Guy at Intercontinental music (Ottawa) lost his mind?
Mike Dusseault
I don't know quite what to make of this.
Last week I was browsing in Intercontinental Music (Ottawa, Canada, Bank
street). It's a rather small music store that opened up very recently.
I looked at a few tab books in their limited selection but didn't find
what I was looking for. I looked at a few cymbals to supplement my
midi drum set. Finally, I asked him if he had any microphone preamps.
That's when he says: "Yes, we have everything... When you are ready to
buy..." In case you haven't caught on, he basically wouldn't show me
the preamp.
I was pretty much staggered by this. I said "If that's the level of service
I'm getting..." and left. But I shook my head pretty much all the way
back to work thinking to myself "Wow. Apparently, he doesn't know who
he's talking to!" What I mean is, I spend quite a bit on guitars and other
things for my little home studio. Salespeople that know me will generally
fight to get to me. Sure, he didn't know that. But that's just the
point. He should be nice to any customer, or he is killing his pathetic
business.
So, I've come to the conclusion that the guy has lost his mind. What
kind of business owner would do something like that to a customer?
I wasn't even in there for more than about 25 minutes, and I was the
only customer there (as every other time I've gone in there). I was
quite polite, as (almost) always.
Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
location? Was it his foreign accent?
Once again, this confirms why I keep returning to Steve's music. Great
prices, they know what they are talking about, and they treat me right.
Vote with your feet!
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
This mailbox is UBE filtered. Junk | "Reality is that which, when
automatically sent to /dev/null. | you stop believing in it,
<mi...@bulwark1.ic.gc.ca> | doesn't go away."
Disclaimer: "Wasn't me, dude." | - Phillip K. Dick
Kurt Rohde
Mike Dusseault (mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca) wrote:
> Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
> business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
> Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
> location? Was it his foreign accent?
It used to be Continental, before they went bankrupt, and resurfaced.
> Once again, this confirms why I keep returning to Steve's music. Great
> prices, they know what they are talking about, and they treat me right.
Sorry, Steve's sucks too.....
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kurt Rohde
Carleton University
"Born to lose.....Live to win."
Motorhead
Email address: kro...@chat.carleton.ca
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Frank Carr
Mike Dusseault wrote in message <6csvtt$q...@crc-news.doc.ca>...
>Anybody else ever have anything like this happen?
I've had this happen a few times at various music stores and some other
types of stores as well. It's my feeling that this attitude comes from jaded
arrogance and general snobbery. One important thing I've learned about sales
is that you never know who you're talking to. Someone dressed nicely may be
one transaction away from bankruptcy and some dressed poorly might be a
millionaire. And, today, you might be talking with someone who'll trash your
company in an internet newsgroup if you're rude to them.
If you've ever seen the movie "Pretty Woman", you may recall a funny scene
where, after a major shopping spree, Julia Roberts' character returns to the
store where she was snubbed the day before and explains to the sales ladies
(who're paid on commission) what a big mistake they made. I've heard that
this film segment is often used in sales training for people who'll be
selling to a wealthy clientele.
My guess is that with this kind of attitude, he won't be in business very
long.
Frank Carr
jfc...@msn.com
George
On 23 Feb 1998 23:15:09 GMT, mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca (Mike Dusseault)
wrote:
This used to happen to everyone I know who ever went to Guitar Center
out here in Los Angeles before they got so much flak from customers
that one day they turned "nice" on us.
In fact, I remember very well the whole bullshit line when the
salesman would duck in a back room to "talk to the manager" and leave
us sitting there for a good 20 minutes. I remember spending at least 6
hours at the local Guitar Center about 10 years ago when my friend
bought a guitar and haggled the whole time. It was classic.
We even made a fake commercial on my 4 track about the experience,
including the salesman calling my friend the wrong name the whole time
we were there, and continually trying to get him to buy different
guitars every time he came back from the dreaded back room. I was
annoying at the time, but looking back on it, it was damn funny!
George
blaine
We've got a guy like that in our home town. The place is called Right-On
Henry's. The guy is a real dick. He has a policy of not letting you play
his guitars for more than ten minutes. I guess this is to ward off
people like me who like to just come in and play his shit. Well, I do
that at another place, Cindy's, all the time, and because of that, he
gets all my business. He also took forever to pay my friend's band for a
gig. They went in there a couple of times, only to be told that he
didn't have the money. He doesn't know what he's talking about either.
He told my bass player that a 6 string bass is tuned from G to G, which
is completely wrong. What a dumbass.
Mike Dusseault wrote:
snip
> I was pretty much staggered by this. I said "If that's the level of service
> I'm getting..." and left. But I shook my head pretty much all the way
> back to work thinking to myself "Wow. Apparently, he doesn't know who
> he's talking to!" What I mean is, I spend quite a bit on guitars and other
> things for my little home studio. Salespeople that know me will generally
> fight to get to me. Sure, he didn't know that. But that's just the
> point. He should be nice to any customer, or he is killing his pathetic
> business.
>
> So, I've come to the conclusion that the guy has lost his mind. What
> kind of business owner would do something like that to a customer?
> I wasn't even in there for more than about 25 minutes, and I was the
> only customer there (as every other time I've gone in there). I was
> quite polite, as (almost) always.
>
> Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
> business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
> Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
> location? Was it his foreign accent?
--
---------------------------------------------
blaine
we...@vt.edu
Push it into third if you know you're gonna
climb a hill
Eat plenty of lasagna 'til you know
that you've had your fill
Resist all the urges that make you wanna
go out and kill.
---------------------------------------------
Steve King
Frank Carr (jfc...@email.msn.com) wrote:
: One important thing I've learned about sales
: is that you never know who you're talking to.
Yes.
But. It's a poor salesman, indeed, who fails to "qualify"
his customer. And if he misses that 10% of grubby kids (or whatever)
that really does have his Mom's Platinum VISA in his pocket,
he's also spent 90% of his time with adults that can and will
buy....
Now, I admit, this probably isn't appropriate to the retail music,
or this incident, in particular; then again, I can't figure out
most music stores, anyway. Huge levels of arrogance; I'm *almost*
amused by it.
"Instead of telling me I can't play _Stairway to Heaven_, why
not tell you manager you're sick of working on Saturdays?"
Mike Dusseault
In article <6ct9ss$8l4$2...@bertrand.ccs.carleton.ca>,
kro...@chat.carleton.ca (Kurt Rohde) writes:
> Mike Dusseault (mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca) wrote:
>> Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
>> business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
>> Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
>> location? Was it his foreign accent?
>
Yeah, I'd heard that. I'm pretty sure this one will go the same way
eventually.
>
>> Once again, this confirms why I keep returning to Steve's music. Great
>> prices, they know what they are talking about, and they treat me right.
>
> Sorry, Steve's sucks too.....
Really? I'm somewhat surprised to hear you say that. You've had problems
with Steve's?
Alex Tobias
mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca (Mike Dusseault) wrote:
>I don't know quite what to make of this.
>Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
>business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
>Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
>location? Was it his foreign accent?
Few things to keep in mind.
Here in the US the stats for new businesses that fail are 9 out of 10.
I don't think most small business owners are rocket scientists based
on these stats.
It's a good possiblity this bozo has his own business because no
company already in existance would ever hire him because he doesn't
have the proper people skills, business skills, etc...
Some people are just jerks period, business owners or not.
There will always be morons that judge people by age/appearance and
discriminate based on those things...
When I was a youngster who had long hair and dressed like a bum the
treatment I received was 180 degrees away from what I get if I walk
into a store these days. Now I'm fairly clean cut and in my mid 30's.
For the most part they size you up based on the amount of $$$ they
think you have.
lo-fi
On 24 Feb 1998 02:05:16 GMT, kro...@chat.carleton.ca (Kurt Rohde)
wrote:
>Mike Dusseault (mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca) wrote:
>> Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
>> business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
>> Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
>> location? Was it his foreign accent?
>
>It used to be Continental, before they went bankrupt, and resurfaced.
>
>> Once again, this confirms why I keep returning to Steve's music. Great
>> prices, they know what they are talking about, and they treat me right.
>
>Sorry, Steve's sucks too.....
>
I don't know about Ottawa, but the Steve's in Toronto does indeed
suck. You can cut the attitude in there with a knife.
Brad Holstead
Webmaster
Victoria University
b.holstead'at'utoronto.ca
Mercutio
This is exactly why you pass so many gone-out-of-business, boarded up
storefronts in many towns. Many people know about music but know nothing
about retail business.
Kurt Rohde
Mike Dusseault (mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca) wrote:
> Really? I'm somewhat surprised to hear you say that. You've had problems
> with Steve's?
Steve's has their assholes too. I imagine there is no perfect store. They
have nothing. I used to like Steve's until I tried US stores, then I
learned what real music stores are like......and it ain't Steve's. When I
was interested in a Hughes & Kettner amp, they didnt have it. The guy said
he didnt have any info on it, and said if I wanted to pay up front, they
could order it in, but I wouldn't be able to return it. An hours drive to
the US, I found a little store which had one. Tried it. Hated it. Glad I
didnt buy it......
root
In article <6cuuu7$d...@surf.beaches.net>,
at7...@aol.com (Alex Tobias) writes:
> mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca (Mike Dusseault) wrote:
>
>>I don't know quite what to make of this.
>
>>business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
>>Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
>>location? Was it his foreign accent?
--- snip ---
> There will always be morons that judge people by age/appearance and
> discriminate based on those things...
>
> When I was a youngster who had long hair and dressed like a bum the
> treatment I received was 180 degrees away from what I get if I walk
> into a store these days. Now I'm fairly clean cut and in my mid 30's.
> For the most part they size you up based on the amount of $$$ they
> think you have.
I know exactly what you mean. Walking into any store with a suit on,
for example, and the sales droids flock to you immediately. And I
remember quite well the treatment I used to get when I was a teenager.
When I'd cross the border, I'd always get hassled by border guards.
Now, they leave me alone. It's pretty sad really.
Of course, that day I was dressed fine. Short hair, clean clothes,
shaved and everything. Basically dressed fine for work (computers).
If I was dressed like a bum, I wouldn't have been surprised at the
treatment (angry, yes, but surprised, no). Maybe it's because I'm
young (26) or something.
You would figure a music store would be nice to people no matter what
they look like. Considering how many musicians dress... <g>
blaine
Alex Tobias wrote:
>
> mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca (Mike Dusseault) wrote:
>
> >I don't know quite what to make of this.
>
> >Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
> >business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
> >Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
> >location? Was it his foreign accent?
>
>
> Here in the US the stats for new businesses that fail are 9 out of 10.
>
> I don't think most small business owners are rocket scientists based
> on these stats.
>
> It's a good possiblity this bozo has his own business because no
> company already in existance would ever hire him because he doesn't
> have the proper people skills, business skills, etc...
>
> Some people are just jerks period, business owners or not.
I seem to remember you acting like this a lot about 6 months ago.
RJT NW, Inc
Yes, we have everything... When you are ready
to buy...
And then you spend a full page trashing him all over the net.
Hmmm, could it be you're a little sensative?
Perhaps he was saying that if you wanted to buy something, he could
get it. Small shop owners, which you are so quick to assassinate
often can't afford to stock every product, but are willing to order in
the product at a competitive price. But it sounds like you were too
busy lugging away your heavy chip to find out.
rjt
mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca (Mike Dusseault) wrote
I don't know quite what to make of this.
Last week I was browsing in Intercontinental Music (Ottawa, Canada,
Bank
street). It's a rather small music store that opened up very
recently.
I looked at a few tab books in their limited selection but didn't
find
what I was looking for. I looked at a few cymbals to supplement
my
midi drum set. Finally, I asked him if he had any microphone
preamps.
That's when he says: "Yes, we have everything... When you are ready
to
buy..." In case you haven't caught on, he basically wouldn't
show me
the preamp.
I was pretty much staggered by this. I said "If that's the
level of service
I'm getting..." and left. But I shook my head pretty much
all the way
back to work thinking to myself "Wow. Apparently, he doesn't
know who
he's talking to!" What I mean is, I spend quite a bit on guitars
and other
things for my little home studio. Salespeople that know me
will generally
fight to get to me. Sure, he didn't know that. But that's
just the
point. He should be nice to any customer, or he is killing
his pathetic
business.
So, I've come to the conclusion that the guy has lost his mind.
What
kind of business owner would do something like that to a customer?
I wasn't even in there for more than about 25 minutes, and I was
the
only customer there (as every other time I've gone in there).
I was
quite polite, as (almost) always.
Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea
how a
business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
location? Was it his foreign accent?
Once again, this confirms why I keep returning to Steve's music.
Great
prices, they know what they are talking about, and they treat me
right.
Vote with your feet!
steve
lo-fi wrote:
>
> On 24 Feb 1998 02:05:16 GMT, kro...@chat.carleton.ca (Kurt Rohde)
> wrote:
>
> >Mike Dusseault (mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca) wrote:
> >> business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
> >> Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
> >> location? Was it his foreign accent?
> >
> >
> >> prices, they know what they are talking about, and they treat me right.
> >
> >
> I don't know about Ottawa, but the Steve's in Toronto does indeed
> suck. You can cut the attitude in there with a knife.
>
Sloar
their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
make them that way?
Alex Tobias
On Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:14:45 +0100, blaine <sp...@spam.spam> wrote:
>Alex Tobias wrote:
>>
>>
>> Some people are just jerks period, business owners or not.
>
>I seem to remember you acting like this a lot about 6 months ago.
>
That's funny Blaine, I had you in mind when I posted the line about
jerks...
6 months later your still looking for flame wars and have yet to
post anything of any interest regarding guitar.
Matthew Ivaliotes
Sloar <sl...@freewwweb.com> writes:
>Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
>their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
>make them that way?
A lot of thse guys are either frustrated musicians themselves, plain old
hacks who managed to sound knowledgeable in an interview, or local gigging
musicians who haven't quite figured out that having had a single recording
session, or maybe a regular gig at a local bar, doesn't make you a deity.
Matt I.
STU AM
my 12 yr old son made me a nice sign for my shop, it says, "If You Can Play
Stairway...Play It".
(he's a big waynes world fan).
the sign is good for a few smiles a week, but alas i have yet to hear anyone
play it right.
fly on
stu
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
STU AM wrote in message <19980225062...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
>my 12 yr old son made me a nice sign for my shop, it says, "If You Can Play
>Stairway...Play It".
>(he's a big waynes world fan).
>the sign is good for a few smiles a week, but alas i have yet to hear
anyone
>play it right.
How do you feel about Stanley Jordan's version?
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
jetlag
lo...@staff.uiuc.edu (Matthew Ivaliotes) wrote:
>A lot of thse guys are either frustrated musicians themselves, plain old
>hacks who managed to sound knowledgeable in an interview, or local gigging
>musicians who haven't quite figured out that having had a single recording
>session, or maybe a regular gig at a local bar, doesn't make you a deity.
>Matt I.
As opposed to some of their customers who haven't yet figured out that
just because they own a guitar or two and have picked up several
others in music stores, and post their opinions about build quality on
the newsgroups, doesn't make them a guitar player
jet
Gary Hollis
Sloar wrote in message <34F3A3...@freewwweb.com>...
>Steve King wrote:
>>
>> Frank Carr (jfc...@email.msn.com) wrote:
>>
>> : One important thing I've learned about sales
>> : is that you never know who you're talking to.
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> But. It's a poor salesman, indeed, who fails to "qualify"
>> his customer. And if he misses that 10% of grubby kids (or whatever)
>> that really does have his Mom's Platinum VISA in his pocket,
>> he's also spent 90% of his time with adults that can and will
>> buy....
>>
>> Now, I admit, this probably isn't appropriate to the retail music,
>> or this incident, in particular; then again, I can't figure out
>> most music stores, anyway. Huge levels of arrogance; I'm *almost*
>> amused by it.
>>
>> "Instead of telling me I can't play _Stairway to Heaven_, why
>> not tell you manager you're sick of working on Saturdays?"
>their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
>make them that way?
*****************************
Frustrated musician "wanna-be's" having to deal with people that they feel
superior to...Having to "prostitute" themselves by actually earning a living
instead of receiving royalties from the mega-hit albums that they will never
release....
Wolfgang
Most ARE frustrated musicians who can't make it on stage so they work at a
music store. These people aren't sales people. They're used to people coming up
to them and saying I want this guitar here's my money, most aren't more than
cashiers.
I friend of mine recently lost his job as a high end stereo and TV salesman
and ended up working at a music store. Because of his real background in sales
(some 15 years) and customer service he has held the place as the top sales
person in the store since the day he started. Every month he breaks the store's
sales record and people line up to deal with this guy. That's what a real sales
guy at a music store can do.
Wolfgang
Mike
They are PAID to serve customers and should keep their opinions to
themselves. There are many amateur musicians to one professional. You
can't run a business catering to 1% of the available customer base and
expect to grow. Unless, you are able to draw almost all the professionals
from a region to your store. Personally, I think all customers should be
treated respectfully; pro or amateur.
jetlag wrote in message <6d0oii$6vh$3...@usenet11.supernews.com>...
Mike
Kamchak Tuchuk
On Tue, 24 Feb 1998 23:52:17 -0500, Sloar <sl...@freewwweb.com> wrote:
>> "Instead of telling me I can't play _Stairway to Heaven_, why
>> not tell you manager you're sick of working on Saturdays?"
>Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
>their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
>make them that way?
It just might be that working there makes them that way. Think of all
the young kids that come in w/ all their youthful exuberance, wanting
to play everything in the store, whipping off whatever riff seems to
be the flavor of the day over and over and over. Remember the "Jump"
syndrome in the keyboard depts. back in the 80's?
Maybe it's like working at a grocery store where old ladies always
want a double bag because they've "got a long walk" blah, blah, over
and over and over. It's a valid request but can drive you insane. Yes,
I've been there. No, I'm not there anymore.
I'm not condoning the salespeople's behavior. I wish it were an
idealistic world.
Patrick F. Coleman
>Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
>their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
>make them that way?
take a look at the mentality of the guy who posted why are customers
assholes and you'll realize that these guys are born and made.
*G*
twang!
patrick f. coleman
TWANG!
blaine
Here you go again. Remember the whole "blaine is gay" thing? I believe
you were all at fault. As for posting anything worthwhile, so says you.
STRATQUEEN
<<Here you go again. Remember the whole "blaine is gay" thing? I believe you
were all at fault. As for posting anything worthwhile, so says you.>>
Who was the sicko last fall that posted all of those porno homosexual comments
faking Alex's sig?
Slide on........
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/STRATQUEEN/index.html">Stratqueen's Page</A>
**************************************
Sharon L. Demmerlé, Esq.
Demmerlé Law Offices, P.L.L.C.
Post Office Box 688
Manchester, NH 03105-0688
root
In article <34F36617...@teleport.com>,
"RJT NW, Inc" <r...@teleport.com> writes:
>
> Let me get this straight, the shop owner said:
>
> Yes, we have everything... When you are ready to buy...
>
> And then you spend a full page trashing him all over the net. Hmmm, could it
> be you're a little sensative?
Unlikely. Actually, I generally take quite a bit of crap with a smile.
If you'd heard him say it, there would have been no mistaking his
meaning. He had this kind of belligerent attitude when he said it.
> Perhaps he was saying that if you wanted to buy something, he could get it.
No, that's not what he said.
> Small shop owners, which you are so quick to assassinate often can't afford to
> stock every product, but are willing to order in the product at a competitive
> price. But it sounds like you were too busy lugging away your heavy chip to
> find out.
I'm not assasinating small shop owners. I love small shop owners and would
rather support them than the large ones, most of the time. The service
tends to be more personal. That's exactly where this guy failed: service.
Instead he acts like I am wasting his precious time making sure I purchase
the right product.
I like to be an informed customer. I like to make sure I am buying the
right equipment. That's not wasting his time, nor is it a chip on my
shoulder.
Mike Dusseault
In article <34F3A3...@freewwweb.com>,
Sloar <sl...@freewwweb.com> writes:
> Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
> their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
> make them that way?
Perhaps it has something to do with hearing Nirvana tunes done with
missed string bends too often. I must say if I had to listen to that
all day I might lose it too... <g>
backcrkr
Hi all,
>Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
>their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
>make them that way?
I would like to answer this question from my perspective as
having been both a consumer - AND an employee of many music stores.
First off the bat, I do not feel that any employee at a music
store has the right to be intimidating, arrogant, or abusive to any
customer. That is not their job. That is not what they're being paid
to do.
The job of a sales person at a music store is to assist the
customer, and hopefully sell a product. They're also responsible for
daily cleaning of the store, merchandising, receiving and stocking,
deterring shop lifting, answering the phones, setting up equipment for
people to check out, answering questions of any or all customer in the
store, and having to contend with some SERIOUS douche bags on a daily
basis.
Having said that, we as consumers have had to content with
serious douche bag sales clerks. The following is a true story:
There is a store in Pittsburgh (Swissvale Music) that has a guy
in there who's one of the biggest cocksmokers I've ever met. The
store in general cops an elitist attitude. It's almost as though
you've got to be flashing a wad of green just to try out a $400 Korean
made electric.
Last year, a friend of mine and myself were "music-storing"
throughout the city. Well, we ended up at Swissvale Music. The
asshole salesclerk I had previously mentioned was there. Well, in
walked a group of 15 year olds. They immediately flocked over to an
Ibanez EX series guitar which was perched on a guitar stand. One of
the kids asked if he could check out the guitar. This fuckwad salesman
says to the kid: "Are you going to check it out with the intention of
buying it? Or are you checking it out to check it out? Because we
don't want you to just check it out if you're not serious about buying
it."
Folks, we're talking about a guitar that was selling for less
than $300!!!!!!!!!
This is a store which sells Bogner, Soldano, Tom Anderson,
Yamaha, Pedulla, Hartke, and other such brands. And they're pulling
this kind of shit with a piece of garbage, plywood, Korean made
Ibanez! I really felt like walking over to the kid and telling him
to just go over to Pianos-N-Stuff, because they'll let him play any
guitar in the store he wants. (PRS's, Brian Moore's....it doesn't
matter). But I didn't because I didn't want to make a scene.
I realize that music stores have a vested interest in protecting
their inventory. If a customer drops a guitar and snaps the neck, the
store has to eat the guitar. Even if a customer inadvertently bumps
the guitar against something and puts a ding into it...that guitar is
instantly depreciated. That spells loss of profit to the store. And
in the eyes of the owners, that sucks.
But does that necessarily mean that music stores should be run by
nazis? Absolutely not. A store should hire people who are cautious
enough to keep an eye on things, but not so paranoid that they allow
the merchandise to get trashed.
Swissvale Music story #2:
Back in 1988, prior to matriculating into Duquesne University
School of Music, I was shopping for a cheap electric. The reason for
this was so that I didn't have to schlep my PRS down there and get it
trashed. Well, I was in Swissvale Music...and saw a Fernandes strat
sitting there on a guitar stand. It was a Clapton blackie knockoff and
was selling for (I believe $275). Not too bad. I wanted to check out
the neck and see how much of an acoustic tone it had. So I asked one
of the other salesman if I could play the guitar. The guy I spoke to
said yeah...sure and which amp would I like to plug into, etc... I
mentioned to him that I only wanted to play it unplugged to check out
the neck, and see how it ringed acoustically.
So I'm sitting there on a little stool, playing a Fernandes
strat clone - unplugged (ergo not making any noise and not disturbing
anybody). Well this douche bag salesman (same guy as from the above
anecdote) walks up to me and asks if I am going to be buying the
guitar. I said "Well, I'm not sure. I'm just checking out the neck."
With that, he grabs the guitar out of my hands, wipes it off, and puts
it back on the guitar stand. And then glares at me.
And this was after I had dropped about $5 grand in the store in
the previous 4 years. I don't expect for those people to line up and
kiss my ass after spending money in there. But is it too much to ask
for at least a little common courtesy?
Well, that was a great lesson that I learned. It was the "how to
NOT treat a customer" lesson. You shit on somebody today, and it
might come back to haunt you tomorrow. You treat people well
today...and they'll probably remember it.
Next point of business:
To the guy who said that music store salespeople/employees are
people who couldn't make it performing:
You have very little knowledge of how life works - let alone the
music industry. MOST people cannot sustain 100% of their income
performing. Most performing is done at night. (When's the last band
you went to see on a Wednesday afternoon)? And most gigs aren't so
lucritive so that you needn't supplement your income with some kind of
a day gig.
I think that a lot of musicians are attracted to work at a music
store becuase at least their day gig is related to the industry.
They're around guitars and amps...and might even get an employee
discount.
WTFDIK? <G>
Kevin
--
The artist formerly known as Lots...@aol.com
blaine
backcrkr wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> >Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
> >their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
> >make them that way?
> There is a store in Pittsburgh (Swissvale Music) that has a guy
> in there who's one of the biggest cocksmokers I've ever met. The
> store in general cops an elitist attitude. It's almost as though
> you've got to be flashing a wad of green just to try out a $400 Korean
> made electric.
Actually, that must be that one guy, because I've been in their with two
of my drummer friends, and they let them really bang away at the drums
for about an hour. Maybe that guy was in there getting pissed at all the
noise! Anyway, I've heard Piano's n Stuff was a great store, but I've
never been able to find it!
Greg Peterson
> > their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
> > make them that way?
>
> missed string bends too often. I must say if I had to listen to that
> all day I might lose it too... <g>
I really believe that the reaons why most (definitely not all!) music
store employees are assholes is the way guitars are solds; that is,
there is no definite price and salesman works on comission. This is the
exact same reason why most car salesmen are assholes.
The customer is at a disadvantage in this situation, you don't really
know how much the shop is willing to sell the guitar for, only they know
that and they're not telling. If you're an experienced buyer you can
probably finagle a fair deal, but if you're inexperienced, watch out!
Those guys will really put their fangs into you.
The salesmen who are sucessful in this format (the ones who make a lot
of money and stick with the job) are the guys who don't mind taking
advantage of inexperienced folks and generally are good at screwing
people. In other words, assholes. The guys who don't like screwing
people don't like being guitar salesman and find different jobs.
That being said, despite all Guitar Center bashing that goes on in here,
the folks in the Seattle GC are genuinely nice folks. I've been in
there a few times now and haven't yet met a salesman who tried to do
anything other than help me out. So it doesn't have to work that way,
but it does all too often.
I've never gotten screwed at a music store, but the slimey sales people
have ruined the experience for me. I plain don't like going music
stores because I immediately get a bad feeling as soon as I talk to a
salesmen.
--
Greg
jetlag
>I've never gotten screwed at a music store, but the slimey sales people
>have ruined the experience for me. I plain don't like going music
>stores because I immediately get a bad feeling as soon as I talk to a
>salesmen.
>--
>Greg
After reading all these posts, I have to say that I must be either
very lucky or just don't have all that much of a problem interacting
with sales folks, since my experiences with music stores are almost
always a lot of fun. I think part of this is that there are a couple
of local stores that I do frequent, and so have developed a
relationship with the sales folks there. Even if I'm just going in to
buy strings or what not, I'll make it a point to ask the sales people
how business has been, how their playing has been, etc......
Now, I'm well past my teens, and so that is something that probably
works to my advantage here... that and the fact that I do spend money
from time to time. But even in some of the stores that I don't often
spend money in around here treat me very well even when I'm just
browsing. Maybe that's just the way it is here in Seattle.
When I was younger, I would always ask permission before playing an
instrument... I don't always do that now before pulling a guitar off
the wall, but that's just me. I do think that if you do walk into a
store and start playing guitars or keyboards or whatever, you should
expect a sales person to come up to you and ask if you need any
help.... if I was ever treated very rudely, I would have no problem at
all in complaining to the store manager.
your friend
jet
Peter Trahms
What stores in seattle are you talking about that treat you well in
seattle? the only ones that treat me decently are Al's Guitarville and
the Trading Musician. Kennelley Keys and especially American Music
treat me like shit, that is, when my dad isn't looking around with me.
Peter Trahms
Greg Peterson
Peter Trahms wrote:
>
> What stores in seattle are you talking about that treat you well in
> seattle? the only ones that treat me decently are Al's Guitarville and
> the Trading Musician. Kennelley Keys and especially American Music
> treat me like shit, that is, when my dad isn't looking around with me.
> > Now, I'm well past my teens, and so that is something that probably
> > works to my advantage here... that and the fact that I do spend money
> > from time to time. But even in some of the stores that I don't often
> > spend money in around here treat me very well even when I'm just
> > browsing. Maybe that's just the way it is here in Seattle.
Guitarville is okay, I've never had problems with them. I don't like
Trading Musician too well (Used Gear at New Gear Prices!). I've had
mixed results with Musicans Friend on the Eastside. If you go in when
they're not busy they can be okay. Plus they have the Rogue
Aluminator! American Music is a collection of wankers extraodinaire. I
can't imagine a bigger collection of assholes under one roof, although
they were very nice the last time I was in. Maybe they are getting
better. Still, they are pretty much last on my list of places I want to
buy something. The old Seattle Music downtown made my stomache churn, I
think they might be around somewhere still, eastside maybe.
As I mentioned in a different post, I like the Guitar Center downtown
despite their reputation. One of the salesmen in Mick who used to run
Mick's Vintage Guitars over in West Seattle. He knows his stuff and
just likes guitars. I've been in a couple other times and the other
salespeople were good too.
--
Greg
Doug Gosling
This used to be Continental Music on Montreal Road. The owner (Joe) got caught in the retail downturn and got screwed by the banks so he's opened up a little shop on Bank. The bank won't let him have his stock from the old store so he's carrying limited inventory for now. He's suffering bad right now (including everyone who worked for him - nice guys - good musicians) so cut him some slack for God's sake! I dealt with Continental for years and wouldn't go near Steve's. He had a great policy of letting you trade up with a full credit (ie. your original purchase price) which I took advantage of as I got more cash. Try to get that kind of understanding and service from Steve's or anyone else. They sure as hell got my loyalty and I must have spend about
$6,000 total in there over 2 years. So what if his sales skills are a little shakey? And what's his accent got to do with anything? If you're a serious buyer you should be on the lookout for a good tong-term relationship. Take a pill!
SEFSTRAT
<<So I'm sitting there on a little stool, playing a Fernandes
strat clone - unplugged (ergo not making any noise and not disturbing
anybody). Well this douche bag salesman (same guy as from the above
anecdote) walks up to me and asks if I am going to be buying the
guitar. I said "Well, I'm not sure. I'm just checking out the neck."
With that, he grabs the guitar out of my hands, wipes it off, and puts
it back on the guitar stand. And then glares at me.
And this was after I had dropped about $5 grand in the store in
the previous 4 years.>>
That's when you should have demanded to see the owner.
Steve
SEFSTRAT
Cypher
><<So I'm sitting there on a little stool, playing a Fernandes
>strat clone - unplugged (ergo not making any noise and not disturbing
>anybody). Well this douche bag salesman (same guy as from the above
>anecdote) walks up to me and asks if I am going to be buying the
>guitar. I said "Well, I'm not sure. I'm just checking out the neck."
>With that, he grabs the guitar out of my hands, wipes it off, and puts
>it back on the guitar stand. And then glares at me.
This sounds just like an experience I had at Spier Music in Garland,
TX. I've spent a good bit of money there in the past few years. One
day I was checking out the new California Strat and this salesman was
standing nearby and talking to some customers. He walks over, picks up
the California Strat out of my hands and walks over and starts showing
it to the people. I just sat there with my jaw on the ground. I just
couldn't believe what that guy did. With no regard for me whatsoever,
he just picked up the guitar like he was taking it off of a guitar
stand. For a moment, I felt like a guitar stand. Then, I got my
composure back and left the store vowing never to return.
-Cypher
jetlag
Peter Trahms <ptr...@uclink4.berkeley.eduNOSPAM> wrote:
>What stores in seattle are you talking about that treat you well in
>seattle? the only ones that treat me decently are Al's Guitarville and
>the Trading Musician. Kennelley Keys and especially American Music
>treat me like shit, that is, when my dad isn't looking around with me.
> Peter Trahms
(plug opp)
Well since you asked:
Danny's Music in Everett
Guitar Maniacs in Tacoma
Don's Green River Music in Auburn
American Music in Southcenter (and sometimes Bellevue)
Al's Guitarville
-never really go into Kenelley Keys, so I have no opinion
But then I may be old enough to be your dad, so that may explain it,
too
Generally, as I said earlier, when I was younger, I would always ask
before picking up a guitar. Now, I don't worry as much about it, but
I will still get "help" (permission) before playing the more expensive
gear.
Any other suggestions for our young friend here?
jet
Jackie Maisonneuve
Funny, I went to that place a couple of Saturdays ago. Few of the guitars
on display were remotely playable, and the guy walks up to me, puts his
hand on my shoulder, and says "if you buy today, I'll give you a deal - a
good deal just for you". I felt like I was talking to a used car salesman.
I visited in response to a "75% off" ad in the paper. Most of the items'
prices instead looked like they had 75% tacked ON.
As well, he requested that I stop auditioning guitars (even at low volume)
because "there are music lessons being held upstairs". Strange place, and
yes, I think I was the only person inside the store during that whole hour.
Mike Dusseault <mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca> wrote in article
<6cuqpm$p...@crc-news.doc.ca>...
> In article <6ct9ss$8l4$2...@bertrand.ccs.carleton.ca>,
> kro...@chat.carleton.ca (Kurt Rohde) writes:
> > Mike Dusseault (mi...@strategis.ic.gc.ca) wrote:
> >> Anybody else ever have anything like this happen? Any idea how a
> >> business owner could be so totally stupid (not to mention rude)?
> >> Anybody know why it's called Intercontinental when this is the only
> >> location? Was it his foreign accent?
> >
> > It used to be Continental, before they went bankrupt, and resurfaced.
>
> Yeah, I'd heard that. I'm pretty sure this one will go the same way
> eventually.
dob...@sk.sympatico.ca
In article <19980226003...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
sefs...@aol.com (SEFSTRAT) wrote:
>
> <<So I'm sitting there on a little stool, playing a Fernandes
> strat clone - unplugged (ergo not making any noise and not disturbing
> anybody). Well this douche bag salesman (same guy as from the above
> anecdote) walks up to me and asks if I am going to be buying the
> guitar. I said "Well, I'm not sure. I'm just checking out the neck."
> With that, he grabs the guitar out of my hands, wipes it off, and puts
> it back on the guitar stand. And then glares at me.
>
> And this was after I had dropped about $5 grand in the store in
> the previous 4 years.>>
>
>
> Steve
> SEFSTRAT
Usually "that" guy *is* the owner. Unfortunately...
Stevie Rob
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
leo...@rocketmail.com
In article <34F3A3...@freewwweb.com>,
sl...@freewwweb.com wrote:
>
> Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
> their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
> make them that way?
becoming famous rockstars. Now the reality of it all is starting to sink in
and they are beginning to realize it will never happen. That explains why
they are so bitter towards everyone.
BTW - Ever tell a guitar salesman his band sucks? Next time a salesman gives
you crap when you politely ask if you can play one of the guitars, try it.
Say it really loud so all of the customers in the store hear you. I
guarantee you he won't be a jerk to you again.
- geoff
Lutegirl
>One important thing I've learned about sales
>>> : is that you never know who you're talking to.
I was the customer who paid for everything, signed the checks in my name and
yet they never knew that I bought these things for myself.My "agent" did all
the talking and I just kept my mouth shut,gazing around the room looking bored
and disinsterested because I thought that I would get screwed over by the sales
guy for being a dumb girl if I went in by myself.
Carlginger
>I was the customer who paid for everything, signed the checks in my name and
>yet they never knew that I bought these things for myself.My "agent" did all
>the talking and I just kept my mouth shut,gazing around the room looking
>bored
>and disinsterested because I thought that I would get screwed over by the
>sales
>guy for being a dumb girl if I went in by myself.
If you picked up a guitar and played, while revealing a generous amount of
cleavage, I'm sure the salesguy would have paid attention.
Carl
James Fuller
Carlginger wrote:
> If you picked up a guitar and played, while revealing a generous
> amount of cleavage, I'm sure the salesguy would have paid attention.
>
> Carl
On the other hand, if Carl did this we'd tell him for god's sake
pull up your pants and turn around.
Giri
Cypher wrote:
>
> For a moment, I felt like a guitar stand.
That'll teach you to respect your guitar stands a little
more. Now you know what they go through.
So... did you react with any guitar finishes?
..Giri
--
e-mail: giyengar "at" ford "dot" com
Carlginger
>Subject: Re: Why are most music store employees insensitive?
>From: James Fuller <no....@no.commercial.email>
>Date: Thu, Feb 26, 1998 14:04 EST
>Message-id: <34F5BC...@no.commercial.email>
Can you think of a better way to clear the store out?
Carl
MT
In article <34F3A3...@freewwweb.com>, Sloar <sl...@freewwweb.com> wrote:
>Steve King wrote:
>>
>> Frank Carr (jfc...@email.msn.com) wrote:
>>
>> : One important thing I've learned about sales
>> : is that you never know who you're talking to.
>>
>>
>> But. It's a poor salesman, indeed, who fails to "qualify"
>> his customer. And if he misses that 10% of grubby kids (or whatever)
>> that really does have his Mom's Platinum VISA in his pocket,
>> he's also spent 90% of his time with adults that can and will
>> buy....
>>
>> Now, I admit, this probably isn't appropriate to the retail music,
>> or this incident, in particular; then again, I can't figure out
>> most music stores, anyway. Huge levels of arrogance; I'm *almost*
>> amused by it.
>>
>> "Instead of telling me I can't play _Stairway to Heaven_, why
>> not tell you manager you're sick of working on Saturdays?"
>their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
>make them that way?
A job of a salesman is to sell. That means that they tend to be of the assholy
persuasion because being dishonest, arrogant and pushy tends to make sales,
unfortunately. It would help the store in the long run to treat customers
nicely. It's amazing how many places just don't get this.
I know some negative things have been said about Guitar Center. However, in my
experience this is a great place and it deserves mentioning (at least the GC
in San Diego):
1) Their "sales" people have always been courteous and helpful.
2) Their prices are actually reasonable.
3) You can try out the equipment (at least the less expensive stuff). Nearly
every time I've been in there, there have been several kids doing their
version of Hendrix or Nirvana.
4) They have a 30 day money back guarantee.
Gary Hollis
>>> Frank Carr (jfc...@email.msn.com) wrote:
>I know some negative things have been said about Guitar Center. However, in
my
>experience this is a great place and it deserves mentioning (at least the
GC
>in San Diego):
>
>1) Their "sales" people have always been courteous and helpful.
>2) Their prices are actually reasonable.
>3) You can try out the equipment (at least the less expensive stuff).
Nearly
>every time I've been in there, there have been several kids doing their
>version of Hendrix or Nirvana.
>4) They have a 30 day money back guarantee.
***********************************************************
I have lived in both LA and Dallas/Fort Worth and have been to the Guitar
Center in LA, Dallas, and Arlington. As for as how I was treated by
salespersons, it really all depended on the time of day, how busy they were,
weekend vs weekday, etc. I will admit that if they don't know you - once
they figure out that you are knowledgeable, they tend to be more helpful.
It also helps if they get the feeling that you are serious about spending
money. And, let's face it, they are human, too - and can have a bad day
like everybody else. But I have also run across some "attitudes" that I
felt were totally unwarranted. And these were usually from "guys who
thought they knew way too much to be dealing with me".
This brings up an interesting observation - why aren't there more female
salespersons in music stores? I'm not sure what makes me say this, but -
being a guy, I think I might enjoy dealing with a sales"woman" for a change.
One final point - Guitar Center in LA...back in the late 70's and early
80's - if they were busy and you weren't Stevie Wonder or Steven Stills,
chances are, you would get snubbed. Surprising? ..... Hardly....
Gary Hollis
blaine
Jackie Maisonneuve wrote:
> As well, he requested that I stop auditioning guitars (even at low volume)
> because "there are music lessons being held upstairs". Strange place, and
> yes, I think I was the only person inside the store during that whole hour.
The store owner that I wrote about told me that once, too. I wasn't even
playing that loud. Yeah, I hope you are listening, owner of Right On
Henry's. You're a dick.
Mike Dusseault
In article <6d2t24$c4k$1...@newsmaster.pathcom.com>,
"Doug Gosling" <dgos...@pathcom.com> writes:
>
> This used to be Continental Music on Montreal Road. The owner (Joe) got
> caught in the retail downturn and got screwed by the banks so he's
> opened up a little shop on Bank. The bank won't let him have his stock
> from the old store so he's carrying limited inventory for now. He's
> suffering bad right now (including everyone who worked for him - nice
> guys - good musicians) so cut him some slack for God's sake!
That sucks and all, but how is being rude to me going to help his
business?
> I dealt
> with Continental for years and wouldn't go near Steve's.
That's a different opinion than most people I know who've been to
Continental. Still, obviously some will have fine experiences there
and others not, as with Steve's.
> He had a great
> policy of letting you trade up with a full credit (ie. your original
> purchase price) which I took advantage of as I got more cash. Try to
> get that kind of understanding and service from Steve's or anyone else.
> They sure as hell got my loyalty and I must have spend about
> $6,000 total in there over 2 years.
That is a good deal. I've never heard of that, nor was I told this
when I got my guitar. But I'll take your word for it. Realize though,
that the only reason he could do this was high prices. If the markup
on the product wasn't enough to make up the the difference, he wouldn't
do it. Unless you think he was taking a loss for you, but I doubt
it.
> So what if his sales skills are
> a little shakey?
Shakey? That's ... kind ... There's a difference to me between rude
and just shakey sales skills.
> And what's his accent got to do with anything?
In the context of what I said, I was joking about the name
(Intercontinental) since it's not. It's only in Ottawa. So the
name doesn't really make sense. So I figured his accent was the
Intercontinental part. But that part was pretty much irrelevant to
my point (and obviously to my opinion of the store or the salesperson).
> If you're a serious buyer you should be on the lookout for a good tong-term
> relationship. Take a pill!
Yup, and I've very satisfied with my long-term relationship with Steve's.
They always give me decent prices, remember my name and let me mess with
any of the equipment for as long as I want. Kevin knows his stuff pretty
well too and answers all my questions. Of course, they are pretty damn
busy sometimes. But that's hardly their *fault*. They really need more
space though.
So, no pill necessary. I was shocked at the treatment because it seemed
to me to be the exact opposite of what a salesperson (especially an
owner!) should be doing if they want to stay in business.
Besides, the prices in that store are *very* high, and the selection is
also limited. So you want me to go to a store that gives me bad prices,
bad service and bad selection? Not likely. I wish to be an informed
consumer, not a sucker.
M.A. Martin
jetlag wrote:
> Peter Trahms <ptr...@uclink4.berkeley.eduNOSPAM> wrote:
>
> >What stores in seattle are you talking about that treat you well in
> >seattle? the only ones that treat me decently are Al's Guitarville and
> >the Trading Musician. Kennelley Keys and especially American Music
> >treat me like shit, that is, when my dad isn't looking around with me.
>
> > Peter Trahms
>
> (plug opp)
>
> Well since you asked:
>
> Danny's Music in Everett
> Guitar Maniacs in Tacoma
> Don's Green River Music in Auburn
> American Music in Southcenter (and sometimes Bellevue)
> Al's Guitarville
>
> <snip>
> Any other suggestions for our young friend here?
>
> jet
It's great to see some of the good guys getting some press -
usually it's the other way around. Here's another suggestion if you're
ever in Vancouver:
Two great salesman I've met are Steve and Andre at Long and
McQuade's on Granville St., Vancouver. These guys are extremely
knowledgable, very helpful, great to deal with, and intrinsically nice
fellows. They're both the type of person who will also go the extra mile
and look for answers/stuff/ etc. for you if they don't have it available
immediately. It's a pleasure to deal with them.
M.A. Martin
Nina Bargiel
>This brings up an interesting observation - why aren't there more female
>salespersons in music stores? I'm not sure what makes me say this, but -
>being a guy, I think I might enjoy dealing with a sales"woman" for a change.
I am reading about the experiences you guys are having...and I can
empathize. But you think it's bad...a female customer in a guitar store
is live bait. You either get taken or beyond ignored. I don't know a
heck of a lot about guitar, and when I went to purchase one I took a
female friend with me who had been playing for over 20 years. We went on
a weekday, small stores, large stores, you name it...the places were empty
and the salesmen still refused to talk to us after we demonstrated that I
had the cash, and that she could play.
Why should I have to *prove* my right to buy a guitar?
I went gun shopping with my same friend later. And guess what? No
problem purchasing a gun!
Hmmmm....
Nina
Jeff Vineburg
>I know exactly what you mean. Walking into any store with a suit on,
>for example, and the sales droids flock to you immediately. And I
I always get great service. Why?
I look like a thief or drug addict, I guess, judging by the way I'm
always followed, in whatever store I enter (mind you, I'm 34).
It works to my advantage because I rarely enter a store except to buy,
or worship, in the case of Route 66.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff Vineburg - Nuclear Fish - je...@nuclearfish.com
http://www.op.net/~jeffv http://www.nuclearfish.com
lefty guitars, humor song parodies
dob...@sk.sympatico.ca
In article <19980226203...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
carlg...@aol.com (Carlginger) wrote:
>
> > On the other hand, if Carl did this we'd tell him for god's sake
> >pull up your pants and turn around.
>
> Can you think of a better way to clear the store out?
>
> Carl
>
Hehe. You don't think Carl actually paid for all those nice guitars do you?
rd
Joe Breitenbach
You should've taken that gun back to the music store - *then* you
would've got some attention, right? ;)
--
Joe Breitenbach
jeb...@bellsouth.net
http://www.tranquilitybase.com/joe
SEFSTRAT
Nina wrote:
<<when I went to purchase one I took a
female friend with me who had been playing for over 20 years. We went on
a weekday, small stores, large stores, you name it...the places were empty
and the salesmen still refused to talk to us after we demonstrated that I
had the cash, and that she could play.
Why should I have to *prove* my right to buy a guitar?
I went gun shopping with my same friend later. And guess what? No
problem purchasing a gun!>>
Maybe you then should have returned to the music store........
Steve
SEFSTRAT
Zaibatsu
> ><<So I'm sitting there on a little stool, playing a Fernandes
> >strat clone - unplugged (ergo not making any noise and not disturbing
> SNiP......
"...and thats why i shot him officer..."
I have experienced guys like this too
git...@chokkelm.com
I have an astounding story for a recent experience at West L.A. Music
in Los Angeles. I tried out some guitars for about a half hour and
the salesman seemed very cordial. Then when I narrowed it down as to
which one to buy, I stated that I wanted to buy it and asked the
salesman "How much is this guitar?". I swear he said "We don't quote
prices"!!!!!! My eyes bugged out of my head and I walked out.
Jesse
Nina,
Same problem is you are a 40 year old, balding, white male. They just
will not wait on you. Its like I have "NOT A MUSICIAN" stamped on my
forehead. I finally went to Daddy's Junky Music in Nashua, NH and they
were great. Helped me pick a guitar, amp, accessories and set me up
with lessons. Not only that but they talked me out of a more expensive
guitar and sold me something that was a little more practical for a
beginner.
BTW, a woman who wants to play guitar and shoots. Damn, where were
you when I was dating.
Jesse
--
blaine
What kind of store doesn't tell you how much you have to pay for
something? I would have told him, "Well, okay then, since you can't tell
me how much you want, I'll tell you how much I want to give you. I'll
give you 50 bucks for it."
Mike Dusseault
In article <34f68d4b....@nntp.we.mediaone.net>,
git...@chokkelm.com writes:
> I have an astounding story for a recent experience at West L.A. Music
> in Los Angeles. I tried out some guitars for about a half hour and
> the salesman seemed very cordial. Then when I narrowed it down as to
> which one to buy, I stated that I wanted to buy it and asked the
> salesman "How much is this guitar?". I swear he said "We don't quote
> prices"!!!!!! My eyes bugged out of my head and I walked out.
"How much is it?"
"Won't tell you. Nyah!"
"But..."
"You've got to haggle!"
Well, one thing I've learned is that there are a lot of incompetant sales
people in music stores. I must say I am astounded at the frequency with
which people get bad service in some music stores. I find it incredibly
weird that some make it so difficult to buy anything from them. Seems
anti-evolutionary.
From a customer perspective, I suppose this underscores the importance of
rewarding the good stores for their good service so they stay in business.
And for music stores, this shows the importance of being nice to your
customers. As someone said, you never know where your next purchase
will come from, so be nice to all your customers. Even the annoying ones.
It's your job and your livelyhood.
gm...@ohgawdilovespam.ibm.net
> jetlag wrote:
>
> > Peter Trahms <ptr...@uclink4.berkeley.eduNOSPAM> wrote:
> >
> > >What stores in seattle are you talking about that treat you well in
> > >seattle? the only ones that treat me decently are Al's Guitarville and
> > >the Trading Musician. Kennelley Keys and especially American Music
> > >treat me like shit, that is, when my dad isn't looking around with me.
> >
> > > Peter Trahms
> >
> > (plug opp)
> >
> > Well since you asked:
> >
> > Danny's Music in Everett
> > Guitar Maniacs in Tacoma
> > Don's Green River Music in Auburn
> > American Music in Southcenter (and sometimes Bellevue)
> > Al's Guitarville
> >
> > <snip>
>
> > Any other suggestions for our young friend here?
> >
> > jet
>
The folks at Emerald City Guitars have always been very nice to me.
you can figure out how to reply, i'm sure
Raincity
On Thu, 26 Feb 1998 04:22:55 GMT, jet...@accessone.com (jetlag) wrote:
And what about Emerald City Guitars in Pioneer Square, or if you are
willing to drive down to Olympia for a decent deal and great service:
Music 6000.
Bear
>Peter Trahms <ptr...@uclink4.berkeley.eduNOSPAM> wrote:
>
>>What stores in seattle are you talking about that treat you well in
>>seattle? the only ones that treat me decently are Al's Guitarville and
>>the Trading Musician. Kennelley Keys and especially American Music
>>treat me like shit, that is, when my dad isn't looking around with me.
>
>> Peter Trahms
>
>(plug opp)
>
>
>Well since you asked:
>
>Danny's Music in Everett
>Guitar Maniacs in Tacoma
>Don's Green River Music in Auburn
>American Music in Southcenter (and sometimes Bellevue)
>Al's Guitarville
>
>-never really go into Kenelley Keys, so I have no opinion
>
>But then I may be old enough to be your dad, so that may explain it,
>too
>
>Generally, as I said earlier, when I was younger, I would always ask
>before picking up a guitar. Now, I don't worry as much about it, but
>I will still get "help" (permission) before playing the more expensive
>gear.
>
Ross Stites
blaine <sp...@spam.spam> writes:
>git...@chokkelm.com wrote:
>>
>> I have an astounding story for a recent experience at West L.A. Music
>> in Los Angeles. I tried out some guitars for about a half hour and
>> the salesman seemed very cordial. Then when I narrowed it down as to
>> which one to buy, I stated that I wanted to buy it and asked the
>> salesman "How much is this guitar?". I swear he said "We don't quote
>> prices"!!!!!! My eyes bugged out of my head and I walked out.
>What kind of store doesn't tell you how much you have to pay for
>something? I would have told him, "Well, okay then, since you can't tell
>me how much you want, I'll tell you how much I want to give you. I'll
>give you 50 bucks for it."
We have a store like that in town (Minneapolis/St. Paul). They don't
have prices marked on anything. When I've asked what they want for
something, they always respond with,"What will you give me for it?".
Never a price quote, just that smartass answer. Once I told them that
if they didn't want to sell to me, I'd go somewhere else. The only
other time I've been there, I got the same answer and just offered
them $150 for a Marshall head - the guy seemed affended, but I figured
two could play the same game... Unfortunately, there are only a couple
of good stores in the entire metro area here, so the pickings are
pretty slim.
Ross
Greg Peterson
blaine wrote:
>
> git...@chokkelm.com wrote:
> >
> > I have an astounding story for a recent experience at West L.A. Music
> > in Los Angeles. I tried out some guitars for about a half hour and
> > the salesman seemed very cordial. Then when I narrowed it down as to
> > which one to buy, I stated that I wanted to buy it and asked the
> > salesman "How much is this guitar?". I swear he said "We don't quote
> > prices"!!!!!! My eyes bugged out of my head and I walked out.
>
> What kind of store doesn't tell you how much you have to pay for
> something? I would have told him, "Well, okay then, since you can't tell
> me how much you want, I'll tell you how much I want to give you. I'll
> give you 50 bucks for it.
Unfortunately that's the way lots (most) of them work. Go into an auto
dealership and ask them how much their cars cost, they won't tell you
either. Car salesmen are generally considered scum, guitar salesman
usually aren't much better in my experience.
--
Greg
Patrick F. Coleman
sefs...@aol.com (SEFSTRAT) wrote:
>Nina wrote:
>Steve
>SEFSTRAT
I had to laugh at this.
I was shopping for shotguns for me and the kid, (for next year, he's
only 11 and can't take the safety course until he's twelve. I don't
need a safety course as I've already shot off both my feet) and I was
really taken aback at how much friendlier gunshop folks are than just
about ANY other shop folks.
No surly old fart at the video store asking you.. Woody Allen movies?
who's he?
No distracted teeny bopper smearing tartar sauce on your hamburger and
breaking into a sweat trying to figure out the correct change on a
3.17 transaction when you give him 5.17.
Just a friendly guy, who loves guns, talks about what he owns, the
differences in performance, shell sizes, wieght, etc.
Just EXACTLY what I would want in a music store.
Of course.. He doesn't have to be there while people shoot the damn
things all day, either.
Still....
twang!
patrick f. coleman
TWANG!
GeoMac
Jesse wrote:
>
> Nina,
>
> Same problem is you are a 40 year old, balding, white male. They just
> will not wait on you. Its like I have "NOT A MUSICIAN" stamped on my
> forehead.
Heck, I'm not even 40 or balding but since I don't fit the typical
profile I usually have quite a time getting attention.
Our local Guitar Center has had some good people, but I went in looking
to buy a cheap bass a couple of years ago, I got waited on by a total
idiot who knew NOTHING.
One good thing about the GC was that I knew a woman who had worked there
(but got a better job with a distributor) who gave me the rundown on
which sales people to deal with. That helped a lot.
pH
Mike
Why don't more men sell women's lingerie? If I walk into Victoria's Secret
to get something for my wife, the sales women are usually very eager to wait
on me!
You want good service - walk in wearing a business suit. Sales people will
not leave you alone if they think you have money to spend.
Nina Bargiel wrote in message ...
>
>>This brings up an interesting observation - why aren't there more female
>>salespersons in music stores? I'm not sure what makes me say this, but -
>>being a guy, I think I might enjoy dealing with a sales"woman" for a
change.
>
>I am reading about the experiences you guys are having...and I can
>empathize. But you think it's bad...a female customer in a guitar store
>is live bait. You either get taken or beyond ignored. I don't know a
>heck of a lot about guitar, and when I went to purchase one I took a
>female friend with me who had been playing for over 20 years. We went on
>a weekday, small stores, large stores, you name it...the places were empty
>and the salesmen still refused to talk to us after we demonstrated that I
>had the cash, and that she could play.
>
>Why should I have to *prove* my right to buy a guitar?
>
>I went gun shopping with my same friend later. And guess what? No
>problem purchasing a gun!
>
>Hmmmm....
>
>Nina
jetlag
rain...@nwnexus.com (Raincity) wrote:
>On Thu, 26 Feb 1998 04:22:55 GMT, jet...@accessone.com (jetlag) wrote:
>And what about Emerald City Guitars in Pioneer Square, or if you are
>willing to drive down to Olympia for a decent deal and great service:
>Music 6000.
yeah, I haven't been into Emerald City Guitars in awhile, and even
longer since I've been down to Music 6000, but I'm glad you mentioned
them... especially Music 6000, which I particularly like...
jet
Ross Carlson
Not sure why but it's yet another reason I rarely buy from them. Let's hear
it for the used instrument newsgroups!
RC
--
"To live outside the law you must be honest"
-Dylan
Patrick F. Coleman wrote in message <6d79pi$25l$8...@usenet52.supernews.com>...
>sefs...@aol.com (SEFSTRAT) wrote:
>
>>Nina wrote:
>
>><<when I went to purchase one I took a
>>female friend with me who had been playing for over 20 years. We went on
>>a weekday, small stores, large stores, you name it...the places were empty
>>and the salesmen still refused to talk to us after we demonstrated that I
>>had the cash, and that she could play.
>
>>Why should I have to *prove* my right to buy a guitar?
>
>>I went gun shopping with my same friend later. And guess what? No
>>problem purchasing a gun!>>
>
>
Baby Grand
Yeah, we got a store like that up here in Toronto, Canada. The place has
pretty good prices, BUT THE SALESMEN ARE ASSHOLES.
I have been shopping there for about 10 years. Spending about $1,000 to
$2,000 a year most of it on accessories. And in all those years i have come
accross only one real cool guitar sales man. He's this older guy with long
grey hair. He knows a heck of alot about guitars e.t.c. The rest of them
are assholes. I hope thats what they are like only at the store because
they would be pretty lonley people if they were like that all the time. I
don't get it, it seems that they expect you to buy a brand new guitar or
amp everytime you go into their store.
These guys are pretty dumb assholes too. I used to be in retail sales as
well (now I am in industrial sales). I made probably 40 to 50% of my annual
income from repeat buyers/customers. What that really means is that for
that 40 to 50% of my income, i didn't have to work very hard. The repeat
customer would come into the store go straight to me and make a buy. Once
you develop are good rapport with a cutomer he keeps coming back to you.
It's basic sales 101. Maybe Steves should sent their guys to take a little
course in college. Man if i worked there, i would make a killing. There
aren't that many places to buy guitars e.t.c. in Toronto.
Here's a little bit of arithmetic for you assholes.
Toronto has probably at least 100,000 potential customes for the stuff you
sell. There are only 2 places to go, Long & Mcwade or Steves. Even if you
only had half the market, thats 50,000 customers. (you probably have more
market because you can under cut L&M in price.
Lets say that each customer goes about 10 times a year to Steves. Thats
500,000 sales interactions. Lets say that 20% are actual sales. Thats
100,000 actual sales. Divide that by # of employees (lets say 20). Thats
5,000 sales a year. Lets say that each sales transaction is worth only $10
in commision. Thats $50,000. And lets say that 50% of those are repeat
customers. Thats $25,000 a year for you to just sit there and pick your
nose. Ain't life grand.
Greg Peterson <gsp...@concentric.net> wrote in article
<34F491...@concentric.net>...
> Mike Dusseault wrote:
> >
> > In article <34F3A3...@freewwweb.com>,
> > Sloar <sl...@freewwweb.com> writes:
> > > Really, about the arrogance at music stores, do they pick and train
> > > their salesmen to be total $#@#ing assholes, or does working there
> > > make them that way?
> >
> > Perhaps it has something to do with hearing Nirvana tunes done with
> > missed string bends too often. I must say if I had to listen to that
> > all day I might lose it too... <g>
>
> I really believe that the reaons why most (definitely not all!) music
> store employees are assholes is the way guitars are solds; that is,
> there is no definite price and salesman works on comission. This is the
> exact same reason why most car salesmen are assholes.
>
> The customer is at a disadvantage in this situation, you don't really
> know how much the shop is willing to sell the guitar for, only they know
> that and they're not telling. If you're an experienced buyer you can
> probably finagle a fair deal, but if you're inexperienced, watch out!
> Those guys will really put their fangs into you.
>
> The salesmen who are sucessful in this format (the ones who make a lot
> of money and stick with the job) are the guys who don't mind taking
> advantage of inexperienced folks and generally are good at screwing
> people. In other words, assholes. The guys who don't like screwing
> people don't like being guitar salesman and find different jobs.
>
> That being said, despite all Guitar Center bashing that goes on in here,
> the folks in the Seattle GC are genuinely nice folks. I've been in
> there a few times now and haven't yet met a salesman who tried to do
> anything other than help me out. So it doesn't have to work that way,
> but it does all too often.
>
> I've never gotten screwed at a music store, but the slimey sales people
> have ruined the experience for me. I plain don't like going music
> stores because I immediately get a bad feeling as soon as I talk to a
> salesmen.
>
> --
> Greg
>
Brian Witowski
I have a couple theories about why music store salesmen are jerks:
1) Because evey swingin' dick (or pair of tits) that walks thru the door
has this
fucking prima dona attitude like they invented guitar, their brother is the
president
of Gibson and their dad founded Marshall. I've seen it a thousand times.
As another
customer not a salesman.
2) Because all these axmasters walk in the door, bust the salesmans balls
for
an hour, check out the equipment to see if it is what they want, then buy
the shit mail order or from somebody else. I'm in retail and I see it all
the time.
3) Because the Salesman thinks HE'S the owner of Gibson USA and can't stand
the fact that many of the people that walk thru the door could blow his
shit away
anyday.
Just some ideas.
Brian
Mike <telec...@hotmail.com> wrote in article
<34f7b...@news.randori.com>...
> Why don't more men sell women's lingerie? If I walk into Victoria's
Secret
> to get something for my wife, the sales women are usually very eager to
wait
> on me!
>
> You want good service - walk in wearing a business suit. Sales people
will
> not leave you alone if they think you have money to spend.
>
> Nina Bargiel wrote in message ...
> >
> >>This brings up an interesting observation - why aren't there more
female
> >>salespersons in music stores? I'm not sure what makes me say this, but
-
> >>being a guy, I think I might enjoy dealing with a sales"woman" for a
> change.
> >
> >I am reading about the experiences you guys are having...and I can
> >empathize. But you think it's bad...a female customer in a guitar store
> >is live bait. You either get taken or beyond ignored. I don't know a
> >heck of a lot about guitar, and when I went to purchase one I took a
> >female friend with me who had been playing for over 20 years. We went
on
> >a weekday, small stores, large stores, you name it...the places were
empty
> >and the salesmen still refused to talk to us after we demonstrated that
I
> >had the cash, and that she could play.
> >
> >Why should I have to *prove* my right to buy a guitar?
> >
> >I went gun shopping with my same friend later. And guess what? No
> >problem purchasing a gun!
> >
> >Hmmmm....
> >
> >Nina
>
>
>
STRATQUEEN
Ross Stites wrote:
<<We have a store like that in town (Minneapolis/St. Paul). They don't have
prices marked on anything. When I've asked what they want for something, they
always respond with,"What will you give me for it?". Never a price quote,
just that smartass answer. Once I told them that if they didn't want to sell
to me, I'd go somewhere else.>>
Ross, I can sympathize because I've been through this, too, at a BIG store in
Boston many years ago. I said to the guy, "I drove an hour and 15 minutes to
come here. I don't have time to play games, please quote me a price." He
refused, so I took my wad of $$$ and went to another store.
This kind of ticks me off, because unless you know exactly what you want when
you go out shopping, there's no way to check out what's a fair price
beforehand. You could end up getting majorly screwed on a price.
So if I had played this dude's game, I would have made one trip to check out
everything, then I would have had to spend more time comparing prices, then
make another trip back down there to make him an offer....and hope he accepts
the price.....but probably haggle for a while......and then maybe close the
deal -- and hope that the specific guitar I'd wanted is still there.
This sort of "salesmanship" is akin to *black mailing* someone into buying a
guitar, and I dislike it intensely. Nowadays, my friends and I all boycott
stores that have this "no quote" practice.
Slide on........
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/STRATQUEEN/index.html">Stratqueen's Page</A>
**************************************
Sharon L. Demmerlé, Esq.
Demmerlé Law Offices, P.L.L.C.
Post Office Box 688
Manchester, NH 03105-0688
STRATQUEEN
Jesse,
<<Same problem is you are a 40 year old, balding, white male. They just will
not wait on you. Its like I have "NOT A MUSICIAN" stamped on my forehead.>>
Women get the same treatment, my friend. I've already posted my rather
nasty review of Daddy's in Manchester.
elizabeth & chris
Mike wrote:
> You want good service - walk in wearing a business suit. Sales people will
> not leave you alone if they think you have money to spend.
Actually, that doesn't seem to matter as much if you are a woman. I
don't get ignored, but I get the wrong kind of attention. Questions
like, "Is this for you?" when I'm buying strings and stuff. If they
asked you guys that at Victoria's Secret wouldn't you think it was kind
of stupid? "Are you the keyboard player/singer?", when visiting music
stores with my husband. It doesn't really matter what I wear. If I
thought I'd actually get better service maybe I would show a little
cleavage, ok, maybe even a lot, but it still doesn't happen. :) I
shouldn't have to compromise who I am to be treated right by a store
that I would potentially spend lots of money in. I don't have to do it
in the reptile stores I frequent, even though that is also a
male-dominated business.
I know the whole issue isn't about sex, and that this kind of thing
happens to us all when bad salespeople are involved, but it seems to
happen a bit more to women. I have found a few stores that respect me
as a customer, regardless of my sex, and I support them. The stores
that don't, well, they just don't get my business, even for small
stuff. I would rather spend a few bucks on gas to support a business
that does things right than go someplace close.
As far as women working in music stores: How many female car
salespeople have any of you seen? Personally I have never seen one.
Since the businesses are pretty similar on the base level, I'm not
surprised. It's still the good old boys network thing going on.
ESB
STRATQUEEN
<<As far as women working in music stores: How many female car
salespeople have any of you seen? Personally I have never seen one. Since the
businesses are pretty similar on the base level, I'm not surprised. It's still
the good old boys network thing going on.>>
Good points, Elizabeth. I've been car shopping (and guitar shopping)
several times in the past 20 years, and I've lived all over the country. I've
never seen a female car or guitar salesperson.
I think the reason I don't get ignored is because of my height/size (I have
a strong presence), but I still don't get taken as seriously as a man the first
time I go into a new store. I don't think this problem is going away anytime
soon, either.
P.S. Now I know why Ani DeFranco started her own record label, "Righteous
Babe" records.
Stephane Boucher
strat...@aol.com (STRATQUEEN) writes:
> Ross, I can sympathize because I've been through this, too, at a BIG store in
> Boston many years ago. I said to the guy, "I drove an hour and 15 minutes to
> come here. I don't have time to play games, please quote me a price." He
> refused, so I took my wad of $$$ and went to another store.
>
> This kind of ticks me off, because unless you know exactly what you want when
> you go out shopping, there's no way to check out what's a fair price
> beforehand. You could end up getting majorly screwed on a price.
So how does it reduce the likelyhood of getting screwed if the guy
quotes you a price? You still have to know the value, whether he gives
you a quote or not.
--
,
Stephane Boucher, ing s...@nortel.ca
- NORTEL - Tel: (613)763-9778
Bell-Northern Research / Recherches Bell-Northern
STRATQUEEN
<<So how does it reduce the likelyhood of getting screwed if the guy quotes you
a price? You still have to know the value, whether he gives you a quote or
not.>>
For me, it's just a matter of simplifying the process and making it less
time-consuming -- streamlining, so-to-speak. If you already know what you
want, and have checked around for prices, you could buy the guitar from him
right then and there, if his price is acceptable to you.
If you walked in there with no particular model in mind, find something you
like, and he quotes you a price right then and there, you can comparison shop
at other stores on the same shopping trip. Otherwise, if nobody will quote you
a price, you'd have to spend more time researching prices and then go back to
one of the stores, make an offer, and hope they accept it.
For some people who need to buy a guitar NOW, this can be a real hassle. I
went thru this when my house burned down in '92 and I had to replace all of my
gear. It would be gross understatement to say I was NOT in the mood to play
games with salesmen after losing ALL of my gear in a fire.
George4908
<<As far as women working in music stores: How many female car
salespeople have any of you seen? Personally I have never seen one. >>
Try "Barbara's Guitars" in Washington, D.C. She worked with Gil Southworth for
many years, then split and opened her own shop. Small but growing. Vintage
only. The usual mix of stuff, but tons of mint Dano/Silvertones -- go figure.
Mark Zedaker
MT wrote:
[snip snip]
> A job of a salesman is to sell. That means that they tend to be of the assholy
> persuasion because being dishonest, arrogant and pushy tends to make sales,
> unfortunately. It would help the store in the long run to treat customers
> nicely. It's amazing how many places just don't get this.
>
> I know some negative things have been said about Guitar Center. However, in my
> experience this is a great place and it deserves mentioning (at least the GC
> in San Diego):
>
> 1) Their "sales" people have always been courteous and helpful.
> 2) Their prices are actually reasonable.
> 3) You can try out the equipment (at least the less expensive stuff). Nearly
> every time I've been in there, there have been several kids doing their
> version of Hendrix or Nirvana.
> 4) They have a 30 day money back guarantee.
You're talking about the one a few minutes away from SDSU, right? IMO,
it's one of the best places in SD to shop for guitar and music stuff (except
for manuscript paper ^_^), for all the reasons you mentioned above. Not only
do they allow you to play with any guitar in the store, they'll let you plug
into any amp you feel like, too, which is a nice thing. They also stock
something for just about everyone -- most of the smaller guitar stores has
been mostly one brand or another (Fender or Gibson, one or the other), with a
smattering of other things.. GC carries EVERYTHING. And the sales staff
rocks, too ^_^
Pat Lyman
If it's any consolation, I bought my Eden cabinet from a woman at the Guitar Center
in Sherman Oaks. The last time I was in the Guitar Center in Hollywood, there was
a female salesperson helping folks out (myself include) in the acoustic department.
STRATQUEEN wrote:
> <<As far as women working in music stores: How many female car
> salespeople have any of you seen? Personally I have never seen one. Since the
> businesses are pretty similar on the base level, I'm not surprised. It's still
> the good old boys network thing going on.>>
>
> Good points, Elizabeth. I've been car shopping (and guitar shopping)
> several times in the past 20 years, and I've lived all over the country. I've
> never seen a female car or guitar salesperson.
>
> I think the reason I don't get ignored is because of my height/size (I have
> a strong presence), but I still don't get taken as seriously as a man the first
> time I go into a new store. I don't think this problem is going away anytime
> soon, either.
>
> P.S. Now I know why Ani DeFranco started her own record label, "Righteous
> Babe" records.
>
Nina Bargiel
>Mike wrote:
>
>> You want good service - walk in wearing a business suit. Sales people will
>> not leave you alone if they think you have money to spend.
>
>Actually, that doesn't seem to matter as much if you are a woman. I
>don't get ignored, but I get the wrong kind of attention. Questions
>like, "Is this for you?" when I'm buying strings and stuff.
I concur: I've gotten - "Is this for your boyfriend/dad/brother?"
Also, when I was first looking at guitars, I had my boss' car for the day
- a 1997 Mercedes 500SL convertible - I pulled up to a music store where
and employee was standing outside having a smoke - I parked the car,
smiled, said hello, etc. walked in the store to browse...and when he
walked in he still ignored me, and when I asked for help, I got the
question above...
Maybe next time I should walk in naked?
:)
Nina
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
Nina Bargiel wrote in message ...
>In article <34F862...@concentric.net>, bink...@concentric.net wrote:
>>Actually, that doesn't seem to matter as much if you are a woman. I
>>don't get ignored, but I get the wrong kind of attention. Questions
>>like, "Is this for you?" when I'm buying strings and stuff.
>
>I concur: I've gotten - "Is this for your boyfriend/dad/brother?
I've been over this before, but this depends on the store. One of the
reasons I have done a lot of business with one particular store is that they
didn't treat my wife like this when she came in and wanted to try out a PRS
Custom 22 10-top for her first electric guitar.
>Maybe next time I should walk in naked?
Not if I'm there with my wife. I might get in trouble for staring.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
Stratguy98 wrote in message
<19980301031...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
>Between the parents dropping of their theiving children to hack away at
>noodlefest 98,
Today I saw what must have been a three year old running away from mommy
with hand outstretched directly toward some nice vintage guitar on a floor
display. I think it was a 60's Gretsch White Falcon or something shiny. I
was talking to the vintage guitar manager at the time and it looked like he
aged maybe a year or two while the mommy picked up the kid and took it out
of the guitar department.
That kid had a _strong_ preference for the vintage guitars. Looks like
congenital G.A.S.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
Mike
Hey, I sympathize with the women. I don't know what it's like to have this
happen to me. I wasn't even really referring to what women should do. I
was relating to buying cars, buying clothes, buying appliances. Look like a
yuppie and you get service. Look like a *loser* and get ignored. Maybe
this is different in music stores, where the *dress code* is not the same.
Personally, if a woman approached me with her breasts hanging out, and I was
a salesman, I'd definitely *notice*. You can bet I'd think she was weird.
elizabeth & chris wrote in message <34F862...@concentric.net>...
Damien Harrison
Nina Bargiel wrote in message ...
>In article <34F862...@concentric.net>, bink...@concentric.net wrote:
>
>
>Maybe next time I should walk in naked?
>
>:)
>
>Nina
Which store was that sorry? I'll bring my friends if you bring the popcorn.
Harro.
Kamchak Tuchuk
On Sat, 28 Feb 1998 15:35:33 +0100, Pat Lyman <ply...@as.net> wrote:
>If it's any consolation, I bought my Eden cabinet from a woman at the Guitar Center
>in Sherman Oaks. The last time I was in the Guitar Center in Hollywood, there was
>a female salesperson helping folks out (myself include) in the acoustic department.
>
Did she have nice tits?
Ahhhh, just kidding!!!! : )
Don't want anybody getting their panties in a wad.
Doh! Did I say that?........
I'm a baaaaaddddd boy.....................
STRATQUEEN
Jay wrote:
<Did she have nice tits?
< Ahhhh, just kidding!!!! : )
<Don't want anybody getting their panties in a wad.
<Doh! Did I say that?........
<I'm a baaaaaddddd boy.....................
Yes, you are....and you deserve to be punished...severely. <eg>
Kamchak Tuchuk
On 1 Mar 1998 00:22:45 GMT, strat...@aol.com (STRATQUEEN) wrote:
>Jay wrote:
>
><Did she have nice tits?
>< Ahhhh, just kidding!!!! : )
><Don't want anybody getting their panties in a wad.
><Doh! Did I say that?........
><I'm a baaaaaddddd boy.....................
>
>Yes, you are....and you deserve to be punished...severely. <eg>
>
>Slide on........
>
um.....................................o...................k...................................
Jeff Preston
In a previous article, bink...@concentric.net (elizabeth & chris) says:
>I know the whole issue isn't about sex, and that this kind of thing
>happens to us all when bad salespeople are involved, but it seems to
>happen a bit more to women. I have found a few stores that respect me
>as a customer, regardless of my sex, and I support them. The stores
>that don't, well, they just don't get my business, even for small
>stuff. I would rather spend a few bucks on gas to support a business
>that does things right than go someplace close.
Right on -- vote with the dollah!
>As far as women working in music stores: How many female car
>salespeople have any of you seen? Personally I have never seen one.
>Since the businesses are pretty similar on the base level, I'm not
>surprised. It's still the good old boys network thing going on.
Well, I dunno... I'd be willing to wager that 70% of women salespeople
who make $50K+/yr. are either in real estate or high-end home furnishings.
Whereas that figure for males would probably be ~2%.
A good waitress in a popular upscale restaurant makes more than the
average music store salesman. This is why they are not pleasant
people: they are completely bitter about their situation in life.
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston
http://www.holdsworth.net/
Replies to this e-mail address will fail because mail spammers suck.
Legit mail? Use the form! http://www.holdsworth.net/mailjeff.html
Kamchak Tuchuk
On Sat, 28 Feb 1998 18:56:07 -0800, ni...@mindspring.com (Nina Bargiel)
wrote:
>
>I concur: I've gotten - "Is this for your boyfriend/dad/brother?"
>
>- a 1997 Mercedes 500SL convertible - I pulled up to a music store where
>and employee was standing outside having a smoke - I parked the car,
>smiled, said hello, etc. walked in the store to browse...and when he
>walked in he still ignored me, and when I asked for help, I got the
>question above...
>
>
>:)
>
>Nina
Oh yeah. That's definitely the way to go. No doubt about it. Yep, if I
were you, that's what I'd do. You GO GIRL!
Not on a cold day though okay? You'll catch a cold.... : )
Stratguy98
I agree many are assholes. but you're probably not seeing the other side. I
think you would find it incredible to try to work in a music store on a
Saturday afternoon say about 3:00PM.
Between the parents dropping of their theiving children to hack away at
difficult to imagine how some of these guys can make even a few bucks a week.
So if they seem rather bitter, please remember what I said and please don't act
serious if you're not.
Thanks.....
Alec Horgan
In article <19980301031...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
strat...@aol.com (Stratguy98) wrote:
> So if they seem rather bitter, please remember what I said and please
> don't act serious if you're not.
> Thanks.....
Forgive my ignorance, but, for those of us who aren't blessed with
wealthy, guitar-playing friends who own and let us try tons of equipment,
how are we supposed to know whether or not we're serious about a
particular product without going into a music store to try it?
Alec
--
You got a bearing just like Che Guevara
But you dress to make me see stripes and stars
--John Wesley Harding
http://pantheon.yale.edu/~awh8
STRATQUEEN
alexande...@yale.edu (Alec Horgan) wrote:
In article <19980301031...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
strat...@aol.com (Stratguy98) wrote:
>> So if they seem rather bitter, please remember what
>>I said and please don't act serious if you're not. Thanks.....
>Forgive my ignorance, but, for those of us who aren't blessed with wealthy,
guitar-playing friends who own and let us try tons of equipment, how are we
supposed to know whether or not we're serious about a particular product
without going into a music store to try it?>
Exactly. And if I'm going to spend a good chunk of change on a new guitar I
want the opportunity to play several before I pick one out.
BTW, I do have a lot of wealthy, guitar-playing friends but I prefer to try out
gear on my own. And I am going to take Kevin's advice and A/B some guitars to
determine the differences (thanks for that info, Kev.) ;-)
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
Alec Horgan wrote in message ...
>In article <19980301031...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
>strat...@aol.com (Stratguy98) wrote:
>
>> So if they seem rather bitter, please remember what I said and please
>> don't act serious if you're not.
>> Thanks.....
>
>Forgive my ignorance, but, for those of us who aren't blessed with
>wealthy, guitar-playing friends who own and let us try tons of equipment,
>how are we supposed to know whether or not we're serious about a
>particular product without going into a music store to try it?
I think one way to do business is to be up front and honest about what you
do and don't know about a particular piece. If there's no way you're going
to buy it no matter what is does, give it a miss, or go to a guitar show,
etc. Everything will either fade from your interest or become affordable one
way or another, so you can always wait until you _are_ serious.
If you think you might buy it but you need to compare to others, say so. A
salesman who doesn't want you to try the competition is basically telling
you that he's afraid the competing gear will be better, and is making the
mistake of hoping to sell you something even though you'll probably become
disappointed with it when you eventually play the competition. If he isn't
comfortable with you trying to make sure you get the right piece then you
shouldn't be comfortable with getting anything from him.
If you already know that you won't buy it from the guy you're dealing with
because you're going to mail order it anyway, then don't ask to try it. Let
the people you're really going to be buying it from figure out how to make
sure you're happy with the piece (return period, etc.). You may think you're
getting something out of this behavior but you're not. The sales guy will
downgrade you on his seriousness meter, and you'll have tried out a piece
which isn't the one you get in the mail anyway. With guitars you really
ought to play the exact one you are going to own. Even the most exacting
constructed instruments, such as PRS Custom 22 or Anderson Hollow Cobra,
each are individual. I've played samples of both which are direct from
heaven and also which are not really worth the time of day. _You get a lot
more in value from getting the instrument that you are happiest with than
the typical small price difference between vendors_.
So don't bullshit the sales guy and don't take bullshit from them. The more
they know that you don't bullshit them the more time they will have for you.
You want to know good salesmen? I'll tell you two. I asked at Manny's about
Schecter and the guy sends me to 48th St. Custom Guitars right away. I go
into 48th St. Custom guitars hoping to find a dual humbucker Schecter PT
other than the zebrawood boat anchor and the sales guy levels with me that
they don't expect to stock any more of them, and I can custom order it.
Well, I don't do the pay before play thing with guitars, and he understands
this. So I ask him if there is any other maker that might have what I want.
After we consider ESP (which he also deals) He says, probably Anderson.
I knew about Tom Anderson's history with Schecter, so I should have come to
this conclusion myself, but at that time I didn't know he was making his own
guitars.
I ask if he has any Anderson? No, but he sends me to Manny's who is an
Anderson dealer. I go there, and the only guitar there which fills the bill
is this Hollow Cobra. So I try it out. I buy it from the guy who was nice
enough to help me find the Schecter dealer. You'll be prying that one out of
my cold dead fingers....
And since the 48th. St. guy was straight with me, I kept going back there
and eventually he sold be a really nice playing good sounding Strat
(although it is the ugliest guitar ever conceived by the mind of man).
So everyone is happy. Mainly because we didn't waste each other's time.
There's another kind good salesman I know, and that's the one who takes the
time to figure out what you're really looking for and who works to make sure
he gets it in front of you first. The guy who sold me my Anderson Hollow T
got hold of it when he heard I was getting into Andersons. He's not an
Anderson dealer, so the piece was used, but really in fine shape. Result? He
makes a sale, I pay less for an Anderson. What's not to like? You have to be
careful with this kind of guy though. I made the mistake of reminding him
that I would be intersted in a Danny Gatton or Albert Collins model Tele,
and now I'm afraid he's got one coming second day air or something like
that.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
LostPradis
>You want to know good salesmen? I'll tell you two. I asked at Manny's about
>Schecter and the guy sends me to 48th St. Custom Guitars right away. I go
>into 48th St. Custom guitars hoping to find a dual humbucker Schecter PT
>other than the zebrawood boat anchor and the sales guy levels with me that
>they don't expect to stock any more of them, and I can custom order it.
>Well, I don't do the pay before play thing with guitars, and he understands
>this. So I ask him if there is any other maker that might have what I want.
>After we consider ESP (which he also deals) He says, probably Anderson.
>
>I knew about Tom Anderson's history with Schecter, so I should have come to
>this conclusion myself, but at that time I didn't know he was making his own
>guitars.
>
>I ask if he has any Anderson? No, but he sends me to Manny's who is an
>Anderson dealer. I go there, and the only guitar there which fills the bill
>is this Hollow Cobra. So I try it out. I buy it from the guy who was nice
>enough to help me find the Schecter dealer. You'll be prying that one out of
>my cold dead fingers....
>
>
I just want to interject here about the two dealers you're speaking with. I
had virtually the exact same experience with these two dealers last
thanksgiving when I was shopping strats. I went into Manny's looking to play
every American standard they had, and zeroed in on only one (those of you who
have shopped strats know what I'm talkign about..you play 20 and find only one
you actually want). The salesman says try 48th street custom guitars, they
have some strats you may be interested in. After walking back and forth long
that block for about 5 horus I ended up with a beautiful, big and open-sounding
57 reissue from 49th st custom guiatars. Everyone was cool to me as soon as
they saw I wasn't some punk in to try the latest stuff and leave. As long as
you make it clear to salesman that you are actually interested in buying or
A/Bing or taking a good look at a new piece of equipment, they usually try
their best to help you out. You just gotta realize that joe shmo saleman at
Sam Ash on long island has to deal with 500 kids coming in to wack the hell out
of the black les paul custom n the wall every weekend, knowing full well
they're gonna play and leave. Granted, there are some (many?) salesman who
will try and steer you into something you dont want and dont need, but findin
the right salesman is almost (but not quite) as imprtant as finding the right
guitar.
Brian Vecci
bve...@center.colgate.edu
http://bostwick.colgate.edu/bvecci
Nicholas Delonas
elizabeth & chris wrote:
> I know the whole issue isn't about sex, and that this kind of thing
> happens to us all when bad salespeople are involved, but it seems to
> happen a bit more to women.
Oh brother. How the hell do you know that?
We all get treated badly in these stores. Good service is very rare. I almost
never encounter it and I deal with bad service on a daily basis.
There is no sexism issue here.
In fact, whenever I go shopping with my wife, the salespeople invariably approach
her first.
--
Nick Delonas
Cult V
http://www.cultv.com