Michelle by The Beatles - 2nd chord of verse?
Joey Goldstein
The original is in F, which makes the chord I'm talking about Bbm or
Bbm7. It's the chord that's on the lyric "my belle" in bar 2 of the verse.
So... I'm watching this PBS thing with Sir Paul receiving his award at
The White House and somebody in his band is playing a major chord there.
I thought to myself that either one of his sidemen doesn't know the tune
or that he's getting a little senile.
But then I try to check online with a recording of the original, like
this one:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfWVKQoRXhk>
And it really sounds like Bbmaj to me.
The melody against it is:
Db Ab
my belle
WTF?
Am I going nuts?
Did this just slip by in the studio when they recorded it?
I guess not.
And who am I to argue with Sir Paul and John Lennon and George Martin?
But what an odd choice.
Or are my ears just fucked?
--
Joey Goldstein
<http://www.joeygoldstein.com>
<http://homepage.mac.com/josephgoldstein/AudioClips/audio.htm>
joegold AT primus DOT ca
paul s
I've always thought it was a IVminor chord too (that's how I "hear
it" in my head) and I've seen a few charts that had it that way. I
think it's in the Real Book that way. Really seems like the logical
choice...
Paul S
DannyW.
The "Complete Scores," which is generally accurate, shows this as a
Bbm7.
Danny W.
Bg
<http://www.beatlestube.net/video.php?title=Michelle>
Joey's right about the melody notes, and the chord and vocal harmonies
indicate a Bb7 Chord making the melody a b9 and 7th of that chord for
what it's worth.
I wouldn't do it that way on a gig tho.
Bg
Joey Goldstein
Db is a #9 on Bb7, not b9.
Bg
Yeah, sheesh, that's exaclty what I meant. I'm an idjit who doesn't
double check what he writes.
My posts are full of spelling errors etc.
I wonder if that tune was done Pre-George martin?
Bg
Jeremey Poparad
Wow, you're right! I was almost certain that it was Bbm, and that's
how I've always played it, but after listening to that clip, it really
is Bb7 with a #9 in the melody. I don't think I would actually play a
Bb7#9 chord for accompaniment, but sure enough, it is indeed Bb7 and
not Bbm. You learn something new every day...
Frisbieinstein
>
The Beatles were rather unconstrained by musical convention. When I
check my memory against what they actually did I'm often surprised by
odd twists like that. They did whatever their ears told them,
especially John Lennon, and the results were often unorthodox.
I was listening to the intro to I Want To Hold Your Hand the other
day. They drop a half beat in the third measure and add it back in at
the end of the fourth measure. Sort of. Or more like they create an
illusion that this is what they are doing. The voices coming in are
always a surprise: they seem like they are in the wrong place, but no.
There's a clever thing like that in Jmi Hendrix' I Don't Live Today.
The guitar deliberately comes in "wrong." It's exciting, shocking.
van
That was always kind of wedged in my subconscious. I heard someone
singing a D natural in the vocal harmony, and the chord is just
chunked instead of held out so it doesn't really bother you as it
would have if they sustained it.
There could be three reasons why they did this:
1) It's a mistake
2) Paul was doing some "word painting" on the words "my belle" making
them spicy and dissonant because they're in French.
3) The Beatles had no training in harmony, so they could do anything
they wanted to do, and maybe they thought that might make it sound
like a French cabaret song, which it does.
On the little guitar line, he sustains the Db, and it doesn't sound
that dissonant, but towards the end you can hear the acoustic 12 str.
guitar play the 4ths Ab and Db as a double stop against the Bb bass
when the singing returns.
One thing to notice is the first word "my" comes in after a rest on
the first beat, so it's not as dissonant sounding as coming in on the
first beat.
It's also held for only one beat and then it drops to the Ab which is
held out cause it's not as dissonant (a 7th compared to a #9) as the
Db.
This reminds me of a string quartet by Haydn we were listening to in
college when all of a sudden we hear these 7th # 9 chords come out of
nowhere!
Another one of Papa Joe's jokes, apparently.
Paul Mitchell Brown
The Rik Rooksby book, "The Beatles Complete Chord Songbook" is
generally even closer to the actual voicings than 'The Complete
Scores" but in this case, they're both wrong. It's definitely an Bb7#9
and it sounds to me like an F7#9 (1-3-X-2-4-4) capoed at the 5th fret.
Your ears are just fine, Joey.
Although 7#9s were everywhere during that period ("The Word" from
"Rubber Soul" is built around that chord), they were nearly always a I
or V chord - I agree it was pretty out there to use it only for the IV
but that's the Fabs for you!
Here's a link that has both the mono and stereo remasters for "The
Word" and "Michelle":
rpjazzguitar
thought I heard a 7#9 and it sounded like 6x6789 (I'm not sure of the
key, but that grip anyway) -- surprisingly dissonant. The camera
didn't catch his hand well enough for me to see the chord.
charlieguitar
The first time that he did it I thought he made a mistake. When he
continued to do it I realized that it couldn't be.
Charlie
Dave
closely to the original), so in recent years when I've seen Paul play it on
TV, I was initially jarred by the #9 chord I heard. If you watch this
version, you can see and hear him playing a Bb7#9 (7th fret).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cBUBzL5mhc
Upon closer istening to the original, it sounds like the background (guitars
and voices) are probably voicing a Bb7, w/ the melody hittng the Db note.
Joey Goldstein
> I used to think it was a minor chord (based on not actually listening
> closely to the original), so in recent years when I've seen Paul play it on
> TV, I was initially jarred by the #9 chord I heard. If you watch this
> version, you can see and hear him playing a Bb7#9 (7th fret).
There it is.
Thanks.
What an odd choice.
pmfan57
There's nothing on any album that's pre George Martin.
onlyserious
Beatle tunes "arranged and harmonised (sic) in authentic jazz style by
George Adie..." and he calls the chord in that measure Eb11, voiced in
6th position low to high as Eb,Ab,Db,and first melody note on top Db,
and moves the Ab to Bb on the second melody note and playing the
"Belle" of course, as Ab in the same position (9th fret b-string).
Sounds fine in context, a bit square in slow-motion.
Samuel
Bg
Amin melody to it.
Years later when my hearing imrpoved I could hear the the Rythmn
player playing Major Bar chords in that A, G, F E, pattern they do.
The contrasting C# is there buried in that chord, but iwth 3 A's in
that voicing you almost don't notice.
Ther were quite a few tuines in Ventures repertiore that had Minor/
Major clashes, but I couldn't hear them at the time(in the 50's).
It almost seems like every body learned their parts separately. They
had a good lead player who should have noticed these issues.
Bg
Joey Goldstein
That's essentially the same function/sound as Bbm7/Eb.
Most people play it as Bbm7.
What's weird is that it's really Bb7#9.
rpjazzguitar
Revision:
On the video you can see (and hear) that there's no 6th. He's capoed,
but it's the equivilent of 686799
Joey Goldstein
Sounds like that are quite common on tonic function chords, eg. I7#9 on
a blues.
But it's extremely uncommon on a IV chord in a major key, in my experience.
If the key in that section was F minor rather than F major then the Db
melody note might be somewhat less jarring against the Bb7 chord, but I
hesitate to give a "reason" for this because it won't be logically
consistent. But that's the way I hear it.
TD
>
> - Show quoted text -
And Papa was a rolling stone.
-TD
Jazzer
> I've always thought that this was a IVm chord.
I heard it as a dominant 7th chord in the 60's and still do to this
day.
But then, maybe I need to just clean out my ears? :)
Dave
> On 7/29/2010 10:04 AM, Dave wrote:
>> I used to think it was a minor chord (based on not actually listening
>> closely to the original), so in recent years when I've seen Paul
>> play it on TV, I was initially jarred by the #9 chord I heard. If
>> you watch this version, you can see and hear him playing a Bb7#9
>> (7th fret).
>
> There it is.
Yep...but on the 6th fret of course! D'oh!!