Your view of Charles Walter pianos
The Piano Tuner
Charles Walter piano -- technicians, dealers, owners or even anyone who
has just tried one out.
I've read nothing but positive comments about Charles Walter pianos
since finding RMMP about 9 months ago. However, these comments are
usually in reference to other brands of pianos.
I'd like to make the Charles Walter piano the main point of discussion
in this thread. What are your likes, dislikes and overall impressions of
these pianos.
My reason for asking is that I've only run across two of these pianos --
one the 43" model and one the 45" -- both from 1988. I tuned the 43"
model back in 1993 - it sat next to a wood stove. The 45" was serviced
in 1996 - it's in a church - and that was, I believe, the first tuning
it had ever had. So, I can't really base any opinion on those two
experiences.
From what I've read, I get the feeling that these truly are great pianos
- but I just want to make sure.
..
Remember - Stay In Tune
Eric Gloo
Piano Technician
Richfield Springs, New York
Alex Maas
to highest treble, without even being one of the massive uprights like I
have.
A master tuner who has tuned my piano told me the the Charles Walter
makes you proud to be an American. Additionally, it used to be the only
other piano allowed in the Steinway showroom in New York, or so I have
heard. I never knew if this was true.
However, the comments on this group have not all been positive. But I
imagine with any handmade instrument that is true. I didn't buy one because
I had a hard time finding one in San Diego. That of course is one
problem--if you buy an upright and want to move to a grand later--you might
have a small resell market, although the internet, Ebay, and Sterling Van
lines have changed that a lot. (That's not a plug--they told me that about
70 to 80 percent of their business is moving Ebay items, and they move a lot
of pianos--in case anyone needs to know).
Alex Maas
Rick Clark
"proud to be an American" thing too. I always thought of them as
having the quality of something like a Steinway, without paying the
extra money for the marketing/advertising/promotions/other intangibles
overhead.
Rick Clark
The Piano Tuner
>>Charles is working on a 5' 8" grand as
>>he can find the time to devote to it.
>>Don't look for it for probably another
>>year, though.
Hi Larry!
I read in another thread that you sell this brand. Do you know of any
Walter dealers in the central New York State area? I'd love to try the
grand (and the uprights). It's encouraging to hear that a "smaller"
American piano manufacturer is doing well. (Not really sure "smaller" is
the right word.)
Steve_K
AM> When I played one, way back ten years ago, the upright sang from
AM> lowest bass to highest treble, without even being one of the
AM> massive uprights like I have.
I currently own one of their grands, but a long time before I got it, I
had played one of the Walter uprights, which really impressed me as
sounding like a much bigger piano than it was. It was one of the
nicest uprights I can recall playing, and I liked it much better than
the Yamaha of about the same size that I owned at the time.
I've heard rumors that they have some other models of grands in the
works. Does anybody know what they might be?
- steve
Larry Fletcher
>works. Does anybody know what they might be?
>
> - steve
>
Charles is working on a 5' 8" grand as he can find the time to devote to it.
Don't look for it for probably another year, though.
Larry Fletcher
Pianos, Inc.
Atlanta, GA
Dealer/Technician
"A man must consider what rich realm he abdicates when he becomes a
conformist." Ralph Waldo Emerson
Larry Fletcher
>Walter dealers in the central New York State area?
I'm home now so I don't have the Walter's # with me. I don't know who the
dealer is there, but I'll get back to you with the phone # so you can call them
& find out.
(if this feeble brain doesn't forget....too much lacquer thinner, maybe)
VOCE88
>had played one of the Walter uprights, which really impressed me as
>sounding like a much bigger piano than it was. It was one of the
>nicest uprights I can recall playing, and I liked it much better than
>the Yamaha of about the same size that I owned at the time.
>
>works. Does anybody know what they might be?
>
> - steve
Yes, Steve. A 5'8" grand may come out before the year is out.
BTW, the 6'3" was in the works for a long time, so it may take a little longer.
Richard Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co
Phila,. Pa.
1 (800) 394-1117
VOCE88
>
>I read in another thread that you sell this brand. Do you know of any
>Walter dealers in the central New York State area? I'd love to try the
>grand (and the uprights). It's encouraging to hear that a "smaller"
>American piano manufacturer is doing well. (Not really sure "smaller" is
>the right word.)
>
>..
>
>Remember - Stay In Tune
>
>Eric Gloo
>Piano Technician
>Richfield Springs, New York
Try calling Rachel Walter at 219 271 0171.
She is the sales rep. for the company.
Yogi Panda
Any chance for getting a feel for what is involved in the design? How
many prototypes? How many iterations for the scale design? For the
action? etc etc
Just curious,
Yogi
Alex Maas
specialize in
small cross-country moves, especially heavy items, such as pianos, bought through
the internet, especially Ebay. When I was in negotations for a certain heavy
digital piano, I found that Sterling Van Lines was quite reasonable and easy to
deal with.
But I don't know about the quality about the work, but it seemed like they
would take good care of a piano moved cross-country. So next time you see that used
high-quality piano for sale, you might consider doing this, with this company or
another company. The advent of the auction houses on the internet have made this
type of business possible.
And this subject comes up time to time in people being donated a piano by a distant
relative. Before this was much more of a problem. I guess you could try to send a
piano UPS, but I don't think that would have worked. And most other movers
specialize in moving whole houses full of furniture,
not just one piano at a time cross-county.
But companies like Sterling Van Lines pick up and deliver one item at a time on a
preplanned route.
I am sure there are many other companies who do this, but I thought it was neat
that companies specialize in this type of small move.
Alex Maas
alex...@ixpres.com
Damon Shields
There are quite a few companies that do long haul piano moving. I do it based on the
"Price is Right" method. I find it interesting that a technology as relatively new as
the internet affects a very old profession like piano moving.
With regard to quality of work: get a copy of their insurance policy. They need
Bailees (care, custody and control), cargo, and general liability insurance. It is a
nightmare if they mess it up but, you know damages will be repaired.
In my humble (and very biased) opinion sending one with a furniture company is a
terrible risk. Let your furniture mover move your furniture and let a piano mover
move your piano.
Damon Shields
mailto:dshi...@chisp.netNOSPAM
Shields' Piano Moving
Ft. Collins, CO
b...@thepianosource.com
>When I played one, way back ten years ago, the upright sang from lowest bass
>to highest treble, without even being one of the massive uprights like I
>have.
> A master tuner who has tuned my piano told me the the Charles Walter
>makes you proud to be an American.
That's because there really is not a lot of pianos coming from
American piano factories to be proud of and those that are come out of
either Stinewy, Kawai, Yamaha or Walter factories. You Baldwin people
can take your shot now but there is only a little coming from there to
be really proud about.
--
Bob Shapiro - - located in paradise (southwest Florida)
A retail salesperson dealing in major brands with years of
experience in retail,also college and armory promotions, etc.
Represented most major and minor brands in the past
Currently representing Yamaha,Kawai,Petrof,Kohler & Campbell,Samick,Technics.
For credentials and also for the answers to many of your questions please see
http://www.thepianosource.com
Fredisg
company. Also, Dan Fusco in New Hartford used to sell them.
Irwin Goldberg....pianist, conductor.
Jon Parker
Damon Shields <dshi...@chisp.net> wrote in message
news:38AA329F...@NOSPAMchisp.net...
Hi!! A Coloradoan!!
--
Jon Parker
Jazz Pianist
Denver
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"Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord" -Ephesians 5:19
--
David Schmitt
church just built and is opening tomorrow. It was delivered Wednesday and on
Thursday we had our first rehearsal in the new building. Some observations:
1. Ohmygoodness its so much nicer than the Kurzweil digital keyboard we've
been using while in our temporary (five years!) location at a local school
auditorium.
2. Sweetest action I ever played. Soft enough that you don't fight it, but
just enough resistance to allow you complete control. Slight variation from
bass to treble but I'm sure the dealer will take care of that.
3. Wonderful tone from lows through highs.
4. Makes me want to sell my Petrof IV and find the extra thousands to get a
Walter of my own. (Rich, Larry -- I'm kidding.)
I just couldn't be more pleased. While on the one hand its a lot of fun to
shop with someone else's money, we're talking a church here, where the
parishioners have donated the money. And on top of that, everyone has their
own opinion (such as the one parishioner who couldn't understand why we
would look at anything besides a Yamaha). But in the end, I think we found
the perfect piano for our budget (which grew 50% once I explained what it
took to do it right).
Okay, those are the likes. Dislikes? Well, we got satin instead of gloss
ebony. I'm serious -- that's it. I honestly do not know what else anyone
could want from a piano. Over the last year, I've played pianos from $4000
Paso's to $80,000 Schemes. I can't figure out what the extra $60k for the
Scheme is for...
"The Piano Tuner" <thepia...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:18309-38...@storefull-293.iap.bryant.webtv.net...
> This post is for any of you out there who have had an experience with a
> Charles Walter piano -- technicians, dealers, owners or even anyone who
> has just tried one out.
>
> I've read nothing but positive comments about Charles Walter pianos
> since finding RMMP about 9 months ago. However, these comments are
> usually in reference to other brands of pianos.
>
> I'd like to make the Charles Walter piano the main point of discussion
> in this thread. What are your likes, dislikes and overall impressions of
> these pianos.
>
> My reason for asking is that I've only run across two of these pianos --
> one the 43" model and one the 45" -- both from 1988. I tuned the 43"
> model back in 1993 - it sat next to a wood stove. The 45" was serviced
> in 1996 - it's in a church - and that was, I believe, the first tuning
> it had ever had. So, I can't really base any opinion on those two
> experiences.
>
> From what I've read, I get the feeling that these truly are great pianos
> - but I just want to make sure.
>
Jory Olson
that had some major problems.
The two pianos in question, both Walter 6'3" grands one ebony, one mahogany,
sat around the Portland, OR Walter dealership for over two years. The
mahogany one was sent out to have the downbearing adjusted and sounded
better, but still pretty poor after that.
After more than two years the mahogany one finally sold. The ebony model,
which was older than the mahogany model sat around for several more months
before it finally sold.
Both pianos sold at "firesale"pricing, rumored to be in the $15K range,
after becoming very shop worn. Both were pretty scratched up after years on
the dealership floor.
The "salesman story" about these two pianos is that they were some of the
first off the line. That can't be entirely true because the mahogany model
didn't show up for nearly a year after the ebony model. Both had thin weak
sound, with little or no projection. The sustain was poor. The touch was
okay, but nothing to write home about.
I have since played some Walter grands that were magnificent (at Chris
Finger's in Niwot, CO), but if I were basing my opinion on these two, I
would say that the Walter grands suck.
I really like the Walter uprights. Very nice all around and very
affordable. I remain skeptical of the grands however.
So the moral of this story is that nobody is perfect. I don't understand
what went wrong with these two pianos. Some people have said it was prep
and blame the dealer. I believe they had too much downbearing. In any
case, there is an exception that makes the rule in this case.
Jory
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Larry Fletcher
>that had some major problems.
>
>The two pianos in question, both Walter 6'3" grands one ebony, one mahogany,
>sat around the Portland, OR Walter dealership for over two years.
Hi Jory,
I am familiar with these two pianos. They were two of 4 prototypes built, which
the dealer got cheap. The Walter has a unique adjustment for downbearing, and
if the dealer messed with the settings he probably did screw them up worse than
they already were. I played all four prototypes, and only one (a cherry one)
should have been brought to the trade show, but the Walters were under so much
pressure to get them to the show they had to go with what they had ready. The
mahogany model was taken around to several PTG showings after that, which could
explain why it was later arriving at the dealers.
The pianos that have come out of the factory since then are all just fine.
Larry Fletcher
Pianos, Inc.
Atlanta, GA
Dealer/Technician
Doing the work of three men..........Larry, Curly, and Moe.
Steve_K
JO> model. Both had thin weak sound, with little or no projection.
Sounds like there were other things wrong too, but I wonder if hammer
hardness could have had some bearing on this too. When mine was brand
new, it had what I could only call a "thin, weak" sound in the upper
few octaves, but after having played it for a month or so that
completely went away and the treble is quite powerful now (as is the
rest of the piano). Lacking any other explanation, I've attributed
that to the hammers up there becoming a bit harder with a month's use
in them. It was a big enough change that I don't think it was my
imagination. I don't know if my experience was atypical, but I wonder
if some of them in showrooms that haven't been played much could be in
a similar condition. I like mine so much that I'd hate to think
someone ended up avoided them based on seeing one that wasn't up to its
full potential.
- steve
Jory Olson
>Sounds like there were other things wrong too, but I wonder if hammer
>hardness could have had some bearing on this too. When mine was brand
>new, it had what I could only call a "thin, weak" sound in the upper
>few octaves, but after having played it for a month or so that
>completely went away and the treble is quite powerful now (as is the
>rest of the piano). Lacking any other explanation, I've attributed
>that to the hammers up there becoming a bit harder with a month's use
>in them. It was a big enough change that I don't think it was my
>imagination. I don't know if my experience was atypical, but I wonder
>if some of them in showrooms that haven't been played much could be in
>a similar condition. I like mine so much that I'd hate to think
>someone ended up avoided them based on seeing one that wasn't up to its
>full potential.
I know that the Renner Premium Blue hammers come from Renner pretty soft.
These two pianos had MUCH bigger problems than soft hammers, however. I
really cannot full explain just how bad these two Walter grands sucked.
Your average Korean upright would sound better than these two grands. They
sucked long, hard, and deep. No amount of hammer hardening was going to get
a full rich sound out of these pianos. Besides these two pianos were played
on all day for two years by people shopping for pianos.
I think Larry's explanation is better. The Walter's I've played elsewhere
really sound okay. The ones at Chris Finger's in Niwot, CO sound really
good.
In any case, the local Walter dealership no longer stocks the grand. Burned
twice...and all of that.
Rick Clark
>I know that the Renner Premium Blue hammers come from Renner pretty soft.
Not true really, but I understand where you get the impression.
Actually they arrive from Renner extremely hard *except* at the
surface layer of the strike point. Major needling is required to
loosen them. They are not "metallic bright" out of the box, but medium
or hard playing is unpleasantly harsh if they aren't voiced.
"Distorted" or "honky" is probably a good term. The under layers are
too hard even if the top layer isn't. It won't give a metallic sound,
which is what lacquer-hard hammers or worn hammers can give you.
Renner Blues seem to require about the most prep work to sound good.
The extra cost of the hammer is small compared to all the extra labor
they need. Not that some other hammers might not need as much.
Of course it's also possible that someone might hear Renner Blues that
have been lacquered, which is supposed to be a no-no, and that might
certainly sound too bright in the traditional sense. These are hammers
not built to take lacquer. They sound the way they sound. And
according to Renner, will take a long time breaking in before they
start to sound good.
Rick