Kurt's Ibanez Artcore AF75 experience.
Joey Goldstein
So Kurt, I know you had (still have?) one of these and that you didn't
like its tone.
I've seen your HC review and I've read most of your usenet posts about it.
I know you tried some SD Alnico II pups in it.
Did you try changing the bridge, perhaps to a 3rd party Tune-O-Matic
type? The tune-o-matic that comes with it looks and sounds sort of cheap.
What type of strings did you put on it?
Were you after something sort of Metheny-ish or some other sound?
It looks to me like the only difference between the AF75 and the AG75 is
the type of cutaway although I've seen some folks suggest that there is
a body depth difference as well. Does anybody out there know for sure?
I played an AK85 (spruce top, rosewood bridge, 3 pc mahogany + maple
neck) and an AF75 (maple top, tune-o-matic bridge, 1 pc mahogany neck)
today in a local store. The AF75 sounded a bit warmer, I'm assuming
because of the mahogany neck. And I tend to favour tune-o-matic bridges
on laminate top archtops anyways. But the workmanship on the AK85 seemed
better. Specifically the nut was cut better. Of course that could be
adjusted to my tastes.
It's a toss up right now for me between an Epi Joe Pass and one of these
(AF75 or AG75).
Anybody have any other suggestions for a budget 16" lower bout, 24.75"
scale, fully hollow archtop, preferably with mahogany neck?
I recently tried a used (1981) Aria Pro II EA 650 too. Supposed to be an
almost exact replica of an ES 175. Didn't like it, especially at
$1295.00 CND. But then I tried a few used ES 175s at the same store and
didn't like them either, especially at $3k CDN.
There's a nice D'Aquisto by Fender at a local store but I'd want to
change the pickups and it has these weird pickup retainer rings that
won't accept normal humbuckers.
I'm thinking that the AG75 (or AF75) might be worth the $600.00
(Canadian) gamble.
--
Joey Goldstein
http://www.joeygoldstein.com
joegold AT sympatico DOT ca
Kurt Shapiro
tune-o-matic it came with.
I put flatwound TI .014-.055's (George Benson) on it. The AF75 body was a
little thinner than that of my Samick HJ-650; I think the AF75 is 2-and 1/2
inches or 3 inches in body depth. It's not a full depth axe. I wasn't
after a Metheny-ish sound; his sound is a little bright for my tastes. I
wanted something closer to Grant Green or early Martino (Consciousness).
I haven't heard or tried the AG75 -- It might be better sounding than the
AF75. I think the body specs are different in ways other than just the
cutaway, but I'm not sure. If you can get a good sound out of an AG75, I
might be tempted to give one a whirl.
"Joey Goldstein" <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:4037FAB0...@nowhere.net...
Joey Goldstein
mark
Not sure if it's what you're looking for, but I'm close to putting up my
DeArmond X-145 on Ebay. If you're interested, I would sell it to you direct.
Let me know. It's a great, inexpensive guitar, but I just don't play it
enough and I need a new amp.
Joey Goldstein
Thanks but no thanks. I would never buy a guitar without playing it first.
VA3UX
more along the lines of the GB10 in terms of size: somewhat smaller than
the AF75 and I believe there is a small difference in the depth as well.
These Artcores all use the same pickup compliment : a ceramic at the
neck and Alnico at the bridge. A ceramic at the neck is likely to
produce a bright rather than dark sound and sure enough, that's how the
Artcores sound.
I've always spoken favorably of the Artcores but my favorable view is
based on bang for the buck, not in absolute terms. When I got interested
in jazz guitar back in the very late 70's, there was NOTHING on the
market that compared in terms of value. Then, a used ES-175 was around
$1500 in today's money but there was nothing in $300 - $500 range for
someone wanting a half decent playing, full hollow body guitar to get
started on (at least nothing that I could find at the time). Which is
why I bought an ES-175 back then. But I would have been thrilled if the
Artcore series had been available back as an alternative.
The Artcores are not a magic bullet; they're not "sleepers" that sound
and play like a Gibson L5 or Johnny Smith but at a fraction of the
price. But they are good value for the money.
In terms of price Joey, the AG-75 should be no more than about $470 -
$480 Canadian : that's what I've seen them priced at in Niagara area
(Burlington to St. Catharines). The AF-75 should be within $20 or so of
the AG-75. Lakeshore Music in Burlington sold an AG-75 for $459 a few
months ago and an AF-75 for $479 just before Christmas. That's typical
of what I've seen. There's no need to pay 600 bucks for one of these at
all. New ones on eBay are typically selling in the low 400's (Cdn).
Phil
Joey Goldstein
VA3UX wrote:
>
> The AG75 body is reasonably different from the AF75. The AG75 body is
> more along the lines of the GB10 in terms of size: somewhat smaller than
> the AF75 and I believe there is a small difference in the depth as well.
Hmmm. The AF75 I played seemed to be about the size I was looking for.
About the same as a Epi JP, a little thinner than a 175. I figure the
thinner bodies will be better for feedback rejection. I don't worry too
much about the acoustic sound of these types of guitars. Ibanez'
Japanese web site lists the width on both guitars as 70mm, or approx 2.75".
<http://www.ibanez.co.jp/japan/guitar/page_artcore/af75bs.html>
<http://www.ibanez.co.jp/japan/guitar/page_artcore/ag75bs.html>
Both the AK85 and the AF75 appeared to have 16" lower bouts.
All the AF, AG and AK series guitars *appear* to have the same body
shape.
<http://www.ibanez.co.jp/japan/frame_japan.html >
The only differences *appear* to be in the type of wood used used in a
couple of the models (AK85 has a spruce top, AG85 is bubunga all around).
So how is it that do you know that they are different?
> These Artcores all use the same pickup compliment : a ceramic at the
> neck and Alnico at the bridge. A ceramic at the neck is likely to
> produce a bright rather than dark sound and sure enough, that's how the
> Artcores sound.
I'll be changing the pickups so I try to ignore their sound as much as I
can when I'm trying the guitars out. The worst thing about the way these
guitars sound is that they are set up in the store with a .09" set of
strings on them.
> I've always spoken favorably of the Artcores but my favorable view is
> based on bang for the buck, not in absolute terms. When I got interested
> in jazz guitar back in the very late 70's, there was NOTHING on the
> market that compared in terms of value. Then, a used ES-175 was around
> $1500 in today's money but there was nothing in $300 - $500 range for
> someone wanting a half decent playing, full hollow body guitar to get
> started on (at least nothing that I could find at the time). Which is
> why I bought an ES-175 back then. But I would have been thrilled if the
> Artcore series had been available back as an alternative.
Well I'm after something quite close to the sound of an ES175 and I
refuse to pay the kind of money that even a used one from the 80s or 90s
will cost me. Even the better clones I've seen around have been too much
IMO.
So since you've owned both, how does the AF75 stack up compared to your
ES175?
Did you do any mods to the AF75?
> The Artcores are not a magic bullet; they're not "sleepers" that sound
> and play like a Gibson L5 or Johnny Smith but at a fraction of the
> price.
I don't expect it to sound like a 17" carved spruce top guitar. I hope
it will sound close to a 16" maple laminate top guitar like the 175. In
theory it shouldn't be that far off because the materials used (mahogany
neck, laminated maple top back and sides) and the dimensions (24.75"
scale, 16" lower bout) are so similar. I figure that with a good neck
pickup and a decent bridge (perhaps some new tuning pegs too) this
should sound very similar to a 175 which is really just a cheap guitar
IMO.
These guitars certainly look (finish, binding, etc.) very very good for
this price range. They played pretty good too. For me though it's all
about the sound.
My main problem with these guitars is that they all have a volute on the
back of the neck, and while I understand their structural purpose I
don't like the way they feel.
> But they are good value for the money.
Well that's the theory, yes. But if they just sound like shit they're of
no value at all *to me*.
> In terms of price Joey, the AG-75 should be no more than about $470 -
> $480 Canadian : that's what I've seen them priced at in Niagara area
> (Burlington to St. Catharines). The AF-75 should be within $20 or so of
> the AG-75. Lakeshore Music in Burlington sold an AG-75 for $459 a few
> months ago and an AF-75 for $479 just before Christmas. That's typical
> of what I've seen. There's no need to pay 600 bucks for one of these at
> all. New ones on eBay are typically selling in the low 400's (Cdn).
Hmm. The $600.00 ones I saw were at the 12th Fret and their prices are
usually pretty good. I'll have to look around a bit more.
KevinW
<nos...@nowhere.net> wrote:
>
>Well I'm after something quite close to the sound of an ES175 and I
>refuse to pay the kind of money that even a used one from the 80s or 90s
>will cost me. Even the better clones I've seen around have been too much
>IMO.
>So since you've owned both, how does the AF75 stack up compared to your
>ES175?
>Did you do any mods to the AF75?
>
>
>I don't expect it to sound like a 17" carved spruce top guitar. I hope
>it will sound close to a 16" maple laminate top guitar like the 175.
>
Joey, you might want to take a look at the Epi Zephyr Regent. Single
pickup 175 copy.
KevinW
Peter Grey
What do you want for your guitar and where are you located?
Thanks,
Peter
"mark" <Ih8Spam...@especiallyyours.net> wrote in message
news:XzXZb.41064$M8....@nwrdny02.gnilink.net...
Chrome!Hat
There was a posting for a DeArmond X-155 here a few days ago. It's 17"
though. In my mind, it's a much better guitar than a Joe Pass. It sounds
much better acoustically and the stock pups are far superior. It also has a
narrower neck - which I personally prefer.
"Joey Goldstein" <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:4037FAB0...@nowhere.net...
>
Wes
The AG75 has a smaller body size. And I agree with the last post
that $600 Canadian is to much for either the AG or AF75. I got an
AG75 for $450 from LA music in Port Credit (about an hour from
Toronto- Long and Mcquade had it for about 30 bucks cheaper but were
out of stock. I have seen these guitars for almost $600 and I think
it has to do with whether the store is an Ibanez dealer. The owner of
the guitar shop I work at tried to order it for me and it would have
been about $550 and that is with an employee discount! Maybe try LA
music- when I was there they had both models - and they were nice to
me - though I do have a friend who was terribly ripped off by them in
the past.
I like my AG75 - though I will replace the neck pickup and I think
it does need a fret level. The guitar didn't have any significant
buzzing with the crappy 9s that were on it when it was in the store
but now that I put 12s on - some parts of the neck don't play to
smooth. Overall I'm not to disapointed because of the price and I
think this problem is fixable. I should have asked them to put 12s on
for me before I bought it - mind you I've tried some of these guitars
with 12s on them at the 12th Fret in Toronto that played fine.
Good luck
I'd be curious to know what decision you finally make.
WEs
Joey Goldstein
I have. It's 25.75" scale and has a maple neck. It also has a mahogany
body which is different from most 175's. Different animal. It just looks
the same.
> KevinW
Joey Goldstein
"Chrome!Hat" wrote:
>
> Joey,
>
> There was a posting for a DeArmond X-155 here a few days ago. It's 17"
> though. In my mind, it's a much better guitar than a Joe Pass. It sounds
> much better acoustically and the stock pups are far superior. It also has a
> narrower neck - which I personally prefer.
I've had students with these too. Yes, they are nice guitars, but not
what I want.
I have a 17" plywood archtop now, a Samick HJ650. It's OK but it has the
longer scale maple neck and feedsback too soon.
I know the basic parameters of what I'm after and the X155 doesn't have them.
For the life of me I don't know why there aren't more budget makers
making ES175 copies since Gibson's prices got so out of touch with
reality. I know there were lawsuits a few years back for some of the
better clones but the patents that Gibson has can not possibly cover
every conceivable combination of:
• 16" lower bout
• maple laminate top, back and sides
• 2" to 3.5" width
• mahogany 24.75" scale neck
• humbucker in the neck position
The mentioned Artcore guitars appear to be filling this gap. In theory
they should sound very much like what I want. But we all know that there
is often a difference between theory and reality. <g>
Joey Goldstein
Joey Goldstein wrote:
>
> KevinW wrote:
> >
> > On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:25:28 -0500, Joey Goldstein
> > <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >Well I'm after something quite close to the sound of an ES175 and I
> > >refuse to pay the kind of money that even a used one from the 80s or 90s
> > >will cost me. Even the better clones I've seen around have been too much
> > >IMO.
> > >So since you've owned both, how does the AF75 stack up compared to your
> > >ES175?
> > >Did you do any mods to the AF75?
> > >
> >
> > >
> > >I don't expect it to sound like a 17" carved spruce top guitar. I hope
> > >it will sound close to a 16" maple laminate top guitar like the 175.
> > >
> >
> > Joey, you might want to take a look at the Epi Zephyr Regent. Single
> > pickup 175 copy.
>
> I have. It's 25.75" scale
Sorry, I meant 25.5" scale.
Joey Goldstein
Wes wrote:
>
> Joey,
>
> The AG75 has a smaller body size.
Smaller than what, the AF75? Or smaller than an ES-175?
(I know it's smaller than an ES-175 and I like that about it. I don't
think I'd want to go much smaller than the body size of the AK85 and
AF75 that I tried the other day though.)
Smaller what? Lower bout? Width? Headstock-to-tailpiece length?
> And I agree with the last post
> that $600 Canadian is to much for either the AG or AF75.
Yeah, I guess I'll look around. It's an even safer gamble at $450.00.
Steve's was carrying thes too. I don't know why The 12th Fret would have
them priced so high.
> I got an
> AG75 for $450 from LA music in Port Credit (about an hour from
> Toronto- Long and Mcquade had it for about 30 bucks cheaper but were
> out of stock. I have seen these guitars for almost $600 and I think
> it has to do with whether the store is an Ibanez dealer. The owner of
> the guitar shop I work at tried to order it for me and it would have
> been about $550 and that is with an employee discount! Maybe try LA
> music- when I was there they had both models - and they were nice to
> me - though I do have a friend who was terribly ripped off by them in
> the past.
> I like my AG75 - though I will replace the neck pickup and I think
> it does need a fret level. The guitar didn't have any significant
> buzzing with the crappy 9s that were on it when it was in the store
> but now that I put 12s on - some parts of the neck don't play to
> smooth.
Well that *is* something to worry about. Some of these cheap guitars
don't have truss rods that can handle heavier strings and this is of
course not visible when you buy it.
> Overall I'm not to disapointed because of the price and I
> think this problem is fixable. I should have asked them to put 12s on
> for me before I bought it - mind you I've tried some of these guitars
> with 12s on them at the 12th Fret in Toronto that played fine.
>
> Good luck
>
> I'd be curious to know what decision you finally make.
>
> WEs
--
VA3UX
>
> VA3UX wrote:
>
>>The AG75 body is reasonably different from the AF75. The AG75 body is
>>more along the lines of the GB10 in terms of size: somewhat smaller than
>>the AF75 and I believe there is a small difference in the depth as well.
>
>
> Hmmm. The AF75 I played seemed to be about the size I was looking for.
> About the same as a Epi JP, a little thinner than a 175. I figure the
Sorry about that. You're right : the AF75 is thinner than the AG75.
That's what I meant to say but I crossed my "F's" and "G's"
> So how is it that do you know that they are different?
>
If you're asking about the guitars it's because (i) I've played them
all, and (ii) I have the paper catalogue. If you are asking about the
pickups it's because they're specified in the paper catalogue in a table
in the back (ACH1 is ceramic; ACH2 is Alnico). Before I ever saw the
catalogue I figured the pickup nomenclature meant : "A"rtcore "C"eramic
"H"umbucker, "1" = wound for neck; "2" = wound for bridge. COnsidering
the prices of the guitars it makes sense that less expensive ceramic
pickups would be used in both positions. But the table in the catalogue
says otherwise. Could be a misprint too.
>>These Artcores all use the same pickup compliment : a ceramic at the
>>neck and Alnico at the bridge. A ceramic at the neck is likely to
>>produce a bright rather than dark sound and sure enough, that's how the
>>Artcores sound.
>
>
> I'll be changing the pickups so I try to ignore their sound as much as I
> can when I'm trying the guitars out. The worst thing about the way these
> guitars sound is that they are set up in the store with a .09" set of
> strings on them.
>
>
>>I've always spoken favorably of the Artcores but my favorable view is
>
> Well I'm after something quite close to the sound of an ES175 and I
> refuse to pay the kind of money that even a used one from the 80s or 90s
> will cost me. Even the better clones I've seen around have been too much
> IMO.
I'm with you on that. That's the reason I don't another 175 right now.
> So since you've owned both, how does the AF75 stack up compared to your
> ES175?
It's a long time since the 175 was here so my comparison is based on
memory. Bear in mind too that I have the AFS75T which is the thinnest of
the bunch - thinner than the AF75 and thinner than a 335; really quite a
different guitar all together. But comparing the AF75s I've played in
stores to how I remember the ES-175 I would say :
(i) the Artcore played as well as the Gibson (neck, feel, action etc).
Certainly the feel is personal thing, different neck profiles and all
that. But there was no "quality" issue with AF75; it didn't feel like
cheap or low-end.
(ii) The Gibson definitely had a warmer mellower sound than the AF75
both acoustically and electrically. Acoustically, they are probably
similar; electrically they are different. But, I can get mine to sound
fairly nice just by playing with amp settings.
(iii) Acoustically, I *think* the Gibson was louder, but not by a huge
amount.
(iv) Quality of fit and finish : there was no difference. If someone
wanted to get picky, the Artcore probably has an edge. My Artcore is
totally flawless; the Gibson probably had some very minor fit & finish
issues that didn't amount to hill 'o beans but were nevertheless
visible. From memory I *think* the finish on the ES-175 was probably a
tad thinner
Having owned both guitars(not simultaneously) and having played a more
recent ES-175 within minutes of playing an AF75 in the same store, I
would say the 175 left the *slight* impression of being a "better"
guitar, but the difference is not a big one. 500 bucks versus 3000
bucks and the very next question is : "where the hell's the money in the
Gibson ?" Both guitars side by side, ignore the name on the headstock
(which I now can do but couldn't at one time), fresh memory of having
just played both, and...there's no justification for paying 6 times more
for one over the other. I preferred the sound of the 175 over the
Artcore in terms of that classic warm sound, but I was thinking that I
could get a an AF75 to sound pretty close to a 175 by changing a pickup,
strings and playing with amp settings. I don't know that to be
perfectly true, but if you get close and save $2500, close will do just
fine (at least for me).
> Did you do any mods to the AF75?
>
No changes at all so far. I'm having fun with the "different" sound of
the guitar just as it is. However a Duncan '59 or Gibson Classic '57
will probably find it's way into the neck position as an experiment.
> I don't expect it to sound like a 17" carved spruce top guitar. I hope
> it will sound close to a 16" maple laminate top guitar like the 175. In
> theory it shouldn't be that far off because the materials used (mahogany
> neck, laminated maple top back and sides) and the dimensions (24.75"
> scale, 16" lower bout) are so similar. I figure that with a good neck
> pickup and a decent bridge (perhaps some new tuning pegs too) this
> should sound very similar to a 175 which is really just a cheap guitar
> IMO.
I too think the potential is there, for the very same reasons.
> These guitars certainly look (finish, binding, etc.) very very good for
> this price range. They played pretty good too. For me though it's all
> about the sound.
>
> My main problem with these guitars is that they all have a volute on the
> back of the neck, and while I understand their structural purpose I
> don't like the way they feel.
Oh, up near the transition to the head. Yea I know. I was quite aware of
it a first. Hadn't thought about it recently until you mentioned it here.
> Hmm. The $600.00 ones I saw were at the 12th Fret and their prices are
> usually pretty good. I'll have to look around a bit more.
That's Toronto pricing. Drive for 30 minutes outside the city and that
price won't look so good. 10 bucks in gas and a couple of hours of your
time could save you $100 to $150. 20 minutes down the Gardiner/QEW will
get you to LA Music in Port Credit; another 10 minutes gets you
Burlington. Regardless, the 12th Fret is an excellent store.
Good luck...Phil
Chrome!Hat
Rick
"Joey Goldstein" <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:40391853...@nowhere.net...
>
>
> "Chrome!Hat" wrote:
> >
> > Joey,
> >
> > There was a posting for a DeArmond X-155 here a few days ago. It's 17"
> > though. In my mind, it's a much better guitar than a Joe Pass. It sounds
> > much better acoustically and the stock pups are far superior. It also
has a
> > narrower neck - which I personally prefer.
>
> I've had students with these too. Yes, they are nice guitars, but not
> what I want.
> I have a 17" plywood archtop now, a Samick HJ650. It's OK but it has the
> longer scale maple neck and feedsback too soon.
> I know the basic parameters of what I'm after and the X155 doesn't have
them.
>
> For the life of me I don't know why there aren't more budget makers
> making ES175 copies since Gibson's prices got so out of touch with
> reality. I know there were lawsuits a few years back for some of the
> better clones but the patents that Gibson has can not possibly cover
> every conceivable combination of:
> . 16" lower bout
> . maple laminate top, back and sides
> . 2" to 3.5" width
> . mahogany 24.75" scale neck
> . humbucker in the neck position
mark
PA). If you're local, I'd be happy to let you try it out "old school" as
Joey says : )
(you try it...you like...you buy it)
The $325 is firm (I had originally wrote it as $350, but that's what I'd get
off ebay for it, which I'd rather not sell through ebay if possible).
If anyone's interested let me know. Shoot me an email:
mark...@VURIZUN.net (obviously, replace the ISP with verizon.net)!
Rbsoul
One of the other tonal characteristics that may be of interest to you about the
artcore guitars as compared to the US and European guitars is the finish that
is used on them. I have been told (and I don't know if it's true) by a very
fine guitar tech that the finish that is used on the asian made guitars
(although not on the high end Japanese guitars) is a very hard laquer that
doesn't allow the instruments to open up tonally. For the type of instrument
you're seeking that may not be an issue but I think this may be why these
guitars seem to sound so bright to most everyone who tries them, and especially
why they'll never really sound like a 175 (even tho it's plywood). But again I
stress it's only what I've been told by a legitimate source. I don't know how
much truth lies in it.
Ken Willinger
Hear my clips at:
http://www.soundclick.com/kenwillinger
See me play at:
http://homepage.mac.com/getken/iMovieTheater2.html
Joey Goldstein
--
Joey Goldstein
"Chrome!Hat" wrote:
>
> Out of curiosity, what is about the ES175 spec that you're after?
The sound of an ES-175.
Joey Goldstein
That could very well be true. I'm hoping the brightness I heard comes
from the cheap bridge but you could be right.
mark
Joey Goldstein wrote:
> "Chrome!Hat" wrote:
>>
>> Out of curiosity, what is about the ES175 spec that you're after?
>
> The sound of an ES-175.
>
Joey,
If you find that, for under $500, please let me know!
Joey Goldstein
Will do.
It shouldn't be impossible IMO. A 175 ain't all that. But then again, if
that's the sound I want I might have to get one of them and only one of
them will do. I know that with guitars what is is and what ain't ain't
but geez man, it's just a plywood guitar. It doesn't need to be made by
hand. It doesn't need to have great appointments. It certainly shouldn't
cost $4k or even $1500.00.
I still believe that if all the components, the same wood, the same
dimensions were to come together on a guitar, something like the
Artcores, that the sound would be very very close.
The Epi JP's are pretty close but the maple necks and spruce tops give
them a slightly different take on that sound. I'll probably wind up with
one of these instead but the Artcores seem promising.
Who was it that recently bought the Samick HF650? Was that you Kurt?
How's it working out? Except for the maple neck that one should be real
close too, assuming my theories on this have any truth at all to them.
otis
think they might be making the new ones in china or indonesia), I've always
liked mine better than any artcore I've ever tried.
"Joey Goldstein" <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:4038D7F1...@nowhere.net...
Steven Rosenberg
laminated, but that might get you closer both in quality and sound.
Joey Goldstein
otis wrote:
>
> FWIW I really recommend trying an AF120 (a korean version if possible, I
> think they might be making the new ones in china or indonesia), I've always
> liked mine better than any artcore I've ever tried.
I think they've been discontinued but if you have any info to the
contrary I'd like to know.
One of my students has one of those and yes, they're quite nice. Comes
with Super 58's too I think.
Joey Goldstein
Steven Rosenberg wrote:
>
> How about a used Heritage H-575? I know it's a solid top, not
> laminated, but that might get you closer both in quality and sound.
I'm sure it's a quality sound but it's not the sound I'm after. Thanks anyways.
> > It shouldn't be impossible IMO. A 175 ain't all that. But then again, if
> > that's the sound I want I might have to get one of them and only one of
> > them will do. I know that with guitars what is is and what ain't ain't
> > but geez man, it's just a plywood guitar. It doesn't need to be made by
> > hand. It doesn't need to have great appointments. It certainly shouldn't
> > cost $4k or even $1500.00.
> > I still believe that if all the components, the same wood, the same
> > dimensions were to come together on a guitar, something like the
> > Artcores, that the sound would be very very close.
--
Joey Goldstein
Joey Goldstein wrote:
>
> otis wrote:
> >
> > FWIW I really recommend trying an AF120 (a korean version if possible, I
> > think they might be making the new ones in china or indonesia), I've always
> > liked mine better than any artcore I've ever tried.
>
> I think they've been discontinued but if you have any info to the
> contrary I'd like to know.
> One of my students has one of those and yes, they're quite nice. Comes
> with Super 58's too I think.
It might be that they have been replaced by the AF195 which is a more
expensive ($1330.00 list) version of the AF75. It's got a Japanese made
neck and super 58s but the bodies are made in China. I dunno. still
seems like too much money for one of these.
It looks like there's a few places (8th Street Music for one) who are
still selling of some AF120s and they pop up on eBay every once in a
while, but I don't think I'd gu one without playing it first. The Epi
JPs seem to be just as good and are more readily available here. I might
even be renting one this week to check out.
Chrome!Hat
Turser ES175 type out there.
"Joey Goldstein" <nos...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:403A5C56...@nowhere.net...
Joey Goldstein
"Chrome!Hat" wrote:
>
> If it hasn't been mentionned in the 1001 replies. There's supposedly a Jay
> Turser ES175 type out there.
Looks to me like all they make are semi-acoustics with a center block.
ts duke
>
>
> "Chrome!Hat" wrote:
> >
> > If it hasn't been mentionned in the 1001 replies. There's supposedly a
Jay
> > Turser ES175 type out there.
>
> Looks to me like all they make are semi-acoustics with a center block.
Their es175 type guitar has a center block, but not along the whole lenght
of the body, like a es335, just a small piece of wood underneeth the bridge.
It also has a smaller body. I wasn't too impressed with the quality of the
one I played, but supposedly they are very hit and miss in QC department. It
was kind of a neat guitar, though.
William C.
"ts duke" <tsduke...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c1eck8$1hq4h2$1...@ID-98355.news.uni-berlin.de...
I tried one. QC wise, that particular unit was very nice (I have seen some
terrible Tursers, QC wise). The fret work was great. Sound.... I was
leery... to my ears, and it is a subjective thing, I wasn't up for taking a
chance that a pickup change would be a fix.... a disappointment, because it
felt and played great.
Chrome!Hat
Now I'm really curious whether refinishing a brighter sounding archtop (like
my x145) with a finish used on high end boxes would jazz up the sound to any
significant degree. Has anyone tried this? Likewise, could it change the
feedback equation in any way?
How much does it cost?
Rick
"Rbsoul" <rbs...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040222213446...@mb-m15.aol.com...
pataud
>
> Steven Rosenberg wrote:
>
>>How about a used Heritage H-575? I know it's a solid top, not
>>laminated, but that might get you closer both in quality and sound.
>
>
> I'm sure it's a quality sound but it's not the sound I'm after. Thanks anyways.
>
Heritage H-516 perhaps:
http://www.heritageguitar.com/models/H516.htm
...similar to a H-575, except with a laminate maple top, mahogany neck
etc. Seems very much like an ES-175, although I admit I've never played
one myself.
Joey Goldstein
That's the new one that just came out, eh?
Yes, that seems like a contender. But I've never seen a Heritage that
*I* would consider to be a budget guitar. Those guys are too proud of
their work to be selling inexpensive boxes, and rightly so. I just can't
really afford one.
I think I read a bad review on one of these too, probably at
Harmony-Central so it can't really be trusted as meaning anything, but
still. The guy mentioned quality control as being an issue with these models.
Max Leggett
That might have been a problem at one time, but Joe Glaser told me
recently that Heritage now have a Plek machine at the factrory, so
stuff should be coming out pretty flawlessly. US$2000 is pretty much
the entry point [I think], which, as you say, ain't inexpensive. Worth
it, but not cheap..
pataud
Whoops, you're right. They may be nice boxes, but definitely not budget
priced.
I think the 516 is based on the new Kenny Burrell model. A less fancy
version with a bridge pickup.