Bad technique from practicing on digital "pianos."
James R. Turner
a number of students who don't seem able to learn proper expression
and voicing. Without exception, these are the students whose
parents are subjecting them to digital "pianos."
They also tend to play the piano much harder than they should,
no doubt being used to the inadequate sound from an electronic
sound system. The dynamic range and audio power from even a small
6' piano is tremendous. You'd probably need many hundreds of watts
of power to provide a realistic simulation of the volume levels
and dynamic range that a real piano can produce.
Have any other teachers noticed this? Or am I being prejudiced
by the knowledge of the type of pianos the students have? (It
does bother me to see parents drop their kids off in $70K cars
who won't spend $$ for a decent piano! This is nothing but
child abuse.)
--
Jim T.
Russ Evans
>I've been teaching Piano for the past 15 years and have noticed
>a number of students who don't seem able to learn proper expression
>and voicing. Without exception, these are the students whose
>parents are subjecting them to digital "pianos."
I would never deny the virtues of a good acoustic piano, and, playing
both (+ synthesisers) on a daily basis, I would not suggest that even
the best of current digitals approach the quality of even a reasonably
good upright. But, I would point out that the quality of today's
"digital pianos" with good weighted actions is far improved on that of
even five years ago. I would certainly recommend a beginner with
anything more then trivial aspirations to go for an acoustic instrument,
but I would have thought a good current "digital" (Technics PX-7,
Roland RD-500, Yamaha PFP-100) an adequate substitute in many cases.
Have your pupils been using instruments of this standard?
Russ
Eric Charles Agnew
I'm a college frosch, and have been taking piano lessons since kindergarten.
Anyway, about 3-4 years ago, we got a Korg-5000. I ended up practicing a LOT
more than I used to (with the headphones on, up to 4 or more hours instead of
the dragged out 1/2 hr.) However, this being one of the eariler digital pianos
its touch was QUITE light, even though it was "weighted" keys.
Now I practice usually in the main lounge, on an old baby grand with an
EXTREMELY heavy touch, and have been getting more used to it, although the
transition was difficult after being used to the light digital. Can't quite
play Flight of the Bumblebee anymore... It's almost like having to relearn it
for a new instrument. I don't know. But there are better rooms to practice in,
I just haven't gone to that building to do so since my lessons audition. Which
of I course I got booted from, even after passing the audition, because I'm not
a music major. <SIGH>. oh well, probably get in next semester. :>
L8er...
-Eric (ag...@cae.wisc.edu)
Erik A. Henchal
An antidote:
Recently, I used a Yamaha PFP-100 as a substitute piano for two weeks. I
attempted to continue my Hanon exercises but found that I was developing
pain in my forearm that does not occur when I use a regular piano. I also
noticed that this and other digital pianos exert a certain amount of upward
force on your fingers that acoustic instruments do not have. My conclusion:
different muscles are used with acoustic instruments than with digital
keyboards.
******************************************************************************
o _______________ ERIK A. HENCHAL
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sud...@acy.digex.net
In article <35r5d9$e...@news.doit.wisc.edu>, <ag...@cae.wisc.edu> writes:
> Path:
news1.digex.net!uunet!gatech!nntp.msstate.edu!saimiri.primate.wisc.edu!news.doi
t.wisc.edu!agnew
> From: ag...@cae.wisc.edu (Eric Charles Agnew)
> Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.piano
> Subject: Re: Bad technique from practicing on digital "pianos."
> Date: 22 Sep 1994 05:40:57 GMT
> Organization: College of Engineering, Univ. of Wisconsin--Madison
> Lines: 24
> Distribution: usa
> Message-ID: <35r5d9$e...@news.doit.wisc.edu>
> References: <1994Sep13.0...@boy.com> <35qbkq$p...@apple.com>
> NNTP-Posting-Host: hp-106.cae.wisc.edu
>
> In article <35qbkq$p...@apple.com> mdta...@apple.com (Mark D. Taylor) writes:
> >difference, _provided_ that I have the volume set high enough. With volume
> >turned down low (so as not to disturb my neighbors,) I find I unconsciously
> >hit the keys harder to try to produce greater volume. If this is the case
> >with your students, they should simply turn up the volume, and/or connect
> >the output to a stereo system for a fuller sound.
> >
> >This brings up another point: if they have a digital piano for the purpose
> >of not disturbing neighbors, there's really no alternative. With a real
> >piano, once a neighbor in the adjacent apartment bangs on the wall, it's
> >going to make the student so self-conscious he probably won't practice at
> >all.
>
> You forgot one very important thing about digitals & noise-
> Headphones :>
> I practiced so much with headphones on, occasionally my parents would spazz
> out and demand that I remove them. And after taking them off, it would be too
> quiet, and then my stepdad would start humming along & then, usually in under
> 5 minutes, they'd go listen to their talk radio & I'd have the headphones
back
> on again. <sigh> It's also VERY nice for practicing with background noise
(i.e.
> the radio and TV going in the other rooms with no doors between...)
> L8er...
> -Eric (ag...@cae.wisc.edu)
>
I beg to differ. They sell digital pianos because that's
what's made. They are massively inferior to acoustic instruments
in every respect. They don't particularly hurt your technique, because
technique is more a matter of spatiality than muscularity. But the
notion that because it is digital you can play it without disturbing others?
a massive over hype. I guarantee you that for a few hundred dollars I
can get a better sounding used spinet, stuff its rear end with pillows
till only i can hear it, and i'll have the real tactile feedback of a
wooden key, not a stupid imitation, with bad voices, and, worst of
all, the possibility of coded, pre done, step time, non real time, non
improvisation COMPUTER MUSIC (sic).
You can really score well with a used acoustic since they're so
out of fashion and so superior to anything in the digital sphere.
If you're interested in learning to play jazz standards, email me and
i'll send you a brochure about a really happening course that I have.
nils per skjodt
>I beg to differ. They sell digital pianos because that's
>what's made. They are massively inferior to acoustic instruments
>in every respect. They don't particularly hurt your technique, because
>technique is more a matter of spatiality than muscularity.
all spatiality. What I've noticed is that digital players totally lack
any way of gaining a good sense of tone and touch and action. Playing
piano is not pressing a key and having a note come out.. it is a
_physical_ mechanism.. having an intimate knowledge of how the mechanism
feels under your hands is absolutely crucial if you ever want to sound good.
--Nils
Glenn Mandelkern
>In article <1994Sep13.0...@boy.com>,
>James R. Turner <jtu...@boy.com> wrote:
>>I've been teaching Piano for the past 15 years and have noticed
>>a number of students who don't seem able to learn proper expression
>>and voicing. Without exception, these are the students whose
>>parents are subjecting them to digital "pianos."
>
>weighted keys, I can see the difficulty. However, I have a Yamaha Clavinova,
>and having practiced on real pianos before, I find that I forget the
>difference, _provided_ that I have the volume set high enough. With volume
>turned down low (so as not to disturb my neighbors,) I find I unconsciously
>hit the keys harder to try to produce greater volume. If this is the case
>with your students, they should simply turn up the volume, and/or connect
>the output to a stereo system for a fuller sound.
>
>This brings up another point: if they have a digital piano for the purpose
>of not disturbing neighbors, there's really no alternative. With a real
>piano, once a neighbor in the adjacent apartment bangs on the wall, it's
>going to make the student so self-conscious he probably won't practice at
>all.
>
I have been recently looking into getting a weighted keyboard.
Presently I have an SQ-2 keyboard/synthesizer and have really noticed
my technique suffering because of the plastic keys. It was a great
buy at the time.
However, when I find myself playing a weighted keyboard, especially
an acoustic piano, I get overwhelmed with what I have been missing.
So I am looking for something that has a good feel and response.
The accompaniment extras are really not needed, and the sound is
secondary at this point.
There are some weighted keyboards, however, that I have found fairly
awkward. The Fatar 90 keyboard controllers seemed promising to me
on paper, primarily because of the price and that I really wanted
just the keys--I could use MIDI cords to my SQ2 to obtain the piano
sound. But when I played the Fatar, it seemed very springy to me.
I must have a digital piano because like the above paragraph, I am in
a 1-bedroom apartment, upstairs. Also, ever since I was a child when
I did have a real piano in my parent's house, there was always the times
that I'd want to get up at 2AM, 3AM and start playing. Luckily, at the
university there were private practice rooms which let me do that.
Most of all, I'd love playing when an intense thunderstorm was going on.
Even so, sometimes I find it's late at night, about 10PM (not my definition
of late) and get that urge to play. Mark talks about neighbors
banging on your walls--but what about those that live below you?
One time I had a pack of frozen hot dogs fall on my floor and the neighbor
downstairs raised a fuss. This was at 8:30AM on a Friday when I was
reorganizing some items in the freezer after eating breakfast waffles.
I've had countless encounters with this guy, I don't need any more.
Personally, I thought it was pretty funny when the hot dogs fell and
I thought we could have a laugh and perhaps break the ice between us.
Instead, he said that I had to be more considerate of my neighbors,
that I had to refrain from my heavy walking. (It was later discovered
that the heavy walking was caused by the adjacent neighbor whose
floor was the same as mine.) I told him since our last encounter,
I had been focusing on reorganizing my place so I could take the least
amount of steps, especially since he said he went to sleep early because
his job required him to leave at 4AM. I then said, "Wait, it's Friday,
and it's now 8:30AM. Why aren't you at work?"
Luckily, he has now obtained the reputation of being the resident
chronic complainer.
Imagine if he would feel the rhythmic thumping caused by fortissimo chords
from a real piano. Not too long ago when I played my keyboards, I would
wonder if he felt any noise transmitted from my floor to his ceiling.
The above statement about being overly self-conscious does accurately
paint my lack of desire to play. But at our last confrontation, the wife
of the super told the guy that I too paid rent and that I had a life to
live and that I could not continue tippy-toeing everywhere in my apartment.
--
_______________________________________________________________________________
Glenn Mandelkern Hee, hee, hee, hee!
gma...@megatest.com Questor the Elf lives!
What do you think? Do you think? Do you? You?
swee...@gmail.com
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