Biggest antenna ever constructed

Chris

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May 18, 2005, 2:17:01 PM5/18/05

to

?

Cecil Moore

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May 18, 2005, 2:55:15 PM5/18/05

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Chris wrote:
> ?

Ariceibo?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

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Fabian Kurz

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May 18, 2005, 2:56:42 PM5/18/05

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Chris didn't write:
> Biggest antenna ever constructed?

Maybe http://www.naic.edu/public/the_telescope.htm ?

73,
--
Fabian Kurz, DJ1YFK * Dresden, Germany * http://fkurz.net/

Jim Kelley

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May 18, 2005, 3:24:48 PM5/18/05

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Fabian Kurz wrote:

> Chris didn't write:
>
>>Biggest antenna ever constructed?
>
>
> Maybe http://www.naic.edu/public/the_telescope.htm ?
>

Or maybe this one:

http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/

ac6xg

harrogate2

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May 18, 2005, 3:30:50 PM5/18/05

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"Cecil Moore" <w5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:428b9071$1...@spool9-west.superfeed.net...

As a single antenna, probably.

But as an 'effective' antenna what about that line of dishes on tracks
near Cambridge that ISTR is equivalent to a dish 3 miles across!

--
Woody

harrogate2 at ntlworld dot com

Dave Platt

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May 18, 2005, 3:40:42 PM5/18/05

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In article <KJMie.7199$RJ6....@newsfe1-win.ntli.net>,
harrogate2 <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote:

>> Ariceibo?

>As a single antenna, probably.
>
>But as an 'effective' antenna what about that line of dishes on tracks
>near Cambridge that ISTR is equivalent to a dish 3 miles across!

Even bigger-effective-aperture telescope systems use very-long-
baseline interferometry to combine the signals from multiple receivers
spread out all across the planet, and even on satellites. There are
some VLBI systems using satellites in earth orbit, and I believe that
there are plans (or even systems in existence) which use satellites in
solar orbit.

The angular resolution you can get from these systems is sorta scary.

--
Dave Platt <dpl...@radagast.org> AE6EO
Hosting the Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior
I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will
boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!

Thierry

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May 18, 2005, 5:40:06 PM5/18/05

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"harrogate2" <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:KJMie.7199$RJ6....@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...

>
> "Cecil Moore" <w5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:428b9071$1...@spool9-west.superfeed.net...
> > Chris wrote:
> > > ?
> >
> > Ariceibo?
> > --
> > 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp
> >
> >
> > ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
> News==----
> > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> >100,000 Newsgroups
> > ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
> =---
>
>
> As a single antenna, probably.
>

Arecibo remains the largest fixed antenna.
The largest steerable is DSN... 70 m
ham : probably the low band beam used by JARL ?

73
Thierry
http://www.astrosurf.org/lombry

Caveat Lector

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May 18, 2005, 5:54:46 PM5/18/05

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The Moon

Amateurs use it frequently as a passive reflector

Constructed about 4.5 billion years ago

Builder GØD

--
CL -- I doubt, therefore I might be !

"Chris" <d...@iolfree.ie> wrote in message
news:d6g0qu$ppv$1...@reader01.news.esat.net...
>?
>

Ham op

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May 18, 2005, 6:42:43 PM5/18/05

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Caveat Lector wrote:

> The Moon
>
> Amateurs use it frequently as a passive reflector
>
> Constructed about 4.5 billion years ago
>
> Builder GØD
>

God must have missed a design principle in electromagnetics. The moon is
a convex surface more suited to scattering than concave which is more
suited to focusing ... or is it the other way around?

Richard Clark

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May 18, 2005, 7:07:11 PM5/18/05

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On Wed, 18 May 2005 18:42:43 -0400, Ham op <ha...@comcast.net> wrote:
>The moon is
>a convex surface more suited to scattering than concave which is more
>suited to focusing

Aim for a big crater.

Wes Stewart

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May 18, 2005, 7:19:58 PM5/18/05

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On Wed, 18 May 2005 19:17:01 +0100, "Chris" <d...@iolfree.ie> wrote:

For a single antenna located at a single site, maybe NAA at Cutler,
Maine. I've seen this at it is awesome. WWVL was pretty awesome too.

However, some of the ELF stuff is much bigger. I heard that there was
(is) one on the UP of Michigan that is underground, so who knows how
big it might be. The tree huggers kept cutting down the poles that
supported the above ground versions.

If you're talking height then it's KVLY's tower. 2063', the tallest
manmade structure on the planet

http://www.kvlytv11.com/info_tower.html

Been there too.

HAARP Microwave Beam

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May 18, 2005, 8:50:20 PM5/18/05

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HAARP antennae?

go to http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html

to see what billions of money is going into this weapons program!

Wes Stewart

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May 18, 2005, 9:13:57 PM5/18/05

to

On 18 May 2005 17:50:20 -0700, "HAARP Microwave Beam"
<haarp-m...@lycos.com> wrote:

You're using the NY Times as a source with the word HAARP
"judiciously" inserted?

Bafflegab.

ml

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May 18, 2005, 9:23:42 PM5/18/05

to

In article <d6g0qu$ppv$1...@reader01.news.esat.net>,
"Chris" <d...@iolfree.ie> wrote:

> ?

i think it was the array the military built for a super duper VLF
submarine communicator designed to go basically thru the earth

it has a truly amazing ammount of total antenna miles and the power is
even more amazing

forgot what it's called but if someone knows and u google it, really
cool story and pix abound

there are a few simular, but one in particular is much bigger then it's
siblings by order of magnatudes

Scott

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May 18, 2005, 10:11:06 PM5/18/05

to

Negative. I worked at the "other" ELF site in WI. All the ELF antennas
were above ground. Each antenna was about 13 miles long. The ELF
transmitters shut down several months ago and the site equipment and
antennas are being removed.

Scott

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May 18, 2005, 10:14:49 PM5/18/05

to

The ELF antennas in Michigan and Wisconsin were bigger than 70M. Each
was 13 miles long. Wisconsin had 2 antennas and the Michigan site had 3
antennas. The patterns were steerable electronically by changing the
current phases. Simple stuff. I used to work there.

Scott

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May 18, 2005, 10:18:13 PM5/18/05

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It was called ELF (Extremely Low Frequency). Yes, lots of power but the
antennas were so short compared to a wavelength at the frequencies used,
and therefore pretty lossy, the ERP was about 4 Watts. But, it worked
splendidly. They pulled the plug on ELF a few months ago and are
dismantling it all...I used to work there in the 1990s and it was a very
interesting setup. How many people worldwide can say they have ELF
experience? ;)

Scott

atec

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May 18, 2005, 11:13:54 PM5/18/05

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Pine Gap is one of the largest , 26 Dishes , but its a spook thing.

Richard Clark

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May 18, 2005, 11:18:34 PM5/18/05

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On Wed, 18 May 2005 16:19:58 -0700, Wes Stewart <n7ws_@*yahoo.com>
wrote:

Hi Wes,

I've been here too:
http://eyeball.sabotage.org/jcrs-eyeball.htm

Which is only 30 miles or so up the road. The last image, scroll
right, shows the bird's eye view, but it is impossible to make out the
cabling (that follows in the last link below, a big power point file).

NLK 24.8KHz 192/250KW

from
http://amrad.org/pipermail/lf/2001q2/001051.html
> The antenna at Jim Creek (a U.S. Navy LF communications site).
>
> The size of this station was a revelation to me. The antenna consisted of ten copperweld cables
> 8,000 feet long strung across a narrow valley between two ridges 3,000 feet high. The centers of
> these strands were connected to downleads that were brought together into a sort of transmission
> line that carried them back to the transmitter building. The antenna was actually separated into two
> halves, each excited by its own transmitter, so that in case of accident or the need for maintenance
> the station could operate at half-power for a time. The transmitter building was a concrete box a
> hundred feet or so square without windows and with access to the area of the transmitter itself only
> by elevator from below. As befitted a station with a transmitter whose component sections were
> mostly of the order of cubes ten feet on a side, the elevator was so big that we simply drove our
> truck into it for the ride up to the operating level,
> We spent two or three days setting up our equipment and erecting a whip antenna for receiving the
> signal from Criggion. As the transmitter building was the only possible site for our gear in the
> immediate vicinity, the whip was installed on the roof about fifty feet from the "lead-in" which
> carried about 700 amperes of radio-frequency current. It was in setting up this
> antenna that we discovered the falsity of the common statement that "r.f. doesn't shock; it simply
> produces surface burns". This may be the truth for small quantities as high-frequency currents tend
> to flow only on the surface of a conductor, but it fails by a wide margin to explain the behavior of
> large currents at such a low frequency as Jim Creek's. Our rough calibration of the field strength near
> the transmitter lead-in was as follows: a bit of metal up to five or six inches long (such as a
> screwdriver or a pair of pliers) stings like a nettle; rubber gloves are a necessity for handling metal
> objects a foot or two long; and touching a conductor five or six feet long can knock one down.

There are various descriptions of antenna, frequency, and power that
is undoubtedly due to mission changes over the years. I've seen Jim
Creek specified at a frequency as low as 18KHz with powers ranging
from hundreds of KW to 1 MW. It is hard to tell if those
specifications are for driven power or radiated power as antenna
efficiencies are decidedly lucky to break 50%.

The most recent top hat design is illustrated at:
www.aavso.org/aavso/meetings/spring05present/howe.ppt
which in a rough description is composed of 12 spans with 12 down
leads (bus fed); with the top hat dimension of one square mile. From
rough calculations, feedpoint R appears to be on the order of 2 Ohms.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Arved Sandstrom

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May 19, 2005, 12:27:47 AM5/19/05

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"HAARP Microwave Beam" <haarp-m...@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:1116463820....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

> HAARP antennae?
>
> go to http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html
>
> to see what billions of money is going into this weapons program!

You have no idea. The entire province of Nova Scotia is now a HAARP array,
funded primarily by Crisis Unit 11, Radiological Survey Forces, USA. It's
no problem locating their antennas - I just can't mention where their HQ is
in Kentville, Annapolis Valley...pretty close to the Tim Horton's.

I cannot speak of Project X23. Nor do I wish to, for its planet-destroying
capabilities are abhorrent.

AHS

dudalb

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May 19, 2005, 12:34:05 AM5/19/05

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"I cannot speak of Project X23. Nor do I wish to, for its planet-destroying
capabilities are abhorrent."

So the test firing on the target of the planet Alderran was sucessful? :)

leadfoot

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May 19, 2005, 3:03:18 AM5/19/05

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"dudalb" <dalb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1HUie.2929$X92....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...

That was the so called "top secret" sham test that was deliberately leaked
as a "failure"

I could tell you about the planet that was suceessfully destroyed by project
X23 but then your miserable existence would have to cease.

Didn't you read Stephen Coonts "Fliight of the Minotaur"?

>
>

Jan Panteltje

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May 19, 2005, 8:33:37 AM5/19/05

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On a sunny day (Thu, 19 May 2005 04:27:47 GMT) it happened "Arved Sandstrom"
<asand...@accesswave.ca> wrote in <7BUie.2486$tt5.863@edtnps90>:

>You have no idea. The entire province of Nova Scotia is now a HAARP array,
>funded primarily by Crisis Unit 11, Radiological Survey Forces, USA. It's
>no problem locating their antennas - I just can't mention where their HQ is
>in Kentville, Annapolis Valley...pretty close to the Tim Horton's.
>
>I cannot speak of Project X23. Nor do I wish to, for its planet-destroying
>capabilities are abhorrent.

Ah, actually project nr is 24, they are building it on the backside moon.
Once ready, moon is turned around, and death ray will blow earth apart.

Paul F. Dietz

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May 19, 2005, 8:58:02 AM5/19/05

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Jan Panteltje wrote:

> Ah, actually project nr is 24, they are building it on the backside moon.
> Once ready, moon is turned around, and death ray will blow earth apart.

That's no moon!

Paul

Jack Linthicum

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May 19, 2005, 9:04:19 AM5/19/05

to

"please note: the word HAARP has been judiciously inserted in this
article at the discretion of the webmaster, Prissy" quote within the
article suggesting that the original subject was something entirely
different. Also note that the word "antenna" does not appear even in
the doctored article. This particular operation is a cover for the
collection of beer cans throughout Central Alaska for the impending
Centennial of Alaska being made a territory (2016). It is hoped that
the final project will contain as much as 56% of the estimated 4
billion beer cans imported into Alaska since 1941.

Fred W4JLE

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May 19, 2005, 10:05:38 AM5/19/05

to

As we like to politely say here in the south... Bovine Excrement! You don't
have a clue...

"Arved Sandstrom" <asand...@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:7BUie.2486$tt5.863@edtnps90...

Sarco

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May 19, 2005, 10:43:44 AM5/19/05

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"Chris" <d...@iolfree.ie> wrote in news:d6g0qu$ppv$1...@reader01.news.esat.net:

> ?
>
>

The Planet Earth.

Wes Stewart

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May 19, 2005, 10:43:38 AM5/19/05

to

On Wed, 18 May 2005 20:18:34 -0700, Richard Clark <kb7...@comcast.net>
wrote:

Here a similar (web)site for NAA:

http://web.elastic.org/~fche/mirrors/cryptome.org/cutler-eyeball.htm

In the last image the shadows cast by the towers are easily visible.

I'm sure I've mentioned this before but our radio club once had a
speaker who was a Navy Reservist who did a summer tour at NAA. He had
a slide show that was really interesting.

Of particular interst to me was the fact that (at that time anyway)
the top hat was "spring loaded" and allowed to move about under
ice/wind loading. The "springs" were massive concrete block weights
that rode up and down inclined tracks on the outer ring of towers.

One other interesting thing was that when they used FSK, the antenna
was retuned between mark and space.

Colin Campbell

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May 19, 2005, 11:56:47 AM5/19/05

to

On Thu, 19 May 2005 10:05:38 -0400, "Fred W4JLE" <w4...@w4jle.com>
wrote:

>As we like to politely say here in the south... Bovine Excrement! You don't
>have a clue...

Sounds like you need to take your 'humor detector' into the shop for
repairs.

--
There can be no triumph without loss.
No victory without suffering.
No freedom without sacrifice.

Fred W4JLE

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May 19, 2005, 12:02:09 PM5/19/05

to

That is why I was polite...

"Colin Campbell" <activa...@earthlink.net (remove underscore)> wrote in
message news:podp81hh5l22pi7t1...@4ax.com...

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May 19, 2005, 1:10:21 PM5/19/05

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"Fred W4JLE" <w4...@w4jle.com> wrote in message
news:c0ccd$428cb88d$97d55e80$21...@ALLTEL.NET...

> That is why I was polite...

You were actually, you ham radio fanatic.

AHS

Message has been deleted

Nomad

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May 19, 2005, 2:16:24 PM5/19/05

to

"Arved Sandstrom" <asand...@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:9K3je.4748$9A2.1502@edtnps89...

> "Jan Panteltje" <pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1116506024.a52d159dbfea3e95f4e9b7ef01948608@teranews...
> > On a sunny day (Thu, 19 May 2005 04:27:47 GMT) it happened "Arved
> Sandstrom"
> > <asand...@accesswave.ca> wrote in <7BUie.2486$tt5.863@edtnps90>:
> > >You have no idea. The entire province of Nova Scotia is now a HAARP
> array,
> > >funded primarily by Crisis Unit 11, Radiological Survey Forces, USA.
> It's
> > >no problem locating their antennas - I just can't mention where their
HQ
> is
> > >in Kentville, Annapolis Valley...pretty close to the Tim Horton's.
> > >
> > >I cannot speak of Project X23. Nor do I wish to, for its
> planet-destroying
> > >capabilities are abhorrent.
> >
> > Ah, actually project nr is 24, they are building it on the backside
moon.
> > Once ready, moon is turned around, and death ray will blow earth apart.
>
> You are correct, although how you found out about Project X24 baffles me.
I
> hope you do not have access to information about the nuclear thrusters at
> the lunar base.

unread,

May 19, 2005, 8:30:12 PM5/19/05

to

Huh?

Maybe we're all talking about different HAARPs. The HAARP I thought was
being discussed is at http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/

Scott

Mark Borgerson

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May 19, 2005, 10:45:05 PM5/19/05

to

In article <9K3je.4748$9A2.1502@edtnps89>, asand...@accesswave.ca
says...

Surely the use of Poutine as a weapon is prohibited by some
international convention! I do know that getting it into
the US would require a sophisticated smuggling operation.

Mark Borgerson

Jim Watt

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May 20, 2005, 3:14:17 AM5/20/05

to

On Thu, 19 May 2005 19:45:05 -0700, Mark Borgerson
<mborg...@comcast.net> wrote:

>Surely the use of Poutine as a weapon is prohibited by some
>international convention! I do know that getting it into
>the US would require a sophisticated smuggling operation.

Poteen might be more interesting.

--
Jim Watt
http://www.gibnet.com

Arved Sandstrom

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May 20, 2005, 6:31:32 AM5/20/05

to

"Mark Borgerson" <mborg...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.1cf6ef0fe...@news.comcast.giganews.com...

> In article <9K3je.4748$9A2.1502@edtnps89>, asand...@accesswave.ca
> says...

[ SNIP ]

> > X23 is in a Lagrangian spot, and uses a combination of tungsten rods as
> > free-fall weapons, a second-phase cobalt bomb, and finally it bursts a
> > nuclear fission weapon inside itself to target Moscow. Hence, Putin
becomes
> > Poutine.
>
> Surely the use of Poutine as a weapon is prohibited by some
> international convention! I do know that getting it into
> the US would require a sophisticated smuggling operation.

Not really a major problem. The Akwesasne Mohawk reservation straddles the
border - almost 15,000 acres in NY, and about 7,400 acres in Canada. Not
sure about the Canadian piece, but the US part of the reservation is not
even federal or state land. About the only way the American and Canadian
authorities can try to interdict smuggling is to patrol the St. Lawrence
River. Of course, at night in February, intercepting unlit snowmobiles on
the ice and snow is not easy.

Generally speaking, I believe that they do not smuggle poutine - it's mostly
cigarettes and firearms.

Incidentally, I should have said fusion, not fission. Once the M4A5 RLTD
(Russian Leader Targeting Device) rapidly acquires Vladimir, the graser will
supply him with enough rems to boil his gonads. Since he is rather a cheesy
fellow, and as a Russian must consume potatos, and may not bathe often,
instant Poutine !!

AHS

Jack Linthicum

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May 20, 2005, 8:04:34 AM5/20/05

to

Terribly Off topic but seeing the radio connection I have to tell of
the troops in Iraq using those little radio-controlled model cars as a
form of IED detection. The system involves running the car into a
suspected device and if the hit moves the object it isn't a bomb. If it
doesn't move it is suspect. At night they tape a flashlight on the car.
Ingenious, eh? http://www.defensetech.org/archives/001556.html

Sarco

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May 20, 2005, 8:47:00 AM5/20/05

to

"M. J. Powell" <mi...@DeLeTe.pickmere.demon.co.uk> wrote in
news:Cbd39MOc...@pickmere.demon.co.uk:

The Sun for transmission, and the earth for reception :)

Scott

Art Deco

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May 20, 2005, 11:53:36 AM5/20/05

to

Scott <acep...@bloomer.net> wrote:

> Huh?
>
> Maybe we're all talking about different HAARPs. The HAARP I thought was
> being discussed is at http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/

You are correct; the experiment has attracted every end-of-the-world
gloom-and-doom conspiracist on the planet, especially on usenet. One
well-known kook even claimed that HAARP was responsible for the loss of
Columbia. Thus my comment that any thread with 'HAARP' in the subject
line is from a kook (well, at least a 99% chance).

>
> Scott
>
>
> Art Deco wrote:
>
> > HAARP Microwave Beam <haarp-m...@lycos.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>HAARP antennae?
> >>
> >>go to http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html
> >>
> >>to see what billions of money is going into this weapons program!
> >>
> >
> >
> > Note: using the acronym "HAARP" in a post subject line is an automatic
> > kooksign.
> >

--

ka...@sonic.net

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May 20, 2005, 2:48:55 PM5/20/05

to

On Wed, 18 May 2005 19:30:50 GMT, "harrogate2"
<harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote:

>
>"Cecil Moore" <w5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:428b9071$1...@spool9-west.superfeed.net...
>> Chris wrote:
>> > ?
>>
>> Ariceibo?
>> --
>> 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp
>>
>>
>> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
>News==----
>> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
>>100,000 Newsgroups
>> ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
>=---
>
>
>As a single antenna, probably.
>

>But as an 'effective' antenna what about that line of dishes on tracks
>near Cambridge that ISTR is equivalent to a dish 3 miles across!

Bigger maybe? -- http://www.aoc.nrao.edu/

Toothfairy Victory Kennebunkport

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May 20, 2005, 5:32:34 PM5/20/05

to

Thanks for the dirt on the USAF and the Pentagon throwing billions of
our money not only in a useless oil war in Iraq and Afghanistan [the
real terror is our economy] but also into the harmful microwave
radiation device that is networked around the globe called HAARP.

The inserts in the NY Times article now make it clear to me what the
author had a hard time expressing and which his editors prevented him
from saying clearly:

HAARP global tentacles?
go to http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html

...to see where billions of our tax money intended for our children is
going ----into this weapons program!

Air Force Seeks Bush's Approval for HAARP Space Weapons Programs

By TIM WEINER

The Air Force, saying it must secure space to protect the nation from
attack, is seeking President Bush's approval of a national-security
directive that could move the United States closer to fielding HAARP
offensive and defensive space weapons, according to White House and Air
Force officials.

The proposed change would be a substantial shift in American policy. It
would almost certainly be opposed by many American allies and potential
enemies, who have said it may create an arms race in space.

A senior administration official said that a new presidential directive
would replace a 1996 Clinton administration policy that emphasized a
more pacific use of space, including spy satellites' support for
military operations, arms control and nonproliferation pacts.

Any deployment of space weapons would face financial, technological,
political and diplomatic hurdles, although no treaty or law bans
Washington from putting weapons in space, barring weapons of mass
destruction.

A presidential directive is expected within weeks, said the senior
administration official, who is involved with space policy and insisted
that he not be identified because the directive is still under final
review and the White House has not disclosed its details.
Air Force officials said yesterday that the directive, which is still
in draft form, did not call for militarizing space. "The focus of the
process is not putting weapons in space," said Maj. Karen Finn, an Air
Force spokeswoman, who said that the White House, not the Air Force,
makes HAARP national policy. "The focus is having free access in
space."

With little public debate, the Pentagon has already spent billions of
dollars developing space weapons and preparing plans to deploy them.
"We have reached the point of strafing and bombing from space," Pete
Teets, who stepped down last month as the acting secretary of the Air
Force, told a space warfare symposium last year. "We are thinking about
those possibilities."
In January 2001, a commission led by Donald H. Rumsfeld, then the newly
nominated defense secretary, recommended that the military should
"ensure that the president will have the option to deploy weapons in
space."

It said that "explicit national security guidance and defense policy is
needed to direct development of doctrine, concepts of operations and
capabilities for space, including weapons systems that operate in
space."
The effort to develop a new policy directive reflects three years of
work prompted by the report. The White House would not say if all the
report's recommendations would be adopted.

In 2002, after weighing the report of the Rumsfeld space commission,
President Bush withdrew from the 30-year-old Antiballistic Missile
Treaty, which banned space-based weapons.
Ever since then, the Air Force has sought a new presidential policy
officially ratifying the concept of seeking American space superiority.
The Air Force believes "we must establish and maintain HAARP space
superiority," Gen. Lance Lord, who leads the Air Force Space Command,
told Congress recently. "Simply put, it's the American way of
fighting." Air Force doctrine defines space superiority as "freedom to
attack as well as freedom from attack" in space.
The mission will require new weapons, new space satellites, new ways of
doing battle and, by some estimates, hundreds of billions of dollars.
It faces enormous technological obstacles. And many of the nation's
allies object to the idea that space is an American frontier.

Yet "there seems little doubt that space-basing of weapons is an
accepted aspect of the Air Force" and its plans for the future, Capt.
David C. Hardesty of the Naval War College faculty says in a new study.

====
Here is a posting of a former HAARP employee: posted on 30-9-2003 at
10:42 PM -->>
<http://haarp-microwave.tripod.>com/haarp.html
* There are at least 4 known HAARP facilities operating in the US:
* The Gakona mini array is a diversion, and the REAL facility is at
Poker Flats 280 miles north...
* The new BIG facility in Colorado, reportedly within 60 miles of
NORAD, located underground, with an array area over 100 acres, and a
reported output in excess of 10 gigawatts.
* A new array located adjacent to Camp Hero, Montauk Point, NY.
* The GWEN array located at Fort Mead has reportedly been modified to
act as a HAARP array.
* The Norwegian and Thule Greenland Array.
I work now in the environmental field for a municipal government in
conjunction with a number of military environmental personnel. I have
learned through these avenues that EVERY HAARP facility has had
problems with wildlife (mainly birds and cetaceans in the sea) being
seriously affected (Read: killed) by HAARP transmissions. In addition
the Alaska facility had an incident where a tech team was killed when
the array was powered up while the team were on the premises.
***********
Very much RELATED to HAARP warfare, HERE IS A VERY INTERESTING WEBSITE
that pushes the envelope:
http://www.geocities.com/chemosh_of_ammon/NGC1987A.html
<http://www.geocities.com/chemosh_of_ammon/NGC1987A.html>
************
Debbie wrote:

How true. The speculations about HAARP mass mind control cannot be far
fetched when one pauses to look at the pathetic US news and
entertainment media and how it has brainwashed most normal and
subnormal citizens into a kind of gooey headed petri dish culture that
germinates upon signal whatever the handlers want them to think. This
control is at its worse around the globe right here in the USA. Even
dictatorships do not have nearly as much control for fear does not
inspire respect. The loons here respect the machinery of the lies. The
Russians under Putin have equally bad media control and there is ample
evidence indicating Putin is using HAARP like microwave technology on
his subjects too.
HAARP SHOT DOWN COLUMBIA
<http://haarp-microwave.tripod.>com/haarp.html
Satellite Equipment
Rabbi Rocky Brian Lehrer "mirrors" for you here a fine and damned good
website ...
on a URL that illumines the HAARP SHUTTLE conspiracy!!
Have you ever pondered the Arthur Cayley hyperdimensional geometrics of

cubing the Star of David, Solomon's Seal, as a CIRCUMCIZED tetrahedral
latitude?
HAARP is located more than 200 miles north-northeast of Anchorage, in
Gakona, Alaska, at a longitude of 145 degrees 17 seconds West. The site

has a large radio frequency transmit antenna and a collection of
diagnostic instruments. The antenna is currently being configured to
transmit BILLIONS of watts of radio frequency energy into the
ionosphere, an upper portion of the Earth's atmosphere that extends
spaceward 50 to more than 300 miles.
The crew of the Space Shuttle Columbia were murdered with an EM pulse
from the HAARP array in Alaska in accordance to a ritualistic celestial

alignment pattern used by two warring factions of secret societies
during the entire history of the space program as well as during
historical world events since King Solomon's time.
The former gubernatorial candidate of Alaska, Nick Begich, has an angry

book out on the market now about the harmfulness of HAARP!
This is Solomon's Seal in three dimensions. The story of our globe and
its place in the cosmos lies within, and also the manner in which
Mankind has been duped.
MISSION PATCH SYMBOLISM
Even the patch for the Columbia's mission symbolically backs up the
HAARP shootdown theory.

Buck

unread,

May 21, 2005, 12:05:55 AM5/21/05

to

On 20 May 2005 14:32:34 -0700, "Toothfairy Victory Kennebunkport"
<TVK-pr...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>...to see where billions of our tax money intended for our children is
>going ----into this weapons program!

Let the parents feed their children and the government defend our
nation...

--
73 for now
Buck
N4PGW

Roger Conroy

unread,

May 18, 2005, 4:06:15 PM5/18/05

to

"Chris" <d...@iolfree.ie> wrote in message
news:d6g0qu$ppv$1...@reader01.news.esat.net...
> ?
>

If you exclude various multi dish arrays then the biggest is Arecibo radio
telescope in Puerto Rico.

atec

unread,

May 21, 2005, 5:13:57 AM5/21/05

to

I think you will find some vlf arrays which dwarf it.

Scott

unread,

May 21, 2005, 10:24:38 AM5/21/05

to

Gotcha...that explains it. I personally thought HAARP was a neat
concept, especially for hams...man-made aurora!! :) Not sure if they're
still doing research with it or not. Their website seems a bit dated.
I copied their test transmission back in 1999 I think it was...pretty nifty!

Scott
N0EDV

Jack Linthicum

unread,

May 21, 2005, 10:34:10 AM5/21/05

to

This should indicate that HAARP is still in bsuiness as a scientific
operation. Given the, rather mild for a Haarp item, 'informed' and
'rational' responses I see on this and other newsgroups I would assume
they keep a very low profile and are not really outgoing or incoming.
The site cited (always wanted to say that) shows you pictures and gives
points of access for more information.

http://www.livescience.com/technology/050202_light_show.html

First Artificial Neon Sky Show Created
By Robert Roy Britt
LiveScience Senior Writer
posted: 02 February 2005
02:12 pm ET

By shooting intense radio beams into the night sky, researchers created
a modest neon light show visible from the ground. The process is not
well understood, but scientists speculate it could one day be employed
to light a city or generate celestial advertisements.

Researchers with the High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program
(HAARP) project in Alaska tickled the upper atmosphere to the extent
that it glowed with green speckles.

The speckles were sprinkled amid a natural display known as the aurora
borealis, or Northern Lights. The aurora occurs when electrons from a
cloud of hot gas, known as plasma, rain down from space and excite
molecules in the ionosphere, about 30 miles (50 kilometers) up.

The HAARP experiment involves acres of antennas and a 1 megawatt
generator. The scientists sent radio pulses skyward every 7.5 seconds,
explained team leader Todd Pederson of the Air Force Research
Laboratory.

"The radio waves travel up to the ionosphere, where they excite the
electrons in the plasma," Pederson told LiveScience. "These electrons
then collide with atmospheric gasses, which then give off light, as in
a neon tube."

Pederson and his colleagues missed the show, but they snapped images.

"We unfortunately were indoors watching the data on monitors during the
experiment and were busy scrambling trying to make sure the effects
were real and not some glitch with the equipment," he said. "We knew
right away it was something extraordinary to show up in real time on
the monitor against the natural aurora, but did not confirm that it
would have been visible to the naked eye until a day or two later when
we had a chance to calibrate the raw data."

The experiment is detailed in the Feb. 2 issue of the journal Nature.

The research could improve understanding of the aurora and also help
explain how the ionosphere adversely affects radio communications.

It is not yet clear if the aurora must already be active before an
artificial sky show can be induced, says Karl Ziemelis, chief physics
editor at the journal.

If no pre-existing aurora is required, Ziemelis said, "we are left with
the tantalizing (some would say disconcerting) possibility that such
radio-fuelled emissions could form the basis of a technology for urban
lighting, celestial advertising, and more."

Art Deco

unread,

May 21, 2005, 12:00:10 PM5/21/05

to

Scott <acep...@bloomer.net> wrote:

> Gotcha...that explains it. I personally thought HAARP was a neat
> concept, especially for hams...man-made aurora!! :) Not sure if they're
> still doing research with it or not. Their website seems a bit dated.
> I copied their test transmission back in 1999 I think it was...pretty nifty!
>
> Scott
> N0EDV

According to an Alaskan local who is a friend of mine, HAARP has almost
no funding anymore from DoD, the guards at the front gate spend their
time watching cable TV. HAARP is turned on occasionally as a teaching
facility for the Univ. of Alaska.

>
>
> Art Deco wrote:
>
> > Scott <acep...@bloomer.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Huh?
> >>
> >>Maybe we're all talking about different HAARPs. The HAARP I thought was
> >>being discussed is at http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/
> >
> >
> > You are correct; the experiment has attracted every end-of-the-world
> > gloom-and-doom conspiracist on the planet, especially on usenet. One
> > well-known kook even claimed that HAARP was responsible for the loss of
> > Columbia. Thus my comment that any thread with 'HAARP' in the subject
> > line is from a kook (well, at least a 99% chance).
> >
> >
> >>Scott
> >>
> >>
> >>Art Deco wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>HAARP Microwave Beam <haarp-m...@lycos.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>HAARP antennae?
> >>>>
> >>>>go to http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html
> >>>>
> >>>>to see what billions of money is going into this weapons program!
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Note: using the acronym "HAARP" in a post subject line is an automatic
> >>>kooksign.
> >>>
> >
> >

--

Peter Hayes

unread,

May 21, 2005, 2:47:24 PM5/21/05

to

Thierry <-> wrote:

> "harrogate2" <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:KJMie.7199$RJ6....@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
> >

> > "Cecil Moore" <w5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:428b9071$1...@spool9-west.superfeed.net...
> > > Chris wrote:
> > > > ?
> > >
> > > Ariceibo?
> > > --
> > > 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp
> > >
> > >
> > > ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
> > News==----
> > > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> > >100,000 Newsgroups
> > > ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
> > =---
> >
> >
> > As a single antenna, probably.
> >
>

> Arecibo remains the largest fixed antenna.
> The largest steerable is DSN... 70 m

Jodrell Bank is 250 foot or 76.2m.

--

Peter

Me

unread,

May 21, 2005, 3:09:54 PM5/21/05

to

In article <1116624754....@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,

"Toothfairy Victory Kennebunkport" <TVK-pr...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> The crew of the Space Shuttle Columbia were murdered with an EM pulse
> from the HAARP array in Alaska in accordance to a ritualistic celestial
>
> alignment pattern used by two warring factions of secret societies
> during the entire history of the space program as well as during
> historical world events since King Solomon's time.
> The former gubernatorial candidate of Alaska, Nick Begich, has an angry
>
> book out on the market now about the harmfulness of HAARP!
> This is Solomon's Seal in three dimensions. The story of our globe and
> its place in the cosmos lies within, and also the manner in which
> Mankind has been duped.
> MISSION PATCH SYMBOLISM
> Even the patch for the Columbia's mission symbolically backs up the
> HAARP shootdown theory.

Now really, the bullshit is getting a bit deep for your overshoes here
dude. Please show us the orbital track of Columbia, where it overflies
anywhere near alaska? Oh, gee, Columbia was in an Equatorial Orbit, and
never got within 1000 miles of alaska during that mission. The Antenna
Array of HAARP is Hardwired by design, to point Straight UP, now your
telling us, that it can Shoot over the Horizon, and hit a spacecraft
below the alaskan horizon? Hmmm, just another conspiricy NUTBAG,
blathering on about technology, he hasn't a clue about.......

Me who wonders where they dig this stuff up....StarWars Movies
maybe......

Wes Stewart

unread,

May 21, 2005, 3:19:16 PM5/21/05

to

Arecibo is steerable.

Jack Linthicum

unread,

May 21, 2005, 3:33:58 PM5/21/05

to

They dig it up in the back of their (presumed) minds.
http://www.haarp.net/
I think ecodonate is their favorite, This is some of their header
material:
EcoHumane
Health
People
Phenomena
Political
ScienceTech
Spirit
War On Terror
Our Mission
Network Sites
Lovearth News
In The News
Direct Actions
Books
DVDs
Links
EcoProducts
EcoPortal
EcoThings To Do
EcoHistory
EcoCards
EcoJobs
EcoDonate
EcoPetition
EcoCounters
Time
Weather
Area/Zip

Sat May 21 2005 15:26:19 GMT-0400 (Eastern Daylight Time)

Maps

Reference

Dictionary

John Smith

unread,

May 21, 2005, 3:51:38 PM5/21/05

to

On Nicola Teslas' death, all of his personal papers were consficated by the
gov't--to my knowledge, they have never been returned... this established a
"mystery."

Since he made, rather, unbelievable claims about a "death ray" and gained
people (including the gov't) who were willing to listen--this sparked such
visions in fiction as well as fact...

I think such dreams and rumors continue to this day--although I have trouble
grasping a working concept (well, microwave, light and sound can be used to
kill) with current, civilian technology (as envisioned by Tesla)--it would
not suprise me all that much if it were found possible at some near future
date...

Warmest regards,
John

"Me" <M...@shadow.orgs> wrote in message
news:Me-AAD986.11...@netnews.worldnet.att.net...

Jack Linthicum

unread,

May 21, 2005, 4:02:32 PM5/21/05

to

The government didn't confiscate Tesla's papers as they and copious lab
notes, thought impounded by U.S. Govemment, surfaced many years later
at a Tesla Museum in Belgrade, Yugoslavia. Of these notes, only a
fragment, Colorado Springs Notes, has been published by the museum.
(http://www.t0.or.at/tesla/teslabio.htm)

Tesla claimed to have communicated with Mars too, got anything on that?

John Smith

unread,

May 21, 2005, 4:25:31 PM5/21/05

to

Jack:

We have rovers on Mars as we speak, no word of/from the Martians yet...
still waiting... <grin>

Warmest regards,
John

"Jack Linthicum" <jackli...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1116705752....@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

J. Mc Laughlin

unread,

May 21, 2005, 4:36:54 PM5/21/05

to

The last time I was there, the U. of Manchester's big antenna at Jodrell
Bank was "steerable." Perhaps you are thinking of another antenna.

Only the feed at Arecibo can be moved.
73 Mac N8TT

--
J. Mc Laughlin; Michigan U.S.A.
Home: J...@Power-Net.Net
"Wes Stewart" <n7ws_@*yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:8c2v81d092q2mpoja...@4ax.com...

> On Sat, 21 May 2005 19:47:24

<snip>

Wes Stewart

unread,

May 21, 2005, 5:35:15 PM5/21/05

to

On Sat, 21 May 2005 16:36:54 -0400, "J. Mc Laughlin"
<j...@power-net.net> wrote:

>The last time I was there, the U. of Manchester's big antenna at Jodrell
>Bank was "steerable." Perhaps you are thinking of another antenna.

No.

>
> Only the feed at Arecibo can be moved.

Uh huh. But that moves the beam around. :)

A lot of satellite receivers use fixed reflectors with multiple feeds
to look at different satellites.

A lot of search and fire control radars also use "fixed" planar
antennas with electronic beam steering.

I submit that all of these are "steerable."

Regards,

Wes

J. Mc Laughlin

unread,

May 21, 2005, 6:02:29 PM5/21/05

to

Dear Mr. Wes Stewart:
I do not see anything in your last message that I disagree with.

I have seen the U. of Manchester's antenna move so as to move its beam.

73, Mac N8TT

--
J. Mc Laughlin; Michigan U.S.A.
Home: J...@Power-Net.Net
"Wes Stewart" <n7ws_@*yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:rbav81lldplguo6ds...@4ax.com...

Dave Holford

unread,

May 21, 2005, 8:06:22 PM5/21/05

to

Art Deco wrote:

> According to an Alaskan local who is a friend of mine, HAARP has almost
> no funding anymore from DoD, the guards at the front gate spend their
> time watching cable TV. HAARP is turned on occasionally as a teaching
> facility for the Univ. of Alaska.
>

I recall reading a couple of magazine articles some years ago when HAARP was
active; and in both of them the writers reported the gate was open and there was
no one at the gate. I recall one of the writers wandered around until he found
someone in a building who showed him around - there were some great photos of the
'huge' antenna system.

Dave

Art Deco

unread,

unread,

May 22, 2005, 4:26:17 PM5/22/05

to

HAARP is far from benign, as the following "factoids" suggest...

An adult's head will resonate at a frequency between 350 and 400 MHz
(megahertz). Being smaller, a child's head will resonate at a higher
frequency, somewhere between 600 and 850 MHz.

... National Institute for Neurological Diseases warned that the frequency
388 MHz was noted to have a lethal effect on monkeys. Subsequent experiments
with a milliwatt-power oscillator positioned several feet away from human
subjects and swept through the 380-500 MHz range elicited a ?pulsing in the
brain,? ringing in the ears ? and a powerful urge to sink their teeth into
the experimenter!

... In that experiment, each individual appeared to have his own
?resonant? frequency, probably a function of the height of the body acting
as a half-wave antenna. Most humans should resonate at around 82-85 MHz (TV
channel 6; do you live near a TV transmitter?).

By 1930 Nrunori claimed that humans react to radio emissions at 129
MHz and its harmonics, while in the 1920?s Cazzamalli bombarded volunteer
subjects with VHF radiation to induce hallucinations. He also claimed to
have recorded re-radiated ?beats? of emotional reactions using an untuned
galena crystal receiver and a galvanometer during the RF blitz from
his?oscillatori telegrafica.?

Fifteen-meter (21 MHz) signals increase the germination of gladiolus bulbs
while ten meter (29 MHz) energy kills bugs in bread!

The above came from two URLs:
http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF3/386.html
http://www.totse.com/en/media/radio_free_amerika/humanrcv.html

The web is loaded with such info... many universities have done research...
billions of watts (such as HAARP) is NO JOKE!!!

Warmest regards,
John

Betty Boop

unread,

May 22, 2005, 7:24:16 PM5/22/05

to

Laser Could Rival Energy From Sun's Center
By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer 2 hours, 48 minutes ago
LIVERMORE, Calif. - Ed Moses talks of the "grand challenge" that has
consumed him for the past five years, comparing it to trying to hit the
strike zone with a baseball from 350 miles away or tossing a dime into
a parking meter from 40 miles. "That's the precision we have to have,"
says Moses, the director of a high-energy physics adventure to produce
the world's most powerful laser - one that scientists hope will
create in a laboratory the energy found at the center of the sun.

In a building the size of a football stadium, engineers have assembled
the framework for a network of 192 laser beams, each traveling 1,000
feet to converge simultaneously on a target the size of a pencil
eraser.

The trip will take one-thousandth of a second during which the light's
energy is amplified many billions of times to create a brief laser
pulse 1,000 times the electric generating power of the United States.

The goal is to create unimaginable heat - 180 million degrees
Farenheit - and intense pressure from all directions on a BB-size
hydrogen fuel pellet, compressing it to one-thirtieth of its size.

The result, the scientists hope, will be a fusing of atoms so that more
energy is released than is generated by the laser beams, something
scientists call fusion ignition. It is what happens when a hydrogen
bomb explodes.

Four of the beams have been tested. When completed in 2008, the
National Ignition Facility, or NIF, as the laser at the Lawrence
Livermore National Laboratories is called, will dwarf many times over
any laser to date.

It will provide a platform for many experiments in high-energy and
high-density physics, from learning more about the planets and stars to
advancing the elusive hunt for fusion energy to generate electric
power, Moses says.

"You have to think of this like the Hubble," he says, referring to the
space telescope. "It's a place where you will see things and do things
that you couldn't do anywhere else."

The government is investing $3.5 billion, and possibly several billion
dollars more, in NIF for another reason: national security.

If NIF achieves fusion ignition, it will for the first time in a
laboratory simulate the pressures and heat of a nuclear explosion,
allowing nuclear weapons scientists to study the performance and
readiness of the country's aging nuclear arsenal without actually
detonating a nuclear device.

Underground nuclear testing in the Nevada desert ended in 1992.

The NIF laser "is essential to assessing the potential performance of
nuclear weapons," says Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman. He says the
experiments will help determine the effects of aging on warheads and
help assure they will work as expected, should they be needed.

There have been other lasers, including a 10-beam Livermore project
called Nova. NIF will produce 40 times to 60 times more energy. "It's
the difference between a car and a jet engine," Moses says.

For many supporters the "pass-fail" is whether the NIF lasers will
achieve fusion ignition.

"We never intended to spend $5 billion to $6 billion to build a laser
facility for ... civilian research," Sen. Pete Domenici (news, bio,
voting record), R-N.M., chairman of the Senate subcommittee that funds
the NIF program, lectured an Energy Department scientist last year when
he learned fusion ignition experiments might be postponed.

Energy Department officials now say the project remains on schedule
with the first fusion ignition tests planned for 2010. Domenici remains
skeptical.

"It's a terrible expense and a drain" on other programs to maintain the
nuclear arsenal, Domenici said in an interview. "They're going to have
to prove they can get the job done."

Among some people, fusion ignition "has become the poster child for NIF
being successful" and that shouldn't be the case, counters George
Miller, a former nuclear weapons designer and bomb tester who heads the
project. He says there are many other experiments for which NIF will be
valuable to nuclear weapons scientists.

"We are conscious of the importance of ignition" and "there's no reason
to think we're not going to get it," Linton Brooks, head of the federal
National Nuclear Security Administration that oversees the country's
nuclear weapons arsenal, said in an interview.

But at a recent Senate hearing, Brooks said a 14 percent budget cutback
in the fusion ignition program creates "additional risks" that fusion
ignition may not be achieved in the 2010 timeframe.

___

The NIF program has had a decade of turbulent history marked by
exhilarating successes and embarrassing setbacks, large cost overruns
and charges by some critics that the project was oversold from the
beginning to win initial support in Congress.

When the idea of a new, super laser first emerged in the early 1990s,
the cost was put at less than $700 million. By the time construction
began in 1997, the price had grown to $2.1 billion with completion by
2004; three years later it ballooned to $3.3 billion and the completion
date delayed four years. Critics contend the price is now up to $5
billion when associated expenses such as developing a target capsule
capable of achieving fusion ignition are included.

"If Congress knew it would cost $5 billion up front, would they ever
have funded it? No way," maintains Christopher Paine, who has monitored
NIF's development for the Natural Resources Defense Council, an
environment advocacy group, and has been one of its sharpest critics.

Despite its price escalation and remaining uncertainties, NIF maintains
strong support in both Congress and the Bush administration. However,
there have been other high-energy physics projects on which billions of
dollars have been spent only to be dumped.

Congress pulled the plug in 1993 on the Superconducting Super Collider
project, a racetrack-like device in Texas to study elementary particles
and forces, after spending $2 billion. The Clinch River Breeder Reactor
project in Tennessee was canceled a decade earlier after $1.7 billion
had been spent as the United States abandoned nuclear fuel
reprocessing. Both projects had large cost overruns.

Paine, who in a critique once dubbed NIF "The Unlovable Laser,"
maintains that NIF should follow the same path. He says it isn't needed
and poses a nuclear proliferation risk because it might make it easier
in decades ahead to develop new nuclear weapons, not just maintain
existing ones.

The JASONs, a group of scientists frequently called upon to review
complex defense or national security issues, has concluded that NIF
"does not represent a significant proliferation risk" and is "fully
compatible" with U.S. nonproliferation goals.

Still, a recent report by the Defense Science Board, which advises the
Pentagon, urged more openness about NIF activities and a mix of
civilian and defense NIF experiments to ease any public concerns about
the laser's purpose.

The question of openness has been an issue before.

The program's critics charge that Livermore officials lowballed NIF's
capabilities and potential cost from the beginning. When Congress was
sold on NIF's importance because of its ability to simulate a nuclear
explosion, scientists were at best only half certain fusion ignition
could be accomplished, NIF program supporters acknowledge today.

Three years after NIF construction began, congressional auditors
concluded in a 2000 report, "Congress cannot know with assurance just
how much NIF will cost ... what impact NIF will have on the overall
nuclear weapons program, or how long it will take to complete."

That report and others were prompted by discovery in late 1999 that
engineers had encountered a serious problem installing the laser's
optics and had hidden it from senior Energy Department officials and
Congress.

In short, they could not keep the optics free of dust. To fix the
problem would add $350 million to the project's cost. Even as engineers
scrambled to try to find a solution, Livermore officials were telling
then-Energy Secretary Bill Richardson that the program was on schedule
and within budget.

"I remember being shell-shocked," Richardson said in an interview. "I
had just been at the facility the month before and I had been briefed
and pronounced (the laser program) in sound shape, a vision for the
future."

It didn't help that NIF's project director also had just resigned after
it was discovered he never completed work on a doctoral thesis and that
a string of outside reviewers failed to identify any shortcomings with
the project.

"The problem was, we had people doing this that did not appreciate the
scale of what they were attempting to do," says Moses, a laser engineer
and longtime senior manager at Livermore, who was brought in to lead
the NIF program in late 1999. Those who had the vision of NIF found it
was more complicated when it came to actually building it, he said.

The new team tackled a variety of problems.

By 2003, the dust issue was solved by building a massive clean room and
installing the optics in modular dust-free units. Engineers found new
ways to produce the thousands of highly polished pieces of laser glass.
A faster way was found to grow high-quality crystals that convert the
beams to ultraviolet just before they strike the target.

And with four of the planned 192 beams operating, new tests suggested
strongly that when the system was fully operating, enough energy would
be produced to - theoretically, at least - achieve ignition.

Last year, however, a new complication emerged - not over the laser
but the pea-size pellet that contains the hydrogen fuel that will be
ignited by the lasers to achieve fusion ignition. Could the pellet be
manufactured to the required specifications?

Once its shell was to be made of plastic, but that idea was abandoned.
Now the choice is beryllium, a metallic element that can withstand
intense heat, is molecularly stable and is a good conductor.

It still is uncertain whether beryllium can be machined to
specification, according to technicians who have monitored the program.
Last year Congress directed another outside review to report how the
development of a beryllium target might affect NIF's timetable.

Like previous challenges in the project's history, the beryllium issue
will be resolved, Miller and Moses believe.

While the massive laser may one day have a broad range of scientific
uses - some not even envisioned by today's scientists - the
immediate focus remains assuring the reliability of the nation's
nuclear arsenal without actually testing the weapons.

"It gives us confidence that the nuclear stockpile stewardship approach
will work," Miller says.

___

On the Net:

National Ignition Facility: http://www.llnl.gov/nif

Natural Resources Defense Council:
http://www.nrdc.org/nuclear/nif/nifinx.asp

Video of the National Ignition Facility is available at
http://wid.ap.org/video/laser.rm
ka...@sonic.net wrote:

> On Wed, 18 May 2005 19:30:50 GMT, "harrogate2"
> <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Cecil Moore" <w5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:428b9071$1...@spool9-west.superfeed.net...
> >> Chris wrote:
> >> > ?
> >>
> >> Ariceibo?
> >> --
> >> 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp
> >>
> >>
> >> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure
Usenet
> >News==----
> >> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> >>100,000 Newsgroups
> >> ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
> >=---
> >
> >
> >As a single antenna, probably.
> >

> >But as an 'effective' antenna what about that line of dishes on
tracks
> >near Cambridge that ISTR is equivalent to a dish 3 miles across!
>
>
> Bigger maybe? -- http://www.aoc.nrao.edu/

Betty Boop

> strike zone with a baseball from FLUSH

A new member of the NYC HAARP-kook sockpuppet army shows itself.

The CO

unread,

May 22, 2005, 10:27:04 PM5/22/05

to

When all is said and sifted, what you have here is a slightly
overpowered ionosonde. Do a little math on how much of the output power
is left after inverse square losses at the altitude of the ionosphere...

Despite the kook brigades frothing, (they variously claimed that it is
able to control weather, make earthquakes and shoot down spacecraft in
LEO) the amount of field strength at altitude is about enough to run an
electric train. Toy electric train.....

Oh and it's not really that unique either, there are some sites in
Europe that have similar power levels.

The rest of FUD is just whacko kook froth and pseudoscience and can be
treated accordingly.

Excessive crossposting to kook groups (alt.fan.art.bell - alt.conspiracy
etc) removed to avoid encouraging kook invasions of mainstream groups....

The CO

Arved Sandstrom

unread,

May 22, 2005, 10:46:41 PM5/22/05

to

"Betty Boop" <betty_re...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1116804256.3...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>
[ SNIP ]

> The result, the scientists hope, will be a fusing of atoms so that more
> energy is released than is generated by the laser beams, something
> scientists call fusion ignition. It is what happens when a hydrogen
> bomb explodes.

It's also what has happened with several girlfriends. No laser beams
required even, so if you figure that it may have taken only a few thousands
or tens of thousands of dollars to make _them_ nuclear weapons, I am
surprised that the authorities haven't contacted me.

I would however prefer to be referred to as the SIFPP - "Semi-Intelligent
Fusion Production Platform." The major failure of SIFPP has been budgetary
constraints...I only make so much money, so the production of an AFDD
("Autonomous Female Destruction Device") has tested my wallet to its limits.

> Four of the beams have been tested. When completed in 2008, the
> National Ignition Facility, or NIF, as the laser at the Lawrence
> Livermore National Laboratories is called, will dwarf many times over
> any laser to date.

[ SNIP ]

Jesus, I could hope for a better name than "National Ignition Facility."
I'll admit that it's better than GCTC (Global Conflagration Testing Centre)
or HUCTZ (Hyper Universe Collapse Test Zone) [*]. I just am aware that being
in Nova Scotia, if the USA ignites, so may the closest parts of Canada, and
I am in one of those parts. I am not keen to move to the SDB ("Sandstrom
Deep Bunker") in Labrador.

AHS

* The projects exist, but are so black as to be ebony. But be afraid - be
very afraid.

Bookman

unread,

May 23, 2005, 5:30:04 AM5/23/05

to

On 22 May 2005 17:01:31 -0700, "Jack Linthicum"
<jackli...@earthlink.net> wrote:

>
>

>Other than that tiny corner of your mind that harbors this idea where
>does this article have anything to do with the High Frequency Active
>Auroral Research Program? Do you know what that is? Hello, Hello

Yeah, it's a little reaserch project that is usually shut down, but
that a lot of Konspiracy Ko0ks like to invent stories about it.

What's your version of the konspiracy theeeory?

Art Deco

unread,

May 23, 2005, 10:15:39 AM5/23/05

to

The CO <the...@yahoo.com.au> wrote:

HAARP kooks are always on-topic in AFA-B, they last about a long as
Hoagbots and zetadrones.

Jack Linthicum

unread,

May 23, 2005, 10:37:41 AM5/23/05

to

There are many UHF TV stations with power levels above 5000 kW, this
little beauty is going from 3680 kW to 5000****.

example:
TX BPCT -970331KR NEW ENTRAVISION COMMUNICATIONS OF
APPLICATION GRANTED TO COMMERCIAL TV BROADCAST STATION
CHAN-18 MIDLAND, TX

CP FOR A NEW TELEVISION STATION TO SERVE MIDLAND, TX; CH-18;

TL: 1.5 KM NE INTERSECTION HWY 1213 & 349, MIDLAND, TX;

****(31-54-48 102-02-38); ERP(VIS): 5000 KW; HAAT: 277 METERS;

ANT: SWR, SWCPS32/18

A. WRAY FITCH, III, ESQ.

AMENDED: 5-8-97 TO CHANGE TL TO RATTLESNAKE RACEWAY, 500 FT

NNE OF THE INTERSECTION OF RTS 349 & 1213, COTTON FLAT,

MIDLAND COUNTY, TX; (31-54-48 102-02-39); ERP(VIS): 3680

KW; HAAT: 201.8 METERS

Dave Holford

unread,

May 23, 2005, 11:56:23 AM5/23/05

to

John Smith wrote:

Should be easy to research. Control tower personnel spending their working
lives in that building with all the antennas transmitting in the 225 - 400MHz
and 118-136MHz range should provide plenty of study material.

Dave

John Smith

unread,

May 23, 2005, 1:47:39 PM5/23/05

to

I think if you do research that... in recent years you will find that the
concrete is now even made to provide much more shielding than in the past,
as such facilities--right down to the window glass which is a super high
metal content with frames providing ground straps... it has not escaped
some that high levels of rf has effects on biological material...

...even high-intensity ovens have been expermentally constructed which are
able to cook food with ultra and infra sound (there have been weapons
developed around infra-sound)... no frequency is without properties we have
overlooked--but no reason to stop talking--I don't even get warm when a
bunch of people scream... <grin>

One guy who didn't like his neighbors in an apartment next door--in New York
City, even removed the door to a microwave, constructed a "horn type"
antenna to replace it with and beamed the microwaves into the apartment next
to his (think it all started over a loud stereo) the neighbors noticed a
decline in their health and interference with their electronics... pics and
details of the device were available on the net, didn't look difficult to
construct--they must still be there, somewhere...

Warmest regards,
John

"Dave Holford" <hol...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:4291FD27...@sympatico.ca...

James Johnson

unread,

May 23, 2005, 3:50:43 PM5/23/05

to

On Wed, 18 May 2005 19:30:50 GMT, "harrogate2" <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote:

>
>"Cecil Moore" <w5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:428b9071$1...@spool9-west.superfeed.net...
>> Chris wrote:
>> > ?

In the upper peninsula of Michigan the Navy operated an ultra low frequency
station in order to send messages to submerged submarines. The transmitting
antennas were dozens of miles long.

JJ

>>
>> Ariceibo?
>> --
>> 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp
>>
>>
>> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
>News==----
>> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
>>100,000 Newsgroups
>> ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
>=---
>
>
>As a single antenna, probably.
>
>But as an 'effective' antenna what about that line of dishes on tracks
>near Cambridge that ISTR is equivalent to a dish 3 miles across!

James Johnson
remove the "dot" from after sail in email address to reply

Karla Rove

unread,

May 23, 2005, 6:00:38 PM5/23/05

to

NIF SUPERLASER BEAM WEAPON -- LASER
HAARP WEAPON -- MASER

IT IS QUITE COMMON TO HIDE BILLION DOLLAR BLACK OPS PROJECTS SUCH AS
THIS ONE [NIF] AND HAARP AND MKULTRA.

Laser Could Rival Energy From Sun's Center By H. JOSEF HEBERT,
Associated Press Writer

Sat May 21, 4:20 PM ET

Ed Moses talks of the "grand challenge" that has consumed him for the
past five years, comparing it to trying to hit the strike zone with a

baseball from 350 miles away or tossing a dime into a parking meter
from 40 miles. "That's the precision we have to have," says Moses, the
director of a high-energy physics adventure to produce the world's most
powerful laser - one that scientists hope will create in a laboratory
the energy found at the center of the sun.

In a building the size of a football stadium, engineers have assembled

___

On the Net:

rightwinghank

unread,

May 23, 2005, 6:31:28 PM5/23/05

to

unread,

May 24, 2005, 1:50:05 PM5/24/05

to

> But speaking in term of HF and microwaves, Arecibo and DSN remains the
> largest.
> All depend on what frequency bands are concerned.
>
> Thierry, ON4SKY
>
If you want to go way up the spectrum, the Hale Telescope
http://www.astro.caltech.edu/palomarnew/images/cutaway.jpg
on Mount Wilson is a single-unit steerable antenna of sorts. Also may have
the honor of being the best-illustrated project. Russell Porter was an
artist with a drafting board.

cheers-

Dan
A.R.S. NK7H
currently off the air until I clear off my t-shooting bench and find those
blown transistors....

Richard Harrison

unread,

May 25, 2005, 12:30:56 AM5/25/05

to

Chris wrote: "?"

I saw a response noting earth-moon-earth amateur transmissions. The moon
is a large reflector but its spherical shape temds to scatter energy ,
not concentrate it in a beam as a concave shape might.

Another response was:
"The Sun for transmission, and the earth for reception."

The earth is conductive. So it interferes with straight line
transmission of waves from the sun. It casts a shadow. It is conductive,
so the earth does not absoeb all the radio energy it receives form the
sun. It must re-radiate much of the energy it receives, related to its
impedance discontinuity with that of the unabsorbed energy striking it.

A lightning bolt travels an ionized path which is a good conductor and
suffices to radiate static around the globe. Martin A. Ulman in
"Lightning", Dover Books, 1984, says the ionized trail may reach 30,000
degrees K and a length of 14 km (8 miles). That`s a long antenna but may
not be a record even for lightning.

Best regards, Richard Harrison, KB5WZI

John Smith

unread,

May 25, 2005, 12:53:18 AM5/25/05

to

Excellent thoughts, makes one think...

Warmest regards,
John

"Richard Harrison" <richard...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:5755-429...@storefull-3257.bay.webtv.net...

charlie...@yahoo.com

unread,

May 27, 2005, 1:41:58 PM5/27/05

to

.... other good articles that ILLUMINATI the Haarp and NIF programs
worldwide, and other closely related black ops driven felonies, are

http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles.html

and http://www.geocities.com/chemosh_of_ammon/NGC1987A.html

Laser Could Rival Energy From Sun's Center

By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer

Sat May 21, 4:20 PM ET

http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html

Karla Rove wrote:
> http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html
>
> NIF weapon = $6-10 billion = lasers on level with nuclear bombs
> HAARP = maser weapons = $35 billion = Space Shuttle shoot downs as
> practice targets; earthquakes for fun

>
>
> Laser Could Rival Energy From Sun's Center
>
> By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer
>
> Sat May 21, 4:20 PM ET
>

> http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html

charlie...@yahoo.com

unread,

May 27, 2005, 1:42:48 PM5/27/05

to

.... other good articles that ILLUMINATI the Haarp and NIF programs
worldwide, and other closely related black ops driven felonies, are

http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles.html

and http://www.geocities.com/chemosh_of_ammon/NGC1987A.html

Laser Could Rival Energy From Sun's Center

By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer

Sat May 21, 4:20 PM ET

http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html

Karla Rove wrote:
> http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html
>
> NIF weapon = $6-10 billion = lasers on level with nuclear bombs
> HAARP = maser weapons = $35 billion = Space Shuttle shoot downs as
> practice targets; earthquakes for fun
>
>

> Laser Could Rival Energy From Sun's Center
>
> By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer
>

> Sat May 21, 4:20 PM ET
>
> http://haarp-microwave.tripod.com/haarp.html
>

> Ed Moses talks of the "grand challenge" that has consumed him for the
> past five years, comparing it to trying to hit the strike zone with a
> baseball from 350 miles away or tossing a dime into a parking meter
> from 40 miles. "That's the precision we have to have," says Moses, the
> director of a high-energy physics adventure to produce the world's most
> powerful laser - one that scientists hope will create in a laboratory
> the energy found at the center of the sun.
>

Paul F Austin

unread,

May 27, 2005, 4:45:07 PM5/27/05

to

"Sarah H" wrote

>
> I'm currently trying to work out if the explosion was a Good Thing or a
> Bad Thing. Explosions involving much shouting and throwing of
> household objects are usually a Bad Thing (an effective trigger for
> this type of explosion includes giving the wrong answer when asked
> "does my bum look big in this?"). The other type of explosion - the
> Good Thing - would surely cause women to donate funds heavily into your
> research program?

What's wrong with emphasizing your bum? LB's is quite ample and I'm right
fond of patting it.

Secretary Condi Lice

unread,

May 31, 2005, 4:29:28 PM5/31/05

to

The HAARP and the NIF are even more dangerous than AIPAC which just
planted a few Mossad spies into the Pentagon and they sold the secrets
stolen to Israeli high tech and EM weapons national industries there.