Yamaha flugels, the 631 or 731?!?
Brad Meyer
set on getting a Yamaha. I've been told the 631 has a more mellow sound,
but the 731 is more responsive. In the show "Blast!" they got Ben, the
awesome and outstanding flugel soloist, playing a 731. Man did that sound
good! Anyways, if you have any info that would aid me in my decision, I'd
very much appreciate it. And by the way, dont turn this into a Michael
Schmidt topic again. Thanks,
LeadTrumpetGuy
SiegTrmpt
>set on getting a Yamaha. I've been told the 631 has a more mellow sound,
>but the 731 is more responsive.
I've been playing my 731 now for over 22 years and have no desire to replace it
with anything else. Great instrument and a nice clean mellow sound. Don't know
about the 631. I added a third valve trigger since it didn't come with one
originally. Bill
Douglas Waterston
represents silver plated
Model: YFH-631
Years: 1972-
Key: Bb
Bore: .433"
Bell Size: 6"
Finish: Lacquer
Model: YFH-6310Z
Years: 1998-
Key: Bb
Bore: .413"
Bell Size: 6"
Finish: Lacquer
Current Model: Current
Model: YFH-635T
Years: 1986-1997
Key: Bb
Bore: .413"
Bell Size: 6"
Finish: Lacquer
Current Model: YFH-6310Z
Model: YFH-731
Years: 1972-
Key: Bb
Bore: .433"
Bell Size: 6"
Finish: Silver
"Brad Meyer" <hornyp...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:39d94397$0$99051$726...@news.execpc.com...
> I've been looking into getting a flugel for a while now, and I'm pretty
well
> set on getting a Yamaha. I've been told the 631 has a more mellow sound,
SiegTrmpt
>represents silver plated
>
Nope. The 631 has a valve section that is more like a conventional trumpet and
the 731 looks like a traditional flugelhorn with the valve tubes pointed
downward. Bill
Jim Donaldson
>>Aren't they the same instrument - the "6" represents
>Nope. The 631 has a valve section that is more like a
>conventional trumpet and the 731 looks like a traditional
>flugelhorn with the valve tubes pointed downward.
Well, neither one of these opinions is exactly right. The 631 has a rose brass
bell and is lacquered; the 731 has a yellow brass bell and is silver plated.
The difference is significant. Otherwise, however, they are the same
instrument.
Both have traditional vertical valve slides. The Yamaha YFH 2310 "standard"
flugel has the horizontal valve slides and trumpet-like large bore, and is
priced several hundred dollars less.
Jim Donaldson
Denver Colorado
JFDon...@aol.com
The Schilke Loyalist
http://www.dallasmusic.org/schilke
Jim Donaldson
>Anyways, if you have any info that would aid me in my
I would think your time would be well spent purusing the following:
Flugelhorn Guide
http://www.dallasmusic.org/gearhead/Flugelhorn%20Guide.html
Frank Bloise
"SiegTrmpt" <sieg...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20001002231155...@ng-cd1.aol.com...
betwenn the 631 and 731 is silver plating.
http://www.yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/DsplyModel/?gTCF00009YFH-631
http://www.yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/DsplyModel/?gTCF00009YFH-731
KC
>"Frank Bloise" <fbl...@earthlink.net> wrote INCORRECTLY:
> If you check out the Yamaha site you will see that the only difference
> betwenn the 631 and 731 is silver plating.
> http://www.yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/DsplyModel/?gTCF00009YFH-631
> http://www.yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/DsplyModel/?gTCF00009YFH-731
>>
Frank,
With all due respect, if you would take the time and click on the
"specifications" link for each of the above flugels, you would note a
difference in the bells as well as the finish.
I have a 631 (thanks John Lynch), and chose it over the 731. I prefer
silver on most of my horns, BUT I chose the 631, which is a laquered
horn because the rose bell delivered a darker sound to me.
Nice looking is good.....Nice sound is better.
Kevin
Josh
better model.
"Douglas Waterston" <dwt...@nospam.netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:8rbia1$ss...@imsp212.netvigator.com...
BillBarbS1
OOPS! I guess this is my first mistake for the new millenium :) Way back in
the dark reaches of my memory I thought what is now the YFH-2310 had a number
in the 600 range. A quick look at the new catalog says the 631 has a red brass
bell and Lacquer finish and the 731 is silver plate with a yellow brass bell.
Mine is the 731 which I like a lot. I added a third valve trigger later as I
thought it was needed for better tuning on the c # and d rather than "lipping"
it. Somebody help me out...what was the number for the 2310 in the 70's and
early 80's. Bill
KC
and
> early 80's. Bill
Bill, that would be the YFH-231. It was made from 1974-1984 and
replaced in 1984 by the YFH-2310.
Kevin
M Magers
know, what's been said before is correct, that the differences are that
the 631 is lacquer and has the rose brass bell where the 731 is silver
plated and has a yellow brass bell. They are both clones of the old
classic Cousenon, and are almost identical except for the bell material
and finish, aren't they?
Michael E. Schmidt
Yamaha flugelhorn but it is harder to find .
The 631 is darker but the difference in sound is very small , the quality of
sound ( timbre )is better on the 631 , the 731 has a brighter tone .
Michael Schmidt
----------
In article <20001002230111...@ng-cd1.aol.com>, sieg...@aol.com
SiegTrmpt
Thanks Kevin, I was hoping it was in the 600's but I guess I'll just have to
eat some crow on this one. I remember some folks preferred this model to the
731but I liked the 731 in silver. I'm going to my music room to put on a
patterned shirt, a floppy hat and play some of Chuck's tunes!
Dave Lee
>Yamaha flugelhorn but it is harder to find .
Can you qualify this statement with some type of evidence, please? Or, did you
mean to say, 'In my opinion.....'
Dave Lee, J.D.
Dave Lee
>731but I liked the 731 in silver.
That's true, I've heard people say, as well as read a few posts here that the
231 was a nice horn, comparable in ways to the 631 and 731. I don't play a
Yamaha flugel, so I can't comment personally.
Dave Lee, J.D.
M Magers
231s and they were very good horns. I think they were supposedly
student horns, but they were definitely great horns if they were student
line instruments. Our 231s were yellow brass, all in lacquer. Playing
the 231s is what got me interested in a Yamaha 631, the only flugel I
have ever owned.
Michael E. Schmidt
----------
In article <20001004085522...@ng-bg1.aol.com>,
dave...@aol.comspamnot (Dave Lee) wrote:
>>he rose brass Yamaha 631 flugelhorn is a better horn than the silver 731
>>Yamaha flugelhorn but it is harder to find .
>
> Can you qualify this statement with some type of evidence, please?
I did Dave, as I said it is darker,the silver horn is very bright which is
not what you want from this type of flugelhorn, the rose brass horn is not
only plated differently, but is made of a different alloy which is one of
the reasons for the darker , fatter tone, I guess the type or amt of copper
in the alloy creates that darker sound. Or, did you
> mean to say, 'In my opinion.....'
Well... I talked to a lot of people like Jake McLein before I bought my
horn,and those who I spoke with all said that the rose brass flugel plays
better, and after / comes in because the rose brass horn was / is back
ordered. (Remember that I have to get a new horn because a partition wall in
the recording studio fell on my new 631 and destroyed it- ouch )
Michael Schmidt, L.T.D.
> Dave Lee, J.D.
Dave Lee
>not what you want from this type of flugelhorn, the rose brass horn is not
>only plated differently, but is made of a different alloy which is one of
Again, is this not ones opinion??
Dave Lee, J.D.
Dave Lee
"brighter" playing of the two. If this were the case, everyone would hop on the
631, no? I know a fair share of locals the really like the 731, and others who
simply like the sound of a silver flugel. By all means, if the sound of the 631
is what you are looking for, then I naturally would agree that it is more
suited, rather than a better horn, for your needs.
Dave Lee, J.D.
Brad Meyer
You see, today I brought home my Jazz Band director's flugel, an old 631!
Is this horn beautifull or what? However, I think a silver plating could
enhance the tone a little, and be more responsive to the nuances I like to
add into my playing. One thing you have all overlooked, however, is that if
the rose-brass bell has a more suitable flugel tone in it, then why not just
get a 631S (a silver-plated 631). Please let me know, because now I'm
really caught up in the decision to get a silver 631 or a 731. I'm looking
for a mellow tone, yet with enough edge to be really jazzy. Am I making
sense?! Thanks,
LeadFlugelGuy (a.k.a. LeadTrumpetGuy)
Hee hee
SiegTrmpt <sieg...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20001004205443...@ng-da1.aol.com...
> > I know a fair share of locals the really like the 731, and others who
> >simply like the sound of a silver flugel.
>
> I like my 731. I have no basis to compare to the 631 but I like the sound
of
> the 731 enough to not feel the need to shop around. I'd probably like the
631
> too. I tend to prefer silver on my instruments for a little more ring in
the
> sound. Bill
SiegTrmpt
Dave Lee
>sound.
Precisely my point. It's the sound one is seeking that determines the decision
as to which horn. To simply make a blanket statement that the 631 is the better
horn of the two is almost absurd.
Dave Lee, J.D.
Dave Lee
>>sound.
And, I must admit, I have a silver Eterna Flugel. It plays reasonably well for
my needs, which really doesn't amount to more than playing downstairs in my
basement for a captive audience ( my daughter).
Dave Lee, J.D.
Dave Lee
Dave Lee, J.D.
BillBarbS1
I liked my Getzen Eterna Cornet enough to sell my large bore Bach. Nice
sounding instrument. Bill
BillBarbS1
>the rose-brass bell has a more suitable flugel tone in it, then why not just
>get a 631S (a silver-plated 631).
I'll bet the 631 is a nice horn. Since I've stepped in it earlier I'm not
going to present this as fact. The red bell looks cool in it's own right and a
coat of silver would make it look like just another bell. Appearances make a
difference even if it is just the psycological affect of having a style
instrument you like. Bill
Jim Donaldson
>...then why not just get a 631S (a silver-plated 631). Please
a silver 631 or a 731.
Mostly because Yamaha doesn't made a 631S. The design dates to a time when
Yamaha's lacquered horns had model numbers like 6XX and the silver plated horns
had numbers like 7XX, with the first digit indicating the quality level (pro,
student, or intermediate) and finish. As has been pointed out, the horns have
the some body, but different bells and finishes and the bell material and
finish each contribute to the sound difference between the two. The 631 has a
lacquered rose brass bell, the 731 (under the silver plate) has a yellow brass
bell.
Showing once again that consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds, Yamaha's
predecessor to the current YFH 6310Z flugel was the YFH 635T (it came with a
third valve trigger). It came in silver also, which was disignated the YFH
635ST. Alas.
It is interesting to note that the Yamaha brochures from a couple of years ago
described the tone of the 631 as "clear and light" and the 731 as "darker," for
whatever that is worth.
RHAAPANEN
than other flugelhorns, so I use a very deep funnel mouthpiece, a Stork Custom
11, and I like the dark sound that it gets. The trigger helps me play in tune,
although it gets hung up occasionally.
Roger H.
Dave Lee
>ago
>described the tone of the 631 as "clear and light" and the 731 as "darker,"
>for
>whatever that is worth.
I thought I was imagining things. I remembered this but could not get the
gumshum to say it for fear I had it backwards. Thanks Mr. Donaldson.
Dave Lee, J.D.
M Magers
means by those terms because the 631 is plenty dark. It would be hard
for it to be anything else, the way it is made. The rose brass bell,
the lacquer, etc. all contribute to it getting a typical flugel sound.
Probably either one would be suitable.
Dave Lee wrote:
> jd wrote:
> >It is interesting to note that the Yamaha brochures from a couple of years
> >ago
> >described the tone of the 631 as "clear and light" and the 731 as "darker,"
> >for
> >whatever that is worth.
>
BillBarbS1
>although it gets hung up occasionally.
I put a stronger spring on and have had no problem since.
Michael E. Schmidt
The Rose Brass played darker than the silver,the silver is brighter and the
rose brass is darker, period.
Michael
----------
In article <20001005090445...@ng-cl1.aol.com>,
dave...@aol.comspamnot (Dave Lee) wrote:
> a
Michael E. Schmidt
Besides, the horn can only take you so far, the mouthpiece and the player of
the horn also factor into the tone.
Michael
----------
In article <39dbe344$0$56642$3929...@news.execpc.com>, "Brad Meyer"
<hornyp...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Yes! I think this is what I'm looking for...
> You see, today I brought home my Jazz Band director's flugel, an old 631!
> Is this horn beautifull or what? However, I think a silver plating could
> enhance the tone a little, and be more responsive to the nuances I like to
> add into my playing. One thing you have all overlooked, however, is that if
> the rose-brass bell has a more suitable flugel tone in it, then why not just
> get a 631S (a silver-plated 631). Please let me know, because now I'm
> really caught up in the decision to get a silver 631 or a 731. I'm looking
> for a mellow tone, yet with enough edge to be really jazzy. Am I making
> sense?! Thanks,
>
> LeadFlugelGuy (a.k.a. LeadTrumpetGuy)
> Hee hee
>
> SiegTrmpt <sieg...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20001004205443...@ng-da1.aol.com...
D. Neuman
731 are great horns with beautiful characteristic mellow tone. In my
estimation there was only slight difference between the two. The 731 is
slightly brighter.
In my trials I also tried the Yamaha "Z" flugel, the Bobby Shew model. This
horn was a lot easier for me to play, with an freer high register. However
IMO it was more bright than I like. I am sure that with proper mouthpiece
selection this would be a prime choice. I also noticed that (at least for
me) the intonation on the Z was better in the bottom register than either
the 631 or 731 both of which are sold without the 3rd slide trigger which is
standard on the "Z".
"Brad Meyer" <hornyp...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:39dbe344$0$56642$3929...@news.execpc.com...
> Yes! I think this is what I'm looking for...
> You see, today I brought home my Jazz Band director's flugel, an old 631!
> Is this horn beautifull or what? However, I think a silver plating could
> enhance the tone a little, and be more responsive to the nuances I like to
> add into my playing. One thing you have all overlooked, however, is that
if
> the rose-brass bell has a more suitable flugel tone in it, then why not
just
> get a 631S (a silver-plated 631). Please let me know, because now I'm
> really caught up in the decision to get a silver 631 or a 731. I'm
looking
> for a mellow tone, yet with enough edge to be really jazzy. Am I making
> sense?! Thanks,
>
> LeadFlugelGuy (a.k.a. LeadTrumpetGuy)
> Hee hee
>
> SiegTrmpt <sieg...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20001004205443...@ng-da1.aol.com...
Dave Lee
I didn't write the brochure, and this was quoted from another post, so you
should give the credit to whom it is due.
And I'm sure I said more than -
>dave...@aol.comspamnot (Dave Lee) wrote:
>> a
Dave Lee, J.D.
BillBarbS1
>rose brass is darker, period.
>Michael
>
Individual playing style sure can play a role as well as audience vs.
performers perspectives. Type of hall can play a role in perceptions as well
as the temperature (let's not start again). Subjective descriptions are just
that... Subjective. One persons light and bright can be anothers heavy and
dark. Period? Bill
johnk...@gmail.com
With all due respect I am going to make a slight correction here:
Though it is not currently offered in silver plate, the Yamaha 631 was offered in silver in the past. I bought my Yamaha 631 in 1977 from Schilke back when they were on South Wabash Avenue, and it was silver plated. Now, courtesy of John Lynch, it has a trigger and is gold plated. John did a gorgeous job on it, as he was with all the horns he's done for me.
Cheers,
John Mohan