Trunpets in actual use
sabel
buy?", and get hundreds of answers. Since coming back to the tpt. a few
years ago after a 35 year lay off, I have now played in numerous
amateur and professional concert bands, symphony orchestras, and
(especially) big bands, and have played with some fine and experienced
classical, jazz, and free-lance players in the nothern New Jersey-New
York area. It is my observation that fully 95% of the quality players
in this area play Bach trumpets, usually the 37 standard weight, or the
72 lightweight. In addition, I know one big band lead player with a
Yamaha, one jazzer with a Monette (plus his Bach lightweight for section
work), and one jazzer with the WT, which he swears by, and 3 players
with Schilkes. However, no matter how much Bach-bashing one reads on
this ng, Bach is THE standard out there, at least in the NY-NJ area.
Yes, and all the Bach players agree about the bad quality control, but
they still buy Bachs. George
Jerry Houston
>
<snip> However, no matter how much Bach-bashing one reads on
> this ng, Bach is THE standard out there, at least in the NY-NJ area.
> Yes, and all the Bach players agree about the bad quality control, but
> they still buy Bachs.
... then afterwards, they typically spend anywhere from $1000 - $2000
having them reworked into great trumpets. I think there's a lot to be
said for an instrument that consistently plays well right from the
factory, and everything I've read here over the last couple of years
says that ain't Bach.
This is just an idea, but maybe Bach could lower their prices, and sell
their Strads as a set of parts -- a trumpet kit? Wouldn't that make it
easier on the technicians who make a living putting them together
right?
Given today's labor costs, that should save some serious money that's
apparently being wasted by having Bach assemble 'em.
Greg Evans
>
> Bach is THE standard out there, at least in the NY-NJ area.
> Yes, and all the Bach players agree about the bad quality control, but
> they still buy Bachs.
Yeah, well, so is Win98 a standard but that doesn't automatically make it
great...
Virtuoso2B
plays jobs of all sorts. From top level studio work, to symphony orchestra, to
contemporary orchestras. He has played with many people, including all the
greats. I asked him what most people play on in the city. Because this was
the time when people were giving me flak about playing Yamaha. He said that
there is an infinite variety of horn in the city. The studios do have alot of
bachs, but there are just as many schilke, benge, Yamaha, and other around.
Classical players are even worse, they play everything. Every brand you can
think of or may hev heard of, they play. 10 or 15 years ago, it was pretty
much all Bach, but since then Yamaha, Callet, Monnet, Besson/Kanstul have all
come onto the scene in force. Bach is still one of the Big companies, with
more of their horns out there than other comapnies. The thing is now though,
there are more choices. And more QUALITY choices to pick from. There isn't
just one good company, and alot of not so good ones. there are several very
good companies producing very very good horns, much better than ones produced
20 years ago. (then there's also the thing with bach, how their horns were
better 20 years ago than they are now). But in the end, we all just play what
we like. People try to get us to try new things, and every now and then,
something we try turns out to be better. PLay what you like, play what works
best for what you do. There is no PERFECT horn out there for everyone. Some
horns suit some better. Personally, I like Yamaha and think they're amazing
horns (not to sound like a comercial).
Matthew
dennis
> This is just an idea, but maybe Bach could lower their prices, and sell
> their Strads as a set of parts -- a trumpet kit? Wouldn't that make it
> easier on the technicians who make a living putting them together
> right?
>
> Given today's labor costs, that should save some serious money that's
> apparently being wasted by having Bach assemble 'em.
very funny, but a great idea. i think you should forward it to selmer, or whoever
owns them.
--
«.--.¸¸.´¯`.º.´¯`·.¸¸..º..¸¸.·´¯`.º.´¯`·.¸¸.--.»
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change nospam to wdhill to reply to me by e-mail
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Pops
would have.
I can't consider Bach to be a pro horn because of the 2 grand retro
fits.
Pops
A collection of Net Trumpet Lessons.
http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/Delta/2429/Lessons.html
Information about my 2 books. "The No Nonsense Trumpet From A-Z" &
"Trumpet FAQ's" http://www.bbtrumpet.com
Best wishes
Clint 'Pops' McLaughlin
stanton
math (at least for me) works like this:
Used Strad 37 (lacquer) @ $700
Laskey/Pinc conversion @ $1200
Total Cost= $1900
Wild Thing= $2100
Max (silver) w/ eliptical tuning slide $1900
Monette (diamond studded)= $650,000
I'd say all things considered, I did alright with my "retrofitted" 37
<G>.
Regards to all,
SK
Jerry Houston wrote:
>
> sabel wrote:
> >
> <snip> However, no matter how much Bach-bashing one reads on
> > this ng, Bach is THE standard out there, at least in the NY-NJ area.
> > Yes, and all the Bach players agree about the bad quality control, but
> > they still buy Bachs.
>
> ... then afterwards, they typically spend anywhere from $1000 - $2000
> having them reworked into great trumpets. I think there's a lot to be
> said for an instrument that consistently plays well right from the
> factory, and everything I've read here over the last couple of years
> says that ain't Bach.
>
DHoff56012
>in this area play Bach trumpets,
I think many of us grew up with Bachs, and if nothing else it's what we are
used to. To me nothing else has quite the "familiar" feel. But I agree that
quality control is woefully lacking. I took an opposite approach and found me
a '40 New York, and have been extremely happy with it. And it cost me less
than a new one, all told.
David Hoffman
JWorleyjr
standard 37 ML ect... The ones with the 65 bells or anything out of the
ordinary probaly was built in the Bach shop. Judging from my observation, they
seem to be put together with more care and consistency.
Around the SF Bay area, there are players playing everything from Yamaha,
Benge, Bach, Cahlichio, Schilke and King Legends. That is the horn I play.
2070 large bore. I took off the modular valve caps to brighten up the horn a
bit. I like the way the horn speaks and how versatile it is. I use it for
lead, jazz,swing, motown, classical ect...I've had alot of different horns and
so far the King is my favorite.
John L. Worley Jr
Tootman
if they could make a trumpet like his (or was it, "why they couldn't ?").
Their response was to not sell parts to Tottle anymore. That didn't do a
lot of good as Tottle just bought their bells from another dealer.
> > This is just an idea, but maybe Bach could lower their prices, and sell
> > their Strads as a set of parts -- a trumpet kit? Wouldn't that make it
> > easier on the technicians who make a living putting them together
> > right?
> >
> > Given today's labor costs, that should save some serious money that's
> > apparently being wasted by having Bach assemble 'em.
>
du...@my-deja.com
play. I believe many modifications are just like heavy valve caps...
nothing more than the placebo effect at best. Usually these mods just
ruin an otherwise good horn. Most of the posters to this NG are just
plain horn junkies. Monnette and Laskey et. al. depend on these guys
for their livings. Get a horn and practice. Bach, Schilke, Yamaha,
whatever.
Nobody cares what you play, but most pros do play Bach Strads for much
of their work. It is a great all 'round trumpet. I've earned my living
on several horns, but I always come back to the Strad. The one I play
now is less than a year old and is an off-the-shelf horn.
Dulia
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
EarleSlick
share a quote that's certainly food for thought:
"....I don't really care. I try to get the best instrument I can, but whatever
instrument I have to play, I play. Ultimately, your sound is is just your
personality being projected. That's really your sound...... The difference
between a tube with a hole in it and a trumpet is really not that great. It's
a matter of mechanization. The sound that you're going to project comes from
you. Everything else is an academic argument........" Wynton Marsalis
quoted from the interview with Mark Swed copyrighted 1994 /attachment from
"The London Concert...Wynton Marsalis and the English Chamber Orchestra////earl
slick
just my opinion...I could be wrong
David Griffin
a Funny Car racer as saying "any ol' car will do...as long as it has four wheels
and roles." I'm not sure this Wynton quote proves the antithesis, but it comes
close.
David
EarleSlick
>Oh, come on. Quoting Wynton Marsalis on how trumpets are all alike is >like
quoting
>a Funny Car racer as saying "any ol' car will do...as long as it has four
>wheels
>and roles." I'm not sure this Wynton quote proves the antithesis, but it
>comes
>close.
>David
Two things....first of all, David wrote me a nice email in addition to this
response which I appreciated...(after all I'm only the messenger.) More
importantly, I'd really like to recommend the particular video and recording
(and interview) which I referred to in my previous post again copied below. It
really is a superbly played rendition of Haydn's Concerto for Trumpet and
Orchestra in E fl major. Also included is Hummel's Concerto for Trumpet (3
movements) (Wynton playing a SHILKE E Trumpet and one Shilke E trumpet with a
Bach Bell); also, Leopold Mozart's Concerto for Trumpet and Orchestra In D
Major. And last but far from least is the included interview I referred to
with Wynton conducted by Mark Swed. Although I wish it were longer, Mark's
questions are as intelligent and comprehensive as I've seen presented to Wynton
and it provides a valuable insight into both the musician and this music from
Wynton's perspective. I'm confident anyone, but especially conservatory
students, will gain much from both hearing _and seeing_ these familiar pieces
played by Wynton.///earl slick
DizzysBluz
and
Orchestra in E fl major. Also included is Hummel's Concerto for Trumpet (3
movements) (Wynton playing a SHILKE E Trumpet and one Shilke E trumpet with a
Bach Bell); also, Leopold Mozart's Concerto for Trumpet and Orchestra In D
Major. And last but far from least is the included interview I referred to
with Wynton conducted by Mark Swed.>>>>>>
If this is the same recording I'm thinking of (one WM did when he was but a
youth), I've heard the man publicly apologize for having even made this
recording. When asked about the recording he replied, "Sorry about that one,
man --- I didn't know any better."
If it's a newer recording than the one from '82 (?date), it would be
interesting to compare the two side-by-side and hear his different approaches.
WH
Bookman
DizzysBluz
Don't you mind your own business?
If you've got something to say about the topic at hand, say it. Otherwise, I've
got nothing to explain to you, or to anyone else besides the other party who is
involved. And, since I've already communicated with him about that, there is
nothing further I wish to say about it to you, or anyone else, for that matter.
Sorry, but you're out of line, pal (as usual).
Howard Peirce
> A long time ago Ghitalla showed the Bach folks a Tottlephone and asked them
> if they could make a trumpet like his (or was it, "why they couldn't ?").
> Their response was to not sell parts to Tottle anymore. That didn't do a
> lot of good as Tottle just bought their bells from another dealer.
As much as I hate showing my ignorance.... What's a Tottlephone?
HP
EarleSlick
>If this is the same recording I'm thinking of (one WM did when he was >but a
>youth), I've heard the man publicly apologize for having even made this
recording. When asked about the recording he replied, "Sorry about that one,
man --- I didn't know any better."
>If it's a newer recording than the one from '82 (?date), it would be
>interesting to compare the two side-by-side and hear his different
>approaches.
It's from 1994, and not a re-release. (Wynton appears more or less as he does
today, only a few pounds lighter) and it really is superbly played, and again
it's actually on video. The interview I referred to is a supplement to the
video. It's released on the Sony label. ///earl slick
DizzysBluz
does
today, only a few pounds lighter) and it really is superbly played, and again
it's actually on video>>>>>>
Very interesting, indeed. I'll have to check it out. Thanks for the info....I
wonder what Wilmer thinks of this date *hint, hint*
EarleSlick
>Very interesting, indeed. I'll have to check it out. Thanks for the info....I
>wonder what Wilmer thinks of this date *hint, hint*
Don't leave us hanging with this "hint hint" stuff or I may erroneously start
presuming that "Wilmer" may actually be........
Also, I might add, in regards to that video...I've seen videos of Wynton with
the Jazz Messengers taped back in the early 80's; He was quite thin and
appeared to be in his late teens to low 20's. In this particular video, he
appears to be much more filled out, so to speak, and possibly in his low to mid
30's, (far closer to as he appears today) although I've never been very good
and guessing ages. I would guess Wynton should be about 38-39 years old these
days. So, based on those guestimates, this should definately be a much later
performance....and it really is superbly played.///earl slick
DizzysBluz
start
presuming that "Wilmer" may actually be........>>>>>
Oh no...that's not what I meant at all. Wilmer is indeed Wilmer and Wynton is
someone else.
After having met Wilmer Wise, and having the pleasure of hearing him play live,
I greatly respect his opining on many topics. Coupled with the fact that Wilmer
often counts himself in the company of WM, I thought it would be interesting to
hear any behind the scenes anecdotes which he may be privy to.
dennis
> After having met Wilmer Wise, and having the pleasure of hearing him play live,
> I greatly respect his opining on many topics.
i think a list of recordings that wilmer has participated in, probably is one of the most
varied and eclectic anyone could lay claim to. including one of the most bizarre recordings
ever done: "Jesus blood has never failed me yet" by gavin bryars.
some of the comments by listeners after a canadian pbs station played the whole thing,
had me in tears laughing. ( http://www.radio.cbc.ca/programs/takefive/jesus.html )
i had to stop and recoup before i could finish the whole article.
an excerpt:
"Did somebody die in the control room Thursdays? I hate to think that anybody
would have inflicted something like whatever that was on purpose. It is
still going on, and on, and on. If anybody does read this, could they please
check to make sure there isn't a medical emergency. BUT FOR GOD'S SAKE DO
SOMETHING!!!!!!!!!!!! "
after reading this whole page, i had to buy the cd! (it is interesting meditation music).
WWise72606
Don't leave us hanging with this "hint hint" stuff or I may erroneously start
presuming that "Wilmer" may actually be.. >>
When I met Wynton in 1978 he was SKINNY.
He was very young,but he played great.
A few years ago I met Sergei Nakariakov,he was SKINNY and played great.
Maybe these guys practiced when they should have eaten :-)
Sergei has an interesting father :-(
Stage father.
He's a great kid though.
Two super players.
Wilmer
WWise72606
HP
>>
It is a tunable belled trumpet with a fourth valve.Or maybe I have the Voison
horn in mind.
Wilmer
Dr. Trumpet
wwise...@aol.com (WWise72606) wrote:
The fourth vavle was a rotary as I recall that in effect made the horn one
step lower. B rian Moon should have the complete scoop on these horns.
Will the man from Detroit please continue the discussion of the
Tottlephone? :-)))))
DizzysBluz
He was very young,but he played great.
A few years ago I met Sergei Nakariakov,he was SKINNY and played great.
Maybe these guys practiced when they should have eaten :-)
Sergei has an interesting father :-(
Stage father.
He's a great kid though.
Two super players.>>>>>>
Hmmmm...what are you trying to say, Wilmer? <G>
Being the complete neurotic that I am, I'm a little concerned that you're
trying to tell me something..... but then neither is Mr. Jaudes a lightweight
;-)
Anyway, you have to know that I wasn't trying to disparage WM in any way,
right? I happen to like his playing of late very much..
Tootman
nephew, Bill Mazzocca (out of the business as far as I know). I believe
that some had a 4th valve that raised the pitch up a step.
WWise72606 <wwise...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990816174149...@ng-ck1.aol.com...
Tootman
has been cleared up.
DizzysBluz <dizzy...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990816123314...@ng-xc1.aol.com...