Terry Bozzio and Sabian part ways

[Lisa]

I see on the Sabian website that Terry Bozzio and Sabian have parted
ways. Its under the artist news section.

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article 6a8805e4.02042...@posting.google.com on 20-4-02 2:07
PM, Lisa at lovely...@hotmail.com posted for all the world to see:

> I see on the Sabian website that Terry Bozzio and Sabian have parted
> ways. Its under the artist news section.

Hmm, wonder who he's going to go with now...

Stuart McConaghy - Proud endorser of Canopus Drums
Drop my pants to e-mail me

http://www.javamusic.com/severance
"Je suis Marxiste, tendance Groucho."

[Bill Ray]

I wonder.....

--
Best Regards,
13612
Bill Ray
www.billraydrums.com

"Stuart McConaghy" <stuart_T...@s2-designs.com> wrote in message
news:B8E73178.E5AA%stuart_T...@s2-designs.com...

[Josh]

This will be interesting! Yet another series of cymbals in the offing I'm
sure!
"Lisa" <lovely...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6a8805e4.02042...@posting.google.com...

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article iRiw8.46493$%A.40...@news1.west.cox.net on 20-4-02 2:56 PM,
Bill Ray at bi...@billraydrums.com posted for all the world to see:

Meinl? Paiste? Zildjian? Any one of the countless Turkish makers? Sunluck?
SuperZyn? Krut? Who can tell? ;-)

[kujawat]

Camber.

"Stuart McConaghy" <stuart_T...@s2-designs.com> wrote in message
news:B8E73178.E5AA%stuart_T...@s2-designs.com...

[randysdrums]

well it won't be Zildjian for they do not make custom signature cymbals,
otherwise Weckl would have stayed on.

[Jay Kahrs]

>I see on the Sabian website that Terry Bozzio and Sabian have parted
>ways. Its under the artist news section.

Hmmm... there may be cheap cymbals in the near future.

---
-Jay Kahrs
Owner - Chief Engineer
Mad Moose Recording Inc.
East Rutherford, NJ
http://www.madmooserecording.com

Difficult is what the studios that aren't up to par call it.
Demanding is what the studios that are up to par call it.

[Furrtig]

i have it on good authority he's endorsing Saluda
now.................................ahem.

greg
r a t

[George Larson]

I think the rumored six figures might have had something to do with the
Weckl thing as well.

Zildjian will certainly design cymbals with endorsers in mind (the K Custom
Ride was originally designed for Dave Weckl). They just will not put out a
"Signature" cymbal or line. I actually think that's refreshing. I get tired
of signature everything. It does lead to more choices for drummers, but it
seems to cause a more mercenary endorser mindset.

George

"randysdrums" <randy...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:Unkw8.46545$%A.40...@news1.west.cox.net...

[Josh]

I heard Wuhan
"Furrtig" <fur...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020420172822...@mb-ce.aol.com...

[Josh]

What is the 6 figure rumor?
"George Larson" <panja...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:ymlw8.36606$%s3.14...@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...

[Mell Csicsila]

In article <3Blw8.4158$cT2.1...@news-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca>, "Josh"
<jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I heard Wuhan

Actually, that would not necessarily be out of the realm of
possibility. Universal (the designers/distributors of Wuhan) are also
the owners of Attack, who have a Bozzio drumhead series. Universal has
lots of bronze made for them in China and also has connections with
Michael Ranta's Asian Sound in Cologne.

Although... OBJECTION, calls for speculation, your honor.

--
Mell D. Csicsila
email: mcsicsil (AT) kent (DOT) edu
web: http://home.sprintmail.com/~mdcsicsila

[Edward W Warshauer]

In article <mcsicsil-03848E...@nntp.a001.sprintmail.com>,
Mell Csicsila <mcsi...@kent.edu> wrote:

> In article <3Blw8.4158$cT2.1...@news-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca>, "Josh"
> <jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I heard Wuhan
>
> Actually, that would not necessarily be out of the realm of
> possibility. Universal (the designers/distributors of Wuhan) are also
> the owners of Attack, who have a Bozzio drumhead series. Universal has
> lots of bronze made for them in China and also has connections with
> Michael Ranta's Asian Sound in Cologne.
>
>
>
> Although... OBJECTION, calls for speculation, your honor.

They are also the US rep for Istanbul Mehmet.
ED W

[George Larson]

I heard that Weckl got $100,00 as part of his deal to switch.

Who knows how valid it is, but it did come from an "industry source."

George

"Josh" <jo...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:uHlw8.4227$cT2.1...@news-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...

[Dan Radin]

That has nothing to do with why Weckl left Zildjian.

"randysdrums" <randy...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:Unkw8.46545$%A.40...@news1.west.cox.net...

[Dan Radin]

How about the Dennis Chambers Crash of Doom, the Zach Danzinger Remix, the
Vinnie Colaiuta A. Customs...

"George Larson" <panja...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:ymlw8.36606$%s3.14...@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...

[JVN]

He's not going to use cymbals at all. Says they get in the way...take to long
to set-up...etc. He is going to wear a headset mic and make cymbal-like noises
with his mouth where cymbal hits would have been. Should be cool!

Where there is no vision, people perish. - Ralph Waldo Emerson

[res0hura]

"JVN " <dw...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020420204720...@mb-fd.aol.com...

> He's not going to use cymbals at all. Says they get in the way...take
to long
> to set-up...etc. He is going to wear a headset mic and make
cymbal-like noises
> with his mouth where cymbal hits would have been. Should be cool!

LOL-So what's his next endorsement deal,Chapstick?
Terry's Tic-Tacs?

Les

[George Larson]

They'll mention endorsers in the promo stuff, but they won't do a
"signature" cymbal. Nobody's name is on any Zildjian cymbal besides
Zildjian. The Crash of Doom was developed "with" Dennis Chambers. There are
no "Signature" Zildjians. That was one reason Jonathan Mover went to Sabian,
and I'm sure one reason why Weckl went as well.

George

"Dan Radin" <dra...@rcn.com> wrote in message
news:a9t08f$hgh$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article mcsicsil-03848E...@nntp.a001.sprintmail.com on
20-4-02 6:27 PM, Mell Csicsila at mcsi...@kent.edu posted for all the world
to see:

> In article <3Blw8.4158$cT2.1...@news-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca>, "Josh"

> <jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I heard Wuhan
>
> Actually, that would not necessarily be out of the realm of
> possibility. Universal (the designers/distributors of Wuhan) are also
> the owners of Attack, who have a Bozzio drumhead series. Universal has
> lots of bronze made for them in China and also has connections with
> Michael Ranta's Asian Sound in Cologne.
>
>
>
> Although... OBJECTION, calls for speculation, your honor.

Sustained, although it certainly would bolster Wuhan's market position with
an endorser of that caliber...

[joem]

George Larson wrote:

> They'll mention endorsers in the promo stuff, but they won't do a
> "signature" cymbal. Nobody's name is on any Zildjian cymbal besides
> Zildjian. The Crash of Doom was developed "with" Dennis Chambers. There are
> no "Signature" Zildjians. That was one reason Jonathan Mover went to Sabian,
> and I'm sure one reason why Weckl went as well.

i didn't know jonathon mover had signature sabian cymbals.

--
joe.

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article 3CC1791B...@speedynet.net on 20-4-02 10:20 PM, joem at
jo...@speedynet.net posted for all the world to see:

He doesn't, although he did help develop the Pro Sonix series.

[Dan Radin]

If Jonathan Mover went to Sabian for Signature cymbals, where are they? He
helped design the Pro Sonix line, but they're not the "Jonathan Mover Pro
Sonix" cymbals. Weckl's move was not at all cymbal based. It was a financial
desicion.

"George Larson" <panja...@attbi.com> wrote in message

news:zuow8.36659$%s3.15...@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...

[George Larson]

Whatever, I don't really want to fight about it. I was told by someone with
intimate knowledge of the situation that Mover left because Zildjian would
not do signature cymbals. It's possible that the relationship between
Jonathan and Zildjian was damaged and he felt he really wanted to leave.
Once with Sabian he did help design a line of cymbals. (totally thinking out
loud on that last part)

It might be a question of semantics. I think the fundamental philosophy
could be royalties (is that the right word?). Zildjian will not give a
stipend for a signature model, Sabian will. I'm sure there are other ways
that Zildjian endorsers are compensated, so it might be purely a cosmetic
difference. (more pondering out loud)

I agree that Weckl's move was a financial decision, but I contend that
having a line of Signature cymbals plays into the finances. If you get x
amount every time somebody buys a cymbal with your name on it, it's going to
add up over and above any flat compansation deal.

One last thing on the Mover issue. It's possible Zildjian didn't want to do
a pro-grade line with B8 alloy? That could be taken as not wanting to do a
signature line even though technically Jonathan's name isn't on the Pro
Sonix line. Just a thought.

George

"Dan Radin" <dra...@rcn.com> wrote in message

news:a9t9tr$k3f$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...

[scottp118]

You must have inside knowledge then. Why did Weckl leave Zildjian???

"Dan Radin" <dra...@rcn.com> wrote in message

news:a9t000$gmi$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...

[Dan Radin]

Paycheck.

"scottp118" <scot...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a9td4f$26q$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...

[Funksmith <-- Tony Pros]

lovely...@hotmail.com (Lisa) wrote in news:6a8805e4.0204201007.48186cb0
@posting.google.com:

> I see on the Sabian website that Terry Bozzio and Sabian have parted
> ways. Its under the artist news section.

This is interesting, because he mainly used "his" Radius "tuned" chinas
almost exclusivly, I can only think that wuhan would meet his demand for
China cymbals.

--
<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><
<><
<>< Tony Pros - to...@funksmith.com
<>< http://www.funksmith.com
<><
<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><

I've learned that if someone says something unkind about me,
I must live so that no one will believe it.

[George Lawrence]

Well, US distributor.

--
George Lawrence
George's Drum Shop
Akron, Ohio
http://www.drumguru.com
http://GeorgesDrumShop.com
"If thy neighbor offends thee, buy his children a drum" (Chinese proverb)

"Edward W Warshauer" <hlu...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:hlupino-3A410B...@news.mindspring.com...

[Josh]

My "inside industry source" says that Weckl spent a couple of weeks at the
Sabian factory helping to develop the Evolution line, and that no dotted
line would be signed until the cymbals were right. I was actually
pleasantly surprised when I heard that. Obviously, no endorser is going to
change camps unless there is something in it for them. Yes they are
artists, but they have to pay the bills too! With Weckl, it sounds like at
least an equal motivator, was the product. The Bozzio one stumps me.

"Dan Radin" <dra...@rcn.com> wrote in message

news:a9tehr$78j$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...

[Soulbelly]

>I see on the Sabian website that Terry Bozzio and Sabian have parted
>ways. Its under the artist news section.

that's it. bozzio's dead to me.

peace,
nick

http://www.cdbaby.com/soulbelly
http://www.trueline.com/endorse/amoroso.html
-----
"I know a guy who says he doesn’t like Wheat Thins. He’s an ass. Somebody
needs to shoot him dead" ~ grandpa

[Robert Schuh]

Lisa wrote:

> I see on the Sabian website that Terry Bozzio and Sabian have parted
> ways. Its under the artist news section.

Why the fuck do you people give a rat's ass about such Bullshit. Quit
reading MD and grow the fuck up.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

"The meek shall inherit nothing" - Zappa

[Robert Schuh]

George Larson wrote:

George,
Talk to ANYONE who works for a drum company or cymbal company. NO ONE gets paid
that much $. Think abut how many cymbals, drums etc. i would take to sell to
offset such a large amount of $. I have a buddy who always claimed that Yamaha
paid Mullet Dave and Erskine well into the 6 figures. I asked a buddy who is a
semi big shot at Yamaha and he laughed his ass off. He told me that they don't
make that much profit in one year, let along give that kind of $ away. NEVER
believe these bullshit MD induced rumors. God damn, Modern Drummer is THE worst
fucking rag on the planet.

[wsp]

Very interesting - So Yamaha's yearly profits don't go "well into the 6
figures"?

Realize that "6 figures" means $100,000 to $999,999 - hard to believe that
Yamaha makes less than $1M a year in profits.

Get your story/facts straight, bud.

"Robert Schuh" <r...@robschuh.com> wrote in message
news:3CC3614F...@robschuh.com...

[Ronn Dunnett]

I just received a press release from William Leung III, CEO of the
SunLuck drum company. Mr. Leung stated that he has been working on the
Bozio deal for months and since TB won't switch drum companies (very
loyal to DW) Mr. Leung decided to get into the cymbal making end of
things in order to ecure an endorsement deal.

The first line of cymbals ever produced by a drum company and will be
marketed under the brand name SunLuck Symbals. TB has been heavily
involved in the design of his own signature line and Mr. Leung has
compensated TB to the tune of $1,500,000 US. Bozio denied that money
was a motivator and that the quality and workmanship of the SunLuck
Symbal line is what attracted him. The new line of symbals will be
made from recycled Paiste 602's blended into a special alloy that
includes recycled Ocheltree snare drums. The new line will bear a
special stamp "The spirit of the spirt of 2602". Leung has reportedly
shifted several hundred workers from one of his Nike plants to the
SunLuck Symbal factory.

Under the terms of the agreement, TB has agreed to get a Kenny Aronoff
hairdo/biguglysunglasses make over, begin eating meat again, NEVER
wear black, appear on Oprah and guest host the final episode of
Survivor.

[MMORITZ884]

>
>The first line of cymbals ever produced by a drum company and will be
>marketed under the brand name SunLuck Symbals.

So, the rumor is true! Are these the square symbals I've heard so much about?

[JaKe-Seattle]

I heard his Radia cymbals and they sounded like shite!

JaKe

[Kurgan666]

I wouldn't be surprised if Sabian ended the deal. Hard to believe
Sabian actually sold many of the Radia line -- too specialized, IMO.
Sabian may very well have decided to discontinue the Radia line and it
pissed Terry off. Maybe? Perhaps?

Later,
Chris

lovely...@hotmail.com (Lisa) wrote in message news:<6a8805e4.02042...@posting.google.com>...

[Dan Radin]

Oh man, 9 lug cymbals!

"Ronn Dunnett" <ro...@dunnett.com> wrote in message
news:b16abf84.02042...@posting.google.com...

[Sonall]

I bet Zildjian is going to make some Color Sound Cymbals! lol

[carlton jackson]

I was thinking of dipping mine in chocolate and playing them with turkey
legs......that is the sound that a Radia seems to replicate to me :)

--
carlton jackson
cjac...@teleport.com
sou...@aol.com
-----------------------------
remember......it's always the attempt that counts.

[George Lawrence]

Ronn, That's not the way I heard it. I have an inside source in China (I
speak fluid Mandarin) that Leung's brother, Iron, who took over the Wingnut,
China plant after the death of Leung Jr., enticed Bozzio away from Sabian
with a special deal that included enormous amounts of money, some food so he
can gain some weight, Signature cymbals, and an actual gig with a band,
though they only play in China. Gret band, though: Papa Oom Mao Mao.

--
George Lawrence
George's Drum Shop
Akron, Ohio
http://www.drumguru.com
http://GeorgesDrumShop.com
"If thy neighbor offends thee, buy his children a drum" (Chinese proverb)

"Ronn Dunnett" <ro...@dunnett.com> wrote in message
news:b16abf84.02042...@posting.google.com...

[George Lawrence]

Also buddy Rich was geting close to 40 or 50 grand a year 40 or 50 years
ago.

--
George Lawrence
George's Drum Shop
Akron, Ohio
http://www.drumguru.com
http://GeorgesDrumShop.com
"If thy neighbor offends thee, buy his children a drum" (Chinese proverb)

"wsp" <w...@nothere.com> wrote in message
news:UlJw8.153$I04....@news1.iquest.net...

[George Lawrence]

Yes, drum companies have paid that much to endorsers. I know personally one
in particular who was paid $90,000 verified by both him and the
manufacturer.

--
George Lawrence
George's Drum Shop
Akron, Ohio
http://www.drumguru.com
http://GeorgesDrumShop.com
"If thy neighbor offends thee, buy his children a drum" (Chinese proverb)

"wsp" <w...@nothere.com> wrote in message
news:UlJw8.153$I04....@news1.iquest.net...

[NOSPAM]

>Bozio denied that money
>was a motivator

Oh for christ sakes. Paaaaleasee.

[res0hura]

So..guys like Weckl and Bozzio sign a deal with Sabian,get some endorser
$$, free/low cost equipment, tour/clinic support; Sabian spends $$ on
research & development, re-tooling their manufacturing process,
materials, and ads for the new products, and a few months after Dave's
'Evolution' and Terry's 'Radia' lines hit the market, they walk. I have
to think Sabian's taking a huge bath on these kind of endorsement
agreements,and I'm sure other companies are as well.

I have to wonder why these companies keep going after some of these
big-name players,and this isn't really a knock on Terry or Dave;I like
them both as drummers,but these musical-merchandise-mercenary actions
don't really help anybody's credibility,artist or manufacturer.Kind of
like sports free-agents,I loved A-Rod when he was with the Mariners,but
I can't blame him for taking Texas's $$.

Which leads to my questions for those here in the retail/manufacturing
biz:

1)Are the profits generated by these artists considerable enough to
out-weigh the risk of losing them after a year or two?

2)Are any of the major M.I. manufacturers listed on the Stock
Exchange?Are they good investments?Are the Japanese companies
(Yamaha,Tama,etc.) affected more by the Asian economic climate or the
U.S.A.'s?

Just Wondering..
Les

"George Lawrence" <drum...@ameritech.net> wrote in message
news:Nj2x8.8700$d7.26...@newssrv26.news.prodigy.com...

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article sI6x8.15210$uV.1...@nwrddc01.gnilink.net on 23-4-02 1:56 AM,
res0hura at res0...@verizon.net posted for all the world to see:

I'd say yes. Not necessarily with the signature cymbals, but with lower-end
models. It's about luring the beginning and intermediate student drummers
into the customer base, which is why companies traditionally make a run for
the legendary names like Bozzio, or the current flavor of the month. Get the
teenagers' favorite drummer de jour and you're guaranteed some increased
sales for at least a short period. I'd say they'd at least come close to
recouping their expenses when buying those big-name guys. It's like Jennifer
Lopez doing commercials for L'Oreal, kids love her and want to wear the same
lipstick, or like Lou Rawls doing commercials for life insurance, the
"celebrity spokesperson" helps boost sales.

Yamaha's listed on the stock exchange, and suffered major losses last year,
I believe for the 3rd year in a row. They're projecting losses for this
year, too, mainly because of poor sales in the musical division.

[Ronn Dunnett]

> I bet Zildjian is going to make some Color Sound Cymbals! lol

Don't laugh too hard. There is a company in the US that will be doing
the PVD coating on my Black titanium series. They have an exclusive
deal with Zildjian. You may well see some color sounds from Zildjian.

[Pete Pemberton]

"Ronn Dunnett" <ro...@dunnett.com> wrote in message
news:b16abf84.02042...@posting.google.com...

Let me get a start, here. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Feel better already...

:-)

PP

[JaKe-Seattle]

OH NO!!! The 80's all over again!

[Jay Kahrs]

>Yamaha's listed on the stock exchange, and suffered major losses last year,
>I believe for the 3rd year in a row. They're projecting losses for this
>year, too, mainly because of poor sales in the musical division.

I'm not too suprised. How many drum sets and snare drums can you sell? Think
about it, how many used Recording Custom kits are out there? Why buy a new one?
What about guitars? Where do they go?

---
-Jay Kahrs
Owner - Chief Engineer
Mad Moose Recording Inc.
East Rutherford, NJ
http://www.madmooserecording.com

Difficult is what the studios that aren't up to par call it.
Demanding is what the studios that are up to par call it.

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article 20020423123322...@mb-cc.aol.com on 23-4-02 12:33 PM,
Jay Kahrs at brown...@aol.com posted for all the world to see:

>> Yamaha's listed on the stock exchange, and suffered major losses last year,
>> I believe for the 3rd year in a row. They're projecting losses for this
>> year, too, mainly because of poor sales in the musical division.
>
> I'm not too suprised. How many drum sets and snare drums can you sell? Think
> about it, how many used Recording Custom kits are out there? Why buy a new
> one?
> What about guitars? Where do they go?
>

It's not really drums, that's their profitable area, it's keys and synths
where they've had too many flukes in the past years. They lost the groovebox
business to Roland and Korg, and the synths they've been making over the
last years have been lackluster attempts at best, or better put, they have
the technology to blow the competition out of the water, they don't know
what to do with it and instead run around like headless chickens trying to
jump on bandwagons.

[DD]

So R&D as applied to a majority of the major percussion manufactures amounts
to this:
1.) Drill holes in it.
2.) Paint it a different color.

"Ronn Dunnett" <ro...@dunnett.com> wrote in message
news:b16abf84.02042...@posting.google.com...

[matt porter]

That is strange. I saw him in clinic 4-20-02 Saturday and he had a full
complement of Sabian Radia. Too many to count. He even made a point to
mention them and explain why they sound like they do. (Highly melodic, to
be used in combinations of each other, quick to get out of the way of the
other cymbals, not meant to be played in a traditional manner at all.) And
he said he gets all of his equipment for FREE!

Lisa <lovely...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6a8805e4.02042...@posting.google.com...

[matt porter]

res0hura <res0...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:sI6x8.15210$uV.1...@nwrddc01.gnilink.net...

> Which leads to my questions for those here in the retail/manufacturing
> biz:
>
> 1)Are the profits generated by these artists considerable enough to
> out-weigh the risk of losing them after a year or two?

It depends. If the artist has their name on a product that can be
easily incorporated into the manufacturer's main line, then yes it can be
quite profitable. Remember the Rod Morgenstein Ride Cymbal from Sabian? It
is now the Tri-Tone Ride. Rod's design, but his name is removed as this
cymbal no longer needs artist endorsment to sell. Bozzio's Radias are a
different matter entirely. Paiste created the Vision line exclusively for
TB and sold them all to him until they started to catch on. When TB left
Paiste, Paiste discontinued the line shortly after as there was not enough
business to justify them. Sabian will be in the same pickle and as short a
stay as this has been, I have to believe they did not make the return they
originally anticipated. They may have even dropped him after weighing the
cost of production, advertising, and stocking vs. product sales re: profit.
It would be interesting to know who initiated the break.

> 2)Are any of the major M.I. manufacturers listed on the Stock
> Exchange?Are they good investments?Are the Japanese companies
> (Yamaha,Tama,etc.) affected more by the Asian economic climate or the
> U.S.A.'s?

Yes. Look them up on any financial search and you should come across a
few. M.I. is not usually a good performer as competition is fierce and
profits are small. The cost of manufacture vs. what the public will pay vs.
market saturation is usually the culprit. Combine this with the fact that
most manufacturers are owned by musicians and not business people, you find
capitalization (cash) in small supply. But money can be made in the market
if you do your research and don't rely on your emotions. What you wish
would happen or think ought to happen is not what usually happens.

Matt Porter

[matt porter]

Actually, cymbals should show a bigger profit as it is nothing but a
brass disk. Drum companies have more parts and more competition to contend
with. Overhead, overhead, overhead.

Stuart McConaghy <stuart_T...@s2-designs.com> wrote in message
news:B8EB10F8.EA53%stuart_T...@s2-designs.com...

[George Lawrence]

His contract with Sabian runs through July 15th

--
George Lawrence
George's Drum Shop
Akron, Ohio
http://www.drumguru.com
http://GeorgesDrumShop.com
"If thy neighbor offends thee, buy his children a drum" (Chinese proverb)

"matt porter" <mdpo...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:Omrx8.6273$vV5.31...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...

[Jay Kahrs]

>It's not really drums, that's their profitable area, it's keys and synths
>where they've had too many flukes in the past years. They lost the groovebox
>business to Roland and Korg, and the synths they've been making over the
>last years have been lackluster attempts at best, or better put, they have
>the technology to blow the competition out of the water, they don't know
>what to do with it and instead run around like headless chickens trying to
>jump on bandwagons.

They should reissue the DX7. Then they'd make some money.

[JVN]

Paiste's Colorsounds were existing Paiste models coated in black (there were
other colors too...but Terry adopted the black ones as his) so they weren't a
line designed by Terry/Paiste from the ground up. The Radia on the other hand
were designed by Terry (actually he drew the design during a flight somewhere
if I remember correctly) and Sabian made his ideas come to fruition.

Where there is no vision, people perish. - Ralph Waldo Emerson

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article 5Grx8.6298$qP5.31...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com on 24-4-02
1:47 AM, matt porter at mdpo...@prodigy.net posted for all the world to
see:

>

> res0hura <res0...@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:sI6x8.15210$uV.1...@nwrddc01.gnilink.net...
>> Which leads to my questions for those here in the retail/manufacturing
>> biz:
>>
>> 1)Are the profits generated by these artists considerable enough to
>> out-weigh the risk of losing them after a year or two?
>
> It depends. If the artist has their name on a product that can be
> easily incorporated into the manufacturer's main line, then yes it can be
> quite profitable. Remember the Rod Morgenstein Ride Cymbal from Sabian? It
> is now the Tri-Tone Ride. Rod's design, but his name is removed as this
> cymbal no longer needs artist endorsment to sell. Bozzio's Radias are a
> different matter entirely. Paiste created the Vision line exclusively for
> TB and sold them all to him until they started to catch on. When TB left
> Paiste, Paiste discontinued the line shortly after as there was not enough
> business to justify them. Sabian will be in the same pickle and as short a
> stay as this has been, I have to believe they did not make the return they
> originally anticipated. They may have even dropped him after weighing the
> cost of production, advertising, and stocking vs. product sales re: profit.
> It would be interesting to know who initiated the break.
>

Paiste still makes the Visions line, albeit as a custom option for any of
their existing cymbals. You could get a Traditional Light Ride in back color
sound if you wanted one... Not that you'd want one, but, hey, you never
know...

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article GJrx8.6302$Hg6.31...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com on 24-4-02
1:51 AM, matt porter at mdpo...@prodigy.net posted for all the world to
see:

True, but Yamaha doesn't make cymbals.

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article 20020424022434...@mb-mw.aol.com on 24-4-02 2:24 AM,

Jay Kahrs at brown...@aol.com posted for all the world to see:

>> It's not really drums, that's their profitable area, it's keys and synths

>> where they've had too many flukes in the past years. They lost the groovebox
>> business to Roland and Korg, and the synths they've been making over the
>> last years have been lackluster attempts at best, or better put, they have
>> the technology to blow the competition out of the water, they don't know
>> what to do with it and instead run around like headless chickens trying to
>> jump on bandwagons.
>
> They should reissue the DX7. Then they'd make some money.
>

I'd buy a reissued TX816 in a heartbeat.

[Dan Radin]

"matt porter" <mdpo...@prodigy.net> wrote in message

news:5Grx8.6298$qP5.31...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...

> It depends. If the artist has their name on a product that can be
> easily incorporated into the manufacturer's main line, then yes it can be
> quite profitable. Remember the Rod Morgenstein Ride Cymbal from Sabian?
It
> is now the Tri-Tone Ride. Rod's design, but his name is removed as this
> cymbal no longer needs artist endorsment to sell.

Tri-TOP, and his name's on the bottom, and the "RM" is still in the part
number.

> Paiste created the Vision line exclusively for
> TB and sold them all to him until they started to catch on.

I thought they were designed as a successor to ColorSound.

[Dan Radin]

Their Motif line has been doing incredibly well. However, between GC moving
in on every corner, and internet e-tailers offering low, low discount
pricing, there is absolutely no money in MI technology.

"Jay Kahrs" <brown...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020424022434...@mb-mw.aol.com...

[George Lawrence]

Bronze, not brass (Bronze = mostly copper and some tin) Bought any copper
lately? It ain't cheap.

--
George Lawrence
George's Drum Shop
Akron, Ohio
http://www.drumguru.com
http://GeorgesDrumShop.com
"If thy neighbor offends thee, buy his children a drum" (Chinese proverb)

"matt porter" <mdpo...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:GJrx8.6302$Hg6.31...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...

[Soulbelly]

>> Paiste created the Vision line exclusively for
>> TB and sold them all to him until they started to catch on.

no, they didn't. the vision line replaced the colorsound line. nothing to do
with terry bozzio.

peace,
nick
http://www.cdbaby.com/soulbelly
http://www.trueline.com/endorse/amoroso.html

"...herds of wild felt hogs roaming the countryside" - muffinhead
-----
"For restrooms, go back toward your behind" ~ sign in tokyo airport

[BlueM0ZARK]

<no, they didn't. the vision line replaced the colorsound line. nothing to do
with terry bozzio>

I remember those red paistes, scary stuff....

[Dan Radin]

My middle school (school colors keeley green and gold) had a horrible kit
rewrapped in gold wrap with green colorsounds. Yikes!

"BlueM0ZARK" <bluem...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020424125649...@mb-bj.aol.com...

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article aa7pc7$gjo$1...@bob.news.rcn.net on 24-4-02 10:24 PM, Dan Radin at
dra...@rcn.com posted for all the world to see:

I had dual-coloured Colorsound crashes, black on one side, and white on the
other.

[matt porter]

I wasn't speaking specifically about Yamaha. I was just making a general
comment. I didn't make myself clear. You were right to call me on it.

Matt Porter

Stuart McConaghy <stuart_T...@s2-designs.com> wrote in message

news:B8EC35CB.EC0A%stuart_T...@s2-designs.com...

[matt porter]

whoops! Slip of the keyboard. I know better.

Matt Porter

George Lawrence <drum...@ameritech.net> wrote in message

news:vkzx8.8921$d7.28...@newssrv26.news.prodigy.com...

[matt porter]

I stand corrected. Wow, three errors in one thread. I must need a nap.

Matt Porter

matt porter <mdpo...@prodigy.net> wrote in message

news:5Grx8.6298$qP5.31...@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...

[Dan Radin]

Very nice, Mr. McConaghy, very nice.

"Stuart McConaghy" <stuart_T...@s2-designs.com> wrote in message

news:B8ECE2D4.ECF0%stuart_T...@s2-designs.com...

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article WUJx8.11784$3I6.32...@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com on 24-4-02
10:32 PM, matt porter at mdpo...@prodigy.net posted for all the world to
see:

I couldn't resist, mate, I'm in smartypants mode today ;)

[Vdrummer]

While I hate to kill all the speculation. I had dinner with Terry a
week and a half ago. He is now with Wuhan.

[Stuart McConaghy]

in article aa7qvn$mgs$1...@bob.news.rcn.net on 24-4-02 10:51 PM, Dan Radin at

dra...@rcn.com posted for all the world to see:

> Very nice, Mr. McConaghy, very nice.

At that time I also had waist-long hair and played METAL!!!!! ;-)