Sticky Key on Cajun Accordion
happypo...@hotmail.com
ago, and it was working fine up until about last week when I noticed
my 6th key on the right side was sticking when I released it, I am
almost positive it isn't due to another substance that got spilt or
something into the key so I'm wondering what the cause might be, I've
checked to the best of my ability trying to find out what it is but
really have no idea, the accordion is about 7-8 years old, but wasn't
used a whole lot as far as I know, it is in great condition otherwise,
so does anyone have an idea what might be causing the key to stick, or
how I can check and/or fix it?
Bruce
(snip)
> so does anyone have an idea what might be causing the key to stick, or
> how I can check and/or fix it?
There are a number of causes. A relatively frequent one is a
spring that's not strong/tight enough. But usually, it's humidity.
The pivot part of the key is wood on most one-rows. It will swell
enough to pinch down on the metal rod that it's supposed to pivot on.
Also, it is made to fit quite closely in a slot milled in a wooden
fingerboard -- the reason it's tight is that if it were to be loose,
the whole thing would wobble around. If the key pivot swells (or if
the slotted area in the fingerboard swells) this will pinch the key,
too.
One good way to check this out is to put the box in a dry place
(air conditioned or de-humidified room - maybe a local library would
let you leave it there overnight -- or an airing cupboard etc.) and
see if that helps. If it's humidity, the problem is around that
pivot. Probably the best way to tackle it is to pull the metal pivot
rod, watch what happens very carefully with the top two or three keys
then be prepared to reassemble them correctly in reverse order. Once
you have the rod out, carefully relieve the sides of the key pivot
area (or the slot in the fingerboard if you see something like a wood
"burr" but usually it's best to smooth down the sides of the key; it's
easier to keep the areas flat -- but be careful and don't remove too
much). If it's the key sticking to the rod, that's harder. You'll
have to find a way to remove a miniscule amount of wood from the pivot
hole; maybe a set of number/letter drills would be the way to go. I'd
polish the rod in that area, too.
One thing you *shouldn't* do is to put any kind of oil or grease on
the area. It will attract dust and gum things up even worse. I've
heard people recommend graphite-lube (the "dry" kind, not graphite in
oil) but I've never tried it and I'd be leery of it.
HTH, BH
(PS DAMHIK .... )
DoN. Nichols
> On Oct 31, 11:20 pm, happypotatod...@hotmail.com wrote:
> (snip)
> > so does anyone have an idea what might be causing the key to stick, or
> > how I can check and/or fix it?
>
> There are a number of causes. A relatively frequent one is a
> you have the rod out, carefully relieve the sides of the key pivot
> area (or the slot in the fingerboard if you see something like a wood
> "burr" but usually it's best to smooth down the sides of the key; it's
> easier to keep the areas flat -- but be careful and don't remove too
> much). If it's the key sticking to the rod, that's harder. You'll
> have to find a way to remove a miniscule amount of wood from the pivot
> hole; maybe a set of number/letter drills would be the way to go.
If the rod is a precise standard diameter (inch or metric,
depending on where it was made -- measure with a micrometer), what I
would try is a hand reamer -- which are available both very slightly
oversized (for clearance fits) and very slightly undersized (for press
fits). Also, number or letter sized drills tend to pull into the hole,
thanks to the spiral nature of the flute -- good for pulling chips out
of the hole when drilling, but with a hole just slightly undersized, it
will grip the flutes and pull the drill quickly into the hole. And if
the drill is powered by a drill press or even a hand-held electric
drill, it might split the key.
The reamers have straight flutes, and a short bevel on the end
which does the actual cutting.
An alternative might be a drum sanding which fits inside the
hole. used with a Dremel -- carefully.
> polish the rod in that area, too.
Right -- if you have a bench grinder, put a cloth wheel on it,
and load it with something like jeweler's rouge to get a very nice
finish on the rod.
> One thing you *shouldn't* do is to put any kind of oil or grease on
> the area. It will attract dust and gum things up even worse. I've
> heard people recommend graphite-lube (the "dry" kind, not graphite in
> oil) but I've never tried it and I'd be leery of it.
The dry graphite would not attract dust or gum things up, but it
might drift into the reeds and jam them.
Good Luck,
DoN.
--
Email: <dnic...@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
Bruce
> If the rod is a precise standard diameter (inch or metric,
> depending on where it was made -- measure with a micrometer), what I
> would try is a hand reamer -- which are available both very slightly
> oversized (for clearance fits) and very slightly undersized (for press
> fits). Also, number or letter sized drills tend to pull into the hole,
> thanks to the spiral nature of the flute -- good for pulling chips out
> of the hole when drilling, but with a hole just slightly undersized, it
> will grip the flutes and pull the drill quickly into the hole. And if
> the drill is powered by a drill press or even a hand-held electric
> drill, it might split the key.
>
> The reamers have straight flutes, and a short bevel on the end
> which does the actual cutting.
>
> An alternative might be a drum sanding which fits inside the
> hole. used with a Dremel -- carefully.
Hi, DoN. Good info. The rod in question* is the rod that the
keys/buttons pivot on. I haven't measured one but "about the size of
the lead in a standard wood pencil" would be about correct. Your
point about a standard number/letter drill pulling into the hole is a
good one - we're talking about a very small hole and even a much
smaller amount of material to be removed. I was thinking that it
might be possible to take a very small piece of emery paper, roll it
up "like a cigarette" with the abrasive on the outside, and insert
that in the hole but likely the hole is too small for this; but this
may be possible.
(* Original poster didn't specify the make, place of manufacture, or
age of instrument, so we can only guess here.)
I've been told that Louisiana builders bore this hole oversize and
put in a bearing of nylon or "Delrin" to prevent the problem of the
pivot for the key sticking to the rod.
> > polish the rod in that area, too.
>
> Right -- if you have a bench grinder, put a cloth wheel on it,
> and load it with something like jeweler's rouge
A good suggestion! I'd check the area both above and below the
sticking key area. I wouldn't want to thin down the rod so much that
it left adjacent notes sloppy (but with a minimum amount of care, I
don't think that this would be likely).
Both these would resolve the issue if the problem is that the key
is sticking to the rod. Probably slightly more likely is the problem
of excess width of the key/ slot too narrow in which case he has the
issue of removing material squarely from parallel surfaces. It may be
that the "high area" that's causing the sticking will be apparent as a
discolored or shiny area when the parts are disassembled but --
whatever he finds upon disassembly -- he'll need to be careful to not
remove too much wood and to keep the surfaces flat. It will probably
be easier remove wood from the side of the key than from the slot but
if there's a "high area" on the side of the slot, he may have no
choice but to work in the slot. In such case, keeping the area flat
and parallel will be a must.
It's a tricky, touchy repair. As I said in my first post, DAMHIK!
BH, NC USA
ike milligan
<happypo...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1193887249.6...@q3g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
If the key has no spring tension at all and is a Hohner like an HA 114 or HA
113, the spring is broken, because they are made in China, and the Chinese
are putting springs in them that break regularly.
DoN. Nichols
> On Nov 1, 6:36 pm, dnich...@d-and-d.com (DoN. Nichols) wrote:
> > If the rod is a precise standard diameter (inch or metric,
> > depending on where it was made -- measure with a micrometer), what I
[ ... ]
> > The reamers have straight flutes, and a short bevel on the end
> > which does the actual cutting.
> >
> > An alternative might be a drum sanding which fits inside the
> > hole. used with a Dremel -- carefully.
>
> Hi, DoN. Good info. The rod in question* is the rod that the
> keys/buttons pivot on. I haven't measured one but "about the size of
> the lead in a standard wood pencil" would be about correct.
Hmm ... I would probably have called that some stiff steel (or
iron) wire, not "a rod". :-)
> Your
> point about a standard number/letter drill pulling into the hole is a
> good one - we're talking about a very small hole and even a much
> smaller amount of material to be removed. I was thinking that it
> might be possible to take a very small piece of emery paper, roll it
> up "like a cigarette" with the abrasive on the outside, and insert
> that in the hole but likely the hole is too small for this; but this
> may be possible.
Hmm ... I would probably consider the round file out of a small
set of Swiss pattern needle files as being likely to fit the hole.
Or -- if the "rod" is a bit larger, there are hacksaw or coping
saw blades which are round wire with diamond or carbide chips bonded to
the outside. They are usually advertised as being able to cut glass.
So -- snip off the attachment ring at one end, and you can thread it
through the hole.
> (* Original poster didn't specify the make, place of manufacture, or
> age of instrument, so we can only guess here.)
Understood. I've seen button boxes (but not Cajun ones) with
rods on the order of 3/8" or so. Hmm ... since it was a Hohner, that is
more likely to be a metric size, so somewhere between eight and ten mm,
with the 10 mm being the closest to the 3/8" guess -- 9.525 mm
> I've been told that Louisiana builders bore this hole oversize and
> put in a bearing of nylon or "Delrin" to prevent the problem of the
> pivot for the key sticking to the rod.
O.K. With Delrin, or even more so with Nylon, the chance of a
drill bit "screwing" into the bushing is pretty great -- unless you
remove the bushing from the lever and grip it in a collet in a lathe.
> > > polish the rod in that area, too.
> >
> > Right -- if you have a bench grinder, put a cloth wheel on it,
> > and load it with something like jeweler's rouge
>
> A good suggestion! I'd check the area both above and below the
> sticking key area. I wouldn't want to thin down the rod so much that
> it left adjacent notes sloppy (but with a minimum amount of care, I
> don't think that this would be likely).
I don't think that you can remove that much from even that small
a rod with jeweler's rouge -- its primary purpose is to make a really
shiny finish -- and for more serious metal removal you have to precede
it with something like Tripoli compound. But that thin a rod would be
likely to get bent if the wheel grabbed it, so perhaps not there.
> Both these would resolve the issue if the problem is that the key
> is sticking to the rod. Probably slightly more likely is the problem
> of excess width of the key/ slot too narrow in which case he has the
> issue of removing material squarely from parallel surfaces. It may be
> that the "high area" that's causing the sticking will be apparent as a
> discolored or shiny area when the parts are disassembled but --
> whatever he finds upon disassembly -- he'll need to be careful to not
> remove too much wood and to keep the surfaces flat. It will probably
> be easier remove wood from the side of the key than from the slot but
> if there's a "high area" on the side of the slot, he may have no
> choice but to work in the slot. In such case, keeping the area flat
> and parallel will be a must.
Agreed. The benefit of working with the key instead of the slot
is that if all else fails, you can make a replacement key, while the
slot requires replacing *all* the slots in most cases -- all cut in a
single piece of wood.
> It's a tricky, touchy repair. As I said in my first post, DAMHIK!
O.K. I won't. I know that warning acronym all too well.
(Though I don't normally encounter it in *this* newsgroup. :-)
Squeeze On,
ike milligan
"DoN. Nichols" <dnic...@d-and-d.com> wrote in message
news:fggmp...@news2.newsguy.com...
the problem? I don't remember any information about what kind of Cajun
accordion, or how old, or any picture being posted. Are you recommending the
owner do all this stuff? Are you sure that is the problem?
Bruce
> I haven't read all the postings on this, but have any of you actually seen
> the problem? I don't remember any information about what kind of Cajun
> accordion, or how old, or any picture being posted. Are you recommending the
>
> - Show quoted text -\
Thanks for bringing that point up, Ike. My discussion was (I
hope) "this is what may be wrong -- but look and consider before you
do anything". I am a very big fan of someone *not* jumping in and
sanding or cutting bits of their accordions without being absolutely
sure of what they're doing.