Weird time signatures
Arthur Levine
unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
I am planning to use the music for a show I'm piecing together. So,
because of the format, extra points for pieces of duration between
4:00 - 7:00
Also, extra points if the music is GREAT, quite apart from the time
stuff.
I have posted pretty much the same request to the classical,
progressive, and jazz groups, but I thought some of the local "misc"
experts might have a few things rattling around. If so, please let me
know by posting on the net or e-mailing me.
Art Levine
ale...@epas.utoronto.ca
Ethan Evan Prater
| I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
| unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
| Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
We had a discussion like this not too long ago.
There are simply gajillions of songs in unusual time signatures. "Money"
is the most often cited.
Sting's new album has "Love Is Stronger Than Justice" in 7, though the
chorus is in four. "St. Augustine in Hell" is also in 7. "Seven Days" from
that album, soon to be a radio single, is in 5.
Rush (bad word on this group) has tons of time variations. Most popularly
"Limelight" is mostly in 7, and "Freewill" alternates between 7 and 6.
There's a ton more -- any Yes song, most Rush songs, a good number of
Floyd songs -- just open your ears, you'll find them.
--Ethan
Ethan Evan Prater -- pra...@yale.edu
------------------------------------------------------------
"And I don't have to hide my toys..." -- Klerk Kant --
Mark Schnitzius
>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
>Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
The Pixies constantly used phrases that were 3 bars long, yet had
four beats per measure. Let's see... the Hoodoo Guru's "Head in the
Sand" is in 5. The close of the Police's "Roxanne" also repeats
after 6 bars -- kind of unusual.
Mark
Paul Andresen
|> I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
|> unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
|> Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
This is pretty obscure but there's a big jazz fusion band called The Fowler
Brothers which likes odd time signatures. When I saw them live one time they
played this fantastic boogie-woogie tune that was in 19/32.
Then there's a Pat Metheny tune called (I think) First Circle. I have yet to
figure out what time sigs are used, but it's definitely bizarre (and good).
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David Thomas
>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
>Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
Jethro Tull's "Living in the Past" is in 5/4. It also made it
onto the singles charts, but didn't run nearly as long as "Money".
--
David Thomas Texas Instruments (da...@wotangate.sc.ti.com) (713)-274-2347
JEREMY CRAIG MARKMAN
: unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
Rush's La Villa Strangiato is a GREAT instrumental song. Also, it's got
numerous weird time sigs. It's on Hemispheres with a live version on Exit
Stage Left
Erik Velapoldi
> I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
> unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
> Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
>
Jethro Tull's "Living in the past" is in 5/4
Some Beatles stuff varies time signatures:
"Good Day Sunshine" -- 4/4 to 3/4
"Strawberry Fields" -- a few sections of 9
"Day in the Life" -- that groovy middle section is in 7
or 9 I think.
Otherwise, see Rush.
Erik
Charles F. Board
|> ale...@epas.utoronto.ca (Arthur Levine) writes:
|>
|> >I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
|> >unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
|> >Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
|>
|> Jethro Tull's "Living in the Past" is in 5/4. It also made it
|> onto the singles charts, but didn't run nearly as long as "Money".
Actually it did :)
US (Billboard) charts
Jethro Tull-Living In The Past: peaked at #11, 10 wks Top 40, 14 wks. Hot 100
Pink Floyd-Money: peaked at #13, 9 wks Top 40, 15 wks. Hot 100
|> --
|> David Thomas Texas Instruments (da...@wotangate.sc.ti.com) (713)-274-2347
--
***************************************************************************
*Charlie Board "I speak only for myself, my employer *
*cnc...@bnr.ca probably doesn't give a hoot about this" *
***************************************************************************
Chris Kalish
mostly in 5, although it has several sections in 3. The main riff of The Ocean
is two measures, the first of which is in 7/8, and the second is in 4. Also,
The Crunge has just about every possible time signature imaginable. That's all
I can think of now, but I'm sure there's more.
Mike Stok
>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
>Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
>
>I am planning to use the music for a show I'm piecing together. So,
>because of the format, extra points for pieces of duration between
>4:00 - 7:00
>
>Also, extra points if the music is GREAT, quite apart from the time
>stuff.
Is Turn It On Again by Genesis in 13/4? Some of the last 3 King Crimson
albums might be considered great (even if I don't know what the time
signatures are...) like Thela Hun Ginjeet and Indiscipline from
Discipline, Sartori In Tangier from Beat, Larks' Tongues In Aspic Part 3
and Sleepless from Three Of A Perfect Pair. Some of Bill Bruford's
Earthworks suff is neat as well, try Up North from the first (eponymous)
album.
Mike
--
The "usual disclaimers" apply. | Meiko
Mike Stok | Reservoir Place
Mike...@Meiko.Waltham.MA.US | 1601 Trapelo Road
Meiko tel: (617) 890 7676 | Waltham, MA 02154
Michael Locker
> In article <1993May3.0...@epas.toronto.edu> ale...@epas.utoronto.ca (Arthur Levine) writes:
> >I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
> >unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
> >Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
> >
> >I am planning to use the music for a show I'm piecing together. So,
> >because of the format, extra points for pieces of duration between
> >4:00 - 7:00
> >
> >Also, extra points if the music is GREAT, quite apart from the time
> >stuff.
The Beatles' "All You Need is Love" is in alternate 3/4 4/4 measures!
Led Zep's "The Crunge" sure sounds as though it's in an odd time sig.
I would also suspect that Yes and Rush have put out some odd time sig
stuff, but nothing comes to mind.
If you want jazz, check out Dave Brubeck's stuff.
If you want classical, try Holst, Grainger, & Vaughan Williams.
stephen clover
> In <1s4ak7$e...@bart.meiko.com> mi...@meiko.com writes:
>
> > In article <1993May3.0...@epas.toronto.edu> ale...@epas.utoronto.ca (Arthur Levine) writes:
> > >I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
> > >unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
> > >Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
> > >
> > >I am planning to use the music for a show I'm piecing together. So,
> > >because of the format, extra points for pieces of duration between
> > >4:00 - 7:00
> > >
> > >Also, extra points if the music is GREAT, quite apart from the time
> > >stuff.
He has an entire album devoted to this topic. Named _Time Further Out_ ,
it has time sig's of all sorts ie: 3/4, 5/4, 6/4, 7/4, 8/8, 9/8 etc..
--
John Curcio
>ale...@epas.utoronto.ca writes:
>> I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>
>Jethro Tull's "Living in the past" is in 5/4
Hey, that's cool.....I didn't realize that.
......
>
>Otherwise, see Rush.
Including "Limelight"...that's defintly in 7/4. "Time Stand Still" has a
bridge that is also 7/4. (and I'm CERTAIN ALOT of their stuff is in odd
key signatures.)
If you are into jazz, look into Toshiko Akiosi's band (sometimes called
Toshiko Akiosi/Lew Tabin band......though beware I'm all but certain I
spelled Toshiko's last name incorrectly).....alot of her stuff is in odd
meters. (I wish I could remember the name of the piece, but I was in a
"stage band" which did one of her numbers which had a time signature of
13 & 1/2 over 8!!!! I've NEVER seen a time signature who's top number
included a fraction!!! [And incidentally, it was a GREAT, swinging
piece!]....I should check my collection....looking through the names might
trigger my memory)
Good luck.......John C
numbers
Terry Siederer
A New Day Yesterday - Jethro Tull
Take Five - Dave Brubeck
---
Regards/Hälsningar/Groetjes
Terry Siederer
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Arthur Levine
>
>If you are into jazz, look into Toshiko Akiosi's band (sometimes called
>Toshiko Akiosi/Lew Tabin band......though beware I'm all but certain I
>spelled Toshiko's last name incorrectly).....alot of her stuff is in odd
>meters. (I wish I could remember the name of the piece, but I was in a
>"stage band" which did one of her numbers which had a time signature of
>13 & 1/2 over 8!!!! I've NEVER seen a time signature who's top number
>included a fraction!!! [And incidentally, it was a GREAT, swinging
>piece!]....I should check my collection....looking through the names might
>trigger my memory)
>
Hi. Thanks for the tip. Incidentally, if you're into really amazing
time signatures, the place to go is, as usual, India. I know about
that music already, so I didn't post on the Indian group. Some
metrical delicacies from the subcontinent: 8.5 beats (Ali Akbar Khan
on Oriental); 7.75 beats (L. Subramaniam on Waterlily); lots of
incredibly slow 14 beat cycles, etc.
Thanks
Art Levine
Jet Girl
>>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4.
The Pretenders "Tattooed Love Boys" is in 7/8 time I believe. Chrissie
Hynde apparently used to fit rhythm around her lyrics rather than fitting
the lyrics around the general rhythm/time, hence a lot of her songs change
time in the middle of a phrase or whatever.
love Joolz
--
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** "Douse hair with gasoline...set it *** JOOLZ THE JET GIRL **
** light and set it free" - PJ Harvey *** cei...@uk.ac.coventry.cck **
*****************************************************************************
matthew mcglynn
I've counted sevens, nines, and fifteens.
Enjoy.
- matt.
David Mandl
>A New Day Yesterday - Jethro Tull
Sorry, this is in 3/4 or 6/8. Not weird at all.
There are thousands of answers to this question. I don't
even know where to start, but here are some of the better known ones:
Mahavishnu Orchestra: almost anything (e.g., Birds of Fire, 9/8)
Brand X: lots (e.g., Nuclear Burn, 11/8)
Old Genesis: tons (e.g., Battle of Epping Forest, 7/4, or Watcher of
the Skies, 6/4)
King Crimson: lots (e.g., Larks' Tongues in Aspic Pt. I, 5/4, 7/4, etc.)
Jethro Tull: Thick as a Brick and Passion Play LPs (5s, 6s, 11s, 13s, etc.)
Art Bears: Rats and Monkeys, 9/8
Fred Frith: Gravity LP and many others (e.g., Spring Any Day Now, 5/4, etc.)
XTC: English Roundabout (on English Settlement LP, 5/4)
Gentle Giant: almost anything
Zappa: lots (e.g., Don't Eat the Yellow Snow, 7/4 and 7/8)
Cream: Passing the Time (7/4 with parts in 4/4)
Old Yes: lots (but do you dare to play it on your radio show?)
Fairport Convention: Tam Lin (3/4-4/4-3/4-3/4, very cool)
The Slits: Instant Hit, 5/4
Dr. Nerve: lots
Egg: Seven Is a Jolly Good Time (7/8, also 5/8, 11/8, etc., and they talk
about the time signatures as they change--great!)
--Dave.
Christopher McEvoy
"Novalis" which is in 11/8, I believe. Also Primus has a song on thier
"Sailing The Seas of Cheese" album called "Eleven" which is named for
the 11/8 time signature.
Those are all I know off the top of my head, but if you look into
Primus, and Soundgarden you'll probably find a few more. They're pretty
eccentric.
\X/
Terry Siederer
Terry Siederer
Charlie Byrne
>>
>>>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>>>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4.
Funny, as people post responses to this many of the artists are ones that are
among my favorite - I never was sure what they had in common.
I used to play keyboards for fun; we had a band played high school dances;
stones, beatles that kind of stuff.
My question is: How can someone who can keep time but is not some kind of
musical genius tell what signature a piece of music is written in?
I've always known Yes, Mahavishnu, some Zep like Kashmir etc etc had a
strange "pace", but I don't know if I could count it!
Charlie Byrne * University of Miami * Div of Marine Biology and Fisheries
4600 Rickenbacker Causeway, Miami, FL 33149 * Voice: (305) 361-4705
Michael David Jones
Actually, this album was a followup to _Time Out_, which contained the
classic piece _Take Five_, written in 5/4. Both albums are full of stuff in
odd time, such as _Unsquare Dance_, a catchy tune in 7/4, _Blue Rondo a la
Turk_, which was in 11/8, and my favorite _Three to get Ready_, which
alternates two bars of 3/4 then two bars of 4/4 throughout the piece.
Mike Jones | jon...@rpi.edu
I've seen the future and it's much like the present, only longer.
- Dan Quisenberry, 1981
A.M. Campbell
If you want *really* wierd, try the first track of the 1985 Miles Davis album
"Aura". I certainly wouldn't like to try to transcribe it!
--
%*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*%
% "At Carlops the Allan Ramsay Hotel is a long standing Belhaven outlet %
% and new licencee, Louise Walker, is maintaining the tradition with %
% fine pints of Belhaven 80/- plus a guest beer." %
% -Pints of View April-June '93 %
%#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#%
, (amc...@cus.cam.ac.uk)
P.S. Alba gu brath!
R Clement
>My question is: How can someone who can keep time but is not some kind of
>musical genius tell what signature a piece of music is written in?
>I've always known Yes, Mahavishnu, some Zep like Kashmir etc etc had a
>strange "pace", but I don't know if I could count it!
Not too difficult, try counting. Does ONE-two-Three-four-ONE-two-Three-four
fit, or is it ONE-two-three-Four-five-six or whatever. It's more difficult
to tell the difference between 3/4 and 6/8 etc, but practice makes a difference.
Then, when I count more complex time signatures, I often count alternating
bars rather than a single complex one. E.g. I count "Money" as:
Money Get Away
ONE two three ONE two Three four ONE two three ONE two Three four
I don't know if this will be damaging in the long run. Anyone?
DISCLAIMER: *PLEASE* do not assume I've got all the accents right in the
above example. (Especially since my counting example (how I do it) puts
*two* ONE accents per 7/4 bar rather than one).
Cheers,
Ross-c
Steve W Hill
Check out several songs on their most recent album (TV Sky), like "Dame
Chance" for example.
Steve Hill SH...@HARPERVM.BITNET
Network Communications Technician William Rainey Harper College
Information Systems division 1200 W Algonquin Rd Palatine IL
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u96_gb...@vaxc.stevens-tech.edu
> In article <1993May3.0...@epas.toronto.edu>, ale...@epas.utoronto.ca (Arthur Levine) writes:
> |> I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
> |> unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
> |> Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
<><><><><><><><><>
You are correct. Money is most definatly in 7/4 time.
Another band that is really big on doing odd time stuff is Rush(especially
their older stuff). You have to have a good ear though because a lot of the
songs switch time signature in the middle. Sting also has a few songs in 7 on
latest release. ....who else......oh, Yes is always good for some 5 and 7.
Similarlly anyones solo albums that are in Yes are full of odd time sigs.
If you feel like getting into jazz, then the possibilities are endless.
We played a lot of Hal Levy's stuff in my high school jazz band. Most of it
was in 7/4 and 7/8......
If you are interested in any specific recordings let me know.....
Walker Andrew John
>ale...@epas.utoronto.ca (Arthur Levine) writes:
>Mark
The start of Penny Lane changes time signature every bar,but I'm
not sure what is used
Andrew Walker
John Fereira
--
John Fereira
jo...@netcom.com
Gerald E Sylvester
>Has anyone mentioned Money, by Pink Floyd?
Just about everyone. Too late 8-)
Let me add a couple. The song "100 Years" by Blues Traveller. They
throw in bars of 9/8. "Diary of a Madman" by Ozzy is in 7/4 like
"Money." "Diary...." though is strange though. It is not a true
7/4. It is more of 7/8 + 6/8. Then again, time signatures are
only written and not heard.....sort of. It is usually easier to
write a piece (or transcribe) in a particular time sig. but whether
a piece is in 3/4 or 6/8 doesn't mean much. A 12/8 jazz piece
can just as easily be written in 4/4 with "swing" written in
below the tempo settings and still convey the same feel to
the player. I believe I read an interview with the drummer
from Jethro Tull and he said with some of their music, they have
trouble talking about particular measures of the song because they
did not label any parts of the song by specific measures and
each person in the band though of the phrasing in a different
way and therefore thought the measures were of different length (of
course, all the measures have to add up to the same amount).
Gerald Sylvester
A.M. Campbell
Sorry if this has already been mentioned but 'the Crunge' by Led Zeppelin has John Bonham
doing spectacular things with nines, eights et c.
'Four organs' by Steve Reich has a continually developing time signature that starts with
11/8 ( split into 3+8 ) and develops throughout the twenty or so minutes of the piece
until the last bar which has ( I think, although it's a while since I've seen it )
something of the order of one hundred beats in it!
And let's not forget the scherzo of Tchaikovski's sixth symphony. A 5/4 waltz that fits
its nineteenth century context like a glove!
Murray "4/4! What's that?" Campbell
--
%*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*%
% "At Carlops the Allan Ramsay Hotel is a long standing Belhaven outlet %
% and new licencee, Louise Walker, is maintaining the tradition with %
% fine pints of Belhaven 80/- plus a guest beer." %
% -Pints of View April-June '93 %
%#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#%
` (amc...@cus.cam.ac.uk)
P.S. Alba gu brath!
David Mandl
> The start of Penny Lane changes time signature every bar,but I'm
>not sure what is used
> Andrew Walker
"Penny Lane" is in 4/4. You're probably thinking of "All You Need
Is Love," which alternates 4/4-3/4 (or you can think of it as 7/4).
--Dave.
Andrew Fordham
>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4. Someone told me that
>Pink Floyd's "Money" is in 7. Very unusual, I think.
How about peter gabriel's Solsbury Hill (yes, that _is_ the correct
spelling) from his first album. It's in 7 _and_ charted. There aren't
many songs you can say that of. It's interesting to note that unlike
the new Sting stuff, which I think is obviously a case of `let's write
a song in a strange time signature,' Solsbury Hill sounds very natural
and I've even had to point out to some musicians that it's not in
common time.
Andrew
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JANET: and...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk | 2 Buccleuch Place
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John Fereira
>
>>Has anyone mentioned Money, by Pink Floyd?
>
>Just about everyone. Too late 8-)
>
I've also heard that "Will the Circle Be Unbroken" is in 3.14159.../4.
--
John Fereira
jo...@netcom.com
pcsd...@altair.selu.edu
Did I miss something here or is everyone trying to list songs with odd time
signatures?? If so, then let me add a few on the list. Try Xanadu by Rush
and La Villa Stangiato or Freewill by Rush. Well shit, try anything by Rush
they all have other than normal time.
============================================================
====== Chuck Dolese Southeastern Louisiana University =====
====== Department of Industrial Technology =====
====== e-mail PCSD...@selu.edu =====
====== "Were on a mission from God"- Elwood =====
Erik Velapoldi
That's principally because of the strong emphasis on each
beat. There is a bass drum pounding exactly "1-2-3-4-5-6-7".
A similar effect can be seen in Genesis' "Turn it on Again,"
which essentially alternates between 6/4 and 7/4 (or
3/4-3/4-3/4-4/4 depending on how you read it). The drumming is
straightforward, minimizing the disturbing effect of the time
change.
This is not always true -- Living in the Past is drummed
unusually, although a great bass line minimizes the strange
time signature. Other songs take advantage of the strange time
signature -- Yes and Genesis (whil under the influence of Peter
Gabriel) were very adept at this -- and good drummers create
bizarre drum lines.
Erik
Kenneth Jennings
Lloyd Llewellyn
are big on odd times...
Let's see-- they got one in 7, one in 5, one in 3, one that
alternates between 5 and 6, one that I don't know (anyone out there
know how to count Shotguns and Pickups?)
Primus has a few...
The Breeders have one.
PJ Harvey has a couple in 5/4...
rcm
Andrew Rogers
>>>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>>>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4.
>
>The Pretenders "Tattooed Love Boys" is in 7/8 time I believe.
Actually, it alternates between 7/8 and 4/4 during the intro and verses; the
"stop sniveling..." chorus is all in 4/4.
>Chrissie
>Hynde apparently used to fit rhythm around her lyrics rather than fitting
>the lyrics around the general rhythm/time, hence a lot of her songs change
>time in the middle of a phrase or whatever.
Not very often on the second and subsequent albums, unfortunately; I, for one,
miss the abrupt time changes so prevalent on the first.
Also, Hendrix's "Manic Depression" alternates between bars of 9/8 and 12/8;
the intro to the Allman Brothers' "Whipping Post" is in 11/8 while the rest
of the song is in 12/8. The intro to Cream's "White Room" is in 5/4 and
the rest is in 4/4.
Andrew
fr...@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu
> In article <C6I2n...@cck.coventry.ac.uk> cei...@cck.coventry.ac.uk (Jet Girl) writes:
>>>>I am looking for pop (broad term, but it will have to do) music in
>>>>unusual time signatures, such as 5/4 and 7/4.
>>
signatures--I think one is in 5/2, and there's another one maybe in
7/4 or 7/8, I forget.
Sorry I can't be more specific! :(
Dryw