chinese hohners

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bouzouki

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May 1, 2005, 8:18:24 PM5/1/05
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Whats with all this chinese crap? Does anyone know what Hohner
accordions and squeeze boxs are NOT MADE IN CHINA? I hear that the
Panther, the Double Ray and even the Corona II and III are slugged out
there.

Ike

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May 1, 2005, 11:19:34 PM5/1/05
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"bouzouki" <zul...@i-plus.net> wrote in message
news:117as8a...@corp.supernews.com...

> Whats with all this chinese crap? Does anyone know what Hohner accordions
> and squeeze boxs are NOT MADE IN CHINA? I hear that the Panther, the
> Double Ray and even the Corona II and III are slugged out there.
Just because it's made in China codsn't mean it's junk. The Hohnica line is
contracted out by Hohner in China, but other lines of PA's are made with
Hohner's own machinery in China by Chinese technicians trained by Hohner in
Germany. The button boxes have similar quality control. I think only the
custom made accordions are now made in Germany, but I can find out what
Hohner says and get back to you. Or maybe other people would have an opinion
in the NG..

bouzouki

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May 2, 2005, 9:11:16 AM5/2/05
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It's not only "quality" that I'm concerned about, I don't knowingly
spend money on stuff made by the commies. I can't seem to find out
anything from Hohner. This may not be news to some, but I discovered
this while trolling ebay and researching a Hohner concertina and the
HA2815 pokerwork button accordion. Most of the "Italian" accordions on
ebay turned out to be commie made when the sellers were pressed for the
answer.

gazzapt

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May 2, 2005, 10:40:05 AM5/2/05
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> >
> > Just because it's made in China codsn't mean it's junk. The
Hohnica line
> > is contracted out by Hohner in China, but other lines of PA's are
made
> > with Hohner's own machinery in China by Chinese technicians
trained by
> > Hohner in Germany. The button boxes have similar quality control.
I
> > think only the custom made accordions are now made in Germany, but
I can
> > find out what Hohner says and get back to you. Or maybe other
people
> > would have an opinion in the NG..
> >

The Chinese made Hohners are garbage in my opnion. Terrible keyboard,
bellows action, basses. The only thing worse than playing one is
playing one of the E soprani boxes that are made not far from china.
Some of the cheap russian accordions are just as bad. You pay for what
you get.
Regards
Gary Blair (scotland)

>

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Ike

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May 2, 2005, 2:23:55 PM5/2/05
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"gazzapt" <gary....@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:d55de...@eGroups.com...

>
>
>> >
>> > Just because it's made in China codsn't mean it's junk. The
> Hohnica line
>> > is contracted out by Hohner in China, but other lines of PA's are
> made
>> > with Hohner's own machinery in China by Chinese technicians
> trained by
>> > Hohner in Germany. The button boxes have similar quality control.
> I
>> > think only the custom made accordions are now made in Germany, but
> I can
>> > find out what Hohner says and get back to you. Or maybe other
> people
>> > would have an opinion in the NG..
>> >
>
> The Chinese made Hohners are garbage in my opnion. Terrible keyboard,
> bellows action, basses. The only thing worse than playing one is
> playing one of the E soprani boxes that are made not far from china.
> Some of the cheap russian accordions are just as bad. You pay for what
> you get.
> Regards
> Gary Blair (scotland)
>
Gary, are you talking about button accordions or PA's? If PA's is it Hohnica
or Bravo, etc.?
--
www.1accordion.net

Ike Milligan

Wendy

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May 2, 2005, 3:12:18 PM5/2/05
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Hi all. Without commenting on the socio-political aspects of this
thread:

My understanding is basically the same as Ike's. Hohner's Bravo and
Amica lines are A-OK *amateur* instruments (the Amica being noticeably
better all around). I wouldn't care to go on stage or into a recording
studio with one, but I'd recommend them to my students. Hohnicas, on
the other hand, are little more than accordion-shaped objects, no
better than Parrots, built cheap for those who look only at price. All
are made in China.

IMO, the only modern Hohner piano accordion that can be compared in
quality with the much lamented German-built Atlantic, or even Concerto,
Tango, etc. would be the two Morino models, which are still made in
Germany. How these stack up to older Morinos, I don't know, I haven't
played them. There is a gaping price differential between the Amica and
the Morino. Prices, and the Hohner blurb which is surprisingly free of
hyperbole, can be found at http://hohnerusa.com/apiano.htm. Perhaps
someone on the ng who has a modern Morino would care to comment.

In button boxes, AFAIK, only the Corona II Classic and the Club models
are still made in Germany. All others, including all the one and two
row boxes, and the Corona II, are made in China. I'm not 100% certain
about the Corona III - I thought I recalled Rick Epping telling me they
were also made in China, but a check of the pricing would seem to
indicate German manufacture. The concertina is made in China.

The Corona II Classic is OK but definitely not up to former
German-built Corona standards. The Panther has the same innards and
shell as the Chinese-built Corona II; production costs were lowered by
skimping on cosmetics and accessories. The sound is not to my taste,
and I'm not enough of a buttonbox player to criticize the action,
except that it doesn't seem as smooth as my old 31/16 German built
Hohner.

There has been some confusion on eBay (and probably elsewhere, in
stores and private transactions) regarding the origin of the
Chinese-built Coronas. Hohner is not exactly blaring from the rooftops
the news that nearly all of their accordions are now MIC. The cardboard
box they come in is often marked with Hohner's import stamp and the
word "Germany" - my guess is some, if not all, of them are shipped from
China to Hohner in Germany and from there to distributors. Since the
accordion itself is not marked "Made in China", some folks on either
side of the transaction have assumed that it's German made. How do you
distinguish a Corona II from a Corona Classic? Simple. The Corona
Classic is stamped "Made in Germany" on the accordion. If you don't see
this, the accordion was made in China.

/Wendy Morrison
Accordion Specialist, House of Musical Traditions

Squeezy

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May 2, 2005, 3:32:35 PM5/2/05
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The Chinese Honer button boxes are better quality than the old German made
ones, and mine has a very simple but very effective modification that makes
playing more comfortable - makes you wonder why the originals were not
modified like this.
dave
"Ike" <accordiond...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:%eude.2968$7F4....@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...

Russ Gray

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May 2, 2005, 8:19:24 PM5/2/05
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When I talked to hohner a while ago they told me that ALL The 3 rows
are built in China - the Classic and the ones that say made in germany
are sent to germany after being made in china for finishing touches.

I have an old 70s Corona II and i have played a panther which was not
that bad at all. Many Many 3 row players (including the pros) are
playing the new Classics and IIs with no complaints so I don't think
they are 2 bad.
russ

bouzouki

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May 3, 2005, 12:49:54 AM5/3/05
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Thanks again for all your help and straight answers. I guess I will be
saving for something Italian made.

Wendy

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May 3, 2005, 2:37:12 PM5/3/05
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Or, you might save some bucks by getting an older Corona II, mid-1960's
or thereabouts. They show up on eBay from time to time; nothing there
right now. Few years ago, I found a nice circa 1965 Blackie there, good
price, didn't need much work, although a couple notes have gone a
little out of tune since I bought it. Also got a IIIR, which I sold
last year for what I paid. The Blackie is for sale at
http://www.klezmusic.com/sbx-pix/sale.html if you're interested.

If you can afford to wait, keep an eBay eye peeled for listings from
idif - he's a pal of mine from Italy - when he lists an accordion you
can be sure it's a goodie.

/Wendy

Ike

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May 3, 2005, 6:29:42 PM5/3/05
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"Wendy" <klez...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1115061138....@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Thanks for that thoughtful and eloquent crtique! There is one thing I would
have said a little differently, and that is, about Parrot accordions (like
the Hohnica line). I had known someone who played a 96 bass Chinese Parrot
on the stage with a Zydeco group. I tuned it, and found that the reeds were
rather inferior steel, but all-in-all it was a useful instrument, admittedly
inferior to the Scandalli it was a copy of, because of the reeds, but
playable. The tuning was interesting in that,the lower-pitched treble reeds
being brought up to the right tremolo, it was then in tune with itself. I
guess the lower pitched reeds weren't staying in tune with a lot of playing
as well as the higher register did.
--
www.1accordion.net

Ike Milligan

Eric von Daeniken

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May 3, 2005, 6:32:07 PM5/3/05
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Speaking of accordions, the most expensive models like Gola and Morino
are made in the Trossingen factory.
Parts of some mid-priced models like the Atlantic are made in Italy or
Czech Republic. The Alpina's are italian made.
The cheapest "crap" models like the Amica's are made in China, but most
R&D work and prototype testing for those models is also done in the
Trossingen factory.

panda_baerchen

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May 3, 2005, 9:40:04 PM5/3/05
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--- In squee...@yahoogroups.com, usenet@d... wrote:
> Really-Reply-To: bouzouki <zuldare@i...>

> Thanks again for all your help and straight answers. I guess I will be
> saving for something Italian made.
>

Don't forget, there are many communists in Italy, too! ;)

David Tong

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May 6, 2005, 6:01:17 AM5/6/05
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Can't see why anyone would consider the Amicas to be 'crap' models...

I saw a pre-production Amica in sliced-in-half form at the Frankfurt Music
Messa the year before they came on sale. Very impressed by the application
of modern materials and manufacturing techniques in a way designed to
minimise the need for craft work and so as to allow volume manufacture.

I bought one new about a year ago to take on holidays and as a 'party'
accordion but found I enjoyed playing it far more than I expected. The
manufacturing quality is excellent.

Here's what I like about it:

1. The compression is very good (no air seepage).
2. The treble keys have a nice precise action with no rattle. (Each treble
key is separately removable if ever necessary).
3. The bass mechanism is a self-contained module (Hohner-style) with fewer
sympathetic twangs and rattles and less susceptible to transit damage than
the normal arrangement.
4. The bass buttons have a graded and uniform action (probably because of
(3) which lets me vary the bass volume independently of the treble to some
extent. (The fact that the buttons are consistent in travel and the air
supply to the four bass voices seems to close off at the same rate means you
can use the effect in playing).
5. I also like the Hohner tuning (not too wet, not too dry).
6. The straps are nylon, fasten quickly and easily, take up hardly any
space, and have no metal buckles to wreck your chair backs or clothes.
6. Even the case is nice - it's moulded into a conformal shape with
conformal internal padding and gives far better protection than the classic
case made of what seems like thick cardboard.
7. Unlike the small Weltmeister instruments which otherwise are fairly
comparable (I have the Rubin) the bass has four voices instead of three.
This makes it sound much more civilised and less oom-pah-pah.

The only thing I don't like about the Amica 48 is that the weight balance is
too far to the bass end for me. I solved that by replacing the top strap
support with a home-made cantilevered support. This puts the effective
support point slightly over the bellows.

I think it's a great pity the Italian industry doesn't want to compete in
this type of market (lower cost through higher volume, good quality).

I've no affiliation with Hohner - I just like the product - Chinese made or
not.

--
David Tong

[Please replace 'invalid' with 'com' to reply].
"Eric von Daeniken" <globaler...@UPPERCASEbluewin.ch> wrote in message
news:4277fbe7$1...@news.bluewin.ch...

Ike

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May 6, 2005, 10:08:52 AM5/6/05
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I hope Hohner, Inc. reads this about the balance of the strap bracket and I
think they are likely to. It would be great if that were improved. I'm told
some of the other models have 2 ways you can fasten the straps on.
--
www.1accordion.net

Ike Milligan

"David Tong" <gz...@btinternet.invalid> wrote in message
news:d5ff9d$4oh$1...@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...

David Tong

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May 6, 2005, 11:57:54 AM5/6/05
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Ike,

Actually, it does have two strap positions. The top hook is like the
standard 'chromed rod bent into a U-shape' arrangement, but there are two
U-shaped bits on it instead of one. You just slide the strap from one to
the other. Snag is, both of them are too far to the treble side for good
balance. They couldn't get them any further towards the bass because of the
bellows. My bodge puts the hook over the bellows.

I took the fitting off, mounted a flat piece of wood onto the original
fixing holes using spacers to stand it off about half an inch, and so it
projects over the bellows. I then fitted the bracket onto the piece of
wood. It looks, and is, crude but the improved balance makes it worthwhile.
('Plan A' was to use that just as a feasibility test and then 'do it
properly' - but seems I'd rather spend the time playing it!).

Given proper bending gear, it should be feasible (especially for Hohner) to
make a bolt-in replacement (equivalent to my wooden piece plus original
bracket) all out of one piece of rod, but the shape you need is too complex
for me to tackle.

I think it's a pity that Hohner stopped making the Student V. That combines
good powerful sound and good balance and is the lightest 48-bass I've ever
weighed. I've had one for years but it's got a bit too beaten up and I got
the Amica 48 as the next best replacement.

--
David Tong

PS. Thanks for all your interesting and constructive contributions to this
group over the years. I always read them even though I mostly lurk.


[Please replace 'invalid' with 'com' to reply].

"Ike" <accordiond...@mindspring.com> wrote in message

news:UTKee.4866$7F4....@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...


>I hope Hohner, Inc. reads this about the balance of the strap bracket and I
> think they are likely to. It would be great if that were improved. I'm
> told
> some of the other models have 2 ways you can fasten the straps on.
> --
> www.1accordion.net
>
> Ike Milligan
>
> "David Tong" <gz...@btinternet.invalid> wrote in message
> news:d5ff9d$4oh$1...@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
>> Can't see why anyone would consider the Amicas to be 'crap' models...
>>

snip


Ike

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May 6, 2005, 3:17:01 PM5/6/05
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The 48 bass they make now only has 26 keys. the old 48s had 33 or so keys.
BTW I think I have a couple of those somewhere in storage. I have so many
accordions to fix up, and not enough time, plus repair and tuining jobs
coming in all the time. Your old 48 could have probably been fixed upwith
new bellows, hardware and reed work. I wish I had more time to work on
accordions, but my wife has been recovering form surgery, and my 10-year-old
goes to a school which expects me to enslave him at home with their homework
which he has trouble understanding, although he is actually rather
intelligent, but he has issues with language skills. The other hooligan kids
in the neighborhood are always making a ruckus, since their parents have
even less time to spend with them than I do wih mine. People are forced to
work long hours to make ends meet, both parents, and then with what little
time they have left they are zonked out and lie around watching TV instead
of paying attention to their kids. Plus, I'm expected to be sociable which
is where I usually have to draw the line. Oh well, if I spent less time on
usenet, I would have more time to work
--
www.1accordion.net

Ike Milligan

"David Tong" <gz...@btinternet.invalid> wrote in message

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Pete Nalda

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May 7, 2005, 2:40:05 PM5/7/05
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Man I'm glad to see someone step up onto the plate on this as I'm a big
fan of high quality hand made instruments as much as the next guy, but
I was really impressed with the Hohner Panther 3 row. It actually out
played a German Corona II in terms of ease and responsiveness.

On May 6, 2005, at 5:01 AM, use...@d-and-d.com wrote:

> Really-Reply-To: "David Tong" <gz...@btinternet.invalid>
> "David Tong" <gz...@btinternet.invalid>
> Really-From: "David Tong" <gz...@btinternet.invalid>

> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
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"Egun On, Lagunak!!" (Basque For "G'day, Mates")
Pete

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Ike

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May 8, 2005, 1:15:14 AM5/8/05
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"Pete Nalda" <na...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:13DEED1F-BF10-11D9...@sbcglobal.net...

>
> Man I'm glad to see someone step up onto the plate on this as I'm a big
> fan of high quality hand made instruments as much as the next guy, but
> I was really impressed with the Hohner Panther 3 row. It actually out
> played a German Corona II in terms of ease and responsiveness.

Could that have to do with the airtightness? Also the Corona II never had
really very good reeds, They were just barely adequate. matbe better reeds
are cheaply available now than when the Corona II was made. I just received
a new model of another brand with Czech reeds and the cost was comparable to
the Corona II. The playability and responsiveness of the reeds was
fantastic. I'm not saying more about it until the makers get some bugs
ironed out.

dennis

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May 8, 2005, 12:16:19 PM5/8/05
to
Aren't most of the Corona II's mde in China now? A few years ago I had
a chance to play a Corona III that a friend of mine had purchased on
eBay. He said it was Chinese-made. It was very playable. It seemed
every bit as good as any German-made Corona II I had ever played.
However, I owned a brand-new Hohner Amica for awhile. The balance was
terrible on it. The bass side kept pulling down so that the treble side
was perpendicular to my chin.

David Tong

unread,
May 15, 2005, 10:47:16 AM5/15/05
to
Denis,

Interested to hear that you also found a balance problem with the Hohner
Amica. Mine is the 48-bass, which model is yours? I'm curious to know if
they've got the balance wrong on all of them.

--
David Tong

[Please replace 'invalid' with 'com' to reply].

"dennis" <denn...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
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MK

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May 27, 2005, 3:17:58 AM5/27/05
to
Dear accordion friends,

I have played the Parrot and Hohnica and also now play a wonderful Zero
Sette, and hey - now I am even a recording artist!! - hey!! hey!! ho ho
- so maybe you might like to hear what I noticed about how the Parrot
and Hohnica accordions compare to eachother... Plus...

If someone is putting off buying their first accordion to save up for a
top notch or even middle price range brand, I'm not so sure it's the
best idea - but it does sound like a good way to put off having to put
ones self thru the time consuming and sometimes frustrating (but always
rewarding) process of beginning to learn to play.

;-)

I always say I started off with a Parrot, but actually I keep forgetting
that my first accordions were actually very good ones - a very well
maintained like new vintage Petromillis 120 bass that my dad found for
me back in the land of Frankie Yankovic, and I also had a couple of
vintage button boxes (one of them cost a lot of money to tune and both
were very special antiques). However, I learned to play on none of these
really good accordions!

Only after I bought what I could tell would FIT did I get a foothold on
playing. And, I bought the most economical accordion I could find, but
not the bottom of the Chinese line (although some might disparage that
they are all lower than the bottom - ha!). Also, only after starting to
"play out" as part of our group did I have enough motivation to practice
enough.

So, I have now said in a very long fashion that I think you should not
wait to get an accordion just because you think you might not get a
great one first time out of the gate. I have heard many smart people in
this group say to just get one that will work and that is economical,
and then after you grow out of it, sell it. That is what worked for me,
and I recommend it as well. But, now about those accordions and the
differences...

I found that the Hohnica is not all that different from the Parrot,
because a funny thing happened as I was thinking of selling my Parrot. I
got a great deal on a like new (really like new) Hohnica on ebay,
because I decided to have an economical accordion for playing in
situations where I did not want to take my new 07, and was actually
surprised to see Made In Shanghai on it!

I had a Hohnica and Parrot to compare side by side, and can tell you
that there really is not much different about the two and it was like a
toin coss (coin toss) to decide between the two. But there are some
little differences you might like to know about. The Hohnica keyboard
naturally lays vertical and the Parrot tipped a few degrees toward the
left. (Note that I recently noticed an expensive Saltarelle being played
on a video clip, and it was tipped more than the Parrot, so some
expensive accordions or accordionists tip them too I guess.) The
keyboards both feel the same when playing. They both have a longer
"travel" to the keys and compared to the expensive keyboard, I feel as
if I must "manhandle" the 2 Chinese accordions in order to play them.
But, so what. Neither Parrot or Hohnica keyboards felt different from
eachother. Regarding the sound, the Parrot was a very teeny slight bit
off of 440 tuning but it was evenly off for all keys and it was not out
of tune. I don't know if this is wet or dry or whatever, but it was fine
and I think caused a little extra musette sound. The Hohnica however is
tuned right spot on. The difference was not discernible except for on
the tuning meter. It was impossible to say one was better than the
other. (I got compliments on the sound of both accordions!) The cases
were of comparable quality. So, there, not much difference really. Oh,
lastly, the bellows were more stiff than the 07 of course, but neither
bellows was stiffer than the other, and I played for hours at a time and
did not get sore. Both accordions did get less stiff over time and yes
they were stiffer than the expensive accordion.

So, I am still glad that when I bought the Parrot as a beginner, because
money mattered and I chose the $200 cheaper Parrot instead of the
Hohnica. However, I guess I decided to sell my Parrot and keep the
Hohnica for playing in crowds (with swinging bagpiper drummers and
people close to me etc...) probably because I like the vertically
balanced keyboard and used to tape the Parrot to get it to lay vertical
(which it did).

The keyboard on the 07, on the other hand, has less travel in the keys,
and they play with a much lighter touch. That does not mean you need
such a keyboard in order to learn to play! My old Petromillis was like
this, and I did not learn much on it. But, comparing the good keyboard
to an economical one, - - well - - It's like having a match trigger on
your rifle as opposed to a heavy pulling trigger. It takes more finesse
to play the 07, but I play that Hohnica once a month in the crowd and
get used to it right away.

I also think that a person should get something inexpensive to start,
learn to play, then go for it and buy the top of the line and don't even
bother with middle priced or middle quality items. (But, that preference
is probably due to a personality trait, rather than "sound science.")

;-)

Hope this "Survey of Comparative Chinese Accordion 101" helps you. I
would have liked to have read a post like this when I was trying to
decide what to get. But, figured it out anyway and am having a great
time.

My only disclaimer is that I am not playing solo classical accordion in
a symphonic or competition setting, and have no interest in that kind of
music. But, we make a good tune and - hey - hear it now
http://Aufrance.com/gairin/ - Celtic Music - Click on the Demo CD to
download our playing Just for Fun!

Hugs to all you accordion news group people,

Mary Kay

Ike

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May 28, 2005, 11:12:45 AM5/28/05
to

"MK" <mkaREM...@aufranceREMOVTHIS.com> wrote in message
news:4296C9...@aufranceREMOVTHIS.com...
> Dear accordion friends,

>
>
>
> I had a Hohnica and Parrot to compare side by side, and can tell you
> that there really is not much different about the two and it was like a
> toin coss (coin toss) to decide between the two. But there are some
> little differences you might like to know about. The Hohnica keyboard
> naturally lays vertical and the Parrot tipped a few degrees toward the
> left. (Note that I recently noticed an expensive Saltarelle being played
> on a video clip, and it was tipped more than the Parrot, so some
> expensive accordions or accordionists tip them too I guess.) >
> So, I am still glad that when I bought the Parrot as a beginner, because
> money mattered and I chose the $200 cheaper Parrot instead of the
> Hohnica. However, I guess I decided to sell my Parrot and keep the
> Hohnica for playing in crowds (with swinging bagpiper drummers and
> people close to me etc...) probably because I like the vertically
> balanced keyboard and used to tape the Parrot to get it to lay vertical
> (which it did).
>
> The keyboard on the 07, on the other hand, has less travel in the keys,
> and they play with a much lighter touch. That does not mean you need
> such a keyboard in order to learn to play! My old Petromillis was like
> this, and I did not learn much on it. But, comparing the good keyboard
> to an economical one, - - well - - It's like having a match trigger on
> your rifle as opposed to a heavy pulling trigger. It takes more finesse
> to play the 07, but I play that Hohnica once a month in the crowd and
> get used to it right away.
>
> Mary Kay
>

Others writing to the ng have complained that the Hohnica isn't balanced
well. Was this a 72 bass?

More comments from anyone about balance particularly on Chinese made
accordions?

MK

unread,
Jun 1, 2005, 10:08:43 PM6/1/05
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Ike wrote:
> Others writing to the ng have complained that the Hohnica isn't balanced
> well. Was this a 72 bass?
>
> More comments from anyone about balance particularly on Chinese made
> accordions?

Hi Ike! Yes, it is a 72 bass and balances perfectly up and down. I saw
those other posts too and noticed they seemed to be about more expensive
models, but may have missed someone complaining about the Hohnica
balance. Anyway, mine is veritical. It does take some "manhandling" to
play, and some teachers might think that is not so great for a student,
but I would be a lot less devastated if the Scottish drum playing lady
next to me at Mulligan's Pub whacked the Hohnica instead of my 07.
(Terrible thought in either case!)

;-)

MK

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zach :::

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Jul 12, 2021, 11:34:11 PM7/12/21
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Lol what a fucking dumbass. "The commies"

Gaines Milligan

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Aug 18, 2021, 5:20:17 PM8/18/21
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you are lucky to even get accordions at any kind of reasonable price
that aren't total junk.
The Chinese Hohners are fair quality. The reeds are good enough steel to
be tuneable unlike other Chinese brands. The German-trained Chinese ree
makers make mistakes so sometimes a reed in a new accordion needs to be
replaced, but this is a rare occurrence.
People buy them and use them, and are happy because they might not have
seen anything better.
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