Joe Pass on his heroin addiction
SWOM GT
addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to survive his
addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz artists didn't.
Bg
He went to Synanon, and gave it up.
Bg
ScotGormley
It's not something that Joe wanted to talk about very much. Several
times in interviews he mentioned how he lost or wasted more than 10
years on junk and that it was a terrible myth that drugs helped
creativity. His stint in rehab actually helped him develop his solo
guitar playing--he makes a subtle reference to this in his GIT video.
pmfan57
According to, I think it was John Collins (one of Nat King Cole's
guitarists), Joe was about as amazing in the late forties, when he
must have been a teenager, as he was in the early 60's. So it's
pretty sad what a waste it was. But luckily for him and us, he did
overcome his problems and never looked back.
Joe Finn
news:18611f47-42aa-4d9c...@c29g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
It seems like a residential program like Synanon is never at a loss for
customers. For some it's a revolving door. For Joe Pass it was exactly what
he needed. Many recovering addicts find that it's depressing to contemplate
the years they can never have back. I have not seen much in terms of
interviews from JP on this topic, but that's understandable. ...joe
--
Visit me on the web www.JoeFinn.net
andy-uk
Art Pepper was talks about his experiences of Synanon in his book
"straight life"... i don't know anything about Joe though.
bird...@earthlink.net
Check this out -- fantastic radio show, with clips from Joe's "Sounds
From Synanon" record.
http://indianapublicmedia.org/nightlights/resolution-jazz-from-rehab/
drthoma...@gmail.com
>
> His stint in rehab actually helped him develop his solo
> guitar playing--he makes a subtle reference to this in his GIT video.
I think he might have been talking about his time in a Texas prison
where he did nothing but play guitar.
Tim McNamara
wrote:
> "Bg" <ott...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:18611f47-42aa-4d9c...@c29g2000yqd.googlegroups.com
> ... On Jan 18, 12:16 am, SWOM GT <jmali...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Are there any good interviews where Mr. Pass reflects on his heroin
> > addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to survive
> > his addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz artists didn't.
>
> >>>He went to Synanon, and gave it up. Bg
>
>
> It seems like a residential program like Synanon is never at a loss
> for customers. For some it's a revolving door. For Joe Pass it was
> exactly what he needed. Many recovering addicts find that it's
> depressing to contemplate the years they can never have back. I have
> not seen much in terms of interviews from JP on this topic, but
> that's understandable. ...joe
He's mentioned it in some interviews, basically saying that he turned up
on their doorstep with everything he owned at the time: the clothes he
was wearing and a sack of onions (a sack of onions?). He no longer
owned a guitar at that point. Joe, for whatever reason, was able to
make a go of Synanon and turn his life around. I don't know if he
stayed straight the rest of his life or relapsed, I've not heard
anything about it one way or the other.
I just finished _One Long Tune_, the biography of Lenny Breau, last
night. An excellent read and seemingly very well researched. The
author really manages to take the reader on a part of the roller coaster
that was Lenny's life. In the end, though, it seems that what he didn't
survive was his last marriage rather than being killed by drugs and/or
alcohol. And jeez, the stuff he did- got a brand-new custom made Tom
Holmes guitar given to him by the luthier- I think it's the one in the
"Tal Farlow" movie- and went and hocked it a couple days later for $50.
I don't know what the deal is with heroin and jazz.
--
"I wear the cheese, it does not wear me."
Joe Finn
news:timmcn-F720CC....@news-2.mpls.iphouse.net...
> In article <hj217f$mb0$1...@news.datemas.de>, "Joe Finn" <J...@JoeFinn.net>
> wrote:
>
>> "Bg" <ott...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:18611f47-42aa-4d9c...@c29g2000yqd.googlegroups.com
>> ... On Jan 18, 12:16 am, SWOM GT <jmali...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Are there any good interviews where Mr. Pass reflects on his heroin
>> > addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to survive
>> > his addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz artists didn't.
>>
>> >>>He went to Synanon, and gave it up. Bg
>>
>>
>> It seems like a residential program like Synanon is never at a loss
>> for customers. For some it's a revolving door. For Joe Pass it was
>> exactly what he needed. Many recovering addicts find that it's
>> depressing to contemplate the years they can never have back. I have
>> not seen much in terms of interviews from JP on this topic, but
>> that's understandable. ...joe
>
> He's mentioned it in some interviews, basically saying that he turned up
> on their doorstep with everything he owned at the time: the clothes he
> was wearing and a sack of onions (a sack of onions?). He no longer
> owned a guitar at that point. Joe, for whatever reason, was able to
> make a go of Synanon and turn his life around. I don't know if he
> stayed straight the rest of his life or relapsed, I've not heard
> anything about it one way or the other.
I recall the "bag of onions" remark. He must have gone through hell to have
sunk to such a depth. His ability to reclaim his life and his career is an
inspiration ...joe
dwabeslim
Joe used to play up here during the 50's[he also worked Las Vegas and
New Orleans where he shared a pad with writer and famous junkie
William S Burroughs.
He had several close friends among the musicians here and there are
lots of stories about his dope days and various stunts he pulled while
in town.
It's great that Synanon worked for him as he was there in the years
before it turned into a cult.
Greg
Graham
he said he played in 'strip joints' during his lowest period - that
must have distracted the customers a bit!).
However I've read 3 biographies of jazz musicians with the same
problem.
Art Pepper - Straight Life: a gruelling read, but at least has a
reasonably upbeat ending - he was turned around by Synanon, happily
married and had a resurgence in his career.
Hampton Hawes - Raise Up Off Me: lightened by the fact that he was
able to view all his experiences with an amazing sense of humour.
Well worth reading. You feel that he retained his humanity a lot
better than most in this situation.
Chet Baker - Deep in a Dream: Utterly depressing. Seems that Chet
was a total maniac about drugs and had no redeeming features
whatsoever (apart from his music of course - and I am a Chet Baker
fan!).
As an example, one year before his death he had to do a tour of Japan
on prescription methadone only (the drug laws in Japan were too strict
even for Chet to take chances). He played brilliantly, threw no
tantrums, was calm the whole time, was nice to everybody in the band,
seemed to enjoy himself, etc. When the tour ended, somebody in the
band said to him 'Don't you think life is better this way?' Chet just
said 'No, I can't wait to get back to Europe and get totally f**cked
up, man!'
The one good thing about this book is that after reading it, no matter
how bad your life is, you will probably feel that it is a hell of a
lot better than Chet's!
Graham
Keith Freeman
> problem.
read.
-Keith
Clips, Portable Changes, tips etc.: www.keithfreemantrio.nl
e-mail: info AT keithfreemantrio DOT nl
Joe Finn
"Graham" <grah...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:8279d43c-70e5-4077...@22g2000yqr.googlegroups.com...
The heroin epidemic among jazz players in those days was a real tragedy.
This goes back to the Charlie Parker generation and beyond. Bird's musical
genius together with his storied reputation as a dope fiend set him up as a
role model that personified this strange duality. Everybody wanted to play
like him and it seems like a lot of players also wanted to emulate his drug
lifestyle.
At the same time there is a sense in which jazz should be viewed as a
cultural expression of an oppressed class. Social pathologies seem to go
hand in hand with the oppression, segregation, discrimination, etc. that was
commonplace in the world Bird grew up in. As integration took hold the
heroin problem in jazz seemed to ease at least a little. Now that jazz has
moved into the academic setting things have really changed. Most jazz
players are teaching now and this tends to impose what I will call a certain
stability. Heroin use among today's players is rare as a result.
......joe
Keith Freeman
> hand in hand with the oppression, segregation, discrimination, etc.
> that was commonplace in the world Bird grew up in. As integration took
> hold the heroin problem in jazz seemed to ease at least a little.
A major factor that should not be overlooked is the need - owing to the
ridiculously late opening hours of jazz clubs - to be able to stay awake
all night and perform and still do recording sessions in the daytime. Stan
Tracey, the father of British jazz piano, was very honest about this in a
documentary on his life.
Chickenhead
day to practice and three square meals sounds like a vacation to me. Throw
in cigarettes and coffee, and I'm just about ready to sign up!
"tomb...@jhu.edu" <drthoma...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:43e5edbd-bfe6-4907...@g25g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
Joe Finn
news:Xns9D05A71D2C7CBk...@212.54.40.12...
>> Social pathologies seem to go
>> hand in hand with the oppression, segregation, discrimination, etc.
>> that was commonplace in the world Bird grew up in. As integration took
>> hold the heroin problem in jazz seemed to ease at least a little.
>
> A major factor that should not be overlooked is the need - owing to the
> ridiculously late opening hours of jazz clubs - to be able to stay awake
> all night and perform and still do recording sessions in the daytime. Stan
> Tracey, the father of British jazz piano, was very honest about this in a
> documentary on his life.
Good point. That kind of scheduling has to be awfully tough. I've spoken to
some older guys that were around in those days. ....joe
drthoma...@gmail.com
> > Social pathologies seem to go
> > hand in hand with the oppression, segregation, discrimination, etc.
> > that was commonplace in the world Bird grew up in. As integration took
> > hold the heroin problem in jazz seemed to ease at least a little.
I don't think the timeline fits this hypothesis. Heroin is a feature
of bebop and later -- the early classic civil rights era. It wasn't an
issue for the first few decades of jazz.
> A major factor that should not be overlooked is the need - owing to the
> ridiculously late opening hours of jazz clubs - to be able to stay awake
> all night and perform and still do recording sessions in the daytime. Stan
> Tracey, the father of British jazz piano, was very honest about this in a
> documentary on his life.
Then why are downers -- alcohol, heroin-- the most common jazz drugs,
instead of uppers?
Tim McNamara
wrote:
> "Tim McNamara" <tim...@bitstream.net> wrote in message
> news:timmcn-F720CC....@news-2.mpls.iphouse.net...
> > In article <hj217f$mb0$1...@news.datemas.de>, "Joe Finn"
> > <J...@JoeFinn.net> wrote:
> >
> >> "Bg" <ott...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >> news:18611f47-42aa-4d9c...@c29g2000yqd.googlegroups.
> >> com ... On Jan 18, 12:16 am, SWOM GT <jmali...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > Are there any good interviews where Mr. Pass reflects on his
> >> > heroin addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to
> >> > survive his addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz
> >> > artists didn't.
> >>
> >> >>>He went to Synanon, and gave it up. Bg
> >>
> >>
> >> It seems like a residential program like Synanon is never at a
> >> loss for customers. For some it's a revolving door. For Joe Pass
> >> it was exactly what he needed. Many recovering addicts find that
> >> it's depressing to contemplate the years they can never have back.
> >> I have not seen much in terms of interviews from JP on this topic,
> >> but that's understandable. ...joe
> >
> > He's mentioned it in some interviews, basically saying that he
> > turned up on their doorstep with everything he owned at the time:
> > the clothes he was wearing and a sack of onions (a sack of
> > onions?). He no longer owned a guitar at that point. Joe, for
> > whatever reason, was able to make a go of Synanon and turn his life
> > around. I don't know if he stayed straight the rest of his life or
> > relapsed, I've not heard anything about it one way or the other.
>
>
> I recall the "bag of onions" remark. He must have gone through hell
> to have sunk to such a depth. His ability to reclaim his life and his
> career is an inspiration ...joe
It really is, even over and above his astonishing musical skills. A
remarkable life.
Mark Cleary
That is no excuse to use drugs that will ruin your life. Many people
have difficult jobs and terrible hours that make life difficult, jazz
musician's have no claim on that end.
The one thing that I seem to pick up about Joe Pass was he did turn
around his life and he was a very humble person. He was a great player
but also a personality that was not centered on "himself". That to me
might be the difference. To admit to the problem and deal with it is
part of the "12 step process" that says there is a higher power than me
at work. Some just never seem to get past this point and why I do not
know.
Joe was a great player and he was aware of that for sure, but never did
let his ego get in the way. He seem to enjoy explaining to players how
he approached the guitar, and that he simply like to play melodies. He
went out of his way to give back to the guitar community what he knew.
He did not do this for money, fame, or personal gain, the hallmark of
someone capable of beating the struggle of addictions. Joe just like to
play the guitar and hear melodies he had in his head.
Thanks Joe!
--
Deacon Mark Cleary
Epiphany Roman Catholic Church
Joe Finn
"tomb...@jhu.edu" <drthoma...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0cde24af-e17e-4846...@b2g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 19, 9:25 am, Keith Freeman <x...@x.net> wrote:
> > Social pathologies seem to go
> > hand in hand with the oppression, segregation, discrimination, etc.
> > that was commonplace in the world Bird grew up in. As integration took
> > hold the heroin problem in jazz seemed to ease at least a little.
>>I don't think the timeline fits this hypothesis. Heroin is a feature
>>of bebop and later -- the early classic civil rights era. It wasn't an
>>issue for the first few decades of jazz.
Hello Thomas: I see that you are [perhaps] inadvertently quoting my remarks.
I welcome your input. You are correct that heroin kicked in during the post
war era. It was pretty much unknown during the early years of the jazz
style. What I was trying to articulate was that Bird grew up as part of the
oppressed class and that addiction and other problems were endemic. When
Parker came of age heroin was one of the available options in nyc. Of
course, in his particular case, he is reputed to have binged/splurged on a
wide array of substances. ..............joe
Joe Finn
"Mark Cleary" <mcle...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:hj5k3v$rdi$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
The humility that you mention makes the case of Joe Pass that much more of
an inspiration. His personal history stands as a monument to the triumph of
the human spirit. I am of the opinion that he saw *music* as "the higher
power". I think this is why we continue to remember him like we do. ...joe
p.s. The "Social pathologies" remarks were mine. Let's not blame that
nonsense on maestro Freeman!! 8-)
cl...@claymoore.com
wrote:
Hi Tom, Scot, and everyone else,
I thought I'd drop by, saw this thread, and, well - here goes.
I've mentioned many times here my good friend and mentor drummer A.D.
Mannion, who played with Joe in NY when they were young, and later in
California when they were in Synanon together. This is the two of them
+ Gary Peacock and an unidentified pianist on a West Coast TV show
called Frankly Jazz. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5KJhX2uDoM&NR=1.
A.D. was an amazing guy with many talents but very humble and not
given to exaggeration or name dropping though he played with many of
the top musicians of the day. But one day he revealed to me, only half
joking, that the Virtuoso recording was his idea. He told me that
during their days at Synanon Joe would sit around playing solo guitar
for hours, and he suggested to Joe that he record an album of this
material, to which Joe supposedly replied "nah, who'd wanna listen to
this stuff?"
I also recall reading an article, perhaps in Down Beat or Guitar
Player, where they mentioned Joe getting back into heroin for a while
later in his career - 70's or 80's perhaps. This is not too surprising
really since a lot of people relapse back into whatever addiction they
have.
Good to see you guys still carrying the torch.
Clay Moore
Dan Adler
> On Jan 18, 3:55 pm, "tombr...@jhu.edu" <drthomasfbr...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On Jan 18, 4:07 am, ScotGormley <scot.gorm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > His stint in rehab actually helped him develop his solo
> > > guitar playing--he makes a subtle reference to this in his GIT video.
>
> > I think he might have been talking about his time in a Texas prison
> > where he did nothing but play guitar.
>
> Hi Tom, Scot, and everyone else,
>
> I thought I'd drop by, saw this thread, and, well - here goes.
>
> I've mentioned many times here my good friend and mentor drummer A.D.
> Mannion, who played with Joe in NY when they were young, and later in
> California when they were in Synanon together. This is the two of them
> + Gary Peacock and an unidentified pianist on a West Coast TV show
> A.D. was an amazing guy with many talents but very humble and not
> given to exaggeration or name dropping though he played with many of
> the top musicians of the day. But one day he revealed to me, only half
> joking, that the Virtuoso recording was his idea. He told me that
> during their days at Synanon Joe would sit around playing solo guitar
> for hours, and he suggested to Joe that he record an album of this
> material, to which Joe supposedly replied "nah, who'd wanna listen to
> this stuff?"
>
> I also recall reading an article, perhaps in Down Beat or Guitar
> Player, where they mentioned Joe getting back into heroin for a while
> later in his career - 70's or 80's perhaps. This is not too surprising
> really since a lot of people relapse back into whatever addiction they
> have.
>
> Good to see you guys still carrying the torch.
>
> Clay Moore
Hi Clay,
Great to see you here! I hope you're back to hang out a while!
What is amazing on the Synanon record is that ALL the players were so
great.
There is not a single solo by anyone on that album that is not a
melodic and harmonic masterpiece, the compositions are all beautiful
and sophisticated, and the arrangements are tight and executed
perfectly - and the sound and feel are consistent throughout the
album. Certainly does not sound like a bunch of rehabs amusing
themselves in their spare time. It's one of my favorite records of all
time.
I still can't play the intro to C.E.D. perfectly. Can anyone here? In
the Wolf Marshall book he fingers it in the E bar chord form at the
8th fret, but to me it sounds more reasonable to play in G form (pinky
on 8th and first finger bar on 5th). Wolf does a good job of playing
it the way he notated it, but I can't get it to sound right in that
position. The changes and form on that song are a pretty interesting
mix of modal and standard cycle progressions and Joe's intro, improv
behind the head, solo and outro are just out of this world.
Keith Freeman
> instead of uppers?
his usual upper.
Anita O'Day was an alcoholic when she met John Poole. She noticed he was
not drinking and asked him what the secret was. It was heroin. She tried
it, found it worked as an antidepressant and got hooked.
tom walls
>
> Anita O'Day was an alcoholic when she met John Poole. She noticed he was
> not drinking and asked him what the secret was. It was heroin. She tried
> it, found it worked as an antidepressant and got hooked.
>
> -Keith
>
Tangentially speaking, I recently watched the dvd "Anita O'Day - The
Life Of A Jazz Singer" and achieved the impossible -- I love her even
more! There is an interview with Bryant Gumbel(lightweight), where he
continually presses the substance abuse angle in the most judgmental
way, and she says "That's just the way IT WENT DOWN, BRYANT!" and gave
him a withering glare.
335
wrote:
I've heard one story attributed to Dexter Gordon, perhaps apocryphal,
that heroin enabled him to tune out everything else and achieve
perfect concentration on the music.
Joe Finn
news:23d98709-1c3d-4403...@14g2000yqp.googlegroups.com...
>>Clay Moore
Clay: Thank you for your input. I hope you are doing well and will check in
here more often. Bestly, ....joe
Gerry
Tangent off the tangent. Our mysterious local participant Maj6 played
with Anita O'Day...
--
Dogmatism kills jazz. Iconoclasm kills rock. Rock dulls scissors.
Joe Montgomery
> I also recall reading an article, perhaps in Down Beat or Guitar
> Player, where they mentioned Joe getting back into heroin for a while
> later in his career - 70's or 80's perhaps. This is not too surprising
> really since a lot of people relapse back into whatever addiction they
> have.
My guess is that Heroin (using it, kicking it, and ultimately treating
the ramifications of having both used and kicked it) were never too
far from Joe's essence or conscience or core or whatever word you want
to use. The "wasted years" made him determined to use the rest of his
time determined and devoted to good lines and melodies, playing what
he heard in his musical heart and making music with his very close
inner circle of friends.
The ultimate irony to me is that toward the end of his life, heroin
once again played a pivotal role, in that his cancer of the liver was
most likely a tragic by-product of the addiction he so successfully
kicked.
So sorry I did not discover him and his music in earnest until about a
year after he died, especially since I was living in LA during the
Donte's Days. THAT would have been something.
So glad youtube, etc., has made Joe Pass accessible to those who are
seeking.
Joe (pass) Montgomery (wes)
cl...@claymoore.com
> <c...@claymoore.com> wrote in message
>
> news:23d98709-1c3d-4403...@14g2000yqp.googlegroups.com...
> On Jan 18, 3:55 pm, "tombr...@jhu.edu" <drthomasfbr...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jan 18, 4:07 am, ScotGormley <scot.gorm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > His stint in rehab actually helped him develop his solo
> > > guitar playing--he makes a subtle reference to this in his GIT video.
>
> > I think he might have been talking about his time in a Texas prison
> > where he did nothing but play guitar.
> >>Hi Tom, Scot, and everyone else,
> >>I thought I'd drop by, saw this thread, and, well - here goes.
> >>I've mentioned many times here my good friend and mentor drummer A.D.
> >>Mannion, who played with Joe in NY when they were young, and later in
> >>California when they were in Synanon together. This is the two of them
> >>+ Gary Peacock and an unidentified pianist on a West Coast TV show
> >>A.D. was an amazing guy with many talents but very humble and not
> >>given to exaggeration or name dropping though he played with many of
> >>the top musicians of the day. But one day he revealed to me, only half
> >>joking, that the Virtuoso recording was his idea. He told me that
> >>during their days at Synanon Joe would sit around playing solo guitar
> >>for hours, and he suggested to Joe that he record an album of this
> >>material, to which Joe supposedly replied "nah, who'd wanna listen to
> >>this stuff?"
> >>I also recall reading an article, perhaps in Down Beat or Guitar
> >>Player, where they mentioned Joe getting back into heroin for a while
> >>later in his career - 70's or 80's perhaps. This is not too surprising
> >>really since a lot of people relapse back into whatever addiction they
> >>have.
> >>Good to see you guys still carrying the torch.
> >>Clay Moore
>
> Clay: Thank you for your input. I hope you are doing well and will check in
> here more often. Bestly, ....joe
Thanks for the sentiments, Joe, but at present it's all I can do to
keep up with the things I'm paid to do and my duties as a dad,
husband, and homeowner. I woke up last night and couldn't sleep, so
that's why I dropped in. Good wishes and happy new year to everyone.
Clay
cl...@claymoore.com
HI Joe,
Yeah, it is ironic, because A.D. died of liver cancer as well.
Clay
tom walls
> HI Joe,
>
> Yeah, it is ironic, because A.D. died of liver cancer as well.
>
> Clay
Liver problems amongst substance abusers is not so much ironic as it
is predictable.
Gerry
> ...it's all I can do to keep up with the things I'm paid to do and my
> duties as a dad,
> husband, and homeowner. I woke up last night and couldn't sleep, so
> that's why I dropped in. Good wishes and happy new year to everyone.
Your voice is missed here.
Larry Grinnell
Joe Pass. One of the stories recounted by an old friend was that Joe
did briefly return to heroin after his diagnosis with liver cancer,
taking the attitude, "why not?" The article went on to say that some
friends exercised some tough love and encouraged him, successfully, to
kick it again. In the end, I think it was his love of Ellen that gave
him the will to quit--I can only presume he didn't want to disappoint
her.
Larry Grinnell
In article
<23d98709-1c3d-4403...@14g2000yqp.googlegroups.com>,
Tim McNamara
<89d80d15-dfbc-475c...@36g2000yqu.googlegroups.com>,
Joe Montgomery <mejoemo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jan 20, 1:50�am, "c...@claymoore.com" <c...@claymoore.com> wrote:
>
> > I also recall reading an article, perhaps in Down Beat or Guitar
> > Player, where they mentioned Joe getting back into heroin for a
> > while later in his career - 70's or 80's perhaps. This is not too
> > surprising really since a lot of people relapse back into whatever
> > addiction they have.
At least among alcoholics, the standard estimate from AA is that about
50% will relapse at least once (the link below indicates 54%). I don't
know what the stats are for other substances but I would imagine are
very similar if not somewhat higher.
Here's some information about relapse that seems to have decent face
validity:
http://www.relapse-prevention.org/user-news.htm?id=163
Don Francks talks about drugs in the "Genius of Lenny Breau" documentary
and opines that people who have not been in the situation of feeling
unable to get from one second to the next don't really understand why
someone would do something so obviously self-destructive as take heroin.
I think the reasons people start are very individual and whether one
becomes addicted involves a lot of factors.
> My guess is that Heroin (using it, kicking it, and ultimately
> treating the ramifications of having both used and kicked it) were
> never too far from Joe's essence or conscience or core or whatever
> word you want to use. The "wasted years" made him determined to use
> the rest of his time determined and devoted to good lines and
> melodies, playing what he heard in his musical heart and making music
> with his very close inner circle of friends.
>
> The ultimate irony to me is that toward the end of his life, heroin
> once again played a pivotal role, in that his cancer of the liver was
> most likely a tragic by-product of the addiction he so successfully
> kicked.
Well, if he had contracted hepatitis- particularly hepatitis C- that is
a possibility as a contributor. And the risk of contracting hepatitis
is very high as an IV drug user.
> So sorry I did not discover him and his music in earnest until about
> a year after he died, especially since I was living in LA during the
> Donte's Days. THAT would have been something.
>
> So glad youtube, etc., has made Joe Pass accessible to those who are
> seeking.
YouTube may be one of the greatest resources for the promulgation of
jazz in decades. Maybe ever. There is an astonishing amount of very
fine jazz to be found there (and not a little crapola, too).
Des Higgins
Gerry wrote:
> On 2010-01-20 10:02:20 -0800, "cl...@claymoore.com" <cl...@claymoore.com> said:
>
> > ...it's all I can do to keep up with the things I'm paid to do and my
> > duties as a dad,
> > husband, and homeowner. I woke up last night and couldn't sleep, so
> > that's why I dropped in. Good wishes and happy new year to everyone.
>
> Your voice is missed here.
> --
I agree; best of luck Clay!!
johnbla...@gmail.com
> Are there any good interviews where Mr. Pass reflects on his heroin
> addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to survive his
> addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz artists didn't.
Heroine takes away pain. For someone who does nothing but make bar chords for 6-8 hours a day, heroine may allow that person to continue working as a musician, whereas any other solution would be to stop playing-- which may not be an option. Heroine is typically a drug taken in isolation, rather than a party drug. It allows abstract thinking away from physical pain, even in circumstances of extreme depravation or poverty.
While I do not argue for the use of drugs, if one needed to meet Parker or Davis, junk would be one way to get their attention and keep it long enough to get the important musical questions answered.
How many would give up cigarette smoking in order to keep playing music!?! Very few.
Finally, I know of no Texas prison that allows guitar playing of any type, as the strings can be used as weapons. I believe this is an urban myth, and the suggestion that Joe played in Synanon sounds more likely than in prison. However, pen and paper are allowed in prison, and he could have thought and written music away from an instrument while inside.
Tim McNamara
> On Monday, January 18, 2010 at 2:16:17 AM UTC-6, SWOM GT wrote:
>> Are there any good interviews where Mr. Pass reflects on his heroin
>> addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to survive his
>> addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz artists didn't.
>
> As we take Joe Pass's inventory and "tsk tsk" to ourselves in
You are replying to a 7 1/2 year old question, presumably because of the
awfulness of the Google Groups interface for Usenet newsgroups.
Joe was a junkie; he publicly referred to those years- about 15 years,
IIRC- as wasted time. Fortunately for him and for all of us he was able
to get some help, kick the habit and have decades of wonderful
music-making. Synanon was a weird program that got weirder and creepier
(you can read the history elsewhere) but it did help some folks like Joe
and other jazz musicians. The "Sounds of Synanon" album is a testament
to that.
Some folks refer to drugs as a two edged sword, but the negative side of
many/most forms of hard drugs (and alcohol) is far sharper than the
positive side. Heroin and alcoholism were scourges for decades of jazz
musicians. There was a stretch where the scourges shifted to alcohol
and cocaine, but I would not be surprised if heroin is making a comeback
among jazz musicians like it is in all other parts of American society.
TD
Tim McNamara
wrote:
> All stimulants are lurking and inevitable depressants. Escaping always
> has a price tag.
Nil
rec.music.makers.guitar.jazz:
> Joe was a junkie; he publicly referred to those years- about 15
> years, IIRC- as wasted time. Fortunately for him and for all of
> us he was able to get some help, kick the habit and have decades
> of wonderful music-making. Synanon was a weird program that got
> weirder and creepier (you can read the history elsewhere) but it
> did help some folks like Joe and other jazz musicians. The
> "Sounds of Synanon" album is a testament to that.
'60s or early '70s. It was sponsored either by my school, or my Boy
Scout troop, or maybe by the YMCA, I can't remember which. It seemed to
be more of a PR exercise on their part than a learning experience for
us. It wasn't made clear what the purpose of the place was, though I
was vaguely aware it was a place for people with "problems" to live
communally. It had a vibe somewhere between a hospital and a jail and
was painted with thick globby institutional green paint everywhere and
bars on the windows. They never mentioned their illustrious musical
guests.
charlie...@gmail.com
Tuesday, January 19, 2010 at 1:04:30 PM UTC-5, Chickenhead wrote:
> Kind of makes spending time in a Texas prison sound appealing. 10 hours a
> day to practice and three square meals sounds like a vacation to me. Throw
> in cigarettes and coffee, and I'm just about ready to sign up!
>
> "
joel fass
> Are there any good interviews where Mr. Pass reflects on his heroin
> addiction? I would like to know how Joe Pass was able to survive his
> addiction to heroin, when many other great Jazz artists didn't.
We all know the rest...
johnsha...@gmail.com
>
> A major factor that should not be overlooked is the need - owing to the
> ridiculously late opening hours of jazz clubs - to be able to stay awake
> all night and perform and still do recording sessions in the daytime. Stan
> Tracey, the father of British jazz piano, was very honest about this in a
> documentary on his life.
>
>
> Clips, Portable Changes, tips etc.: www.keithfreemantrio.nl
> e-mail: info AT keithfreemantrio DOT nl
Sorry, Keith, but you clearly don't understand the basics of recreational drugs use. The most abused drugs in that era of jazz were things that made you sleepy,...not things that kept you awake.
Gerry
> \On Tuesday, January 19, 2010 at 7:25:45 AM UTC-8, Keith Freeman wrote:
>
>> A major factor that should not be overlooked is the need - owing to the
>> ridiculously late opening hours of jazz clubs - to be able to stay awake
>> all night and perform and still do recording sessions in the daytime. Stan
>> Tracey, the father of British jazz piano, was very honest about this in a
>> documentary on his life.
>
> Heroin, Pot and Alcohol to stay awake?!?!?!
> Sorry, Keith, but you clearly don't understand the basics of
> recreational drugs use. The most abused drugs in that era of jazz were
> things that made you sleepy,...not things that kept you awake.
I don't know what Keith said in context 8 years ago, and I certainly
don't claim to fully understand the many reasons or impulses that
direct people to drugs. I do know that some people take "make you
sleepy" drugs in order to counter the "make you wakey" drugs, such as
drinking coffee, benzedrine and [other], in order to work through the
night, or long/late hours.
As is frequently the case, it's not a single element to be viewed in a
single situation, but a composite.
hodge12
van
> many musicians passed through this place:
> http://www.narcoticfarm.com/t2_book.html