Highest Note Written for Soprano
Candide
repertoire. Also greedy songbirds aside what is the most difficult and most often
transposed up or down.
I ask this because while listening I have noticed a tendency lately of sopranos
singing "the interest,not the capital". Using La Traviata as an example I have
heard wonderful recordings of Stratas and others singing "Sempre libera" which
they whip themselves into such a frenzy of fireworks ending with that glorious
final sustained high note. Recent performances by the current crop of soprano' s
either seen live or recorded seem more like wet firecrackers; they sputter and
fizzle out rather anti-climactically.
No one is suggesting an artist take on a role for which her voice is not suitably
trained but just wondering if preservation of career leads to rather lazy
performances.
Candide
--
"Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing
himself."-Tolstoy
Jon Davis
>repertoire.
It's hard to calculate - as with many of the bel canto scores, these notes were
just assumed rather than written out by the composers. Sutherland regularly
hit high E's in her first performances of SONNAMBULA at the Met, and Massenet
wrote F's (and maybe G's) for Sybil Sanderson in ESCLARMONDE. This is the kind
of question that when a definitive answer is found, someone else will always
find an even higher note or more improbable anecdote.
Jon Davis
A closed mouth gathers no feet.
MD
Sybil Sanderson. Sutherland didn't attempt it.
"Matthew B. Tepper" wrote:
> An F-sharp _in alt_ in the original version (not the later version,
> transposed down) of Zerbinetta's thingumajig in _Ariadne auf Naxos_ is
> reported by _Guinness_ -- which means it is almost certainly something
> else.
>
> --
> Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
> My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
> My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
> To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
> "Compassionate Conservatism?" * "Tight Slacks?" * "Jumbo Shrimp?"
Mike Richter
ladies (Silberklang?) get up there?
Of course, an essential point here is that the note is written into the
score. What may actually be sung is another question in either
direction.
Mike
"Claud H. Shirley III" wrote:
>
> MD wrote:
>
> > I think it has to be the high G written by Massenet in ESCLARMONDE,
> > for
> > Sybil Sanderson.
> >
>
> This is the highest vocal note I have seen printed in any opera
> score. There are also 2 high G's in Mozart's concert aria "Popolo di
> Tessaglia".
--
mric...@cpl.net
http://mrichter.simplenet.com
CD-R http://resource.simplenet.com
Matthew B. Tepper
Matthew B. Tepper
note Sutherland hit (I presume you mean in her "Esprits de l'air,
esprits du monde, obeissez-moi ... ah!" business), it was certainly high
enough that I did not want to hear anything higher.
MD wrote:
>
> I think it has to be the high G written by Massenet in ESCLARMONDE, for
> Sybil Sanderson. Sutherland didn't attempt it.
>
> "Matthew B. Tepper" wrote:
>
Scott Tisdel
jdavi...@aol.com (Jon Davis) wrote:
> >Wondering what is the highest note written for fach soprano in current opera
> >repertoire.
>
Here are my candidates: In the original version of Strauss' Ariadne auf
Naxos, he writes two high F#'s in Zerbinetta's big aria. (Sumi Jo has an
incredible recording of this version.) Later, when Strauss revised the
work, this section was transposed down a whole step, and the F#'s became
E's.
Perhaps the most difficult high note I've ever seen, though, is at the end
of a remarkable work of Schoenberg, Herzgewachse, for Celeste, Harmonium,
Harp, and very high soprano. This time it's a high F-natural, but
sustained for four slow beats and marked "pppp"!! Marni Nixon is the only
one I know of that has recorded it.
A T
:-))))
Mark D. Lew
> I think it has to be the high G written by Massenet in ESCLARMONDE, for
> Sybil Sanderson. Sutherland didn't attempt it.
I don't own a copy of Esclarmonde, but my recollection from when I was
studying the library's copy is that the high F's are written normal, but
the high G's are printed in the score as optional cue notes.
On a similar subject, I used to think that that delicious downward leap in
"Regarde-les ces yeux", from high B down to low D#, must surely be among
the widest leaps in the repertoire. (Two octaves minus a major 3rd; "Come
Scoglio" includes a jump one half-step wider, though to my ear it sounds
less dramatic.)
A few days ago, however, I discovered in _Le Postillon de Lonjumeau", in
the third act tenor aria (ie, not the famous one), a jump from high D to
low B -- that is, two octaves PLUS a minor 3rd. Unbelievable.
mdl
Harpsichordist
>note Sutherland hit (I presume you mean in her "Esprits de l'air,
>esprits du monde, obeissez-moi ... ah!" business), it was certainly high
>enough that I did not want to hear anything higher.
Matthew, that gets a major L O L.
Zerbinetta would have been my vote.
Mark Slater
Per aures ad animum
"Through the ears to the spirit"
Mike Richter
"Mark D. Lew" wrote:
> A few days ago, however, I discovered in _Le Postillon de Lonjumeau", in
> the third act tenor aria (ie, not the famous one), a jump from high D to
> low B -- that is, two octaves PLUS a minor 3rd. Unbelievable.
The Gedda excerpts disc has a remarkable version of that aria. Overall,
it makes the one which 'just' has the D's sound simple. Of course, Gedda
makes the Rosenschein aria sound simple, too, but that's not the
composer's fault. <G>
Mike
james jorden
when she sort of materializes out of the mist. The score indicates a rapid
scale passage up to the G with an alternative bar with a more practicable
vocal line. I remember reading a remark by Richard Bonynge that the high F
and G are not in Massenet's original manuscript but seem to have been added
later (in Massenet's hand), perhaps during the early rehearsals of this
piece.
"Matthew B. Tepper" wrote:
> I was at the re-premiere of _Esclarmonde_ in San Francisco, and whatever
> note Sutherland hit (I presume you mean in her "Esprits de l'air,
> esprits du monde, obeissez-moi ... ah!" business), it was certainly high
> enough that I did not want to hear anything higher.
>
> MD wrote:
> >
> > I think it has to be the high G written by Massenet in ESCLARMONDE, for
> > Sybil Sanderson. Sutherland didn't attempt it.
> >
> > "Matthew B. Tepper" wrote:
> >
> > > An F-sharp _in alt_ in the original version (not the later version,
> > > transposed down) of Zerbinetta's thingumajig in _Ariadne auf Naxos_
> > > is reported by _Guinness_ -- which means it is almost certainly
> > > something else.
>
> --
> Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
> My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
> My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
> To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
> "Compassionate Conservatism?" * "Tight Slacks?" * "Jumbo Shrimp?"
--
==============
james jorden
jjo...@bellatlantic.net
www.parterre.com
"I cannot begin to describe the filth backstage." -- Kyra Vayne
james jorden
I think the score *as written* of Lulu includes some high F-sharps, though
most performers of the role do not attempt them.
Mike Richter wrote:
> I don't have a score for Schauspieldirektor - but doesn't one of the
> ladies (Silberklang?) get up there?
>
> Of course, an essential point here is that the note is written into the
> score. What may actually be sung is another question in either
> direction.
>
> Mike
>
> "Claud H. Shirley III" wrote:
> >
> > MD wrote:
> >
> > > I think it has to be the high G written by Massenet in ESCLARMONDE,
> > > for
> > > Sybil Sanderson.
> > >
> >
> > This is the highest vocal note I have seen printed in any opera
> > score. There are also 2 high G's in Mozart's concert aria "Popolo di
> > Tessaglia".
>
> --
--
Jon Davis
>note Sutherland hit (I presume you mean in her "Esprits de l'air,
>esprits du monde, obeissez-moi ... ah!" business), it was certainly high
>enough that I did not want to hear anything higher.
It was a D. I have the tape.
dtritter
Scott Tisdel wrote:
> Perhaps the most difficult high note I've ever seen, though, is at the end> of a remarkable work of Schoenberg, Herzgewachse, for Celeste, Harmonium,> Harp, and very high soprano. This time it's a high F-natural, but> sustained for four slow beats and marked "pppp"!! Marni Nixon is the only> one I know of that has recorded it.
five years later, robert craft included "herzgewaechse" in his columbia
masterworks "complete works of schoenberg, vol. 2. it was sung on the
recording by a soprano labeled there by producer john mcclure as "rita
tritter," her married name, though instructed that the surname should
have been shane. steane, in his "the grand tradition," makes a great
deal over this recording, unaware that the schoenberg performer and rita
shane were one and the same. she had yet to make her professional debut,
but was a recent graduate of the santa fe opera apprentice program.
craft was in santa fe and had heard her sing the nightingale in
"l'enfant et les sortileges," which likewise has an f-in-alt, sustained
for 9 beats, and naturally needed a soprano with such equipment. shane
later was heard to sing many such f's in performance, and even a few
f-sharps.
dft
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Donald Collup
mark...@earthlink.net (Mark D. Lew) wrote:
> In article <394EDDE3...@isomedia.com>, MD <dal...@isomedia.com> wrote:
>
> > I think it has to be the high G written by Massenet in ESCLARMONDE, for
> > Sybil Sanderson. Sutherland didn't attempt it.
>
> I don't own a copy of Esclarmonde, but my recollection from when I was
> studying the library's copy is that the high F's are written normal, but
> the high G's are printed in the score as optional cue notes.
>
> On a similar subject, I used to think that that delicious downward leap in
> "Regarde-les ces yeux", from high B down to low D#, must surely be among
> the widest leaps in the repertoire. (Two octaves minus a major 3rd; "Come
> Scoglio" includes a jump one half-step wider, though to my ear it sounds
> less dramatic.)
>
> A few days ago, however, I discovered in _Le Postillon de Lonjumeau", in
> the third act tenor aria (ie, not the famous one), a jump from high D to
> low B -- that is, two octaves PLUS a minor 3rd. Unbelievable.
>
> mdl
Highest note I've heard:
High A above high C: Merja Sargon, 1969 American premiere of Penderecki's
"The Devils of Loudon"
Big skip:
High Bb to middle C: Die Frau ohne Schatten - Empress: "mein rich-ter hervor!"
--
Donald Collup
http://www.collup.com
Jon A Conrad
used to have original-Zerbinetta), on the basis of Mozart's "Popoli di
Tessaglia," where it's demanded twice. (And as noted it's an option in
Massenet's ESCLARMONDE, understandably declined by Sutherland.)
Higher unwritten notes are sung on occasion by young coloraturas who feel
up (sorry) to it. Popular occasions are going "up" for the very last note
in Adele's Laughing Song or Olympia's Doll Song.
The 2-octaves-plus-minor-third leap already cited is written by Mozart on
those same notes but in the other direction: low B up to high D, in the
middle of a word. It's in his insertion aria "Vorrei spiegarvi, O Dio!"
Margaret Price manages this especially well on recordings. (And I'm told
there's a really funny editing-down on a 78 version by Ria Ginster: she
takes the bottom note up, the top note down, and ends up dazzling us with
a leap of a minor third!)
Jon Alan Conrad
Department of Music
University of Delaware
con...@udel.edu
dtritter
Bill Erwin
"Popoli di Tessaglia...Io non chiedo," where 2 consecutive runs end in G
above high C. I have recordings by Eda Moser (who does not really sing the
notes), and Natalie Dessay, who sings them wonderfully. Mozart wrote it for
his sister-in-law when she was still unmarried and said that it was "the
best I have written in my life" (1778). The G in alt is the highest note
that Mozart ever demanded of a singer.
Candide <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote in message
news:Mhw35.6339$n95.1...@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net...
> Wondering what is the highest note written for fach soprano in current
opera
Candide
"free music" coupon's to use up).
May I also say it was really refreshing to have a nice civilized
conversation/debate amongst ourselves sans all the hate filled Spam which has
befallen the group of late.
Perhaps we all should post more such queries thus crowding out the Spam and
sharing collective information in the bargain.
Cheers,
Candide
--
"Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing
himself."-Tolstoy
Bill Erwin <ok...@nfdc.net> wrote in message
news:wGR35.1702$Qb1.1...@monger.newsread.com...
A T
the highest you ever heard,
or is there any other higher than that one?
Jon A Conrad
It depends on the context you'll allow. The versatile vocalist Cleo Laine
(usually typed as a jazz or cabaret singer, but she did occasionally
perform and even record "art" songs) during the 1970s employed an
altissimo range that extended to C above high C. I heard it on TV
appearances, and it's there on her first Carnegie Hall live recording (in
Carole King's "Music").
james jorden
Sack where she touches C above high C.
Natalie Dessay interpolated several high G's into the role of Olympia at the
Met two seasons ago; I am pretty sure her range would extend to the high
A-flat as well.
Jon A Conrad wrote:
--
maf1029
Scott Tisdel wrote in message <394eff49$0$33688$726...@news.execpc.com>...
>In article <20000619182008...@ng-cp1.aol.com>,
>jdavi...@aol.com (Jon Davis) wrote:
>
>Perhaps the most difficult high note I've ever seen, though, is at the end
>of a remarkable work of Schoenberg, Herzgewachse, for Celeste, Harmonium,
>Harp, and very high soprano. This time it's a high F-natural, but
>sustained for four slow beats and marked "pppp"!! Marni Nixon is the only
>one I know of that has recorded it.>>
Bill Erwin
the top. Has anyone out there checked that?
A T <spam...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:9XW35.12715$C44.7...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Elsa Scammell
21:06:30 GMTIn article <qdv45.2234$Qb1.1...@monger.newsread.com>, ok...@nfdc.net (Bill
Erwin) wrote:
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> Subject: Re: Highest Note Not Written for Soprano
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Yes; Yma Sumac is reckoned to be able to reach A above high C; but she does have a near
5-octave range !
Elsa
Mark D. Lew
vel...@cix.co.uk wrote:
> Yes; Yma Sumac is reckoned to be able to reach A above high C; but she
does have a near
> 5-octave range !
Let's do the math here. If A above high C is her high note, and her range
is near five octaves, then her low note is "near" the A below the lowest
string on a cello (ie, three leger lines below the bass staff). I've only
known a handful of basso profundos who can growl out something audible on
that pitch; I hardly think that any soprano could.
Outside the opera world, people toss around ludicrous statements about
someone having an X-octave range. The reality is that one can have a
perfectly good career with only two octaves; three octaves is very
impressive, even for a professional opera singer; four octaves is truly
extraordinary and very very rare; and five octaves is just plain false.
Four octaves, incidentally, is one half step short of encompassing the
Queen of the Night AND Sarastro.
mdl
Elsa Scammell
Lew<markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net>Sat, 24 Jun 2000 11:25:00
GMTIn article <markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net>,
> Article: 225198 of rec.music.opera
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> From: mark...@earthlink.net (Mark D. Lew)
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> Subject: Re: Highest Note Not Written for Soprano
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>
> In article <memo.20000623...@velluti.compulink.co.uk>,
> vel...@cix.co.uk wrote:
>
> > Yes; Yma Sumac is reckoned to be able to reach A above high C; but she
> does have a near
> > 5-octave range !
>
> Let's do the math here. If A above high C is her high note, and her
> range
> is near five octaves, then her low note is "near" the A below the lowest
> string on a cello (ie, three leger lines below the bass staff). I've
> only
> known a handful of basso profundos who can growl out something audible
> on
> that pitch; I hardly think that any soprano could.
>
> Outside the opera world, people toss around ludicrous statements about
> someone having an X-octave range. The reality is that one can have a
> perfectly good career with only two octaves; three octaves is very
> impressive, even for a professional opera singer; four octaves is truly
> extraordinary and very very rare; and five octaves is just plain false.
>
>> Article: 225198 of rec.music.opera
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> From: mark...@earthlink.net (Mark D. Lew)
> Newsgroups: rec.music.opera
> Subject: Re: Highest Note Not Written for Soprano
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>
> In article <memo.20000623...@velluti.compulink.co.uk>,
> vel...@cix.co.uk wrote:
>
> > Yes; Yma Sumac is reckoned to be able to reach A above high C; but she
> does have a near
> > 5-octave range !
>
>>>
I took this from the "official" (sic) Yma Sumac web site; I have some of her recordings, but not
having perfect pitch (and no instrument) I had to go on what was said there. No criticism of
other singers with a more limited range; in fact, Sumac never did perform (so far as I am aware)
any classical works, or appear on the operatic stage, but do correct me if I am wrong, as I am
sure you will !!
Yes, I did know the Mozart reference and all the rest.
BUT all *I*did, Sir, to was answer someone else's question, but I should have left the answer at
the "high" note.
I don't know if you are acquainted with the experimental "Roy Hart" Theatre; this person
claimed to be able to utter all the piano notes; but these musical extremes are curiosities, and
are not very tuneful or attractive.
Elsa Scammell
Mark D. Lew
vel...@cix.co.uk wrote:
> I took this from the "official" (sic) Yma Sumac web site; I have some of
her recordings, but not
> having perfect pitch (and no instrument) I had to go on what was said
there. No criticism of
> other singers with a more limited range; in fact, Sumac never did perform
(so far as I am aware)
> any classical works, or appear on the operatic stage, but do correct me
if I am wrong, as I am
> sure you will !!
> Yes, I did know the Mozart reference and all the rest.
> BUT all *I*did, Sir, to was answer someone else's question, but I should
have left the answer at
> the "high" note.
I meant no criticism at all to you, just setting the record straight. I
assume that the "official" site is making the common x = x+1 error --
common because of the deceptively fallacious reasoning that "if I can sing
three different G's then I have three octaves in my range". Add to that
the notion that a fourth constitutes "near", then the 3 octaves plus a 5th
which Claud cited becomes "near five octaves".
mdl
VALFER
sure of your tone when you say that she could make some "interesting"
sounds. Do you mean interesting in the same sense as the Chinese curse -
"May you live in interesting times"?
Listening to every recording Ms. Sumac made and enjoying them
qualifies one, IMO as a masochist. You don't mention enjoying them,
therefore I must respect and admire your tolerance.
Valfer
Agreed. And I have listened to all of the pseudo-exotic Ms. Sumac's
recordings, 1st to last... She could make some very interesting sounds.
Andre Edouard
You're about as unbendingly humorless a dude as I've ever run across.
I thought Sumac [Ima, not poison] was a gas, very enjoyable, and in no
way was she to be taken as a singer of serious music.
On the other hand, if an entertainer isn't packaged in an envelope of
"legitimacy," you seem to reject that person out of hand.
Beware the Curse of the Xtabay !!
AE
VALFER
Inca Princess, the full-blooded descendant of the Immortal Manco Capac the
Inca, who ruled over the Empire of Gold ! I will forever fear the Curse of
Xtabay and cower at the sound of the voice of the Immortal Princess! May
all the hairs on my head gravitate to my nose and ears if I should ever
again offend Her Holiness (oops - it happened - oh horror!)
Never mind that she was born in Union City (or was it Passaic?)
Valfer the Humorless
Andre Edouard wrote in message <39556E97...@bellsouth.net>...
Oisk17
Capital both, capital both, you've caught it nicely
That is the style of things precisely!
Best regards
Paul
Andre Edouard
Got that right.
Did I ask where she was born? Do I give a shit? No.
I said she was "a gas" to listen to. I still say that. I still maintain you
are a stiff.
Laugh at those who took her, and take you, at face value.
AndreEdouard
Matthew B. Tepper
>
> Way to go , Valfer!
>
> Capital both, capital both, you've caught it nicely
> That is the style of things precisely!
Oh, sweet to earn a nobleman's praise!