Classical alto mouthpiece comparison
Joe Ramirez
thought I'd pre-empt them for a while by posting these musings.
I decided to see if I could find an alto mouthpiece that I like better
than my Selmer C*, which I normally use for playing in a concert band
and sax quintet, and for classical playing at home. The tone and
control I get from the C* are fine; I just felt like experimenting. I
ordered a few mouthpieces from International Music Suppliers, trying
to keep the tip openings fairly consistent.
I tested the following mps on my Yanagisawa A-990 (black lacquer),
with Legere # 3 and Fibracell M reeds, and a Rovner dark ligature:
Bilger Gold* (medium-large round chamber, virtually no baffle)
Selmer Larry Teal (only 1 facing available) (medium round chamber,
very low baffle)
Hite Classical M64 (medium round chamber [*slightly* smaller than the
Selmer's], very low baffle)
Yanagisawa hard rubber # 3 (medium round chamber, low baffle [a bit
higher than the Selmer & Hite's]) -- came with the horn
Selmer S-80 C* (medium square chamber, very low baffle) -- my old
stand-by
The Hite came with a decent Hite metal ligature, but it didn't seem to
provide an improvement in tone or response over my Rovner. I ceased
testing it after one run-through because, as a dedicated Rovner user
on multiple horns, I no longer have the patience to fuss with two
ligature screws rather than one. <g>
The mouthpieces, I discovered, could be divided into two tone
categories: the Bilger, and everything else. The Bilger definitely
produced a noticeably darker and more "covered" sound than the other
four. Of course, that's exactly what the design, featuring a larger
chamber and missing baffle, is supposed to achieve. Personally, I
found the sound too muffled for my taste. I suppose I could get used
to it over time, but I place a lot of weight on first impressions in
mouthpiece testing. If the sound isn't close to what I have in my
head, I look elsewhere. I crossed the Bilger off my list, but I
recommend it as a mouthpiece to be tested by someone looking for a
truly dark, old-fashioned sort of saxophone sound. It's probably
similar to, though perhaps less extreme than, the Caravan and Rascher.
It's easy to blow (all of them were, btw), and also reasonably priced.
The other four mouthpieces were generally similar in tone quality,
with some minor differences in smoothness and edge. Frankly, I could
be content with any of them. In this test, however, I tried to focus
on the minor differences, because the point was to see if the C* was
really the best I could do.
The Hite seemed a lot like the C*, although it had a round chamber
instead of a square one. Its chamber was a little bit smaller than
that of the Larry Teal, so the sound was a tiny bit brighter than the
Teal's. I crossed off the Hite because I figured I might as well stay
with the C* if that was the sound I wanted.
The Yani, which I've used from time to time but never on a steady
basis, also had a generally smooth French sound, though with a bit
more edge, probably because its baffle is slightly higher than the
others'. The facing was also a little too close for me; the C* is
more comfortable, and a bit less spit-accumulating.
The Teal was close to the C* in sound; in fact, the C* with the Legere
reed was hard to tell from the Teal with the Fibracell. Going from
the C* to the Teal was similar to moving from a C** (which I also
have, but didn't compare here) to a C*. But the Teal also provided an
extra bit of roundness to the sound -- greater purity, if you will --
that I liked. It was most noticeable in the upper register. Of all
the mouthpieces I've ever tried on alto, the Teal has come closest to
matching the sound in my head, so I kept it. I'll probably continue
to use the C* for band playing, and will use the Teal at home.
I'd like to know, however, why the Larry Teal costs 50% more than the
S-80 models, since it appears based on the same blank. Is
hand-finishing involved? The table on the Teal had more of a
hand-worked look than the obviously machine-finished S-80s.
Joe Ramirez
ben davis
classical stuff I used a Rascher...right now I use a Link and the
chamber/design seems (to me anyway) remarkably similar/only I play a 9* as
opposed to the Rascher's 1/2* or whatever.
I did play that old fashioned 20th century stuff though...
Joe Ramirez <jra...@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:398302a3...@news3.attglobal.net...
Joe Pairman
Selmers I've tried.
--
Joe Pairman
Leeds, UK
Benjamin Kim
smaller tip opening and a much longer facing than than that of the C*. I
believe the rollover on the tip is non-existent on the Teal while the C*
has a bit of a rollover. And the Teal's chamber is round while the C*'s
is square (I don't know if the volume of the chambers are different which
may be a more determining factor in sound quality). I can't explain the
price discrepancy between the S-80 mouthpieces and the Teal's. It
probably has to do with the lack of demand of the Teal's relative to the
C*'s, or maybe the Teal's require higher tolerances in manufacturing. Or
maybe it's a simple matter of requiring some kind of hierarchy in their
product lines.
I played on a Teal for a number of years because many of the classical
cats seemed to play it. It was by all means a good classical mouthpiece.
Then I tried the Selmer metal classicals and have stuck with them ever
since. The only problem with the metal classicals is their inconsistency
- you can actually SEE the differences especially in the rails, baffle,
and tip rollover. So it's imperative to try a few of the same facing, as
well as different facings, which gets a bit expensive if you're doing all
of this by mail order. But I think it was worth it since you'll have to
pry my Selmer metals from my cold dead hands.
Ben
David Southard
- Morgan 3C (classic model, large-ish chamber)
- Steve Broadus (vintage large-chamber design)
- Vandoren V5 A20 (small round chamber)
I think these would compete well with the C* and LT (although either are
fine choices too)...
Dave S.
Robert L. Carroll
Thanks for your comparison. Your opinion agrees with mine, although I
never compared these mouthpieces all at the same time.
The next time you get in a comparing mood, try these: the Bilger Silver,
the Selmer S-90, the Morgan, and the Caravan.
Joe Ramirez
[deleted]
>Thanks for your comparison. Your opinion agrees with mine, although I
>never compared these mouthpieces all at the same time.
>
>The next time you get in a comparing mood, try these: the Bilger Silver,
>the Selmer S-90, the Morgan, and the Caravan.
Isn't the Bilger Silver meant for jazz?
I believe Jamal Rossi uses the S-90, so it must be a good classical
piece as well.
I've never tried a Caravan because I won't purchase a mp that I can't
return if I don't like it. The Woodwind & Brasswind and International
Music Suppliers don't sell the Caravan. Classic Winds does, but I
don't think they have an ironclad return policy.
Joe Ramirez
David Southard
> ....
> I've never tried a Caravan because I won't purchase a mp that I can't
> return if I don't like it. The Woodwind & Brasswind and International
> Music Suppliers don't sell the Caravan. Classic Winds does, but I
> don't think they have an ironclad return policy.
I asked Classic Winds in advance for a trial and was able to try a Rascher
vs. Caravan in this way. I sent back the Caravan and received a refund with
no hassles, but ended up using the Morgan 3C.
Dave S.
ben davis
shop on the web.
David Southard <david.s...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
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Richard Bush
BAFFLES. While some baffles are very shallow or high, and others are deep
and further away from the reed, they are still baffles. If a mouthpiece
had no baffle, the air would blow out the top of the mouthpiece and up
into your nose. :-)
Joe Ramirez wrote:
(Cut) Bilger Gold* (medium-large round chamber, virtually no baffle)
> Selmer Larry Teal (only 1 facing available) (medium round chamber,
> very low baffle)
> Hite Classical M64 (medium round chamber [*slightly* smaller than the
> Selmer's], very low baffle)
> Yanagisawa hard rubber # 3 (medium round chamber, low baffle [a bit
> higher than the Selmer & Hite's]) -- came with the horn
> Selmer S-80 C* (medium square chamber, very low baffle) -- my old
> stand-by
>
(Cut)
>
>
> Joe Ramirez
Thanks for sharing your experiences with mouthpieces. It is most helpful.
As mentioned by some others who have responded, you might want to try
some of the Morgan classical designs. While very conservative, they are
beautifully finished and have very responsive facing schedules.