Val Shively's R&B Records store

[Rick Schubert]

[Rick Schubert]

There was an interesting article in the Philadelphia Inquirer about Val Shively and his R&B Records
store. It's available only to subscribers, but a friend sent it to me. I've uploaded it here:

http://marcdashevsky.com/ValShivelArticle.pdf

[Bruce]

Not Found

The requested URL was not found on this server.

[Bruce]

I see what the problem is. Your URL left out the y in Shively. This link will work.

http://marcdashevsky.com/ValShivelyArticle.pdf

[Bill B]

On Monday, November 6, 2023 at 1:22:24 AM UTC-5, Rick Schubert wrote:

> There was an interesting article in the Philadelphia Inquirer about Val Shively and his R&B Records
> store. It's available only to subscribers, but a friend sent it to me.

Thank you, Rick. Very enjoyable.

[Bruce]

This guy has his head up his ass calling this dump "The World's Greatest Record Shop." Shively doesn't even know where most of his records are. He tells people he has a copy of a record they want, but has no idea where it is.

You can't even walk in there and buy a new copy of most famous albums on vinyl or CD. How the fuck is it the "World's Greatest Record Store?"

And saying that "Val knows everything" is even more ridiculous. All he knows is rare vocal group 45s. If you asked him for a famous hip hop or heavy metal song he would not even know what you're talking about.

[Roger Ford]

On Monday, 6 November 2023 at 16:35:03 UTC, Bruce wrote:

> This guy has his head up his ass calling this dump "The World's Greatest Record Shop."

In terms of finding a physical (and often original) copy of a given 45rpm single in the pop/r&r/r&b or country fields from the past 70 odd years it must be well in the running for that title..

If there is a better such store location I've never been in it

>Shively doesn't even know where most of his records are.

That's why he has Chuck D. who's got the phenomenal knack of locating a given record in minutes

>He tells people he has a copy of a record they want, but has no idea where it is.

Again back to good ol' Chuck-O

> You can't even walk in there and buy a new copy of most famous albums on vinyl or CD.

He's not catering for the album or CD buying market. The emphasis is on oldie SINGLES just as it is the main deal to write about for members of this newsgroup (including you and I)

>How the fuck is it the "World's Greatest Record Store?"

Check the first line of my reply here

> And saying that "Val knows everything" is even more ridiculous. All he knows is rare vocal group 45s.

That's his forte. I don't think he claims otherwise

>If you asked him for a famous hip hop or heavy metal song he would not even know what you're talking about.

As nor would I

[Bruce]

On Tuesday, November 7, 2023 at 1:44:34 AM UTC-5, Roger Ford wrote:
> On Monday, 6 November 2023 at 16:35:03 UTC, Bruce wrote:
>
> > This guy has his head up his ass calling this dump "The World's Greatest Record Shop."

> In terms of finding a physical (and often original) copy of a given 45rpm single in the pop/r&r/r&b or country fields from the past 70 odd years it must be well in the running for that title..

Which in no way would make it "The World's Greatest record Store." Only a small percentage of record collectors in 2023 are interested in original 45's. But even in that narrow category I'd put Craig Moerer ahead of him. Not only does he have similar stock, but everything is catalogued and found quickly if ordered. And with Craig it's the same with albums and lots of other categories of music that Val knows nothing about. Frankie C called him about several 60s chart hits he needed for his series of year CDs that Val did not even know in the past couple of years. The guy is turning 80 soon and has head all clogged up with all of his Christian bullshit now. Plus he's a fucking Trump supporter.

> >Shively doesn't even know where most of his records are.

> That's why he has Chuck D. who's got the phenomenal knack of locating a given record in minutes

Don't know when you were there last, but Chuck only knows where the things that are filed are. In the last few years Val has told Bill Olb that he has about half a dozen 45's from his want list, but has no idea where they are....and neither does Chuck. Bill has given up trying to deal with Val and looks elsewhere for these items now.

> >He tells people he has a copy of a record they want, but has no idea where it is.

> Again back to good ol' Chuck-O

No, back to bad old Val.

> > You can't even walk in there and buy a new copy of most famous albums on vinyl or CD.

> He's not catering for the album or CD buying market. The emphasis is on oldie SINGLES just as it is the main deal to write about for members of this newsgroup (including you and I)

How can a store that only caters to old 45's possibly even be mentioned by anybody as the world's greatest record store? Some thing like 75% of collectors in 2023 don't even collect 45s at all. Hardly anybody under 50 even cares about 45's Maybe you haven't noticed but your generation of record collectors are dying off.

I don't really write about 45's, I write about 40s, 50s and 60s recordings, whatever format the music happened to be available on. I never agreed with limiting the yearly battles to just singles. It should just be about the best recordings that were first released in each year. What format they were on is irrelevant. That was controlled by the pricks like my grandfather who owned the labels, not by the people who made the music. Why list something like "Baby" by Little Richard in the 1960 battle rather than the 1957 battle, where it belongs and was first released. I don't get that mindset. This all should e=e about the music, not about the records, IMO.

> >How the fuck is it the "World's Greatest Record Store?"

> Check the first line of my reply here

Check my reply to your reply.

> > And saying that "Val knows everything" is even more ridiculous. All he knows is rare vocal group 45s.

> That's his forte. I don't think he claims otherwise.

But he's not correcting people like the writer of this article, is he? And even in that genre he knows almost nothing about unissued things and album tracks. He's a record collector, he's not any kind of an expert even about 50s music, let alone the music of before and after the 50s.

> >If you asked him for a famous hip hop or heavy metal song he would not even know what you're talking about.

> As nor would I

And neither of you would be in the running as the world's biggest expert on rock and roll music. You know WAY WAY WAY more than Val does about 50s music, but it's 2023 now. There's a lot more to rock and roll history than there was when Val started his store in like 1971 or whenever he first opened.

Now that Samp has studied the early days of rock and roll in such depth I would say that he knows WAY more about the entire history of rock than you and I do. He wouldn't beat us on the 50s or maybe not even the 60s, but he'd destroy us on anything from the past like 45 years. We're like fossils now. But Val is not even that. I'll bet you if you called him and asked him to name 10 Howlin' Wolf songs that he couldn't do it. Same with acts like Smiley Lewis, Jimmy McCracklin, Stick McGhee and even BB King. I don't think he could even come up with 10 B King songs off the top of his head. Expert, my fucking ass. He's just a fucking record collector.

[Roger Ford]

On Tuesday, 7 November 2023 at 07:25:32 UTC, Bruce wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 7, 2023 at 1:44:34 AM UTC-5, Roger Ford wrote:
> > On Monday, 6 November 2023 at 16:35:03 UTC, Bruce wrote:
> >
> > > This guy has his head up his ass calling this dump "The World's Greatest Record Shop."
>
> > In terms of finding a physical (and often original) copy of a given 45rpm single in the pop/r&r/r&b or country fields from the past 70 odd years it must be well in the running for that title..

> Which in no way would make it "The World's Greatest record Store." Only a small percentage of record collectors in 2023 are interested in original 45's.

I'm not a "collector" anymore (if I ever was one)---but I suppose I must count myself in this select group :)

>But even in that narrow category I'd put Craig Moerer ahead of him. Not only does he have similar stock, but everything is catalogued and found quickly if ordered. And with Craig it's the same with albums and lots of >other categories of music that Val knows nothing about. Frankie C called him about several 60s chart hits he needed for his series of year CDs that Val did not even know in the past couple of years.

I've personally never had dealings with Craig nor ever met the guy so really can't comment on him. But I've always only ever heard good things about him

>The guy (Val) is turning 80 soon and has head all clogged up with all of his Christian bullshit now. Plus he's a fucking Trump supporter.

Ha! That last sentence goes a long way,I suggest to explaining your obvious distain for the guy :)

> > >Shively doesn't even know where most of his records are.

Had the same problem (but on a much smaller scale) at Moondog's. And my girlfriend says I'm the untidiest guy in the world (she's obviously never met Val).

But unlike Val I know where everything is

>
> > That's why he has Chuck D. who's got the phenomenal knack of locating a given record in minutes

> Don't know when you were there last, but Chuck only knows where the things that are filed are. In the last few years Val has told Bill Olb that he has about half a dozen 45's from his want list, but has no idea where >they are....and neither does Chuck. Bill has given up trying to deal with Val and looks elsewhere for these items now.
> > >He tells people he has a copy of a record they want, but has no idea where it is.

Last time I saw Val in person was 2002 ----the last time I was in the USA

>
> > > You can't even walk in there and buy a new copy of most famous albums on vinyl or CD.
>

Nor could you at Moondog's nor at any of the other "oldies" record shops that sprang up since over here in the UK. since And which are mostly all sadly just as demised now as Moondog's

> > He's not catering for the album or CD buying market. The emphasis is on oldie SINGLES just as it is the main deal to write about for members of this newsgroup (including you and I)

> How can a store that only caters to old 45's possibly even be mentioned by anybody as the world's greatest record store?

Quite easily when you're somebody like me whose main interest in music is far and away the r&r/r&b of the 1950's and r&b/soul of the 60's and 70's. I have little to no interest in the rest

>Some thing like 75% of collectors in 2023 don't even collect 45s at all. Hardly anybody under 50 even cares about 45's Maybe you haven't noticed but your generation of record collectors are dying off.

That's all true but why should that have any bearing on my thinking or my opinions? Easy answer - it doesn't

> I don't really write about 45's, I write about 40s, 50s and 60s recordings, whatever format the music happened to be available on. I never agreed with limiting the yearly battles to just singles. It should just be about >the best recordings that were first released in each year. What format they were on is irrelevant. That was controlled by the pricks like my grandfather who owned the labels, not by the people who made the music. >Why list something like "Baby" by Little Richard in the 1960 battle rather than the 1957 battle, where it belongs and was first released. I don't get that mindset. This all should e=e about the music, not about the >records, IMO.

The Battles were all based on the singles that were released in the year in question.I don't recall any adverse comment on here at the time about that from others. But I can see your argument for basing them on when the recording was released (in any format).But either way it was done somebody was always gonna be less than happy with the battle method

> > >How the fuck is it the "World's Greatest Record Store?"
>

Because it's aimed at people like me. I'm not saying it IS the "World's Greatest".

But what I am saying is that I never was in a record store I liked more.Nor one where I bought so much merchandise

>> > > And saying that "Val knows everything" is even more ridiculous. All he knows is rare vocal group 45s.

> > That's his forte. I don't think he claims otherwise.
>

> But he's not correcting people like the writer of this article, is he? And even in that genre he knows almost nothing about unissued things and album tracks. He's a record collector, he's not any kind of an expert even >about 50s music, let alone the music of before and after the 50s.If you asked him for a famous hip hop or heavy metal song he would not even know what you're talking about.

>
> > As nor would I
> And neither of you would be in the running as the world's biggest expert on rock and roll music.

I don't think Val himself has ever aspired to that position just as neither have I. I'm just your ordinary everyday 1950's rock 'n' roll fan,

>You know WAY WAY WAY more than Val does about 50s music, but it's 2023 now. There's a lot more to rock and roll history than there was when Val started his store in like 1971 or whenever he first opened.

As I recall he opened the first Garrett Road store in 1972. Much smaller and MUCH MUCH tidier than the 2002 version. As I recall I was one of the first people there on the day he opened

> Now that Samp has studied the early days of rock and roll in such depth I would say that he knows WAY more about the entire history of rock than you and I do. He wouldn't beat us on the 50s or maybe not even the >60s, but he'd destroy us on anything from the past like 45 years. We're like fossils now. But Val is not even that. I'll bet you if you called him and asked him to name 10 Howlin' Wolf songs that he couldn't do it. Same >with acts like Smiley Lewis, Jimmy McCracklin, Stick McGhee and even BB King. I don't think he could even come up with 10 B King songs off the top of his head. Expert, my fucking ass. He's just a fucking record >collector.

But for you I get the distinct impression that his political views tend to...um.....trump.....everything else,no? :)

[Bruce]

On Tuesday, November 7, 2023 at 8:59:06 AM UTC-5, Roger Ford wrote:

> But for you I get the distinct impression that his political views tend to...um.....trump.....everything else,no? :)

They certainly don't help. But it's really the constant series of video clips and articles declaring him the expert of all experts and claiming that his dump is the Greatest Record store. Now some guy is making a short movie about him.

Here's a link to Craig Moerer's website, check it out.

https://www.recordsbymail.com/

I never met him in person, and I don't think there's an actual physical store, it's just mail order. He's got some warehouse, and everything is run professionally, unlike Val's shithole. Me and Donn were partners on a couple of finds back in the 70s and we wholesaled them to Craig. We sold him like 400 copies of "Rock Crazy Baby" by Art Adams for like 2K I think. Of course he had sold every copy decades ago.

[Bruce]

Frankie C weighs in on this:

Fred Bohn`s store (THE ATTIC) has MORE records than Val. He has 3 warehouses full of records.Val wouldn`t have paid 100K for Hunt`s records. Bohn has loads of rare stuff and much better prices. Pittsburgh is the oldies (groups,50`s & 60`s,Blues) capitol of the world, not NY or Philly. What you said is true about Val not knowing where everything is. I can`t believe Val has only 11K records in his personal collection. Roger ever been to Pittsburgh?

ME
When Jim Hunt died his wife wanted to sell the records, so I hooked her up with Fred. He came into town, went through the collection and gave her 99K for it, which was worth around 200K retail.

[Roger Ford]

On Tuesday, 7 November 2023 at 18:10:31 UTC, Bruce wrote:
> Frankie C weighs in on this:
>
> Fred Bohn`s store (THE ATTIC) has MORE records than Val. He has 3 warehouses full of records.Val wouldn`t have paid 100K for Hunt`s records. Bohn has loads of rare stuff and much better prices. Pittsburgh is the oldies (groups,50`s & 60`s,Blues) capitol of the world, not NY or Philly. What you said is true about Val not knowing where everything is. I can`t believe Val has only 11K records in his personal collection. Roger ever been to Pittsburgh?

Hi Frankie. Yep been to Pittsburgh just once---but only for a plane change (in 2002 I go t a real cheap flight deal from London to St Louis but I had to change planes at Pittsburgh)