Seagull guitar questions
Phil
I've read many positive reviews of the Seagull line on this site. I'll
head out to a shop soon. However, most shops in the Berkeley area don't
carry a wide enough selection to do proper comparisons.
That said, I tend to buy with several factors in mind:
- sound. I gather that spruce top is a bit more articulate than cedar.
This is appealing. I'm not sure about the cherry vs. mahogony back. I
know nada about maple backs except they're bright. (Yes, I need to do
more test-driving, but these are my *beginner* questions.)
- a good value? I gather the S6 line is preferred to the M6's. Although
the anniversary seems pretty sweet.
- will the guitar work for the next style I'm into? Not sure if the
anniversary maple back would be a bit much for some things....
- will the guitar's sound improve? Makes me think spruce top. Not sure
what maple will do over time (nevermind how it would sound with cedar vs.
spruce).
- will the guitar increase in value (so in 20 years I can swap it for 4
guitars!) Makes me consider the anniversary again....
Anyhoo. Please post your thoughts so I can further inform myself between
trips to the shops!
Mr. Underhill
everything I could afford. All I knew about guitars was a few brand names.
I came home with a Guild D-35. Not the classiest guitar certainly, and not
much prestige-wise...but it still plays like butter and has an awesome tone
and I wouldn't part with it for anything. My point? Just go down there,
try 'em all 'til you find something that works for YOU, then take it home
and play the hell out of it.
-Underhill
"Phil" <pvnews1@NOSPAM_nekophile.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2002.08.27.20.20.45.968760.16053@NOSPAM_nekophile.com...
Gurusvw
>try 'em all 'til you find something that works for YOU, then take it home
>and play the hell out of it.
>
>-Underhill
I nominate this as the offical RMMGA slogan!
Jerry Gant
1 eyed jack
"Gurusvw" <gur...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020827173158...@mb-cv.aol.com...
I think Frank Zappa said it more succinctly; "Shut up and play yer guitar".
JD
John Holbrook
"Phil" <pvnews1@NOSPAM_nekophile.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2002.08.27.20.20.45.968760.16053@NOSPAM_nekophile.com...
Phil, I'm not a guitar expert, but I do own a Seagull S6+ Cedar and a
Taylor 812C, so I'll give you MY answers to your questions. Others may
not agree, but that's ok, as you'll have to make up your own mind in the
end anyhow.
When I was shopping for my Seagull, I played about a dozen of them, both
spruce and cedar tops, both cherry and mahogany bodies, covering a range
of prices from about $300 up to near $1,000, and I kept going back to one
particular guitar, a cherry/cedar S6. The icing on the cake was, that
particular
guitar was the lowest priced one on the wall, although that DID NOT sway
my choice. I'm not sure what you mean by a spruce top being more
"articulate",
so I'll pass on that question.
My "style" is a mix of both flatpicking and alternating thumb fingerstyle,
and
I love my Seagull for both. I don't (usually) use it to play rhythm in a
bluegrass
setting, as the cedar top doesn't have quite the "punch" that a spruce top
will give.
Will the guitar's sound improve? As others have stated, cedar tops really
don't have to "break in" as much as a spruce top, but I think mine has
improved
somewhat in the year that I've owned it. Some of that might be that I've
settled on a brand of string that seems best suited to it, plus I had a
setup
done, although the factory setup was really VERY good.
Will the guitar increase in value? Probably not. I didn't buy mine as an
investment, I bought it as a tool, and it continues to serve me very well in
that respect.
Although I've added a Baggs I-Beam pickup to the Seagull my Taylor works
better in a plugged-in band situation, and it has become my "electric
guitar".
But, sitting out on the porch, when I want an acoustic sound, its the
Seagull
that gets picked up........every time.
Best of luck choosing YOUR guitar.
John
MKarlo
Hey Phil.
>I've read many positive reviews of the Seagull line on this site. I'll
>head out to a shop soon. However, most shops in the Berkeley area don't
>carry a wide enough selection to do proper comparisons.
Great bang/buck ratio.
>That said, I tend to buy with several factors in mind:
>
>- sound. I gather that spruce top is a bit more articulate than cedar.
>This is appealing. I'm not sure about the cherry vs. mahogony back. I
>know nada about maple backs except they're bright. (Yes, I need to do
>more test-driving, but these are my *beginner* questions.)
My take only. Go for the cedar top if warm fingerstyle is your thing. If you
plan to thrash it, go with the spruce. Try every combo, see what your ear
likes.
>- a good value? I gather the S6 line is preferred to the M6's. Although
>the anniversary seems pretty sweet.
Their best selling point. I think the only difference betwixt the two series
is the back/side wood. S=Wild Cherry, M=Mahogany. Again, what sounds better
to you.
>- will the guitar work for the next style I'm into? Not sure if the
>anniversary maple back would be a bit much for some things....
If you've got a lot of growing and learning to do, get one that's versatile.
Say, a mahogany/spruce dred w/cutaway vs. the smaller folk sizes.
>- will the guitar's sound improve? Makes me think spruce top. Not >surewhat
maple will do over time (nevermind how it would sound with >cedar vs. spruce).
A little with the solid top.
>- will the guitar increase in value (so in 20 years I can swap it for 4
>guitars!) Makes me consider the anniversary again....
Not much if any. You're not talking investment grade guitars here. Really not
a good criteria for buying any guitar if you really want to play it.
>Anyhoo. Please post your thoughts so I can further inform myself between
>trips to the shops!
Enjoy the journey!
Mitch
Hojo2x
>I've read many positive reviews of the Seagull line on this site.
They're a good buy, particularly in Canada.
>- sound. I gather that spruce top is a bit more articulate than cedar.
>This is appealing. I'm not sure about the cherry vs. mahogony back.
Spruce will tend to have better separation between the notes of the chords, and
also be brighter, at least initially. The sound of a spruce top will change
more with age and use than will the sound of a cedar top, but there is some
aging and break-in with cedar, too.
As for the difference between cherry and mahogany backs in the Seagulls, unless
you get into the more expensive Seagull Artist series you're going to be
dealing with laminated woods in the back and sides (and laminated sides even in
the Artist models.) So I'm not sure you'll find a huge difference in tone -
the main difference is likely to be in appearance.
>I >know nada about maple backs except they're bright.
Well, the same caveats about the behavior of laminated versus solid woods
apply, but maple tends to have a quicker decay, as well. The notes don't
sustain as long as they do with other tonewoods.
When plugged in and onstage, this can be an advantage.....less muddy that way,
easier to run through a PA.
>(Yes, I need to do >more test-driving, but these are my *beginner* questions.)
Hey, that's why we're HERE.
>- a good value? I gather the S6 line is preferred to the M6's. Although
>the anniversary seems pretty sweet.
The S6 line is the better value. The Seagull Artist line gets up there into
low end Larrivée and Martin territory, and you can generally find a
better-sounding example of one of those at the same price range as a Seagull
Artist model.
It's all a matter of taste, of course, and I know that some folks with the
ability to buy any guitar they want have chosen upper end Seagulls and just
adore them.
But as a general rule, I think the S6 Seagulls are the best deal that they
offer.
>- will the guitar work for the next style I'm into? Not sure if
the>anniversary maple back would be a bit much for some things....
I'm not sure what you're asking here, unless you're asking whether the guitar
will be versatile enough to allow you to develop as a player.
Tough call. I think the Seagulls are marvelous guitars for the money, but
haven't found them to have the range of tonal colors and dynamics available on
even a lowball Martin.
>- will the guitar's sound improve?
It should.
>Makes me think spruce top. Not sure
>what maple will do over time (nevermind how it would sound with cedar
vs.>spruce).
Well, again, unless you're talking about solid maple (which I doubt) there's
not much chance that a laminated tonewood will change a whole lot.
The solid top is another matter entirely. Solid spruce will definitely improve
with age and use, a cedar top less so.
Another factor to think about when choosing between spruce and cedar for the
top is that the cedar is much more prone to getting scratched up: it's a
considerably softer wood than spruce.
If you decide at some point to sell this Seagull in order to invest in another
guitar, it'll be easier to resell it if it's in reasonable condition. It's
much easier to keep it looking good when you have a spruce top, believe
me.....cedar will dent if you give it a hard look!
>- will the guitar increase in value
No. Not a chance. There are thousands of them out there.
>(so in 20 years I can swap it for 4
>guitars!)
Oh, yeah, dream ON! It'd be NICE, mind you, but it never works that way.
>Makes me consider the anniversary again....
Which is precisely the wrong reason to consider the anniversary model. Buy it
if you like that guitar, but the special label or special woods aren't going to
make anyone's heart go pitter-pat ten years from now.
The main thing is to find one that you like, as a player, not as an investment.
Because as an investment, very few guitars are going to show much in the way of
return. But as musical instruments, you can get priceless enjoyment out of
them.
Have fun with the search.
Wade Hampton Miller
Chugiak, Alaska
misifus
> Hi,
> I've read many positive reviews of the Seagull line on this site. I'll
> head out to a shop soon. However, most shops in the Berkeley area don't
> carry a wide enough selection to do proper comparisons.
>
> That said, I tend to buy with several factors in mind:
>
> - sound. I gather that spruce top is a bit more articulate than cedar.
> This is appealing. I'm not sure about the cherry vs. mahogony back. I
> know nada about maple backs except they're bright. (Yes, I need to do
> more test-driving, but these are my *beginner* questions.)
The S6+ Cedar top I bought for my grandson has a nice, articulate sound.
That would be with the lam cherry b+s.
>
>
> - a good value? I gather the S6 line is preferred to the M6's. Although
> the anniversary seems pretty sweet.
I thought it was a very good value
>
>
> - will the guitar work for the next style I'm into? Not sure if the
> anniversary maple back would be a bit much for some things....
>
> - will the guitar's sound improve? Makes me think spruce top. Not sure
> what maple will do over time (nevermind how it would sound with cedar vs.
> spruce).
Yes.
>
>
> - will the guitar increase in value (so in 20 years I can swap it for 4
> guitars!) Makes me consider the anniversary again....
I'm sure you're pulling our legs, but, if not, check out the Ovation 12
string thread.
-Ralph
--
Misifus-
Ralph Seibert
mailto:rsei...@cox-internet.com
http://www.ralphandsue.com
Don
If you are considering a seagul I would recommend trying as many guitars
from the Lasido factory as you can, as they seem to differ in tone and
playability.I live in Vancouver Canada and Seaguls ,and their bretherin,
"Simon and Patrick" and "Norman."I recently tried about 25 guitars ,of
different models, by these companies and my favorite Seagul was a M6.The
tone and action were great and I believe comparable to much more expensive
instraments.A few Seaguls I tried ,including the "artist series
dreadnoughts, "seemed to have badly set up actions and some had somewhat
"thin tones" and lacked complexity.The simon and Patricks, seemed overall,
more consistant in their playability, and had superior fit and finish.I
purchased a Simon and Patrick Spruce top Parlor model recently and am
enjoying it a lot.It seems well suited to folk blues and ragtime and is fun
to play.Action is factory set up on my guitar at 1/8" at 12 fret where the
neck meets the body.Definitely play as many models as you can lay your hands
on.Some of the Seagul S6's were good players with a cedar cutaway model
standing out from the rest.If you can afford the cash the Simon and patrick
Pro [Spruce top]rosewood cutaway was the nicest Lasido I ever played.It was
920$ Canadian or about 600$ US.Very good value and quality. Don
Phil
Twas a bit hard to hear over the other folks in the cramped acoustic
section, and I was fingerpicking only. However, the Cedar Anniversary
played the best for me. I'm not sure if the action was simply better,
strings newer, or if it was my fingerpicking. It just worked better.
'Course, I didn't try _everything_; after a few mahoganies, I steered
clear as they seemed a bit wooley to me.
They had no S6 spruce on hand. Drat!
The M6 gloss was OK. I found little to distinguish it from the S6 cedar
in terms of playability. Neck felt a bit different, though. I really
have to spend more time on this.
The spruce anniversary was icky; I probably couldn't play cards on
that thing. ;^)
I agree that there's really no investment value here, though. Guess that
was a silly question, but when you lay down a few hundred based on
beginning-level instincts, you hope you can recoup some of it should you
choose wrong.
The salesman suggested checking out the S&P's: he indicated that they
would be better. I tried a couple and wasn't impressed with them. Again
- there was a roomfull of others to try before comping to any real
conclusions.
I think I should go to another guitar shop and see how much of my
experience was chance factors!
Tony Done
to the cedar top - more complexity and less tendency to boom.
I also like the Grande, but I've tried maybe a dozen or so more expensive
Seagulls and not liked any of them much. - To quiet, too dull or too many
strange overtones in the mid range.
I wonder about quality control on LaSiDo guitars. I've seen a range of
problems, including low neck angle, sliding pickguards and backseam
separation on guitars in the local store. The "Seagull bulge" isn't a
problem as far as I know, just an annoyance to an anal type like myself when
I realise it's there. It appears as a lifting of the top and side on the
lower bout treble side edge, when sighted for the headstock. I'm not sure
how common it is, but others in this newsgroup have seen it.
Tony D
Phil <pvnews1@NOSPAM_nekophile.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2002.08.27.20.20.45.968760.16053@NOSPAM_nekophile.com...
Jim Ellis
Get whatever John Holbrook tells you to get. His sounds like a million
bucks.
FWIW,
Jim
John Chamberlain
Timothy530
thinks it sounds great. Does sound to have heavier bottom than some 12's in
this price range. I think we paid around $500 bucks for it. Has the laminated
cherry back and sides. And it's true if you just stare at the cedar top hard
enuff it will dent. Very soft. All those nicks and dings on mine..good
converation starters. Good luck on your Seagull quest.
tim in louisville
>Subject: Re: Seagull guitar questions
>From: "Tony Done" tony...@bigpond.com
>Date: Wed, Aug 28, 2002 3:04 AM
>Message-id: <Xz_a9.17047$g9.5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>
Dan Carey
"John Holbrook" <jhol...@infinet.com> wrote in message
news:3d6bf95f$0$1422$4c5e...@news.erinet.com...
SNIP HERE
Phil, I'm not a guitar expert, but I do own a Seagull S6+ Cedar
> When I was shopping for my Seagull, I played about a dozen of them,
> Best of luck choosing YOUR guitar.
>
> John
I agree with John 100%. Although I bought my Seagull to dabble in alternate
tunings, my experiences were the same. I kept coming back to the S6+ Cedar
model.
I paid less than $300 for it and have never had a complaint.
Dan
Gary Trend
fingerpick on this. It has a fairly wide kneck but I believe this has
been reduced on newer models.
I found the Spruce top have a much brighter sound and the string
seperation was better compared to the Cedar. It was much louder too.
Cheers Gary
Phil <pvnews1@NOSPAM_nekophile.com> wrote in message news:<pan.2002.08.27.20.20.45.968760.16053@NOSPAM_nekophile.com>...
Phil
Different store this time. This place had the S6+ spruce and it was
setup better than the cedar that they carried. I could feel what
folks were saying about the ability to discern notes within a chord
better on spruce.
Unfortunately, I must be honest with myself and recognize that the setup
really affects this experience. It's a bit agonizing for a weak-fingered
electric player to go through this process! Thus far the best sounding
guitars have also been the best-setup (lowest action). The cedar anniversary
was like butter and sounded great. Today's S6+ Spruce was nice, but
neither played as well nor sounded as good (based on comparisons 2-days
apart, mind you).
Parting thought for today:
At least there is one truth I can rely on: I haven't found a roundback
yet that sounded natural.
misifus
> The ongoing commentary continues...
>
> Different store this time. This place had the S6+ spruce and it was
> setup better than the cedar that they carried. I could feel what
> folks were saying about the ability to discern notes within a chord
> better on spruce.
>
> Unfortunately, I must be honest with myself and recognize that the setup
> really affects this experience. It's a bit agonizing for a weak-fingered
> electric player to go through this process! Thus far the best sounding
> guitars have also been the best-setup (lowest action). The cedar anniversary
> was like butter and sounded great. Today's S6+ Spruce was nice, but
> neither played as well nor sounded as good (based on comparisons 2-days
> apart, mind you).
Well, I'm gonna say it. It's been said before, and you've heard it before, but
here goes. Buy the one you like the best. It's clear that you aren't going
into this blind. You've done your research, tried the various options, and
found one that plays and sounds better to you than the others. Go for it.
Nobody else's opinion matters as much as yours. You're the guy that has to live
with this thing. You're the one who's paying for it. So, pick the one you
like. I don't think you'll be disappointed. In general, the Seagulls are
pretty good guitars for the price, so if the Anniversary model is the one that
rings your chimes, great!
Gary Beckwith
guitar in the past and I'm telling you I like this one better. And it
costs half as much. Seagull guitars are a great value. But if you
think about it, the value is not the bottom line. If you are going to
own a guitar for 10 years, it doesn't matter if it costs 300 or 800.
Spread out over the lifetime, the cost is not very much. But what
matters is the sound and how much you like it. I'm telling you, i've
owned about 10 guitars in my life and i'm IN LOVE with my Seagull. I
was just playing it last night and someone came up to me and commented
on the beautiful tone afterwards.
I would recommend you call Seagull and have them tell you where there's
a dealer with a large selection of their guitars. That way, you can
play a few of them and pick the one you like best.
By the way, mine is cedar and cherry and I love the sound.
gary