The new Marillion album
Hans G Bäckman
have followed for many years and I have always liked what they have done
(more or less). Their last album "marillion.com" was one the defenitive step
off the neo-progressive map. But that the next album would be off the
musical map and enough wrong oriented to reach beyond the borders of
trash-music. This is not fun! Anoraknophobia is a real bummer! So even if
you are a die-hard-Marillion-fan, you should be warned, and keep away from
this crappy shit! They are great musicians, but that doesn´t creat good
music. It sounds like they have been trying to show off, and it just don´t
turn me on :) One last time, this is not the old good Marillion 1981-1998.
Now it´s some pop-trash that is some of the worst I have heard...I recommend
you to spend your money on Pendragons new album "Not of this World" instead,
Pendragon still have it, Marillion don´t...!
/ Hans G Bäckman
Adam Levin
> Pendragon still have it, Marillion don´t...!
Whatever Pendragon has is stolen property that was severely damaged in the
theft.
-Adam
----
T h e D a r k A e t h e r P r o j e c t
http://www.darkaether.net/
http://mp3.com/darkaether/
firemill
news:LptR6.18785$Qp1.2...@nntp1.chello.se...
Haven't got the album, but what I've heard of it sounds awfully dull. It's
not because its less prog or whatever and to be honest I don't care whether
they decide to be progressive or not just so long as they're any good. I
know the band say they don't care what is said about them by the media, but
all that criticism must get pretty depressing after a while. Consequently
the music on this album sounds like a bit of an attempt to fade into the
background (drawing on Radiohead, Massive Attack influences etc) and thus
attract less derision.
Have to say I don't like "Not of this World" at all. IQ's latest offering
on the other hand, "The Seventh House", is excellent.
rory the tory
I haven't got the Pendragon album but I agree with you about the new I.Q
one it is very good. The new Marillion album has a couple of decent
tracks and some decent parts of tracks but then again they seem to get a
bit muddled, I don't think it's poppy at all but at least it's an
improvement on Marillion.com if that's anything to go by.
I wonder what other Marillion fans out there think of it ? Has anybody
bothered to do a track by track review or is this asking to much?
Mark.
Gern Blensten
"Hans G Bäckman" <h...@hem.passagen.se> wrote in message
news:LptR6.18785$Qp1.2...@nntp1.chello.se...
Well... just to add the other side to this - I'm a big Marillion fan (got
all their studio releases and some live ones), and I think Anorak is the
best thing they've done since "Clutching at Straws". The only thing that
has come close is maybe "Radiation" or "Afraid of Sunlight". There seems to
be a wide variety of opinions on M's latest - at least it's generating some
discussion!
- G
*Legion*
You must have a different copy of the album than everyone else.
I find it amusing how some Marillion fans have themselves caught in a
logic error. The error comes from a conflict between "Pop is bad" and
"I like Marillion". So we get "well, erm, weeellll.... it's kinda
sorta somewhat conceivably proggy!". Sheesh. If you like the album,
then keep on liking it. Just don't try to pass it off as something
it's not. There's nothing wrong with a pop (or even just "pop-ish" or
"poppy") album.
-- *L*
Bo Bo
at least Marillion is a band who dares to change direction with each album.
Now isn't that the true sence of the word 'progressive' or what ?
bobo
Gern Blensten
"*Legion*" <legion_@_vgpalace.com> wrote in message
news:3mddhtc3bpp6avuuo...@4ax.com...
I quite agree, however Anorak is not a pop album. It is, however, an album
with a couple of pop tracks. "Bewteen You and Me" and "Map of the World"
are about as poppy as you can get (Map of the World sound like a homage to
Neil Finn). However, I don't really think there's my "poppiness" to
"Quartz", "If My Heart Were a Ball..." or "21st Century".
I don't think us Marillion fans have ourselves caught in any sort of
"error"... it's just that certain music will have different qualities to
different ears.
Christopher J Currie
> at least Marillion is a band who dares to change direction with each album.
> Now isn't that the true sence of the word 'progressive' or what ?
Not if their 'directional change' just puts them more in line with the
industry standard. (qv. arguments on Yes's _90125_)
Mind you, I'm not saying this is necessarily the case with _Anarok_ (which
I haven't heard).
The Christopher Currie
*Legion*
>"error"... it's just that certain music will have different qualities to
>different ears.
Do note that I said "some Marillion fans", not just "Marillion fans"
and certainly not "all Marillion fans".
I think your praise of the album has been very reasonable. From an
earlier thread:
"I agree that the album isn't very proggish - but to my ears it's the
best thing they've put out since Season's End. I like the direction
they've gone in..."
It's people that cry "but... but.... it *has* to be proggy, it's
Marillion, and they're prog!" that annoy me. And I'm not referring
only or specifically to this newsgroup (and certainly not to any one
person in particular).
And what bothers me isn't the Marillion at all, but the notion that
something has to be prog to be good (or at least that pop
automatically equals "bad").
-- *L*
Jack Hesse
Gern Blensten
Couldn't agree with you more... sorry for the misunderstanding.
googlesux
"Clutching at Straws," but I might say it's their best overall since
"Brave" or at least since "Afraid of Sunlight." Whatever, I think
it's excellent stuff. It's both poppy and prog. Overall I'd say more
prog than pop, but it's a tough call. I agree with those who say
don't get caught up in that issue. For whatever it's worth, there is
really very little pop (from after the 1940s!) that I really enjoy
listening to that often, but I love Marillion, even their poppier
moments.
Also to help you triangulate or whatever, I also like the new IQ a
lot, and although I've only given the new Pendragon 1 1/2 listens, it
sounded pretty solid to me, for those who like Pendragon that is! ;-)
I affirm everyone's right to not like Pendragon (disclaimer required
by law!).
Jed
"I'm just a victim of pomp-rock and circumstance!"
Clive Backham
<ott...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>Well... just to add the other side to this - I'm a big Marillion fan (got
>all their studio releases and some live ones), and I think Anorak is the
>best thing they've done since "Clutching at Straws". The only thing that
>has come close is maybe "Radiation" or "Afraid of Sunlight". There seems to
>be a wide variety of opinions on M's latest - at least it's generating some
>discussion!
Here's an opinion from a prog fan who hasn't really bothered much with
Marillion. My wife is a big Marillion fan, so I've heard a fair amount
of their output without ever becoming really familiar with it. (I'd
say the Fish era stuff is more interesting than the Hogarth era,
although Brave has its moments). Anyhow, I got her Anoraknaphobia as a
pressie. Listening to it, I'd say it's not prog, and it's not pop.
It's basically a fairly competent rock album, with occasional leanings
in the direction of unusual instrumental parts. Many of the tracks
start out sounding quite promising, then the vocals come in and we
enter dullsville. There is one very nice track (something about God,
track #4 I think).
My wife dragged me along to a Marillion gig in Hemel Hemptstead a
couple of weeks ago. (I will get my own back in October: she's agreed
to come and see Gong with me). They were a competent rock band, and
played quite well, but it wouldn't have bothered me not to have been
there.
I have a question for devoted fans: why does Hogarth sling a cricket
bat around his neck and hold it like a guitar? It had some marks on it
that looked like they might be buttons: is it a noise-producing
instrument of some sort, or just something for him to do with his
hands?
Alex Temple
that isn't prog? anything in popular music that isn't "rock"? does it
have to be peppy and cheerful? does it hvae to actually be popular?
googlesux
> I have a question for devoted fans: why does Hogarth sling a cricket
> bat around his neck and hold it like a guitar? It had some marks on it
> that looked like they might be buttons: is it a noise-producing
> instrument of some sort, or just something for him to do with his
> hands?
It is a functioning keyboard, although with just a few notes. There's
a song called "Uninvited Guest," from the Seasons End album, for which
he used to wear special gloves for -- the gloves had pressure pads in
the fingertips, that triggered a midi device, or something like that.
Kind of cute. A bit of stagecraft mainly.
Clive, your opinions are all fair enough. I find Hogarth's voice to
be one of the best around. The same way that I could listen to Peter
Gabriel sing the phone book, I could with Hogarth. So it's not
dullsville to me. I find the instrumental parts on Anoraknophobia to
be excellent. "This is the 21st Century" is pretty awesome, IMO. And
yes, "When I Meet God" is one of their best songs ever, IMO.
But Marillion is definitely one of those love 'em or ignore 'em bands,
for some reason. So everyone's mileage may vary.
Jed
Clive Backham
>Clive, your opinions are all fair enough. I find Hogarth's voice to
>be one of the best around. The same way that I could listen to Peter
>Gabriel sing the phone book, I could with Hogarth. So it's not
>dullsville to me.
Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. It isn't the quality of Hogarth's
voice that I find dull, but the way that as soon as the vocals come in
the backing instruments become very unimaginative. It's almost as
though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
Of course, if you like Hogarth's voice so much, then no song will
sound boring. And I agree with you that Hogarth is a damn fine singer.
He's way preferable to a whole raft of other singers whose distinctive
vocal characteristics brush me up the wrong way. (Fish, for example,
and the guy in IQ. And that screeching harpie Geddy Lee....)
*Legion*
In the context of discussions at this newsgroup, it usually means
something along the lines of "pop/rock". Popularity is irrelevant -
only the style itself is being discussed.
>does it have to be peppy and cheerful?
Not all pop is peppy and cheerful, so definitely "no" here.
-- *L*
Alex Temple
> >how are we all defining "pop" anyway?
>
> In the context of discussions at this newsgroup, it usually means
> something along the lines of "pop/rock". Popularity is irrelevant -
> only the style itself is being discussed.
How do you define "pop/rock"?
*Legion*
Ask Perez.
-- *L*
Zero the Hero
> Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. It isn't the quality of Hogarth's
> voice that I find dull, but the way that as soon as the vocals come in
> the backing instruments become very unimaginative. It's almost as
> though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
Doesn't that describe most neo-prog?
> and the guy in IQ. And that screeching harpie Geddy Lee....)
LOL! Well, it's been a while since he's done any screeching...
NP: Mark O'Connor - The New Nashville Cats
--
Jason Ellerbee - jel...@unf.edu
DREAMS WIDE AWAKE radio show - http://www.unf.edu/~jeller/dreams.html
Now broadcasting on the Internet!
'Limbaugh was railing about how feminists believe that all heterosexual
sex is rape.... I know a lot of women, almost all of whom consider
themselves feminists, and I know only one who actually holds this belief.
And we've been married nearly twenty years.'
-- Al Franken's _Rush Limbaugh Is a Big Fat Idiot_
Adam Levin
Funky little red candies that crackle in your mouth, but not in your hand.
amr
news:3b17bac4....@supernews.nildram.co.uk...
> On 1 Jun 2001 08:44:16 -0700, jkl...@my-deja.com (googlesux) wrote:
[snip]
> Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. It isn't the quality of Hogarth's
> voice that I find dull, but the way that as soon as the vocals come in
> the backing instruments become very unimaginative. It's almost as
> though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
[snip]
Well, I really like Marillion, including their latest, although I had to
actually ignore them for 6 or 7 years after Fish left, then listen with
"fresh" ears in order to better appreciate their work with Hogarth.
While I may not agree completely with what you are saying (I don't find the
backing instrumentals to be "dull" per se), you do make a fair point: during
the Fish era, keyboards and guitar seemed to get more of a work-out not only
during the song intros, but also between verses. With Hogarth, the
instrumentalists are pretty much relegated to the role of simply being
Hogarth's backup band. Yes, they do get their occasional moments, but they
seem to be much farther and fewer between.
Regards,
Andy
firemill
There's an interesting review here of the album and also the band's attitude
to things prog. I personally find myself agreeing with a lot of it.
Alex Temple
> What Clive Backham <cl...@capita.nildram.co.uk> say!:
> > It's almost as
> > though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
>
> Doesn't that describe most neo-prog?
three words: Spock's. Beard. "Thoughts"
Gern Blensten
Although how This Strange Engine = Crowded House and Radiation = Radiohead
is beyond me...
- G
"firemill" <iain.ma...@virgin.net> wrote in message
news:7o5S6.14529$%_1.24...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com...
Ron
> I am very sorry that it had to come down to this. Marillion is a band that I
> have followed for many years and I have always liked what they have done
> (more or less). Their last album "marillion.com" was one the defenitive step
> off the neo-progressive map. But that the next album would be off the
> musical map and enough wrong oriented to reach beyond the borders of
> trash-music. This is not fun! Anoraknophobia is a real bummer! So even if
> you are a die-hard-Marillion-fan, you should be warned, and keep away from
> this crappy shit! They are great musicians, but that doesn´t creat good
> music. It sounds like they have been trying to show off, and it just don´t
> turn me on :) One last time, this is not the old good Marillion 1981-1998.
> Now it´s some pop-trash that is some of the worst I have heard...I recommend
> you to spend your money on Pendragons new album "Not of this World" instead,
> Pendragon still have it, Marillion don´t...!
>
Pendragon manages to be stale over the years, I had The World, Window
of Life and Masquerade Overture. All these sound so bland, I welcome
Marillion's "experimentations". I would never had bought any Hogarth
era CDs if they all sounded like Seasons End or Holidays In Eden.
Playing it safe and calling oneself a progressive rock band is an
oxymoron.
"This is just my opinion, I could be wrong"
Adam Levin
> Playing it safe and calling oneself a progressive rock band is an
> oxymoron.
Is "oxymoron" a new name for the neoprog subgenre?
Zero the Hero
> Bo Bo come on down:
>>at least Marillion is a band who dares to change direction with each album.
>>Now isn't that the true sence of the word 'progressive' or what ?
> No, the true meaning of the word progressive is AAAAARGH BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM
> BLAM
/me blows smoke from muzzle of pistol
--
Jason Ellerbee - jel...@unf.edu
DREAMS WIDE AWAKE radio show - http://www.unf.edu/~jeller/dreams.html
Now broadcasting on the Internet!
'Progression magazine is to progressive rock as Lawrence Welk is to
Classical music.'
-- Mac Beaulieu
Alex Temple
> Alex Temple come on down:
> That's the boring Gentle Giant ripoff, right?
Yeah, that and "Gibberish".
Master Chalk
>
> >Zero the Hero wrote:
> >
> >> What Clive Backham <cl...@capita.nildram.co.uk> say!:
> >> > It's almost as
> >> > though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
> >>
> >> Doesn't that describe most neo-prog?
> >
> >three words: Spock's. Beard. "Thoughts"
>
> That's the boring Gentle Giant ripoff, right?
Not so much "boring" as "half-assed." "Well, we don't know how to do
counterpoint, really, so let's just sing alternately, and dumb proggers who
know nothing about music theory will *think* it's counterpoint." ;-{)>
MIKE (a.k.a. "Progbear")
make GEORYN disappear to reply
"You can take the war out of the soldier, but you can't raise that soldier from
the dead."
--Shona Laing
N.P.:"¿De dónde vienes, amor, mi niño?"- G e o r g e C r u m b /
A n c i e n t V o i c e s O f C h i l d r e n
Johan Lif
> Not so much "boring" as "half-assed." "Well, we don't know how to do
> counterpoint, really, so let's just sing alternately, and dumb proggers who
> know nothing about music theory will *think* it's counterpoint." ;-{)>
What unsophisticated, unwashed idiots.
Johan
Adam Levin
> > >three words: Spock's. Beard. "Thoughts"
> >
> > That's the boring Gentle Giant ripoff, right?
>
> Not so much "boring" as "half-assed."
I assure you that nothing Spock's Beard does is half-assed. They're
never less than 110% ass. Just talk to Neal Morse sometime for proof.
Alex Temple
> Alex Temple wrote:
> >
> > >Zero the Hero wrote:
> > >
> > >> What Clive Backham <cl...@capita.nildram.co.uk> say!:
> > >> > It's almost as
> > >> > though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
> > >>
> > >> Doesn't that describe most neo-prog?
> > >
> > >three words: Spock's. Beard. "Thoughts"
> >
> > That's the boring Gentle Giant ripoff, right?
>
> Not so much "boring" as "half-assed." "Well, we don't know how to do
> counterpoint, really, so let's just sing alternately, and dumb proggers who
> know nothing about music theory will *think* it's counterpoint." ;-{)>
My objection to "Thoughts" isn't the contrapuntal part, which I kind a like. It's
the stuff in between the contrapuntal bits, which consists of really cheesy music
with incredibly embarrassing lyrics ("I thought about where to go for lunch / I
thought I'd give her what she wants / I thought the dream makes the man").
Moebius x
Adam Levin <ale...@DarkAether.net> wrote in message
news:Pine.BSO.4.21.010604...@horton.darkaether.net...
> On 4 Jun 2001, Master Chalk wrote:
>
> > > >three words: Spock's. Beard. "Thoughts"
> > >
> > > That's the boring Gentle Giant ripoff, right?
> >
> > Not so much "boring" as "half-assed."
>
>
> I assure you that nothing Spock's Beard does is half-assed. They're
> never less than 110% ass.
...And there's nothing worse than a band that is 110% ass, especially
when they're in your face and blowing.
--
Moebius x
いいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいい
Audio Deluge - Instrumental music from the Moebius Vortex
Stuff about the music of Mike Oldfield - Wind Chimes analysis.
http://members.madasafish.com/~urbangeo/moebius.x
いいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいいい
Gern Blensten
I imagine the following question has been answered in posts past, but I've
missed them so I'll ask...
Why do you hate SB and TFK so much? This is not a facetious question... I'm
just curious - you seem to go out of your way to bash those groups.
- G
"Adam Levin" <ale...@DarkAether.net> wrote in message
news:Pine.BSO.4.21.010604...@horton.darkaether.net...
Gern Blensten
"Master Chalk" <prog...@aol.comGEORYN> wrote in message
news:20010604005051...@nso-bk.aol.com...
> Alex Temple wrote:
> >
> > >Zero the Hero wrote:
> > >
> > >> What Clive Backham <cl...@capita.nildram.co.uk> say!:
> > >> > It's almost as
> > >> > though the album is full of great intros to boring songs.
> > >>
> > >> Doesn't that describe most neo-prog?
> > >
> > >three words: Spock's. Beard. "Thoughts"
> >
> > That's the boring Gentle Giant ripoff, right?
>
> Not so much "boring" as "half-assed." "Well, we don't know how to do
> counterpoint, really, so let's just sing alternately, and dumb proggers
who
> know nothing about music theory will *think* it's counterpoint." ;-{)>
Hmmm... I'm a "dumb progger" who likes "Thoughts". However, I like it
because I enjoy listening to it - not because of whether or not music theory
was applied appropriately.
That said, I'm quite sure that Neal Morse is aware of what counterpoint is.
- G
NP: Tool "Lateralus"
Zero the Hero
> That said, I'm quite sure that Neal Morse is aware of what counterpoint is.
Okay, why would you assume this?
NP: Djam Karet - Live at Orion
--
Jason Ellerbee - jel...@unf.edu
DREAMS WIDE AWAKE radio show - http://www.unf.edu/~jeller/dreams.html
Now broadcasting on the Internet!
'My views are that homosexuality should cease functioning. Too bad you
can't steer clear of stupidity.'
-- Dick Enbaughs
Mike Prete *www.progweed.net*
> What Gern Blensten <ott...@newsguy.com> say!:
> > That said, I'm quite sure that Neal Morse is aware of what counterpoint
is.
>
> Okay, why would you assume this?
Anyone with the technical skill to do those jukes while playing keyboards
must know what a simple thing like counterpoint is.
NP: Novalis - Sommerabend
--
Mike Prete - Mi...@progweed.net
The Giant Progweed - Progressive Rock Reviews
www.progweed.net
Jason E
">
> There's an interesting review here of the album and also the band's
attitude to things prog. I personally find myself agreeing with a lot of
it.
>
OK...how about if we boycott Marillion until they repent and release a prog
album. It must be a double concept CD, with a Mark Wilkinson Sleeve, and
Fish back in the fold, entitled "Grendel 2: Clutching at Misplaced Tears"
and includes a 30 minute suite chronicling a lonely Jester who is driven mad
through loss of love and starts to eat children to wreak vengeance on
society.....with an apocalyptic ending in, say, 8/9 .... :-D
Now, *that* would be a Marillion album!
Gern Blensten
"Zero the Hero" <jel...@osprey.unf.edu> wrote in message
news:3b1c3...@csd-32630.noc.unf.edu...
> What Gern Blensten <ott...@newsguy.com> say!:
> > That said, I'm quite sure that Neal Morse is aware of what counterpoint
is.
>
> Okay, why would you assume this?
Well, counterpoint is "combining individual melodies to form a harmonious
whole". I'm a half-assed guitarist, while Morse is a pretty good
professional musician. If I know what counterpoint is, I'm sure HE does...
Also, I think alot of the interplay between Morse's synths and Ryu's hammond
could be defined as counterpoint. The complex vocals on "Thoughts" (whether
you like the song or not) are a pretty decent example of counterpoint IMHO.
Or the bass/keyboard bit near the beginning of "The Good Don't Last". Or
the electric guitar/piano interplay about 1:00 into "Thoughts (Part II)".
I'm sure there's a few more examples.
I, however, am not a student of music theory so I could be wrong about what
exactly counterpoint is. All I'm saying is that I think Neal is a very good
musician, so I'm assuming he knows basic music theory.
I actualy think this discussion has more to do with whether or not folks
individually LIKE Morse, as opposed to the doubtful scenario that has him
not knowing the definition of counterpoint. It's whether he EXECUTES it
properly or not where our disagreement lies...
- G
Zero the Hero
> OK...how about if we boycott Marillion until they repent and release a prog
> album. It must be a double concept CD, with a Mark Wilkinson Sleeve, and
> Fish back in the fold, entitled "Grendel 2: Clutching at Misplaced Tears"
> and includes a 30 minute suite chronicling a lonely Jester who is driven mad
> through loss of love and starts to eat children to wreak vengeance on
> society.....with an apocalyptic ending in, say, 8/9 .... :-D
> Now, *that* would be a Marillion album!
No, that would be a Jestersaurus issue :-)
NP: Djam Karet - Burning the Hard City
--
Jason Ellerbee - jel...@unf.edu
DREAMS WIDE AWAKE radio show - http://www.unf.edu/~jeller/dreams.html
Now broadcasting on the Internet!
'Animals don't behave like men. If they have to fight, they fight; and if
they have to kill, they kill. But they don't sit down and set their wits
to work to devise ways of spoiling other creatures' lives and hurting
them. They have dignity and animality.'
-- Richard Adams' _Watership Down_
firemill
Jason E <Jason...@nospam.bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:TLXS6.40484$hV3....@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
>
> OK...how about if we boycott Marillion until they repent and release a
prog
> album. It must be a double concept CD, with a Mark Wilkinson Sleeve, and
> Fish back in the fold, entitled "Grendel 2: Clutching at Misplaced Tears"
> and includes a 30 minute suite chronicling a lonely Jester who is driven
mad
> through loss of love and starts to eat children to wreak vengeance on
> society.....with an apocalyptic ending in, say, 8/9 .... :-D
>
> Now, *that* would be a Marillion album!
>
Very funny, but seriously I don't think the problem is with Marillion's
music itself. The album actually gets a positive rating in that review (8
or 9 out of 10 I think). The problem is with their attitude in that they
seem to be increadibly ashamed of their past (especially it seems their
early years, Grendel etc etc). Unfortunately in this lies a tinge of
hypocrisy in that what they're doing now is not so detached from prog (10
minute + songs, changes in melody, signatures etc). Of course they want to
move on and try different things, but that doesn't mean they have to shy
away from their past and belittle bands that still play the kind of music
they used to play (IQ, Pallas etc). I mean live and let live, there is room
for all kinds of music in this big old world. If that means scratchy
sampled trip-hop beats fused with wah-wah guitar thats fine. But if it
means songs about goblins and chessboards complete with minimoog and gibson
twin necks in 13/4 time, then that should be fine as well.
Jason E
> No, that would be a Jestersaurus issue :-)
>
LOL... who are Jestersaurus? I'd probably *like* them ;-)
Mike Prete *www.progweed.net*
>
> > No, that would be a Jestersaurus issue :-)
> >
>
> LOL... who are Jestersaurus? I'd probably *like* them ;-)
Goto www.gnosis2000.net and find out. Now if only I could find a cool hat
like his...
Zero the Hero
> LOL... who are Jestersaurus? I'd probably *like* them ;-)
Click the Jestersaurus link, and enjoy :-)
NP: Deus ex Machina - s/t
--
Jason Ellerbee - jel...@unf.edu
DREAMS WIDE AWAKE radio show - http://www.unf.edu/~jeller/dreams.html
Now broadcasting on the Internet!
'If everyone agreed with everyone else, this planet would be like a bunch
of Chip and Dales trying to hold the door open for each other.'
-- Theron Kousek