Dodge 440 Won't start hot.

[Henry Blair]

There are two things that can happen on this engine to cause vapor lock.
Look at how the fuel line goes by the right exhaust pipe. Is it getting
hot? If so, shield it. this could also be true at the rear near the
exhaust pipe.

A cure would be to put an electric fuel pump very near the gas tank that is
powered by a source that is keyed to the ignition key. I have had to do
this on multiple Dodge trucks because of engine compartment heat. Holley
makes a good pump for this for about $60.

Henry

Mike & Sandy Mayberry wrote in message <364F9F5A...@home.com>...
>I have a 79 dodge motorhome with a 440 and it is very hard to start
>after I stop and get gas. The engine gets very hot when it is not
>running.
>snip<
>Any Suggestions? Is it vapor lock?

[Gary Niederhuth]

As suggested the electric fuel pump is a must. Also don't make the mistake I did and use other manufacturers radiator fan clutches, they're worthless and wont drive that big fan. Get one from Dodge albeit about $130 but it works great. Another thing is if the re-starting problem occurs within 5 - 10 minutes after stopping but will start OK after an hour or so, then it may be loaded up due to the plastic floats in the carb (known problem). My '78 also had a small solonoid and rubber plunger on the end (in the carb) that covered the float bowl breather tube when the ignition was turned off (I imagine a poor attempt to stop fuel evaporation to the outside world), as the engine heats further after shut off the fuel boiled and was then forced out of the bowl thru the main jets and loaded up the engine further (toss the rubber stopper). I did that and put brass floats in mine years ago and totally eliminated hot starting problems (be advised that the brass float level needs to be set differently than the plastic ones)....

Gary Niederhuth
Yucca Valley, CA

Henry Blair wrote in message <72o9f0$6jg$1...@camel19.mindspring.com>...

[Gary - KJ6Q]

IF fuel lines run close to the engine, especially near exhaust pipes or
manifolds, try wrapping several layers of aluminum foil around them -
preferably shiny side out - I've successfully used that on several similar
problems in past years... BUT, if the engine compartment gets hot enough to
actually boil the gas in the carburetor - THAT'S another story...

Gary - KJ6Q

Mike & Sandy Mayberry wrote in message <364F9F5A...@home.com>...
>I have a 79 dodge motorhome with a 440 and it is very hard to start
>after I stop and get gas. The engine gets very hot when it is not

>running. It just keeps cranking and will start most of the time
>eventually but I have had to spray starting spray into the carb
>sometimes to get it to refire. HELP!!!!!
>
>The repair shop keeps telling me it is the spark and I have replaced
>everything they told me to and it still keeps happening. It starts right
>up cold or a few seconds after I shut it off.

[Mike & Sandy Mayberry]

[Will Rosenberry]

have you tried the ballest resistor? It is cheep, Is known to go
bad, can have the same symptomns you are explaning, when its bad it
Will prevent spark.
Will Rosenberry
Remove NOSPAM to return email

[wi...@epix.net]

In Article<364F9F5A...@home.com>, <mikean...@home.com>
writes:

> I have a 79 dodge motorhome with a 440 and it is very hard to start
> after I stop and get gas. The engine gets very hot when it is not
> running.

If it simply doesn't start after refueling, you may be boiling fuel
right out of the carb. If it starts and then stalls and won't
restart, the problem is almost certainly what several people have
identified: vapor lock. I have not seen anyone mention the combination
that worked for me: in addition to the electric fuel pump (installed
near the tank) you will want a bleeder line which will allow the
electric pump to push hot fuel and vapor out of the hot fuel line
around the engine back to the fuel tank. This is accomplished with a
special fuel filter (available at NAPA) that has a bleeder port which
you must pipe back to the fuel tank. It must be placed close to the
carb.

Also, try to find some practical way to cool down the carb, either by
an extra gasket to insulate it from the intake and/or (best of all) by
ducting some outside air around it with a blower.

It's a lot of hassle but worth it. Modern fuels are much more volatile
than in days of yore.

Will KD3XR

[loki...@chumming.com]

> >Any Suggestions? Is it vapor lock?

My 1977 Dodge 440 was vapor locking all summer long and I pretty much learned
to live with it from talking to mechanics from Barstow to Boston and
everywhere in between. Here is all that I have done to increase my odds.

1. Put in a heavy duty electric fuel pump. 2. Put a vapor release cap on my
fuel tank. 3. Lined WOODEN clothes pins along the metal fuel line into the
carb to disperse heat. 4. Checked to make sure that the vents to my exhaust
lines weren't rusted shut (backing up heat unnecessarily). You can wire
these open so that heat always vents like my does. 5. Replaced my finicky
Holley Carb with an Edelbrock that seems to be working great, make sure you
get an electric choke instead of a manual (I learned to hate my Holly over my
3 months traveling this summer and haven't yet had a problem with my
Edelbrock although it is cold out now and not the 110 degree heat the Holly
dealt with). 6. I have thought about putting a vapor return line on the tank
or running the gas line back around on itself to let it cool the fuel more
but since it is winter and cooler out I haven't seen any problems recently.
I will see how Mexico goes this winter.

From everything I have gathered, there really isn't much you can do about
vapor lock except pull over, turn off the engine (I also open the doghouse
and take off the air filter to help it cool faster), sit back and drink a
beer or two while it cools off. I usually could restart in about 1-2 hours
(which wasn't quite quick enough either time on the George Washington Bridge
at rush hour or the time on the highway onramp in Cheyenne after Frontier
Days Closing for the respective state patrols).

Good luck.

cousin.red

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[John E. Balch]

loki...@chumming.com writes:

>Good luck.

>cousin.red

Throw cold water on the fuel pump. An electric fuel pump located between
the fuel tank and the engine fuel pump should take care of any vapor lock.
You may want to try a fuel cap with a spring loaded vent in it (the type
used on most late model cars) and let the vapor in the tank keep a positive
pressure on the fuel line. The problem with this is a sitting RV will have
the vapor pushing fuel into the carbuerator all the time which can get raw
gas into a cylinder and break a piston on startup. You are getting vapor
lock because the mechanical pump is sitting on a hot engine and heating the
fuel. I have seen thick fiber mounts about a quarter inch thick that are
placed between the fuel pump and the engine to slow up the heat transfer.
You might even put a drip type irrigation spray nozzel directed at the fuel
pump with a valve that you turn on when you have vapor lock. Plumb it into
your water supply system for the RV.

[John E. Balch]

Fuel can be forced right out of the carbuerator into the intake and flood
the engine. One option is to put a fuel valve like those used to select
alternate fuel tanks and shut off fuel to carb, run the engine until carb is
empty and then do a shut down so the hot engine will not boil the gas
forcing it into the intake. Also check iginiton timing. A retarded spark
will cause a lot of cranking. If you get black smoke when the RV finally
starts, you are getting flooding into the intake so it would not be a
retarded spark.

[bsp...@diespammers.jlc.net]

>>In Article<364F9F5A...@home.com>, <mikean...@home.com>
>>writes:
>>
>>> I have a 79 dodge motorhome with a 440 and it is very hard to start
>>> after I stop and get gas. The engine gets very hot when it is not
>>> running.
>>

Mike, do you have the original Thermo-quad carb? I do on my 1977
and it has a phenolic resin base, not metal. It states in the
Chrysler motorhome manual that they were used to keep the fuel
20 degrees cooler. I have no problems with my setup and the HEAT
is quite high "under the bonnett".

Bob

[Gary - KJ6Q]

And it just happens *I* still HAVE one of those thermo Quads for the 440...
8^)

Gary - KJ6Q

bsp...@DIESPAMMERS.jlc.net wrote in message <72t11f$2qg$1...@mozart.jlc.net>...

[KT1256]

Had a similar problem on a '75 440 with thermo quad carb. It turned out to be
gas leaking into the intake from a o-ring gasket in the carb float bowl.
Replacement requires disassembly of carb., or purchase rebuilt carb.