Kodak film prices may rise 40%

[RichA]

Talk about killing the Golden Goose. Just when the market is apparently on the rise with flightly millenial shooters of film, they go and sabotage it by pushing the price of a roll to what, $15?

https://petapixel.com/2023/01/11/kodak-poised-to-raise-the-price-of-film-by-up-to-40/

[nospam]

In article <2ddbb1ba-248e-4f57...@googlegroups.com>,

RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Talk about killing the Golden Goose. Just when the market is apparently on
> the rise with flightly millenial shooters of film,

it isn't.

> they go and sabotage it by
> pushing the price of a roll to what, $15?

basic economic theory at work.

[Alan Browne]

On 2023-01-11 12:56, RichA wrote:
> Talk about killing the Golden Goose. Just when the market is apparently on the rise with flightly millenial shooters of film, they go and sabotage it by pushing the price of a roll to what, $15?
>
> https://petapixel.com/2023/01/11/kodak-poised-to-raise-the-price-of-film-by-up-to-40/

Capital costs sunk.
Material costs up.
Labour costs up.
Supplier costs up.
Operating costs up.
Volumes down.

What would a competent businessman do?

--
“Donald Trump and his allies and supporters are a clear and present
danger to American democracy.”
- J Michael Luttig - 2022-06-16
- Former US appellate court judge (R) testifying to the January 6
committee

[RichA]

On Wednesday, 11 January 2023 at 14:47:16 UTC-5, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2023-01-11 12:56, RichA wrote:
> > Talk about killing the Golden Goose. Just when the market is apparently on the rise with flightly millenial shooters of film, they go and sabotage it by pushing the price of a roll to what, $15?
> >
> > https://petapixel.com/2023/01/11/kodak-poised-to-raise-the-price-of-film-by-up-to-40/
> Capital costs sunk.
> Material costs up.
> Labour costs up.
> Supplier costs up.
> Operating costs up.
> Volumes down.
>
> What would a competent businessman do?

Make less profit until the cost structure stabilized. Rather than threaten sales by just taking the money in an attempt to keep margins as high as possible. Cause? Short-term strategies that impact long-term prospects. What do people do when costs rise? They look for alternatives or do without the product, if feasible.

[David Brooks]

There are many people who will pay for a quality product, regardless of
the price.
--
Kind regards,
David

[geoff]

On 12/01/2023 10:51 am, RichA wrote:
> On Wednesday, 11 January 2023 at 14:47:16 UTC-5, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2023-01-11 12:56, RichA wrote:
>>> Talk about killing the Golden Goose. Just when the market is apparently on the rise with flightly millenial shooters of film, they go and sabotage it by pushing the price of a roll to what, $15?
>>>
>>> https://petapixel.com/2023/01/11/kodak-poised-to-raise-the-price-of-film-by-up-to-40/
>> Capital costs sunk.
>> Material costs up.
>> Labour costs up.
>> Supplier costs up.
>> Operating costs up.
>> Volumes down.
>>
>> What would a competent businessman do?
>
> Make less profit until the cost structure stabilized. Rather than threaten sales by just taking the money in an attempt to keep margins as high as possible.

Keep margins as high as possible, or maintain marginal margins ?

geoff

[Alan Browne]

Once prices have gone up, they don't necessarily settle - other than
volatile commodities.

Which is not Kodak's case (I doubt raw material input is a large part of
the overall product cost. I'd surmise further that they also have very
little buying power for source material).

And since it's a dwindling market overall (over time), they're not about
to invest in cost reductions in production (capital investments that
would reduce labour and operating costs).

So the right move may indeed be to milk it until it's time to send it to
the glue factory.

Business, rightly or wrongly, is there to serve the business first, the
shareholders second and the customer last.

[RichA]

https://www.marketplace.org/2022/11/30/film-photography-has-made-a-comeback-can-manufacturers-keep-up-with-demand/

[RichA]

Just like to add, it's not an expensive hobby. I saw a fine condition Nikkormat EL and a 50mm f/1.4 lens going for $55 the other day. There are MILLIIONS of used cameras out there. Film isn't digital, you don't machine-gun it. A 36 exposure roll and a thinking shooter can do a lot and the total cost of it development and basic (4x6) printing is about $30.00.

[nospam]

In article <f4ebbe2d-919d-47b0...@googlegroups.com>,

RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Just like to add, it's not an expensive hobby.

yes it is.

> I saw a fine condition
> Nikkormat EL and a 50mm f/1.4 lens going for $55 the other day. There are
> MILLIIONS of used cameras out there. Film isn't digital, you don't
> machine-gun it.

nothing about digital requires 'machine-gunning' it, which could also
be done with film:
<https://i.redd.it/0buk0u3grpa81.jpg>
<http://www.nicovandijk.net/nikonFback1.jpg>

but for those who lack discipline, get a very small memory card that
holds 20-30 photos.

> A 36 exposure roll and a thinking shooter can do a lot and the total cost
> of it development and basic (4x6) printing is about $30.00.

which quickly adds up.

[Whisky-dave]

On Thursday, 9 February 2023 at 04:23:37 UTC, nospam wrote:
> In article <f4ebbe2d-919d-47b0...@googlegroups.com>,
> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Just like to add, it's not an expensive hobby.
> yes it is.

Most hobbies can range from cheap to expensive .

> > I saw a fine condition
> > Nikkormat EL and a 50mm f/1.4 lens going for $55 the other day. There are
> > MILLIIONS of used cameras out there. Film isn't digital, you don't
> > machine-gun it.

The equipment for taking pictures using film is pretty cheap because few want it
and there's loads avaible as you say.

> nothing about digital requires 'machine-gunning' it, which could also
> be done with film:
> <https://i.redd.it/0buk0u3grpa81.jpg>
> <http://www.nicovandijk.net/nikonFback1.jpg>

yeah I had a 5 FPS drive for my canon which meant could get through a whole roll of 36 exposures
in about 8 seconds .

>
> but for those who lack discipline, get a very small memory card that
> holds 20-30 photos.
> > A 36 exposure roll and a thinking shooter can do a lot and the total cost
> > of it development and basic (4x6) printing is about $30.00.
> which quickly adds up.

So using the above example of 36 pictures for $30 so roughly $1 per picture
or 5 FPS is $5 per second or $300 per miniute which I'd say is expenive at $18,000 per hour.

which is probbaly why there are so many more photos taken with digital
than would be if film was used.

[RichA]

On Wednesday, 8 February 2023 at 23:23:37 UTC-5, nospam wrote:
> In article <f4ebbe2d-919d-47b0...@googlegroups.com>,
> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Just like to add, it's not an expensive hobby.
> yes it is.

I've spent over $100k on telescope stuff and a friend's wife spent almost $1M on horses. Photography is NOT expensive.

[nospam]

In article <9fb9d30f-e307-4ba6...@googlegroups.com>,

RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > Just like to add, it's not an expensive hobby.
> > yes it is.
>
> I've spent over $100k on telescope stuff and a friend's wife spent almost
> $1M on horses.

so what?

> Photography is NOT expensive.

yes it is.

[Carlos E.R.]

Yes it is.

If you have ample funds, then it is cheap for you. At ~1€ per picture I
can not afford to do a hundred photos in a day, as I can with digital. I
have to go back to my old skills, where I could spend one or two rolls
per year, and only take a shot when it is worth it.

Sure, there are more expensive hobbies.


No, thanks, I'll stay with digital.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

[Alan Browne]

On 2023-02-08 23:07, RichA wrote:
> On Wednesday, 11 January 2023 at 19:34:26 UTC-5, Alan Browne wrote:

>> And since it's a dwindling market overall (over time), they're not about
>> to invest in cost reductions in production (capital investments that
>> would reduce labour and operating costs).
>>
>> So the right move may indeed be to milk it until it's time to send it to
>> the glue factory.
>>
>> Business, rightly or wrongly, is there to serve the business first, the
>> shareholders second and the customer last.
>

> https://www.marketplace.org/2022/11/30/film-photography-has-made-a-comeback-can-manufacturers-keep-up-with-demand/

Yep - those high prices will surely create demand destruction. Kodak is
not going long on the capital required to support a pandemic borne
fetish with film.

Fujifilm Velvia is $30/roll.
5-pack of Portra 160 in 120: $99 for a 5 pack.
35mm Portra 160 - single roll: $27
35mm Ektachrome E100 - single roll: $40.

(Prices CAD above).

No idea what processing costs these days either.

[Alan Browne]

On 2023-02-08 23:14, RichA wrote:

> Just like to add, it's not an expensive hobby. I saw a fine condition Nikkormat EL and a 50mm f/1.4 lens going for $55 the other day. There are MILLIIONS of used cameras out there. Film isn't digital, you don't machine-gun it. A 36 exposure roll and a thinking shooter can do a lot and the total cost of it development and basic (4x6) printing is about $30.00.

Luckily I sold my Hasselblad and some other film gear at a peak during
the pandemic in the spring of 2021. Prices had ballooned something
nuts. Sold a scanner for above what I had paid for it new.

See my other post for the costs of good quality film.

Film will be available as long as makers make money - but they're not
going to invest to grow the market.

[Whisky-dave]

Sex hasn't cost me much, but Trump spent how much on keeping Stormy daniels quiet ;-)

[Alan Browne]

Not enough, apparently.

[nospam]

In article <4ca31c1f-53a6-492e...@googlegroups.com>,

Whisky-dave <whisk...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Sex hasn't cost me much, but Trump spent how much on keeping Stormy daniels quiet ;-)

was more than just her.