AA lithium damage to Nikon F4?
migh...@aol.com
NPS estimate to fix it is approximately $175. I've heard through the vine
that the camera was damaged by AA lithiums, as in "too much power." Has
anyone ever heard of this? Is it possible? I've been using lithiums in my
N90s for over a year and haven't experienced any trouble. I figure if all
goes well, I've got an F4 for a reasonable price, if not, I've got an
expensive doorstop.
Thanks,
Jeff
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Liv2cruise
There was a post about 3-4 weeks ago of someone saying there N6006 was
burned up from the AA lithiums. Whether true or not I don't know.
Steve
Jared43
Anders Svensson
The Lithium cells are capable of large(r) currents, and if the
electronics/electromechanics designer is assuming that there is a limit
to the current capacity in way of the batteries internal resistance,
and uses that phenomena as a current limiting device, nasty things
*can* happen if a more "agressive" power source is introduced.
--
Anders Svensson
----------------------------------------
Liv2cruise <liv2c...@aol.com> skrev i inlägg
<19981214104013...@ng-ft1.aol.com>...
ClintAK
>that the camera was damaged by AA lithiums, as in "too much power." Has
>anyone ever heard of this?
Yes. My understanding is that some parts of the F-4's circuitry can't handle
lithium AA's. At a seminar I attended, Moose Petersen said it was just one
chip (out of 8?) that couldn't deal with the voltage of lithium batteries.
don ferrario
I've used Lithium's in my F4 since the batteries have been
available (2 or 3 years). I've discussed this with several other
F4 users who do the same. No problems.
Officially, Nikon does not recommend lithiums in the F4,
but I believe that's more of a defensive move on their part,
so they wouldn't be blamed for damage caused by other things.
Speaking of damage caused by other things...
By the "advance unit", I assume you are talking about the geartrain
that moves the film. That F4 has seen *many* miles if those are
worn out. You'll still have a strong unit for your $675 spent. I can't
imagine how anyone would accuse the lithium batteries of that.
If you do so, the first thing I'd recommend is the smaller battery
pack (MB20, I believe), and a set of Lithium batteries. Makes the
unit much lighter.
don ferrario
http://www.epix.net/~ferrario
migh...@aol.com wrote in message <752pl5$k3t$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>A friend of mine is selling an F4 for $500. The advance unit is bad and the
>NPS estimate to fix it is approximately $175. I've heard through the vine
>that the camera was damaged by AA lithiums, as in "too much power." Has
>anyone ever heard of this? Is it possible? I've been using lithiums in my
>N90s for over a year and haven't experienced any trouble. I figure if all
>goes well, I've got an F4 for a reasonable price, if not, I've got an
>expensive doorstop.
>
> Thanks,
> Jeff>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start
Your Own
James Grove
to the cited author.]
In article <19981214104013...@ng-ft1.aol.com>,
liv2c...@aol.com says...
> Hi;
> There was a post about 3-4 weeks ago of someone saying there N6006 was
> burned up from the AA lithiums. Whether true or not I don't know.
> Steve
>
Nikon states that repeated expsure to these cells may cause
permanment damage to the PCB inside the camera due to the larger current
discharged by these batteries. I never used them in my F4, becuase it
worked fine with NiCads.
--
JPG Photography
Professional 35mm Photography
jpgp...@ndirect.co.uk
http://www.jpgservices.ndirect.co.uk
Call: (+44) (0)121 602 0857
Steven Bakalis
Here goes the simple answer.
A typical alkaline AA battery has a working voltage of 1.5 volts. If
your camera requires two AA batteries it usually means it need a working
voltage of 3 volts. (2 x 1.5 = 3)
A lithium AA battery has a working voltage of 3 volts. If you use two
lithium AA batteries in place of two AA alkaline batteries, the working
voltage will be 6 volts. (2 x 3 = 6)
If the circuit board in your camera was designed to work at 3 volts, and
you run it at 6 volts you will be driving the circuitry with a greater
voltage than it was designed to work at, and 99 times out of 100 you
will fry the circuitry.
This is why you don't plug 120 volt appliances into a 220 volt outlet.
Hope this helps.
Steven Bakalis
Markku Ojala
>
> A typical alkaline AA battery has a working voltage of 1.5 volts.
> lithium AA batteries in place of two AA alkaline batteries, the working
> voltage will be 6 volts. (2 x 3 = 6)
> Steven Bakalis
I don't believe that this is the case!
I have never heard of any company making 3V lithium batteries in
AA size! On the other hand there are nowadays 1.5V AA style
Lithium batteries. They are pretty expensive but in certain applications
they perform beautifully. Especially at low temperatures! These
batteries work fine at temperatures where alkalines have no chances
to survive.
Some rechargeable batteries (such as NiCd) work pretty well at
low temperatures as well, but I believe that in most conditions
Lithiums would outperform other technologies.
Unfortunately I haven't been able to prove that personally, as I haven't
had the guts to try Lithiums in my F801 (N8008 in US?) bodies.
Being a Finn, the low temperature performance is one of my top concerns,
I would appreciate any experience using Lithiums at these conditions.
Markku
Markku Ojala
> > There was a post about 3-4 weeks ago of someone saying there N6006 was
> > burned up from the AA lithiums. Whether true or not I don't know.
> > Steve
> >
>
> Nikon states that repeated expsure to these cells may cause
> permanment damage to the PCB inside the camera due to the larger current
> discharged by these batteries. I never used them in my F4, becuase it
> worked fine with NiCads.
>
> JPG Photography
I wonder what is the reason for this. Most non-Nikon cameras use
6V (2x3V) Lithiums. And for example Nikon F801 (N8008) which
uses AA-batteries has an optional anti-cold battery packet that takes
one 6V Lithium!
These 1.5V Lithiums must have some nasty special feature that causes
the trouble. I just checked one battery catalogue and it labeled all
3V and Nx3V (6 and 9) Lithium batteries as "Lithium Manganese".
On the other hand 1.5V AA sized Lithium batteries were labeled
as "Lithium Iron Disulphide". So the technology differs. So...???
Anyone any ideas...??
Markku
Anders Svensson
Batteries with low internal resistance can usually discharge a larger
current, if the current isnt regulated in some other way.
If a electronics/electromechanical designer relies on the batterys
themselves to limit the current flow in a "near short circuit"
condition, the actual battery type can play a part. Usually and most
often, this is not a concern.
It is perfectly possible that there perhaps are motor drivers mounted
on IC's that are a little less than optimally mounted/cooled that need
that consideration here.
--
Anders Svensson
----------------------------------------
Markku Ojala <markku...@nospamnelescontrols.com> skrev i inlägg
<36775D37...@nospamnelescontrols.com>...
A.Hahn
4 cells and 6 cells (F4s) for some years now and have never
had any problems. lithiums last a lot longer and they can not
damage your equipment, as they deliver 1,5 Volts, not
3 as claimed.
Alex
Donald D. Forsling
--
Steven Bakalis wrote in message <36772B0A...@san.rr.com>...
>Greetings
>
>Here goes the simple answer.
>
>A typical alkaline AA battery has a working voltage of 1.5 volts. If
>your camera requires two AA batteries it usually means it need a working
>voltage of 3 volts. (2 x 1.5 = 3)
>
>A lithium AA battery has a working voltage of 3 volts. If you use two
>lithium AA batteries in place of two AA alkaline batteries, the working
>voltage will be 6 volts. (2 x 3 = 6)
>
>If the circuit board in your camera was designed to work at 3 volts, and
>you run it at 6 volts you will be driving the circuitry with a greater
>voltage than it was designed to work at, and 99 times out of 100 you
>will fry the circuitry.
>
>This is why you don't plug 120 volt appliances into a 220 volt outlet.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Steven Bakalis
Well, it doesn't help much because it's just plain wrong. A AA lithium has
a no-load voltage of a tad more that 1.7 volts and under load as would be
the case in an F4, the voltage delivered by each cell will indeed be higher
than 1.5 volts but nowhere near the 3 volts you claim.
For goodness sake, put a voltmeter on a AA and see for yourself both in a no
load and in an under load state.. While lithiums will put a bit of extra
zip in your cameras operation, there's _very_ little change than the AA's
will hurt a camera. I used them for years in an f4 with no problems
whatsoever. The batteries are a great product--they are light, they work
well in cold weather, they have a ttremensous shelf life, etc.
A "working" voltage--what the heck is that? I presume it's voltage under
load. THREE volts per cell?! No way. No way.
Cheers.
======================================
Don Forsling <fors...@netins.net>
"Iowa--Gateway to Those Big Rectangular States"
Bucks
>From: Markku Ojala <markku...@nospamnelescontrols.com>
>Subject: Re: AA lithium damage to Nikon F4?
>Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1998 07:11:52 GMT
>James Grove wrote:
>> > There was a post about 3-4 weeks ago of someone saying there N6006 was
>> > burned up from the AA lithiums. Whether true or not I don't know.
>> > Steve
>> >
Hang on! My F-601 (=N6006) uses a Lithium battery as standard. How the hell do
you fit AA bateries in the battery campartment designed for one of those odd
sized lithium cells?
>>Nikon states that repeated expsure to these cells may cause>> permanment
damage to the PCB inside the camera due to the larger current>> discharged by
these batteries. I never used them in my F4, becuase it>> worked fine with
NiCads.>>
>> JPG Photography
I just use plain old non-rechargeable batteries in my F4s. I shoot well over
100 rolls of film per year, have had the camera 18 months, and am on my third
set of batteries. Why take any risks with the camera when it's battery
consumption is negligible. Hell! A replacement set of batteries costs less
than a 6-pack (and if I get serious, a 6-pack only lasts an hour or two.)
Kevin
Chris Ho
first-hand *bad* experiences with lithiums and an F4.
Everything official that I have read about the F4 would suggest that lithiums are bad for my camera, but I have yet to
hear anything but positive remarks from people in this NG who have used them.
Lithiums are tempting, but I'm so scared that if anybody's camera is going to be fried, it will be mine!
So please, I ask the question: Can I get a witness?
-Chris
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