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Borax granular vs 20 Mule Team

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Lew

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Apr 25, 2009, 10:56:11 AM4/25/09
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Are these the same? I'm looking for the 3 grams specified for the
Microphen substitute in Darkroom CB.

Richard Knoppow

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Apr 25, 2009, 6:01:39 PM4/25/09
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"Lew" <lew...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:013c5f89-ec7a-41ca...@v35g2000pro.googlegroups.com...

> Are these the same? I'm looking for the 3 grams specified
> for the
> Microphen substitute in Darkroom CB.
A few years ago someone contacted the United States
Borax Co, the maker of 20 Mule Team Borax. It is chemically
pure, at least enough for photographic purposes and is
granulated. It should work in any photo formula calling for
Borax. Red Devil Lye is another "grocery store" product
(although I haven't seen it recently) that is pure enough
for photo use where sodium hydroxide is called for. One can
make the equivalent of Kodalk (sodium metaborate) by
combining the hydroxide and Borax in solution in the right
proportions.


--
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA
dick...@ix.netcom.com


Lawrence Akutagawa

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Apr 25, 2009, 11:02:25 PM4/25/09
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"Richard Knoppow" <dick...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:9KednVwV8dv7FW7U...@earthlink.com...
as per lye -
http://candleandsoap.about.com/od/coldprocesssoapmaking/a/lyesources.htm


Lloyd at dot com

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Apr 28, 2009, 7:17:35 AM4/28/09
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April 28, 2009, from Lloyd Erlick,

Watch out for anhydrous borax. I foolishly
bought a large bag of it many years ago, just
because the price was attractive.

Anhydrous borax dissolves in water so slowly
we will all die of old age waiting. I could
find no additional chemicals that made it
dissolve fully. It's a nice white powder that
you can pour on the ground to mark your path.

regards,
--le
________________________________
Lloyd Erlick Portraits, Toronto.
website: www.heylloyd.com
telephone: 416-686-0326
email: port...@heylloyd.com
________________________________
--

Richard Knoppow

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Apr 28, 2009, 7:50:14 PM4/28/09
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<Lloyd at @the-wire. dot com> wrote in message
news:r5pdv4llttiutsu0s...@4ax.com...

> On Sat, 25 Apr 2009 07:56:11 -0700 (PDT), Lew
> <lew...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Are these the same? I'm looking for the 3 grams specified
>>for the
>>Microphen substitute in Darkroom CB.
>
>
>
> April 28, 2009, from Lloyd Erlick,
>
> Watch out for anhydrous borax. I foolishly
> bought a large bag of it many years ago, just
> because the price was attractive.
>
> Anhydrous borax dissolves in water so slowly
> we will all die of old age waiting. I could
> find no additional chemicals that made it
> dissolve fully. It's a nice white powder that
> you can pour on the ground to mark your path.
>
> regards,
> --le
> --
Kodak used to include a warning about this along with
its formulas calling for Borax. It stated that only
granulated Borax should be used "because powdered Borax
dissolves only with great difficulty."

Jean-David Beyer

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Apr 28, 2009, 8:08:13 PM4/28/09
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I thought they said that about boric acid, not borax.
It may be true for both.

--
.~. Jean-David Beyer Registered Linux User 85642.
/V\ PGP-Key: 9A2FC99A Registered Machine 241939.
/( )\ Shrewsbury, New Jersey http://counter.li.org
^^-^^ 20:05:01 up 35 days, 2:19, 3 users, load average: 4.39, 4.34, 4.37

Lloyd at dot com

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Apr 29, 2009, 8:09:12 AM4/29/09
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 16:50:14 -0700, "Richard
Knoppow" <dick...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:


...


>> April 28, 2009, from Lloyd Erlick,
>>
>> Watch out for anhydrous borax. I foolishly
>> bought a large bag of it many years ago, just
>> because the price was attractive.
>>
>> Anhydrous borax dissolves in water so slowly
>> we will all die of old age waiting. I could
>> find no additional chemicals that made it
>> dissolve fully.

...


> Kodak used to include a warning about this along with
>its formulas calling for Borax. It stated that only
>granulated Borax should be used "because powdered Borax
>dissolves only with great difficulty."
>

...

April 29, 2009, from Lloyd Erlick,

I bet a lot of people have been perplexed by
the difference between granulated and
powdered!
--le

Nicholas O. Lindan

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Apr 29, 2009, 8:13:02 PM4/29/09
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"Jean-David Beyer" <jeand...@verizon.net> wrote

> I thought they said that about boric acid

They sell the 'wrong sort' of Boric Acid as roach powder.
I found it will dissolve in boiling water. In cold water
one may as well be trying to dissolve sand.

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Darkroom Automation: F-Stop Timers, Enlarging Meters
http://www.darkroomautomation.com/da-main.htm
n o lindan at ix dot netcom dot com


Lew

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Apr 30, 2009, 9:13:38 AM4/30/09
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On Apr 29, 8:13 pm, "Nicholas O. Lindan" <s...@sig.com> wrote:
> "Jean-David Beyer" <jeandav...@verizon.net> wrote

>
> > I thought they said that about boric acid
>
I think the published 'mix at' temperatures for many formulae are
minimums. When I have to mix something using boric acid, I have the
solution in a pyrex container on a hot plate. Heating it up allows the
roach powder to dissolve more easily. I haven't noticed any ill
effects on the resulting soups.

> They sell the 'wrong sort' of Boric Acid as roach powder.
> I found it will dissolve in boiling water.  In cold water
> one may as well be trying to dissolve sand.
>
> --
> Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio

> Darkroom Automation: F-Stop Timers, Enlarging Metershttp://www.darkroomautomation.com/da-main.htm

Richard Knoppow

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Apr 30, 2009, 1:35:33 PM4/30/09
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"Jean-David Beyer" <jeand...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:NTMJl.3369$b11...@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
You are right, my memory is slowly slipping away. Its
Boric acid.
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