Does anyone have experiences of Sage 390 XP?
Jarmo Hurri
Hi there!
My lightweight gear project is moving forward. I've got a pretty good
idea of available reels. I've also selected the most prominent
candidate for the rod. However, my selection is based on specs,
reputation and rumours. I'd be very happy if someone could provide me
with first hand experiences.
My needs are as follows. I will be fishing trout and grayling with
this rod. My 6wt is too powerful for such fishing. On the other hand,
fishing does not necessarily take place in very small rivers. For
example, last year in Sweden I had to cast as long as I could *with my
6wt equipment* while fishing for grayling. Therefore I should be make
fairly long casts with the rod. Also, the rod should be able to handle
some wind. Finally, I expect that this fishing equipment will be my
primary fishing equipment for the next 10 years, so I want to purchase
quality stuff.
With these requirements I've chosen Sage 390 XP to be my primary
candidate. I've estimated that a 3wt rod will be substantially lighter
than my 6wt, hopefully optimal for my purposes. The XP is
lightweight. It has the power and length for long casts, and should
also be able to handle windy conditions. And the quality should be
high. The only problem with it is that there is no travel model
available. I contacted Sage about this, and they had a good
justification for it: in fast-action lightweight rods it is difficult
to add ferrules without compromising action.
So, I'd be interested to hear opinions about this rod from people who
own or have tested the rod. What is the range of fly sizes that can be
cast successfully, how does the rod behave in windy conditions etc.?
There are a lot of opinions involved, but I'm interested in them too.
I know that some people will respond to this message with "you have to
try the rod yourself". Well, first of all, I don't think any of the
local shops have this rod in stock. Second, even if they had, the
stores are somewhat reluctant to give such rods out for testing. They
are saying that the properties of the rod change a little when it is
tested, and that it is therefore no more new. This is somewhat
ridiculous for rods that are supposed to last for a lifetime, but it's
their business and I don't want to argue with them.
Thanks in advance for all those who choose to contribute. :)
--
Jarmo Hurri
Spam countermeasures included. Use firstname...@hut.fi as email
address or apply rot13 to header email address.
Jarmo Hurri
Jarmo> My needs are as follows. I will be fishing trout and grayling with
Jarmo> this rod. My 6wt is too powerful for such fishing. On the other hand,
Jarmo> fishing does not necessarily take place in very small rivers. For
Jarmo> example, last year in Sweden I had to cast as long as I could *with my
Jarmo> 6wt equipment* while fishing for grayling. Therefore I should be make
Jarmo> fairly long casts with the rod. Also, the rod should be able to handle
Jarmo> some wind. Finally, I expect that this fishing equipment will be my
Jarmo> primary fishing equipment for the next 10 years, so I want to purchase
Jarmo> quality stuff.
Jarmo> With these requirements I've chosen Sage 390 XP to be my primary
Jarmo> candidate.
I just love it when I'm the first one to reply to my own post. :-D
Well, the first feedback I got from this message (via email) suggested
that a 3wt might not just do it (too light for our northern
conditions), and that the XP might be too fast. Sort of what I was
afraid of. So I'm back to flip-flopping between 3wt and 4wt. And if XP
is too fast, then there are a number of other possibilities: T&T
Vector, Scott SES, GLoomis GLX, Winston LT5...
Well, if you have any opinions they are still welcome. Back to the
drawing board...
Brian D. Nelson
and an 480 (4-piece) XP and I love them both. Good fast action rods yet I
can still perform the short casts, at least with the 4 weight. I would think
your choice will be a good one.
--
Brian D. Nelson
Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana
br...@diamondnoutfitters.com
www.diamondnoutfitters.com
"Jarmo Hurri" <wnezb...@uhg.sv> wrote in message
news:4bit7rr...@james.hut.fi...
Charlie Wilson
"Jarmo Hurri" wrote:
> With these requirements I've chosen Sage 390 XP to be my primary
> candidate. I've estimated that a 3wt rod will be substantially lighter
> than my 6wt, hopefully optimal for my purposes. The XP is
> lightweight. It has the power and length for long casts, and should
> also be able to handle windy conditions. And the quality should be
> high. The only problem with it is that there is no travel model
> available.
I believe you will be amazed by the versatility of that rod. I can
easily cast #4 foam bodied stoneflies with it; the rod has power, finesse,
and range. Do you really NEED it in a multi piece travel rod, or are you
falling victim to advertising pressures? I've never found myself in position
to say "Aw heck, I'm going to have to stay home today because all I have is
this crummy old two piece rod".
Roger Ohlund
I beleive You are wise to reconsider and look at 4wt instead. I've got a
Sage LL 490-4 myself and even though it's something of a favourite it
doesn't always suffice. Fishing in the mountains even a 4wt has it's
limitations. My guess is that You're, for the most, going to use it in
running water. In a water such as Rostoetno it will do just fine but try
fishing River Pite........
A 3wt on the other hand, will with a little wind have problems in Rostoetno
too.
Yours/ Roger
"Jarmo Hurri" <wnezb...@uhg.sv> wrote in message
news:4belifq...@james.hut.fi...
William Loehman/Susan Schwarz
Jarmo Hurri wrote:
>
> Hi there!
>
> My lightweight gear project is moving forward. I've got a pretty good
> idea of available reels. I've also selected the most prominent
> candidate for the rod. However, my selection is based on specs,
> reputation and rumours. I'd be very happy if someone could provide me
> with first hand experiences.
I think a four weight would be more versatile than a 3 weight.
It sucks that your shops won't let you cast the rods the have for sale.
Since what makes a "good" rod is such a personal thing, it's hard to
give someone a recommendation without knowing what type of rod they
like.
What make and model is your six weight rod?
What do you like and dislike about it?
There are people here on ROFF with alot of knowledge about the
properties of different rods. With this above information, some of them
will probably be able to make some good recommendations.
Willi
gol...@frii.com
Jarmo Hurri
Willi> I think a four weight would be more versatile than a 3 weight.
Judging from the responses I've had, that seems to be the concensus,
especially among those who fish in similar waters as I do (fairly long
casts, windy conditions). So now I'm focusing on 4wt rods.
Willi> It sucks that your shops won't let you cast the rods the have
Willi> for sale. Since what makes a "good" rod is such a personal
Willi> thing, it's hard to give someone a recommendation without
Willi> knowing what type of rod they like.
Yes, it makes gear ***ring much less fun. The risk is *a lot* bigger
than what it would be if I could test the rods beforehand.
Willi> What make and model is your six weight rod?
It's Scott SAS 906.
Willi> What do you like and dislike about it?
Well, I like it's action when there's a fish at the other end of the
line (at least I have good memories about those moments). There are
two things I don't like. The first thing I don't like is that the rod
is restless. I mean, it takes too long for the rod to calm down after
a forward or backward cast.
Second, I would like it to have more power for casting. Rivers are
typically fairly wide over here. Then again, I'm *definitely not* an
expert in casting, so my need for more power from the rod may decrease
in the future (I hope). This casting power, if I've understood
correctly, is almost eternally somehow in conflict with the goodness
of contact with the fish when it's hooked. (I seem to lack one English
verb. What is it that you're doing when your trying to land the fish?
And no smartass answers, ok :-).) There's probably an intermediate
optimum for an angler and a fishing situation.
I've sometimes thought that my two-handed salmon rod could be as stiff
as an iron bar if it helps me make longer casts. When fishing Atlantic
salmon on the Teno you have to make approximately 10,000 casts for one
strike. Let's say that takes a week, 8 hours a day (3 casts in a
minute), and then the fish is hooked for 15 minutes, so the fish is
hooked for 0.4% of the time you're fishing. If you can make long casts,
you enjoy casting, and perhaps increase your chances of a strike a
bit.
But in grayling and trout fishing the situation is different. IMHO it
is a much more reasonable combination of casting and the other thing
(the verb which I don't know yet). And the rod should reflect this.
I also like the unconditional warranty. ;-)
Willi> There are people here on ROFF with alot of knowledge about the
Willi> properties of different rods. With this above information, some
Willi> of them will probably be able to make some good
Willi> recommendations.
That would be very nice. Thanks, Willi.
Jarmo Hurri
Roger> I beleive You are wise to reconsider and look at 4wt
Roger> instead. I've got a Sage LL 490-4 myself and even though it's
Roger> something of a favourite it doesn't always suffice. Fishing in
Roger> the mountains even a 4wt has it's limitations. My guess is that
Roger> You're, for the most, going to use it in running water. In a
Roger> water such as Rostoetno it will do just fine but try fishing
Roger> River Pite........
Well, I've got the 6wt for larger rivers.
Roger> A 3wt on the other hand, will with a little wind have problems
Roger> in Rostoetno too.
I've flip-flopped today again so that I now think that what I need is
a 4wt.
Jarmo Hurri
Brian> Sorry Jarmo, can't tell you about the 390 XP. I do, however,
Brian> have a 690 XP and an 480 (4-piece) XP and I love them
Brian> both. Good fast action rods yet I can still perform the short
Brian> casts, at least with the 4 weight. I would think your choice
Brian> will be a good one.
Brian,
When you're using the 480 XP, what do you think of the contact with
the fish when you're trying to land it? What type and size of fish do
you usually catch with it? I'm currently leaning towards 490 XP (if
it's going to be a Sage), assuming that it's not too stiff for landing
soft-mouthed graylings weighting something like 500gr-1000gr. I'm sure
it's ok for larger fish.
Jarmo Hurri
>> With these requirements I've chosen Sage 390 XP to be my primary
>> candidate.
Charlie> I believe you will be amazed by the versatility of that
Charlie> rod. I can easily cast #4 foam bodied stoneflies with it; the
Charlie> rod has power, finesse, and range.
I think I have to play it safe and get a 4wt because of long distances
and windy conditions.
Charlie> Do you really NEED it in a multi piece travel rod, or are you
Charlie> falling victim to advertising pressures? I've never found
Charlie> myself in position to say "Aw heck, I'm going to have to stay
Charlie> home today because all I have is this crummy old two piece
Charlie> rod".
Well, it would help me a lot if the rod could fit into my backpack. A
second (smaller) issue is traveling in aeroplanes, in which I prefer
to carry my rod as a hand luggage.
Vaughan Hurry
> second (smaller) issue is traveling in aeroplanes, in which I prefer
> to carry my rod as a hand luggage.
For what it is worth Jarmo, before the current fuss about carry-on I had no
trouble flying with 3-pc 10' rods and certainly 3-pc. 9' rods were no
problem. These days everything seems to be a bit more difficult and I don't
know if it makes much difference if you have a 5-pc rod tube rather than a
3-pc. But I agree with you that the shorter rods are better for stuffing in
a pack. I have had no trouble with 3-pc rods for backpacking. See if you
can't bully that shop into letting you cast that 4wt XP with both 4 and 5wt
lines, surely they want to sell stuff, and if they wont let you cast it you
might as well mail order it.
Vaughan
Charlie Wilson
"Roger Ohlund" <Roger....@epl.ericsson.se> wrote in message
news:a7a5iu$5dn$1...@antares.lu.erisoft.se...
> Jarmo,
> I beleive You are wise to reconsider and look at 4wt instead. I've got a
> Sage LL 490-4 myself and even though it's something of a favourite it
> doesn't always suffice. Fishing in the mountains even a 4wt has it's
> limitations. My guess is that You're, for the most, going to use it in
> running water. In a water such as Rostoetno it will do just fine but try
> fishing River Pite........
> A 3wt on the other hand, will with a little wind have problems in
Rostoetno
> too.
That's like comparing apples to oranges. I also have a 490LL, which
is just dandy for delicate presentations, but it's a noodle in comparison.
The 390XP has quite a bit more backbone, and it will cast a four weight line
with much greater authority (greater distance and into the wind) than the
490LL will. A friend claims his 490XP is the last word in all-around rods
and I'd possibly agree with him if I spent much time on bigger waters.
Peter Charles
>[snip]
>Thanks in advance for all those who choose to contribute. :)
OK, you've got tons of good advice so I'll screw things up by posting
an alternate. You already have a six weight - why not get a short six
(around 8')? I have one, my son has one and we love 'em. They are
light enough to feel like a four but the still cast a six. They don't
overpower the fish yet we can still sling large flies.
Orvis still makes one, Loomis has one in a GL3 - 3 piece and maybe one
or two others may have something similar.
Peter
Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html
George Gehrke
> I believe you will be amazed by the versatility of that rod. I can
> easily cast #4 foam bodied stoneflies with it; the rod has power, finesse,
> and range.
A perfect oxymoron. Impossible.
Sorry to say,
George
Power, finesse, and range? Surely, you jest!
TyKo
>
>
>
> I think a four weight would be more versatile than a 3 weight.
>
>
I would agree with this. I fish small streams a lot, but a heavy
streamer can be a pain with a 3 weight. As for the action of the rod,
i can't comment on particulars of Sage rods, but I wouldn't be afraid
of a fast action with a light line weight. I think a rod of that
weight won't be too stiff even in a fast action, and the alternative
is a rod that doesn't have enough guts for wind, heavy flies, or
distance, not to mention a large fish. To me, a fast-action 4-wt would
be a good all around "light" outfit for trout/grayling. If you're
afraid of the action being too stiff, try to find a medium-fast. Just
don't get the medium action (which is a "slow" for graphite rods). I
don't think they have enough guts to be useful for their line weight.
good luck,
TyKo
Roger Ohlund
news:3c98...@news.peakpeak.com...
<snip>
>That's like comparing apples to oranges.
<snip>
Funny, I thought they were both fruits.
See your point though.
Yours/ Roger
Jarmo Hurri
Charlie> A friend claims his 490XP is the last word in all-around rods
Charlie> and I'd possibly agree with him if I spent much time on
Charlie> bigger waters.
I've decided to go for Sage 490 XP. It should have enough power for
long casts and wind, and still be "soft enough" for grayling (I
contacted a guy with 30 years of experience of Sage rods and he
confirmed this). The rod also has an unconditional lifetime guarantee.
I'm sure that there are other good alternatives, such as T&T Vector,
Winston LTX or LT5, Scott SES, or GLoomis GLX. XP has a *very good*
reputation around here. The Vector is more expensive, and (as far as I
know), does not have an unconditional guarantee. Winston is also more
expensive, and fairly unknown around here. Scott would be a
possibility, but we don't have a dealer here anymore, and it's
reputation is not as good as Sage's. The same goes for GLoomis.
As sugar on top, I also just got a very good offer on the 4-piece
model from my dealer on the phone. So it looks like this case is
getting closed.
Thank you all for your input. I feel fairly confident about this case
of gear-***ring. :-)
Jarmo Hurri
Jarmo> The Vector is more expensive, and (as far as I know), does not
Jarmo> have an unconditional guarantee.
Have to correct myself. According to an email reply I got from a T&T
sales rep, all current production models have unconditional lifetime
guarantee for original owner.
Rusty Hook
> > I believe you will be amazed by the versatility of that rod. I can
> > easily cast #4 foam bodied stoneflies with it; the rod has power,
finesse,
> > and range.
George Gehrke wrote:
> A perfect oxymoron. Impossible.
It's quite possible; I could use those same words to describe my Diamondback
4wt.
The right rodbuilder could do the same with split cane. Many have.
--
Rusty Hook
Laramie, Wyoming
c...@eightysixthis.uwyo.edu