Winterizing: antifreeze vs. empting pipes.
Tom T
winterization method has changed a bit from years back and I thought
I'd share my opinion about it. I use to always pump antifreeze in my
pipes via the water pump. I still think this method is wise for
systems without a low to ground valve to empty the fresh water system.
My RV has a drain valve at a low point. As long as the rig is level,
it drains the lines pretty well but not completely. I also empty my
tanks including the hot water, fresh, gray, and black water via the
appropriate valves before I begin emptying my water lines. My RV has
PEX piping for the fresh water system. It is a plastic type tubing
that has some give in it. As I understand it, the only weak points are
the couplers and the water pump. No copper in my system. I drain my
pipes by opening up each and every valve in the rig AFTER I open the
drain valves. This so that the water runs out of the lines. I open the
toilet flush valve to drain that line. I pour some pink stuff in the
sinks (sink traps) and the toilet.
I believe freezing pipes were a problem with copper but when was the
last time you heard of broken water pipes in a newer RV? Seriously,
when? If you have heard of an issue with frozen pipe breakage, was it
an older RV? After dealing with frozen copper pipes in my earlier
life, I found that simply leaving valves open with the inlet water
shut off would more times than not allow enough pressure relief to
save the copper pipes even if they were not drained but left open. Now
with plastic PEX pipes, it is not an issue and if the pipes are
drained to allow more expansion of ice, you afford yourself even more
protection against pipe breakage.
In the last several years I haven't added antifreeze to my pipes even
once,. We have had temps down to 10F and I had no issue at all with
pipe breakage. I do still add antifreeze to the gray and black water
tanks and the sink traps.
For those people that doubt this method, I'd suggest you fill a
plastic bottle with water and toss it into the freezer. Does it break
when it's frozen? It might if you fill it to the top and seal the cap
with no air in at all but that's even doubtful. Fill it all the way
to the top and leave it in the freezer up right. Does it burst? No,
it doesn't. Not ever. The new plastic pipes in RVs are a lot better
than a plastic bottle. They won't break if air is in the lines to
allow water expansion. The weak points are the pipe joints and the
water pump but even those are not issue if the water pump is run dry
after the fresh water tank is emptied and the water pipes are mostly
drained. There can be water in the lines without any pipe issue at
all. If you are concerned of a low point in the water line system,
drive around a block or two with the low point valves open. That will
drain the low point of the pipes mostly.
There are some people that will always say the sky would fall if you
don't put antifreeze in your water pipes. These people don't really
know any better so they go with what they *know* works. There is
nothing wrong with that but they are wrong. You don't need antifreeze
in your lines if you have PEX pipe, a bottom drain and run the pump
dry along with emptying your tanks. Having antifreeze in the sink
traps might save a break of the sink traps but I doubt that's even
needed. I still add antifreeze to the sink traps because I have no
experience indicating not adding antifreeze to them is OK.
Make up your own mind regarding it. You can spend the time and money
to winterize your fresh water pipes every year with antifreeze if you
have your mind made up about it. I chose not to and have not for years
and have not had a single problem.
Tom
lil abner
weakest point or everywhere.
RVing is a hobby. You need more reasons to replace pipes etc because you
are bored stiff with nothing to do to your coach.
dm_callier
than 15 minutes and takes less than a gallon of the pink stuff, I
think I'll continue to opt for peace of mind.
Enjoy the day!
Tom J
> I've owned a RV for more than 25 years and each year I winterize. My
> winterization method has changed a bit from years back and I thought
> I'd share my opinion about it. I use to always pump antifreeze in my
> pipes via the water pump. I still think this method is wise for
> systems without a low to ground valve to empty the fresh water
> system.
> My RV has a drain valve at a low point. As long as the rig is level,
> it drains the lines pretty well but not completely. I also empty my
> tanks including the hot water, fresh, gray, and black water via the
> appropriate valves before I begin emptying my water lines. My RV has
> PEX piping for the fresh water system. It is a plastic type tubing
> that has some give in it. As I understand it, the only weak points
> are
> the couplers and the water pump. No copper in my system.
I owned RV's from 1971 to January of this year and never had frozen
pipes, pumps, anything. Some had copper lines & some had plastic
lines. Never in all those years did I put anything in the fresh water
lines, I just drained them and then blew them out with air hose. I did
put antifreeze in the traps because I didn't want to let oders into
the rigs by having empty drain traps. What I did do was turn on the
heat when outside temps went below 27 degrees!! You see, my RV's were
always parked where they had electric service available & if the power
went off, which happened several times over the years, I just turned
on the gas furnace.
Tom J
N4HHE
> I believe freezing pipes were a problem with copper but when was the
> last time you heard of broken water pipes in a newer RV? Seriously,
> when?
The previous owner of my "old" 2007 Hobbi toy hauler removed one-way
valves from the kitchen sink which previously prevented them from
draining back. Removed the one-way valves when he had to replace the
faucet due to freeze damage.
When I bought the rig the toilet valve was leaking. Finally found the
stress crack which really couldn't be from much else other than freezing.
Am a bit confused about the plumbing. When temporarily turning the water
off in the shower at the shower head, when its re-opened a minute later
the water is cold. Is as if the hot water recedes being pushed back by
cold water.
I rigged a garden hose to connect to my air compressor and blew out all
the lines several weeks ago. Pulled the anode from hot water heater to
drain it. Also opened the low point drains at the rear of the trailer
(which is also under the shower). Curious in that one line vented
pressurized air but the other only dumped a bit of water and never blew
air. Didn't seem to matter whether the hot water bypass was on or off.
Steve Wolf
For years, for more than a decade, I ran without antifreeze. But I had
a unit that had a plumbing system that had drains at the low points.
Further, it was during a time when the faucets and valves could be left
open and air. But knock-off and cheap units don't often have those
drains properly placed.
I'm arriving home in zero degree weather and while I can drain, I can't
get it all. I can blow the pipes out if I want to spend more time with
the compressor than I ever would with the antifreeze.
My biggest advantage is having a unit that is very easy to antifreeze.
It now takes me about five to ten minutes and just over half a gallon of
antifreeze to protect my whole system. When I'm ready to camp, it takes
me another ten to flush it out.
It is much easier to antifreeze the system in my current box than to do
otherwise.
Steve
www.wolfswords.com under the motorhome link
nothermark
Hmm, bought two gallons of pink stuff last year and I know the second
gallon is around somewhere. 1 gall does the job, I would just lose
the half I would save by not filling the lines. Not worth taking the
chance. ;-)
Elliot Richmond
<tomink...@gmail.com> wrote:
>I've owned a RV for more than 25 years and each year I winterize.
Well, I never winterize my Casita and I have never had a problem.
Oh, wait. I live in Central Texas.
Never mind.
Elliot Richmond
Itinerant astronomy teacher
PJ
is in the various faucets, toilet, shower fixtures etc. The big thing
would be the pump. It's not that big a hassle to winterize, once the
bypass valves are in place. It's a major hassle to replace broken fixtures.
"nothermark" <nothe...@not.here> wrote in message
news:lluph51l0ns58dmro...@4ax.com...