Leather for Reeds

W.D.

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Apr 15, 2004, 8:14:15 AM4/15/04

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Hello,

I'm looking for a good and reliable source of leather skins in various
weights for accordion and concertina reeds. The leather must be
strong, soft and the spring like.
I bought some leather in tree different places but it doesn't work
like the leather in older accordions. New leather is too thin and
requires support.

I own small paper cutter so I can cut my own strips for accordions and
concertinas and I hate to pay from $.20 - $1.00 for pre-cut leather
valves for reeds. Any suggestions? Please writet to wj...@snip.net.

Thanks,
W.D.

Jim C

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Apr 15, 2004, 9:10:04 AM4/15/04

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--- use...@d-and-d.com wrote:
> Really-Reply-To: wj...@comcast.net (W.D.)
> Really-From: wj...@comcast.net (W.D.)

Have you tried going to Staples and getting some mylar? There was a
post earlier about using mylar that was rough on one side and gluing it
on with super glue. I've also seen mylar sold for reed valves on ebay
and on the internet.

It is used on the Sonerex and it sounds great.

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Ike Milligan

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Apr 16, 2004, 6:15:09 AM4/16/04

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"Jim C" <lite...@tir.com> wrote in message
news:2004041512571...@web12505.mail.yahoo.com...

>
>
> --- use...@d-and-d.com wrote:
> > Really-Reply-To: wj...@comcast.net (W.D.)
> > Really-From: wj...@comcast.net (W.D.)
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I'm looking for a good and reliable source of leather skins in
> > various
> > weights for accordion and concertina reeds. The leather must be
> > strong, soft and the spring like.
> > I bought some leather in tree different places but it doesn't work
> > like the leather in older accordions. New leather is too thin and
> > requires support.
> >
> > I own small paper cutter so I can cut my own strips for accordions
> > and
> > concertinas and I hate to pay from $.20 - $1.00 for pre-cut leather
> > valves for reeds. Any suggestions? Please writet to wj...@snip.net.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > W.D.
>
>
> Have you tried going to Staples and getting some mylar? There was a
> post earlier about using mylar that was rough on one side and gluing it
> on with super glue. I've also seen mylar sold for reed valves on ebay
> and on the internet.
>

I don't know if Mylar is sold for this purpose, since the so-called plastic
valves are actually vinyl. The whole post about Mylar made no sense to me
whatever. Super Glue is not something that I would advocate, since it is
very problematic to remove. That whole post made about as much sense to me
as the e-mail question I got asking if you could make reed plates by etching
them with acid. I will be selling accordion repair supplies sometime this
year, and will be having the Hohner-style vinyl reed valves. Meanwhile you
can order an actual sized list, an then get them from the Hohner Co. by
calling 1-800-446-6010.

--
www.1accordion.net

Jerry Tierney

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Apr 16, 2004, 8:40:05 AM4/16/04

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Dear W.D.,

I remember, "back in the day" there was an outfit called TANDY LEATHER.
They were like a hobby shop for those people who tooled leather and
made wallets, belts saddles. They also sold big pieces of leather.
They are long gone from Philadelphia but still may be somewhere. Boy
scouts still get leather wallet kits from somebody.

Remember when you cut leather for reed valves you have to cut it some
particular way, with or across the grain. I can't remember. You'll have
to find out.

Best wishes, Jerry Tierney

J. Coon

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Apr 16, 2004, 3:55:05 PM4/16/04

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Hey guess what? They are still around.

http://www.tandyleather.com/

Jerry Tierney

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Apr 16, 2004, 5:25:05 PM4/16/04

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My sister 9 years my junior was a horse woman even though we didn't
have a pot to piss in.

I actually made her a saddle when we were both kids. I loved Tandys,
the smell of the place. It wasn't till years later that I actually
touched a horse. I still have the tools. Jerry

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John C.

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Apr 16, 2004, 6:10:05 PM4/16/04

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We used to have a Tandy Leather place in Washington DC as well. I
think I still have a box of tools around someplace as well. I don't
think that you would want to use leather from Tandy's on your
accordion. I understand that the leather used in accordions is
especially tanned with non-acid solutions and then soaked in some
chemical or the other so as not to cause corrosion when in contact
with the steel or to absorb water.

John C.

Jerry Tierney

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Apr 16, 2004, 8:10:05 PM4/16/04

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Dear Jim,

I have bought large pieces of leather. Again way back when, and cows
have really thick skin. Have you ever noticed how hard it is to insult
a cow? You had to really figure where you needed thick and thin on the
pattern. When they make nubic (SIC) leather shoes they split it. I
can't imagine that tanned leather diverts from the "normal" way for
accordions. It is a real nasty process with salt based chemicals.

Now here is what we do best. Those salt based chemicals would leave
salt based residues. That would resist water. Subsequent treatments
will make it more or less supple. Thickness and grain direction would
be the issue I think.

I remember that they had all kinds at Tandy. Thinner for more sensitive
applications.

It's funny when I first started to deal with these reed valves I bought
women's leather gloves at the Salvation Army and cut my own reed
leathers on a small paper cutter. Needless to say It didn't work.

I recently bought a selection of reed leathers, bass and treble from
Derffner. There were 7 sizes 2 thicknesses.

I also bought what they called leather reed cement. It came in a 1 oz.
jar with a screw top. I think that it is "Liquid nails" Not even a
class one adhesive like you would use for vinyl tile. It went hard in
that container in about two weeks. It worked well enough and tought me
that shellack is not the current method of gluing down the leathers. I
am going to return the glue rock with suggestions for packaging (they
charged me $7 I think, I can't find it in the catalog right now.)

I bet that guy with all the reed info(Johann) knows about this subject.
He was amazing.

Best Wishes, Jerry

Jim C

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Apr 17, 2004, 12:10:08 AM4/17/04

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Insult a cow, hell I was raised on a farm and they didn't care what I
called them. As long as they were fed, milked, and the poop shoveled
they were happy. I didn't try making any leathers myself, I got some
of them and some wax from Castigleoni. I tried shellac and it was a
pain in the butt, so I just started using Duco cement. It works just
fine so far.

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Ricky Dietsch

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Apr 17, 2004, 12:22:01 AM4/17/04

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About 8 months ago I had a long dialog with Tandy. I sent them sample
leathers and tye could not match them.
They did not have much interest in tryng to find the leather, even with the
prices being cahrged for the pieces.

Ricky

Johann Pascher

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Apr 17, 2004, 4:55:05 PM4/17/04

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Really-Reply-To: Johann Pascher <j_pa...@yahoo.de>
Really-From: Johann Pascher j_pa...@yahoo.de

Jerry Tierney did Write:

> I bet that guy with all the reed info(Johann) knows about this subject.

Yes may be I know a little abut this subject too.

I did some posts before on this subject.
But I never did explain a lot abut Leater valves.

I personally prefer Leather valves, or Leather valves in combination
with additional layers of Mylar.
I don’t like to use Contact cement or other now ways of gluing Leathers
to the frame. I also don’t use the old Italian way Shellac.
I use plain pain tree rosin in soft consistence, May be it is not the right
Explanation in English language. This can be cleaned with alcohol again.
In the first place it looks the leather keep not firm to the frame but I
don’t have problems with loose leathers. If the rosin is just a few
weeks old one can easily take off the Valves and put it on again without
renewing the rosin. I know this is not the way it is dune today! But on
old days all leathers here in Austria ware glued to the frame this way.
I also like the smell of the rosin. And the rosin keeps the Leather soft
for a long time. Old leathers can easily cleaned again, and with new
rosin added al is in working condition again foe decades. If I have to
use Leather valves in combination of Mylar, the Mylar is glued to the
leather with modern contact glue like you would use to mend Leather shoes.

I could explain how to make Leather valves oneself, but it would be very
difficult not being able to show what make the difference.
The main problem is the leather "Type" itself.
So I recommend not making them one self.
You must have contact to special Leather suplay. You could bay leather
from Organ part suppliers, the sell lather for valves in whole skins.
But easier is to bay the Valves.

I do get some Valves from:

Moritz Grimm
Zwoterer Straße 31
D-98248 Klingenthal
Tel.: 0049 3746722656
Fax: 0049 3746722656
e-mail: moriz...@musikwinkel.com

He also supplies Leather for some Italian Manufactures and he sends the
Leathers all over the world for repairs.

Mr Grimm can supply every valve leather or plastic
And he sends it all over the world also in small quantities.

Just send a fax or phone. He is not relay familiar with email
somebody else answers the mails.

If you do not need a special bill he would send the leathers
In a Letter to You. I am sure to bay is very uncomplicated.

He sends the staff to Italy, Australia, USA, and all over the world.

You would find a price list but not up to date.
1,8MB scanned picture of an A4 page not zipped.
http://elektor.htl-leonding.ac.at/~jp/de/h/bilder/preisl-moritz-grimm.jpg

I think the price is very reasonable, because he produces Valves now for
a long time. And what make a difference is, he knows what Leather is
needed to have perfect Valves.

All the best to you all, Johann

Jerry Tierney schrieb:

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Ike Milligan

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Apr 17, 2004, 8:09:31 PM4/17/04

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"J. Coon" <lite...@tir.com> wrote in message
news:40803930...@tir.com...

That's good to know. However, accordion leather is made by a special
process. Tandy doesn't have it, as far as I know. You now have to get it
from Italy. You cut so that it doesn't stretch when pulled..

Johann Pascher

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Apr 18, 2004, 5:10:06 AM4/18/04

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Really-Reply-To: Johann Pascher <j_pa...@yahoo.de>
Really-From: Johann Pascher j_pa...@yahoo.de

Hallo Walter (W.D)!

I had a look through my links and I looked up the web page of weiblein
again.
May be you are interested in looking through this pages as well.
Most info is in German Language. The price list is in English too.
The sell parts for Organ building and repairs.

I remember an other German supplier similar to weiblein but I cant
recall the name at the moment.
May be you do have similar online supply’s in the Sates as well.
Still I think you are better off to bay the Valves.
I hope you also did see the last post on this subject, and Moritz Grimm.
Did you download his Price list?
This pricelist is a scanned A4 sheet with real leather valves samples
glued to the sheet.
So you would see a lot of details of the Valves.
1,8MB scanned picture of an A4 page.
http://elektor.htl-leonding.ac.at/~jp/de/h/bilder/preisl-moritz-grimm.jpg

Weiblein:

http://www.weiblen.de/homepage.htm
http://www.weiblen.de/katalog/katalog.htm
http://www.weiblen.de/katalog/katalog.htm#v

catalogue with leather:
http://www.weiblen.de/katalog/43katalog2002s.43.pdf

Preislist:
http://www.weiblen.de/plistee.pdf

Leather info:
http://www.weiblen.de/infoblaetter/lederangebot.pdf

All the best to you, johann

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Dennis Gurwell

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Apr 18, 2004, 12:25:07 PM4/18/04

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Isn't/wasn't Tandy also the company that owned (Allied) Radio Shack
back in the day?

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Jerry Tierney

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Apr 18, 2004, 5:25:05 PM4/18/04

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Dear Johann,

All that I can say here is thank you very much for all that you have
shared with us.

Best wishes, Jerry Tierney

w.d.

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Apr 19, 2004, 8:59:15 AM4/19/04

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Jerry Tierney <jerry....@verizon.net> wrote in message news:<8FE35779-8F9E-11D8...@verizon.net>...

Hi Jerry and others,

I discovered another place in New Jersey. The Leather Supply House in
Garwood, New Jersey owned by Mike M. He supplies special hide glue and
the leather to organ builders. His address is: 345 Hazel Ave.,
Garwood NJ 07027 www.leathersupplyhouse.com tel 908-389-1000. Mike
sells very good leather for making gussets for bellows.

Mike is very nice fellow to deal with, however, he was not successful
to locate for me special skins for the accordion valves, although he
sells the leather used for that purpose that was manufactured in
chromium process. I even have provided the sample of different leather
from old accordion valves.
May be someday he finds those sources for me too. I like to cut my own
leather strips for the reed valves. This way I can control my work
better and its much cheaper when dealing in valume. As I said before,
I have my own small 19" professional paper cutter that I use for
bending of bellows stock, leather and tape.

The hot glue hide glue that Mike sells in granules is good for
attaching thick reed valves for basses or helikon reeds, and the
bellows work and all other accordion projects. The reed plate must be
clean from oily substance and the litte application of shellac to bare
metal is very appropriate prior to attaching any reed valve. This was
disussed here before and its work.

The glicerine is added to make the glue more flexible if needed. Salt
is added to extend its drying time but I do not add the salt. I prefer
to work very fast. Be careful! Litte bit of shellac on the tongue
inside at the end changes the tone so check the reed in provino before
attaching it the block with wax.

Enjoy it,
W.D.

~Dream~

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Apr 19, 2004, 9:29:26 AM4/19/04

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just a quick mention - leather for "experimental" purposes in thickness
and quality quite useful for Accordion can often be found among the
sheet "Samples" at the higher qualty Furniture stores (that carry
Italian leather sofa's, etc.) the size of their "samples" is tiny
compared to a sofa, but is huge compared to what you need to make
a hundred valves, or new pads, or even a gasket.

I don't know about the salt/impurities content, but I did wash some
samples of the Natuzzi leathers in condensed water, checked the TDS with
my water meter, and it was not significantly higher than a control
sample.
Where I have used pieces, I have seen no discoloration or other
signs of acidification on surrounding materials (reed plates, etc)

not a solution for most of you I realise, but for home repair folks
IMHO this is a decent and economical source of supply... (take one
of the salespeople out for lunch in return for the older samples
they no longer need)

Ciao

Ventura

Johann Pascher

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Apr 19, 2004, 3:25:05 PM4/19/04

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Hi, Jerry Tierney!

Thank you, for telling me that you appreciated the info I could share
with you and all others interested in mending accordions in a way one
would not regret the changes later.

I also would like to say thank you to all others on this group who did
share information.
And it is great that a lot of people tell their experiences in this forum.

Special thanks also to Donald Nichols and Stephen J. Navoyosky.

The next few weeks, I rather will be reading since I don’t have mach
time (have to do some work outside) , but if special questions came up I
may jump in again.

Fedrick Mike

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Feb 16, 2024, 7:47:10 PM2/16/24

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