Your top 10 most influential prog bands?
Jerry Lucky
Give me your top 10 MOST INFLUENTIAL progressive, progressive rock,
neo-prog, whatever bands. and explain why they are perhaps the most
influential. Cheers. Jerry Lucky
CountV
1. Dream Theater
2. Spock's Beard
3. Styx
CountV
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spacefreak
KING CRIMSON
PINK FLOYD
THE MOTHERS OF INVENTION
VAN DER GRAAF GENERATOR
GENESIS
AMON DUUL II
FAUST
NURSE WITH WOUND
HAWKWIND
JETHRO TULL
--
spacefreak
The Original Irish Bastard
> Hey gang...need some input and I don't think I've ever seen this thread.
Hey Jerry. Don't think I've ever seen you on this newsgroup.
> Give me your top 10 MOST INFLUENTIAL progressive, progressive rock,
> neo-prog, whatever bands. and explain why they are perhaps the most
> influential.
Why, working on a new edition of the book? :)
Fine...
1) King Crimson. Although other bands arguably came before, _In
The Court of the Crimson King_ is the border between proto-prog and the
progressive rock movement.
2) Genesis. True, they weren't the most well-known of the original
big bands and got much more recognition as a pop act, but they spawned an
entire subgenre of bands trying to clone their sound, most failing sadly.
Nevertheless their high profile and continuing influence on the genre
justifies their position. I would consider them the largest influence on
Italian prog as well.
3) Yes. Possibly the biggest of the original wave of prog bands
and (I believe) achieved the most commercial success in terms of proggy
output. Their side-long track "Close to the Edge" is considered by many
the definitive prog rock song. They were also quite successful in drawing
vilification from critics with _Tales From Topographic Oceans_, and own
the distinction of "worst 70s prog release" with _Tormato_.
4) ELP. Yeah, not too many surprises on this list, eh? :). Anyway,
ELP was at the head of the "rob classical music" school of thought,
copping (and, in many minds, massacring) works from Copeland, Ginastera,
Bartok and Mussorgsky. They were also the symbol of prog excess with
Emerson stabbing keyboards, setting them on fire, whatever... and probably
the most vilified prog group. Many bands have also come along to copy
their sound, including Triumvirat, Le Orme, Latte E Miele, Par Lindh, etc.
5) Rush. One of the few English speaking bands to still be making
good prog in the late 70s, Rush has offered a more palatable and
accessible form of progressive rock. As such, they have served as a
gateway for many from straight ahead rock or metal into the progressive
world. While Dream Theater was responsible for a lot of prog-metal bands
thinking they could succeed, Rush was a band many of them (including DT)
patterned themselves after. While that may be a somewhat dubious
distinction, we *are* talking influence, right? :)
6) Pink Floyd. While I think they ceased being prog quite a long
time ago, their early work did serve as an influence on a lot of space
rock. You tend to hear a lot of Floyd in French symphonic as well, and (of
course) in neo-prog, where the Gilmour-guitar (sometimes called the
Latimer-guitar) is almost a prerequisite of "heartfelt" soloing.
7) Marillion. For all the wrong reasons.
8) Dream Theater. See Marillion. Of course, it should be mentioned
that Dream Theater was not the first prog-metal band, because Fates
Warning predated them by six years. They were, however, the first
successful one, and probably to blame for Magna Carta's existence.
9) Anglagard. Yeah, kind of a surprise for a band with only two
studio releases, but Anglagard was at the vanguard of the 90s progressive
revival. For many who had been disillusioned by a decade of neo-prog,
Anglagard showed that quality prog could still be made in the 90s. Along
with the increasing use of the Internet and a renewed interest from
musicians who had grown up listening to the stuff, progressive rock
could survive, and even flourish, underground. Anglagard also almost
singlehandedly launched the Scandinavian progressive rock scene.
10) Premiata Forneria Marconi. Not my favorite Italian band
personally, but released the first grand success of Italian prog, _Storia
Di Un Minuto_, in 1972. This created a flourishing Italian scene for most
of the 70s, producing quality music after most of the English bands had
disbanded or gone to AOR (crap). PFM is still influential today in the
Italian scene, and is often a "first step" for people getting accustomed
to prog without English vocals. One of the few Italian bands to have an
(inferior) English translation of some of their albums.
Howzat?
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The Original Irish Bastard
> Thus spake The Original Irish Bastard:
>> Why, working on a new edition of the book? :)
>>
>> Fine...
>>
>> 1) King Crimson.
>> 3) Yes.
>> 4) ELP.
>> 5) Rush.
>> 6) Pink Floyd.
>> 7) Marillion.
>> 8) Dream Theater.
>> 9) Anglagard.
>> 10) Premiata Forneria Marconi.
>> Howzat?
> I think your choices are far too symphonic.
That's what I was thinking. Thing is, if I'd added an eleventh it
would have been Camel because they seem to appear in a lot of neo too. And
since so many of the RIO bands tend to be groundbreaking, I didn't list
Henry Cow.. although that's really punishing them for being so hard to be
derivative of.
> the bands on your list did have wide influence, I'd leave off Anglagard, Rush,
> and Pink Floyd and put on one of the Krautrock bands- Can comes to mind as by
> far the most influential Krautrock band- and one of the RIO bands. Henry Cow
> comes to mind.
I simply don't know enough about Kraut to put a Kraut band on the
list.. Can hasn't done much for me, incidentally, although I like the
Faust album I have (S/T on vinyl).
As for Henry Cow, maybe they *should* be on the list. Again, it's
the question of how important was the coining of the RIO term, and how
much of RIO/avant would have not come about if not for Henry Cow? While
there's no doubt they are influential, I dunno if they are in the top 10.
> Much as I like Floyd, I'd also have to cite Hawkwind or
> Tangerine Dream as the avatars of space-prog. Actually, Zappa is probably
> worth citing on that list as well.
Tangerine Dream would probably have been a better choice than
Floyd. Heck, even Gong.
> Can't fault your naming all the "big names" aside from that, though, as they
> genuinely were influential.
<nod> PFM might be somewhat unnecessary, if one accepts the
hypothesis that they weren't necessary for Italian prog given the big
Genesis influence (and smaller ELP influence) on the Italian scene -- one
could argue they just happened to be first, and bands that sound just like
them do so because they sound like a folkier, pastoral Genesis.
Guy Berger
> > Much as I like Floyd, I'd also have to cite Hawkwind or
> > Tangerine Dream as the avatars of space-prog. Actually, Zappa is probably
> > worth citing on that list as well.
>
> Tangerine Dream would probably have been a better choice than
> Floyd. Heck, even Gong.
I disagree. Pink Floyd's early material was quite influential on space-oriented
prog, including Hawkwind and many of the German bands.
Guy
np Ozrics, _Curious Corn_
----
gbe...@ucsd.edu
"The black and green scarecrow, as ev'ryone knows
Stood with a bird on his hat and straw everywhere
He didn't care..." -- Syd Barrett
Svartedaun
Henry Cow
Holy Toy
Van der Graaf Generator/Peter Hammill
When
Kraftwerk
Devil Doll
Ved Buens Ende
Darkthrone (minimal and primitive yes.. but much more progressive in their
regression and deconstruction than any neo-Yes, Genesis, Rush, Floyd, etc.
concept clotting the word's essential definition)
and a few more that didnt seem to influence my choices at the moment..
"Beam me up, there's no intelligent life, down here where I am."
S.P.O.C.K.
Svartedaun
was the theme... "YOUR top 10 most influential prog bands".. oh well..
The Original Irish Bastard
> Thus spake The Original Irish Bastard:
> It's not so much for their music as their ethos; taking music for music's sake
> to the extreme. Thus, while you won't find a lot of bands that sound exactly
> like Henry Cow, a fair amount are inspired in some way by them.
Possibly. I think Art Zoyd might have come first.. whoever the
first "big" RIO band was should be on the list, just as Marillion and DT
were.
> Is it the clear sleeve vinyl? Those things rawk.
Unfortunately, I have a "normal" pressing. The music's still good
though :P.
> And it took me a long time
> to get into Can. You have to hear the right album- Tago Mago is a good one.
I have _Ege Bamyasi_, Babluma, _Landed_, _Flow Motion_. The first
two are good but not great, the last two are .. lesser.
> Well, the RIO movement gave prog more exposure, even if a lot of those groups
> come into existence independently of Henry Cow. And they also cover
> Canterbury to a degree, even if they were latecomers to that field.
One of the few prog bands to gain respectability from the critics,
too. At least I *believe* Western Culture is well liked among some of
them.
> Possibly, but I'd say that Italian prog was influential in its own right. Any
> band that gets enough renown to be called the "Italian Beatles" is fairly
> influential, IMO.
Prob'ly.
SkyHarmony
and prog, is pretty undeniable. Of course, I'm ridiculously biased after
immersing myself in the CAN BOX for the past 48 hours...
Magma could also be considered very influential, seeing how they founded Zeuhl,
a major prog sub-genre.
The important symphonic bands have already been covered, so I won't mention
them. I do think that Fates Warning deserve a mention, they did the prog metal
thing *first* and *right.* (yeah yeah yeah... there was sorta Rush).
I'd also second Zappa, he deserves to be near the top of the list.
NP: CAN Live Video! Wahooo! Love this crazy version of "Halleluhwuh"!
¸__¸,.-·´¨¯¨`·-Jon Dharma·-.,¸__¸,.-·´¨¯¨`·-.,¸__
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HERTHAHOLK
>neo-prog, whatever bands.
Gresham's Rule: the bad drives out the good.
Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap.
Ever take a Xerox of a Xerox of a Xerox? Genesis to Ange to Marillion. Pink
Floyd to Eloy to Arena. Vertigo to Cyclops to Magna Carta. And so on. You sure
this thread is a good idea? Or is this research for a 'must-to-avoid' list?
Michael Julian Topper
>> And it took me a long time
>> to get into Can. You have to hear the right album- Tago Mago is a good one.
>
> I have _Ege Bamyasi_, Babluma, _Landed_, _Flow Motion_. The first
>two are good but not great, the last two are .. lesser.
"Flow Motion" is considered quite possibly the group's worst album, even
by the bandmembers themselves (I think "Saw Delight" is worse, though--avoid
that one at all costs!). "Landed" gets mixed reviews. "Ege Bamyasi"
and "Soon Over Babaluma" are great IMO, but "Tago Mago" is their
masterpiece--I suggest you hear that one before making a final judgement
on the group.
Michael
Progbear
>> I have _Ege Bamyasi_, Babluma, _Landed_, _Flow Motion_. The first
>>two are good but not great, the last two are .. lesser.
>
>"Flow Motion" is considered quite possibly the group's worst album, even
>by the bandmembers themselves (I think "Saw Delight" is worse, though--avoid
>that one at all costs!).
I think the one that pretty much all the band members dismiss is _Out Of
Reach_. Now *that* one was a real stinker. One of those notoriously bad albums
like _Love Beach_ and _Giant For A Day_ that I'm oh so glad I didn't purchase.
Makes _Saw Delight_ sound like a classic (I mean, at least it had "Animal
Waves").
>"Landed" gets mixed reviews.
I personally really enjoy this one. A return to harder-edged realms after
the detour into lush soundscapes with the previous two albums. I even like the
rock-oriented songs like "Full Moon On The Highway".
>"Ege Bamyasi"
>and "Soon Over Babaluma" are great IMO, but "Tago Mago" is their
>masterpiece--I suggest you hear that one before making a final judgement
>on the group.
I think TM is a tad self-indulgent, though there are moments of brilliance
(pretty much all of Side One of the original LP, and most of Side Four). I
believe that the lessons learned here were better integrated on _Ege Bamyasi_,
which to me is their high point, certainly the one album of theirs I enjoy
most.
No one's yet mentioned _Future Days_, my first taste of Can, and still as
close to true beauty as you'll ever hear in Krautrock. Especially "Bel Air".
MIKE (a.k.a. "Progbear")
make GEORYN disappear to reply
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Achird
>> Hey gang...need some input and I don't think I've ever seen this thread.
Only ten? Well, that'll be:
* King Crimson
* Genesis
* Van der Graaf Generator / Peter Hammill
* ELP
* Yes
* Tangerine Dream
* Rush
* Universe Zero
* Marillion
* Anekdoten
Achird
(achird at hem1 dot passagen dot se)
--
http://www.progmusic.com/tp/personal/creutz/
The Original Irish Bastard
> Thus spake The Original Irish Bastard:
>> Possibly. I think Art Zoyd might have come first.. whoever the
>>first "big" RIO band was should be on the list, just as Marillion and DT
>>were.
> Henry Cow's first album was around '72 or so. While Art Zoyd had a one-sided
> (butt-kicking, but totally unlike their later work) single in '69, their first
> album didn't actually come out until '76, by which time Henry Cow had already
> done "In Praise Of Learning".
Yup. I'd consider Cow's first RIO album to be Unrest in '74,
though.
SkyHarmony
>>> I have _Ege Bamyasi_, Babluma, _Landed_, _Flow Motion_. The first
>>>two are good but not great, the last two are .. lesser.
>>
>>"Flow Motion" is considered quite possibly the group's worst album, even
>>by the bandmembers themselves (I think "Saw Delight" is worse, though--avoid
>>that one at all costs!).
>
> I think the one that pretty much all the band members dismiss is _Out Of
>Reach_.
In the CAN book that came in the box set, Jaki Liebzeit doesn't even _remember_
it. LOL! All the members trash _Saw Delight_, too, IIRC.
NP: Can, "Future Days" (second the Progbear!)
JCRYIAD
Crimson
Yes
Nice/ELP
Mothers
Soft Machine
Moodies
Tull
Can
TD
Genesis
Remove "Remove" to reply
JCRyiad
"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is to try to
please everyone."
-Bill Cosby
JCRYIAD
(snip)
>Henry Cow's first album was around '72 or so. While Art Zoyd had a one-sided
>(butt-kicking, but totally unlike their later work) single in '69, their
>first
>album didn't actually come out until '76, by which time Henry Cow had already
>done "In Praise Of Learning".
The first Cow album actually came out in '73, but they appeared on the BBC in
'72 at least a time or two, and were known in the London underground to some
extent.
Incidentally, as big a fan as I am of Cow, I cannot see the logic in them ever
being placed in the top ten most "influential" bands. The *entire* RIO movement
pales in sheer numbers to bands inspired by Genesis, Yes, Tull, etc.
LLanos
Goblin
Nektar
Finch
SFF
Kayak
Banco
Happy The Man
Gentle Giant
JCRYIAD
>Thus spake JCRYIAD:
>
>>Incidentally, as big a fan as I am of Cow, I cannot see the logic in them
>ever
>>being placed in the top ten most "influential" bands. The *entire* RIO
>movement
>>pales in sheer numbers to bands inspired by Genesis, Yes, Tull, etc.
>Well, you can't measure everything by numbers, I think. I value one Doctor
>Nerve as highly as fifty neo-prog bands.
I might agree, but we can't redefine the term
"influential". Aw hell, maybe we can.....!
Michael Julian Topper
>>"Flow Motion" is considered quite possibly the group's worst album, even
>>by the bandmembers themselves (I think "Saw Delight" is worse, though--avoid
>>that one at all costs!).
>
> I think the one that pretty much all the band members dismiss is _Out Of
>Reach_. Now *that* one was a real stinker.
You're probably right, but I've avoided the album for just that very reason;
to this day it's the one Can album I have not heard.
>>"Landed" gets mixed reviews.
>
> I personally really enjoy this one.
I love "Vernal Equinox". There's a great version of that one in the
box set video!
>>"Ege Bamyasi"
>>and "Soon Over Babaluma" are great IMO, but "Tago Mago" is their
>>masterpiece--I suggest you hear that one before making a final judgement
>>on the group.
>
> I think TM is a tad self-indulgent, though there are moments of brilliance
>(pretty much all of Side One of the original LP, and most of Side Four).
What about "Halleluwah"?!? I always considered that the definitive Can
song.
>I
>believe that the lessons learned here were better integrated on _Ege Bamyasi_,
>which to me is their high point, certainly the one album of theirs I enjoy
>most.
I like side two (especially "Soup" and "Spoon") better than side one, which
sounds a bit too unfocused for me. But "Soup" was another real peak for them.
> No one's yet mentioned _Future Days_, my first taste of Can, and still as
>close to true beauty as you'll ever hear in Krautrock. Especially "Bel Air".
I love "Bel Air", but it always irked me that the guitar was undermixed
on that one.
Michael
Michael Borowiec
Jerry Lucky <jlu...@pacificcoast.net> wrote:
>Hey gang...need some input and I don't think I've ever seen this thread.
>Give me your top 10 MOST INFLUENTIAL progressive, progressive rock,
>neo-prog, whatever bands. and explain why they are perhaps the most
>influential. Cheers. Jerry Lucky
>
Not in any particular order...
The Beatles - I think this was the first prog band
Jethro Tull
Pink Floyd
Van Der Graaf Generator -
Nektar
King Crimson
The Moody Blues
Genesis
YES
ELP
spacefreak
> No one's yet mentioned _Future Days_, my first taste of Can, and
still as
> close to true beauty as you'll ever hear in Krautrock. Especially "Bel
Air".
Yes, it is their finest moment and a masterpiece of dreamy otherwordly
melodies. And perfectly balanced as well...
spacefreak
NP: SPOILS OF WAR "The spoils of war"
(pre MORMOS)