Beethoven Waldstein Octave Glissando
Daniel G. Emilio
that famous passage. I've never been happy with it because of the
stop at the mid point - as is somewhat a problem with most I imagine.
I'm wondering how others handle this issue. I've heard a Horowitz
recording that almost sounded like octave scales, but at speed that
doesn't seem very likely.
Marvin Wolfthal
program if he found that the action didn't lend itself -
Marvin
albert landa
handed scale and do the left hand octaves glissando.Somehow I find the L.H.
glissando easier and more reliable than the right.I am not sure why this is
so.Perhaps it has something to do with the thumb being on the top.But it
works really quite well. I would be interested in your opinion of this
procedure.
albert landa
"Daniel G. Emilio" <daniel...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:fdd71043.04060...@posting.google.com...
Daniel G. Emilio
> I have found that the best solution for me is to play the R.H. in a two
> handed scale and do the left hand octaves glissando.Somehow I find the L.H.
> glissando easier and more reliable than the right.I am not sure why this is
> so.Perhaps it has something to do with the thumb being on the top.But it
> works really quite well. I would be interested in your opinion of this
> procedure.
>
> albert landa
>
same approach tbroughout, but this combination of approaches solves
many problems. It may not satisfy the purists out there, but it seems
to fit the bill. I'm going to experiment with this tonight. There is
a good reason you find the LH easier than the RH. It's psychological.
When playing the RH descending, you will notice that the LH does not
play. The problem then becomes stopping at the middle G and then
continuing. There is nothing technically difficult about stopping,
but it is difficult nonetheless. This same problem does not exist for
the LH because when you get to the middle G, you also play the RH
chord, which makes the stop immensely easier. If you were to throw in
a LH chord at the middle G on the descending octaves (which you would
never do) you would find the descending glissando to be far easier.
Daniel G. Emilio
> Serkin used to spit on his fingers. Arrau would take the piece off the
> program if he found that the action didn't lend itself -
>
> Marvin
I've heard this as well. What I have tried is to play the initial
attack deep and then as the glissando progresses to slightly lift the
hand and then strike downwardly at the middle G to stop and then
proceed as before. Nothing is really satisfactory because of the
injury due to repeated practice. What I have noticed is that if I
haven't played the piece for awhile, that I play it pretty well the
first or second time and after that I become "gun shy" because the
repeated playing takes its toll. Perhaps the Serkin idea is a good
one, or the alternative is to not practice the glissandi and only play
them in performance.
Daniel
Daniel G. Emilio
> program if he found that the action didn't lend itself -
>
> Marvin
Marvin Wolfthal
> attack deep and then as the glissando progresses to slightly lift the
> hand and then strike downwardly at the middle G to stop and then
> proceed as before. Nothing is really satisfactory because of the
> injury due to repeated practice. What I have noticed is that if I
> haven't played the piece for awhile, that I play it pretty well the
> first or second time and after that I become "gun shy" because the
> repeated playing takes its toll. Perhaps the Serkin idea is a good
> one, or the alternative is to not practice the glissandi and only play
> them in performance.
practice I developed a callous on the pinky that made it much easier to
play.
Marvin
Alan Young
articulated scale, using a fast wrist bounce?
Of course, I may be playing it too slowly, by some standards. But it
works for me.
--
Alan
http://www.hummingbear.net/~aayoung/Jazz/jazz.html
Damn the rules--it's the feeling that counts.
--Coltrane
Harp
> > I've heard this as well. What I have tried is to play the initial
> > attack deep and then as the glissando progresses to slightly lift the
> > hand and then strike downwardly at the middle G to stop and then
> > proceed as before. Nothing is really satisfactory because of the
> > injury due to repeated practice. What I have noticed is that if I
> > haven't played the piece for awhile, that I play it pretty well the
> > first or second time and after that I become "gun shy" because the
> > repeated playing takes its toll. Perhaps the Serkin idea is a good
> > one, or the alternative is to not practice the glissandi and only play
> > them in performance.
> I haven't played the piece for a long time,
Playing a lot of 12 tone music I'll bet! I listened to your recorded
presentation at a public library. It was very interesting, and I thought
you were a very effective speaker. However I couldn't seem to enjoy the
music much. It seems to me that music that doesn't take advantage of the
harmonics of fifths and fourths and octaves etc, the simple mathematical
ratios, sort of hamstrings itself. Aren't humans designed to find such
pitch ratios appealing, or is it the opinion of the 12 tone afficianados
that all such tastes are acquired?
H. Emmerson Meyers
I've seen him play the piece twice. On both occasions he would sneak his
thumb and pinkie into his mouth as he got near the passage and then slide on
down. For Real!!news:8P9vc.29050$3x.9704@attbi_s54...
gregpresley
This is the way I played it as well. (As an articulated octave scale).
With a light enough touch and a very loose wrist, the octaves can go very
fast indeed.
"Alan Young" <aay...@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:020620041811167683%aay...@sonic.net...
Tjako van Schie
> "albert landa" <a.l...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:<40bdd43c$0$1584$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au>...
> > I have found that the best solution for me is to play the R.H. in a two
> > handed scale and do the left hand octaves glissando.Somehow I find the
L.H.
> > glissando easier and more reliable than the right.I am not sure why this
is
> > so.Perhaps it has something to do with the thumb being on the top.But it
> > works really quite well. I would be interested in your opinion of this
> > procedure.
> >
There is a trick for octave glissandi of this type when played with 2 hands:
grab the thumb of either LH or RH to 'fixate' the distance of the octave,
then slide with both little fingers (one of them curved, of course).
I myself however usually play octave glissandi with 1 hand: curving the 5th
finger or thumb (depending on gliss up/down direction) and then, with very
relaxed hand and bit high wrist position and not too much weight, drag the
glissando to the final notes. (i have -luckily for this purpuse- quite large
hands ... i even can do complete 3note chord glissandi this way...)
Re: rehearsing such glissando's and preventing injuries/bladders etc...:
A. first play them silently, only slipping on the surface of the keys, only
to get feeling of the needed speed (tip: listen to the regularity of the
tiny ticks you hear form your nail passing by all keys),
B. then gradually add weight, until only the keys start reacting a bit, but
still without getting sound,
C. and in the end, enough weight to actually hear all notes within the gliss
(ie hammers hit strings by then).
(More dangerous are the *black-key-only* glissandos: there the necessary
relaxation of the hand and fingers is crucial to prevent injuries.)
Regards,
Tjako van Schie, pianist
http://www.tjakovanschie.com
Daniel G. Emilio
This is very good advice. I have never thought of it myself, but it
is logical. I have only ever played the glissando with one hand
because I believe that to be the only proper way. Any other approach
changes coloration, speed or character. I will begin to practice as
you suggest.
Daniel Emilio
Tjako van Schie
Please let me know if this works for you!
regards,
Tjako van Schie
Comcast Newgroups
I used to play it by bouncing the octaves - but could never get it to sound
like Horowitz. His are amazing - but not very musically enjoying to me.
The Schnabel split octaves method works well for many, and is the most
reliable once learned.
I prefer the sound of the double glissando, though.
Here is a tip: Ask your piano technician to polish the front key pins, then
apply teflon lubrication to them. Glissandos become effortless and precise.
It is very common for the key bushings to have a lot of side friction in
them, and this kills glissandi.
Don Mannino RPT
"Daniel G. Emilio" <daniel...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
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