7b5 chord and The Girl from Ipanema
grady...@mail.house.gov
recommends the diminished half step scale. I guess that works but
it's a beast to get under my fingers. Also it would seem that the
blues scale, with its b5, would work. But the times I've used that it
seems a bit clunky.
2. How to approach the 7b5? It often seems to be a passing chord.
In Girl from Ipanema, it fits between Gmin7 and Fmaj7. Should I stay
within the F tonality? Or am I missing something?
Thanks!
Derek
Five Sharp
#####
<grady...@mail.house.gov> schreef in bericht
news:7377de3a-cf96-4d36...@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
Rick Del Savio
Well, if it's the G7b5 chord that occupies measures 3-4 of 'Ipanema' a
couple of ways to go might be; G whole-tone scale and/or the D melodic
minor scale. Both of which would draw attention, as it were to the b5
of that G dom. 7th chord, Db. Arpeggio wise perhaps Dm/Ma7 add a 9th,
or FMaj7#5. Good luck. Rick Del Savio 30 Free lessons audio clips at;
http://www.rickdelsavio.com
ric...@gmail.com
> recommends the diminished half step scale. I guess that works but
> it's a beast to get under my fingers. Also it would seem that the
> blues scale, with its b5, would work. But the times I've used that it
> seems a bit clunky.
>
In Ipanema the Gb7b5 is a b5 sub for C7. I play over the C7....
...richie
Joe Finn
news:7377de3a-cf96-4d36...@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
There are a few scales you can try.
http://www.joefinn.net/html/altered_scales.htm
But don't overlook the chord tones. There are several easy arpeggios that
you could get started on. Try the fifth one on this page. It's easy.
http://www.joefinn.net/html/down_up_down_sweep_sweep_sweep.html
Enjoy! ...........................joe
--
Visit me on the web www.JoeFinn.net
tonyde...@gmail.com
Before you get into scales, altered scales and slick arpeggiated
devices far into the Ozone, realize that it is subbing for the
*function* of 'V7 to I' via the cycle of 2 as opposed to the cycle of
5. Gb can be a "sexier" bass note at times leading from the ii-7 to
the Imaj. The "flat five" in Gb7 *is* the root of C7, the real
cadential fixture being altered. Gb, in turn, is the b5 of C7. Now you
have a tail chasing the dog, but see the function first and then add
your associations afterward; is just my perspective and
recommendation.
-TD
rpjazz...@gmail.com
major scale with two changes - lower the 7th to a b7 (meaning F to E)
and lower the Db to a C.
But, if you do that, you'll be playing the exact notes of the Gb7b5
chord and it will sound pretty vanilla.
Better to simply play the notes of a C7 chord C E G Bb. The underlying
scale can be seen as Fmaj. Anyway, the C sounds like a b5, the G
sounds like a b9, you still have the 3rd and 7th and you're playing
jazz.
There are lots of other options, but this is a good place to begin.
As far as how to play over a 7b5 more generally, it depends on the
harmonic context. Lyd dom isn't likely to sound bad and it's good to
know.
David Raleigh Arnold
At last the right answer, and without beating it to death. I salute you.
You could play over Gb7 too. Or both of them. daveA
--
email: darn...@cox.net (put "poisonal" anywhere in subject)
DGT: The very best technical exercises for all guitarists:
http://www.openguitar.com/dynamic.html. Original easy solos at:
http://www.openguitar.com. :::=={_o) David Raleigh Arnold
paul s
I'm not really a "scales and modes" guy, but - the Gb Lydian 7 does
work nicely here. The notes of the scale are Gb, Ab, Bb, C,Db,Eb, Fb.
These are the same notes that you'll find in a C altered scale. Both
are modes of a Db melodic minor scale.
A shortcut that some guys use to "get to " melodic minor - flat the
3rd of a major scale. In this case Db major, flat the F to an Fb.
Tim McNamara
<7377de3a-cf96-4d36...@m3g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>,
grady...@mail.house.gov wrote:
I treat it one of three ways, generally. One is to use the min7b5
arpeggio, another is to use a diminished scale (which gives an outside
note), and the third is to use the major scale a half-step above the
min7b5. So, a Dmin7b5 would be treated as being within Eb, or I'd use a
Dmin7b5 arpeggio, or a D diminished scale.
Joe Finn
news:fuo88i$d1b$1...@news.datemas.de...
P.S. Whenever I hear the question, "What should I play over this chord?" or
"What should I play over that chord?", I immediately begin to wonder about
the listening habits of the person asking the question. You really can't
learn jazz improvisation without being a good listener.
What I recommend is simple. Find a recording of your favorite player
improvising over the different types of chords that you want to learn about.
Lift the improvised passages and learn to play them note for note. You
should write them down too. You'll be doing this not so much to imitate what
you've heard but to discover something about the concept of how the
improvisation relates to the various harmonies. You'll also be acquiring
much needed improvisational vocabulary in the process.
Your approach of taking scales out of books is fine but it won't give you
the kind of context you need. That part comes from listening, imitating and
assimilating. ....joe
Joey Goldstein
> 1. Any tips for improvising over 7b5 chords? I've got a book that
> recommends the diminished half step scale. I guess that works but
> it's a beast to get under my fingers. Also it would seem that the
> blues scale, with its b5, would work. But the times I've used that it
> seems a bit clunky.
Depends on context.
The main chord-scale relationships that tend be used on dom7b5 chords are:
lydian b7 [1 9 3 b5 (aka #11) 5 13 b7 1]
altered dominant [1 b9 #9 3 b5 (aka #11) #5 (aka b13) b7 1]
whole tone [1 9 3 b5 (aka #11) b13 (aka #5) b7 1]
dim half-whole [1 b9 #9 3 b5 (aka #11) 5 13 b7 1]
> 2. How to approach the 7b5? It often seems to be a passing chord.
> In Girl from Ipanema, it fits between Gmin7 and Fmaj7. Should I stay
> within the F tonality? Or am I missing something?
The Gb7 in Ipanema usually takes the lyd b7 scale:
Gb Ab Bb C Db Eb Fb Gb
1 9 3 #11 5 13 b7 1
This is the 4th mode of Db melodic minor.
Gb7 here is functionally equivalent to C7alt/Gb.
The C altered dominant scale is also a mode of Db melodic minor. It's
the 7th mode of Db mel min. So you could approach this as being C7alt as
well.
--
Joey Goldstein
<http://www.joeygoldstein.com>
<http://homepage.mac.com/josephgoldstein/AudioClips/audio.htm>
joegold AT sympatico DOT ca
hw
<tonyde...@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:ca8a9f94-b238-4518...@a70g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>-TD
what's the cycle of 2?
tonyde...@gmail.com
> <tonydecap...@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:ca8a9f94-b238-4518...@a70g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>
> - Show quoted text -
2nds. The cycle of three is 3rds. The cycle of 4 is 4ths. The famous
cycle of 5 is fifths? You dig?
-TD
Derek
>The easiest thing would be a half diminished arp.
Sorry about the brain fart. Busy at work yesterday, and wasn't paying
close enough attention.
I thought you were asking about a half diminished chord.
Chickenhead
If you want a "scales and modes" answer, Paul S gave it to you perfectly in
one short paragraph.
Notice, however, that Paul did mention that he's not a 'scales and modes'
guy. Paul knows his scales and modes as well as anyone on this group, yet
he's not a scales and modes guy. So there you have it. You've been warned!
Forget this crap about "improvising over a b5 chord," diminished scales,
blues scales, lydian b7 scales, harmonic major scales, modes of scales,
altered modes of scales, pentatonic scales, etc.
In jazz, one does not improvise by plugging in scales over chords. Chords
are like words. In combination with other chords and information, they are
a useful shorthand for understanding and communicating harmony.
Words change meaning and usage when combined with other words, inflection,
punctuation, syntax. A chord without a context is like a word without other
words and without punctuation, syntax, and inflection. A chord needs
melody, rhythm, other chords, style, and a whole bunch of other stuff before
it means anything. How a chord will be treated and used in improvisation
depends on the style, the song, and the improviser.
Teachers sometimes give students scales to play over chords as an
easy-to-digest introduction to jazz improvisation. It's a fun little toy
that can let students have some fun and creativity. It's good for student
retention if you're a teacher because it gives students instant
gratification. It keeps students from getting frustrated and giving up,
because they can right away start making music and improvising. It also
sounds authoritative and spooky when people say things like "pentatonic,"
"phrygian major," "super-locrian," etc., so people think music teachers are
smart because they have big spooky words and can do a little math.
Find players and styles you dig. Sing along, dance along, copy as much as
you can, learn harmony, learn what "Gb7b5" really means, understand, feel,
and refine your time (a/k/a "rhythm"). You're asking the wrong question.
Which solos, players, and recordings of Ipanema do you like and want to
sound like? Therein lies your answer.
On Apr 23, 4:04 pm, grady.bo...@mail.house.gov wrote:
>> 1. Any tips for improvising over 7b5 chords? I've got a book that
>> recommends the diminished half step scale. I guess that works but it's
>> a beast to get under my fingers. Also it would seem that the blues
>> scale, with its b5, would work. But the times I've used that it seems
>> a bit clunky.
>>
>>
hw
<tonyde...@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:74de64fa-2773-40ea...@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>>-TD
i see. to me actually the cycle of 2nds (minor seconds in this case, aka the
chromatic scale) and the cycle of fifths are just two sides of the same
coin.
i totally agree about going for and playing off the function first. in fact
it's a bit of a pet peeve of mine. ( i wrote an article in german for
beginners which deals with this topic on www.archtop-germany.com)
thomas schönsgibl
"hw" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> i totally agree about going for and playing off the function first. in
fact
> it's a bit of a pet peeve of mine. ( i wrote an article in german for
> beginners which deals with this topic on www.archtop-germany.com)
>
thanks! "com" did not work when i clicked the link. "de" works.
http://www.archtop-germany.de/
or the link direct to the workshop:
http://www.archtop-germany.de/-Workshops/-workshops.html
and to your workshop:
http://www.archtop-germany.de/-Workshops/Funktionsharmonielehre/body_funktio
nsharmonielehre.html
i only take a short look on it ( schmidt is in the tv;-)), but do you teach
really the german-notename "H"? i think you also use the englisch-notename
"Bb". that would be "B" in german, ......... so onetime you use german
names, one time english names, ...... in jazz i only would use english
names, .....
bye
thomas
hw
"thomas schönsgibl" <ilov...@utanet.at> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:fuqtu7$f55$1...@newsreader2.utanet.at...
> hi,
> "hw" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
>> i totally agree about going for and playing off the function first. in
> fact
>> it's a bit of a pet peeve of mine. ( i wrote an article in german for
>> beginners which dealswiththistopiconwww.archtop-germany.com
>>
>
>
> http://www.archtop-germany.de/
>
> or the link direct to the workshop:
>
> http://www.archtop-germany.de/-Workshops/-workshops.html
>
> and to your workshop:
>
> http://www.archtop-germany.de/-Workshops/Funktionsharmonielehre/body_funktio
> nsharmonielehre.html
>
> i only take a short look on it ( schmidt is in the tv;-)), but do you
> teach
> really the german-notename "H"? i think you also use the englisch-notename
> "Bb". that would be "B" in german, ......... so onetime you use german
> names, one time english names, ...... in jazz i only would use english
> names, .....
> bye
> thomas
hey thomas, good to hear from you and thanks for the correction with the
link.
since it's a written article i chose to use Bb and H to avoid any confusion.
actually with my students i also use Bb (but pronounced "Bes", a left-over
from having studied in Holland) and H. with written charts i use Bb and B.
best wishes,
holger
paul s
I was taught the chord/scales approach and found it useful for some
situations and problematic for others. Sometimes I remind myself of
something Barney Kessell said, (paraphrasing) - If you are stuck on a
certain chord and don't know what to play, play the chord (in
context), and listen intently. You will eventually hear it's qualities
and where it is going. You will also start to hear melodies or lines.
The ear is the final arbitar. If you are learning scales and modes,
immerse yourself in their sounds. Don't play Lydian b7 because someone
told you to, check it out note by note over the sound of the chord.
Listen and decide. If you like it, you still need vocabulary. Then,
you'll probably want to check out other options, etc.
ray...@yahoo.com
I am not bein' a smart ass here- play the notes out out the 12 that
you like the sound of!
Maj6th
read somewhere that it "fits." They ignore the chord they are playing over,
where it came from, and where it's going.
Maj6th
"paul s" <pasa...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:dd82e46d-637b-4bc3...@u12g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
Joey Goldstein
Maj6th wrote:
> Good advise, so many players play a certain scale or mode because they have
> read somewhere that it "fits." They ignore the chord they are playing over,
> where it came from, and where it's going.
Then they're not really "players" yet. They're students. They're
students who still have a lot more to learn. And they need to spend more
time figuring out how to make musical lines from the notes in that
scale, or start looking for some other note choice logic that they get
better results from.
Joe Finn
"paul s" <pasa...@mindspring.com> wrote
> I was taught the chord/scales approach and found it useful for some
>situations and problematic for others. Sometimes I remind myself of
>something Barney Kessell said, (paraphrasing) - If you are stuck on a
>certain chord and don't know what to play, play the chord (in
>context), and listen intently. You will eventually hear it's qualities
>and where it is going. You will also start to hear melodies or lines.
>The ear is the final arbitar. If you are learning scales and modes,
>immerse yourself in their sounds. Don't play Lydian b7 because someone
>told you to, check it out note by note over the sound of the chord.
>Listen and decide. If you like it, you still need vocabulary. Then,
>you'll probably want to check out other options, etc.
That's good advice. If you want to know what to play over a given chord,
never overlook the obvious: play the chord tones. ................joe
Rick Del Savio
Bravo JG. Rick
Chickenhead
Between the chord tones, the melody, the key of the moment, and the next
chord(s) coming up, and the RHYTHM and articulation, there's a lot of
options there. Unless you're planning to vamp on an X7#11 or X7b5 for 16
bars or something, the chord tones seem to work quite well and are usually
among the best choices.
My default is always the chord tones -- They require least mental
gymnastics. If I pick the chord tones, I can spend the time I'd spend doing
math and mental gymnastics to focus on what's coming up, instead of what to
"play over" a chord. I can also use those chord tones as a foundation to
hear other notes against and to visualize and hear the harmonic movement.
"Joe Finn" <J...@JoeFinn.net> wrote in message
news:fuson1$p8q$1...@news.datemas.de...
Maj6th
Maj6th
"Rick Del Savio" <rain...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:05ed8821-d9b8-46fd...@m36g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
Joe Finn
"Joey Goldstein" <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:fuso6k$nja$1...@news.datemas.de...
>
> Maj6th wrote:
>> Good advise, so many players play a certain scale or mode because they
>> have read somewhere that it "fits." They ignore the chord they are
>> playing over, where it came from, and where it's going.
>
> Then they're not really "players" yet. They're students. They're students
> who still have a lot more to learn. And they need to spend more time
> figuring out how to make musical lines from the notes in that scale, or
> start looking for some other note choice logic that they get better
> results from.
That's for sure. It's easy to overthink this stuff. .............joe
tonyde...@gmail.com
> 1. Any tips for improvising over 7b5 chords? I've got a book that
> recommends the diminished half step scale. I guess that works but
> it's a beast to get under my fingers. Also it would seem that the
> blues scale, with its b5, would work. But the times I've used that it
> seems a bit clunky.
>
> 2. How to approach the 7b5? It often seems to be a passing chord.
> In Girl from Ipanema, it fits between Gmin7 and Fmaj7. Should I stay
> within the F tonality? Or am I missing something?
>
> Thanks!
Also I think that anyone interested in bII/I should also take “note”
of the similar function concerning bVI/V. The “flat five” of Ab is D
(the root of the chord it is subbing for). Thus we have: Gb7b5 (or
just Gb7) for C7 and Ab7b5 (or just Ab7) for D7. These are two strong
and very user-friendly chord movements to take "note" of, particularly
if you are unfamiliar with them. I consider two classes of students;
beginner and advanced (intermediate is included with advanced in this
case) when juggling scale-to-chord associations is concerned for
improvisation.
The *player* needs no scale reference; he just *plays*. The
“beginner” (in my view) should understand chord function first, before
he/she goes to town on a scales-galore ride (again my view; others may
disagree). Because, as I have often observed, fellows who nix function
and only go delving into ‘scale city’ tend to always end up with a
headache. That’s like dressing up to go to church and they never can
find the church. But, they may hear the bells ringing. He/she may do
better to wait until intermediate-advanced stage (even if figuratively
so) to study all the scale associations to death. Then as Bird said,
“Forget all that shit and just play.”
We can bypass looking at the bII7(b5) as subbing for the V7 and
observe from a ‘cyclic’ viewpoint concerning the destination tone
(tonic in this case = F). For example see the obvious: Gb goes a major
third up to Bb. Bb then goes a perfect fifth up to F (track your steps
also for a reverse look). Two strong cycles emanating from the
Overtone series are the Cycle of 3 and the Cycle of 5. So, I have
presented a look-see from two of the strong cycles (bypassing C2 for
now for an additional perspective). No small wonder that Gb7(b5) moves
so nicely into Fmaj7. Bb is in the mix already (3rd of Gb). Bb is the
mother of F; C is the son of F.
The power of the cyclic route can be further experienced by, for
example splitting up or delaying the cadence to F as: Gb7 to Bb-7 to
Fmaj7. Just play it and let it marinate a few seconds. Since Bb is the
mommy of F, it has “harmonic right of passage” to maybe detour to Eb.
Try Gb7 to Eb-7 to Fmaj7, as well. Now we have resultants of ‘modal
interchange.’ Borrowing from Gbmaj we look at Bb-7 as mediant and Eb-7
as submediant. We take the entire lot and segue it into "FmajorLAnd".
If this interests you, you may want to understand the parallels
between cyclic movements of chords between the three Cycle Realms.
That is a cool study in itself.
-TD
Joey Goldstein
For further explorations, try any scale normally associated with Gb7 or C7.
Especially Gb mixolydian and C mix.
Messing around with the following might be fruitful as well:
Gb blues
C blues
F blues (the blues scale built on the tonic of the key)
Gb mix b2
Gb mix b6
Gb mix b2b6
Gb altered
C mix b2
C mix b6
C mixb2b6
C diminished half-whole (same pitch collection as Gb dim half-whole)
You also might want to try to play off of the other dim scale
relationships of C7 and Gb7, namely A7 and Eb7.
I.e. Try scales normally associated with A7 and/or Eb7 over Ipanema's Gb7.
You might also try playing off of each of these related dom7 chord's
min7 chords.
I.e. On Gb7:
play off of Dbm7 (or Dbm7b5) -Gb7, or just off of Dbm7 (or Dbm7b5).
or Em7(Em7b5)-A7, or just Em7(Em7b5).
or Gm7(Gm7b5)-C7, or just off of Gm7(Gm7b5).
or Bbm7(Bbm7b5)-Eb7, or just Bbm7(Bbm7b5)
tonyde...@gmail.com
> <tonydecap...@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:74de64fa-2773-40ea...@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> - Show quoted text -
"(minor seconds in this case, aka the
chromatic scale)"
Yes, cyclic relations may be formulated within, and of *any* scale(not
restricted to chromatic) and the minor 2nd interval occurs in many
synthetic scales, as well. In using the cycle of 2 (and 3, because
they both share the opportunity of juggling between major minor
intervals), the intervals vary concerning pertinent usage. The chord
qualities are decided upon, based on, this melange of intervals. I
have not included the Cycle of 3, because I am still trying to stay
close to the OP's initial concerns. For the student, I recommend
identfying the Cycle of 2 first off within *major scale harmony*,
particularly if he/she wants to compare with Cycle of 5 harmony to
start as a study.
Here is the parallel in chords: Cycle 5 ascending: I V II VI III VII
IV (can move retrograde, as well) compares to Cycle 2 ascending: I II
III IV V VI VII
The progressions that correspond to the above data: C5 = I III IV VI V
I , which parallels C2= I V VII IV II I
Attempting to address the bII7(b5) within it's function of moving
chromatically between ii-7 and Imaj7 from a choice amongst a potpourri
of altered scales, for example is OK, but by no means a be all and end
all concerning 'hip' improvisation. Much of the scale yield addresses
the 7b5 as a 'vagrant chord' and does not always convincingly cop the
biscuit in the cadential function from my perspective. I mean it will
work, but may it not necessarily encourage a very "happening," story-
telling phrase.
For the OP: There is more than meets the scale. Practice 1,001
related scales, but know that.
-TD
Dan Adler
I like Joe Pass' explanation better: "...and remember, you can always
play a half step below or above your target" :-)
tonyde...@gmail.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
Well, I have an extra ES-175 and amp here at my pad. Speaking of half-
steps, I am only a semi-tone of a move from where you are located. You
are invited to stop by, play together, and we can throw a few of those
ideas around.
-TD
Chickenhead
If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
but the question is "can he cook?"
<tonyde...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b28cbf6a-e0dd-4386...@m44g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
Dan Adler
<kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
> Hey, Dan:
>
> If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
> but the question is "can he cook?"
>
Sounds like a plan.
Hey, Chickenhead - what's up with that youtube video of you playing
wine and roses with a mask? You sure play nicely on that.
rpjazz...@gmail.com
lydian dominant.
Given that the OP was asking for tips and talking about the difficulty
of playing a dim scale, I think that's an appropriate response.
Obviously, there are many alternatives. Others have posted quite a
number of scale ideas. If the thread continues, there might eventually
be posts about hexatonics, 4 note groupings, pentatonics, upper
structure triads and more. And, every one of these ideas would be
something that some excellent player has used effectively. In
addition, if you transcribe, you'll soon find that great players often
play notes that don't fit into any of these devices.
In fact, if you play a strong melodic idea of just a few notes in a
strong rhythm, then play the same thing up or down a specific interval
(and again, up or down the same interval and keep going) you'll find
that it may sound good, at least briefly, over just about any chord
progression. It's the strength of the idea that matters. If it's good,
it will create "bitonality" and the ear will accept it.
So, the problem is that the complexity of the theory is, effectively,
infinite. Some people get further than others. Jimmy Bruno and Joe
Pass talk about just hearing the vanilla chord (like a G7) and playing
the extensions entirely by ear. Other musicians have mastered many
devices.
But, if you can't hear the sounds in your mind, it's all math, and
making it into music is elusive.
Another way to think about this, which can get a player pretty far
(but not all the way) is to realize that there are 4 or 5 notes in a
typical chord. Which means 7 or 8 left over. For dominant chords, you
have to be careful with the natural 7th (although if you transcribe,
you'll hear the greats using it). You have to be careful with the
11th, although it's quite usable. The b9, 9, and #9 are all usable
(although the b and # may not be so good with the natural 9). The #11
is certainly usable. The #5 has to be used cautiously because it's
connected to minor harmony. The 13th is usually a good choice. And
that's all of them. Obviously, all of this depends on context.
The point is, that if you know the sounds of those notes against the
chord and you've got enough facility to find them on the instrument on
the fly, you can play. You can make up melodies using a combination of
sounds, and that's jazz.
There are some sounds which have to do with which combination of notes
are included vs. left out. Transcription and theory can help with
those.
There are some sounds which are created by playing specific licks
against shifting harmony (although, personally, I don't usually find
that approach all that interesting) -- so simply knowing the sounds of
the notes isn't everything, but it's an excellent start.
The explanation above is probably flawed in some significant ways and
I'm confident that someone will point them out. But the fact is that
there are plenty of great players who didn't know beans about the
various scales, hexatonics, pentatonics, upper structures etc and
still played great. I doubt that there has ever been a great player
who couldn't hear the sounds in his/her mind and find them on the
guitar.
paul s
Well put, you make a lot of good points. Often players have better
results by finding just one approach (at a time) that they like and
exploring it thoroughly to the point that hearing and playing it are
second nature. Being aware of 20 possibilities without mastering any
of them can be overwhelming. Personally, I'm very interested in
checking out possibilities but it is easy to lose sight of the goal -
being able to play music in real time.
I agree with all the posters that mentioned chord tones .Hearing
those and knowing where they are on the fingerboard gives you a good
"safety net". Getting back to Gb lyd b7 (aka lyd dom) - in a sense,
every single note in the scale is a chord tone of Gb7 (#11) with
extensions. 1,9,3,#11,5,13,b7. Every note sounds good (no avoid
notes). It's still not "music", but maybe it gets you in the
ballpark.
tonyde...@gmail.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
Yea, that is a good scale covering the voicing you speak of, but also
as you said "music" is the factor of importance. When chords are
moving chromatically, they still fall under the 'jurisdiction" of a
certain scale or mode, but not as strongly adhered to as in less
ancillary situations. In chromatic harmony, there are contributing
factors and this has to do with the ear retaining where the chord is
traveling from and in anticipating where it will go to. In other
words, tones may be drawn from the chords on either side of the Lydian/
dom change even when that change is allotted an entire measure. There
is a craft involved (and yes, there are exceptions too, because when
time and rhythm are factors art prevails), sure, but it need be
addressed early on, because if it isn’t, the player suspends at risk
of remaining in “run the changes land” (ever constructing solos of
poor form).
-TD
Chickenhead
badass! ;-)
But, seriously,
Dan, you're one of my idols, man. Getting a compliment from someone of your
caliber is gonna' keep me going for months. Holy crap, thanks, Bruddah!
"Dan Adler" <d...@danadler.com> wrote in message
news:3b37194b-f319-4bde...@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 26, 7:39 pm, "Chickenhead"
> <kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
>> Hey, Dan:
>>
>> If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
>> but the question is "can he cook?"
>>
>
> Sounds like a plan
>
Chickenhead
badass! ;-)
But, seriously,
Dan, you're one of my idols, man. Getting a compliment from someone of your
caliber is gonna' keep me going for months. Holy crap, thanks, Bruddah!
"Dan Adler" <d...@danadler.com> wrote in message
news:3b37194b-f319-4bde...@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 26, 7:39 pm, "Chickenhead"
> <kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
>> Hey, Dan:
>>
>> If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
>> but the question is "can he cook?"
>>
>
> Sounds like a plan
>
pmfan57
Obviously you stole the idea from Bow Wow Wow's Do You Wanna Hold
Me. ;-)
tonyde...@gmail.com
> On Apr 29, 12:27 am, "Chickenhead"
>
>
>
>
>
> <NOSPkurAMTHAtshapNKYOU...@VERYhoMUCHtmail.SIRcom> wrote:
> > Hey, you should hear the one with GWB wearing the Chickenhead mask. He's a
> > badass! ;-)
>
> > But, seriously,
>
> > Dan, you're one of my idols, man. Getting a compliment from someone of your
> > caliber is gonna' keep me going for months. Holy crap, thanks, Bruddah!
>
> > "Dan Adler" <d...@danadler.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:3b37194b-f319-4bde...@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Apr 26, 7:39 pm, "Chickenhead"
> > > <kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
> > >> Hey, Dan:
>
> > >> If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
> > >> but the question is "can he cook?"
>
> > > Sounds like a plan
>
> > > Hey, Chickenhead - what's up with that youtube video of you playing
> > > wine and roses with a mask? You sure play nicely on that.
>
> > > -Dan
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Obviously you stole the idea from Bow Wow Wow's Do You Wanna Hold
> Me. ;-)
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
Oh man...You guys ain't serious...shit. I write all that stuff and you
toss it all into the toilet. Nothing is sacred. I'm going to join the
French Foreign Legion. Damn...
-TD
tonyde...@gmail.com
> On Apr 29, 4:09 pm, pmfan57 <jwrag...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 29, 12:27 am, "Chickenhead"
>
> > <NOSPkurAMTHAtshapNKYOU...@VERYhoMUCHtmail.SIRcom> wrote:
> > > Hey, you should hear the one with GWB wearing the Chickenhead mask. He's a
> > > badass! ;-)
>
> > > But, seriously,
>
> > > Dan, you're one of my idols, man. Getting a compliment from someone of your
> > > caliber is gonna' keep me going for months. Holy crap, thanks, Bruddah!
>
> > > "Dan Adler" <d...@danadler.com> wrote in message
>
> > >news:3b37194b-f319-4bde...@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > On Apr 26, 7:39 pm, "Chickenhead"
> > > > <kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
> > > >> Hey, Dan:
>
> > > >> If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
> > > >> but the question is "can he cook?"
>
> > > > Sounds like a plan
>
> > > > Hey, Chickenhead - what's up with that youtube video of you playing
> > > > wine and roses with a mask? You sure play nicely on that.
>
> > > > -Dan
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Obviously you stole the idea from Bow Wow Wow's Do You Wanna Hold
> > Me. ;-)
>
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Oh man...You guys ain't serious...shit. I write all that stuff and you
> toss it all into the toilet. Nothing is sacred. I'm going to join the
> French Foreign Legion. Damn...
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
Teasing, of course.
-TD
pmfan57
> On Apr 29, 8:36 pm, tonydecap...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 29, 4:09 pm, pmfan57 <jwrag...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Apr 29, 12:27 am, "Chickenhead"
>
> > > <NOSPkurAMTHAtshapNKYOU...@VERYhoMUCHtmail.SIRcom> wrote:
> > > > Hey, you should hear the one with GWB wearing the Chickenhead mask. He's a
> > > > badass! ;-)
>
> > > > But, seriously,
>
> > > > Dan, you're one of my idols, man. Getting a compliment from someone of your
> > > > caliber is gonna' keep me going for months. Holy crap, thanks, Bruddah!
>
> > > > "Dan Adler" <d...@danadler.com> wrote in message
>
> > > >news:3b37194b-f319-4bde...@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > > On Apr 26, 7:39 pm, "Chickenhead"
> > > > > <kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
> > > > >> Hey, Dan:
>
> > > > >> If you do it, give us report on the Scungili. We all know Tony can play,
> > > > >> but the question is "can he cook?"
>
> > > > > Sounds like a plan
>
> > > > > Hey, Chickenhead - what's up with that youtube video of you playing
> > > > > wine and roses with a mask? You sure play nicely on that.
>
> > > > > -Dan
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > Obviously you stole the idea from Bow Wow Wow's Do You Wanna Hold
> > > Me. ;-)
>
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Oh man...You guys ain't serious...shit. I write all that stuff and you
> > toss it all into the toilet. Nothing is sacred. I'm going to join the
> > French Foreign Legion. Damn...
>
> > -TD- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Teasing, of course.
>
> -TD- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
I was wondering if there still was a French Foreign Legion, or if they
have a jazz band.
Joe Finn
>Oh man...You guys ain't serious...shit. I write all that stuff and you
>toss it all into the toilet. Nothing is sacred. I'm going to join the
>French Foreign Legion. Damn...
When you find out how much the Foreign Legion gig pays let me know. I may be
joining you. 8-) .........joe
tonyde...@gmail.com
> <tonydecap...@gmail.com> wrote
Oh, I am certain that is too a labor of love. (Yikes!)
-T
Chickenhead
<tonyde...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a5baab5b-3ca1-4477...@e39g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
tonyde...@gmail.com
<kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
> Are the various guitars pictured the ones used for the recording?
>
>
> news:a5baab5b-3ca1-4477...@e39g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Apr 29, 4:09 pm, pmfan57 <jwrag...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>> Oh man...You guys ain't serious...shit. I write all that stuff and you
> > toss it all into the toilet. Nothing is sacred. I'm going to join the
> > French Foreign Legion. Damn...
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
I do realize that there must be a code some where within your
statement. I love codes, by the way.
-TD
Chickenhead
I posted the wrong freakin' message to the wrong freakin' thread. It was
supposed to go under the thread for Andy Most's new amp movie.
But a good conspiracy theorist could probably find something more
meaningful.
-TAFKAKS (The Artist Formerly Known as . . . )
<tonyde...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0fcc960f-525f-45fe...@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On May 1, 6:24 pm, "Chickenhead"
> <kuNOrtSPAMshapTHANK...@YOUhoVERYtmail.MUCHcom> wrote:
>> Are the various guitars pictured the ones used for the recording?
>>
>