Help on Rondo Alla Turca (Turkish March)
DennisP
can play it in its entirety from memory (even though my fingers still get
fatigued) towards the end. I've been playing it at moderate speed but now
that I'm experienced enough to make it faster, I've noticed I've had to
change fingering -- not a big problem except for one main area.
In the 13th measure of the Coda section, there is Alberti Base (with an A
chord in root postion) on the left hand; next, the Alberti Base goes to a D
chord with A on the bottom. I have difficulty playing this quickly. I am
using 1,2,5 on the left hand and find it rather awkward to get that thumb to
move fast. Can someone please recommend fingering for this? I've tried to
excercise this area and play it as a chord -- but's it's so different to
play as a chord vs. Alberti Base. Is it that my wrist must move in a
circular motion to get the speed (e.g., turning a door handle)?
Incidentally, I've found that pressing the sustain pedal progressively from
light to full sustain on these measures gives an interesting effect/sound.
Of course, I come fully up on the sustain pedel between chords.
Help is greatly appreciated.
Dennis
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Petri Sihvola
<dperique_does...@comcast.net> wrote:
>Hi. I've been studying this piece for a long time (at least 6 months). I
>can play it in its entirety from memory (even though my fingers still get
>fatigued) towards the end. I've been playing it at moderate speed but now
>that I'm experienced enough to make it faster, I've noticed I've had to
>change fingering -- not a big problem except for one main area.
>
>In the 13th measure of the Coda section, there is Alberti Base (with an A
>chord in root postion) on the left hand;
I use 1,2,5 here...
>next, the Alberti Base goes to a D
>chord with A on the bottom.
...and 2,3,5 here.
>I have difficulty playing this quickly. I am
>using 1,2,5 on the left hand and find it rather awkward to get that thumb to
>move fast. Can someone please recommend fingering for this?
Hopefully this helped.
--
Pete
Cc88m
section. Fingering is not the answer. It is the practice method for alberti in
general, so let me go in some detail.
Of course, start HS. Only 1st 2 notes as parallel sets, 51. Make this as fast
as you can (much faster than final speed, which is easy). If you have
difficulty, start as chords, then as broken chords. Then 3 notes, 512. Really
fast. Again easy; should take only couple days at most. Then 5121. Getting this
really fast might take some work. At this point, start experimenting with hand
rotation, and balancing. Here, you can use a 3-note chord to help you -- bounce
the chord at a certain frequency and then suddenly change to alberti at the
same frequency. This will tell you how the hand should move. Since you spend
more time at 121 than 5, your "center of gravity" should be closer to 1 than 5,
or your will get very tired. That is, you have to press down a little more on
thumb side. Once you get 5121 really fast (much faster than final speed),
practice51215. Then try two albertis in a row plus a 5 at the end. Maintain a
loose elbow & shoulder, try to involve entire hand, and practice relaxation.
Obviously, don't practice only this; find something for RH to practice, and
alternate frequently so neither hand feels ANY fatigue whatsoever. To get any
success, you will find that getting the first 2 notes to start fast is the
secret. To do that, play both in one down movement. Also, try playing all 4
notes in one down movement of hand and bounce back up on the last note so you
can go down again for the repeat. Once you can do it reasonably fast, try all
kinds of different speeds. When 2 works well, go to 3 in a row (end with 5).
It will get much harder and will take more time. By the time you can do 4, you
should find that you can do as many as you want. Now you have more speed than
you need! If your technique is not sufficient, try this for couple weeks, then
take a week rest, and try another 2 weeks, etc.
C. C. Chang; more on piano practice at
DennisP
taken the time to seriously practice Alberti Base -- I just kind of did it
as I worked on various songs. I guess I have to practice just Alberti Base
more seriously.
On a separate note, I have been studying your book for a few weeks now (on
and off when I have time) and feel that I've benefited greatly from it.
Thank you for writing it. I have only read a small portion of it but found
it particularly useful. I plan to continue to read it more regularly once I
get the 100 or so pages printed on actual paper so I can mark it up and make
notes, etc. I've switched to lots more HS practice and felt that I've
solved a lot of problems with your method. I really enjoyed the section on
pedaling.
Regards,
Dennis
"Cc88m" <cc...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030821235222...@mb-m22.aol.com...
Cc88m
>taken the time to seriously practice Alberti Base -- I just kind of did it
>as I worked on various songs. I guess I have to practice just Alberti Base
>more seriously.
Yes, it is definitely useful to take a few weeks, or even months out and get
ONE alberti done to really fast speed with controll, because you need it so
often, and once you have one done, you get the confidence that the next one
will be much easier. Of course, although it will be easier, don't be surprised
if some of them feel like you need to start almost from scratch; but it WILL go
much faster.
DennisP
DennisP
"Petri Sihvola" <petri....@phnet.fi> wrote in message
news:3f4492a6...@news.phnet.fi...
YYZ
>>On Thu, 21 Aug 2003 00:37:46 GMT, "DennisP"
>><dperique_does...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Hi. I've been studying this piece for a long time (at least 6 months).
a long time (at least 6 months) - you have barely scratched the surface.
--
arrau gilels gould richter
DennisP
> DennisP wrote:
>
> >>On Thu, 21 Aug 2003 00:37:46 GMT, "DennisP"
> >><dperique_does...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Hi. I've been studying this piece for a long time (at least 6 months).
>
> a long time (at least 6 months) - you have barely scratched the surface.
I suspected as much. Everytime I play this thing, I can make it sound
different (depending on how lazy I feel, or excited/interested I
feel). I've played with the Alberti bass as block chords, the broken
chords on the left hand (when playing all those octaves) as block
chords with pedal, etc.
There is much to learn on this piece; I'm now working on (along with
Alberti bass), playing much of it without looking at my hands or the
keyboard -- even when I have to jump around the keyboard. I've
started looking a copy of this piece that doesn't have my original
fingering numbers on it so that I can start fresh on fingering
conducive to speed. Only problem is my wife gets tired of listening
to the same thing over and over again although I really love this
piece (because of all you can do with it).
DennisP
YYZ
> YYZ <y...@webmail.co.za> wrote in message news:<3F4B648...@webmail.co.za>...
>
>>DennisP wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>On Thu, 21 Aug 2003 00:37:46 GMT, "DennisP"
>>>><dperique_does...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Hi. I've been studying this piece for a long time (at least 6 months).
>>
>>a long time (at least 6 months) - you have barely scratched the surface.
>
>
> I suspected as much. Everytime I play this thing, I can make it sound
> different (depending on how lazy I feel, or excited/interested I
> feel).
to so so requires almost no skill level whatsoever ... you do know that.
we .are. speaking of a certain mozart snippet here, i take it ... ?
I've played with the Alberti bass as block chords, the broken
> chords on the left hand (when playing all those octaves) as block
> chords with pedal, etc.
>
> There is much to learn on this piece; I'm now working on (along with
> Alberti bass), playing much of it without looking at my hands or the
> keyboard -- even when I have to jump around the keyboard.
why do you feel that this is worthy of mention? should be (is) a given.
I've
> started looking a copy of this piece that doesn't have my original
> fingering numbers on it so that I can start fresh on fingering
> conducive to speed. Only problem is my wife gets tired of listening
> to the same thing over and over again although I really love this
> piece (because of all you can do with it).
because of all you can do with it, except play it as written by w.a.m?
why not the entire sonata, since you feel this is within capabilities?
> DennisP
if not references to sonata k. 331/iii, disregard all written above ...
DennisP
> DennisP wrote:
> > YYZ <y...@webmail.co.za> wrote in message news:<3F4B648...@webmail.co.za>...
> >
> >>DennisP wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>>On Thu, 21 Aug 2003 00:37:46 GMT, "DennisP"
> >>>><dperique_does...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Hi. I've been studying this piece for a long time (at least 6 months).
> >>
> >>a long time (at least 6 months) - you have barely scratched the surface.
> >
> >
> > I suspected as much. Everytime I play this thing, I can make it sound
> > different (depending on how lazy I feel, or excited/interested I
> > feel).
>
> to so so requires almost no skill level whatsoever ... you do know that.
I'm just starting my third year of piano -- so my skill level is
limited.
>
> we .are. speaking of a certain mozart snippet here, i take it ... ?
>
> I've played with the Alberti bass as block chords, the broken
> > chords on the left hand (when playing all those octaves) as block
> > chords with pedal, etc.
> >
> > There is much to learn on this piece; I'm now working on (along with
> > Alberti bass), playing much of it without looking at my hands or the
> > keyboard -- even when I have to jump around the keyboard.
>
> why do you feel that this is worthy of mention? should be (is) a given.
I humbly agree. Unfortunately, when I started playing, I got into the
habit
of having to look at the keyboard and am still trying to unlearn it.
>
> I've
> > started looking a copy of this piece that doesn't have my original
> > fingering numbers on it so that I can start fresh on fingering
> > conducive to speed. Only problem is my wife gets tired of listening
> > to the same thing over and over again although I really love this
> > piece (because of all you can do with it).
>
> because of all you can do with it, except play it as written by w.a.m?
>
> why not the entire sonata, since you feel this is within capabilities?
I will eventually get to the point to play as written -- but I'm still
working on it. I only play the portion titled "Rondo Alla Turca"
because it is what I've heard before and it's "popular" and plenty for
me to work on so far. I
have other pieces that I'm working on too (but they are challenging in
other areas).
>
> > DennisP
>
> if not references to sonata k. 331/iii, disregard all written above ...
This is the part of K.331, I'm referring to:
http://www.mysheetmusic.com/scomain.asp?id=0000118316&Scorch=Selected
Michael Sayers
> Incidentally, I've found that pressing the sustain pedal progressively from
> light to full sustain on these measures gives an interesting effect/sound.
Mozart himself, in at least one extant letter, wrote exultantly about
how much he enjoyed using the innovation of the sustain "pedal" (on
the pianos he used, it was a lever on the piano's underside, moved
upwards by raising the right knee).
Ever tried playing the arpeggio sections of the first movement of K.
545 with the sustain pedal?
M. Sayers
DennisP
Do you mean measures 11 and 56 or 18-21 and 63-66? I really enjoy
this piece
although I'm having difficulty on it too (another story); I find it an
excellent
training piece for hand independence (measures 14-17), arpeggios as
mentioned above, and scales in a musical way (measures 4-9).
DennisP
>
>
> M. Sayers