Heights of Dargai...history?
Cotsford
Highlanders when they particpated in this campaign in northern India in 1897.
Does anybody know any of the history that surrounds the tune of this same name,
presumably written to glorify the occasion?
pmajclark
18 Oct.1897 the Heights of Dargai where secured by the Kings Own Scottish
Borderers. They were then ordered down again by Gen. Lockheart.
(a tactical mistake)
The tribesmen then re-ocupied the ridge.
So on the 20th of Oct. they had to re-take the ridge. Several Regiments attempted
but where not successful. The 1st Gordon's where called up and captured the Heights
in 40 minutes. (They where said to have been told by their commanding officer Col.
Methias "This ridge must be taken at all cost, and the Gordon Highlanders WILL take
it")
2 Soldiers where awarded the Victoria Cross for valour in that action.
Piper George Findlater (not to be confused with the tune Jimmy Findlater)
who was wounded in both ankles, but crawled to his pipes and played the regiment on
while constantly under direct fire.
And Pte.Lawson who showed amazing courage rescuing wounded directly through the
fire zone.
The regiment suffered 33 fatal casualties.
Bill
Very cool stuff!
If you could choose one book about scottish history (No Gary "I cant spell"
Speed, I'm not talking about Braveheart the book, you know, the one they made
the movie about? Remember Dick and Jane Wallace? Oh, I forgot, you flunked...)
that just about sums it all up in a good overall view, which one would you
choose? Please keep it to ones currently available, thanks.
Bill
PJ Riley
Malcom, 1927
Get it from ScotPress www.scotpress.com
This book does not, perhaps, meet your requirements for a good overall view
of Scottish history but it is a good reference, nonetheless.
Pat Riley Ottawa ON
Bill <mrrob...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010503230519...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
Matthew Buckley
"PJ Riley" <2p...@home.com> wrote
> One book, very specific to pipers, is "The Piper In Peace And War", by
C.A.
> Malcom, 1927
> > Bill <mrrob...@aol.com> wrote
> > If you could choose one book about scottish history ...
> > that just about sums it all up in a good overall view, which one would
you
> > choose? Please keep it to ones currently available, thanks.
Nigel Tranter wrote one the best condensed histories of Scotland available.
Readable in a few days.
I'll check the title at home, but I think it's something simple like "The
History of Scotland". Search under Nigel
Tranter and it should come up.
C.A. Malcom's book is somewhat of a standard, but it's does not constitute
well-researched
or well-written history. It doesn't begin to compare with the modern
scholarship of John Gibson [Traditional
Gaelic Bagpiping, 1745-1945] and William Donaldson [The Highland Pipe and
Scottish Society, 1750-
1950]. It's more a compilation of anecdotes/information/tales, many of
which may are not be based in
solid research. Modern day scholars do not take Malcolm's work very
seriously.
Bill
>Malcom, 1927
Sounds like a worthwhile read, thanks.
Bill
Bill
>Readable in a few days.
>I'll check the title at home, but I think it's something simple like "The
>History of Scotland". Search under Nigel
>Tranter and it should come up.
That sounds more broader reaching, more like what I'm looking for. I was
looking for more of a general history, rather than a bagpipe-related read.
Thanks Matt.
Bill
Calum
BTW, my band is the last band to descend from the Gordons that still
wear Gordons kit.
First off, the tune we know as the Height's of Dargai is in fact
misnamed. Lt-Col DJS Murray wrote a bit about this in the April (?)
Piping Times of 2000.
The correct name is in fact the Dagshai Hills, and the Heights of Dargai
should be applied to a know unknown 6/8 march.
The story of the campaign goes on a bit, but:
In about 1897, various tribesman of the northern Indian frontier started
getting a bit uppity, and in order to put down the rebels, a couple of
brigades of some 30,000 soldiers were sent out to give them a talking
to.
At one point, tribesman dominated a vital road into the force's
destination. The Heights of Dargai allowed a vital gun emplacement that
was impervious to British artillery fire. After some skirmishing that
left a number of Gordons dead, the Brigade returned the next day with
orders to take the heights. The Ghurkas, Dorsets, and Derbys were
ordered to take the Heights, but as they crossed the plain in front such
fire was poured on them that almost none made it to the foot of the
heights.
At this point the Gordons were ordered to the front. They advanced as
far as they could in cover and lay there for a time, while artillery put
down a fire on the Heights in order to cow them. At this point, their
commanding officer, Lt-Col Mathias told them 'The General says this hill
must be taken at all costs - the Gordon Highlanders will take it!'
The troops cheered, the advance was sounded, and the pipers struck up.
They dashed across the foot of the hill through 'a murderous fire.' Of
the five pipers who started playing at the charge, only one made it to
the Heights, a Piper Kidd. The rest were hit in the charge, one a Piper
Findlater, gaining enduring fame when he was hit in both ankles but
continued playing, for which he was subsequently awarded a VC.
The regiment paused briefly under cover at the foot of the Heights, then
charged up the precipitous path as best they could. The Heights were
stormed and in British hands by 3.15pm.
Later that day, the Gordons assisted in the removal of the wounded, and
received cheers from the other regiments as they returned to camp.
The brigades later continued their advance as scheduled, and eventually
the Tirah rebellion was crushed.
An interesting footnote to this episode is the vexed question of what
Findlater did in fact play at the Heights.
The order was given that it should be the Cock of the North, the
Regimental March. Some confusion later emerged over what had happened,
after the country had been told that the tune played was Cock of the
North (it became quite fashionable for young ladies to be able to tinkle
this out on the piano, and both music hall and concert hall echoed
repeatedly to it's strains).
Findlater was consulted, and said that he had not heard the order for
the tune, and had therefore decided the tune should be the Charge, the
Haughs of Cromdale, a strathspey. Various other persons were also
consulted, all of whom had their own ideas. Suggestions varied from
Highland Laddie to the Cock to various strathspeys, and goodness knows
what else. Eventually the RSM of the regiment was consulted. Without a
moment's hesitation, he replied 'Cock of the North.' And thus it was.
The news was telegraphed back to blighty, and this is the tune which
history denotes he played.
Few recall that the RSM at the time of the charge was in charge of the
ammo dump, some miles away, and was in fact well known for his lack of
musical knowledge to begin with.
There is more on the subject of the campaign, and more particularly
Findlater's part in it, at:
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Atlantis/2359/
It is a curiosity of the 9/8 tune that it seems to have kick started the
modern tendency of all 9/8 composers to finish the parts with two full
beats, or dotted quavers.
Just a couple of minor details...
Cheers,
Calum
Calum
about £20. Seemingly collectors are paying hundreds for it.
These books, even if they don't stand up to modern historical standards
of research, are often an interesting study in how oral history can
metamorphose over time, and also in how pipers often take their teachers
as imparters of the divine truth.
Bryn Smith
<ENAI6.1221$Px1.1...@nntp1.onemain.com>:
>
<snip>
>Nigel Tranter wrote one the best condensed histories of Scotland
>available. Readable in a few days.
>I'll check the title at home, but I think it's something simple like
>"The History of Scotland". Search under Nigel
>Tranter and it should come up.
>
Bleah, Nigel Trantor, yuck! I am fairly certain he writes historical
fiction, not history. Maybe he digressed in this one book, but I've read
two or three others by him, and they disagreed with any and every other
historical source I've ever read, and had lots and LOTS of speculation in
them. And it wasn't even particularly good prose, either. He's not an
historian, he's a novelist. His books are stories, not histories.
-Bryn
Calum
indeed for much of Scotland's history, filling in of the narrative is
indeed required. What he does is, in my experience required in order to
give the story shape. He does not give the novel the 'Hollywood'
treatment that Braveheart and other films suffered.
He is a knowledgable historian, and from personal experience I can say
that if he wrote a history of Scotland, it will be accurate and worth
reading.
Matthew Buckley
<(Bryn Smith)> wrote
> >Nigel Tranter wrote one the best condensed histories of Scotland
> >available. Readable in a few days.
> >I'll check the title at home, but I think it's something simple like
> >"The History of Scotland". Search under Nigel
> >Tranter and it should come up.
> Bleah, Nigel Trantor, yuck! I am fairly certain he writes historical
> fiction, not history. Maybe he digressed in this one book, but I've read
> two or three others by him, and they disagreed with any and every other
> historical source I've ever read, and had lots and LOTS of speculation in
> them. And it wasn't even particularly good prose, either. He's not an
> historian, he's a novelist. His books are stories, not histories.
Nigel Tranter does, indeed, digress in one important instance to write a
fairly well researched
condensed history of Scotland. That is what the gentleman was asking
about, and that
is what I was responding to.
You are correct insofar as Tranter is best known for his historical
fiction, books which
are not great works of literary art or history. You are not informed
as to the one standard history
that he did write. It is simply, if solidly, researched, and provides a
short introduction to someone just starting to read
Scottish history.
My degree is history, and I have cannot stand reading badly
researched/written material. But Tranter
does surprisingly well in this instance. Perhaps you should actually
read it prior to slamming it.
Cheers. Matt
>
> -Bryn
Matthew Buckley
"Calum" <u3...@abdn.ac.uk> wrote:
> He is a knowledgable historian, and from personal experience I can say
> that if he wrote a history of Scotland, it will be accurate and worth
> reading.
He did indeed write a history, it is quite accurate, and is well worth
reading
for a basic introductory understanding of Scottish history.
Cheers. Matt
Matthew Buckley
<personalbest1spam.com (Bryn Smith)> wrote
> Bleah, Nigel Trantor, yuck!
Well, if you're not big on Tranter, then the following might make you feel
better:
1. The standard 20th century single-volume review of Scottish history is
J.D. Mackie's "A History of Scotland", Pengiun edition 1978, first
published in 1964. Mackie, until 1957, occupied the Chair of Scottish
History and Literature at Univ. Glasgow. 380p., well-researched, but
a
bit of a slog for the first timer wanting an easy overview.
2. For a fascinating and serious look at the connection between Scottish
history and
Scottish folk/folk music, read "The People's Past", edited by Edward
Cowan, a
collection of essays by the likes of Hugh Cheape, Hamish Henderson,
Duncan
MacMillan, Adam McNaughton, John Barrow, Kenneth Logue, Gavin Sprott
and James Reed. Serious history for serious readers. Published by
Polygon,
Edinburgh, last edition published 1991, first published 1980.
Cheers. Matt
Who?
"Matthew Buckley" <bdrp...@together.net> wrote in message
news:KIFI6.773$Bc1.4...@nntp2.onemain.com...
That is what the gentleman >>
Wow! Thats BY FAR the nicest thing I've been called on here in awhile LOL!
G0blet
>fairly well researched
> condensed history of Scotland. That is what the gentleman was asking
>about, and that
> is what I was responding to.
>
> You are correct insofar as Tranter is best known for his historical
>fiction, books which
> are not great works of literary art or history. You are not informed
>as to the one standard history
> that he did write. It is simply, if solidly, researched, and provides a
>short introduction to someone just starting to read
> Scottish history.
>
> My degree is history, and I have cannot stand reading badly
>researched/written material. But Tranter
> does surprisingly well in this instance. Perhaps you should actually
>read it prior to slamming it.
>
>
>Cheers. Matt
>
Another good overview is "Scotland: A Concise History" by Sir Fitzroy MacLean.
Available at Barnes and Noble book store chain.
Gloria
>
>
>
>
>
>
Rick
14 00.3652 0.
Or "Highlanders, A History of the Gael" by John MacLeod, ISBN 0-340-63991-1.
Just for starters, more obscure references available on request.
cheers,
Rick
G0blet <g0b...@cs.com> wrote in message
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