Whatever Happened to Jazz Activism RANT!
Max Leggett
On 27 Jul 2003 13:28:42 -0700, sg...@hotmail.com (sgcim) wrote:
>I'm stuck here dog-sitting, and it's hot as hell, so I think I should
>get a little ranting in. The world is lucky I've chosen not to buy a
>PC, otherwise I'd probably never shut up.
> I've been gigging with a tenor sax player who was a disciple of
>Rhasaan Roland Kirk when he was younger, and back then, they didn't
>take things lying down like we do today.
> One day Kirk decided that there wasn't enough jazz on TV, so he
>called a meeting of his jazz coalition and they came up with a plan to
>get their message across.
> They managed to pick up 60 tickets to the Merv Griffin Show and
>during taping, they started blowing loud marching whistles until Merv
>ran off the stage, almost crying.
> The director pleaded with them to stop and Kirk got up and made his
>demands.
> He wanted jazz musicians (other than himself) scheduled on the show
>at least once a week.
> The director agreed and true to their word, jazz musicians appeared
>weekly from then on.
> Next, they hit the Dick Cavett Show.
> This time, they went on a tour of the ABC studios, and got some of
>their heavier members to make believe they were stuck in the doors so
>the guards couldn't get through.
> Then Kirk came marching in, playing his 3 horns-tenor, stritch and
>manzello at the same time in 3-part harmony and wouldn't stop until
>Cavett acknowledged his demands.
> To his credit, Cavett made a deal with them to have selected members
>of their coalition come on TV for a whole program to discuss the
>problem.
> Sure enough, the next week, Kirk and others (including Freddie
>Hubbard) came on and let people know what they wanted.
> During one memorable part, Freddie introduced himself as "the
>greatest jazz trumpeter in the world" (to a roar of applause from the
>crowd) in his usual modest way.
>As a result Cavett too had jazz musicians on every week, and not just
>Kirk.
> How is this relevant today?
> Things have gotten so bad today, that forgetting jazz, just live
>music itself is as close to becoming extinct as possible.
> I've been working with a band for the last 6 years that has had a
>steady gig during the summer playing at Rye Playland (in NY) for the
>last 23 years.
> Usually, there's another contrasting band (a pop or rock band) for
>the people that don't like the swing stuff we play.
> This week there was a DJ instead of the other band!
> In addition, recorded pop music is piped in with these weird green
>speakers that are screwed into the ground, while we are playing (we
>play outside, near the boardwalk)which they won't turn off!
> This is just one example of thousands.
> Today in Newsday, they had an article about expensive wedding
>receptions and when it came to the music, did they hire bands?
> No, just more expensive DJs!
> Sure, I got smart and got a music teaching day gig 8 or 9 years ago
>when the shit was hitting the fan, but are we just going to sit back
>and let them completely wipe out a profession?
> As the scientific theory says "everything falls equally in a vacuum"
>and so is every aspect of music making.
> Eventually, music teaching is going to go too, because who will want
>to offer classes on an art that has no outlet in society?
> Already many colleges are literally discontinuing their music
>departments.
> So you avoid that by trying to teach music in high school?
> Nice try, but New Jersey just had a secret meeting of their
>Education Dept. and voted 9 to 2 to eliminate the required music
>credit because kids are having a hard time graduating.
> As a result, most of the music teachers in NJ were sent packing.
> I could go over the plight of the recording industry, but that has
>been documented well enough here to bother with doing that.
> Many of you have day gigs that have nothing to do with music so you
>think, well too bad for those idiot musicians- they should have gotten
>a computer programming day gig like me and then they wouldn't have any
>problems.
> Wrong again. The sax player I mentioned was a programmer for the
>last 20 years, working for companies like Merrill Lynch etc... and now
>he's unemployed, as are many others in that profession because
>corporations want to save money by farming out programming to other
>countries like India, where labor is far cheaper.
> Of course this has nothing to do with music- or does it?
> The same principle is being applied here- saving money by screwing
>the employees.
> What can we do about all of this?
>Eventually, futurists predict the collapse of the money system- in
>flames.
> And they're not too sure what is going to replace it.
> What do we do until then?
> I don't know, but I sure wish someone would invent an electronic
>device that could short-circuit DJ equipment. That would be a helluva
>lot of fun!
Ken Lloyd
One of the more thought-provoking posts I've seen here.
Well, short of activism that borders on disruption, what we can do is
support live music, support live jazz, ask club owners to try a night of
jazz each week (then get some people out to attend). For some, working with
young people to show them the joy of listening and playing music in general
and jazz in particular would help. We have to walk the talk, all of us.
On the other hand, artists are not owed success by our society, whether
they're painters or pickers. You've got to generate some interest in your
craft, and if there is none, you have to be okay with doing something for
the pleasure of it, not for the economic or commercial potential it may
have.
Still, nice post. The message is clear. Get active.
Ken
"Max Leggett" <mleg...@nospam.ca> wrote in message
news:3f243b95...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
Pat Smith
Cavett and Griffin are long gone, there is hardly a place on TV for
Jazz. People are busy watching "reality" shows. I suspect Jazz will be
on par with classical music in popularity and so long as those that
believe that the arts should find it's own way and not be supported by
the government are in power it will be pot luck. Ultimately, I imagine
pro musicians will go the way of buffalo hunters, whalers, TV repairmen,
gas station attendants, etc.
Now, let's make some music, it's still good for the soul!
Max Leggett
>Now, let's make some music, it's still good for the soul!
I'm only in it for the babes and the bucks.
Clay Moore
>Things have gotten so bad today, that forgetting jazz, just live
> music itself is as close to becoming extinct as possible.
Hello,
It's early in the morning where I am on a Monday. I gigged last night,
then went to hear some friends at another club and to reschedule a gig
there. Today I'm headed in to teach at Music Tech, where my jazz combo
class is doing a recording session, and rehearsing to play a set
opening up for my band on Wednesday. Later this evening I'm playing my
regular Monday gig at Fireside Pizza. We have several folks come by
and sit in on a regular basis, including a student of mine who is 13.
It's hugely popular, almost always crowded. After that gig I'm headed
over to the Dakota to hear Roy Haynes and his band. If I have any
energy left over afterwards I might hit the jam session at Brilliant
Corners. I have Tuesday night off, but then I'm gigging every night or
day until Wednesday of next week. I haven't had a full day off since
July 4th.
I hear complaints of "no live music" constantly. Just the other night
this guy came up to me (on a gig) and complained about how he'd had to
quit music when disco came in. Disco arrived over 20 years ago, and
this guy's bored me with this story many times, every time when I was
on a gig. Ironic? I'd say so.
I agree, if there's no scene, etc. create one. Roland Kirk has been
dead a long time, and he obviously felt things could be improved in
his time. What's stopping anyone from doing that now?
Clay Moore
1648 Concord Street South
South St Paul, MN 55075
651-450-1144
651-214-8836 cell
cl...@claymoore.com
http://www.claymoore.com/
tony bass
"control" and direct the masses in a manner that would push our jazz agenda
to the whole WORLD, bwah-ha-ha-ha-haaaaaaa<evil maniacal laugh>. First off
we'll need $$$ I'm sure we could invite some prominent "jewish" jazz-loving
financiers into our club, then the politicos like Henry Kissenger, "W",
Cheney and Condi might come along too, i hear that Condi is a musician; }
Now for THE PLAN somehow we'll link WMD, cancer, aids and being unpatriotic
to DJ's and Britney Spears. Also once a year we'll meet, like in Aruba,
where we'll dress in long dark robes and burn in effigy a paper-mache Tommy
Mattola!!! Yes, yes it's becoming clear to me now we must control mankind
again through extended 7th chords and ii-V-I progressions, NOW WHO's WITH
ME?!!!
This message was brought to you by the jazzilluminati and does not reflect
the opinions of every day Americans, thanks.
MBR
> Yes, nice post and one I have much sympathy for. Sadly, TV shows like
> Cavett and Griffin are long gone, there is hardly a place on TV for
> Jazz. People are busy watching "reality" shows.
Jay Leno and David Letterman don't even pay lip service to jazz on
their shows, even though they both have band directors who know
better. You have to admire Branford for getting out of there to play
what he really wanted to play. The Griffin and Cavett shows are a
thing of the past. Now it's entirely about ratings and what's hot.
Holger Weber
"MBR" <jazz...@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:b04a13f9.03072...@posting.google.com...
The host of Germany's most popular late night show had the trumpet player
from the band bring along his Miles Davis record collection and they spent a
whole show playing Miles' records and talking about the music. He also payed
tribute to Miles by moderating a part of his show with his back turned to
the audience. It was hilarious.
Holger
Pat Smith
that plays and makes good $$. One can always make mo money mo money, but
I am pretty content with my situation. Of course I am not playing jazz
(my band plays Brazilian music) and I think most folks in the SF bay
area would agree that there aren't as many jazz gigs here as there used
to be. My point was more in the "when life gives you lemons, make
lemonade" school of thought.
I thought the point of this thread had more to do with TV, which is not
just a wasteland for jazz but for most everything.
kevin coffey
campaign. I knew a bit aobut it, but the details were even better.
My experience: lots of people like jazz, who didn't know they did,
when they finally hear it, especially kids who haven't had their ears
molded yet. They just have to get a chance to hear it.
Kevin Coffey
sg...@hotmail.com (sgcim) wrote in message news:<7318994a.03072...@posting.google.com>...
> Things have gotten so bad today, that forgetting jazz, just live
> music itself is as close to becoming extinct as possible.
Tim Berens
> I've been gigging with a tenor sax player who was a disciple of
>Rhasaan Roland Kirk when he was younger, and back then, they didn't
>take things lying down like we do today.
> One day Kirk decided that there wasn't enough jazz on TV, so he
>called a meeting of his jazz coalition and they came up with a plan to
>get their message across.
> They managed to pick up 60 tickets to the Merv Griffin Show and
>during taping, they started blowing loud marching whistles until Merv
>ran off the stage, almost crying.
Do you know of any proof that this actually happened?
Maybe I'm just too cynical, but unless there is substantial evidence
(press clippings, videot tape, police reports, etc.) I just don't
believe this Kirk/Griffin/Cavett story. It has the feel of an urban
legend.
Seems to me that people blowing whistles could be handled quite easily
by the local police department. And it's hard to imagine a national
TV show caving in and putting someone on the air because of a
disruption.
The rest of your rant was just that....probably felt good to type and
will bring some "Amens" from the chorus, but not particularly
rational, or even factually correct.
Tim
http://timberens.com
A Website for Guitarists
Learn something...Have some fun
tomw
I watched both of these events on television as they occured. The way
sgcim related it, is the way I perceived it. Amen! Furthermore, I've
seen these incidents alluded to from time to time. I'm sure you could
find documentation, if you're really interested.
--
Tom Walls
the guy at the Temple of Zeus
http://www.arts.cornell.edu/zeus/
Tim Berens
wrote:
>
>
>I watched both of these events on television as they occured. The way
>sgcim related it, is the way I perceived it. Amen! Furthermore, I've
>seen these incidents alluded to from time to time. I'm sure you could
>find documentation, if you're really interested.
>--
>Tom Walls
>the guy at the Temple of Zeus
>http://www.arts.cornell.edu/zeus/
Tom:
Thanks for letting me know.
Tom Lippincott
>
>It's early in the morning where I am on a Monday. I gigged last night,
>then went to hear some friends at another club and to reschedule a gig
>there. Today I'm headed in to teach at Music Tech, where my jazz combo
>class is doing a recording session, and rehearsing to play a set
>opening up for my band on Wednesday. Later this evening I'm playing my
>regular Monday gig at Fireside Pizza. We have several folks come by
>and sit in on a regular basis, including a student of mine who is 13.
>It's hugely popular, almost always crowded. After that gig I'm headed
>over to the Dakota to hear Roy Haynes and his band. If I have any
>energy left over afterwards I might hit the jam session at Brilliant
>Corners. I have Tuesday night off, but then I'm gigging every night or
>day until Wednesday of next week. I haven't had a full day off since
>July 4th.
>
>I hear complaints of "no live music" constantly. Just the other night
>this guy came up to me (on a gig) and complained about how he'd had to
>quit music when disco came in. Disco arrived over 20 years ago, and
>this guy's bored me with this story many times, every time when I was
>on a gig. Ironic? I'd say so.
>
>I agree, if there's no scene, etc. create one. Roland Kirk has been
>dead a long time, and he obviously felt things could be improved in
>his time. What's stopping anyone from doing that now?
>
>Clay Moore
Clay; you'd better be careful or legions of guitar players are going to start
moving to the twin cities to steal all your gigs! (heh)
Tom Lippincott
Guitarist, Composer, Teacher
audio samples, articles, CD's at:
http://www.tomlippincott.com
8 string guitar audio samples at:
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/3/tomlippincottmusic.htm
thomas
>
> I watched both of these events on television as they occured. The way
> sgcim related it, is the way I perceived it. Amen! Furthermore, I've
> seen these incidents alluded to from time to time. I'm sure you could
> find documentation, if you're really interested.
I remember how Sandra Bernhard and Bobby Deniro got their
start by kidnapping Jerry Lewis off his telethon. I watched
it happen right on my tv.
tomw
tomb...@jhu.edu says...
This is from Michael Fitzgerald's Kirk website --
http://www.eclipse.net/~fitzgera/rahsaan/rrkhome.htm
"Rahsaan was an activist in getting support for what he termed "Black
Classical Music." He participated in several takeovers of television
talk shows during which he would demand more exposure for black jazz
artists.
This is from a Rolling Stone bio:
http://www.rollingstone.com/artists/bio.asp?oid=7135
In the early '70s, Kirk became something of an activist; he led the Jazz
and People's Movement, a group devoted to opening up new opportunities
for jazz musicians. The group adopted the tactic of interrupting tapings
and broadcasts of television and radio programs in protest of the small
number of African-American musicians employed by the networks and
recording studios.
Here are some details from John Kruth, the author of "Bright Moments:
The Life and Legacy of Rahsaan Roland Kirk" , found here:
http://www.jerryjazzmusician.com/linernotes/kruth.html
Ed Sullivan and Kirk
JJM Tell me about Kirk's appearance on The Ed Sullivan show. This was
the very last Ed Sullivan show?
JK Yes, it was the last thing ever on Sullivan. After Rahsaan came out
and played, Sullivan comes out and says "Ramsam Roland Kirk". The
comedian, Godfrey Cambridge, comes running out and pulls an Afro wig
over Ed's head and says "we now make you an honorary Negro." It was a
wild scene.
JJM He was invited to play on the show because Rahsaan had put some
pressure on television stations through his organization called "The
Jazz and People's Movement."
JK Yes. They blew the whistle originally on Merv Griffin, interrupting
the taping of his show by sneaking in mouthpieces and parts of
instruments and some banners that they opened up underneath their coats.
There were about 25 people in the Jazz and People's Movement, and they
came in and blew the whistle on Griffin for having all that rinky-dink
music on his show. There was a time that the only jazz you were going to
see on television was either Louis Armstrong singing "Mame" or Ella
Fitzgerald, perhaps, singing "A Tisket a Tasket." Anything with any real
edge didn't have a shot. The Jazz and People's Movement was a vehicle
for exposing this.
JJM So, he was invited to play Stevie Wonder's "My Cherie Amour"…
JK Yes, it was a live TV show, and everything was worked out in advance,
and he had that version of "My Cherie Amour," and Sullivan thought
people would enjoy that. But, of course, Rahsaan being the radical that
he was, brought along Archie Shepp, Charles Mingus, Roy Haynes and a
couple other guys, and it really had the intensity of a "Black Panther
moment," where they seized the television network, and he takes his time
and he introduces everybody, and instead of three-and-a-half minutes
live, they went to seven minutes. It really has the feel that they have
taken over the TV network. They didn't play "My Cherie Amour," they
played Mingus' composition "Haitian Fight Song."
JJM I get the sense that the jazz world felt it was really
counterproductive.
JK Well, seeing it now in the "post-punk" years, and all the different
things that have happened since then, if you watch it now it's not so
absolutely outrageous as it probably was in the early 70's. It shook
everybody up to see on television - there was Mingus and there was
Shepp. What was Shepp doing on prime time TV? A full blown radical! It's
like seeing Eldridge Cleaver or Bobby Seale or John Lennon on the Mike
Douglas show. It really had an impact. In a way, you could criticize it,
and it drew a lot of criticism in Down Beat. If you go back and look at
the Down Beat reviews of Rahsaan albums like "Volunteered Slavery," you
will find that they weren't all five-star reviews. Neither did "A Love
Supreme" get a good review, for that matter.
And this is from me:
"Well, I suppose the whole thing was probably fabricated by the media in
collusion with the gov'mint. Yes, in fact, I'm sure it was."
I'm surprised that you dinks over 45 don't remember this shit.
Dave
I hope you are kidding.
I hope you know that you were watching a movie if you saw that on tv.
The movie is called The King of Comedy. Look it up on http://us.imdb.com
Dave
Bob R
kaa...@hotmail.com wrote on 7/30/03 3:52 PM:
In the style of Donald Rumsfeld:
Was Thomas trying to make a point about the veracity of Walls' perception?
You bet he was. Was he mistaken about said veracity? Without a doubt. Did
Walls respond in a later post with significant documentation? Absolutely.
Has Brown had anything else to say about it? Not as of this juncture. Thank
you. If there are any further questions, I'll ask them myself. Good day.
--
Bob Russell
http://www.bobrussellguitar.com
CD, "Watch This!", available at:
http://www.cdbaby.com/bobrussell
Clay Moore
> Clay; you'd better be careful or legions of guitar players are going to start
> moving to the twin cities to steal all your gigs! (heh)
Hi Tom,
It's already happening. A young guy moved here from Iowa just a few
weeks ago who plays pretty well, and a monster player from NY came for
a recon visit a month or so ago.
Also, in case anyone is skeptical, I've been on the phone all day
trying to find a bassist for a gig on a Thursday (tomorrow). Of the
guys I've called so far 9 can't do it, waiting for others to
call......
Rick Del Savio
Washington speech writer. Funny stuff. RD :)
Bob R wrote:
--
Jazz Guitarist/Educator
Check out lessons and original music @
http://www.rickdelsavio.com