEAN / BIGFOOT
i'm glad that more than just a few of us have seen "good numbers" out of
these pills. both Dennis aka #12 and myself have observed 500+ pep out of a
pair of 2879's at typical car voltages ( 14.5 v or so) into non reactive
dummy loads. this is with drive from a radio only, so under high voltage /
high drive, these amps can easily do more than this. as Bill Eitner and i
have compared notes on wattage readings and found our meters to be extremely
similar, so have #12 and myself. the three of our meters read almost
exactly the same, so who's doing what wrong ??? we should be seeing about
the same things out of these similar setups. Sean AKA Bigfoot
nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in article <347C3222...@lucent.com>...
>Alan Anderson wrote:
>>
>> (4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4
2879's
>> at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on
the
>> bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of
drive.
>> Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave
mades" -
>> claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
>>
>> My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
>>
>> I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will
cruise
>> around 700 watts.....
>>
>> Alan
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>Thanks for the positive reinforcement Alan, Bill Eitner has really been
Professor
Bill, I agree... at 700W output (if you could get there) you would be
saturated and distorted as hell !
--
Professor
_________________________________
Bill Eitner wrote in message <347CC2...@earthlink.net>...
Professor
Alan,
Nobody with a "half a brain" would even think about running 150W into this
amp ! Your power output claims are ridiculous also... If you really believe
this than you need to seriously research this subject further.
--
Professor
_________________________________
Alan Anderson wrote in message ...
>(4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
>at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
>bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
>Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave
mades" -
>claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
>
>My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
>
>I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will cruise
>around 700 watts.....
>
>Alan
>
>nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in message <347AEB02...@lucent.com>...
>>JeffHR2510 wrote:
>>>
>>> I agree #12, I have seen a Texas Star DX500v swing to 750 watts on a
>regular
>>> basis. It's not hard to believe-the amp uses 4 Toshiba 2sc2879's.
This
>>> transistor is rated at 120 watts maximum for cw (25% duty cycle I
think).
>For
>>> AM it is possible to swing to @750 watts PEP. SSB may be slightly
higher,
>and
>>> much kinder to the transistors I might add!
>>>
>>> Bill wrote: > It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>Thanks for the positive reinforcement Jeff, Bill Eitner has really been
Dave Hall
I guess I'll throw my hat into this discussion. I have a Texas Star
DX-600 (A 2 stage, 2290 driving 4 2879's). I've bypassed the 2290, so
that I can run it without over driving it. I drive it with a 2950,
putting out 3 watts, and I can get 175 watts carrier, which allows
enough headroom to fully modulate to 700 watts on peak modulation. If
you look at the specs on the 2879, they are rated for about 150 watts.
If you add them all together, you have 600 watts. So how can anyone
expect these same pills to put out 1000 watts? I've measured mine into a
Cantenna dummy load, through a Bird 43, at 14 volts, and I get about 700
- 750 watts full peak power on SSB, driving it with 30 watts. That's all
there is. If I "volt" it up to 18 volts, I can get 800+ out of it, but
that is not good for the transistors
DAve
"Sandbagger"
Amor Powers, Radio
SEAN / BIGFOOT sezz:
> pair of 2879's at typical car voltages ( 14.5 v or so)
Is 14.5 V typical?
Amor Powers
Bill Eitner
That's more than twice the device rating. I suspect that you're just
perpetuating bullshit to save your reputation. In other words, you've
been backing inflated claims for so long that you'd have too much
explaining to do if you turned to the truth all of a sudden.
SEAN / BIGFOOT wrote:
>
> i'm glad that more than just a few of us have seen "good numbers" out of
> these pills. both Dennis aka #12 and myself have observed 500+ pep out of a
> pair of 2879's at typical car voltages ( 14.5 v or so) into non reactive
> dummy loads. this is with drive from a radio only, so under high voltage /
> high drive, these amps can easily do more than this. as Bill Eitner and i
> have compared notes on wattage readings and found our meters to be extremely
> similar, so have #12 and myself. the three of our meters read almost
> exactly the same, so who's doing what wrong ??? we should be seeing about
> the same things out of these similar setups. Sean AKA Bigfoot
>
> nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in article <347C3222...@lucent.com>...
>
> >Alan Anderson wrote:
> >>
> >> (4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4
> 2879's
> >> at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on
> the
> >> bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of
> drive.
> >> Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave
> mades" -
> >> claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
> >>
> >> My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
> >>
> >> I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will
> cruise
> >> around 700 watts.....
> >>
> >> Alan
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> >Thanks for the positive reinforcement Alan, Bill Eitner has really been
> >beating me up lately and I was beginning to wonder if everyone really
> >believed what he said or if there were some other folks out there
> >besides me who had practical, real-world, experiences that were in
> >direct contrast to what he was preaching.
> >
> >Thanks for listening,
> >
> >#12
--
Bill Eitner
Professor wrote:
>
> Alan,
> Nobody with a "half a brain" would even think about running 150W into this
> amp ! Your power output claims are ridiculous also... If you really believe
> this than you need to seriously research this subject further.
2SC2879 device in front of me right now. At 12.5 volts,
and with 12 watts of input drive, the single device out-
put is 140 watts PEP... Yes, I said PEP not RMS!!! The
drive curve is beginning to level at that point. You
could push the drive to 14 to 16 watts and raise the
collector voltage to 18 and the new curve's peak could
go as high as 200 watts. However, the collector dissipa-
tion goes critical at 250 watts with a collector effi-
ciancy of only 35%. With a collector voltage of 14 volts,
and a 7 watt PEP drive per device, you can get a reason-
ably reliable 130 watts PEP per device. That's what I
see when I test a Texas Star 500. 28 watts PEP input
(a very typical 2950), 14 volts at the collectors (about
all you can expect from a regular car), and a powered,
calibrated, peak-reading wattmeter and a mil-spec, oil-
filled, DC to 3 GHz dummy load. These results fall right
in-line with Toshiba's own curves. They are accurate and
they make sense anyway you slice it.
What am I doing wrong Sean??? You're going to have to do
better than just tell me what you've seen.
--
----------------------------------------
\ /
___ | ___
A
/ | \
-=[Bill Eitner]=- III
III
III
_________III_________
> --
> Professor
> _________________________________
>
> Alan Anderson wrote in message ...
> >(4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
> >at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
> >bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
> >Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave
> mades" -
> >claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
> >
> >My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
> >
> >I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will cruise
> >around 700 watts.....
> >
> >Alan
> >
> >nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in message <347AEB02...@lucent.com>...
> >>JeffHR2510 wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I agree #12, I have seen a Texas Star DX500v swing to 750 watts on a
> >regular
> >>> basis. It's not hard to believe-the amp uses 4 Toshiba 2sc2879's.
> This
> >>> transistor is rated at 120 watts maximum for cw (25% duty cycle I
> think).
> >For
> >>> AM it is possible to swing to @750 watts PEP. SSB may be slightly
> higher,
> >and
> >>> much kinder to the transistors I might add!
> >>>
> >>> Bill wrote: > It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages
> >>
> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>Thanks for the positive reinforcement Jeff, Bill Eitner has really been
The CB Guy
My experience has been 14.1 to 14.5 volts...with the motor running.
On Thu, 27 Nov 1997 12:36:49 -0800, "Amor Powers, Radio"
<po...@radio.net> wrote:
>SEAN / BIGFOOT sezz:
>
>> pair of 2879's at typical car voltages ( 14.5 v or so)
>
Ontelcorp
The most I've ever seen one do is 700 PEP with about 17 volts
at the collectors--and that's driven to saturation. I have
alot of trouble believing claims of anything much higher than
that out of four 2879s. Fiddling with the design may get you
5 to 10 percent more, but that's it. The rest is bullshit,
happy meters and/or voltages and drive levels that defy breakdown.
I concur with this opinion
Steve Brills
k1s...@juno.com
onte...@aol.com
John
>> pair of 2879's at typical car voltages ( 14.5 v or so)
>Is 14.5 V typical?
Hmmm, ..2.2 volts per cell, 12 volt system @ 6 cells = 13.2 volts
However, that said, maximum 'acceptable' regulated voltage from an
automobile "12 volt" system should not exceed 14 volts.
Although I'm no expert on these issues.
JOHN
****************************************************
CB SALES (UK) - Private Wants & Sales FREE For UK.
http://freespace.virgin.net/john.carver/cbradio.htm
****************************************************
Newsgroup article replies are best sent via e-mail.
mailto:john....@virgin.net
****************************************************
Professor
The range of a cars charging system should be between 13.5 and 14.5 volts.
It certainly will fluctuate depending on alternator RPM and loading.
FYI Remember that an autos alternator has a rated output at 2000RPM. The
crankshaft / alternator pulleys are chosen for a 2:1 ratio. This means that
full alternator output is possible with an engine(crankshaft) speed of
1000RPM.
--
Professor
_________________________________
John wrote in message <347ed6f8...@news.virgin.net>...
Amor Powers, Radio
Professor wrote:
> The range of a cars charging system should be between
> 13.5 and 14.5 volts.
Is this measured at the battery terminals, or the alternator output to
chassis?
Do they give gourmet battery cooking lessons with the 14.5V systems?
Amor Powers
Warlok671
>Is this measured at the battery terminals, or the alternator output to
>chassis?
>Do they give gourmet battery cooking lessons with the 14.5V systems?
>
>Amor Powers
I have run many electrical systems at over 15v with no problem. Of couse, a
little more frequent checks on water level, and app. 30% less battery life, but
I really like the results of a little higher voltage .......in radio, starting,
and lighting.
nq9220700-Ostrowski
Warlok671 wrote:
>
> I really like the results of a little higher voltage .......in radio, starting,
> and lighting.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Especially that bright flash you get when a spark ignites the Hydrogen
gas build-up under the hood!
#12
Amor Powers, Radio
phil sezz:
> I can now pull 170 amps on CW keydown and drop .3 of a volt!
> Beat that anyone.
Amor sezz:
Wow. That's pretty darn good for a 4 wheeler vehicle!
(if I remember correctly, you have a van, Phil?).
We used to have a Greyhound Scenicruiser Bus (8 cylinder 318 Detroit
Diesel engine) converted into a camper/RV (double decker) between 1972
and 1980. It had an entirely aluminum body and air-ride. (Originally the
bus had two 4 cylinder engines!) We used to run the bus (named "Doggie")
for long periods of time (diesels enjoy that). It carried two fuel
tanks, one 200+ gallon main, and a 120 gallon auxiliary (pitiful 5.5 to
6.5 MPG).
It had a 400A+ alternator, with two 240AH 12V main batteries in
parallel. It took two strong people to lift one of those batteries. I
found that continuous charging at over 14.2V led to battery heating,
excessive H gas, and deterioration, and it was not required to run
higher than that (I set the system at 14.1V, measured at battery
terminals), since the system basically floated the batteries.
There was a compartment in the bus called the "radio bay" (originally
designed for the old huge tube-type Motorola 2-way radios). I installed
an auxiliary 240AH battery in the radio bay dedicated entirely to the
radio system. A size 00-AWG copper wire 30ft long with a giant relay
connected the systems together when charging. The aux battery could be
called upon to assist starting if the main battery was low in winter
sub-zero weather. I don't remember seeing any voltage drop at all at the
main batteries when the linear was keyed while charging on fast-idle,
but the aux battery and wire resistance probably buffered it. The
generator used an electronic voltage regulator.
I ran only about 1.2kW input (700W out AM) mobile, and about a kW (or
so) PEP output on SSB, but had so many problems with my homebrew DC:DC
supply (3kV) used on the tube linear, that I installed a 120VAC 5kW
auxiliary generator in one of the side bays in 1975. The linear and
other appliances then could run using the standard "mains power" supply,
instead of all those troublesome inverters...
The bus provided a good platform for experimenting with mobile antenna
systems. The roof of the upper deck was high, 11feet 8inches. So, many
standard antennas on the upper roof were installed and destroyed over
the years. A couple of DDRR antennas were tried, and the 11m DDRR lasted
quite a while. It was made from copper tubing. It worked well, and could
compete favorably with base stations. People thought it looked like a
flying saucer device. Looking back on it, it was pretty unusual!
All the truckers called me a "porcupine" on the highway. I had 6 ball
mounts on the bus. One in the center of the front (lower deck), one in
the center of the top (upper deck), two on the back corners, and two on
the front sides. All coaxial feeds from the various mounts were brought
into the radio rack, and with jumpers and switches, could be phased with
coaxial lengths. The back antennas were almost one wavelength on 11m
from the front antennas. Antenna phasing was a pain to use when in
motion, but when parked, it was useful for skip shooting, or maintaining
comms with other members of the various caravans I sometimes travelled
with. A telescoping 30ft high mast supported verticals and inverted vees
when parked for extended periods of time. All the comforts of home.
In 1972, I originally tried a 40meter DDRR on the top of the roof. It
worked superbly, but was mangled by a tree limb shortly after its maiden
voyage, so I ended up using tuned whips on the lower HF bands. With a
30ft+ long vehicle, the directivity of the antennas on the lower bands
was very pronounced. One time, while trying to make a 40m contact with
Tennessee while I was visiting New York City, I drove around in a circle
on a dock over the Hudson river, pointing the tail end of the bus
beaming toward Tennessee. When the signal peaked, I parked the bus and
had a good QSO.
2 CB radios w/100W amps, the kW linear amp, 2 scanners, all band HF
240W, VHF/UHF, various RXs, mobilephone, repeater, and various stereo
and Slow&Fast scan video, public address, ship-ship acoustic
hailing/listening, foghorn, navigation, and other gear filled up the
brushed stainless steel rack, along with custom made panels for antenna
phasing, speakers, mic/headsets, phones, phone patch, switching
matrixes, power/SWR, generator &DC metering and control. Electronic
system design was patterned somewhat after aeronautical systems (which
was one of my previous businesses). The Scenicruiser bus was originally
designed by Bodie (design engineer for the Boeing 707).
This monster mobile system took a year or two to reach fruition, and I
never really considered it finished. It was constantly improving, with
much help from my friends. The wild antics, fun, and adventure we had
with it are the stuff movies are made of, taking it all over North and
Central America. Doggie's body had well over a million miles on it, as
attested to by the hub odometer. It became more difficult to get parts
for vintage Scenicruisers, (especially air beams--- which were damaged
on back roads in southern Mexico and Guatemala) so we eventually
"decommissioned" old Doggie. But she will live in the legends and
stories of the many people and a few fascinated radio operators who
shared the experience with me from time to time.
Amor Powers
nq9220700-Ostrowski
Bill Eitner wrote:
However, the collector dissipa-
> tion goes critical at 250 watts with a collector effi-
> ciancy of only 35%.
>
> better than just tell me what you've seen.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure that Sean can respond for himself, but I believe you answered
your own question here. Your collector efficiency was only 35%.
#12
nq9220700-Ostrowski
philip de cadenet wrote:
>
> In article <3481E0...@radio.net>, "Amor Powers, Radio"
> <po...@radio.net> writes
> >Professor wrote:
> >> The range of a cars charging system should be between
> >> 13.5 and 14.5 volts.
> >
> >chassis?
> >Do they give gourmet battery cooking lessons with the 14.5V systems?
> >
> >Amor Powers
> My Adverc charging system, similar to the US made Heart Interface unit
> charges at 14.6 on high load and drops to around 14.2 in low charge
> mode.
> A good battery will not gas or cook at this voltage.
> I've done my homework on this subject Amor. I've personally spoke to
> both the Exide battery techs and my Adverc controller designer and have
> probably spent more money on my mobile PSU than on my HF radio.
> I did get a good deal on the 200 amp Leeces direct from the CA factory.
> I can now pull 170 amps on CW keydown and drop .3 of a volt!
> Beat that anyone.
>
----------------------------------------------------------------
Phil,
Sounds impressive! Have you ever considered marketing your system?
There are a lot of "sick" mobiles out there that could really use it!
#12
John Lacefield
I have owned 15 different Texas Starr amps from 150 to 1k, every one
would
Professor
every on would... what?
--
Professor
_________________________________________
John Lacefield wrote in message <661gh0$he$1...@newsd-111.bryant.webtv.net>...
Bill Eitner
The quote you've taken out of context has nothing to do
with the question. Sean feels that since our readings
differ so much, with his being the higher readings, one
of us must be doing something wrong. The post you took
that quote from outlines my test set-up and resultant
readings which correspond with Toshiba's spec-sheet para-
meters.
The collector efficiency spec was added as further
evidence of the fact that wild output figures aren't
possible within the confines of the device.
73
Bill Eitner
nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote:
>
> Bill Eitner wrote:
>
> >
> > at the collectors--and that's driven to saturation. I have
> > alot of trouble believing claims of anything much higher than
> > that out of four 2879s. Fiddling with the design may get you
> > 5 to 10 percent more, but that's it. The rest is bullshit,
> > happy meters and/or voltages and drive levels that defy breakdown.
>
> I regularly see over 600 watts, (typically 700 to 750 watts), from
> totally stock Texas Star DX500 amplifiers. I do not now, nor have I
> ever, advocated any modifications to be made on these amplifiers. If
> someone comes to me with a new Texas Star amplifier and requests that I
> 'boost' it like other techs. claim to do; I tell them to save their
> money because there is nothing that I can do to the Texas Star that
> would boost the output enough to be worth paying even a minimum bench
> charge for.
> I wanted to counter your claim that the amp could not produce more than
> 600 watts, because I know it can do more than that.
OK. You're entitled to your opinion.
> As far a happy meters go, you will have to argue with Bird! I currently
> own 6 of them. Two of the peak readers are on my bench at all times so
> that if I get what I think is getting a 'funny' reading, I can compare
> it to the other one to verify accuracy. I normally use a Barker and
> Williamson dummy load wattmeter as a termination, but have various other
> terminations around. (Bird, Heathkit, etc.) I try to be as accurate as I
> can with my readings, and as a result, when I return an amplifier, the
> customer usually sees more watts than I do.
> The 600 to 750 watts that I see can be either dead key watts, or they
> can be peak audio watts. If I use an averaging meter, I can still see
> 600 to 750 watts dead key, but will only see 300 to 350 watts average
> power with 100% modulation. But I do regularly see over 600 watts out
> of a DX500 running on 13.9VDC and driven by less than 20 watts.
> (typically less than 10 watts).
Then it's just a case of your equipment and mine disagreeing.
My equipment is calibrated and accurate, which is backed-up
by the fact that my readings agree with Toshiba's own spec-
sheet curves. Your readings are in the ballbark, but clearly
high compared to mine and to Toshiba's curves. At least
you're not going along with the wild claims of others--I
applaud that.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > As for beating you up, I don't feel that that's what I'm doing.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'll let the folks on the web decide that for themselves.
I don't think they really care one way or the other.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > You can't just come out here as a newbie and jump into a bunch
> > of threads with disagreeing opinions expecting total agreement
> > and an open-armed welcome. In your little corner of the world
> > you may have earned a reputation and be considered all-knowing
> > by those in your orbit, but out here you're nothing but another
> > author of opinion-filled posts. I don't see you as deserving
> > of any special treatment. You were treated as anyone would be
> > who did what you did.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> SORRY BILL! Am I encroaching on YOUR little corner of the world?
Not at all. Why would you even say that? I don't even
think you understood what I wrote. I think that's part
of the problem--at times you let your emotions write
your posts for you.
> As far as being all-knowing, I logged on to this net to learn about
> those
> things that I know far to little about and to try to add information
> where I
> was fairly confident in my knowledge.
I suppose, for the most part, that's what you've done.
It's just that when you're on the adding information
side of that equation you're going to have to step up
to the plate and defend the accuracy of that information
if someone disagrees with it (if you want to be taken
seriously). The flip-side of that is that you're
entitled to put other people into that position; which,
from what I've seen, you have no trouble doing.
> If you noticed, I was mostly absent from the great antenna debates
> because
> I did not have much to add and a lot to learn.
>
> You took the first shot at me in this thread when you disagreed about
> making a DX400 into a DX500 and the resultant power output of the DX500.
There you go again thinking that a disagreeing opinion is
a "shot."
> You are the one questioning the quality of my equipment.
Perhaps that's what's necessary.
> You are the one with all the negative remarks.
How would you like me to word my posts? How can someone
disagree with you without you seeing it as a "negative
remark" or "shot." Perhaps you just need to thicken
your skin. I've never gotten any complaints about my
posts being too harsh from anyone other than who they
were focused on originally. My posts aren't intended
to be taken personally. They're sharply worded at times,
but that's just my style--get used to it. One of the
reasons I like this group is because here I can be me.
I hate having to pick my words--especially here. I'm
not going to do so either--it's as simple as that. You
can add my name to your kill-file if you see fit--it
won't break my heart.
> It seems all I am doing is rebuttal after rebuttal!
I don't see many original articles authored by you out
here. Your entrance into most threads is by way of
a disagreeing response, but you don't like it when you
have to defend your own opinions. That's too bad. If
you can't stand the heat--get out of the kitchen.
> Have a Nice Day!
>
> #12
MC Turner
That sucks. he did that on purpose! I hate suspense!!!!!!!!
OH by the way you wont believe what hapened I went down to the.........
MC Turner
Alan Anderson
2:1 that is interesting, mine SB GMC came with a 8" crankshaft pulley and a
2.2" alternator pulley.....8/2.2 must be 2.....
Maybe I can't divide....
!NOT
Alan
Professor wrote in message <65ru1q$pl$1...@nntp0.chicago.il.ameritech.net>...
>The range of a cars charging system should be between 13.5 and 14.5 volts.
Dave Hall
nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote:
>
> Dave Hall wrote:
> >
> > I guess I'll throw my hat into this discussion. I have a Texas Star
> > DX-600 (A 2 stage, 2290 driving 4 2879's). I've bypassed the 2290, so
> > that I can run it without over driving it. I drive it with a 2950,
> > putting out 3 watts, and I can get 175 watts carrier, which allows
> > enough headroom to fully modulate to 700 watts on peak modulation. If
> > you look at the specs on the 2879, they are rated for about 150 watts.
> > If you add them all together, you have 600 watts. So how can anyone
> > expect these same pills to put out 1000 watts? I've measured mine into a
> > Cantenna dummy load, through a Bird 43, at 14 volts, and I get about 700
> > - 750 watts full peak power on SSB, driving it with 30 watts. That's all
> > there is. If I "volt" it up to 18 volts, I can get 800+ out of it, but
> > that is not good for the transistors
> >
>
> Dave's results agree with what I have seen. The DX600 with the driver
> removed is functionally equivalent to a DX500. The big difference is
> that I see those power levels with a little less drive. It could be that
> the resistor attenuators for the 2290 driver in the DX600 are still in
> place and knocking down the drive on Dave's DX600.......
Bingo! That is exactly the case. I removed some of the resistor
attenuation, but if I tried to remove all of them, the input imdedence
was not matched, and I got a high SWR into the amp. I put a 3 db pad in
there to force a 50 ohm match, and my input match is ok now. It takes a
little more drive power, but not that much (3 watts vs. 1.5). The best
part though is that it sounds great! If you keep your dead key watts
down around 180, the thing really sounds good.
> Thanks for the info. Dave,
>
> #12
No problem. I just get a kick out of all these "optimistic" wattage
figures that get spouted out here.....
Dave
"Sandbagger"
philip de cadenet
Prof,
>The range of a cars charging system should be between 13.5 and 14.5 volts.
>It certainly will fluctuate depending on alternator RPM and loading.
>
>FYI Remember that an autos alternator has a rated output at 2000RPM. The
>crankshaft / alternator pulleys are chosen for a 2:1 ratio. This means that
>full alternator output is possible with an engine(crankshaft) speed of
>1000RPM.
Take my Leece 4860J 200 amp alternator as an example.
It's max current is not reached under 4000rpm, from there on it holds
it's O/P. To say alternators are rated at 2000rpm is incorrect. Output
typically starts rising from zero at around 1200rpm. Now this is of
course where pulley size is important. Gas engine pulleys range
typically between 2.5 to 3/1 ratio and diesel's run between 2 to 3.5 to
1.
I personally prefer to run with a diesel due to good torque, no computer
(well, my van's old) and of course no ignition interference to worry
about, and more importantly, even on tickover, I can put a hefty load on
the charging system and the engines governer compensates by
automatically increasing the rpm!
I can run my 1200w output from tickover to max rpm.
An important point which Sean brought up a few months back is if you
want the best from your system your alternator has to be able to deliver
the current required when all the auto'as electrics are on full as well
as your amp being keyed. Otherwise you're just trying to flog a dead
horse.I don't need to mention about sufficient wire gauge.
I'm going on like an old woman.
I'll do a seperate post on correct charging of batteries, one of my pet
subjects.
Phil Unit 148 / G4ZOW/M / UK
philip de cadenet
Hi Amor, #12 and others,
> Sounds impressive! Have you ever considered marketing your system?
>There are a lot of "sick" mobiles out there that could really use it!
>
>#12
designer is suffering from lethargy. I am intending to market the Adverc
voltage controller, it is a controller, not an alternator booster.
With it you have full voltage control of the alternator and battery
sensing. This results in 100% state of charge compared with 60%-70%
using the standard regulation, at a faster rate of charge and safely.
By cycling the battery voltages above and below the gassing point of the
battery, to an established programme, and by compensating for ambient
temperature variations around the batteries.
Because the standard regulator provides little or no compensation for
changes in ambient temperature, batteries tend to be over charged in the
summer and under charged in the winter causing premature battery
failure, usually during a cold spell.
I'm also having Mr Pirate Works put together a proper 1kw 11m amp,
primarily for the european market with up to 10w I/P for 1kw out using
eight 2879's running through a Chebychev filter. This will be the only
amp for sale for 11m, another unit is a copy of Ted Henry's 160-10m
mobile unit running the same device lineup but with switchable filters
for each band, and of course requiring 60-80w of drive for full O/P.
As in the US, there are a lot of cheap and nasty amp's around, and I
would like to think that when someone is asked to pay around 1000 bucks
for an amp that they have learned what makes a good one and are ready to
pay for it.
I am seriously against false big numbers so make sure I run with a two
tone I/P signal and quality low pass filter befor the peak reading Bird.
Most all of my R & D is done on the 160m ham band, which, due to the
efficiency of the best mobile antenna, (typically around 1%, dependant
on ground loss resistance) really does sort out the men from the boys.
I'm currently around 10Db stronger than than any other mobile on this
band in the UK.
When you're in control, you're allowed to brag:-)
I just do it tactfully, just in case some of the old farts have a heart
attack.
Several mobiles over here can make mincemeat of 95% of the base
stations.
I'm aware that in the US the top 160m stations have antenna arrays that
would make the best AM broadcast stations weep, but we're not as well
off as you, nor do we have the acreage.
55 million people in a country a quarter the size of the lone star
state:-)
Phil
philip de cadenet
They're rated at 120w pep in the Toshiba data sheet in front of me,
though I'm not dissagreeing with your numbers.
Phil
>I guess I'll throw my hat into this discussion. I have a Texas Star
>DX-600 (A 2 stage, 2290 driving 4 2879's). I've bypassed the 2290, so
>that I can run it without over driving it. I drive it with a 2950,
>putting out 3 watts, and I can get 175 watts carrier, which allows
>enough headroom to fully modulate to 700 watts on peak modulation. If
>you look at the specs on the 2879, they are rated for about 150 watts.
>If you add them all together, you have 600 watts. So how can anyone
>expect these same pills to put out 1000 watts? I've measured mine into a
>Cantenna dummy load, through a Bird 43, at 14 volts, and I get about 700
>- 750 watts full peak power on SSB, driving it with 30 watts. That's all
>there is. If I "volt" it up to 18 volts, I can get 800+ out of it, but
>that is not good for the transistors
>
>>
>> Alan,
>> Nobody with a "half a brain" would even think about running 150W into this
>> amp ! Your power output claims are ridiculous also... If you really believe
>> this than you need to seriously research this subject further.
>>
>"Sandbagger"
>
Amor Powers, Radio
philip de cadenet wrote:
> I don't need to mention about sufficient wire gauge.
> I'm going on like an old woman.
Was that remark pointed at someone, Phil? :-)
Amor Powers
why don't you look it up
>They're rated at 120w pep in the Toshiba data sheet in front of me,
>though I'm not dissagreeing with your numbers.
>Phil
>>I
>>Cantenna dummy load, through a Bird 43, at 14 volts, and I get about 700
>>- 750 watts full peak power on SSB, driving it with 30 watts. That's all
>>there is. If I "volt" it up to 18 volts, I can get 800+ out of it, but
>>that is not good for the transistors
>
>>> Nobody with a "half a brain" would even think about running 150W into this
>>> amp ! Your power output claims are ridiculous also... If you really believe
>>> this than you need to seriously research this subject further.
>>>
>
>>> >(4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
>>> >at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
>>> >bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
>>>
>>> >My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
>>> >>> I agree #12, I have seen a Texas Star DX500v swing to 750 watts on a
>>> >regular
>>> >>> basis. It's not hard to believe-the amp uses 4 Toshiba 2sc2879's.
>>> This
>>> >>> transistor is rated at 120 watts maximum for cw (25% duty cycle I
>>>>>
>>> >>> Bill wrote: > It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages
>>> >>
>>> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >>
>>> >>Thanks for the positive reinforcement Jeff, Bill Eitner has really been
>>> >>beating me up lately and I was beginning to wonder if everyone really
>>> >>believed what he said or if there were some other folks out there
>>> >>besides me who had practical, real-world, experiences that were in
>>> >>direct contrast to what he was preaching.
>>> >>
>
subtract all your harmonics, <use a GOOD lowpass filter> put all your
power on frequency, Then, hook a bird 43 meter to the output and it
will not be over 700 watts with voltage high with 4 2879's. I don't
care if you are a rocket scientist, you cannot squeeze blood out of
rf. Take the test, keep your signal on frequency, use a lowpass filter
use a ACCURATE meter not some dosy or pdc.... I bet $50 that you
cannot do it....correctly
Bill Eitner
philip de cadenet wrote:
>
> They're rated at 120w pep in the Toshiba data sheet in front of me,
> though I'm not dissagreeing with your numbers.
> Phil
Toshiba Calls them 100 watt devices. Look at the top of the
first page.
> >I guess I'll throw my hat into this discussion. I have a Texas Star
> >DX-600 (A 2 stage, 2290 driving 4 2879's). I've bypassed the 2290, so
> >that I can run it without over driving it. I drive it with a 2950,
> >putting out 3 watts, and I can get 175 watts carrier, which allows
> >enough headroom to fully modulate to 700 watts on peak modulation. If
> >you look at the specs on the 2879, they are rated for about 150 watts.
> >If you add them all together, you have 600 watts. So how can anyone
> >expect these same pills to put out 1000 watts? I've measured mine into a
> >Cantenna dummy load, through a Bird 43, at 14 volts, and I get about 700
> >- 750 watts full peak power on SSB, driving it with 30 watts. That's all
> >there is. If I "volt" it up to 18 volts, I can get 800+ out of it, but
> >that is not good for the transistors
> >
> >Professor wrote:
> >>
> >> Alan,
> >> Nobody with a "half a brain" would even think about running 150W into this
> >> amp ! Your power output claims are ridiculous also... If you really believe
> >> this than you need to seriously research this subject further.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Professor
> >> _________________________________
> >>
> >> Alan Anderson wrote in message ...
> >> >(4) 2SC2879's will easily do 750 watts, infact for key downs I run 4 2879's
> >> >at about 1200 watts on a Bird 43. It will talk around 600-650 watts on the
> >> >bird. This is on 16-17 volts under load with about 150-175 watts of drive.
> >> >Your Texas Star won't do that much stock, but it can be done. "Dave
> >> mades" -
> >> >claim to do around 1500 watts out of a 4-pill.
> >> >
> >> >My reflect is less than 1 watt with the 4 pill.
> >> >
> >> >I wouldn't recommend running 4 transistors that high, but they will cruise
> >> >around 700 watts.....
> >> >
> >> >Alan
> >> >
> >> >nq9220700-Ostrowski wrote in message <347AEB02...@lucent.com>...
> >> >>JeffHR2510 wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>> I agree #12, I have seen a Texas Star DX500v swing to 750 watts on a
> >> >regular
> >> >>> basis. It's not hard to believe-the amp uses 4 Toshiba 2sc2879's.
> >> This
> >> >>> transistor is rated at 120 watts maximum for cw (25% duty cycle I
> >> think).
> >> >For
> >> >>> AM it is possible to swing to @750 watts PEP. SSB may be slightly
> >> higher,
> >> >and
> >> >>> much kinder to the transistors I might add!
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Bill wrote: > It still won't do 600 with real-world voltages
> >> >>
> >> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >>
> >> >>Thanks for the positive reinforcement Jeff, Bill Eitner has really been
> >> >>beating me up lately and I was beginning to wonder if everyone really
> >> >>believed what he said or if there were some other folks out there
> >> >>besides me who had practical, real-world, experiences that were in
> >> >>direct contrast to what he was preaching.
> >> >>
> >> >>Thanks for listening,
> >> >>
> >> >>#12
> >> >
> >> >
> >DAve
> >"Sandbagger"
> >
--
Professor
Phil,
You are right... I should have said most automotive alternators follow these
rules. Yours however I believe is a special truck / industrial (high output)
model and should not be lumped in with my general explanation...
--
Professor
_________________________________________
philip de cadenet wrote in message ...
:Prof,
:horse.I don't need to mention about sufficient wire gauge.
:I'm going on like an old woman.
:I'll do a seperate post on correct charging of batteries, one of my pet
Professor
Again we have someone not talking about a car. I admit that trucks may have
a different ratio... and a GMC is a truck, right?
--
Professor
_________________________________________
Alan Anderson wrote in message <#bvgyD4$8GA.197@upnetnews04>...
:2:1 that is interesting, mine SB GMC came with a 8" crankshaft pulley and a
:2.2" alternator pulley.....8/2.2 must be 2.....
:
:Maybe I can't divide....
:
:!NOT
:
:Alan
:
:Professor wrote in message <65ru1q$pl$1...@nntp0.chicago.il.ameritech.net>...
:>The range of a cars charging system should be between 13.5 and 14.5 volts.
:>It certainly will fluctuate depending on alternator RPM and loading.
:>
:>FYI Remember that an autos alternator has a rated output at 2000RPM. The
:>crankshaft / alternator pulleys are chosen for a 2:1 ratio. This means
that
:>full alternator output is possible with an engine(crankshaft) speed of
:>1000RPM.
:>
:>--
:>
:>
:
:
philip de cadenet
In article <348505...@radio.net>, "Amor Powers, Radio"
<po...@radio.net> writes
>philip de cadenet wrote:
>> I don't need to mention about sufficient wire gauge.
>> I'm going on like an old woman.
>
>
>Amor Powers
You know me better than that, it's a common saying on these shore.
You know how women talk...-)
Phil
philip de cadenet
#12,
>> The most I've ever seen one do is 700 PEP with about 17 volts
>> at the collectors--and that's driven to saturation. I have
>> alot of trouble believing claims of anything much higher than
>> that out of four 2879s. Fiddling with the design may get you
>> 5 to 10 percent more, but that's it. The rest is bullshit,
>> happy meters and/or voltages and drive levels that defy breakdown.
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I regularly see over 600 watts, (typically 700 to 750 watts), from
>totally stock Texas Star DX500 amplifiers. I do not now, nor have I
>ever, advocated any modifications to be made on these amplifiers. If
>someone comes to me with a new Texas Star amplifier and requests that I
>'boost' it like other techs. claim to do; I tell them to save their
>money because there is nothing that I can do to the Texas Star that
>would boost the output enough to be worth paying even a minimum bench
>charge for.
> I wanted to counter your claim that the amp could not produce more than
>600 watts, because I know it can do more than that.
>
>own 6 of them. Two of the peak readers are on my bench at all times so
>that if I get what I think is getting a 'funny' reading, I can compare
>it to the other one to verify accuracy. I normally use a Barker and
>Williamson dummy load wattmeter as a termination, but have various other
>terminations around. (Bird, Heathkit, etc.) I try to be as accurate as I
>can with my readings, and as a result, when I return an amplifier, the
>customer usually sees more watts than I do.
> The 600 to 750 watts that I see can be either dead key watts, or they
>can be peak audio watts. If I use an averaging meter, I can still see
>600 to 750 watts dead key, but will only see 300 to 350 watts average
>power with 100% modulation. But I do regularly see over 600 watts out
>of a DX500 running on 13.9VDC and driven by less than 20 watts.
>(typically less than 10 watts).
>
>>
>> As for beating you up, I don't feel that that's what I'm doing.
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'll let the folks on the web decide that for themselves.
>
>>
>> You can't just come out here as a newbie and jump into a bunch
>> of threads with disagreeing opinions expecting total agreement
>> and an open-armed welcome. In your little corner of the world
>> you may have earned a reputation and be considered all-knowing
>> by those in your orbit, but out here you're nothing but another
>> author of opinion-filled posts. I don't see you as deserving
>> of any special treatment. You were treated as anyone would be
>> who did what you did.
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> SORRY BILL! Am I encroaching on YOUR little corner of the world?
>
>those
>things that I know far to little about and to try to add information
>where I
>was fairly confident in my knowledge.
>
>because
>I did not have much to add and a lot to learn.
>
> You took the first shot at me in this thread when you disagreed about
>making a DX400 into a DX500 and the resultant power output of the DX500.
>
>
>
pull modules on seperate boards.
Do they actually have a low pass filter, if so, what type and how many
sections?
Phil
nq9220700-Ostrowski
philip de cadenet wrote:
> I've never seen a Texas Star on these shore. I'm aware they use push
> pull modules on seperate boards.
> Do they actually have a low pass filter, if so, what type and how many
> sections?
>
> Phil
Phil,
Yes, they use push-pull modules on separate boards.
No, they do not have a low pass filter.
I have seen some 'filters' in some large amps, but I believe they were
there more for impedance matching than anything else. If they did any
filtering it was probably an added benefit to what their real function
was........
#12
Professor
There are no filters on any Texas Star units I ever saw...
--
Professor
_________________________________________
philip de cadenet wrote in message ...
:#12,
:I've never seen a Texas Star on these shore. I'm aware they use push
:
Charles Adkins
Well, I asked and the person offering to give out the information is too
big of a chicken shit to tell me, even in private e-mail and his reasons
are stupid, if the people that were making texas star stopped, why are they
afraid for people to know who they were or is it sean aka Bigdumbassfoot
88 really doesn't know, and who contacted you? the FCC? The makers? or
someone from this news group, I'm gonna get an answer, even if I have to
pay someone to tell who it was, I'm a top dog investigator and I always get
answers...
-Charles
philip de cadenet
> Toshiba Calls them 100 watt devices. Look at the top of the
> first page.
Where did I get 120w from? Maybe in the RFP cat just went to my filing
cabinet and sure enough 100w.
You're right Bill.
philip de cadenet
>Phil,
>
> Yes, they use push-pull modules on separate boards.
>
> No, they do not have a low pass filter.
>
>I have seen some 'filters' in some large amps, but I believe they were
>there more for impedance matching than anything else. If they did any
>filtering it was probably an added benefit to what their real function
>was........
>
>#12
anything other than signals above which it is tuned for?
It is therefor for this reason that just maybe, some of those meters are
reading a little high, ie: all the harmonic content in TS amp's have to
be added in, yes/no anyone?
Do a proper two tone measurement into a peak reading meter then come
back and give us all the low down.
From past experience very few people are able to hold 14.5v on full load
even on micky mouse two transistor amp's.
Phil
Steve Hanis
Charles Adkins wrote in message <3486DDCC...@concentric.net>...
Charles,
I don't know about the validity of Sean's post on 10-2-97 but for what it is
worth:
Subject: LATEST FCC LINEAR BUST INFO
From: "SEAN FOLEY" <big...@xsite.net>
Date: 1997/10/02
Message-ID: <01bcca35$9eba05c0$96fe...@bigfoot.realworld.com>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb
THANKS TO GO TO RON FOR FORWARDING THIS INFO TO ME. HERE'S THE LATEST INFO
FOR ALL TO SEE.
.
NEWS
Report No. CI 97-11 COMPLIANCE AND INFO ACTION October
2,
1997
FEDERAL COMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION UNVEILS
JOINT CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION
The Federal Communications Commission, in conjunction with the United
States
Attorney's Office for the Western District of Michigan and the United
States
Customs
Service, today announced the existence of an ongoing joint investigation.
During the past
four years, the FCC and the Customs Service have conducted a national and
international
investigation into the manufacture, importation, distribution, and sale of
illegal electronic
devices.
There are two types of electronic equipment that are the primary subject
of the
investigation - illegal transceiver radios (CB radios) and power
amplifiers.
The FCC has
established regulations and technical requirements for the operation of
electronic equipment to
ensure the orderly enjoyment of the airwaves. The illegal CB radios and
power
amplifiers
cause interference with electronic communications, such as radio,
television,
and telephone
transmissions and reception. Each year, the FCC receives tens of thousands
of
complaints
from the public involving interference from such equipment.
In a 27 count indictment, ten defendants are charged with unlawfully
importing
and
distributing illegal electronic equipment into the United States in
violation of
18 U.S.C. §
545, and conspiring to import illegal electronic equipment in violation of
18
U.S.C. § 371.
The individuals are subject to a maximum five years' imprisonment and
$250,000
fine, and
three years' supervised release. The corporations are subject to the
greater of
$500,000 or
double the illegal proceeds.
Currently under indictment in the Western District of Michigan are: RANGER
ELECTRONIC
COMMUNICATIONS, INC.; RANGER COMMUNICATIONS, INC. (USA); TSENG JYI
PENG (A/K/A "JIM PENG"); CTE INTERNATIONAL SRL; CORRADO TORREGGIANI;
GIUSEPPE COPPOLA; TEXPRO SALES CANADA INC.; JOHN SUMMACH; PARKSIDE
TRADING (A/K/A/ PRESIDENT EXPORT); and, ARON TYRNAUER (A/K/A "ADAM").
The case is currently awaiting trial before the Honorable Richard Alan
Enslen,
Chief District
Court Judge for the Western District of Michigan.
(over)
- 2
-
The defendants are also charged with money laundering and conspiring to
commit
money
laundering in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 1956. The individuals are subject
to a
maximum
twenty years' imprisonment and $250,000 fine, and five years' supervised
release. The
corporations are subject to the greater of $500,000 or double the illegal
proceeds.
There are two sources of the illegal equipment - domestic manufacturers
and
foreign
manufacturers. The domestic manufacture and sale of illegal equipment is a
violation of 47
U.S.C. §§ 302(a) and 501 (FCC statutes prohibiting devices that cause
harmful
interference),
and 18 U.S.C. §§ 371 (conspiracy), 1001 (false statements), 1341 (mail
fraud),
and 1342
(wire fraud). The importation and distribution of the illegal equipment is
a
violation of all the
above statutes and 18 U.S.C. §§ 542 and 545 (Customs violations for false
declarations upon
importation and importation of contraband).
.
NEWS
Report No. CI 97-11 COMPLIANCE AND INFO ACTION October
2,
1997
FEDERAL COMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION UNVEILS
JOINT CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION
The Federal Communications Commission, in conjunction with the United
States
Attorney's Office for the Western District of Michigan and the United
States
Customs
Service, today announced the existence of an ongoing joint investigation.
During the past
four years, the FCC and the Customs Service have conducted a national and
international
investigation into the manufacture, importation, distribution, and sale of
illegal electronic
devices.
There are two types of electronic equipment that are the primary subject
of the
investigation - illegal transceiver radios (CB radios) and power
amplifiers.
The FCC has
established regulations and technical requirements for the operation of
electronic equipment to
ensure the orderly enjoyment of the airwaves. The illegal CB radios and
power
amplifiers
cause interference with electronic communications, such as radio,
television,
and telephone
transmissions and reception. Each year, the FCC receives tens of thousands
of
complaints
from the public involving interference from such equipment.
In a 27 count indictment, ten defendants are charged with unlawfully
importing
and
distributing illegal electronic equipment into the United States in
violation of
18 U.S.C. §
545, and conspiring to import illegal electronic equipment in violation of
18
U.S.C. § 371.
The individuals are subject to a maximum five years' imprisonment and
$250,000
fine, and
three years' supervised release. The corporations are subject to the
greater of
$500,000 or
double the illegal proceeds.
Currently under indictment in the Western District of Michigan are: RANGER
ELECTRONIC
COMMUNICATIONS, INC.; RANGER COMMUNICATIONS, INC. (USA); TSENG JYI
PENG (A/K/A "JIM PENG"); CTE INTERNATIONAL SRL; CORRADO TORREGGIANI;
GIUSEPPE COPPOLA; TEXPRO SALES CANADA INC.; JOHN SUMMACH; PARKSIDE
TRADING (A/K/A/ PRESIDENT EXPORT); and, ARON TYRNAUER (A/K/A "ADAM").
The case is currently awaiting trial before the Honorable Richard Alan
Enslen,
Chief District
Court Judge for the Western District of Michigan.
(over)
- 2
-
The defendants are also charged with money laundering and conspiring to
commit
money
laundering in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 1956. The individuals are subject
to a
maximum
twenty years' imprisonment and $250,000 fine, and five years' supervised
release. The
corporations are subject to the greater of $500,000 or double the illegal
proceeds.
There are two sources of the illegal equipment - domestic manufacturers
and
foreign
manufacturers. The domestic manufacture and sale of illegal equipment is a
violation of 47
U.S.C. §§ 302(a) and 501 (FCC statutes prohibiting devices that cause
harmful
interference),
and 18 U.S.C. §§ 371 (conspiracy), 1001 (false statements), 1341 (mail
fraud),
and 1342
(wire fraud). The importation and distribution of the illegal equipment is
a
violation of all the
above statutes and 18 U.S.C. §§ 542 and 545 (Customs violations for false
declarations upon
importation and importation of contraband).
In related actions earlier this year, Judy Korp, Business Manager of A-1
Telecom, pled
guilty to accessory after the fact to illegal importation of contraband
electronic equipment.
Angela Jones pled guilty to the illegal manufacture, distribution and sale
of
linear amplifiers
in violation of 47 U.S.C. § 302(a) and C.C.G. Inc. pled guilty to mail
fraud in
connection
with the distribution of the illegal linear amplifiers. Both Jones and
C.C.G.
Inc. admitted to
manufacturing illegal linear amplifiers. Later, Samuel Lewis and R-F
Limited of
Redmond,
Washington, pled guilty to the illegal manufacture, distribution and sale
of
linear amplifiers.
Lewis has agreed to pay approximately $11,894 in forfeiture and civil
fines, and
faces a
maximum sentence of one year in jail. Meanwhile, Greg Lowry of Milton,
Ohio,
has pled
guilty to the illegal manufacture, distribution and sale of similar illegal
equipment. Lowery
now faces a one year term in jail and has agreed to pay the Government
$20,000
in forfeiture
and civil fines. Sentencing of Lewis, Lowry and Jones is pending.
The investigation and prosecution of other manufacturers, importers, and
distributors
continues. The investigation is being headed by FCC Field Agent Michael
Rhine
and Special
Agent Peter Latham of the U.S. Customs Service. Prosecution of the case is
assigned to
Assistant United States Attorney Daniel Mekaru.
- FCC -
News Media Contact: Rosemary Kimball, (202) 418-0500.
Compliance and Information Bureau Contact: Dan Emrick, (202) 418-1150
Steve Hanis
Steve Hanis
Steve Hanis
Professor
This guy is perfect to own a CB shop... He swears about every other word,
even in text.
P.S. Dave, if you want to do something constructive... pray that Charles
starts to take his lithium pills.
--
Professor
_________________________________________
:
:
:
nq9220700-Ostrowski
philip de cadenet wrote:
#12
> Filters surely should have 50 0hm in and out and be invisible to
> anything other than signals above which it is tuned for?
> It is therefor for this reason that just maybe, some of those meters are
> reading a little high, ie: all the harmonic content in TS amp's have to
> be added in, yes/no anyone?
> Do a proper two tone measurement into a peak reading meter then come
> back and give us all the low down.
> From past experience very few people are able to hold 14.5v on full load
> even on micky mouse two transistor amp's.
>
> Phil
Tried same test with various low-pass filters after the amp. The
measured power did drop somewhat, but that could be filter insertion
losses, and I was still able to see over 700 watts peak or just slightly
less as a dead key, out of a DX500 on a Bird wattmeter into a Bird
500watt wide band dummy load at 13.9VDC.
Thanks for your input Phil,
#12
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Amor Powers, Radio
philip de cadenet wrote:
> Filters surely should have 50 0hm in and out and be invisible to
> anything other than signals above which it is tuned for?
Sometimes "filters" are used to match impedance as well. They really are
combination matching circuits and filters.
Amor Powers
philip de cadenet
#12,
> Tried same test with various low-pass filters after the amp. The
>measured power did drop somewhat, but that could be filter insertion
>losses, and I was still able to see over 700 watts peak or just slightly
>less as a dead key, out of a DX500 on a Bird wattmeter into a Bird
>500watt wide band dummy load at 13.9VDC.
However, AFAIK a basic three section chebychev filter design should
offer around 55dB rejection with approx 1dB insertion loss if built and
set up correctly so I should think that the power reduction was due to
lower level harmonic content rather than insertion loss. That IS what
the filter's for:-)
Have you measured the difference between a single tone and two tone test
for peak output, you will also see a difference here as well?
As your measured power level is noticeably greater than what toshiba
quote for four 2879's I'd really be interested in the IMD figures.
I fear these will not be good.
But I guess who the hell cares in a shootout, right!
Take it easy.
Phil.
nq9220700-Ostrowski
Phil,
I do have customers that go to shootouts, but as spectators, and if
they were going to compete, they would NOT be running a DX500.
You have to explain to me why there should be a difference in peak
output power between a single tone and a two tone test signal. I would
expect there to be a difference in the average power but would expect
the peaks to remain substantially the same.
I would really like to see a copy of the Toshiba quote for the power
output for (4) 2SC2879's because I have never seen it.
All of the numbers I have ever seen are for a single transistor running
in a very different circuit configuration!
If you count filter sections by the number of capacitors to ground
separated by inductors,etc.., then these were at least 3 section
filters. They were the standard 'ham' units that start to limit at about
54MHZ when I sweep them, and some of the newer 'CB' filters that start
to limit at about 32MHZ. I got about the same results with both, and
the power drop was not significant. I don't know if it was 1DB or not
and I didn't care because it was not a "significant" amount, maybe 10
watts or less..........
I can send you videotape of the swept frequency response of the filters
I was using, because I had a project a while back to find the 'best'
filter to use behind a CB linear, where some of the local shops paid for
a friend of mine who runs a Metrology Lab to test the various units that
were provided by the shops.
I do not have a 2-tone test generator in my shop; nor do I have the
knowledge of how to measure the intermodulation distortion level of the
amplifier.
My tone generator is a simple hand-held unit that used to be a remote
access device for an answering machine. My driving radio is an old
'whiteface' johnson that still has the original tubes in it from 1965
because I want to see just how long that old unit will run on the
original set of tubes. (The radio is "on" at least 5 hours every
weeknight and 16 hours or more on Sat.and Sun.).
I use different 'drivers' but tend to favor an old Maco 200, which ,
when combined with the adjustable carrier on the whiteface Johnson,
allows me to set carrier and modulation levels pretty much wherever I
want them.
I normally see what an amp will show as peak watts on the Bird meter
with normal voice modulation. ( I usually repeat the number THREE a few
times and look for a pattern on the scope that looks like a sideways
xmas tree ). Then I'll crank up the input power and watch for that
point where an increase in input power generates no increase in output
power. (saturated output). Both of these numbers are ALWAYS in excess
of 600 watts and usually in the range of 700 to 750 watts. If I get
tired of saying 'three' or I need to make an adjustment while the amp is
keyed, I use the tone generator. I believe it is a single tone, but it
may be multiple tones similar to touch-tone signals.
I do have a device for looking at the trapezoid waveforms comparing the
input with the output to see linearity, but when the driver amp is being
distorted by the input parametrics of the big amp, but yet the big amp
faithfully amplifies that distorted waveform, the trapezoid looks
perfect but I can see the distortion on the oscilloscope when I say the
word 'three'......
If you want to tell me what I need to do to measure the intermod, and I
have the required equipment, I will try to do it for you next time I get
a DX500 in.
I also need you to tell me how I will be able to tell how much intermod
is caused by the amplifier and how much is caused by the driver or the
radio itself. If I measure them separately, the driver is not 'seeing'
the the same load that it would be when connected to and driving the
DX500.
I guess I'm the guy who brings a knife to a gunfight (shootout?)
YHTBT
#12
Sean
and Charles wonders why i wouldn't forward the information that he
requested ? if your investigative skills are represented by the "answers"
you've posted here before, your skills as an investigator AND your sources
are pretty poor. Sean
nq9220700-Ostrowski
I have re-posted this item because I still have not had any response
from Phil on this issue!
All of the numbers I have ever seen are for a single transistor unning
Sean
i just had a 667 on the bench last week that did 710 rms and would do 850
peak at 14.5 volts. this is the strongest 667 that i have seen at 14.5
volts. this was measured using a bird 43P into a dummy load. as far as
someone running 150 to 175 watts into a 4 pill, this is done ALL the time
at keydowns. many guys run two pills into 4 pills into 8 pills with high
voltage to boot. i guess we can tell who the "rookies" and who the real
players in the game are. Sean aka Bigfoot
philip de cadenet <ph...@two-way.demon.co.uk> wrote in article
<H3$ugUA64...@two-way.demon.co.uk>...
> They're rated at 120w pep in the Toshiba data sheet in front of me,
> though I'm not dissagreeing with your numbers.
> Phil