Most Technically Challenging Aria for Soprano
Candide
Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
"Doll Song".
TIA
Candide
--
"Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing
himself."-Tolstoy
Alain Bourdeau
Naxos, or Ophelie's madness aria in Ambroise Thomas' Hamlet
Alain Bourdeau
Candide <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> a écrit dans le message :
JJh55.411$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net...
Mark D. Lew
<I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
> Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
> "Doll Song".
What do you mean by a "fach soprano"?
I don't think the "most technically challenging" question is meaningful
unless voice type is specified. Sure, many sopranos will find Olympia's
song very difficult for them. On the other hand, someone like Nathalie
Dessay or Sumi Jo would no doubt consider Isolde's liebestod far more
"difficult".
mdl
Mark Slater
>> Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a
>fach
>> soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or
>Olympia's "Doll Song".
Zerbinetta's aria is generally referred to as the most challenging soprano
aria.
Don't forget "Glitter and be Gay" from Bernstein's Candide.
Mark Slater
Per aures ad animum
"Through the ears to the spirit"
Skip
Candide wrote:
> Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
> "Doll Song".
>
GRNDPADAVE
challenging because of the range of the aria and because while it may be meant
to be comical, the singer must always remain serious.
A similar aria, "Ah chi mi dice mai" (DON GIOVANNI) requires Donna Elvira to
utilize the lowest register as well as negotiate leaps.
Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION FROM
THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and requires shifts
of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it sung better than by
Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
==G/P Dave
Jon Davis
>>fach
>>> soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or
>>Olympia's "Doll Song".
>
>aria.
>Don't forget "Glitter and be Gay" from Bernstein's Candide.
Also, a few of Mozart's concert arias have great challenges built in.
Jon Davis
A closed mouth gathers no feet.
David Shengold
> From: grndp...@aol.com (GRNDPADAVE)
> Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION FROM
> THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and requires
> shifts
> of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it sung better than by
> Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
Where is this available? On a Berger aria recital? I know that they recorded
MAGIC FLUTE together but am unfamiliar with a "Marten aller Arten".
The young Sutherland is pretty formidable in this aria, though lacking at
the bottom. For that matter I can't imagine Berger had the resonance to make
much of an impression at the bottom of Constanze's range either. But would
like to hear it, of course.
-David Shengold
Steffan O'Sullivan
>
>Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
>soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
>"Doll Song".
I'd say something like La Calunnia e un venticello, myself, if done in
the key as written ...
--
-Steffan O'Sullivan | Are you a US citizen with an apostrophe in
s...@vnet.net | your name? If so, please read:
Plymouth, NH, USA |
www.io.com/~sos | http://www.io.com/~sos/apostrophe.html
lav...@webtv.net
DonJose36
How True!!!!
Rob in St. Louis
Matthew B. Tepper
>
> I would think that Fiordiligi's "Come scoglio" (COSI FAN TUTTE) would
> be most challenging because of the range of the aria and because while
> it may be meant to be comical, the singer must always remain serious.
I'm reminded somehow of the soprano solo in the unfinished C Minor Mass.
> A similar aria, "Ah chi mi dice mai" (DON GIOVANNI) requires Donna
> Elvira to utilize the lowest register as well as negotiate leaps.
"Mi tradi" ain't easy either!
> Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION
> FROM THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and
> requires shifts of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it
> sung better than by Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
Plus, dramatically, she's got to get the listener's attention away from
the potential distraction of that little sinfonia concertante going on
in the orchestra.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
"Compassionate Conservatism?" * "Tight Slacks?" * "Jumbo Shrimp?"
Skip
Scales, Trills, Range, for most a difficult aria....
GRNDPADAVE wrote:
> I would think that Fiordiligi's "Come scoglio" (COSI FAN TUTTE) would be most
> challenging because of the range of the aria and because while it may be meant
> to be comical, the singer must always remain serious.
>
> A similar aria, "Ah chi mi dice mai" (DON GIOVANNI) requires Donna Elvira to
> utilize the lowest register as well as negotiate leaps.
>
> Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION FROM
> THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and requires shifts
> of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it sung better than by
> Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
>
> ==G/P Dave
Evelyn Vogt Gamble (Divamanque)
"coloratura", but "soprano" covers a rather wide range of
roles, not all of them twittering around above high C!
"Mark D. Lew" wrote:
>
> In article <JJh55.411$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net>, "Candide"
> <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
>
> > Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> > soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
> > "Doll Song".
>
GRNDPADAVE
Erna Berger's recording of "Martern aller arten" was recorded in the October
1947. The conductor was Josef Krips leading the Philharmonia Orchestra. The
aria in its entirety is 7 minutes and 41 seconds.
The recital disc, issued by EMI as CDM 7 63759 2 includes the two arias of the
Queen of the Night as excerpted from the 1937 MAGIC FLUTE, Beecham conducting
the Berlin Philharmonic.
There is a gorgeous "Caro nome" (sung in German as "Teurer Name, dessen Klang)
from 1932 !
==G/P Dave
===============================
shen...@pobox.upenn.edu
>Date: 06/25/2000 8:45 AM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: <B57B851E.D651%shen...@pobox.upenn.edu>
>
>
>
>> From: grndp...@aol.com (GRNDPADAVE)
>
>> Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION
>FROM
>> THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and requires
>> shifts
>> of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it sung better than by
>> Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
>
>
Corellifan
>soprano
The one she can't sing!!!!
GRNDPADAVE
>Date: 06/25/2000 12:21 PM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: <20000625132111...@ng-cm1.aol.com>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
OOPS - Bad Editing By me
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The apologies are from me to David Shengold (not "From: David Shengold").
==G/P Dave
======================================
David Shengold
I look forward to hearing it!
-David Shengold
> From: grndp...@aol.com (GRNDPADAVE)
>My apologies for getting recordings mixed up.
>
> Erna Berger's recording of "Martern aller arten" was recorded in the October
> 1947. The conductor was Josef Krips leading the Philharmonia Orchestra. The
> aria in its entirety is 7 minutes and 41 seconds.
>
> The recital disc, issued by EMI as CDM 7 63759 2 includes the two arias of the
> Queen of the Night as excerpted from the 1937 MAGIC FLUTE, Beecham conducting
> the Berlin Philharmonic.
> ===============================
> shen...@pobox.upenn.edu
Candide
Mark D. Lew <mark...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net...
> In article <JJh55.411$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net>, "Candide"
> <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
>
> > Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> > soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
> > "Doll Song".
>
> What do you mean by a "fach soprano"?
Yes you are correct my query should have been directed to *fach* Coloratura. So
much for tossing posts off the top of my head.
Mea culpa,mea culpa, mea maxima,maxima culpa
Candide
Candide
--
"
Mark D. Lew <mark...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net...
> In article <JJh55.411$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net>, "Candide"
> <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
>
> > Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> > soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
> > "Doll Song".
>
> What do you mean by a "fach soprano"?
------------
Yes, you are correct my query should have inquired regarding each specfic *fach*
Coloratura,Lyric Spinto and German Dramatic.
NNRathbun
>I would think that Fiordiligi's "Come scoglio" (COSI FAN TUTTE) would be most
challenging because of the range of the aria and because while it may be meant
to be comical, the singer must always remain serious.<
For me Come scoglio is probably the easiest thing in the whole opera. The two
arias require dramatic range shifts and noble coloratura. The ensembles
require sustained (and often piano) cantilena that just stays in the passagio
from beginning to end.
>A similar aria, "Ah chi mi dice mai" (DON GIOVANNI) requires Donna Elvira to
utilize the lowest register as well as negotiate leaps.>
I would say the most difficult aria in Don Giovanni is "Non mi dir." It
requires a large voice to sustain long-lined cantilena in a high tessitura, and
then a killer coloratura section, difficult not so much for the melismas but,
again, for the tessitura. "Mi tradi", while obviously extremely difficult, has
much easier coloratura and a much more manageable tessitura.
IMO, of course.
Nancy
Candide
Corellifan <corel...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000625134021...@ng-cq1.aol.com...
> >Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> >soprano
>
> The one she can't sing!!!!
______________
*LOL* True, True!
Luis A Nazario
David Shengold wrote:
> The young Sutherland is pretty formidable in this aria, though lacking at
> the bottom.
>
> -David Shengold
Mike Richter
David Shengold wrote:
>
> > From: grndp...@aol.com (GRNDPADAVE)
>
> > Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION FROM
> > THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and requires
> > shifts
> > of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it sung better than by
> > Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
>
> Where is this available? On a Berger aria recital? I know that they recorded
> MAGIC FLUTE together but am unfamiliar with a "Marten aller Arten".
There may be a bit of confusion here. The only Martern aller Arten from
Berger of which I'm aware is her 1944 recording under Karl Schmidt.
Interestingly, it is not on the Grosser Querschnitt which includes her
Welcher Kummer under Heger from 1942.
>
> The young Sutherland is pretty formidable in this aria, though lacking at
> the bottom. For that matter I can't imagine Berger had the resonance to make
> much of an impression at the bottom of Constanze's range either. But would
> like to hear it, of course.
Since I hear in Konstanze the Mozartean dramatic soprano of Fiordiligi,
Anna and Elettra, I turn to Lilli Lehmann as the only fully satisfying
singer of the aria - though I admit that Maria Cebotari, with a slightly
less dramatic instrument, makes a good case for it as well. All the
nightingales strike me as being rather peeved at their treatment;
Konstanze is ready to kill.
Mike
mric...@cpl.net
http://mrichter.simplenet.com
CD-R http://resource.simplenet.com
Mike Richter
GRNDPADAVE wrote:
>
> >From: David Shengold My apologies for getting recordings mixed up.
>
> Erna Berger's recording of "Martern aller arten" was recorded in the October
> 1947. The conductor was Josef Krips leading the Philharmonia Orchestra. The
> aria in its entirety is 7 minutes and 41 seconds.
Whoops - I forgot that one. Still, I prefer the earlier one with
Schmidt.
>
> The recital disc, issued by EMI as CDM 7 63759 2 includes the two arias of the
> Queen of the Night as excerpted from the 1937 MAGIC FLUTE, Beecham conducting
> the Berlin Philharmonic.
>
> There is a gorgeous "Caro nome" (sung in German as "Teurer Name, dessen Klang)
> from 1932 !
But don't you like the live 1944 with the never-ending trill even more?
Of all the 'solutions' to the problem Verdi posed in that aria, it's my
first choice. Besides, in the 1932, she sounds so underaged that it
seems somehow improper. After all, by 1944 she sounded at least like a
teenager, not a child.
Mike Richter
Candide wrote:
>
> --
> "
> Mark D. Lew <mark...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net...
> > In article <JJh55.411$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net>, "Candide"
> > <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
> > > soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
> > > "Doll Song".
> >
> > What do you mean by a "fach soprano"?
> ------------
> Yes, you are correct my query should have inquired regarding each specfic *fach*
> Coloratura,Lyric Spinto and German Dramatic.
Let's make a try:
For coloratura soprano (I *detest* that term), the original version of
Zerbinetta's aria and Fiakermilli's little ditty are probably
contenders. Blondchen has a tough time with respect to range (not the
high D, the low A-flat), but otherwise should be easy for a soubrette.
Butterfly's entrance (with the high D) is tough for many. Otherwise, the
more lyric would find the dramatic (and lower) arias challenging, the
more dramatic ones would be stymied by the higher, more flashy ones.
Consider Violetta: a heavier spinto will be challenged by the Act I
scena; a lighter voice may lack the weight for "Addio del passato".
German Dramatic - In different ways, different arias. "Martern aller
Arten" and "Abscheulicher, wo eilst du hin" are candidates in their
fury; the Salome finale for pitch accuracy and intensity; the Siegfried
awakening for bel canto technique; ... it goes on.
Mark D. Lew
<I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
> Yes, you are correct my query should have inquired regarding each specfic
*fach*
> Coloratura,Lyric Spinto and German Dramatic.
Ah, OK. Now the question makes more sense -- though I would still say that
any answer has to be an overgeneralization. Even within any given fach
there is great variation among individuals, and what is difficult for one
soprano may be easy for another, and vice versa.
mdl
Candide
just as with O level exams many questions seem to have more than one answer,but
really do not.
What I am seeking is an answer to what aria's, as written by the composer, would
be considered difficult or challenging. Several posts described aria's from the
Coloratura repertoire which are quite difficult indeed for a singer of average
talents. Of course we all know that many a greedy songbird will attempt these
aria's but have them transposed down or skip a note here and there to suit her
voice. Which of course is not singing the aria as written.
I am also keenly aware the voice is not a stagnant instrument and varies from
person to person and age to age. The human body has changed quite a bit from the
1700's to the 2000's and it would be foolish not to expect these changes to affect
the voice.
I have read that Mozart composed the Queen of the Night Vengeance aria with his
sister-in-law in mind. Obviously he had heard her sing before and knew she could
tackle the pyrotechnics with no problem. However today's singers usually do not
have that luxury and usually sing from the standard repertory of opera that has
been laid down over the years.
Candide
--
"Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing
himself."-Tolstoy
Mark D. Lew <mark...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net...
Candide
Mike Richter <mric...@cpl.net> wrote in message news:3956E209...@cpl.net...
>
> > Mark D. Lew <mark...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> > news:markdlew-ya0240800...@news.earthlink.net...
> > > In article <JJh55.411$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net>, "Candide"
> > > <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a
fach
> > > > soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or
Olympia's
> > > > "Doll Song".
> > >
> > > What do you mean by a "fach soprano"?
> > ------------
> > Yes, you are correct my query should have inquired regarding each specfic
*fach*
> > Coloratura,Lyric Spinto and German Dramatic.
>
> Let's make a try:
>
> For coloratura soprano (I *detest* that term), the original version of
> Zerbinetta's aria and Fiakermilli's little ditty are probably
> contenders. Blondchen has a tough time with respect to range (not the
> high D, the low A-flat), but otherwise should be easy for a soubrette.
>
> Butterfly's entrance (with the high D) is tough for many. Otherwise, the
> more lyric would find the dramatic (and lower) arias challenging, the
> more dramatic ones would be stymied by the higher, more flashy ones.
> Consider Violetta: a heavier spinto will be challenged by the Act I
> scena; a lighter voice may lack the weight for "Addio del passato".
>
> German Dramatic - In different ways, different arias. "Martern aller
> Arten" and "Abscheulicher, wo eilst du hin" are candidates in their
> fury; the Salome finale for pitch accuracy and intensity; the Siegfried
> awakening for bel canto technique; ... it goes on.
>
> Mike
>
> mric...@cpl.net
> http://mrichter.simplenet.com
> CD-R http://resource.simplenet.com
---------
Thank you for a very informative post,well done.
GRNDPADAVE
Berger was born in 1900. She was no teen-ager in the era opf electrical
recording.
Actually, my favorite recording of hers is the 1950 "complete" RIGOLETTO that
unaccountably has not yet been released on cd. It is also Warren's best studio
recording.
==G/P Dave
>From: Mike Richter mric...@cpl.net
>Date: 06/25/2000 11:42 PM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: <3956DF3F...@cpl.net>
>
>
>
>GRNDPADAVE wrote:
>>
>> >From: David Shengold My apologies for getting recordings mixed up.
>>
>> Erna Berger's recording of "Martern aller arten" was recorded in the
>October
>> 1947. The conductor was Josef Krips leading the Philharmonia Orchestra.
>The
>> aria in its entirety is 7 minutes and 41 seconds.
>
>Whoops - I forgot that one. Still, I prefer the earlier one with
>Schmidt.
>>
>> The recital disc, issued by EMI as CDM 7 63759 2 includes the two arias of
>the
David Shengold
Edda Moser is no nightingale here. Mariella Devia ( on a live Serenissima
CD) is also pretty substantial, with a solid bottom register that eludes
many with her facility at the top- and not many have her facility at the
top, the D is easy for her. Not the most ravishing middle voice in the
world, but not to be dismissed. Eleanor Steber, despite the regrettable
translation, is pretty solid too.
Yes, Lilli Lehmann is immensely impressive but I would not call her version
fully satisfying either tonally or in terms of recorded sound.
-David Shengold
> From: Mike Richter <mric...@cpl.net>
>
> David Shengold wrote:
>>
>>> From: grndp...@aol.com (GRNDPADAVE)
>>
>>> Of Mozart's more florid arias, I think "Marten aller artern" (ABDUCTION FROM
>>> THE SERAGLIO) may be most difficult. The aria is very long and requires
>>> shifts
>>> of mood as well as pyrotechnics. I have never heard it sung better than by
>>> Erna Berger in the Beecham recording of 1937.
>> The young Sutherland is pretty formidable in this aria, though lacking at
David Shengold
Nor ( as a friend points out) is it complete, and the cuts taken make it
difficult to assess Lehmann as the ultimate exponent of the aria.
-DLS
> From: David Shengold <shen...@pobox.upenn.edu>
> Yes, Lilli Lehmann is immensely impressive but I would not call her version
> fully satisfying either tonally or in terms of recorded sound.
>
> -David Shengold
>
>> From: Mike Richter <mric...@cpl.net>
zerbi...@my-deja.com
"Candide" <I'mStil...@SoThere.com> wrote:
>
> What I am seeking is an answer to what aria's, as written by the
composer, would be considered difficult or challenging. Several posts
described aria's from the Coloratura repertoire which are quite
difficult indeed for a singer of average talents. Of course we all know
that many a greedy songbird will attempt these aria's but have them
transposed down or skip a note here and there to suit her voice. Which
of course is not singing the aria as written.
>
> I am also keenly aware the voice is not a stagnant instrument and
varies from person to person and age to age. The human body has changed
quite a bit from the 1700's to the 2000's and it would be foolish not to
expect these changes to affect the voice.
*delurk*
The problem is, of course, that as you said in the above paragraph,
voices (and techniques) vary from person to person.
Given that, I would say the most TECHNICALLY challenging arias are those
written by Mozart. They sound deceptively simple, in general (think of
"Deh vieni, non tardar" or "Ach, ich fühl's," to give a few soprano
examples) but because of where they tend to lie in the voice (this seems
to hold true for most voice types) and because the voice is frequently
very exposed, they are traps that make apparent any weaknesses in a
singer's technique. Furthermore, I'd be willing to bet this is why (in
my experience) a singer will frequently be asked for the Mozart on
his/her list in an audition, if he/she doesn't begin with it--Mozart
will always show the things you most want to hide.
*relurk*
Zerbinetta
--
"TIMMMMYYYYYY!"
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
G Riggs
news:kZs55.869$VN3....@typhoon2.ba-dsg.net...
a fach
> >
> > The one she can't sing!!!!
>
> ______________
>
> *LOL* True, True!
>
> Candide
Perhaps the easiest way to get around this recurring question of different
pieces being peculiarly difficult for different singers is to take a stab
(ludicrous or otherwise<g>) at guessing which pieces would stymie the
*greatest* *number* of singers.
For instance, a Ponselle, a Leider, a Lilli Lehmann (etc.) were remarkable
for their versatility due primarily to their capacity in encompassing both
heroic phrases and intricate coloratura. (Of course, there were other
inherent contrasts in their armory as well [Ponselle and Leider had
strikingly rich coloring in their lowest notes -- even though that was only
true of Leider later on -- and so on].) That meant that, above all else,
they were exceedingly rare.
Now I see no reason to question the various pieces already nominated so far
for different "fach"s. (I will say, however, that the lowest notes in
"Martern aller Arten" have always made me regret the comparative rarity of a
Lilli Lehmann, an Eleanor Steber, a Maria Callas's et al in this aria. This
is a dramatic coloratura aria very much in the Idomeneo Elettra or the Tito
Vitellia tradition, IMO.) However, unless my server has erred in not
transmitting all the contributions to this thread, I'm not aware of any
posts that have spotlighted the heyday of the dramatic coloratura
repertoire: the first half of the nineteenth century. My candidate for Most
Difficult Piece -- *for* *the* *rarest* *kind* *of* *singer* -- would come
from something like Norma, Oberon, Nabucco or Macbeth.
Obviously, Norma's "Casta diva" is a strong candidate in this regard, but
singers have done respectably by this piece in isolation without necessarily
having the most powerful voice in the world, although clearly a flexible,
supple voice (with endless breath supply) is essential. Other sequences in
Norma, by contrast, require the fullest degree of vocal heroics, as opposed
to the nth degree of flexibility (and passages like Norma's incensed "No,
non tremare" clearly require both!).
For a really daunting piece that combines the nth degree of vocal acting and
sheer energy, potent heroic phrases down to easy chest tones, intricate
fioritura in a paradoxical(?) context of overwhelming vocal strength, a
surging high C, the capacity of switching from register to register on a
dime (and additional requirements that I'm sure I've missed), I would
nominate not an aria but the Act II trio from Donizetti's Roberto Devereux:
"Un perfido, un vile". Nominally a trio with some quite striking phrases
for both tenor (Devereux) and baritone (Nottingham), Elisabetta still
dominates this number from beginning to end -- and she's in a hell-bent fury
too!
I recognize that, not being an aria, this nomination may not really be fair.
Still, I've been racking my brains for any other piece, aria or otherwise,
that encompasses quite the contrasts this trio does, and in quite such a
*drammatico* context. Yes, there are "incensed" cabalettas in Nabucco and
Macbeth, there is the Cherubini Medee's Act III stretta(?) right before
killing her children (not necessarily a set piece, BTW), and so on. But is
there any other entirely self-contained set piece that has quite such
radical changes of mood and tessitura throughout, together with the bel
canto passagework, together with the consistently clarion vocal "face",
together with the range of over two octaves (from low Bb to high C),
together with the broad phrasing, and all the rest of it? I really wonder.
Other pieces are certainly more difficult in one or two respects than this
one (some have an even more formidable range, others have even more emphatic
orchestration, others even more intricate fioritura, etc.), but when it
comes to the entire package........
I look forward keenly to any further nominations that others may write in
after taking the time to listen carefully for themselves to this
backbreaking trio. This piece challenges, in turn, the so-called
"coloratura" (like some others here, I too have some problems with this
term, BTW), the lirico spinto, the dramatic soprano.......
Cordially,
Geoffrey Riggs
--
==============================================
The Collector's Guide to Opera Recordings and Videos
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7023
The Collector's Guide to Books on Opera
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7023/reading.htm
==============================================
Mike Richter
Don Giovanni) she sounds like she's finally left her teens, though not
by much.
Note that I did not write about her age (after all, that would be
indiscreet <G>), but about how she sounded.
Mike
--
Evelyn Vogt Gamble (Divamanque)
(unless you speak of one, SINGLE "human body" - obviously
long-decayed) the changes over the past 300 years are not
that great! Slightly taller, maybe - and healthier,
perhaps, due to better nutrition (in countries where
starvation is not rife), but basically unchanged, I think.
The main thing that separates man (meaning "mankind") from
his fellow creatures is that he adapts his environment to
suit himself, rather than adapting to his environment.
(Whether this is a good or a bad "adaptation" belongs on
some other news group, I think.)
Jon A Conrad
>Just wondering what would be the most technically challenging aria for a fach
>soprano. I'm guessing "The Queen of the Night's Vengeance Aria " or Olympia's
>"Doll Song".
I'm not sure what is meant by a "fach soprano" -- there are several fachs
(subcategories) within the general soprano Fach. Maybe there's a usage I
don't know. But in any case, The Queen of the Night's second aria probably
would indeed be on ony list of this sort, if only because its F (four of
them) is the highest note *regularly* called for in the most frequently
performed operas, and the sopranos at any given time who can reliably
supply them (and also keep the passagework clear and in tempo, and so on)
are few.
But there are other kinds of technical challenge. Aida's "O patria mia" is
very hard to do really well -- the demand for dynamic control and tonal
beauty at the range extreme, with no place to hide one's weaknesses and no
real possibility of transposition because of the scene's context, add up
to a formidable set of requirements. And the Figaro Countess's "Porgi
amor" seems to be extraordinarily hard to sing both beautifully and in
tune, more so than one would guess by looking at the notes (even on
recordings few sopranos do it really satisfyingly).
One could name many others. But in any case this is one of those questions
that's fun to think about and talk about, but which can have no final
answer. What's difficult for one voice will not be for another.
Jon Alan Conrad
Department of Music
University of Delaware
con...@udel.edu