Chicks on Jazz Guitar
Gary Allen
Emily Remler
Leni Stern
Sheryl Bailey
Anyone know of others.
I attended the National Guitar Workshop couple years
ago when Sheryl Bailey was teaching. I was blown
away because I never had seen a chick with such
mastery on jazz guitar. I've seen Leni in concert.
She was great.
I'm aware of some chicks on blues guitar:
Meredith Brooks
Susan Tedeschi
Debbie Davies
any others?
Tom Jaffe
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com...
Tom Walls
says...
> I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
> Emily Remler
> Leni Stern
> Sheryl Bailey
>
snip
Word to the wise, Gary, any women who read this newsgroup are likely to
be at least mildly offended by the sobriquet "chick". Also, it's
hopelessly retro.
--
Tom Walls
the guy at the Temple of Zeus
http://www.arts.cornell.edu/zeus/
Larry Austin
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com...
Bob Russell
garyg...@yahoo.com wrote on 3/7/02 12:18 PM:
(mixing blues and jazz players)
Mimi Fox, Badi Assad, Mary Osborne, Shannon Curfman, Debbie Coleman, Shelley
Park, Deidre Cartwright and Joyce Cooling are just a few names that come to
mind.
-- Bob Russell
http://www.uncwil.edu/people/russellr
Rick Ross
"Bob Russell" <bobrus...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:B8AD15A4.50B%bobrus...@hotmail.com...
Rick Benstock
"Tom Walls" <tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu> wrote in message
news:MPG.16f17453b...@newsstand.cit.cornell.edu...
> snip
>
> Word to the wise, Gary, any women who read this newsgroup are likely to
> be at least mildly offended by the sobriquet "chick".
It's a term that women are allowed to usen amongst themselves (see also
"chicka" and "chickie"), but woe unto the man who uses it. Much like white
folks and the word "nigger." On the other hand,
>Also, it's
> hopelessly retro.
But jazz is hopelessly retro. At least bebop and its derivatives. It was
biggest in the forties and fifties. That's when the cats and chicks were
wailing. I know. I was alive then. I was wailing in the forties. In my crib.
Tom Walls
rick...@earthlink.net says...
snip
> >Also, it's
> > hopelessly retro.
>
> But jazz is hopelessly retro. At least bebop and its derivatives.
Get behind me, Satan!
Bob Russell
at tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu wrote on 3/7/02 12:58 PM:
> Word to the wise, Gary, any women who read this newsgroup are likely to
> be at least mildly offended by the sobriquet "chick". Also, it's
> hopelessly retro.
I wouldn't worry about the retro angle too much, since a guy who calls women
"chicks" is very likely to be regarded as "Neanderthal", and you can't get
much more retro than that!
Bob Russell
Benstock at rick...@earthlink.net wrote on 3/7/02 1:16 PM:
> But jazz is hopelessly retro. At least bebop and its derivatives.
Well, retro jazz is (hey!) hopelessly retro! (But a lot of people like it
and continue to play it and listen to it.)
> It was biggest in the forties and fifties. That's when the cats and chicks
> were wailing. I know. I was alive then. I was wailing in the forties. In my
> crib.
Do you mean "crib" in the retro sense or the literal sense? :)
Tom Walls
bobrus...@hotmail.com says...
that. Besides, I thought it paired nicely with "sobriquet".
Dan Cooper
>
> I wouldn't worry about the retro angle too much, since a guy who calls
women
> "chicks" is very likely to be regarded as "Neanderthal", and you can't get
> much more retro than that!
>
That's a bit harsh. I hadn't heard the expression used at all in NY since
graduating high school in the 70s. I started hearing it all the time after
I moved to New Orleans about 12 years ago, and not always from unenlightened
people.
Well, Mark Twain said that we're about 15 years behind the times down here,
and I guess it still holds true. However, I personally would never use that
word to refer to any of the broads that I know.
Dan
Pat Smith
coined, I think, by Frank Sinatra.
**Note**
This is intended as humor, such as it is, and is not meant to offend
anyone...except maybe Nancy Sinatra.
**also note**
Don't you think all internet postings should come with disclaimers?
Gary Allen
Chicks & Babes are still used regularly.
I sure never thought of it as a put down. Chick is a good lookin'
Babe! However, retro that is. Isn't retro back in style?
in article MPG.16f17453b...@newsstand.cit.cornell.edu, Tom Walls
at tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu wrote on 3/7/02 9:58 AM:
Gary Allen
Last thing I heard from her was "Nick Of Time"
I believe. Anything interesting lately?
in article a689m5$q9l$1...@bob.news.rcn.net, Larry Austin at
ldaus...@erols.com wrote on 3/7/02 9:57 AM:
Max Leggett
He means 'dames'.
Max Leggett
And yet Methemney, in a recent interview, describes his latest album
as bebop. If that's retro, them I'm a hottentot.
Gary Allen
I am aware of Badi Aswad. I got here Rhythmns which I love.
Any other good releases.
Now that you mention them I heard of
Joyce Coolings - any recommendations - blues right?
Mimi Fox - any recommendations - blues right?
A buddy just loan me Shannon Curfman.
I couldn't believe she is only 15!
The rest are new ones. Could you comment on their musical styles
and recommendations.
Debbie Coleman
Shelley Park
Deidre Cartwright
Mary Osborne
Are you familar with Sheryl Bailey?
Gary
in article B8AD15A4.50B%bobrus...@hotmail.com, Bob Russell at
bobrus...@hotmail.com wrote on 3/7/02 10:03 AM:
Gary Allen
I use the word "chick" with all due respect.
in article MPG.16f17453b...@newsstand.cit.cornell.edu, Tom Walls
at tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu wrote on 3/7/02 9:58 AM:
> In article <B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com>, garyg...@yahoo.com
Bob Russell
garyg...@yahoo.com wrote on 3/7/02 2:34 PM:
> The rest are new ones. Could you comment on their musical styles
> and recommendations.
> Debbie Coleman
> Shelley Park
> Deidre Cartwright
> Mary Osborne
>
Debbie Coleman - good blues player/singer
Shelley Park - gypsy swing (Pearl Django); also a fine acoustic guitar
builder
Deirdre Cartwright - excellent British player; rock, fusion and jazz
Mary Osborne - now deceased; was a very good swing player in the Charlie
Christian style.
> Are you familar with Sheryl Bailey?
Yes. A fine jazz player. By the way, Mimi Fox is a jazz player, as is Joyce
Cooling, although Joyce plays "smooth jazz", which I'm not personally into.
Tom Walls
says...
> Wow, political correctness! PC stills lives. Where I'm from
> Chicks & Babes are still used regularly.
> I sure never thought of it as a put down. Chick is a good lookin'
> Babe! However, retro that is. Isn't retro back in style?
>
Where do you live... the past? :<) Political correctness: shmolitical
shmorectness, I say(and it's not easily said). I just don't want to see
us alienating the rare female who pops up here on rmmgj -- and we have
started to see a few as of late.
So anyhow, like I said "word to the wise" -- no offense intended.
Bob Russell
garyg...@yahoo.com wrote on 3/7/02 2:26 PM:
> Wow, political correctness! PC stills lives. Where I'm from
> Chicks & Babes are still used regularly.
> I sure never thought of it as a put down. Chick is a good lookin'
> Babe! However, retro that is. Isn't retro back in style?
Gary, I'm glad you're even asking about women who play jazz, so I don't want
to make a big deal out of this, but can you see how a woman who's being
referred to as a "chick" or a "babe" might get the idea that you're not
taking her seriously? We get a few women in here once in a while, you know;
this isn't the guys' locker room. It's not "political correctness". It's
just common courtesy.
Bob Russell
at tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu wrote on 3/7/02 2:03 PM:
> "Retro" was tongue-in-cheek.
Hey, so was "Neanderthal"!
> I don't know the little smiley face for
> that.
Somebody will... (sigh)
> Besides, I thought it paired nicely with "sobriquet".
And so it did! I might've gone for "appellation", but "sobriquet" does have
that certain "je ne sais quoi!"
Man, I think I spent too much time on that French transcription site...
Tom Walls
bobrus...@hotmail.com says...
snip
> And so it did! I might've gone for "appellation", but "sobriquet" does have
> that certain "je ne sais quoi!"
>
> Man, I think I spent too much time on that French transcription site...
>
> -- Bob Russell
> http://www.uncwil.edu/people/russellr
>
>
>
whack
>
> Word to the wise, Gary, any women who read this newsgroup are likely to
> be at least mildly offended by the sobriquet "chick". Also, it's
> hopelessly retro.
>
> --
> Tom Walls
> the guy at the Temple of Zeus
> http://www.arts.cornell.edu/zeus/
Chicks call themselves and each other chicks quite a lot. While politically
incorrect chick is certainly several degrees more acceptable than the
sobriquet "bitch" which has been so embraced by other forms of modern music.
JB
etc.
Chick is a term that has no disrespect whatsoever. Chick is
a term of endearment that refers to a 'cool' lady where I
come from.
Where is this politically correct feminism crap going to
lead us. We'll all be afraid to express ourselves soon, and
when we play we will never be able to play anything other
than pure diatonic scales. We will not be able to use b5's
or #9's in case it is offensive to certain 'sensitive'
groups in our society.
We are all reasonable, friendly folk here.
Some of you guys are far too serious.......lighten up
already.
If any chicks or babes are offended by this, I'm sorry but
there is no disrespect intended.
All I am trying to say is that I really like women. (How
sterile that is....... I would sooner say I really dig that
chick; what a cool babe, or something similar. More fun,
more open and honest in my humble opinion.
Leave the pc stuff to the idiot politicians.
John Bilderbeck
P.S. I'm not picking on you Bob, just the general pc idea.
Tom Walls
says...
> Sheeesh. I don't mind being called a bloke, dude, hunk, guy
> etc.
> Chick is a term that has no disrespect whatsoever. Chick is
> a term of endearment that refers to a 'cool' lady where I
> come from.
This is how I felt until a friend of mine sat me down explained how she
felt marginalized by the word. Being who I am, I argued with her for
about an hour, until I realized that I was arguing to continue to call my
friend a name that she found demeaning. Alright, I was a little thick,
but I was only nineteen and it was over thirty years ago.
Rbsoul
the 50's. She may have at some point in her career been called both a Gal and a
Lass.
Chris_S
with gender... anybody who can keep up to Jeff Beck on stage is pretty
amazing imho.
Chris
P.S. I have three or four tracks in stereo from the 1999 Tokyo Jeff
Beck show ... probably professionally done for tv - sounds like it
anyway. If anybody else has the rest of this show, I'd love to talk
and swap some tracks.
On Thu, 7 Mar 2002 12:54:27 -0500, "Tom Jaffe" <tja...@eesjobs.com>
wrote:
>"Chicks?" Who are you, Hugh Hefner? They are called women.
>
>"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com...
>> I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
>> Emily Remler
>> Leni Stern
>> Sheryl Bailey
>>
>> Anyone know of others.
>>
>> I attended the National Guitar Workshop couple years
>> ago when Sheryl Bailey was teaching. I was blown
>> away because I never had seen a chick with such
>> mastery on jazz guitar. I've seen Leni in concert.
>> She was great.
>>
>> I'm aware of some chicks on blues guitar:
>> Meredith Brooks
>> Susan Tedeschi
>> Debbie Davies
>>
>> any others?
>>
>> Gary
>> http://www.garygraymusic.com
>>
>
>
Chris_S
that because the pub I frequent - which happens to have some real cask
ales, non-carbonated draughts, whatever you call 'em - still calls one
of their staff the "scullery wench". That's her official title at
least. *chuckles*
www.winkingjudge.com if their website is still up btw.
Chris
On Thu, 7 Mar 2002 12:58:32 -0500, Tom Walls <tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu>
wrote:
>In article <B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com>, garyg...@yahoo.com
>says...
>> I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
>> Emily Remler
>> Leni Stern
>> Sheryl Bailey
>>
>
>snip
>
>Word to the wise, Gary, any women who read this newsgroup are likely to
>be at least mildly offended by the sobriquet "chick". Also, it's
>hopelessly retro.
>
Nazodesu
Benstock <rick...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> But jazz is hopelessly retro. At least bebop and its derivatives. It was
> biggest in the forties and fifties. That's when the cats and chicks were
> wailing. I know. I was alive then. I was wailing in the forties. In my crib.
I use "cat" and "dig" and "groove" in general conversation and
sometimes get the oddest looks and mentions of "hipster" jive. And
still, I wouldn't know what other words to use. I don't use the word
"chick" in reference to women in general but in specific circumstances
I would always use it. Young ladies jammed into an interesting night
spot might be called chicks. And I can *NOT* seem to shake the phrase
"chick singer" even when I was speaking to one and was doing a Basil
Fawlty (Don't say chick don't say chick don't say chick--:"Chick!"
Doh!).
gooeyboy
Please refer to all female jazz guitarists as either bitches or hoes.
Thank You
gooeyboy
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com...
> I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
> Emily Remler
> Leni Stern
> Sheryl Bailey
>
Ethan Young
Ethan
"a futuristic neanderthal long cleansed of political correctness"
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8AD28A8.73F%garyg...@yahoo.com...
Ethan Young
"Tom Walls" <tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu> wrote in message
news:MPG.16f1a1d8c...@newsstand.cit.cornell.edu...
> In article <lsQh8.586$V91....@news.xtra.co.nz>, jbi...@xtra.co.nz
> says...
> > Sheeesh. I don't mind being called a bloke, dude, hunk, guy
> > etc.
> > Chick is a term that has no disrespect whatsoever. Chick is
> > a term of endearment that refers to a 'cool' lady where I
> > come from.
>
> This is how I felt until a friend of mine sat me down explained how she
> felt marginalized by the word. Being who I am, I argued with her for
> about an hour, until I realized that I was arguing to continue to call my
> friend a name that she found demeaning. Alright, I was a little thick,
> but I was only nineteen and it was over thirty years ago.
>
>
Was she hot?
Ethan
"I can't even see where I'm going with this"
Gary Allen
to sound so formal, like women or lady.
Please note, I love women are interested in jazz.
I most certainly take 'em seriously! It amazing
how a little slang can be taken.
in article B8AD2F66.531%bobrus...@hotmail.com, Bob Russell at
bobrus...@hotmail.com wrote on 3/7/02 11:53 AM:
Gary Allen
You got the meaning I intended!
snip
> Chick is a term that has no disrespect whatsoever. Chick is
> a term of endearment that refers to a 'cool' lady where I
> come from.
Good to know I'm not the only one living in past!
thomas
Apropos your thread title, she once cut an album with Tal Farlow
entitled "Cats vs. Chicks".
Gary Allen <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com>...
> I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
> Emily Remler
> Leni Stern
> Sheryl Bailey
>
Tim Berens
wrote:
>Please, any ladies reading this post please know
>I use the word "chick" with all due respect.
>
Gary:
Didn't you know that you're not allowed to use the term "ladies"
either?
Not that it matters much -- it's all guys in here anyway.
Why is it that women don't play jazz in any where near the numbers as
men? My wife insists that it's because they know better.
Tim
teleplayer
here once (in reference to "smooth" jazz, kenny g, and music of that ilk).
I, like you, got lambasted for it. Apparently the pc jazz guitar fascists
forgot to tell you the rules. BTW, most people in the younger generation
(which obviously does not include too many people on this list) - girls
included don't take offense to the word "chick". It's kind of become a
buzzword.
Sticks and stones...
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8AD2B80.742%garyg...@yahoo.com...
Gary Allen
bobrus...@hotmail.com wrote on 3/7/02 11:44 AM:
Very Cool!
Is using the term "cool" being retro as well?
Or living in past as some may say.
I'm not much on smooth jazz neither.
Anyone got a cd they can recommend by these
cool ladies.
John Graham
> Thanks Bob,
> I am aware of Badi Aswad. I got here Rhythmns which I love.
> Any other good releases.
>
> Now that you mention them I heard of
> Joyce Coolings - any recommendations - blues right?
> Mimi Fox - any recommendations - blues right?
>
> >
Gary Allen
> Gary:
> Why is it that women don't play jazz in any where near the numbers as
> men? My wife insists that it's because they know better.
>
> Tim
>
>
>
I've wondered that question for years. Obviously, your wife knows best.
Gary Allen
>>
> Mimi Fox is a burning bebop player. Check her out.> >
>>>
PWatrous
p
Nnajar828
Thom j.
"Tom Walls" <tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu> wrote in message
news:MPG.16f17453b...@newsstand.cit.cornell.edu...
| In article <B8AD0A95.714%garyg...@yahoo.com>, garyg...@yahoo.com
| says...
| > I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
| > Emily Remler
| > Leni Stern
| > Sheryl Bailey
| >
|
| snip
|
| Word to the wise, Gary, any women who read this newsgroup are likely to
| be at least mildly offended by the sobriquet "chick". Also, it's
| hopelessly retro.
|
Thom j.
| Do you mean "crib" in the retro sense or the literal sense? :)
Thom j.
"Pat Smith" <pj...@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:3C87BC65...@pacbell.net...
| Actually I believe the correct "Jazz" term is "Broads" or "Braawds" as
| coined, I think, by Frank Sinatra.
| **Note**
| This is intended as humor, such as it is, and is not meant to offend
| anyone...except maybe Nancy Sinatra.
| **also note**
| Don't you think all internet postings should come with disclaimers?
|
Thom j.
"Max Leggett" <spams...@else.com> wrote in message
news:3c87bfeb...@news.sprint.ca...
| >But jazz is hopelessly retro. At least bebop and its derivatives.
|
| And yet Methemney, in a recent interview, describes his latest album
| as bebop. If that's retro, them I'm a hottentot.
|
|
|
Thom j.
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
Jete Software Inc.
Bob Russell <bobrus...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>in article B8AD2A86.741%garyg...@yahoo.com, Gary Allen at
>garyg...@yahoo.com wrote on 3/7/02 2:34 PM:
>
>> The rest are new ones. Could you comment on their musical styles
>> and recommendations.
>> Debbie Coleman
>> Shelley Park
>> Deidre Cartwright
>> Mary Osborne
>>
>
>Debbie Coleman - good blues player/singer
>Shelley Park - gypsy swing (Pearl Django); also a fine acoustic guitar
>builder
>Deirdre Cartwright - excellent British player; rock, fusion and jazz
>Mary Osborne - now deceased; was a very good swing player in the Charlie
>Christian style.
Have you heard Kris Wiley play blues guitar?? She is an exceptionally strong
blues guitarist from LA (and an incredibly nice person). She has a very
macho aggressive Stevie Ray Vaughn type of sound (but she is simply a stronger
player than Stevie). Really worth a listen. She has a couple of CDs available
on JSP records and played on some Lucinda Williams sides.
Can't understand why she isn't more popular.
Norman Klein
Ethan Young
I found your IUMA site...are all the songs there also on your cd?
Thanks,
Ethan
"Nnajar828" <nnaj...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020307184357...@mb-fh.aol.com...
> "mice"
>
> nate
> www.geocities.com/nnajar828
Dan G
> Mary Osborne was the first really good female jazz guitarist, AFAIK.
> Apropos your thread title, she once cut an album with Tal Farlow
> entitled "Cats vs. Chicks".
Yes, well let's not forget the geetar-political-incorrect-song-title
of all time: "Queerology" by George Van Epps :)
Dan G>
Bob Russell
je...@dgs.dgsys.com wrote on 3/7/02 8:25 PM:
> Have you heard Kris Wiley play blues guitar?? She is an exceptionally strong
> blues guitarist from LA (and an incredibly nice person). She has a very
> macho aggressive Stevie Ray Vaughn type of sound (but she is simply a stronger
> player than Stevie). Really worth a listen. She has a couple of CDs available
> on JSP records and played on some Lucinda Williams sides.
>
> Can't understand why she isn't more popular.
>
> Norman Klein
I haven't heard her. I'm not a huge fan of Stevie Ray style blues, but she
certainly sounds worth checking out. Lucinda Williams has done some things I
liked; maybe I'll try to find the stuff Kris played on.
Thom j.
In what regard do you mean "a stronger player than Stevie)"?
Also is there any site that have Kris Wiley's playing? I am [a]
interested in your comment and [b] want to hear Kris Wiley's
music.. Tia.. thom_j.
Jete Software Inc.
Look for:
Kris Wiley - Breaking the Rules (JSP Records)
http://www.electricblues.com/archive/1999/breaking.html
Her vocal stylings seem to be patterned after Bonnie Raitt (I don't consider
her singing to be her strong suit), but her guitar playing is top notch. You
may not care for her style, but if you just listen past that then you should
find plenty to admire (plus she is tall and physically gorgeous).
Norman
Jete Software Inc.
Thom j. <thom_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Norman,
>In what regard do you mean "a stronger player than Stevie)"?
>Also is there any site that have Kris Wiley's playing? I am [a]
>interested in your comment and [b] want to hear Kris Wiley's
>music.. Tia.. thom_j.
>
Check out http://www.electricblues.com/archive/1999/breaking.html
Unfortunately, you can't download any sample cuts from the CD.
Kris can just really play. There is no bullshiting around with her stuff. This
might sound sexist, but she sounds just like a guy. I have never heard a
female (not Deborah Coleman or anyone else) guitarist play with such a
powerful aggressive bluesy voice.
I have seen her play several times in person and her playing was even stronger
than is displayed on this CD. Even if you don't quite agree with my "stronger
player than Stevie" comment, I think that you will agree that she is someone
definitely worth listening to.
Hope that you enjoy it....
Norman
Bob Russell
je...@dgs.dgsys.com wrote on 3/8/02 12:56 AM:
> Her vocal stylings seem to be patterned after Bonnie Raitt (I don't consider
> her singing to be her strong suit), but her guitar playing is top notch. You
> may not care for her style, but if you just listen past that then you should
> find plenty to admire (plus she is tall and physically gorgeous).
I found clips on Amazon, but they were short and edited with Amazon's
inimitable flair for missing the guitar solo. :)
Jete Software Inc.
I don't have my speakers connected up to my computer, so I can't listen to
any of the samples, but you might want to check out CDNOW.com. I noticed
that they have a sample of every cut. But I don't know the length of any of the
samples, because my system doesn't have any sound. Anyway, check out "Two Long
Leg" and "Iceman - One for Albert", those are probably the most representative
of her best stuff.
Norman
Stephanie Sante
touch to all her styles as well as Fusion.
Stephanie Sante
Tom Walls
"Ethan Young" <(laissez_faire)@att.net> says...
> Was she hot?
>
> Ethan
> "I can't even see where I'm going with this"
>
You might think so... it was your mama.
Nnajar828
>
>I found your IUMA site...are all the songs there also on your cd?
>
>Thanks,
>Ethan
Hey Ethan,
No, but a number of the songs on the cd are on the site. The site has a bunch
of other tunes too (that aren't on the cd). Hope you like it!
Nate
Gary Allen
in article a69nds$r...@dgs.dgsys.com, Jete Software Inc. at
je...@dgs.dgsys.com wrote on 3/7/02 10:58 PM:
Ethan Young
"Tom Walls" <tw...@REMOVEcornell.edu> wrote in message
> In article <khRh8.20436$106.1...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,
> "Ethan Young" <(laissez_faire)@att.net> says...
>
> > Was she hot?
> >
> > Ethan
> > "I can't even see where I'm going with this"
> >
> You might think so... it was your mama.
>
>
> --
> Tom Walls
> the guy at the Temple of Zeus
Oh, you're going down for that, Tommy Boy...
Ethan Young
"respectin' his mama since 1984"
Thom j.
I'm listening Kris Wiley's mp3 now "How Come It Feels So Good"
and what I have heard so far I hear just a "smiggin" of Bonnie but I
hear more of a female Robert Cray in her voice and definitely some
influence of Buddy Guy, BB King and maybe a little SRV?..
Kris's voice isn't as strong aka raging as Bonnie either and Bonnie
would not play like this as her 'tuning' is more conducive to 'Slide
Guitar' like "Johnny Winters".. of course this is jmho :)
Thom j.
I can downnload it off mp3.com & just sent another post on it
prior to this one Norman. She is feminique enough for my ears
to know she is female :)
Her playing's real fine! Putting her up against "SRV" is one tall
order. Since you are right in the middle of my Genre' of music
that I've played for a good 35+years and I think the one cut is
real fine but {imho} she isnt close to "SRV" but I'm bias... :)
As stated in my prior post, I hear/feel more Robert Cray from
her & it is a pleasant change.. I like Kris's lead licks & I know
many of them. Again it isnt fair to judge Kris on just one song
so what I hear I like but she is no SRV!
Please understand, I am not trying to 'demean' her playing in
anyway.. It is just I know SRV's stuff way too well!! jmho :)
Cheers Thom_j.
"Jete Software Inc." <je...@dgs.dgsys.com> wrote in message
news:a69keb$p...@dgs.dgsys.com...
Thom j.
so good" Good ol' Albert Collins, Dag I knew I missed someone!
Now if she can smoke on the other songs like Albert C then she is
smokin' and this is where I heard a 'Chicago Blues' influence right
away instead of a Texas Blues Smokin' & No Jokin' SRV style...
$.02 more from mua` :)
"Jete Software Inc." <je...@dgs.dgsys.com> wrote in message
news:a69nds$r...@dgs.dgsys.com...
David Walden
Gary Allen wrote:
>
> Point well taken. Ladies it is! I was trying
> to sound so formal, like women or lady.
> Please note, I love women are interested in jazz.
> I most certainly take 'em seriously! It amazing
> how a little slang can be taken.
>
Personally, I love to hear a lady vocalist sing the old Ellington
favorite
"Swingless Things Are Meaningless"...
Charlie
Thom j.
feminine gender should come to the fore-front of both blues & jazz.
more of my $.02 :) thom_j.
"Stephanie Sante" <ssa...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ea2i8.2918$Nd.1...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Jete Software Inc.
>prior to this one Norman. She is feminique enough for my ears
>to know she is female :)
>Her playing's real fine! Putting her up against "SRV" is one tall
>order. Since you are right in the middle of my Genre' of music
>that I've played for a good 35+years and I think the one cut is
>real fine but {imho} she isnt close to "SRV" but I'm bias... :)
>As stated in my prior post, I hear/feel more Robert Cray from
>her & it is a pleasant change.. I like Kris's lead licks & I know
>many of them. Again it isnt fair to judge Kris on just one song
>so what I hear I like but she is no SRV!
>Please understand, I am not trying to 'demean' her playing in
>anyway.. It is just I know SRV's stuff way too well!! jmho :)
>Cheers Thom_j.
I am assuming that you only downloaded "How Come It Feels So Good?", which
is a pretty weak tune. I went to mp3.com and that was the featured tune, so
I am assuming that you are basing your entire judgement on that single tune.
If so, that really isn't a very fair or comprehensive evaluation on which to
judge someone.
Anyway, try CDNOW.com. I don't have any speakers on my computer, so I can't
tell how long their free samples are, but they do have samples of all of the
cuts from her CD. Give "Two Long Leg" and "Iceman - One for Albert" a listen
and let me know what you think of them. Hopefully, the sample will be long
enough (or you could just break down and buy the CD). Those are both
instrumental pieces and are much more (IMHO) serious pieces.
Also don't get me wrong I am not saying that Kris Wiley is in SRV's class as
an artist. I consider SRV to be a tremendous artist who forged an incredible
trademark sound with the interplay between his voice and guitar. I don't really
compare SRV to other guitarists, because that shortchanges him. SRV's only
real comparison (IMHO) was Ray Charles. Ray was the only other musician who was
able to get that subtle interplay between his playing and singing. But I am a
big fan of both SRV and Ray Charles, and I think that any type of comparison
to Ray is praise of the highest order.
But I still think that she is a better guitar player than SRV.
Norman
Thom j.
short takes as I could on the other site and again they were real fine!
If you never saw SRV live then you might not understand my point
of view, which is fine. Quickly, I have 100s of tapes and albums of
the so called greats of blues & I am trying to build my 'jazz' library,
not blues.. So at this juncture my blues buying is just about nill..
I could go into a long note-by-note' dissertation on the differences
but this is a Jazz newsgroup not Blues, so I will not go into any of
plus factors of SRV over Kris. Again I am bias and your opinions
maybe valid but still I don't hear 'better' playing by Kris over SRV
nor even close.. :) Cheers Thom_j.
Stephanie Sante
guitar players. Jane Getter is listed so you can follow the link. Here CD is
a mix of styles from Blues to Jazz fusion.
http://www.geocities.com/trogotagel/femmegtrs.html
Stephanie
"Thom j." <thom_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:OV8i8.145265$pN4.7...@bin8.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
Stephanie Sante
http://www.geocities.com/trogotagel/reviews/susanweinert.html
Stephanie Sante
"Stephanie Sante" <ssa...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ea2i8.2918$Nd.1...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Thom j.
learning, reading, etc. etc. :) Thanx Thom_j.
"Stephanie Sante" <ssa...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:Rsni8.7355$Vx1.4...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Evan
> able to get that subtle interplay between his playing and singing. But I
am a
> big fan of both SRV and Ray Charles, and I think that any type of
comparison
> to Ray is praise of the highest order.
How about Jimi Hendrix?
-Evan
Thom j.
"Evan" <industr...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:sBqi8.49640$991.12...@typhoon.kc.rr.com...
funkle
> yeah, women, ... even Jeniffer Baton.
It's really funny that you should mention guitar "babe" Jennifer
Batten, because I just stumbled across this recently:
http://www.emusic.com/albums/25135/
Jennifer shredding her way through Giant Steps!!!!!! It's pretty
amazing - she actually does a pretty good job... better than I can
anyway.
funkle
> I have found only 3 chicks who play jazz guitar:
> Emily Remler
> Leni Stern
> Sheryl Bailey
>
> Anyone know of others.
There is a local guitarist in the San Francisco Bay area named Mimi
Fox, who is really very good - I am very impressed with her playing.
And I definately got the impression that, despite her name, she
wouldn't appreciate being called a "chick"
Thom j.
"funkle" <sv...@speakeasy.org> wrote in message
news:2968b9d6.0203...@posting.google.com...
Home
can't play anyway....
Gary Allen
industr...@hotmail.com wrote on 3/9/02 8:18 AM:
How 'bout Muddy Waters?
Gary Allen
sv...@speakeasy.org wrote on 3/9/02 10:49 PM:
Using the word "babe" might get you in trouble. Watch out.
I think it should go "the attractive lady/woman shredding on Giant Steps".
Any other acceptable PC terminlogy here?
Anyone know where the PC faq is posted?
Gary Allen
sv...@speakeasy.org wrote on 3/9/02 10:54 PM:
Would about "the fox on jazz guitar"?
Do you know where the PC faq is posted? :)
Gary Allen
and are much more (IMHO) serious pieces.
>
> Also don't get me wrong I am not saying that Kris Wiley is in SRV's class as
> an artist. I consider SRV to be a tremendous artist who forged an incredible
> trademark sound with the interplay between his voice and guitar.
>
I thought is was his big guitar sound & bringing the blues to
teenagers. He bought blues to the masses.
I don't think he's that great of a singer myself. What blew me away
was reading how Robin Trower said SRV changed his approach to playing
blues guitar. And I always thought RT had much more creative
things to say than SRV. The real modern blues god is Hendrix.
Stevie tunes can't light torch next to Hendrix. I just think
SRV gets to much hype. I don't Stevie would have expected
all the hype he has gotten. I bet he didn't like it either.
He was one honest person. The media has just made me sick
of the image.
Hope I don't sound like I'm getting on anybodies case.
Just had to chimed my two cents in on Stevie. To me Stevie
real claim to fane is I know several people who 1st got
exposed to the blues through him. Since then they checked
Muddy Waters, Howlin' Wolf, Albert Collins. Stevie Ray
is the Kenny G of blues. I know jazzers hate to admit it,
but the success of Kenny G and the smooth jazz has bought
more listeners to Miles, Trane, & Monk. That's what
important. To me anyway.
Gary
Link
and the pizza's gone cold,
Here's a thought... Isn't something offensive WHEN THEY SAY IT IS? Not just
assuming that some moral high ground has been made by "protecting" someone
we haven't even met yet. *scratches head*
Hell, what do I know. I get called a wanker all the time!!!
Right, about this pizza...
;)
Thom j.
The issue I brought up was the comparison of Kris Wiley to SRV.
Jimi H is entirely different player. I feel they do not compare at all.
I played in the upfront group when Jimi H was in town {Philly} &
he was one of a kind... Also Jimi Hendrix was more into jazz then
rock/blues but I guess most know that here?
Tom Lippincott
>Hope I don't sound like I'm getting on anybodies case.
>Just had to chimed my two cents in on Stevie. To me Stevie
>real claim to fane is I know several people who 1st got
>exposed to the blues through him. Since then they checked
>Muddy Waters, Howlin' Wolf, Albert Collins. Stevie Ray
>is the Kenny G of blues.
yikes! Stevie Ray had more honest human expression in the dead skin of one of
his fallen off calluses than Kenny G has had in his whole career.
I know jazzers hate to admit it,
>but the success of Kenny G and the smooth jazz has bought
>more listeners to Miles, Trane, & Monk.
I've never met one. It's my opinion that just the opposite is true; the more
people who think Kenny G is jazz, the less people who are ever likely to hear
Miles, Trane or Monk. I think Kenny G and "smooth jazz" in general are the
main reason that "bumpy" jazz has become less and less popular in the last 20
years or so.
That's what
>important. To me anyway.
>
>Gary
Tom Lippincott
Guitarist, Composer, Teacher
audio samples, articles, CD's at:
http://www.tomlippincott.com
Thom j.
your ears and brain checked!
"Thom j." <thom_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:asbj8.187608$7a1.16...@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
Bob Russell
tomli...@aol.comnospam wrote on 3/12/02 2:54 AM:
> It's my opinion that just the opposite is true; the more
> people who think Kenny G is jazz, the less people who are ever likely to hear
> Miles, Trane or Monk. I think Kenny G and "smooth jazz" in general are the
> main reason that "bumpy" jazz has become less and less popular in the last 20
> years or so.
I agree with you, Tom. Kenny G and his ilk are being sold to the public as
"jazz" by the corporate music-machine. As a result, when you say the word
"jazz" to the average guy on the street, images of keening soprano saxes and
user-friendly "urban grooves" probably pass through his head. Play this same
guy a Jerry Bergonzi tune and he'll probably just say, "What the hell is
that?".
-- Bob Russell
http://www.uncwil.edu/people/russellr
Gary Allen
bobrus...@hotmail.com wrote on 3/12/02 7:11 AM:
Jazz is one of the casualities of the corporate music-machine. The last 20
years! The real culprit to jazz's popular demise is the Beatles.
Speaking for myself, I went through Lee Ritenour, Larry Carlton, Steve Kahn,
Dave Sanborn, Spyro Gyra, Jeff Lorber, and Kenny Gorelick, b4 "Songbird",
before discovering and learning to appreciate Miles, Monk, & Trane. And
yes, I hate when people think KG is jazz. Of course these artist are the
forerunners of the smooth jazz movement.
It is my understanding that mainstream jazz is selling better today than it
was 20 years ago.
I been so what successful converting past dates from listening to Kenny G
to listening to Miles, Desmond, & Getz. When that romantic feeling is
required. A lot of it has got to do with getting people use to listening
to instrumental music.
In my original statement about KG bringing more listeners to jazz
is an idea bought to me by an Andrew Hill editorial in Downbeat. He was
right in my instance and I figure I am not the only one. Hill was
discussing Pat Metheny comments about KG and using Louis Armstrong in
one of his videos.
For what its worth.
Gary
http://www.garygraymusic.com
Gary Allen
in article Elnj8.56299$hO6.4...@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com, Thom j. at
thom_...@yahoo.com wrote on 3/12/02 5:25 AM:
thomas
> I seen Kenny G play bebop. Can you say the same of Stevie Ray?
SRV wasn't too good at making jazz changes, but so what?
SRV was great at playing blues. Kenny G isn't great at
playing any style.
Thom j.
your points are ludicrous...Did he play beBop? certianly but what
does this have to do with Kris Wiley playing verses SRV? So my
time can be spent replying to better posts then this.. have fun..
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8B3BA9E.3E42%garyg...@yahoo.com...
Tom Lippincott
>years! The real culprit to jazz's popular demise is the Beatles.
>
well, to some extent I can see that you have a point, in that the Beatles'
tremendous popularity, and resulting record sales, were what set stage for the
existence of the "corporate music machine." However, I don't think the Beatles
had anything to do with the "dumbing down" of music for the average music
consumer that has taken place in the last 20 years or so. On the contrary, the
Beatles performed a rare and exemplary feat (in my opinion); they produced
great high level art that somehow managed to be accessible to the average
person.
>Speaking for myself, I went through Lee Ritenour, Larry Carlton, Steve Kahn,
>Dave Sanborn, Spyro Gyra, Jeff Lorber, and Kenny Gorelick, b4 "Songbird",
>before discovering and learning to appreciate Miles, Monk, & Trane. And
>yes, I hate when people think KG is jazz.
okay, when I think back I did know a few horn players in college who got
started listening to jazz via Sanborn, Spyro Gyra, ect. But even though that
music is very "listener friendly," to me it's on a whole other level than
what's going on in the smooth jazz genre these days.
Of course these artist are the
>forerunners of the smooth jazz movement.
>
right, but I really doubt the average Kenny G fan knows who any of those people
are, let alone Miles and 'Trane. I could be wrong, though.
>It is my understanding that mainstream jazz is selling better today than it
>was 20 years ago.
>
well, this gets into a whole other argument; the "Wynton/retro/young lions"
movement versus the "Zorn contingent."
>I been so what successful converting past dates from listening to Kenny G
>to listening to Miles, Desmond, & Getz. When that romantic feeling is
>required. A lot of it has got to do with getting people use to listening
>to instrumental music.
>
>In my original statement about KG bringing more listeners to jazz
>is an idea bought to me by an Andrew Hill editorial in Downbeat. He was
>right in my instance and I figure I am not the only one.
I would contend that you are not an example of someone who started out as a
smooth jazz fan. The artists you mention as being your formative inspirations
were all popular before smooth jazz existed.
Hill was
>discussing Pat Metheny comments about KG and using Louis Armstrong in
>one of his videos.
>
well, Andrew Hill is certainly entitled to his opinion. I just get a bit irked
when someone suggests that jazz musicians owe some sort of "debt" to Kenny G
for "keeping jazz alive" or something. I have heard this type of statement
quite a bit. I guess to me it goes beyond mere music genres. I think that
Kenny G (or probably more to the point, the corporate entities that created the
product called "Kenny G") and his ilk are enemies of every artist who attempts
to express something honest and human. I think the same thing is true of
N'Sync and so forth, but at least no one is claiming that that stuff is "jazz."
>For what its worth.
>Gary
>http://www.garygraymusic.com
>
Gary Allen
tomli...@aol.comnospam wrote on 3/12/02 11:57 PM:
>> Jazz is one of the casualities of the corporate music-machine. The last 20
>> years! The real culprit to jazz's popular demise is the Beatles.
>>
>
> well, to some extent I can see that you have a point, in that the Beatles'
> tremendous popularity, and resulting record sales, were what set stage for the
> existence of the "corporate music machine." However, I don't think the
> Beatles
> had anything to do with the "dumbing down" of music for the average music
> consumer that has taken place in the last 20 years or so. On the contrary,
> the
> Beatles performed a rare and exemplary feat (in my opinion); they produced
> great high level art that somehow managed to be accessible to the average
> person.
The "dumbing down" question is interesting one. I think its only the jazz
listening public in general realize that this phenomena has taken place.
Do you think it has been a plot by corporate america? Or just a natural
downward evolution because our education systems are in peril.
>
>> Speaking for myself, I went through Lee Ritenour, Larry Carlton, Steve Kahn,
>> Dave Sanborn, Spyro Gyra, Jeff Lorber, and Kenny Gorelick, b4 "Songbird",
>> before discovering and learning to appreciate Miles, Monk, & Trane. And
>> yes, I hate when people think KG is jazz.
> okay, when I think back I did know a few horn players in college who got
> started listening to jazz via Sanborn, Spyro Gyra, ect. But even though that
> music is very "listener friendly," to me it's on a whole other level than
> what's going on in the smooth jazz genre these days.
>
I agee whole heartedly. Its a shame. Once in awhile, while I'm in grocery
store, dentist office, friend's car I'll hear them play some of that old
stuff. I couldn't say that 20 years ago.
> Of course these artist are the
>> forerunners of the smooth jazz movement.
>>
>
> right, but I really doubt the average Kenny G fan knows who any of those
> people
> are, let alone Miles and 'Trane. I could be wrong, though.
>
I doubt you're wrong about the average KG fan. I'm referring to the rare
few who might really get excited and start checking out the history.
>> It is my understanding that mainstream jazz is selling better today than it
>> was 20 years ago.
>>
>
> well, this gets into a whole other argument; the "Wynton/retro/young lions"
> movement versus the "Zorn contingent."
>
Interesting how different camps of thought battle one other. Zorn is the
modern day Ornette.
>> I been so what successful converting past dates from listening to Kenny G
>> to listening to Miles, Desmond, & Getz. When that romantic feeling is
>> required. A lot of it has got to do with getting people use to listening
>> to instrumental music.
>>
>> In my original statement about KG bringing more listeners to jazz
>> is an idea bought to me by an Andrew Hill editorial in Downbeat. He was
>> right in my instance and I figure I am not the only one.
>
> I would contend that you are not an example of someone who started out as a
> smooth jazz fan. The artists you mention as being your formative inspirations
> were all popular before smooth jazz existed.
>
> Hill was
>> discussing Pat Metheny comments about KG and using Louis Armstrong in
>> one of his videos.
>>
>
> well, Andrew Hill is certainly entitled to his opinion. I just get a bit
> irked
> when someone suggests that jazz musicians owe some sort of "debt" to Kenny G
> for "keeping jazz alive" or something. I have heard this type of statement
> quite a bit. I guess to me it goes beyond mere music genres. I think that
> Kenny G (or probably more to the point, the corporate entities that created
> the
> product called "Kenny G") and his ilk are enemies of every artist who attempts
> to express something honest and human. I think the same thing is true of
> N'Sync and so forth, but at least no one is claiming that that stuff is
> "jazz."
>
I hope I didn't allude to jazzers owing a "debt". I agree about the honesty.
I think you make a good point about separting KG the product & KG the
person/musician. Surely, you can't blame an ex-accountant for taking the
corporate boat ride. And yes, musically he sold his soul. He should take
the heat for that while he is raising his family in a 4 million dollar
mansion.
I would have to admit that SRV did not make that sacrafice.
Gary Allen
tomb...@jhu.edu wrote on 3/12/02 3:24 PM:
> Gary Allen <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:<B8B3BA9E.3E42%garyg...@yahoo.com>...
>> I seen Kenny G play bebop. Can you say the same of Stevie Ray?
>
> SRV wasn't too good at making jazz changes, but so what?
> SRV was great at playing blues. Kenny G isn't great at
> playing any style.
>
>
True statement above. I wasn't comparing their musical abilities.
SRV bought blues to the masses. KG bought "watered down jazz" to the
masses. That's all. KG sold his musical soul. SRV didn't.
Gary Allen
was not a very good musician. I would venture to guess that KG had, since
SRV as passed on, a better understanding of music theory & applications.
Not that makes him a better musician, just a better educated one.
However, to the real meat of this thread. I checked out the Kris Wiley
samples. I like!! If you haven't checked out the Mimi Fox.
She's hot! All the way around!
Thom j.
in any other thread.. Still Kris isn't close to SRV & it isnt an
opinion but a fact! Also I'm not trying to demean Kris Wiley
in anyway. Its just I know too much about SRV's history &
his playing.. cheers thom_j.
"Gary Allen" <garyg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:B8B51BEE.3F74%garyg...@yahoo.com...
EER-MUSIC.com
news:Rsni8.7355$Vx1.4...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> Here you go.. The Site is E.E.R. This is the page for a number of female
> guitar players. Jane Getter is listed so you can follow the link. Here CD
is
> a mix of styles from Blues to Jazz fusion.
>
> http://www.geocities.com/trogotagel/femmegtrs.html
>
> Stephanie
Stephanie!
Wow, thanks for the plug!
BTW: Don't forget the awesome axe of Susan Weinert of Germay
--
EER-MUSIC.com aka Eclectic Earwig Reviews
http://www.EER-MUSIC.com
Thom j.
expensive Stephanie :)
"EER-MUSIC.com" <legat...@geocities.com> wrote in message
news:pHTj8.38517$y65.7...@typhoon.southeast.rr.com...