Single Coil Switching - Volume Levels Between Humbucker and Single Coil Tap
Martin Dodd
I have a standard fender strat with a DiMarzio HS-2 in the bridge and Fender
Fat 50's in the middle and neck.
I am using a 250k switchable (push-pull) tone pot to switch the HS-2 between
single coil (first/top coil) and normal (in series) humbucking mode.
The single coil sounds fine with plenty of volume, but when switching to
humbucking mode the output level of the pickup decreases. Okay it does
sound warmer and there is no noise in humbucking mode which is great, but
it's a shame I can't have more volume in humbucking mode compared to single
coil mode.
Is there a way to increase the level of the humbucker mode compared to the
single coil?
I thought about maybe trying to use the lower single coil for the tap rather
than the upper one? But what would be the effect on the single coil tone?
Thanks,
Martin Dodd
Ross M Stites
>The single coil sounds fine with plenty of volume, but when switching to
>humbucking mode the output level of the pickup decreases. Okay it does
>sound warmer and there is no noise in humbucking mode which is great, but
>it's a shame I can't have more volume in humbucking mode compared to single
>coil mode.
Check your wiring and make sure that it's really in series and not in
parallel when humbucking. You should see an increase in volume when you
run a pickup in standard series humbucking mode vs. in single coil mode.
Ross
Zorro_2K
"Martin Dodd" <mar...@clara.co.uk> wrote in message
news:103086429...@dyke.uk.clara.net...
While your single coils are intended to work with 250K control pots, your
humbucker is intended to
work with 500K control pots, particularly the volume control pot. 250 K
pots will load down you humbucker
and make it sound muddy and there could be a decrease in volume. I would
suggest changing the volume pot to a 500K value, and putting a seperate tone
control on the humbucker alone.
Amostagain
Ross
>>
The Duncan Classic Stacks I had were louder in single coil mode mode than
humbucking mode.
My tunes at:
http://www.geocities.com/mondoslugness
Don Evans
"Ross M Stites" <stit...@garnet.tc.umn.edu> wrote in message
news:aksh01$lu3$1...@garnet.tc.umn.edu...
remember, the stack style humbuckers are louder in the S.C. mode anyway ...
something to do with the second coil not being next to the strings. My
buddy's Anderson Strats were that way too!
Don
Amostagain
<< "Ross M Stites" <stit...@garnet.tc.umn.edu> wrote in message
news:aksh01$lu3$1...@garnet.tc.umn.edu...
> "Martin Dodd" <mar...@clara.co.uk> writes:
>
> >The single coil sounds fine with plenty of volume, but when switching to
> >humbucking mode the output level of the pickup decreases. Okay it does
> >sound warmer and there is no noise in humbucking mode which is great, but
> >it's a shame I can't have more volume in humbucking mode compared to
single
> >coil mode.
>
> Check your wiring and make sure that it's really in series and not in
> parallel when humbucking. You should see an increase in volume when you
> run a pickup in standard series humbucking mode vs. in single coil mode.
>
> Ross
>
Wait! That was a Dimarzio HS2? That's a "stack" pickup, right? As I
remember, the stack style humbuckers are louder in the S.C. mode anyway ...<<
ding ding ding ding
something to do with the second coil not being next to the strings. My
buddy's Anderson Strats were that way too!
Don
>>
Ross M Stites
><< "Martin Dodd" <mar...@clara.co.uk> writes:
>Ross
> >>
Really!? Is this something specific to stacked humbuckers? (I don't
think I've ever had stacked ones, so maybe I've missed this.)
Ross
Ross M Stites
I stand corrected on this, then...and yes now that I think about it this
makes perfect sense with a pair of stacked magnets vs. parallel
(physically, not electrically) magnets.
Hopefully someone has a helpful suggestion for the original poster because
obviously I don't! :) My experience with pickups is that I typically set
them up for the sound I like best and just leave them that way (no
switches for anything).
Ross
Martin Dodd
news:bxrc9.64773$Rx4.6...@twister.tampabay.rr.com...
>
> While your single coils are intended to work with 250K control pots, your
> humbucker is intended to
> work with 500K control pots, particularly the volume control pot. 250 K
> pots will load down you humbucker
> and make it sound muddy and there could be a decrease in volume. I would
> suggest changing the volume pot to a 500K value, and putting a seperate
tone
> control on the humbucker alone.
>
>
Ok thanks for the feedback on this one. I have emailed DiMarzio as well to
see what they say. I'll post the answer if I get one.
I like the suggestion above... makes some sense, but even with new control
pots, wouldn't the single coil still sound louder than the humbucker? ...It
actually says in the HS-2 manual that single coil mode will sound louder
than the humbucker wired in series, so I guess this goes for any size pots?
I am trying to get the best of both worlds, but it's looking like you either
have to have one or the other, ie. good single coil sound, or good
humbucking sound. So I have to sort out my priorities. Shame though, you'd
think there would be mod to boost the output of the stacked humbucker wired
in series compared to the top single coil?
Also if I upgraded my volume pot to 500k what effect would this have on the
tone of the rest of my pickups? Wouldn't it just make the single top coil
in the humbucker louder as well.... back to square one! Or would the
humbucker volume increase more relative to the single coil?
I will also give the guy a call in the shop where I bought the pickup and
see if he has any answers. If there is no answer to this one then I will
either have to stick to what I have, or go buy a more powerful stacked
humbucker for the bridge, but then I'd lose the good single coil sound of
the HS2... catch 22 !!!
The search continues....
Thanks again,
Martin
HarryJ
Yes
"Ross M Stites" <stit...@garnet.tc.umn.edu> wrote in message
news:aktkq2$cvi$1...@garnet.tc.umn.edu...
Zorro_2K
> "Zorro_2K" <PCo...@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:bxrc9.64773$Rx4.6...@twister.tampabay.rr.com...
> >
> > While your single coils are intended to work with 250K control pots,
your
> > humbucker is intended to
> > work with 500K control pots, particularly the volume control pot. 250 K
> > pots will load down you humbucker
> > and make it sound muddy and there could be a decrease in volume. I
would
> > suggest changing the volume pot to a 500K value, and putting a seperate
> tone
> > control on the humbucker alone.
> >
> >
>
> Ok thanks for the feedback on this one. I have emailed DiMarzio as well
to
> see what they say. I'll post the answer if I get one.
>
> I like the suggestion above... makes some sense, but even with new control
> pots, wouldn't the single coil still sound louder than the humbucker?
...It
> actually says in the HS-2 manual that single coil mode will sound louder
> than the humbucker wired in series, so I guess this goes for any size
pots?
Typically, a humbucker will overpower a single coil because it puts out
about twice
the signal level of a single coil. I have never played around with wiring
the coils of a humbucker in series,
but only of tapping a humbucker for dual or single coil operation, and the
single coil mode has always
been less powerful than both coils of the humbucker wired together.
> I am trying to get the best of both worlds, but it's looking like you
either
> have to have one or the other, ie. good single coil sound, or good
> humbucking sound. So I have to sort out my priorities. Shame though,
you'd
> think there would be mod to boost the output of the stacked humbucker
wired
> in series compared to the top single coil?
Shouldn't be that way...
>
> Also if I upgraded my volume pot to 500k what effect would this have on
the
> tone of the rest of my pickups? Wouldn't it just make the single top coil
> in the humbucker louder as well.... back to square one! Or would the
> humbucker volume increase more relative to the single coil?
500K vol pot will make the single coils sound a little brighter and
snappier. You compensate by
rolling their tone control down a little.
> I will also give the guy a call in the shop where I bought the pickup and
> see if he has any answers. If there is no answer to this one then I will
> either have to stick to what I have, or go buy a more powerful stacked
> humbucker for the bridge, but then I'd lose the good single coil sound of
> the HS2... catch 22 !!!
>
> The search continues....
Good luck...keep us posted.
Zorro_2K
"Don Evans" <GtrDo...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:3d72...@snipnews.snip.net...
Maybe that's why EJ uses one at the bridge of his Strat in single coil mode
only (or so I have read)
Martin Dodd
I have read a few places that indeed stacked humbuckers are quieter in
humbucking mode than in single coil mode. And I also had a reply from
www.suhrguitars.com, that this is the case... "Most stacks are weaker than
real single coils and are louder when the
bottom coil is turned off". Why this is the case though I don't know? If
this problem could be solved someone could make a lot of money selling
pickups!!! I'm off to redesign the stacked humbucker! ...
Anyway given current pickup technology my options are:
1. Stick with what I have: A great single coil sound at the bridge (HS-2 in
single coil mode), but a rather lame humbucking sound.
or
2. Get a small side-by-side humbucker like the Seymour Duncan JBjr or
little59, and compromise on the single coil sound.
I am going to stick with option 1 for now because the single coil sound is
more important to me. I think I'll be able to get round the lack of volume
on the humbucker with effects and compression etc. It's not ideal, but it'll
give me an extra (noise free) option when cranking up the gain.
Thanks for the feedback on this everyone,
Martin
"Zorro_2K" <PCo...@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message
news:PjLc9.71822$bc.9...@twister.tampabay.rr.com...
Martin Dodd
Yes I think it's common knowledge now that ej has used an hs2 in the bridge,
although I'm not sure whether he still uses it? It does sound good in
single coil mode, but pretty weak as a humbucker at the bridge. It's
actually designed for neck or middle positions!
Don Evans
You're welcome, and your plan sounds like a winner to me. (I assume you've
checked out the other hum canceling S.C. size designs).
Don
Zorro_2K
> I have the answer !!! .... :o)
>
> I have read a few places that indeed stacked humbuckers are quieter in
> humbucking mode than in single coil mode. And I also had a reply from
> www.suhrguitars.com, that this is the case... "Most stacks are weaker than
> real single coils and are louder when the
> bottom coil is turned off". Why this is the case though I don't know?
If
> this problem could be solved someone could make a lot of money selling
> pickups!!! I'm off to redesign the stacked humbucker! ...
>
> Anyway given current pickup technology my options are:
>
> 1. Stick with what I have: A great single coil sound at the bridge (HS-2
in
> single coil mode), but a rather lame humbucking sound.
> or
> 2. Get a small side-by-side humbucker like the Seymour Duncan JBjr or
> little59, and compromise on the single coil sound.
>
>
A third option would be to buy a terrific sounding, noiseless single coil
such as the Kinman SCn
pickup. This pickup, although a little on the pricey side, is an
outstanding bridge pickup. It is quieter than
a humbucker, and designed to work with the 250K standard Fender control
pots. You won't be able
to use a push-pull switch with it but you won't need to.
Martin Dodd
real thing. I need 2 guitars really, but buying a set of pickups is a lot
cheaper than a Gibson, and it keeps me happy :o)
John Suhr has recommended V60 LP's in the neck and bridge and a DSH
humbucker in the bridge, so I'm going to play a guitar with these in and see
what the single coil sound of the DSH is like, I'm sure the humbucker will
be good as it's the genuine thing. If this is more suitable I may change in
a year or two. Got to get my money's worth from my Fat 50's and HS-2 yet.
Should inspire some new tracks hopefully.
Cheers,
Martin
Martin Dodd
Yes I've read up about the Kinmans but never tried them. They have varying
reports, but mostly excellent. I'll definitely be trying them out the next
time I'm in a shop... The proof is in the pudding as they say!
Martin
David Eidelberg
"Amostagain" <amost...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020901125255...@mb-mh.aol.com...