Fanciulla del West Recordings
Scarlet Cockrel
Can anyone recommend a good recording of La Fanciulla del West?
*Scarlet Cockrel*
md dl
You could do no better than to find the 'live' Florence 1953
recording with Steber, del Monaco and Mitropoulous. Tebaldi,
Kirsten and Olivero all had great success with the role and the
various available recordings would all work for you. Nilsson's
recording is not very idiomatic, but accurate. What a tragedy that
the originally scheduled Minnie didn't do that recording: Maria
Callas!
GRNDPADAVE
>>Subject: Re: Fanciulla del West Recordings
>From: md dl <dal...@isomedia.com>
>Date: Sat, May 30, 1998 16:45 EDT
>Message-id: <35706FE4...@isomedia.com>
I just love that Nilsson recording. I'll take splendid dramatic and accurate
singing over "idiomatic" every time. Lovro von Matcic gives a very incisive
and rhythmic performance. It is the cuts that disturb me most.
-
If I were restricted to only one recording, and recorded sound was not the most
important aspect, I suppose I would go with Votto / Corelli / Frazzoni / Gobbi.
I kind of like the hair-under-the-armpits singing Frazzoni provides and
although I am not a Corellian, I think this role brings out his best mausical
manners and passion. Gobbi is the best sheriff I've ever heard although
Mongelli (with Nilsson) is quite good.
-
The only note complete recording is that by Felix Slatkin. But to get all of
Puccini's oater you need to put up with Eva Marton, a price I am willing to
pay, but I would not recommend it to the others.
==G/P Dave
PANPERSON
There is an old recording (cetra-soria I believe) with Carla Gavazzi. She
is, of all the sopranos who have recorded this role, the only one who seems to
understand the humor which Puccini put into this piece. Anyway the poker
scene is by far the best ever recorded. If any of you haven't heard it don't
say anything about any other performance. If you have then you will have to
agree.
Alrod
>Can anyone recommend a good recording of La Fanciulla del West?
Umm. Tebaldi on Decca/London for Minnie, Del Monaco on the Mitropoulos
broadcast for Ramerrez (with Corelli's broadcast really close),
Mongelli on EMI for Rance, and Matacic conducting, also EMI. Avoid any
recording made after 1959, due to criminal negligence on the part of
all concerned.
Unfortunately, the EMI is OP at the moment, so the Decca/London is the
safest stereo recommendation. If you're OK for AM radio sound, pick up
both the Del Monaco and Corelli broadcasts.
BTW, not only was Nilsson a last minute substitute for Callas on EMI,
but Tebaldi was substituting for Cerquetti on Decca/London!
Alrod
Enrique Eskenazi
In article <357058B5...@mediaone.net>, Scarlet Cockrel
<coc...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>Can anyone recommend a good recording of La Fanciulla del West?
I had the Domingo/Neblett/Mehta's Fanciulla (and the
Domingo/Neblett/Santi video) and was quite happy with it, when I read in
this group raving reviews about the Del Monaco/Steber/Mitropoulos, so
I've got it. And I'm grateful to the group for the advice. With that one
you can't go wrong.
---
Enrique
eske...@mail.sendanet.es
Io chi sono? Eh, non lo so.
-Nol sapete?
Quasi no.
Matthew B. Tepper
In article <199805302152...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
grndp...@aol.com spake unto the unwashed masses:
>
>>Scarlet Cockrel wrote:
>>
>>> Can anyone recommend a good recording of La Fanciulla del West?
>>>
>
>The only note complete recording is that by Felix Slatkin.
Try Leonard Slatkin.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://www.deltanet.com/~ducky/index.htm
My main music page --- http://www.deltanet.com/~ducky/berlioz.htm
And my science fiction club's home page --- http://www.lasfs.org/
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
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jfu...@unix.asb.com
My favorite is the Del Monaco/Steber/Mitropoulos set, but try to find the
Kirsten/Corelli/Colzani set from Philadelphia, perhaps on Legato - Kirsten
was a superb Minnie as any of you who saw her many performances at the
Met know.
There's also an excellent Met Broadcast out there from 1-08-66, the sound
is excellent if you can find a copy from someone who taped it themselves.
Joe
Martin Hair
Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
The Covent Garden recording with Domingo, Neblett in the leading roles,
Milnes as Rance and Mehta conducting is the best on the Market. I saw the
production in London many years ago and the recorded version is very fine.
Michael Volpe
I would not recommend a full recording of Fanciulla but I do think that
the two arias from it that Jose Cura did on his Puccini CD are thrilling
- particularly the una parola sola. Spine tingling everytime
Volpe
Ed Rosen
In <357699...@dial.pipex.com> Michael Volpe <tg...@dial.pipex.com>
writes:
If you find Cura spine tingling, what would you call Del Monaco in the
great complete set with he, Tebaldi, MacNeil. I would venture to say
that whatever 1000 times spine tingling is, that's what Del Monaco is
compared to the Cura version. Listen to it- you'll all agree.
Ed
The Clark Family
> If you find Cura spine tingling, what would you call Del Monaco in the
> great complete set with he, Tebaldi, MacNeil. I would venture to say
> that whatever 1000 times spine tingling is, that's what Del Monaco is
> compared to the Cura version. Listen to it- you'll all agree.
I also think that Del Monaco's Johnson is a ideally dramatic. My only
problem is that he seems to heavy at times, such as the love duet or
"Chella mi creda".
-Grahm Clark (not THAT one)
md dl
Actually, though the thought of him onstage as Johnson would be ludicrous,
James McCracken did "Una parola sola" on his first LP of arias for Decca, and
sang the bejeezus out of it. I'm with the other posters on del Monaco. Not
so much the thrilling metallic voice at the climaxes, but the tender caress
he's able to invest some of the love music with: totally unexpected given his
reputation as a shouter.
Michael Volpe
Ed Rosen wrote:
>
> In <357699...@dial.pipex.com> Michael Volpe <tg...@dial.pipex.com>
> writes:
> >
> >Enrique Eskenazi wrote:
> >>
> >> In article <357058B5...@mediaone.net>, Scarlet Cockrel
> >> <coc...@mediaone.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Can anyone recommend a good recording of La Fanciulla del West?
> >>
> >
> >I would not recommend a full recording of Fanciulla but I do think
> that
> >the two arias from it that Jose Cura did on his Puccini CD are
> thrilling
> >- particularly the una parola sola. Spine tingling everytime
> >
> >Volpe
>
> great complete set with he, Tebaldi, MacNeil. I would venture to say
> that whatever 1000 times spine tingling is, that's what Del Monaco is
> compared to the Cura version. Listen to it- you'll all agree.
>
Ed,
A powerful recommendation for del Monaco. I have mentioned on this ng
before that I could never get on with del Monaco's voice (many reasons,
don't want to bore you with them) but I will accept your advice and try
to get a listen of it. What I do love about Cura's voice is the rich
ness and depth of it - almost baritone at times. Immense power (well, in
the studio at least) and brilliantly controlled emotion. Del Monaco was
emotional and had power but there was a timbre to his voice that
disagrees with me.
Anyway, there you go.
Volpe
HenryFogel
>From: jfu...@unix.asb.com
>Date: Mon, Jun 1, 1998 10:02 EDT
>Message-id: <jfuller-0106...@x2hicks114.asb.com>
The Kirsten/Corelli Fanciulla that claims to be from Philadelphia IS actually
the January 8, 1966 Met Broadcast. I believe those who have released it as a
Philadelphia performance might have done so to keep the authorities at the Met
from coming after them. I have it on Melodram, and it is good. But I agree
with the recommendation of the Del Monaco/Steber/Guelfi/Mitropoulos performance
-- decent mono broadcast sound from 1954, issued on many labels (Hunt, Myto,
Fonit Cetra), this is a hair-raising, absolutely thrilling Fanciulla.
If you want modern stereo sound, I like the DG recording with Domingo, Neblett
and Milnes -- with Mehta's thrilling conducting.
Henry Fogel
Ed Rosen
I'm sorry, Henry, but you are mistaken about the Legato Fanciulla. It is really
from Philadelphia.
We received the wonderful sounding house tape from baritone Seymour Schwartzman,
who sings the role of Sonora in this performance. The principals are the same as
the Met broadcast from 1965, but the performance is definitely from Philadelphia.
The release you refer to on a European is indeed the Met broadcast.
One of my very favorite Fanciulla is the performance we recently re-=released in
much cleaner sound. This is the performance from La Scala, in 1956, with Frazzoni,
Corelli, Gobbi.
Frazzoni throws herself into the role in a fashion that is almost frightening, and
the Polker Scene with her and Gobbi is one of the most riveting scenes in the
history of live opera recordings. The young Corelli is magnificent as Johnson, and
the entire Italian cast, along with the very knowing conducting of Votto delivers
the real thing in this performance.
It is available from us if any are interested.
Best,
Ed
Ed Rosen<legat...@earthlink.net> for free catalog and CD of Month Club
information
Legato Classics, Inc.
http://www.legatoclassics.com
Martin Hair
HenryFogel wrote:
> >From: jfu...@unix.asb.com
> >Date: Mon, Jun 1, 1998 10:02 EDT
> >Message-id: <jfuller-0106...@x2hicks114.asb.com>
> >
> >My favorite is the Del Monaco/Steber/Mitropoulos set, but try to find the
> >Kirsten/Corelli/Colzani set from Philadelphia, perhaps on Legato - Kirsten
> >was a superb Minnie as any of you who saw her many performances at the
> >Met know.
> >
> >There's also an excellent Met Broadcast out there from 1-08-66, the sound
> >is excellent if you can find a copy from someone who taped it themselves.
> >
> >Joe
>
> The Kirsten/Corelli Fanciulla that claims to be from Philadelphia IS actually
> the January 8, 1966 Met Broadcast. I believe those who have released it as a
> Philadelphia performance might have done so to keep the authorities at the Met
> from coming after them. I have it on Melodram, and it is good. But I agree
> with the recommendation of the Del Monaco/Steber/Guelfi/Mitropoulos performance
> -- decent mono broadcast sound from 1954, issued on many labels (Hunt, Myto,
> Fonit Cetra), this is a hair-raising, absolutely thrilling Fanciulla.
>
> If you want modern stereo sound, I like the DG recording with Domingo, Neblett
> and Milnes -- with Mehta's thrilling conducting.
>
> Henry Fogel
I just re-listened to the DG recording from the ROH, Covent Garden. I agree that
the orchestra plays well too Mehta's baton. The love scene between Minnie and Dick
never fails to reduce me to tears and the poker scene has great damatic impetus.
Why is this Puccini mastrepiece underrated?
Martin
donpaolo
Here we go is right!
I love Cura's essential instrument & its coloration, because he reminds me
a lot of the magnificent Mario DelM. However, Cura I find very dull &
unexciting because he just does not use emphasis or inflections at the
appropriate times to underscore emotion & passion. I pray that he
overcomes this, because he has the potential for becoming THE tenor of the
next 20 or so years. If he continues in the same manner, I fear that he
will be very ordinary, despite the excellent voice.
Regards,
DonPaolo
Michael Volpe <tg...@dial.pipex.com> wrote in article
<3577B4...@dial.pipex.com>...
donpaolo
md dl -
You see, this reputation is not only undeserved, but foolish as well. The
man was one of the most feeling & passionate & emotive singers in history;
and, he had a thrilling & ringing voice. It is beyond my ability to
understand how or why genuine *voices* such as Srs. DelM & Corelli are
condemned, particularly when they evidenced time after time their abilities
at conveying the tenderest of feelings.
Regards,
DonPaolo
md dl <dal...@isomedia.com> wrote in article
<357702E2...@isomedia.com>...
md dl
> The love scene between Minnie and Dick
> never fails to reduce me to tears and the poker scene has great damatic impetus.
> Martin
I think it's because there is too much "filler". Boheme has melodic interest from the
opening few pages. Fanciulla takes a long time to get rolling, almost until Johnson's
entrance. Then there's all the nonsense in Act 2 with Wowkle before, again, Johnson's
entrance through the end of the Act. Act 3 takes FOREVER, and nothing really happens
until "Ch'ella mi creda". It's the ultimate opera for a highlights CD, because the
entire evening really only contains 40 minutes of drop dead wonderful music. The only
exception I would make is the luxurious orchestration throughout, which Maurice Ravel
used to assign to his composition students to study as an example of a total mastery
of orchestral textures and details.
Still when glorious singers like Steber, Kirsten and Tebaldi sang Minnie, it seems a
much better opera than it really is. I feel the same way about Gioconda and Medea,
BTW.
LTopper314
>There is an old recording (cetra-soria I believe) with Carla Gavazzi.
Is this Gavazzi recording available on disc yet? I have been looking for it,
but have not seen it.
Lindsey
LTopper314
>Can anyone recommend a good recording of La Fanciulla del West?
I really love the Met video with Domingo, Daniels, and Milnes. The production
is wonderful. While Milnes voice is tremulous and basically ugly, he cut the
right kind of impression as Rance. His voice does not detract. Daniels and
Domingo are quite good and the sets are really great.
Lindsey
Enrique Eskenazi
In article <35789FA3...@isomedia.com>, md dl <dal...@isomedia.com>
wrote:
>> Why is this Puccini masterpiece underrated?
>> Martin
>
>I think it's because there is too much "filler". Boheme has melodic
interest from the
>opening few pages. Fanciulla takes a long time to get rolling, almost
until Johnson's
>entrance. Then there's all the nonsense in Act 2 with Wowkle before,
again, Johnson's
>entrance through the end of the Act. Act 3 takes FOREVER, and nothing
really happens
>until "Ch'ella mi creda". It's the ultimate opera for a highlights CD,
because the
>entire evening really only contains 40 minutes of drop dead wonderful
music.
I guess that some Fanciulla's fans will (rightly) object to that
statement.
Just wanted to point that IMO Fanciulla is less popular than other
Puccinis mainly because it has only one "aria" -Ch'ella mi creda...-
that can be enjoyed separately of the rest of the work, so it has not
the "prodigality" of La Boheme, Butterfly, Tosca or Turandot. About Act
3 taking forever and nothing happening until "CH'ella mi creda"... well,
it' only around 10-12 minutes up to Johnson's aria, and it is very
exciting including the choral scene of Johnson's persecution and very
beautiful lines in Rance's imprecations and his dialogue with Nick. And
then the "Risparmiate lo scherno" is also memorable
>Still when glorious singers like Steber, Kirsten and Tebaldi sang
Minnie, it seems a
>much better opera than it really is.
I would say that when great singers sang Minnie -and Johnson and Rance-
it becomes apparent what a good opera it really is
GRNDPADAVE
Much of the pleasure I get from FANCIULLA DEL WEST is in hearing music that is
at the same time unfamiliar but arrests the mind.
-
In Act I the music accompanying the arrival of the Pony Express has great
charm. I am taken by Minnie's delightful and funny Biblical reading that
includes a wonderful braying donkey when one of the miners describes Samson's
heroism. Minnie is then carried away into a wistful meditation on the beauty
of purity. These are elements that are not found elsewhere in Puccini.
-
I do not miss the big arias if I can have little ones like Rance's "Minnie
dalla mia caso son partito" or Minnie's "Laggiu nel Soledad" or her "O se
sapeste".
-
My introduction to this opera was a Mario del Monaco recital disk in which he
sang "Or son sei mesi". I was immediately taken by the strong rhythm (is it a
cakewalk?).
-
Indeed it is the powerful rhythms throughout this work that cause me to find
greatest pleasure in Lovro von Matacic's recording even though there preobably
are better singers to be heard elsewhere.
==G/P Dave
Linda B. Fairtile
I don't have much to add to the statements of those who wrote in
praise of Fanciulladel West. It is my favorite opera by my favorite
opera composer, perhaps because of the fact that its music is more
sophisticated than a simple string of arias and duets. The constantly
changing textures and the higher degree of equality between voices and
orchestra make, for me, a more interesting musical and dramatic
experience. And I disagree with those who claim there is no melody in
this work. One of my very favorite Puccini melodies is the one that
opens the final scene: Minnie's "E anche tu lo vorrai, Joe." The
large leaps that characterize this theme may not be typical Puccini,
at least not from the Boheme/Tosca/Butterfly period, but they point
towards the sound of Turandot. I also love the chords used in this
scene, and I can remember having a great time constructing a harmonic
analysis.
As for orchestral detail, all I can say is, listen closely to the
scene where Minnie describes her childhood. After she sings "ed io
che me ne stavo sotto al tavolino aspettando cader qualche moneta"
("and I used to hide under the little table, waiting for some coins to
fall"), there's a barely audible "clink" from the triangle. What a
marvelous detail! It probably passes unnoticed 90% of the time, but
it's there, a testament to Puccini's extraordinary sense of musical
drama.
For me, this is Puccini's most satisfying opera, because more than all
of his others, it pleases both the heart and the mind.
--
Linda B. Fairtile
Astoria, New York
ta...@bway.net
Mallardo7
> Fanciulla takes a long time to get rolling, almost until Johnson's
>entrance.
True. Until Minnie's entrance, in any case; that's were things really start,
but there's so much wonderful atmosphere and scene setting earlier - the Jake
Wallace scene, for instance - what would one cut?
Then there's all the nonsense in Act 2 with Wowkle before, again,
>Johnson's
>entrance.
Really, the Wowkle stuff is very brief. And Wowkle's reaction to Minnie's
bustling anxiety re Johnson's imminent arrival is wonderful.
Act 3 takes FOREVER, and nothing really
>happens
>until "Ch'ella mi creda". >
>
This I don't understand. The whole act is short. The haunting opening moments
between Rance and the Bartender are among the most beautiful pages in the
score, leading directly into the exciting chase music. If you don't like this
Act you just don't like the opera.
Michael Black
Linda B. Fairtile wrote:
> And I disagree with those who claim there is no melody in
> this work.
I completely agree Linda. Remember folks, let us not forget who REALLY
wrote the musical abomination The Phantom of the Opera.
--
"Dolora Zajick Rules!!! Any questions?"
http://www.stairway.org/bjorling/
My Suggested Recordings
http://www.stairway.org/bjorling/suggest.htm
SJ
One of my great regrets is that Caruso, who created the role of Dick
Johnson, never made a recording of any of the arias; never mind "Ch'ella mi
creda", but can anyone imagine the pathos he must have lent to "Or son sei
mesi"?
SJ
l'americano di dicomano
Jacob
Jacob wrote:
Okay Linda, you convinced me. Besides the fact that you have something
really interesting to tell in this newsgroup (which is very rare), you
just convinced me with your contribution to buy this opera. Week after
week I've been waiting for something essential in this group and here it
is. Thanks very much for this. I'm just curious which recording you
recommend. Neblett/Domingo perhaps??
Linda B. Fairtile
On Sun, 07 Jun 1998 20:35:27 +0000, Jacob <jac...@wxs.nl> wrote:
>Okay Linda, you convinced me. Besides the fact that you have something
>really interesting to tell in this newsgroup (which is very rare), you
>just convinced me with your contribution to buy this opera.
Wow! If only I got a commission.
> I'm just curious which recording you recommend. Neblett/Domingo perhaps??
Neblett/Domingo is the one that I own, but that's largely because of
Mehta's conducting. My husband the Del Monaco nut votes for
Tebaldi/Del Monaco, but I would also pay attention to the
recommendations of others on this newsgroup. Generally, those who
know this opera well enough even to have a preference are already
exhibiting good taste.
Joel P. Klein
ta...@bway.net (Linda B. Fairtile) wrote:
>
>Neblett/Domingo is the one that I own, but that's largely because of
>Mehta's conducting. My husband the Del Monaco nut votes for
>Tebaldi/Del Monaco, but I would also pay attention to the
>recommendations of others on this newsgroup. Generally, those who
>know this opera well enough even to have a preference are already
>exhibiting good taste.
>
>--
Linda,
It's your husband who has superb taste. First, for marrying you, and
secondly for prefering Del Monaco and Tebaldi who sing like gods on
this recording.
Michael Volpe
donpaolo wrote:
>
> Here we go is right!
>
> I love Cura's essential instrument & its coloration, because he reminds me
> a lot of the magnificent Mario DelM. However, Cura I find very dull &
> unexciting because he just does not use emphasis or inflections at the
> appropriate times to underscore emotion & passion. I pray that he
> overcomes this, because he has the potential for becoming THE tenor of the
> next 20 or so years.
I must disagree about Cura's inflection. In that aria from Fanciulla
(una parola sola etc) at the end, there is a moment of pure despair in
his voice - I virtually choke every time I listen. Some of his emotional
expression does seem a little forced but at times, it genuinely pours
from him.
Regards
Mike
Michael Volpe
md dl wrote:
>
> > The love scene between Minnie and Dick
> > never fails to reduce me to tears and the poker scene has great damatic impetus.
> > Martin
>
> I think it's because there is too much "filler". Boheme has melodic interest from the
> entrance. Then there's all the nonsense in Act 2 with Wowkle before, again, Johnson's
> entrance through the end of the Act. Act 3 takes FOREVER, and nothing really happens
> until "Ch'ella mi creda". It's the ultimate opera for a highlights CD, because the
> exception I would make is the luxurious orchestration throughout, which Maurice Ravel
> used to assign to his composition students to study as an example of a total mastery
> of orchestral textures and details.
>
> BTW.
I think maybe it is the odd subject matter - at least many Brits think
cowboys are odd sunject matter for an opera (no real reason - a cultural
thing !) And as for forty minutes of drop dead gorgeous music - I wish
some opers could boast such a thing !
volpe
Michael Volpe
>
> Okay Linda, you convinced me. Besides the fact that you have something
> really interesting to tell in this newsgroup (which is very rare), you
> week I've been waiting for something essential in this group and here it
> recommend. Neblett/Domingo perhaps??
You took the words right out of my mouth. Well done Linda - ever thought
of going into marketing !?
volpe
Linda B. Fairtile
>You took the words right out of my mouth. Well done Linda - ever thought
>of going into marketing !?
Maybe I should. It's certainly more profitable than musicology!
Jacob
Linda B. Fairtile wrote:
>
> On Mon, 08 Jun 1998 10:05:18 +0100, Michael Volpe
> <tg...@dial.pipex.com> wrote:
>
> >You took the words right out of my mouth. Well done Linda - ever thought
> >of going into marketing !?
>
> Maybe I should. It's certainly more profitable than musicology!
Jacob
Musicology?? How surprising. I thought most musicologists are only able
to analyse music in a clicical way without showing aspects of beauty.
Are you an exception or what??
Michael Volpe
Linda B. Fairtile wrote:
>
> On Mon, 08 Jun 1998 10:05:18 +0100, Michael Volpe
> <tg...@dial.pipex.com> wrote:
>
> >You took the words right out of my mouth. Well done Linda - ever thought
> >of going into marketing !?
>
> Maybe I should. It's certainly more profitable than musicology!
>
Volpe
The Britalian
Linda B. Fairtile
On Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:59:29 +0000, Jacob <jac...@wxs.nl> wrote:
>Musicology?? How surprising. I thought most musicologists are only able
>to analyse music in a clicical way without showing aspects of beauty.
>Are you an exception or what??
Let me put it this way: those of us who take Puccini seriously are
definitely in the minority :-)