Esther's Symbolism
BrandynB
Have any of you ever considered the symbolism behind the lyrics of Esther?
Being a relative newbie, I understand that what I am about to put forth
may be way, way missing the point. But hell, I'd like your thoughts
anyway. Recently a friend of mine and I, after smoking some doobage,
decided to listen to Esther very closely and then we proceeded to analyze
it to death. I'd like to share what we came up with:
First off, our entire analysis is contingent on one major point: The
puppet represents drugs- hard core or recreational- whatever. A puppet
is something that humans control. By the end of this song, it is Esther
who is controlled by the puppet.
The story starts off with a mischevious old man offering the puppet to an
innocent little girl. This takes place in front of a carnival. The girl,
quite obviously, represents innocence and naivety. She is entranced by
the lights produced by the carnival. Just as a little girl might be
fascinated when staring at a carnival from afar, a young adult is
fascinated and entranced when approaching the carnival of life. What,
afterall, is a carnival? It's a place who's dancing lights and playful
music makes it seem so cool and majestic from afar- but when you get there
they drain your wallet and leave you feeling sick in exchange for a few
cheap thrills along the way. Anyway, the old man offers the little girl
the puppet. She takes it and immediately ran tot he church. I've done
much research in college on halucinagenic (sp?) drugs and one of the
things I learned is that many heavy users of drugs feel a oneness with
God- run to the church. But the church rejects Esther just as the church
rejects drug use and users. When running from the congregation, Esther
soars to the air, presumably driven by the puppet. Her puppet helped her
to escape from the church. One can see how this is a very solid metaphor-
she runs from the church, an organized, hierarchal institution- and with
the help of her puppet (drugs), escapes. And then she was high (above the
houses and people and the chimneys). The music here is just perfect:
It's playful while she's high and then mellows out when she comes down.
And notice where she comes down: "...in the nasty part of town." The
puppet has landed her in hardship, just as drugs, while they may provide a
temporary escape, often land their users in unenviable circumstances. Now
in this town in the middle of the night, she hides and is scared of
potential theives..... paranoia- a classic symptom of junkies. The
morning comes and she feels she's safe to continue in her journey. This
time, though, an angry mob joggers tries to knock her down. Let's
consider the two groups now that have had problems with Esther and her
puppet: The Church and the health conscious. How many times have you
heard non-users say "I don't smoke pot because I'd never do that to my
body". It's two groups in this country who hate drugs- the morally pious
(the church) and the health nuts (represented in this song by joggers).
This time the puppet can not lift her up so she sinks down and swims. She
then sheds all her clothes. One can see now that she has given up all of
her material possesions and beared her soul- a situation that many who
take drugs too seriously often bring upon themselves. Finally, it is the
puppet who drags Esther down- that which she was supposed to control ended
up controlling her- not the church or the joggers but the puppet was her
ultimate downfall. BUT, the puppet brought her to a TRANQUIL sleep. Is
this necessarily a bad thing? Did the puppet murder her or merely provide
her with her ultimate rescue from society?
Any thoughts? Do I have "way too much time on my hands"?
=b
Groo21
i must say, that was a throughly interesting analysis. for a while, esther
was my favorite phish tune, but then i listened to it very closely. i
didn't try to come up with some meaning for the lyrics, i simply took it
at face value, and what it is is a downright disheartening song. it
reminds me of all of the sad things in my life and in the world, of all
the temptations i try to avoid, and of the corruption of innocence. and
while a tranquil sleep may have seemed ok for post-puppet esther, i have
trouble picturing the poor sweet beautiful child of the beginning of the
song being consoled by the prospect of a watery grave. thanks for your
time... keep on truckin'.
matt
Trent Gillespie
I think that your interpretation of the song could very well be what
was intended. However, there are many other ideals which could fit
the place (too bad I can't think of many right now. Basically
anything that society consideres 'bad' will work).
BrandynB
>while a tranquil sleep may have seemed ok for post-puppet esther, i have
>trouble picturing the poor sweet beautiful child of the beginning of the
>song being consoled by the prospect of a watery grave. thanks for your
>time... keep on truckin'.
good point. Through a connection I have, I may (I stress MAY) get to meet
Trey sometime in the near future. If I can muster up the courage to
actually strike up a conversation with him (aside from "Hi, it's a real
honor to meet you sir"), I'll be sure to ask "What's the deal with
Esther"? He'll porbably burst my bubble and say something like "It's just
a story, man" and then I'll feel like an idiot.
back to the analysis: I thought of another issue- Those angry mobs she
encountered- the joggers and the congregation- they were mad at Esther...
they were pissed off and jealous that she had something that she liked and
that she could control. It wasn't until they started chasing her and
terrorizing her that the puppet took control of her. She would have been
fine, in other words, if they had just accepted her. This coincides with
my feelings on recreational drugs. If society would just stop being so
close-minded and unaccepting of drug users- if they'd only stop giving
them something to run from- most of them would never get to the point that
they'd have to be rescued by drugs.
just my thoughts. feel free to attempt to tear them apart
=b
BrandynB
>However, there are many other ideals which could fit
>the place (too bad I can't think of many right now. Basically
>anything that society consideres 'bad' will work).
This sounds familiar. I've felt the same way all along but, like you,
couldn't come up with anything. I guess I like my original theory so much
that I don't want to think of anything else.
Jake Miller-Mack
BrandynB (bran...@aol.com) wrote:
: First off, our entire analysis is contingent on one major point: The
: puppet represents drugs- hard core or recreational- whatever. A puppet
: is something that humans control. By the end of this song, it is Esther
: who is controlled by the puppet.
I think you may have hit the nail right on the head. I've never thought
of it that way, but it sounds reasonable. Sometimes when I listen to it, I
get intense images of the story. That's what I love about so much of
phish's music, there's more than one side to it. I mean, that's present
in all good poetry, but the thing about Esther for me is that even though
I haven't looked at it too metaphorically, I can still be satisfied by
imagining the story just as it's told, no strings attached :-)
It's great that some people can get the message from that song, but when I
don't feel like racking my brain trying to get meaning from a song, I try to
take it as literally as possible, which can be just as entertaining.
Do I think you have too much time on your hands? I think if you have the
time toke up, you might as well use it to do something constructive with your
altered mind. It's a much better use of time on the drug than people who
use it and live their lives through it. I think that's a sad waste of time
and herb if people use it just to use it, or to make them able to handle
situations. However, I believe you have found a good use for it. look at
this, I've tatally strewn off the topic. oh well.
You shouldn't be worried about getting the wrong message out of a song.
Whatever you can draw out of something is legitamate. I know one
philosophy of trey's is to stimulate as much creativity as possible out
of the listener, so whatever you think up *can't* be wrong.
peace, jake
Timothy Lovell
BrandynB wrote:
> First off, our entire analysis is contingent on one major point: The
> puppet represents drugs- hard core or recreational- whatever. A puppet
> is something that humans control. By the end of this song, it is Esther
> who is controlled by the puppet.
> Any thoughts? Do I have "way too much time on my hands"?
>
> =b
I say go with it, I thought it was about a girl who got killed by a doll.
Oh well, Tim
"God never listens to what I say,
and you don't get a refund if you overpray."
Timothy Lovell
BrandynB wrote:
>
> Have any of you ever considered the symbolism behind the lyrics of Esther?
> Being a relative newbie, I understand that what I am about to put forth
> may be way, way missing the point. But hell, I'd like your thoughts
> anyway. Recently a friend of mine and I, after smoking some doobage,
> decided to listen to Esther very closely and then we proceeded to analyze
> it to death. I'd like to share what we came up with:
>
> puppet represents drugs- hard core or recreational- whatever. A puppet
> is something that humans control. By the end of this song, it is Esther
> who is controlled by the puppet.
>
phtc...@scsn.net
bran...@aol.com (BrandynB) wrote:
>=b
Idont know if thats what they were thinking when they wrote the song,
but what you said makes sense. at least a lot more sense than I could
make out of the song. and yeah you probably have too much time on
your hands.
bmattson
That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
music has no relative content pertaining to drugs. Its pathetic to even
begin to take such a beautifull imagination and scar it with chemicals.
The doors to a more open concious are not locked and indeed do not need
drugs to be opened. I would strongly doubt that Trey was thinking of
drugs when he wrote esther, what a disturbing idea.I'm begining to see
the end just like many predicted in early 94.
Steven Nilsen
>up controlling her- not the church or the joggers but the puppet was her
>ultimate downfall. BUT, the puppet brought her to a TRANQUIL sleep. Is
>this necessarily a bad thing? Did the puppet murder her or merely provide
>her with her ultimate rescue from society?
>
>Any thoughts? Do I have "way too much time on my hands"?
>
I can add a little
I've often thought of "Esther" as a play on the word Ether too. Ether
being two things: the stuff scientists used to think existed in space in
place of a vaccum, and the chemical. The chemical seems to be a relative
parallel.
I don't know what an ether high is like, but it is lethal, and is used to
put animal "to sleep". There's your "tranquil and motionless sleep". If
you've ever seen an animal put away this way, you'ld see what I mean.
The rest of the song... Esther gets the pupput, the drugs, from a
pusher. She is rejected by standard society, the chrurch. She is blown
away and flies high in the air, excessive use of drugs. She lands in the
bad part of town; she's become a poor junkie and lives on the street. She
hides from muggers, good plan. She is run down by an angry mob of
joggers; dellusions and paranoia settle in and lead to her demise.
Sinking into the depths and a tranquil and motionless sleep; the death was
an invited conclusion to the pathetic example of a life she led.
The way the lyics are sung, and phrased, Phish has brought some epic glory
to this sad tale of the innocent girl, who was a victem to the drug, the
puppet. I honestly feel they over glorify her role, but that's because
it's all from the little girls perspective and because she is a little
girl we have sympathy fo her (also because many of us experiment from time
to time too, and understand the allure of drugs). The song is very smart,
and invites analysis.
How about an analysis of Theme From the Bottom? Now that's a challenge.
Who the heck is at the bottem anyways? I like to imagine a strange
ethereal goldfish is at the bottem, but maybe that's just due to all the
swimming up and what not. I also like top imagin the medium for swimming
is a giant cup of coffee. Sometimes I imagine I'm an ethereal goldfish at
the bottom of my coffee cup when I sit in cafes and hear this song. Then
I'm just happy.
-Steven
BrandynB
>I can add a little
>I've often thought of "Esther" as a play on the word Ether too.
>put animal "to sleep". There's your "tranquil and motionless sleep".
If
>you've ever seen an animal put away this way, you'ld see what I mean.
Something I hadn't considered but it seems you' ve hit upon an important
point.
I'll definitely have to adopt this as part of my argument (with due credit
to you, of course)
>The rest of the song... Esther gets the pupput, the drugs, from a
>pusher. She is rejected by standard society, the chrurch. She is blown
>away and flies high in the air, excessive use of drugs. She lands in the
>bad part of town; she's become a poor junkie and lives on the street.
She
>hides from muggers, good plan. She is run down by an angry mob of
>joggers; dellusions and paranoia settle in and lead to her demise.
Agreed 100% I need to write my thoughts more to the point as you did in
this passage. All of this is what I was trying to convey.
>Sinking into the depths and a tranquil and motionless sleep; the death
was
>an invited conclusion to the pathetic example of a life she led.
>The way the lyics are sung, and phrased, Phish has brought some epic
glory
>to this sad tale of the innocent girl, who was a victem to the drug, the
>puppet. I honestly feel they over glorify her role, but that's because
>it's all from the little girls perspective and because she is a little
>girl we have sympathy fo her (also because many of us experiment from
time
>to time too, and understand the allure of drugs). The song is very
smart,
>and invites analysis.
This, I think, is the most beautiful aspect of this song. It all depends
on your point of view- you can view Esther as a tragic hero or a pathetic
loser who got what she had coming. It all depends on your outlook.
Personally, I see her as both.
Another interesting angle: Were those joggers really coming up to knock
her down or was this only the paranoid musing of the little girl? Was she
running from nothing when she plunged to her death? One of the things I
learned in English classes is that when one is analyzing any peice of
literature, one should consider the author's background when trying to
find the intended meaning in peice. Now remember, I'm a newbie. I don't
know much about Trey's background (other then his Dad lives in my town).
The image is of a regular drug-user. Perhaps that is what led me to my
conclusions.
>How about an analysis of Theme From the Bottom? Now that's a challenge.
>Who the heck is at the bottem anyways? I like to imagine a strange
>ethereal goldfish is at the bottem, but maybe that's just due to all the
>swimming up and what not. I also like top imagin the medium for swimming
>is a giant cup of coffee. Sometimes I imagine I'm an ethereal goldfish
at
>the bottom of my coffee cup when I sit in cafes and hear this song. Then
>I'm just happy.
and that's all that really matters.
-brandyn
Christopher T. Colyer
I agree with the overall analysis of Esther. However, I do not think the
puppet symbolizes any one thing- it can be any belief that ostracizes
soemone from others, that complete reliance on can be the downfall
(ha, get it) of the believer. I think its a great song because of its
generality, and the flying jam will always remind me of summer 91.
Sniff...I miss that song, man!
BrandynB
>That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
>music has no relative content pertaining to drugs.
"...release the links, undo the clasp...erupts into your lung and heart,
you laugh and laugh and fall apart..."
-Trey Anastasio (from
Sparkle)
Call me crazy, but sounds to me like "relative content pertaining to
drugs" Do you think it would be "sick" for Phish to even MENTION or
ALLUDE TO drug use in their songs? I've been to one show so far and it
seems that, oh, 30-50% of those in attendance were smoking herb. What do
you have against it's mere mention in a song? They don't have to condone
it, but what's wrong with it's mere inclusion in the content of a story?
Should they just pretend it doesn't exist?
> Its pathetic to even
>begin to take such a beautifull imagination and scar it with chemicals.
who's scarring what here? how does my analyzing a song equate to scarring
an imagination? who's imagination? Trey's? Do you think that I scarred
Trey's imagination by offering my interpretation of his lyrics? Sounds a
bit ludicrous to me.
>The doors to a more open concious are not locked and indeed do not need
>drugs to be opened.
Oh, I agree unqualifiedly. Well put. But what the hell does that have to
with what I said? I never meant to suggest that this song's conception
was drug induced. I don't think anyone else got that impression. Did
you?
>I would strongly doubt that Trey was thinking of
>drugs when he wrote esther, what a disturbing idea.
What is so disturbing here? Trey cannot even THINK ABOUT drugs without
you being disturbed? I imagine you don't think very highly of drugs. If
that is the case, you shouldn't find my interpretation disturbing- I don't
claim that drugs are glorified- only that they are discussed.
>I'm begining to see
>the end just like many predicted in early 94.
I'm sorry. My newbie-ness makes it difficult to understand what you mean
by that. But I doubt that open discussions of the lyrics of Phish should
be considered symptoms of "the end" as you put it. I think this is a
positive thing.
-b
Your name here
>That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
>begin to take such a beautifull imagination and scar it with chemicals.
>drugs when he wrote esther, what a disturbing idea.I'm begining to see
>the end just like many predicted in early 94.
It is the end because someone got an interpretation you do not seem to agree
with from a song? I hope not. Trey might not have been thinking about drugs
(specifically) when he wrote the song, but that is the beauty of art. So many
interpretations can be derived from a piece, even without the author intending
those interpretations. If nothing else, an interesting thread has started...
Jeff
--
bmattson
BrandynB wrote:
>
> >That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
> >music has no relative content pertaining to drugs.
>
> you laugh and laugh and fall apart..."
> -Trey Anastasio (from
> Sparkle)
>
> Call me crazy, but sounds to me like "relative content pertaining to
> drugs" Do you think it would be "sick" for Phish to even MENTION or
> ALLUDE TO drug use in their songs? I've been to one show so far and it
> seems that, oh, 30-50% of those in attendance were smoking herb. What do
> you have against it's mere mention in a song? They don't have to condone
> it, but what's wrong with it's mere inclusion in the content of a story?
> Should they just pretend it doesn't exist?
>
> >begin to take such a beautifull imagination and scar it with chemicals.
>
> an imagination? who's imagination? Trey's? Do you think that I scarred
> Trey's imagination by offering my interpretation of his lyrics? Sounds a
> bit ludicrous to me.
>
> >drugs to be opened.
>
> with what I said? I never meant to suggest that this song's conception
> was drug induced. I don't think anyone else got that impression. Did
> you?
>
>
> What is so disturbing here? Trey cannot even THINK ABOUT drugs without
> you being disturbed? I imagine you don't think very highly of drugs. If
> that is the case, you shouldn't find my interpretation disturbing- I don't
> claim that drugs are glorified- only that they are discussed.
>
> >the end just like many predicted in early 94.
>
> by that. But I doubt that open discussions of the lyrics of Phish should
> be considered symptoms of "the end" as you put it. I think this is a
> positive thing.
>
many of us that saw phish then drugs were relatively unimportant. What
lured us into expanding conciousness via drugs was the ideas not the
lyrics. The lyrics were written often just for fun as for the music was
where the real creativeness spawned. Have you ever seen a puppet show
before???? Innocent yet beautifull. The ideas of su Ra and the music
being played for the Gods is so unseen in the phans understanding of
phish today. Newbie you may very well be very correct in everything
you've said, I'm not Trey and have no idea whats truelly behind the
music. I'm just like anyone who has an opinion and likes to voice it.
Just remeber to be kind and only go to the show for the music and
community. If you need a spiritual aid keep it personal. As for
4:20...believe in it some day our generation will crush the cruel laws
against our mothers plant. "Come waste your time with me" -Trey
J Vitunjski
BrandynB wrote:
>
> "...release the links, undo the clasp...erupts into your lung and heart,
> you laugh and laugh and fall apart..."
> -Trey Anastasio (from
> Sparkle)
>
> Call me crazy, but sounds to me like "relative content pertaining to
> drugs" Do you think it would be "sick" for Phish to even MENTION or
> ALLUDE TO drug use in their songs? I've been to one show so far and it
> seems that, oh, 30-50% of those in attendance were smoking herb.
Actually, the line is: 'laugh and laughing fall apart'
^^^
Or, to use more correct grammar, 'laugh and, laughing, fall apart.'
This slight difference alters the meaning completely. It alludes to, I
think, the paradoxical, yet parallel, relationship between joy and
sorrow. 'Sparkle' explores the nature of relationships: their fragility
and strength; their concommitant elation and anguish, and how easily
and quickly the dynamic within a relationship can swing from one
to the other. This, also, is more consistent with the overall theme of
Rift.
Just a thought.
Joe
jims
BrandynB wrote:
>
> >That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
> >music has no relative content pertaining to drugs.
I've heard a few interpetations that might "disturb" you
Reba-making LSD
lawnboy-LSD
YEM-porn theme
sparkle-nitrous, pot
AC/DC bag- a chronic masterbator
oh how about Fluffhead, "I ain't got that but I sure got some powerful
pills"
SoaMelt-being burnt out
Why does that bother you? First of all, they aren't nessisarily condoning
drug use (I think that would increase probs w/ cops etc) they are just
discussing them. Would it be better if nobody said anything, either way?
Second, these aren't the meaning they are interpetation. There is no one
way of seeing these things and some of the best writers make alot of
different references, double meanings. Look at the lyrics and see what
you think.
BTW- Not all of the interpetaions above are mine just things I heard.
Peace
Matt
PS bug me and maybe I'll post the thing I wrote about lyrics of "Rift"
for the free PA contest.
BrandynB
> -bOK, here it is in english. Esther was written in the mid 80's and for
>many of us that saw phish then drugs were relatively unimportant. What
>lured us into expanding conciousness via drugs was the ideas not the
>lyrics.
Somewhere along the line you missed my point. I AM NOT SAYING THAT ANYONE
THOUGHT OF THE LYRICS WHILE UNDER THE INFLUENCE OF DRUGS!!!! I NEVER ONCE
EVEN IMPLIED THAT!!!! READ MY ORIGINAL POST MORE CAREFULLY!!!!!!
...
>Just remeber to be kind and only go to the show for the music and
>community. If you need a spiritual aid keep it personal.
What in God's name are you talking about? Who said I needed a spiritual
aid? You seem to be attributing a lot more to my feelings then you could
possibly have divulged from what I posted to this newsgroup! Who said I'm
out for anything more then "music and community"? And who are you to tell
me what to go to shows for? As long as I'm shelling out for the ticket
I'll get out of the show whatever I damn well please. Sorry if I don't
sound nice right now. Just out to speak my piece and defend my honor.
I like being challenged, but please, I don't want to stain this
good-natured newsgroup with ill will.
later,
b
Matt
bran...@aol.com (BrandynB) wrote:
>>That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
>>music has no relative content pertaining to drugs.
um...what about
Fire Up The Ganga??
McLoughlin
what about an un-wanted pregnacy????!!!????
Sean
jlu...@garnet.berkeley.edu
I've considered this, it certainly fits
Jamie
Brian Durham
bmattson (bmat...@top.monad.net) wrote:
: That is such an absolutely sick comparison. I hope to God that phishs
: begin to take such a beautifull imagination and scar it with chemicals.
: The doors to a more open concious are not locked and indeed do not need
: drugs to be opened. I would strongly doubt that Trey was thinking of
: drugs when he wrote esther, what a disturbing idea.I'm begining to see
: the end just like many predicted in early 94.
do you truely think that phish is a straight band? if so, you have
obviously never gotton into the band personally...for a quite recent
example-take the amsterdam show. all four completely fucked up and loving
it. drugs aren't needed to love phish. it's a personal enhancement that
some folks enjoy. what end could you possibly see?
-bd
john missale
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green.mic...@gmail.com
You will find that the song and the novel have some undeniable similarities. You will find comfort in knowing the main character in the book goes by the name Hester and she is a young woman seduced by an older clergy man who is married. They end up having and affair and the young unwed woman becomes pregnant. The whole town shuns her and forces her to wear a scarlet letter “A” on chest for adultury. The whole town is mean to her and chases her to the outskirts out town where she and the child are now forced to live .. the child ultimately what exposed the adulterous relationship thus drowning her in her own sin... I could go on and on but I would hate to ruin the novel for you.. you will enjoy the read
imgumbydamnit
Thanks mang!.. Wait no..
WOmang!
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METHADONE 10MG, 40MG WAFERS
Lorcet - ( Hydrocodone Bitartrate/ Acetaminophen) 10 mg/ 650 mg
AMBIEN ( Zolpidem, Stilnox) 10 mg
seconal (chemical name-secobarbital)
LO LOESTRIN FE
ADIPEX-P 37.5MG
VIAGRA 100MG
Lorazepam 2.5 mg ( Ativan)
Clonazepam 2 mg ( Rivotril)
CIALIS 20MG
Percocet 10/ 325
Norco - ( Hydrocodone Bitartrate/ Acetaminophen ) 5 mg/ 325 mg
Percocet 5/ 325
endocet 10/ 325
hydrocodone-ibuprofen (brand name:vicoprofen)
suboxone
subutex
watson 540
Dilaudid 8mg
Soma 350mg
Adderall 30mg
Ritalin 10mg
Tramadol ( Ultram) 50mg
ibrpohen
advil pm
Atarax 25mg
viagra gold
FIORICET (BUTALBITOL 50MG) - MIKART
Hydrocodone 539
Roxicodone 15mg, 30mg
Opana 40mg
CRYSTAL METH
MDMA
LSD,
MERPHEDRONE
COCAINE
DMT
MXE,
MVP,
ECTASY]
Growth Hormones
Ansomone,
Hygetropin,
Kigtropin,
Igtropin IGF,
Jintropin ,
HGH Blue Top,
IGF-1LR3
Anabolic Steroids
10 mg ANABOL
10 mg ANABOL
50 mg Anapolon
5 mg Azolol
5 mg Azolol
10 mg Dianabol
10 mg Dianabol
50 mg Oxymetholone(Anadrol)
5 mg Gen-Shi Halotestin
5 mg GP Anavar
50mg Clomid