curing concrete for koi pond- disappearing water!
Randall
About three weeks ago, I poured a 6x9x3 ft. mono-block concrete pond
I waited a couple of days, removed the form, and then filled it with
water, and covered it for the last three weeks. In looking under the
tarp yesterday,
I noticed that most of the water was gone. Yet, there is no indication
around the concrete that there is any water leakage. Could the
water evaporate that quick?, or maybe the concrete curing process
takes in
most of the water? its about 1000gal, so Im curious what the heck
happend.
I do notice if is spray the sides of the concrete, it does dry rather
quickly.
Im in los angeles, and its been a little hot, but not around the pond.
Ill probably seal it with drylock, and then a couple of coats of pond
paint anyway...then watch the levels....
?
randall
RichToyBox
That sounds like an awful lot of water for the concrete to take up. It will
take up water during the hydration process, and this will make it more water
tight in the end. I think that if you lost 1000 gallons, there is a leak
somewhere. To locate the crack, you can try wetting the surface good. Wait
and watch as it dries out. The cracks will hold water and show up very
plainly as the rest of the surface changes color to a lighter gray. If
there are cracks, you will need to take care of them before coating with
DryLock. DryLock is a Portland cement based coating that has a latex or
similar additive that stops or slows the movement of water through the
concrete, or concrete block. It is not elastic enough to bridge cracks, and
particularly if the cracks are moving cracks. The cracks can be routed out
with a chisel and filled with a silicone sealer to allow for movement and
provide a seal. The crack routing should be deep enough and wide enough to
put some form of bond breaker at the back, such as plastic tape, candle wax,
or foam tape. this will allow the silicone to stretch. If it is bound on
all sides, it can crack the concrete, or just pull loose from the edges. In
either case it will be leaking again.
--
RichToyBox
http://www.geocities.com/richtoybox/pondintro.html
"Randall" <randa...@attbi.com> wrote in message
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Randall
> Randall,
>
> If on drying after spraying, there are no cracks visible by darker lines in
> a lighter background, then the sealants will work. If there are cracks,
> they are microcracks and they will not allow water to go through, and are
> not likely to open. If you do see the lines, but filling the pond with
> water does not show a large water loss, then these may be surface cracks, or
> crazing, due to wetting and drying, and they do not go all the way through,
> and the sealer will work. I would start with the filling of the pond, and
> try to get a handle on the amount of water loss, before I started putting
> sealer on. If the loss is small, then it is probably evaporation, and you
> are safe sealing it.
I've had the pond filled for about 2 days now, and Im averaging about
1/4 inch loss so far, in a 6x9x3.5 volume. Im pretty sure I have a
leak. Its hard to tell where a crack is because there is some general
dampening around the pond that is concerning me...Im going to drain it
today and let it dry completely and do another inspection.
What about using Xypex instead of Drylock? That might be the best
product to use in this case..?
Randall
> Maybe I misunderstood, I thought you filled the pond with water before
> a 28 day cure? If that's true what I'd be concerned about is that
> pressure pushing a wall outward a hair and causing cracks, maybe
> inside the concrete, maybe all the way thru. When the water was gone
> the concrete went back to its original position closing all the
> cracks. But the cracks would still be there. Once concrete cracks
> curing the curing process they won't "heal" during the rest of the
> cure.
>
> But true or not the walls may hold up for a very long time. Depends
> where the cracks are, how much rebar was used and too many other
> factors to know. My guess is there's a good chance the DryLock and
> pond paint would hold water, not sure how long. You might consider
> using a liner over the concrete, I think it might be about the same
> cost as the DryLock and paint. I do know that concrete ponds and
> swimming pools if not made to exact standards have unending problems
> down the road.
>
> > This weekend will be day 28 on the concrete. Ive been keeping it moist
> > via spraying since I took the tarp off and saw the low water level.
> >
> > The original plan was to wait the 28 days for curing, then put 2 coats of
> > DryLock on the cement, followed by 2 coats of latex pond paint.
> > If there is a minor fracture or crack (there is none visible on the surfaces)
> > , will those two treatments 'seal' whatever is leaking?
> >
> > Im afraid to go throught the time and $$ to go to the sealing/painting stage,
> > and still have problems with water loss. I wouldnt begin to know what to do
> > then.
> >
> >
> > great info from everybody- thanks....Ill keep ya'll informed.
> >
> > randall
Yes I filled the pond after about 3 days into the cure...maybe not the
best idea. The floor and walls have lots of rebar and wire mesh sa
well, so I feel good about the structure of it.
Im looking into using xypex instead of drylock, that might work well.
any thoughts?
RichToyBox
The loss you are describing really sounds like evaporation. I loose that
much with liner pond. The dampness around the pond may be from water
seeping through the concrete. It is still pretty young, and has not had a
chance to develop all of its water permeability resistance. The
waterproofer will stop that permeability, as will time. If you were not
going to coat it, you could add hydrated lime to the water to accelerate the
natural waterproofing of the concrete, and then when the pond is drained,
allow to dry for about a week. The exposure to carbon dioxide in the
atmosphere with pores full of calcium hydroxide will cause the pores to fill
with calcium carbonate, or limestone like material.
--
RichToyBox
http://www.geocities.com/richtoybox/pondintro.html
"Randall" <randa...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:1e08ee2.02081...@posting.google.com...
Waterbug Guy
even if there are some cracks.
I don't have any personal experience with any applied waterproofing so
no help on the xypex vs drylock. I've heard from others who've tried
to seal concrete and had lots of trouble down the road. I'm sure it
must work sometimes, just don't hear about those cases. Like I said
before, I always put liner over concrete.
John Rutz
check with Ken at http://www.kencofish.com/ for price of permalon to
fit your pond vs the costs of sealers esp if you are in an area
with hard freezes
--
Carolann and John Rutz
Email jo...@fuerjefe.com
See my pond at:
http://www.fuerjefe.com
rec.ponds Frequently Asked Questions
http://www.geocities.com/justinm090/faq.html
Randall
> Randall,
>
> The loss you are describing really sounds like evaporation. I loose that
> much with liner pond. The dampness around the pond may be from water
> seeping through the concrete. It is still pretty young, and has not had a
> chance to develop all of its water permeability resistance. The
> waterproofer will stop that permeability, as will time. If you were not
> going to coat it, you could add hydrated lime to the water to accelerate the
> natural waterproofing of the concrete, and then when the pond is drained,
> allow to dry for about a week. The exposure to carbon dioxide in the
> atmosphere with pores full of calcium hydroxide will cause the pores to fill
> with calcium carbonate, or limestone like material.
I definately plan on sealing it with a waterproofing product, then pond paint.
Any feedback on DryLock vs Xypex?
thanks
randall
James
a leak is like this. With the pond dry/empty, run a hose and saturate/soak
the ground along the "outside" of the pond walls. You will see the water
leak "into" the dry pond through whatever leaks you have. This is an easy
and sure fire method. Here, I only have to run the hose for about 5 minutes
for the water to sink down 3 feet or so. This takes a lot less water than
you would think. And it is easier to spot a leak going into a "dry boat"
than one coming out of a "wet pond".
Now to fix the leaks, I have used "hydraulic cement" many times. This is the
generic name for a waterproof plastic/cement mixture that is intended for
fixing things like pool leaks. You can buy it at any hardware store under
various brand names like "Pool Patch" etc.
If the cracks are hairline, you can even mix the cement real soupy and paint
it on with a brush. Repairs done like this last me about 3 years.
But next spring...I plan to paint the entire pond with this stuff
http://www.hechtrubber.com/pond.htm. -James
"Randall" <randa...@attbi.com> wrote in message
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Randall
Thanks for the tips.
What Ive done is coated the pond with Xypex, a super duper hydrolic
cement that you brush on (www.hi-dry.com)... then I used 2 coats of
Trickers Pond Paint to give it a non-toxic, non-leeching coating.
Since then Ive filled the pond, with not leaks and filled it with
happy fish!
randall