How to fire a piano teacher ?
bev...@pinpoint.avl.com
I am having a bad experience with a new
piano teacher. I have totally lost confidence
in her after 4 lessons.
Examples:
1. I am just starting my 2nd year and she keeps insisting
I work on 1st movement Moonlight sonata, which I KNOW
I can't do justice to at this point (I might be willing to
give Op. 49 No. 2 a shot...)
2. She seems to have little knowledge of the literature.
Wants me to play the aforementioned "loud, with passion"
when Beethoven clearly has indicated pp.
3. As a general rule she wants me to keep the pedal
down halfway into every measure (not just on the above,
but on all pieces unless the measures are staccato or chromatic runs) !
This CANT be correct. It's making my Anna Mag. Bach pieces sound terrible.
4. It took her about 15-20 seconds to realize a note I was referring to
was F, not D as she first told me. It was above the bass staff and
she had to count upwards from the A line to realize I was correct !
Anyway you get the point.
I have been referred to a new teacher who sounds very knowledgeable
and professional who has agreed to take me on.
QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
(I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
Thanks, BOB.
Marvin Allen Wolfthal
> (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
>
in the sense I think you mean (unless the teacher turns it into one).
Tell the truth and say you aren't learning anything useful.
--
Marvin Allen Wolfthal (m...@fsg.com) Phone: (617) 542-6130
Technical Director, Fusion Systems Group, Inc. Fax: (617) 542-6248
10 Winthrop Square
Boston, MA 02110
Carl Tait
<bev...@pinpoint.avl.com> wrote:
>
>I am having a bad experience with a new piano teacher. [...]
>
>1. I am just starting my 2nd year and she keeps insisting
> I work on 1st movement Moonlight sonata, which I KNOW
> I can't do justice to at this point (I might be willing to
> give Op. 49 No. 2 a shot...)
A lot of teachers assign this piece too early. By itself,
this wouldn't be conclusive. But moving on ...
>2. She seems to have little knowledge of the literature.
> Wants me to play the aforementioned "loud, with passion"
> when Beethoven clearly has indicated pp.
Whoa! Sounds like Teacher of the Year material to me.
(*Worst* Teacher of the Year, that is.) Maybe she's trying
to teach you the comedy version: the "Supernova" Sonata.
>3. As a general rule she wants me to keep the pedal
> down halfway into every measure (not just on the above,
> but on all pieces unless the measures are staccato or chromatic runs) !
> This CANT be correct. It's making my Anna Mag. Bach pieces sound terrible.
It will make *most* pieces sound terrible. This is nonsensical advice.
>4. It took her about 15-20 seconds to realize a note I was referring to
> was F, not D as she first told me. It was above the bass staff and
> she had to count upwards from the A line to realize I was correct !
>
>Anyway you get the point.
Indeed. Run away screaming as fast as you can.
>I have been referred to a new teacher who sounds very knowledgeable
>and professional who has agreed to take me on.
>
>QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
> (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
Keep it matter-of-fact: "I've made an effort for several lessons,
but I'm afraid this isn't working out for me. I'm going to try some
lessons with a different teacher who sounds like she might be a
better match for my current skills." This lets the incompetent
teacher save face, if that is important to you.
I salute you for recognizing that this teacher is a flop. It's amazing
how many students will slavishly follow their teachers' instructions
without ever stopping to think and listen for themselves.
Carl Tait
James H. Fownes
>in her after 4 lessons.
>
>
>QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
> (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
>
anyway." and she tries to make it a confrontation, then she's *really* not
a professional. At that point, simply hang up.
I wonder what sort of
recommendations you sought before hiring her? Is there a local music
teachers' association that might keep records of complaints against
teachers who have fraudulent credentials?
Good luck. Keep cool. A real professional will accept "I think I would
be happier with someone else" as sufficient reason for changing.
Jim
r l reid
If it's only been a 4 - lesson relationship, I'd say you call her up and
thank her for her time and effort, but you just feel it's not a good match.
You needn't be rude at all - you can be thankful and gracious. But 4 weekss
into ANY relationship you don't relly need to offer an explanation.
Somtimes it's just not the right match. End it now, quickly, and
with very little explanation. She may be great for others - but not you.
I've have terrible, mediocre, and fabulaous teachers. This is a major
committment of your time and money. Find the right person.
If it were a longer realationship, I'd say you owe some amount
of explanation, but it isn't and you don't.
--
r l reid r...@panix.com
copyright 1996 by r l reid
microtonal resources and what not at:
http://www.panix.com/~ro/ -OR- http://woof.music.columbia.edu/~rlr/
Sang Le
: >QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
: > (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
I would follow the below steps:
(1)
pp
"Ahhumm...I am sorry...But"
(2)
fff
"You're fired!"
I was lucky. My first teacher was great! She always encouraged me to
play how I feel and emphasized that there should always be joy in my playing.
How I play and/or interpret the piece is up to me. And I chose my own
pieces!
I have learned to love music from that teacher.
Sang
Lora Kee
: I am having a bad experience with a new
: piano teacher. I have totally lost confidence
: in her after 4 lessons.
: Examples:
: 1. I am just starting my 2nd year and she keeps insisting
: I work on 1st movement Moonlight sonata, which I KNOW
: I can't do justice to at this point (I might be willing to
: give Op. 49 No. 2 a shot...)
: 2. She seems to have little knowledge of the literature.
: Wants me to play the aforementioned "loud, with passion"
: when Beethoven clearly has indicated pp.
: 3. As a general rule she wants me to keep the pedal
: down halfway into every measure (not just on the above,
: but on all pieces unless the measures are staccato or chromatic runs) !
: This CANT be correct. It's making my Anna Mag. Bach pieces sound terrible.
: 4. It took her about 15-20 seconds to realize a note I was referring to
: was F, not D as she first told me. It was above the bass staff and
: she had to count upwards from the A line to realize I was correct !
: Anyway you get the point.
: I have been referred to a new teacher who sounds very knowledgeable
: and professional who has agreed to take me on.
: QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
: (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
: Thanks, BOB.
If you want to wimp out of confrontations, tell the teacher that you
don't think that you can afford lessons at this time, or you have lost
intrest in playing altogether. Or its inconvenient to get to the lesson,
and there is a better location for you, or you could say that you have
cancer in your arm, and it will have to have it amputated, ok maybe not.
Christine Wagner
I think you need to tell her what you are looking for and nicely thank
her for her time. She will be better off if you let her know what you
find lacking(in a nice way).
Christine (piano teacher of 15 years)
Keith Dunnigan
Sang Le (san...@viper.inow.com) wrote:
: Marvin Allen Wolfthal (m...@nirvana.myth) wrote:
: : >QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
: : > (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
: I would follow the below steps:
: fff
: "You're fired!"
I wouldn't fire my dog sitter that way. How about a little milk of
human kindness, someone may fire you someday. So you don't like their
teaching, that doesn't make them Satan.
Is there *some* person besides me who feels sorry for the teacher?
Keith
Fathom
In article <4lr605$b...@newsreader.wustl.edu>, keith@wubios (Keith
Dunnigan) wrote:
>
> Is there *some* person besides me who feels sorry for the teacher?
No, not if the description of her ineptitude was anywhere near truthful.
No one with so little understanding of music has any business teaching.
--
Fathom >8-)>
** Custom-designed reality is a labor-intensive product **
Fritz Owens
I think this has gone far enough. Let me tell you how you gracefully stop
your piano lessons if you're taking lessons from me. I never intended to
teach you for the rest of your life or mine so it is not unexpected that
students will discontinue their piano lessons. The routine is very simple.
You call up your piano teacher and you say "My schedule has become very
hectic lately and I'm going to have to stop my piano lessons for awhile.
When I'm ready to resume them with you, I'll give you a call. Bye."
Please read the message carefully. "Awhile" can mean anything from 2
minutes to 200 years. Even if you know that you will never go back to
this teacher, you are not lying because you said you will call when you
are ready to resume lessons "with them". Never is a word that does often
get changed. Burning your bridges is not too cool. Any piano teacher
worth their salt will have to tell students from time to time, as I do,
that maybe they had better consider the fact that they don't like the
lessons, don't want to play the piano or that they might do better with
another teacher. Folks, there is no way in the world that I can get along
with everyone else in the world. I don't expect to. I don't look to like
everyone, and I don't expect everyone to like me. It just doesn't happen.
It's the nature of the human beast and has a lot to do with the way people
smell. (Don't laugh - check up on pherenomes). Dogs are most sensitive
to this. It's a well known fact amongst dog raisers that hunting dogs
(particularly ones with really good noses like Labrador Retrievers) raised
in a black family despise white people and dogs raised in white families
despise black people. Now let's not have any flames about racism. I'm
trying to point out that for no discernible reason you may not like your
teacher or your teacher may not like you. If you let this interfere with
the learning process then it's best you find another teacher. NOW. I ask
all of my younger students if they have learned yet that the teacher has
nothing to do with the students grade? Some of them answer with a simple
"yes' and others get absolutely incensed that I should think such a thing
with varying opinions on either side. The fact of the matter is that I
can make the lessons fun and enjoyable and a great learning experience and
a wonderful motivational endeavor only if you allow it as a student. All
of the effort comes from you. I can only show the way. If you don't like
the way I'm pointing you, then for heaven's sake, hunt around for someone
that can! The teacher who abuses the student in any way (and intimidation
about practice is the favorite) needs to be removed from the roles of
active piano teachers by the most effective method: students quitting
after a few lessons. Don't get hung up on worries about "hurting the
teacher's feelings". You are the consumer. Exercise your right as the
consumer and cancel your lessons without any feelings of guilt. You paid
your money and you are entitled to freeedom to make any choice you want.
Don't let some idea of "loyalty" swerve you from the path of getting the
best piano teacher for you that you can find. End of soapbox lecture.
__ _ . ___ ___
|_ |_) | | /
| | \ | | /__
fo...@www.gnofn.org
-------------------------original message below-------------
On 24 Apr 1996, Sang Le wrote:
> Marvin Allen Wolfthal (m...@nirvana.myth) wrote:
> : >QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
> : > (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
> : >
>
> I would follow the below steps:
>
> (1)
>
> pp
>
> "Ahhumm...I am sorry...But"
>
> (2)
>
> fff
>
> "You're fired!"
>
hv...@cln.etc.bc.ca
> Marvin Allen Wolfthal (m...@nirvana.myth) wrote:
> : >QUESTION: How can I fire the first teacher without being rude ?
> : > (I am a wimp and don't like confrontations).
> : >
>
> I would follow the below steps:
>
> (1)
>
> pp
>
> "Ahhumm...I am sorry...But"
>
> (2)
>
> fff
>
> "You're fired!"
>
> I was lucky. My first teacher was great! She always encouraged me to
> play how I feel and emphasized that there should always be joy in my playing.
> How I play and/or interpret the piece is up to me. And I chose my own
> pieces!
>
> I have learned to love music from that teacher.
>
> Sang
I`m a music teacher and I think probably the nicest way to fire a teacher
would be to say, "We`ve/I`ve decided to quit" if you are quitting during
the year and don't offer any explanation. If the teacher is a total
schlepp, he or she won`t even bother to ask why. If you are quitting at
the end of the year, you can simply say, "We won`t be continuing next
year." The best way to avoid confrontation is not to get into any of the
murky details. If the teacher asks why you are quitting, and you`ve
thoroughly decided to quit and cannot be convinced otherwise, it`s best to
say something generic like, "I don`t think this is working out very well."
hv...@cln.etc.bc.ca
r l reid
>In article <4lr605$b...@newsreader.wustl.edu>, keith@wubios (Keith
>Dunnigan) wrote:
>>
>> Is there *some* person besides me who feels sorry for the teacher?
>No, not if the description of her ineptitude was anywhere near truthful.
>No one with so little understanding of music has any business teaching.
Nonsense. We only heard the student's side.
Now, as far as I'm concerned, the STUDENT is the one who has to be
happy. The student has all the right in the world to discontinue
work with this teacher. But there's no reason to be a jerk about it.
As I said (weeks ago - let this die already!) you let them know that
don't feel it's a good match and thank them for thier time. Or if
that's too hard, do what one poster suggested and "wimp out" with
an excuse.
But there's no reason to be a jerk. Her methods may work well for someone
else. I'm glad to have a teacher who doesn't think there's one way
suitable for all.
Kngflrtchk
Hey everyone-
This is my first post since finding this group and I have to respond to
this delicate question. I had to fire my first piano teacher. Lessons
were held at the local Jordan Kitts in the mall...first mistake.....Rude,
immature employees would "knock" on our door and run.....I played a
different piano almost every lesson......finally I answered a local ad for
a teacher and asked to meet him before committing my hard earned $$$$.
Remember, YOU are paying them for their time......he was a little
surprised at first but I am a serious student and will not waste my time
or $$$. I explained to my first teacher the problems and she fully
understood. We got along great and I'm sorry we have lost contact. But
my new teacher is great. He has taught me much more than she could have
under the circumstances and he lets me play what I want. To me that is
extremely important. You will NOT learn by playing what does not sound
pleasant to your own ear.
Thanks for listening.........
Patricia
Martha Beth Lewis
This is always a delicate subject, no matter whether the student or the
teacher is initiating the break.
When I am dismissing a student, I tell the parent (or the student, if
an adult) that "I don't think I'm the right teacher for the child.
Perhaps the problem is that piano is the right choice. Maybe your
child would prefer another instrument or even another artistic
endeavor" (such as dance, theater, etc.). The important point is NEVER
to cast aspersions on the students, only to comment that the match is
not good (not good any more)." Of course, it pays to be choosy about
the students you accept. The more experienced the teacher--and the
more unplesant confrontations which have been weathered, perhaps!--the
choosier the teacher. Don't start a student you know you will have to
dismiss in the foreseeable future. (Exception: you need the cash
desperately and will take any warm body with bucks. Hey. Sometimes
this is the case! If this is YOUR case, just make sure you're honest
with yourself. The less choosy you are with whom you teacher, the more
often you'll have to dismiss students--or the other side of the coin:
the more often they'll quit.)
If a student chooses to "fire" me, the least offensive wording is:
"We've decided to discontinue lessons." Nothing more need to be said
about "for a while" or "with you" or anything else. The less said, the
less there is to take issue with. Losing students is a part of
runnning a studio.
As long as you select students with care and give 110% effort to each
one (among other things, such as motivation, literature, etc.), you
will minimize the turnover in your studio. (I have some more stuff on
this topic on my home page: http://www.serve.com/marbeth/piano.html)
Martha Beth
Musipro
mar...@ix.netcom.com(Martha Beth Lewis) wrote:
If a student chooses to "fire" me, the least offensive wording is:
"We've decided to discontinue lessons." Nothing more need to be said
about "for a while" or "with you" or anything else. The less said, the
less there is to take issue with. Losing students is a part of
runnning a studio.
--True, if you teach privately for any length of time you will, no matter
how carefully you screen your potential students, have some that just
don't work out, for whatever reason. In my town, however, most
independent piano teachers belong to the same local association, and it is
pretty certain that if student switches to another teacher without telling
the first one, that first teacher will find out, either through the
grapevine or possibly from the second teacher. Ethical instructors will
even contact the first teacher, assuming the family has been up front
about whom they studied with before, and make sure it is OK that the
switch is being made (it almost always is perfectly fine). Otherwise the
second teacher can easily get the reputation of "stealing" others'
students.
I think what students, and especially parents of young students, need to
realize is this: teachers are professionals and human beings with
feelings, not servants that can be hired and fired with a curt phrase, or
simply dropped without explanation. Of course I agree that if you realize
that your teacher is unqualified or simply on a different wavelength, it
is in your best interests to find someone else. However, as numerous
people have pointed out in this group, there are ways to do this
gracefully without giving needless offense, and without causing a teacher
to lose face among his/her colleagues. In this era of much rudeness and
name-calling, let's do our best to keep a little old-fashioned class in
our dealings with each other. That's my goal, anyway...
Martha Beth Lewis
>
>mar...@ix.netcom.com(Martha Beth Lewis) wrote:
>
>If a student chooses to "fire" me, the least offensive wording is:
>"We've decided to discontinue lessons." Nothing more need to be said
>about "for a while" or "with you" or anything else. The less said,
the less there is to take issue with. Losing students is a part of
>runnning a studio. mb
>
In my town, however, most
>independent piano teachers belong to the same local association,
Same in my town.
and it is
>pretty certain that if student switches to another teacher without
telling
>the first one, that first teacher will find out, either through the
>grapevine or possibly from the second teacher.
Well, certainly I'd hope the student would switch! I'd WANT
the student to continue with someone else rather than give it up
entirely!
Sometimes a teacher will phone me about a student who comes their
way in this fashion, and I'm happy to pass on what I did that I
thought worked with this student. I want the student to find a
teacher with whom he is congenial and with whom he can have
profitable piano study.
Ethical instructors will
>even contact the first teacher, assuming the family has been up front
>about whom they studied with before,
If the student has studied before, I always ask why they are
leaving the other teacher. This helps me understand better what
they are looking for and deciding whether I am the right teacher
for them. Maybe I'm not!
I rarely contact the "sending" teacher if it's a "quit" situation
because usually the sending teacher doesn't want to talk about it!
Usually I can piece together what I needed to know in order to
make a decision about whether to start teaching this student by
the information I get in the phone inquiry and the studio
interview.
and make sure it is OK that the
>switch is being made (it almost always is perfectly fine).
My only concern here would be whether the student were leaving one
teacher's studio with lessons unpaid or other financial obligation.
No ethical teacher would take on a student knowing he was
still obligated to a previous teacher. AND no thinking teacher
would take on a student who showed such appalling lack of
ethics as to leave a debt unpaid!
Otherwise the
>second teacher can easily get the reputation of "stealing" others'
>students.
In general, I don't worry much about whether other teachers are
going to steal my students. But yes, a teacher who sends letters
soliciting students they know to be current students of another
teacher is about the lowest thing a professional teacher can
do. Proselytizing in another studio is a no-no.
I don't worry bcs I want what is best for the student. If I am
not providing that, then the student should seek a teacher who
will. I ask only that I be given 24 hours' notice and that all
lessons contracted for be paid. (I do not prepare transfer
materials for students whose parents withdraw them summarily.
If the student is moving and I am treated professionally, I
happily prepare a transfer packet for the new teacher so the
transition is as smooth as possible. If a parent calls and says,
"Tomorrow will be the last lesson" I do not feel obligated--nor
would I have time, as this takes a couple of hours to write!)
>
>I think what students, and especially parents of young students, need
to realize is this: teachers are professionals and human beings with
>feelings, not servants that can be hired and fired with a curt phrase,
or simply dropped without explanation.
Of course you are right. BUT....most parents are cowards. They
want to avoid confrontation. They don't want to say, "We don't
like the way you are teaching our child" or "The child doesn't
like you" or "You are always late starting our lesson and early
to end it" or "My child hates competitions. Why won't you get
that through your head?" Instead they would rather keep it short
and sweet.
And you are right about hired/fired. But teaching piano is like
being any other professional--doctor, dentist, lawyer. If you
don't like the service you are paying for, you seek another.
You do not necessarily owe that person a detailed explanation of
why. Some offices might send a follow-up questionnaire--esp if
the office is losing a lot of clients--but this is pretty rare.
If the teacher wants to know why the student is withdrawing, he
should ask the parents. "Would you tell me why?" Maybe the parent
will tell the truth; maybe he'll give the teacher a platitude. In
most cases, tho, the teacher feels that something is wrong even if
she can't put her finger on it precisely. And in most cases the
parents take the easy way out.
there are ways to do this
>gracefully without giving needless offense,
Did you think "We've decided to discontinue lessons" was
graceless and offensive? If so, then my personal prejudice is
showing! I'd rather be told that than some other alternatives!
and without causing a teacher
>to lose face among his/her colleagues.
This is something else altogether! Of course we don't want a
student who has dropped from our studio to call all the other
teachers in the area and tell them what a loser we are as a
teacher, nor take out a full-page ad in the Sunday paper! But
any experienced professional teacher understands he is going to
lose students. In fact, sometimes I even hear from the teachers.
It makes me very happy to know that I was able to give this
student enough of a love for music that he continued lessons even
if it wasn't with me. And it thrills me to death to hear, "You did
an excellent job with him." Then I know I'm on the right track,
just maybe not with this student. (I'd also like to point out that
sometimes students quit for reasons that have nothing to do with
music or the teacher or the student--the parents separate, there
are family financial reverses and a cheaper teacher is deemed
necessary, etc.)
In this era of much rudeness and name-calling, let's do our best to
keep a little old-fashioned class in our dealings with each other.
Hear, hear!
That's my goal, anyway...
Mine too! Martha Beth
PS. What's your first name?
-Chen,J.L.
Have anyone seen the move "Madam Souzustka (sp?)
I think it is a great movie about the teacher student relationship
(may be to the extreme case, though) and many great piano music.
Julian