Kicking guitarist out of band.

Charlie Metcalf

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Apr 26, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/26/95

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Tonight was real difficult. Another band member and I had the unpleasant
duty to tell a guy he was out of our band. I was selected as the one to
break the news.

It was no fun, but I'm glad I was honest. The ejected player got honest
too about how he hadn't been practicing. I wish this guy all of the best
that life has to offer. I also firmly believe our band will sound better
without him. I'm glad we're past this hurdle.
Charlie

Jerry Loyd

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Apr 27, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/27/95

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In article <3nne7n$3...@crl7.crl.com> cmet...@crl.com (Charlie Metcalf) writes:
>From: cmet...@crl.com (Charlie Metcalf)
>Subject: Kicking guitarist out of band.
>Date: 26 Apr 1995 23:39:51 -0700

Charlie,

You've uncovered the main reason I've never been in a band. Most non-musical
people think that all you need is some talent, and BAM! out comes great music.
Until recently, I've never been able to put into words why I've stayed away
from it, but now I can.

Good bands need good management. The whole thing needs to be approached with
a "project" mentality, and there needs to be someone to lead or manage the
project. And the leadership aspect of management often times requires that
you do some unpleasant things in order to protect the integrity of the group,
to maintain or increase the synergy.

Charlie, look at this as experience, learning the ropes, etc. You could be on
your way to becoming a great manager. And kicking the other guy out for non-
performance may have been the best thing that's ever happened to him... he'll
either give up, or get serious.

Hang in there... and mention me in your first album notes as a great influence.

Best regards, Jerry Loyd

Chrispy

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Apr 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/28/95

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In article <3nne7n$3...@crl7.crl.com> cmet...@crl.com (Charlie Metcalf) writes:
>Tonight was real difficult. Another band member and I had the unpleasant
>duty to tell a guy he was out of our band. I was selected as the one to
>break the news.

What's this? You mean it's not standard operating procedure to
just tell him "I'm rewriting all the songs, I'll letyou know when
we'll start practicing again" then schedule a gig with his next
door neighbor's band, so when he runs into the neighbor the
neighbor can say "Hey, guess what, your old band is opening for
us next month. i heard the drummer quit too.."

Old band?? Drummer quit too?

Not that I'm scarred forever and will never get over it :-)

Peace
Chris

Chris

Charlie Metcalf

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Apr 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/28/95

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Much thanks to those of you who responded, whether by posting replies to
my original post, or by emailing me messages. I appreciate your
thoughtfulness.

We rehearsed last night, and the band sounded significantly better on
just about every song without our recently departed member.

Thanks again,
Charlie

Port'o'Chael

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Apr 28, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/28/95

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I disagree with the "manager is a necessity" bit. I think a lot of
it depends on the relative maturity of the individuals, and if all
the members have a similar goal, drive, and competence level. In a
situation like this, you can force someone to comply, yes; but if
you do, it probably won't last too long. I've been in bands that
lasted over ten years, and bands that lasted under ten days (!).
Everybody's got to have their head in a similar place, or no amount
of management is going to hold it together.
---Michael...
Really wierd Japanese Fender Strats, and a Pearce amp. Tone heaven.
_________________________________ ________________________________
_________________________________BGSC________________________________

Kazuya Shinyashiki

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Apr 29, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/29/95

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In article <jerry_loyd....@hpboi1.desk.hp.com>,

Jerry Loyd <jerry...@hpboi1.desk.hp.com> wrote:
>You've uncovered the main reason I've never been in a band. Most non-musical
>people think that all you need is some talent, and BAM! out comes great music.
>Until recently, I've never been able to put into words why I've stayed away
>from it, but now I can.
>
>Good bands need good management. The whole thing needs to be approached with
>a "project" mentality, and there needs to be someone to lead or manage the
>project. And the leadership aspect of management often times requires that
>you do some unpleasant things in order to protect the integrity of the group,
>to maintain or increase the synergy.

Hmmm...I'm sure some bands might need "good management", but it's hardly a
necessity. I think it all depends on what kind of situation you are looking
for. Some situations might call for some type of "leadership", but others
won't, ie just a bunch of people who consider eachother equals having a good
time hopefully making good music. If you refuse to join a band because of
the "management" thing, don't. Being in a band can be a really rewarding
experience, and you can learn so much you can't from books/videos/practicing
alone/etc. Most of all, it can be a lot of fun. There are some situations
where, in a band, you just play your part and everyone else plays their part
and that's it. But there are other situations where you all feed off
eachother and, after a while, begin to influence eachother's playing,
hopefully making the whole greater than the sum of the parts. Of course,
there are a lot of ups and downs, and it can sometimes be pretty damn hard
finding the right group of people, but if you keep at it, it will be well
worth the effort. Personally, I don't like to deal with people who are in
a band where everyone is supposed to be considered equal, who suddenly
decide they are going to be the leader and give orders. So I try my best
to avoid situations like that, and I've always got the option to leave the
band if it gets to be like that (or too screwed upin any other way).

And that kicking people out thing, it sucks but sometimes you just have to
do it. There was this one singer in a band I was in who would (just for
the hell of it, without even telling anyone) skip basically every second
practice. Sure we were in it mostly just to have a good time, but a
little bit of common courtesy would have been nice. So we had to kick her
out or continue being dumped on all the time.
--
Kaz Shinyashiki
shin...@sfu.ca

David A Evans

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Apr 29, 1995, 3:00:00 AM4/29/95

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Jerry Loyd (jerry...@hpboi1.desk.hp.com) wrote:

: Good bands need good management. The whole thing needs to be approached with

: a "project" mentality, and there needs to be someone to lead or manage the
: project. And the leadership aspect of management often times requires that
: you do some unpleasant things in order to protect the integrity of the group,
: to maintain or increase the synergy.

: Charlie, look at this as experience, learning the ropes, etc. You could be on

: your way to becoming a great manager. And kicking the other guy out for non-
: performance may have been the best thing that's ever happened to him... he'll
: either give up, or get serious.

You've touched on some great points, Jerry. But I have to mention that
you have to be able to _work_ and _live_ with the guys in the band. We
had to fire our drummer, because he was an egotist who fished for
compliments and then took a holier-than-thou attitude when he got them.
Sure he was a good musician, but I rather have a musician who is not
quite as great musicly, but is a great guy to hang with. It's hard to
find the mixture of the two, and I wish the original poster the best of luck.