Trent Reznor vs David Bowie

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michael taylor

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Feb 1, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/1/96
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Hello all


I think that David Bowie blows trent Reznor away. I believe that
bowie writes more original music. You may not like his current work,
but you have to admit Bowie is pushing the envelope. Trent will not
move in a direction, unless it has been hip for at least a year. AKA,
synth pop when Depech Mode did Violator, Broken when grunge was
cool(Broken is not a grunge album, but you have to admit it is guitar
rock, with a sequencer), and dark ambient for Downward. Bowie is moving
in his own direction, he may not be selling platnum, but he is not
making music for 14 years olds either.
Another bone I have to pick with trent, is his lame "concept"
album. hey everybody, I am lonley, I am sad, I want to die, what a
concept! At least Bowie is trying to create theater, he is trying to
tell a complex story, Bowie even has multiple characters in his
albums(woah what a concept<G>).
The other thing, I think Bowie will be remembered in 25 years. I
cannot say the same for trent, I think he will be in the same boat with
Human League, and Naked Eyes. Unfortunatly for trent, thats what
happens when you follow trends.
The final thing I Dislike about Trent Reznor, he is a rock star.
Trent thinks that wrecking hotel rooms, and giving groupies enemas is a
good time. Bowie is trying to create art, he is striving to make better
music. Bowie is trying to capture the moment, this alienates people,
because he is about 20 years ahead of his time. When you listen to Low,
you have to admit for when the record was released(January 9th or 19th,
1977, if I am not mistaken), was the most futuristic thing out there.
Trent, Joy Division, Robert Smith, Kraftwerk, they all name check him
as an influence. Trent is a rock star, Bowie is an artist.

if I pissed you off I am sorry, but time will prove me right.
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA


PS For all you alternateens who walked out after NIN, you missed out on
one great show.



Moron

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Feb 1, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/1/96
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That's one kickboxing match I'd pay to see! $5 bux on Bowie. Any takers?

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Eric Pierce

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Feb 1, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/1/96
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In <4eprdo$s...@ixnews4.ix.netcom.com> chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael
taylor ) writes:
>
>Hello all

Hello fool!

>
> I think that David Bowie blows trent Reznor away. I believe that
>bowie writes more original music. You may not like his current work,
>but you have to admit Bowie is pushing the envelope. Trent will not
>move in a direction, unless it has been hip for at least a year. AKA,
>synth pop when Depech Mode did Violator, Broken when grunge was
>cool(Broken is not a grunge album, but you have to admit it is guitar
>rock, with a sequencer), and dark ambient for Downward. Bowie is
moving
>in his own direction, he may not be selling platnum, but he is not
>making music for 14 years olds either.

i think yer pretty stupid. yep, Trent goes with the flow. who knows now
that alternative is the thing maybe the next NIN will be that. Maybe
he'll put out an R&B & rap album also. you obviously no nothing.

Yes, Bowie is a great artist. I like both. I couldn't really compare
the two. Bowie is pretty original, but that is pretty tough to do these
days.

Also, i don't believe TR writes his music for 14 year olds. You
probably didn't even know who NIN was before '94. He writes his music
about what he wants to and if you don't like it, oh well. You don't
have to cut on it. I hate rap & country but i don't post about how it
is being written for drunks and white trash.

William Longsdon

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Feb 2, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/2/96
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[1] Trent Reznor vs David Bowie
chr...@ix.netcom.com

> The final thing I Dislike about Trent Reznor, he is a rock star.
>Trent thinks that wrecking hotel rooms, and giving groupies enemas is a
>good time. Bowie is trying to create art

>Trent, Joy Division, Robert Smith, Kraftwerk, they all name check him


>as an influence. Trent is a rock star, Bowie is an artist.

i agree with some of your points(not your musical view of nin), but you
can't say bowie wasn't a rock star! maybe now he isn't, but it's called
maturing. maybe trent's getting caught up in the decadence of the rock
star thing now (not saying it's right or wrong), but when he's bowies age

who knows.


>PS For all you alternateens who walked out after NIN, you missed out on
>one great show.

yep, he was brilliant, of course. but hey, i'm glad they left cuz we got
to
move to a better spot and didn't have to deal with all the mainstream
kiddies so much. i may be their age, but i'm extremely glad i don't have

their fucked up " follow the trends like sheep" mentality! 8)
amber


Andrew Clegg

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Feb 2, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/2/96
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In article: <4eqqo0$m...@sanjuan.islandnet.com> mo...@islandnet.com (Moron)
writes:

>
> That's one kickboxing match I'd pay to see! $5 bux on Bowie. Any takers?

I'd back Bowie too, on the cover of Let's Dance he just looks *sooooo* hard.

--
Andrew.

"Happy children are just unhappy children having fun."

- Morticia Addams

Mark A. Pitcher

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Feb 2, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/2/96
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Moron (mo...@islandnet.com) wrote:
: That's one kickboxing match I'd pay to see! $5 bux on Bowie. Any takers?

You're on. Bowie's too old. No amount of coke is going to give him
the energy to take on someone like Reznor.


--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Mark A. Pitcher | http://www.waterloo.net/~mark
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"GUH!" - Bill Leeb

Sean Da Great

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Feb 2, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/2/96
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well, starter of this thread, your entitled to your own opinion, so heres mine:

DAVID BOWIE SUCKS DICK.

there, how ya like that? I like NIN, and i walked out on bowie after the
NIN show because, well, i fucking hate bowie. he has the shittiest voice
out of ANYONE in the ENTIRE music industry!! (with the exception of alanis
morrisette)..

some of his musical crap is sort of OK, but his voice just ruins it all.

and if you think trent is "going with the flow" well, whatyever, you can
think that. and even if he IS, does it matter????
does it matter if he DID sell out (even tho he trully DIDNT, regardless of
what you anti-nin freaks say)

THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS THAT THE MUSIC IS GOOD.

i cant stand people like you, who hate music because its trendy. thats no
reason to hate a certain band.

--
You look bored. But I'm sure a vist to my webpage will
cheer you up!! (or not) http://www.efn.org/~sean_h/

=========================================
| dont think you're havin all the fun |
| you know me, i hate everyone |
=========================================

Chris Lynch

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Feb 3, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/3/96
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In article <4ere87$g...@ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>,
>>PS For all you alternateens who walked out after NIN, you missed out
>on
>>one great show.
>
>

No shit... I'm sick of reading posts by people who knock NIN as a band that
follows the flow, steals from other industrial bands, or is unoriginal. I
mean, I love industrial music, and I also love NIN. Yeah, I even consider
NIN to be industrial.

If The Downward Spiral is dark ambient, then I am curious what music that I
called dark ambient is, because it sounds nothing like NIN. No, I also
don't think that Broken sounded like rock metal guitars with a sequencer.
Is that what Klute, Chemlab, Haloblack, or Argyle Park are?? I mean, they
have guitars in their music, so you gotta admit that they are pop grunge,
right?

Hmmm... as for calling Pretty Hate Machine synth pop because of Depeche, I
am curious if any band with an EBM fell to it was also imitating Depeche
Mode?

Just because a band is INFLUENCED by another band doesn't mean they are
stealing. A good portion of modern industrial is inspired by or receiving
ideas from other industrial bands. I mean, there are so many bands that
sound like NIN (like, uh... shit, I'll think of one later), so I know they
must have stolen their sound. Sure, I'll bet parts of NIN may sound like
other bands, but how many bands out there are completely original in
everything they do (and have no fucking influence from some other band)?

Comparing Bowie and NIN is strange, because while influences from Bowie may
exist in NIN, they are two completely seperate worlds. Just because you may
not like NIN doesn't mean they suck or are unoriginal.

Is NIN making music for 14 year olds? No... when he records his next album
with Weird Al Yankovic, then I'll agree for you.

C

[--------------------------------------------------------]
[ Chris Lynch ]
[ Instant Access Publishing ]
[ ]
[ "The greatest trick that the devil ever pulled, ]
[ was convincing the world that he didn't exist." ]
[ -The Usual Suspects ]
[--------------------------------------------------------]

downfall

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Feb 3, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/3/96
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On 2 Feb 1996, Mark A. Pitcher wrote:

> Moron (mo...@islandnet.com) wrote:
> : That's one kickboxing match I'd pay to see! $5 bux on Bowie. Any takers?
>
> You're on. Bowie's too old. No amount of coke is going to give him
> the energy to take on someone like Reznor.
>

though bowie is a cagey and wiley vertern of many a kick boxing battle
reznor is young, agile and fast. bowie may have the weight of a 25 year
recording history on his side, but in the kick boxing format, that doesn't
mean much. reznor not only has speed but also, he has years of training.
after all he spent 7 years in seclusion training with asiatic monks,
learning the arts of karate, ninjitsu, haiku, and praying mantis. reznor
would win, but bowie would put up a helluva fight.

-downfall

michael taylor

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Feb 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/4/96
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In <4eunp6$b...@news.one.net> t...@one.net (Chris Lynch) writes:
>
Trent will not
>>>move in a direction, unless it has been hip for at least a year.
AKA,
>>>synth pop when Depech Mode did Violator, Broken when grunge was
>>>cool(Broken is not a grunge album, but you have to admit it is
guitar
>>>rock, with a sequencer), and dark ambient for Downward. Bowie is
>>moving
>>>in his own direction, he may not be selling platnum, but he is not
>>>making music for 14 years olds either.

>>>PS For all you alternateens who walked out after NIN, you missed out


>>on
>>>one great show.
>>
>>
>
>No shit... I'm sick of reading posts by people who knock NIN as a
band that
>follows the flow, steals from other industrial bands, or is
unoriginal. I
>mean, I love industrial music, and I also love NIN. Yeah, I even
consider
>NIN to be industrial.
>
>If The Downward Spiral is dark ambient, then I am curious what music
that I
>called dark ambient is, because it sounds nothing like NIN. No, I
also
>don't think that Broken sounded like rock metal guitars with a
sequencer.
>Is that what Klute, Chemlab, Haloblack, or Argyle Park are?? I mean,
they
>have guitars in their music, so you gotta admit that they are pop
grunge,
>right?

NIN fans are interesting. First, when I said dark ambient, I mean that
he included more textures in TDS, I have an old interview with Trent
where he states""it'll (tds) also be more AMBIENT, and minimalist"
(Propaganda #20, page 20).

trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
something other then Industrial music.


>
>Hmmm... as for calling Pretty Hate Machine synth pop because of
Depeche, I
>am curious if any band with an EBM fell to it was also imitating
Depeche
>Mode?

well, Depech Mode was selling a lot of records in 1989. PHM in my
opinion, sounds like a dark, overbusy, Depech mode.


Persuasion, you gotta get some
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA

Philip Varner

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Feb 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/4/96
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>> You're on. Bowie's too old. No amount of coke is going to give him
>> the energy to take on someone like Reznor.

>learning the arts of karate, ninjitsu, haiku, and praying mantis. reznor

>would win, but bowie would put up a helluva fight.

Eh, not if Bowie went for Trents fishnets. Then Trent would just whine and
give in and go write a song how horrible his life is and make another billion.
Or, Bowie could go for Trents (lack of) nose and in which case, he'd do the
same thing as the fishnet scenerio.

Either way, I don't think Trent would win.


Not...@execpc.com http://www.execpc.com/~nothing/
::: :::
:: :: DOWNLOAD Homepage
: : http://www.execpc.com/~nothing/download/

michael taylor

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Feb 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/4/96
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In <4etd7r$h...@ophelia.waterloo.net> ma...@ophelia.waterloo.net (Mark A.

Pitcher) writes:
>
>Moron (mo...@islandnet.com) wrote:
>: That's one kickboxing match I'd pay to see! $5 bux on Bowie. Any
takers?
>
> You're on. Bowie's too old. No amount of coke is going to give
him
>the energy to take on someone like Reznor.
>
uhhh...according to Bowie and Brian Eno, Outside was written
without the involvement of controlled substances. besides, Bowie might
not be able to pretend he is sad, or do the "pain" dance, but at least
he plays with a live band. when I mean "live", I mean having real
musicians, not just pretty guys in leather trowsers, triggering samples
and playing two simple riffs on guitar. Reeves Gabriels or Carlos
Alomar could play circles around robin finch, but then again Reeves and
Carlos are not as "cute" as robin.
All in all, I would rather see an artist working with a great
band, than a "Rock star" and his pretty band. Bowie might not be 30
anymore, but he still hasn't lost the touch. A touch that Trent never
had.

someone who knew who trent was before the first Lollapalooza
(and thought he was shit even then)
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA


PS I got "rock star" from the last issue of spin. I love the part where
trent says that he was intimidated by Bowie "I felt like I had to
impress him". "He was reading poetry, and Discussing German art films"
Poor trent, David Bowie would not stroke trent's ego, it must really be
awful when someone will not drop everything to worship at the altar of
Reznor.

Sean Da Great

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Feb 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/4/96
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> trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
> moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
> concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
> listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
> concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
> something other then Industrial music.
>

writes for the charts?? not quite.. prety hate machine and broken were
not popular at ALL until tds came out.. broken?? ha , yah that album did
just GREAT! it sold about 3 copies, until TDS came around

Chris Lynch

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Feb 5, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/5/96
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>NIN fans are interesting. First, when I said dark ambient, I mean that
>he included more textures in TDS, I have an old interview with Trent
>where he states""it'll (tds) also be more AMBIENT, and minimalist"
>(Propaganda #20, page 20).
>
>trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
>moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
>concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
>listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
>concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
>something other then Industrial music.


OLD style industrial fans are interesting as well... you try to tell me how
TG is true industrial and everything nowadays is something else completely
different. I agree that TG, EN, and SPK are true to an OLD style of
industrial which has evolved into MODERN industrial, and I listen to both and
can honestly say that industrial as a style has EVOLVED like any other style
of music has. If it all sounded like 20 Jazz Funk Greats, then we wouldn't be
working towards new forms of industrial, now would we?

Broken sounded nothing like a rock album, and I'm curious what rock bands
sounds like Broken, because maybe I've given rock a cold shoulder for no
reason. Maybe I'm a die hard rock fan?

As for your quote about NIN, I simply said that TDS was far from dark ambient.
I consider ELpH to be dark ambient. I consider Aphex Twin, Global
Communication, Autechre, and Synaethesia to be ambient. The only track on TDS
to fall into either of these categories was a Warm Place. Everything else may
have had textured intros, but you had originally tagged TDS as dark ambient.

I consider modern industrial to fall into bands like Leaetherstrip, NIN, FLA,
Cubanate, Chemlab, Spahn Ranch, F242, Coil, etc. Maybe that's why we discuss
these bands in RMI? However there is a.m.nin, so NIN shouldn't be discussed
here...

michael taylor

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
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Trent
>on the other hand is not such a good singer. He is like the
>Bob Dylan of industrial music. Great song writer but god
>what an ugly voice and no range. Oh well he wouldn't have
>anyone else sing them because of his ego right?
>
>
>-Joe Frank-


To the Readers of R.M.I

Just to be fair, I actually borrowed a copy of TDS. I approached the
album neutrally, and the album did have its moments, but in all
honesty, I laughed out loud when I listened to parts of the album.

my personal favorites include

1. "I am a big man(yes I am)
and I have a big gun
got me a big old dick
i like to have fun"

jesus, I have not heard this kind of lyrical genius, since I bought
Latoya Jackson's album. It reminds me a bit of Iggy Pop, but Iggy makes
it somehow entertaining. Imagine how much better TDS would have been if
Iggy did the vocals "now I wanna be your reptile". (sorry just an
entertaining thought)

2. "I want to know everything
I want to be everywhere
I want to fuck everyone in the world
I want to do something that matters"

Trent..Trent...Trent, you are really sinking to the level of
highschool. I used to have to wash crap like this off desks. It is bad
enough when the remedial students express themselves in this manner,
but lyrics like this are not becomming of a man with a IQ of "140".

3. "how did you get so big
how did you get so strong
how did you get so hard
how did it get so long"

Genetics trent, genetics trent, also I have learned the art of the
Tantric Orgasm.

4. "your God is dead, and no one cares
if there is a hell, I will see you there"

gee trent...if you keep this up you will get banned in walmart. in the
year 1994, it takes a lot more to be shocking. Trent the only problem
with your formula is that it is too obvious, it actually makes me laugh
when I listen to your music.

Dear Joe
Trent reznor is bob dylan, cause they both suck. Dylan is a boring old
hippie that needs to be put out of his misery. trent is a young poseur
that needs to be put into misery. fuck it, I am just going to put on
mission of dead souls and try to forget about it.

are you ready, we need some discipline in here
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA


Mark Beeson

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to
michael taylor (chr...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
// Trent reznor is bob dylan, cause they both suck. Dylan is a boring old
// hippie that needs to be put out of his misery. trent is a young poseur
// that needs to be put into misery. fuck it, I am just going to put on
// mission of dead souls and try to forget about it.

Bob Dylan is Better Than You, Mike.

--Mark
--
Mark Beeson http://www.nin.com http://www.smg.org

I read the following newsgroups: alt.humor.best-of-usenet, az.internet,
az.general, clari.apbl.briefs, rec.music.industrial, alt.fan.chris-randall,
alt.music.nin, and on occasion alt.tv.bh90210. If you don't understand why,
don't ask.

michael taylor

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to
>
>Bob Dylan is Better Than You, Mike.

perhaps, but on the same token, the new kids on the block can twist
your cap back<G>

oh oh ahh oh oh, mark's got the right stuff, cause he is a hippie
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA

Christine Bomke

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to
From on high, ma...@nin.com (Mark Beeson) speaketh:

>Bob Dylan is Better Than You, Mike.

Fuck, Bob Dylan is Better Than Me. (or was that Chris Randall? Hmm...
ibuprofen and insomnia do not bode well with my long-term memory.)

Anyway, I can see where this thread is going, and if you all don't mind having
another "WHAT KMFDM REALLY MEANS ! ! !" -like thread on your hands with this,
by all means, keep 'dem responses coming. No pity for the majority of rmi who
read their news offline, and all that.

Christine

-+- ci...@cts.com http://www2.connectnet.com/users/saljames/circe/ -+-
-+- this space for rent. cheap. i'm out of .sigfile inspiration. -+-
-+- email me for a copy of the black metal box FAQ -+-

michael taylor

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to

>
>Anyway, I can see where this thread is going, and if you all don't
mind having
>another "WHAT KMFDM REALLY MEANS ! ! !" -like thread on your hands
with this,
>by all means, keep 'dem responses coming. No pity for the majority of
rmi who
>read their news offline, and all that.
>
>Christine

Hey Christine

I hear that KMFDM stands for Karl Marx Found Dead Masterbating, en ecsh
told me so himself, this was the night that me, genesis, bill the cat,
and En went out to the city club.

Michael Taylor
Detroit USA


Mark Beeson

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to
michael taylor (chr...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
// >Bob Dylan is Better Than You, Mike.
// perhaps, but on the same token, the new kids on the block can twist
// your cap back<G>
// oh oh ahh oh oh, mark's got the right stuff, cause he is a hippie

By your logic, that would make you a 13-year-old girl with braces,
and zits all over her face that emptied a can of hairspray into her
hair every morning.

--Mark
--this is just too easy

"Jesus built my snowboard."
Contributed by Christine Bromke (hi Christine!)

downfall

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to

On Tue, 6 Feb 1996, Philip Varner wrote:

> In article <Pine.OSF.3.91.960205...@oak.cats.ohiou.edu>, downfall <ew20...@oak.cats.ohiou.edu> wrote:
>
> >ahh, you obviously know not praying mantis, as it teaches one how to
> >defend thy fish net stockings and the nose when battling cagey veterns
> >such as bowie.
>
> What about the hair? Bowie could definatly get a handfull of that hair Trent
> has and yank and yank till submission.

i think that trent would actually enjoy this treatment. *grin*

> I still think Bowie would win. Besides,
> Bowie also has a horde of evil goblins and trolls on his side vs. Trents
> gradeschool munchkins and their jean jackets and NIN backpatches.

we all know that bowie's trolls and goblins were only fiction. . . in
real life trent is a master of the darkness and spends his spare time
training demons and goblins and widgets the art of praying mantis. . .er
and the tango.


-downfall

downfall

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to

On 6 Feb 1996, michael taylor wrote:

> To the Readers of R.M.I
>
> Just to be fair, I actually borrowed a copy of TDS. I approached the
> album neutrally, and the album did have its moments, but in all

so, let me get this straight, you were criticizing a work without ever
having listened to it? hm. brilliant.

> honesty, I laughed out loud when I listened to parts of the album.
>
> my personal favorites include
>
> 1. "I am a big man(yes I am)
> and I have a big gun
> got me a big old dick
> i like to have fun"

you know, humor is what he was aiming for. he was satirizing gangsta
rap.

> jesus, I have not heard this kind of lyrical genius, since I bought

> it somehow entertaining. Imagine how much better TDS would have been if
> Iggy did the vocals "now I wanna be your reptile". (sorry just an
> entertaining thought)

not very.

> 3. "how did you get so big
> how did you get so strong
> how did you get so hard
> how did it get so long"
>
> Genetics trent, genetics trent, also I have learned the art of the
> Tantric Orgasm.

i think he was talking about the night.


> 4. "your God is dead, and no one cares
> if there is a hell, I will see you there"
>
> gee trent...if you keep this up you will get banned in walmart. in the
> year 1994, it takes a lot more to be shocking. Trent the only problem
> with your formula is that it is too obvious, it actually makes me laugh
> when I listen to your music.

he was representing a part of tds' concept. part of the story, that part
is, gasp, thowing away of religious dogma that the character no longer
needed.

-downfall

Neil Whitlock

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Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to
chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) wrote:


>PS I got "rock star" from the last issue of spin. I love the part where
>trent says that he was intimidated by Bowie "I felt like I had to
>impress him". "He was reading poetry, and Discussing German art films"
>Poor trent, David Bowie would not stroke trent's ego, it must really be
>awful when someone will not drop everything to worship at the altar of
>Reznor.

I think you are blowing things a little out of proportion. Im not the
biggest NIN fan in the world but I think that Reznor was simply laying
out how he felt about the situation. Bowie is a big name and it is
tough when you work with someone that you have looked up to for so
long. You are right that Reznor lacks something that Bowie has but
Bowie's career spands many years and Reznor has only been around in
the mainstream for a fraction of that time. A lot of the negative
comments I have heard about NIN seem to stem from the fact that they
think Trent Reznor is a "rock star" with a bad attitude. From the
interviews I have read with him, he seems to be a withdrawn man with
some problems and has found an outlet to express them. That may have
turned into commercial success for him and I think he is dealing with
it quite well. He is very young considering and it will be
interesting to see what will happen to Trent Reznor's career in the
next 5-10 years.


Inert

unread,
Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to

> uhhh...according to Bowie and Brian Eno, Outside was written
>without the involvement of controlled substances. besides, Bowie might
>not be able to pretend he is sad, or do the "pain" dance, but at least
>he plays with a live band. when I mean "live", I mean having real
>musicians, not just pretty guys in leather trowsers, triggering samples
>and playing two simple riffs on guitar. Reeves Gabriels or Carlos
>Alomar could play circles around robin finch, but then again Reeves and
>Carlos are not as "cute" as robin.
> All in all, I would rather see an artist working with a great
>band, than a "Rock star" and his pretty band. Bowie might not be 30
>anymore, but he still hasn't lost the touch. A touch that Trent never
>had.

>someone who knew who trent was before the first Lollapalooza
>(and thought he was shit even then)
>Michael Taylor
>Detroit USA

>PS I got "rock star" from the last issue of spin. I love the part where
>trent says that he was intimidated by Bowie "I felt like I had to
>impress him". "He was reading poetry, and Discussing German art films"
>Poor trent, David Bowie would not stroke trent's ego, it must really be
>awful when someone will not drop everything to worship at the altar of
>Reznor.


David Bowie is every bit the "Rockstar" that Trent is. They both
happen to have talent. I don't like the self pitty that both of them
tend to dwell on... Come on guys is it all that bad??? not that
we should pretend everything in the world is fine I just don't
get into the self centered crap that much anymore, but this is
how I feel. Does anyone else think the song "Poor Boy" is about
Bowie? or is this my imagination? I don't know... the poor boy
singing is soooo fine, it's the words I can do without. Trent

Philip Varner

unread,
Feb 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/6/96
to

>ahh, you obviously know not praying mantis, as it teaches one how to
>defend thy fish net stockings and the nose when battling cagey veterns
>such as bowie.

What about the hair? Bowie could definatly get a handfull of that hair Trent

has and yank and yank till submission. I still think Bowie would win. Besides,

Bowie also has a horde of evil goblins and trolls on his side vs. Trents
gradeschool munchkins and their jean jackets and NIN backpatches.

They would make good food for the trolls.

Robb Cunningham

unread,
Feb 7, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/7/96
to
(for some reason I find myself posting to this pointless thread.... oh
well).

t...@one.net (Chris Lynch) wrote:
>>NIN fans are interesting. First, when I said dark ambient, I mean that
>>he included more textures in TDS, I have an old interview with Trent
>>where he states""it'll (tds) also be more AMBIENT, and minimalist"
>>(Propaganda #20, page 20).
>>

OK for starters -
ANYONE who says that NIN fits into "dark ambient" music is a true fucking
idiot. I don't care what Trent says, you are trying to put the guy down
anyway, so why do you listen to what he says? In the original post you
said that TDS was a dark ambient album, not "it went in a more ambient
direction." Nice try to cover it up, though. In the same post you also
stated that Trent never does anything that hasn't been popular for a
year. Dark ambient TRENDY?!?!? on what planet????

Before you prove to us just how much more idiocy can spew from your
finger tips, go out and buy Lustmord - The Place Where Black Stars Hang.

Second of all, what you said simply didn't make sense. Let me quote it
again for reference:

>>NIN fans are interesting. First, when I said dark ambient, I mean that
>>he included more textures in TDS,

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"more textures"....yeah wow that's the trendiest thing around today.
Let's look at the popular bands of today....Green Day - the kings of
adding textures and layers to their music. ummm Smashing Pumpkins -- oh
wow they have SO many textures in their music. Yeah and come to think of
it Ace of Base is the god of all textured music.

Please make me laugh no longer....

>>I have an old interview with Trent
>>where he states""it'll (tds) also be more AMBIENT, and minimalist"

^^^^^^^^^^
you just said he added more textures....? can't you even keep up the
SAME bullshit arguement for a couple of lines?

>>trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
>>moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
>>concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
>>listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
>>concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
>>something other then Industrial music.

.....*YAWN*.....industrial has evolved.....DEAL WITH IT.....

disclaimer: before you send in the "you trendy NIN fuck" flames....I do
NOT consider myself a "NIN fan", I consider him to be "OK", but I could
probably think of 60 bands I'd rather listen to. I really don't give a
fuck what people say about NIN, I am merely trying to point out the
stupidity, hypocrisy, and contradictiveness of the above article. So
could you kindly point all flames in the direction of WHAT I SAID, rather
than the fact that it is NIN-related. (although your ability to make a
straight-forward argument is questionable).

--
ذد à،

Nothing in a Box

unread,
Feb 7, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/7/96
to
chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) wrote:

> uhhh...according to Bowie and Brian Eno, Outside was written
>without the involvement of controlled substances. besides, Bowie might

What about that game they had to play? You know, the ones with the
cards. And Bowie had to rely on some Burroughs-like computer program
to mess around with his writings!

>not be able to pretend he is sad, or do the "pain" dance, but at least
>he plays with a live band. when I mean "live", I mean having real
>musicians, not just pretty guys in leather trowsers, triggering samples
>and playing two simple riffs on guitar. Reeves Gabriels or Carlos
>Alomar could play circles around robin finch, but then again Reeves and
>Carlos are not as "cute" as robin.

So, you're saying NIN is shit live, just because they trigger samples
and such? Yes, I admit that Reeves & Carlos are better at the guitar
than anyone NIN has worked with at any time (except for maybe Belew),
but don't go trashing NIN because of that. Robin is very good at
playing the guitar. Do you think Cirque du Soleil would hire a shitty
player? Besides, can anyone imagine Reeves being w/ NIN on a regular
tour? It just wouldn't work.

> All in all, I would rather see an artist working with a great
>band, than a "Rock star" and his pretty band. Bowie might not be 30
>anymore, but he still hasn't lost the touch. A touch that Trent never
>had.

Again, you're judging Trent just because of his "pretty" band. I
don't know about you, but Robin scares me. He's certainly not
"pretty."

>PS I got "rock star" from the last issue of spin. I love the part where
>trent says that he was intimidated by Bowie "I felt like I had to
>impress him". "He was reading poetry, and Discussing German art films"
>Poor trent, David Bowie would not stroke trent's ego, it must really be
>awful when someone will not drop everything to worship at the altar of
>Reznor.

That's bullshit! Read the magazine, you moron!

"...On the Bowie tour, his band hung out in our dressing room all the
time. They didn't want to sit around, reading poetry and talking
about fucking German art movies. They wanted to hang out."

And wouldn't you be intimidated if Bowie was in the same room as you?
I sure as hell would, but that's just me.

So, in the end, they're both good artists. Bowie influenced Trent,
and, IMHO, Trent has influenced Bowie to an extent. If you don't like
either one, fine. Just don't go around making up bullshit stories, or
claiming a live bands sucks just because they're "pretty" or try to
bring sounds into the song that're impossible for a human to do.

AHS's #1 Slave, D.R.
good boy/gone bad/so sorry/so sad -filter
www.abol.com/users/droark

Robb Cunningham

unread,
Feb 7, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/7/96
to

SAME bullshit argument for a couple of lines?

>>trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
>>moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
>>concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
>>listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
>>concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
>>something other then Industrial music.

.....*YAWN*.....industrial has evolved.....DEAL WITH IT.....

disclaimer: before you send in the "you trendy NIN fuck" flames....I do
NOT consider myself a "NIN fan", I consider him to be "OK", but I could

probably think of 60 bands I'd rather listen to off the top of my head.

I really don't give a fuck what people say about NIN, I am merely trying
to point out the stupidity, hypocrisy, and contradictiveness of the above
article. So could you kindly point all flames in the direction of WHAT I
SAID, rather than the fact that it is NIN-related. (although your
ability to make a straight-forward argument is questionable)

--
ذد à،

Mulaki Sambo

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to
COOL DUDE wrote:

>
> sea...@efn.org (Sean Da Great) wrote:
>
> >
> >there, how ya like that? I like NIN, and i walked out on bowie after the
> >NIN show because, well, i fucking hate bowie. he has the shittiest voice
> >out of ANYONE in the ENTIRE music industry!! (with the exception of alanis
> >morrisette)..
> >i cant stand people like you, who hate music because its trendy. thats no
> >reason to hate a certain band.
>
> Now you see, this guy is cool! i bet he even hangs at the mall!
>
> COOL DUDE


KEWL!!!! DEWD!!! K-RAD!!! WHERE ARE THE WAREZ? 127.0.0.1


RAWK ON!!


-blub

GodClod

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to
>i cant stand people like you, who hate music because its trendy. thats no
>reason to hate a certain band.

Try this one out:
Trent has ripped off too many people in the industry to "sell out"...he whores
himself out by taking credit for what other artists have been doing for many
years prior to NIN...
He whines and acts depressed about life... *yawn* ....
Talk about not being able to sing? come on...you are comparing Bowie to TR?
How old are you? obviously too young to know that this is Bowie's third decade
of making music...and your false god, trent, pays such a huge tribute to
Bowie...Why?
Because Bowie is the shit...
Too bad you are too young to know...now go change your underoos...


GodClod


downfall

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to

On Sun, 4 Feb 1996, Sean Da Great wrote:

> > trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
> > moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
> > concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
> > listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
> > concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
> > something other then Industrial music.
> >
>

> writes for the charts?? not quite.. prety hate machine and broken were
> not popular at ALL until tds came out.. broken?? ha , yah that album did
> just GREAT! it sold about 3 copies, until TDS came around

actually broken hit the charts at number 7. tds hit at number 2. so, in
a way, the popularity of broken helped tds sales. that and a little song
called "closer" in which there is a lot more than just "i wanna fuck you
like an animal" you just have to listen to it.

-downfall

Kathleen Tibbetts

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to
chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) writes:

>but you have to admit Bowie is pushing the envelope.

True. _1.Outside_ is an awesome, difficult album. Some people find it
pretentious. Hell, some people thought _Diamond Dogs_ was pretentious,
for that matter.

> Trent will not move in a direction, unless it has been hip for at

> least a year. AKA, synth pop when Depech Mode did Violator....

Interesting assertion. Pretty Hate Machine came out a few months BEFORE
Violator. Whatever PHM may be derivative of, it's probably not that.

If you've gotta bash someone, ANYone, at least check your data first.
The cruel truth is that you can't be right if your facts are wrong. But
thanks for playing. -- KT

Mark A. Pitcher

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to
Kathleen Tibbetts (ktib...@post.cis.smu.edu) wrote:

: chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) writes:

: >but you have to admit Bowie is pushing the envelope.

: True. _1.Outside_ is an awesome, difficult album. Some people find it
: pretentious. Hell, some people thought _Diamond Dogs_ was pretentious,
: for that matter.

: > Trent will not move in a direction, unless it has been hip for at
: > least a year. AKA, synth pop when Depech Mode did Violator....

Nobody did anything like TDS until Reznor did it.


--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Mark A. Pitcher | http://www.waterloo.net/~mark
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"GUH!" - Bill Leeb

michael taylor

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to
In <277cc$c2c1...@luzskru.cpcnet.com> dro...@naxs.com (Nothing in a

Box) writes:
>
>chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) wrote:
>
>> uhhh...according to Bowie and Brian Eno, Outside was written
>>without the involvement of controlled substances. besides, Bowie
might
>
>What about that game they had to play? You know, the ones with the
>cards. And Bowie had to rely on some Burroughs-like computer program
>to mess around with his writings!

Dorak? "controlled substances" are Drugs, I don't understand how you
got eno's production technique's confused with drugs, I hope you don't
try to get high by listening to Eno solo records <G>(an interesting
concept though)

Deadly serious as usual
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA

PS it is so easy to piss you nin fans off, take it easy, it is just
music.

Christina M Hamilton

unread,
Feb 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/8/96
to
In article <4eprdo$s...@ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>,
michael taylor <chr...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>Hello all
>

Stuff deleted

> The final thing I Dislike about Trent Reznor, he is a rock star.
>Trent thinks that wrecking hotel rooms, and giving groupies enemas is a
>good time. Bowie is trying to create art, he is striving to make better
>music. Bowie is trying to capture the moment, this alienates people,
>because he is about 20 years ahead of his time. When you listen to Low,
>you have to admit for when the record was released(January 9th or 19th,
>1977, if I am not mistaken), was the most futuristic thing out there.
>Trent, Joy Division, Robert Smith, Kraftwerk, they all name check him
>as an influence. Trent is a rock star, Bowie is an artist.
>
>if I pissed you off I am sorry, but time will prove me right.
>Michael Taylor
>Detroit USA
>


I completely agree with you. Bowie has always been ahead of his time.
For example, several years back I taped Teargarden's "Tired Eyes Slowly
Burning" and threw in a bit of Bowie (the one where he talks about
spiders and glass eyes, something like that - forgive my ignorance). In
my opinion, there was no abrupt change - the two just flowed together.

Sorry this is not a very industrial oriented comment.

later

--
*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^
Christina Hamilton Keeper of the Septimus
"Cracking toast, Grommit!"

Shaken Angel

unread,
Feb 9, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/9/96
to
In article <sean_h-0402...@dynip69.efn.org>, sea...@efn.org (Sean Da Great) writes:
>> trent writes for the pop charts, and Guitar rock was selling at the
>> moment. Broken was just a rock album, plain and simple. As far as I am
>> concerned, all of the above mentioned bands are not industrial. I
>> listen to Second Annual Report and wonder how the hell they is
>> concidered Industrial. I don't hate Chemlab, I just think that it is
>> something other then Industrial music.
>>
>
> writes for the charts?? not quite.. prety hate machine and broken were
> not popular at ALL until tds came out.. broken?? ha , yah that album did
> just GREAT! it sold about 3 copies, until TDS came around


Uh. PHM became really popular in the college crowd, post-Lollapalooza; I know,
I heard it back in 1991 at a party held by people about as industrial as Jimmy
Buffett. Broken was even more popular, and remember, it was voted "Best Heavy
Metal Album" at the Grammys, whatever year it came out.

TDS had, I think, little to do with the two older releases' popularity.

-- sa / a
"i hate every nun"

Philip Varner

unread,
Feb 9, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/9/96
to
In article <sean_h-0402...@dynip69.efn.org>, sea...@efn.org (Sean Da Great) wrote:

>writes for the charts?? not quite.. prety hate machine and broken were
>not popular at ALL until tds came out.. broken?? ha , yah that album did
>just GREAT! it sold about 3 copies, until TDS came around

What rock have you been living under for the past 5 years?

PHM and Broken not popular till TDS came out. Thats a great one. Heh.

My grandma bought PHM a three months after it came out because it got so much
publicity.

Inert

unread,
Feb 11, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/11/96
to


Sure both Bowie and Reznor are pretentious as hell.
They are also two of my favorite artists. Not for the
lyical content but for the music. They also have had some
great producers such as Flood for Trent and Eno and
for the David's "Outside". Eno doesn't sing much anymore
therefore there is less chance of him being pretentious.
I think brian Eno is making an effort to not be pretentious
for which he should be commended!

-Joe Frank-

michael taylor

unread,
Feb 11, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/11/96
to
In <4fjpjf$e...@news.cais.com> ine...@cais.com (Inert) writes:
>
>
>Sure both Bowie and Reznor are pretentious as hell.
>They are also two of my favorite artists. Not for the
>lyical content but for the music. They also have had some
>great producers such as Flood for Trent and Eno and
>for the David's "Outside". Eno doesn't sing much anymore
>therefore there is less chance of him being pretentious.
>I think brian Eno is making an effort to not be pretentious
>for which he should be commended!
>
>-Joe Frank-
>
>

You don't read too many Brian Eno interviews, he is still the icy
intellectual we have come to know and love. It is a shame that Eno does
not sing too much anymore, Spinning Away has some of the best vocals I
have heard in a long while.

Sincerly yours
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA


PS What's wrong with pretention? Pretention can be quite attractive,
you just need the style to pull it off.<G>

phoe...@applewize.com

unread,
Feb 12, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/12/96
to

SC>Try this one out:
SC>Trent has ripped off too many people in the industry to "sell out"...he whor
SC>himself out by taking credit for what other artists have been doing for many
SC>years prior to NIN...

Umm, no. Trent Reznor actually knows what original MUSIC is. Yes, he's
ripped off sounds, but he's done the music better with that sound.

SC>He whines and acts depressed about life... *yawn* ....

This is true.

phoenix.hawk

--

Remember the Censors of the internet, in the November Elections..
Telnet/Finger: applewize.com


michael taylor

unread,
Feb 12, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/12/96
to

>Umm, no. Trent Reznor actually knows what original MUSIC is. Yes,
he's
>ripped off sounds, but he's done the music better with that sound.

I think thats a bit like the Beatles Vs Oasis. "Ya know, Oasis knows
what original music is, they just sound like the Beatles"

I guess I'm old school, I think if someone did something before you
did, then you are not original. (am I way out of line here?)


activate the flash, heaven awaits
Michael Taylor
Detroit USA

GodClod

unread,
Feb 12, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/12/96
to
> (am I way out of line here?)

show me that line...i'll be glad to cross it...seems immaginary...

GodClod


March A. Briner

unread,
Feb 14, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/14/96
to
In article <4ft60s$k...@ixnews2.ix.netcom.com> chr...@ix.netcom.com(michael taylor ) writes:
>
> What I meant was that the instrumental sounds were borrowed from Mr.
>Bowie. I am sick of this thread, and after this post I am not going to
>reply to it anymore.

Somewhere in the frist two paragraphs of the Trent Reznor interview in
the February 1996 SPIN magazine, he says where he got the "opening beats"
for Closer. I can't recall exactly where that was from, though...

Sir Marc


michael taylor

unread,
Feb 14, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/14/96
to

>I'm just curious... industrial bands in general "borrow" from one a
>To claim that NIN ripped off industrial music that other people had
been doing
>for years... hmm... gee, isn't that half the fucking industry? The
only
>part I don't get, however, is that I don't quite get who he ripped his
sound
>off of. Explain it to me, because I sure as hell can't think of any
band that
>sounds like NIN.

>
>
>
>[--------------------------------------------------------]
>[ ]
>[ "The greatest trick that the devil ever pulled, ]
>[ was convincing the world he didn't exist." ]
>[ -The Usual Suspects ]
>[--------------------------------------------------------]

Good movie.

What I meant was that the instrumental sounds were borrowed from Mr.
Bowie. I am sick of this thread, and after this post I am not going to
reply to it anymore.

Michael Taylor
Detroit USA

Chris Lynch

unread,
Feb 14, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/14/96
to
In article <4fmui0$1...@reader2.ix.netcom.com>,

chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) wrote:
>
>>Umm, no. Trent Reznor actually knows what original MUSIC is. Yes,
>he's
>>ripped off sounds, but he's done the music better with that sound.
>
>I think thats a bit like the Beatles Vs Oasis. "Ya know, Oasis knows
>what original music is, they just sound like the Beatles"
>
>I guess I'm old school, I think if someone did something before you
>did, then you are not original. (am I way out of line here?)


I'm just curious... industrial bands in general "borrow" from one another, and
that's just how it works right now. However, industrial bands that do not
sound like other bands can be labelled unique because they have created their
own identity. At least, I think so...

To claim that NIN ripped off industrial music that other people had been doing
for years... hmm... gee, isn't that half the fucking industry? The only
part I don't get, however, is that I don't quite get who he ripped his sound
off of. Explain it to me, because I sure as hell can't think of any band that
sounds like NIN.

Influences are another story... having influence from a band is pretty much
what every band around today has built upon. Otherwise music wouldn't evolve.
The problem is, however when a band sounds or clones the band who has
influenced it. NIN may have influences, but they certainly do not sound like
any of those bands.

I just think it's funny to hear people say that NIN ripped off other
industrial bands, because there's no one who sounds like NIN. So who the hell
are they imitating?

Just because you don't like NIN doesn't mean that they are clones or
unoriginal.

Please don't write back labelling me a Ninnie... I like NIN, but I am not a
fucking freak. I just can't understand labelling NIN as unoriginal or "just
like band X."

C

[--------------------------------------------------------]
[ Chris Lynch ]
[ President ]
[ Apex, Ltd. ]

michael taylor

unread,
Feb 15, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/15/96
to
I
>Somewhere in the frist two paragraphs of the Trent Reznor interview in

>the February 1996 SPIN magazine, he says where he got the "opening
beats"
>for Closer. I can't recall exactly where that was from, though...
>
> Sir Marc
>

the album is called "The Idiot" it is by Iggy Pop, its a good album.
The track is called "night Clubbin" he sampled the kick drum sound.

I wish Trent would have sampled his stuff with the Stooges, I think I
would actually get into I Wanna Be Your Dog, with a 909 kick.<G>

Michael Taylor
Detroit USA

PS "ause now I wanna fuck you like a dog"
Now thats punk <G>


GodClod

unread,
Feb 15, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/15/96
to
>Influences are another story...

Look at Ogre and his style (esp. appearance)...then listen to some old Puppy
and Ministry ("Dig It", "Stigmata")...re-evaluate your stance...He bagged parts
of many artists and then packeaged them as "Trent"...so obvious...

Good or not, just isn't orignal...

GodClod


Chris Lynch

unread,
Feb 16, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/16/96
to
In article <DMtwz...@midway.uchicago.edu>,


Yeah, and it sounds like none of those to me... hmm, so simply because NIN is
popular, he deductively ripped everyone else off to sell records.

Don't think so... but that's just my opinion.

That's a funny claim that you make though, because a lot of bands (esp.
industrial of the modern sense) seem to do a lot of what you are claiming NIN
did. The only difference is that I can say who those bands are ripping off.

NIN doesn't sound even remotely similar to old Skinny Puppy or Ministry in ANY
WAY, IMHO. Especially not Dig It or Stigmata!

Oh well, we just disagree.

Chris

SkimLizard

unread,
Feb 17, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/17/96
to
GodClod wrote:
>>OR the Pigface song "Suck" that NIN claimed as their own

if you look closely, you'll see that trent is credited for the minimalist
"suck" on pigface's "gub" album.

from what i read in AP (or B-Side or something) after trent's stint with
pigface tvt pulled some legal contract shit to keep trent from recording
anything for anyone but tvt.

shortly after he did record the nin version of "suck" for nin's "broken"
ep, but if you listen to any pigface albums after "gub" or go to any
pigface shows, the version of "suck" they play is not the minimalist one
that was recorded on "gub" but trent's nin-ized version. so who's ripping
off who? i don't hear pigface/ martin atkins complaining. i mean jesus,
they're recording HIS version (and more than once).

i also remember some cryptic mention of trent in the liner notes of one of
the later pigface albums, but i'd have to dig it up to check out what it
really says.

besides, meat beat manifesto sampled ministry, consolidated sampled mbm,
fla samples michael douglas films and everyone else, laibach does beatles
and queen songs, etc etc etc.

just commenting,
-skimlizard

Homey G

unread,
Feb 18, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/18/96
to
chr...@ix.netcom.com (michael taylor ) wrote:

>In <4etd7r$h...@ophelia.waterloo.net> ma...@ophelia.waterloo.net (Mark A.
>Pitcher) writes:
>>
>>Moron (mo...@islandnet.com) wrote:
>>: That's one kickboxing match I'd pay to see! $5 bux on Bowie. Any
>takers?
>>
>> You're on. Bowie's too old. No amount of coke is going to give
>him
>>the energy to take on someone like Reznor.

>>
> uhhh...according to Bowie and Brian Eno, Outside was written
>without the involvement of controlled substances. besides, Bowie might

>not be able to pretend he is sad, or do the "pain" dance, but at least
>he plays with a live band. when I mean "live", I mean having real
>musicians, not just pretty guys in leather trowsers, triggering samples
>and playing two simple riffs on guitar. Reeves Gabriels or Carlos
>Alomar could play circles around robin finch, but then again Reeves and
>Carlos are not as "cute" as robin.

> All in all, I would rather see an artist working with a great
>band, than a "Rock star" and his pretty band. Bowie might not be 30
>anymore, but he still hasn't lost the touch. A touch that Trent never
>had.

>someone who knew who trent was before the first Lollapalooza
>(and thought he was shit even then)
>Michael Taylor
>Detroit USA


>PS I got "rock star" from the last issue of spin. I love the part where
>trent says that he was intimidated by Bowie "I felt like I had to
>impress him". "He was reading poetry, and Discussing German art films"
>Poor trent, David Bowie would not stroke trent's ego, it must really be
>awful when someone will not drop everything to worship at the altar of
>Reznor.

Why is everyone out to get Trent Reznor now? A couple of years ago NIN was one of the best
industrial bands acording to you people, but now he is a dick. Why do you people seem to think that
becoming popular is such a bad thing. In a year or two, all the popular fucks that think ti was cool
to like NIN will be on their next favorite band.
I think that we all know that the next album will be drastically diferent, so be ready for it. I
comend you if you never liked NIN in the first place, but I am really sick of the people that seem
to like bands only when they aren't known.

Andrew Clegg

unread,
Feb 18, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/18/96
to
In article <4g13l1$e...@news.one.net>, Chris Lynch <t...@one.net> writes

>NIN doesn't sound even remotely similar to old Skinny Puppy or Ministry in ANY
>WAY, IMHO. Especially not Dig It or Stigmata!

Terrible Lie reminds me of Dig It a bit, also Down In Is is kind of like
Dig It sped up.

Andrew.

"What's the matter, Eddie, does it frighten you?"
"Frighten me? No, Frank, I think 'startle' is a better word."

NP: Bodychoke -- Hook [Mindshaft]

Shaken Angel

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Feb 19, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/19/96
to
In article <DMtx6...@midway.uchicago.edu>, GodClod <sco...@midway.uchicago.edu> writes:
> P.S. I remember seeing NIN tour right after "Too Dark Park", a good friend was
> drumming for them (Abner)...During a song he used a sample right off if "Shore
> Lined Poison" (the acid trip part at the end: "Oh Wow...Orange...something or
> other")...
> BTW, if he is so fucking orignal, why does he parade "Suck" as a NIN song, when
> in fact it is a PigFace song?
>
> GodClod
>

Eh, probably because he wrote it. Although he wrote it *as* a member of Pigface,
so it is ektually a Pigface song.

Now, if he parades "Physical" (or whatever it's called) as a NIN song, then he
deserves to be beaten about the head and neck.

-- sa / adder

GodClod

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Feb 19, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/19/96
to
>>Now, if he parades "Physical" (or whatever it's called) as a NIN song, then
he
>>deserves to be beaten about the head and neck.

>>then he
>>deserves to be beaten about the head and neck.

he deserves to be beaten about the head and neck

Agreed...

GodClod
Twisting and turning...


Andrew Clegg

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Feb 19, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/19/96
to
In article <DMvwv...@midway.uchicago.edu>, GodClod
<sco...@midway.uchicago.edu> writes

>OR the Pigface song "Suck" that NIN claimed as
>their own...even played it at Woodstock...THOSE ARE FACTS!

(a) As I'm sure you know, Trent co-wrote the original. (b) The version
NIN play is entirely written by Trent. The original had four parts --
vocals, drums, bass and camera, and in the NIN version only the vocals
survive (and even they are changed slightly).

I don't see how Martin Atkins or anyone in Pigface can have any claim
over the NIN version of Suck, but I think it's an academic point as the
Pigface live version (the guitar-ish one, not the sitar-ish one) is
better anyway.

Andrew.

"What's the matter, Eddie, does it frighten you?"
"Frighten me? No, Frank, I think 'startle' is a better word."

NP: Bodychoke -- Shallow [Mindshaft]

GodClod

unread,
Feb 20, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/20/96
to
>I don't see how Martin Atkins or anyone in Pigface can have any claim
>over the NIN version of Suck...

It has something to do with copywriting it...you know, publishing rights?!!
TR can sing and change and whine all he wants...BUT what he doesn't do (and
should) is throw a bone to Pigface...it is rightfully theirs...

GodClod


downfall

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Feb 21, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/21/96
to

On Fri, 16 Feb 1996, GodClod wrote:

> >NIN doesn't sound even remotely similar to old Skinny Puppy...
>
> You must know something TR doesn't...HE even claims to have ripped off "Dig
> It"...popularity has nothing to do with it...I remember when Trent and Richard
> rolled through here...Trent played with Pigface...Alas, who else was there?
> Check the liner notes to "Gub"...It's funny too, you never commented on the
> ripped-off Puppy sample from "Shore Lined Poison" NIN played live (right after
> "Too Dark Park" was released)

oh migawd! trent sampled a piece of music LIVE! please.
but as for nin coming from land of rape and honey. . . well, that i will
give into. nin and a ton of industrial rawk that's come our way
recently. that albums spawned a ton of stuff. not just nin.

> ...OR the Pigface song "Suck" that NIN claimed as


> their own...even played it at Woodstock...THOSE ARE FACTS!

> Happy to oblige your opinion, but *zap*...please enter more coins...

godclod, open your ears. the nin version of suck is a major rewrite of
trent's (you know, the guy who was nin until he officially took up a
band) version with pigface. martin's stated time and time again that
trent came up with suck by himself, and just credits pigface, or martin
or whatever with writing it. in fact, i thought one set of pigface
credits for suck said "whatever trent says." also, isn't it kinda hard
to call a song he wrote "a rip off?" hm. sorry, but *zap*...please enter
more coins...

-downfall

SkimLizard

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Feb 21, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/21/96
to

Like I said earlier, I don't know why this is an issue at all. I haven't
heard Martin or anyone else from Pigface complaining about trent's use of
a song he wrote (correct me if I'm wrong). He hasn't recorded with them
since gub (1990 release, if i recmember correctly), but I do agreee that
he could at least give pigface a plug sometime.

-skimlizard

GodClod

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Feb 21, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/21/96
to
> in fact, i thought one set of pigface credits for suck said "whatever trent
> says."

obviously missed Martin's sarcasm...
ring that extra to play to matching 00...

GC


GodClod

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Feb 21, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/21/96
to
>I haven't heard Martin or anyone else from Pigface complaining...

I have...Point is:


>but I do agreee that
>he could at least give pigface a plug sometime.

exactly...

GC


Chris Lynch

unread,
Feb 22, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/22/96
to
In article <DMvwv...@midway.uchicago.edu>,

GodClod <sco...@midway.uchicago.edu> wrote:
>>NIN doesn't sound even remotely similar to old Skinny Puppy...
>
>You must know something TR doesn't...HE even claims to have ripped off "Dig
>It"...popularity has nothing to do with it...I remember when Trent and
Richard
>rolled through here...Trent played with Pigface...Alas, who else was there?
>Check the liner notes to "Gub"...It's funny too, you never commented on the
>ripped-off Puppy sample from "Shore Lined Poison" NIN played live (right
after
>"Too Dark Park" was released)...OR the Pigface song "Suck" that NIN claimed
as
>their own...even played it at Woodstock...THOSE ARE FACTS!
>Happy to oblige your opinion, but *zap*...please enter more coins...

I'm just so bewildered by how NIN being influenced by a certain band or a song
is a rip off. Please type the exact statement where Trent said he "RIPPED
OFF" Dig It, because I can't find a Dig It song ripoff on Pretty Hate Machine,
or any NIN album.

Funny how sampling a song now is ripping it off... I seem to remember a post
from you about FLA's sampling not being ripping off, since we're talking about
industrial music. Hmmm, must be different cuz it's NIN and not FLA.

Happy to oblige your opinion and your other opinion, which just happen to
cause a serious paradox when looked at side-by-side.

I'm curious as to how NIN is cheating Pigface, or anyone else, for playing a
completely different version of the song live? I mean, it's not like he
didn't have anything to do with the Pigface version. A lot of bands do the
same thing...

tsw

downfall

unread,
Feb 22, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/22/96
to

On Tue, 20 Feb 1996, GodClod wrote:

> >I don't see how Martin Atkins or anyone in Pigface can have any claim
> >over the NIN version of Suck...
>
> It has something to do with copywriting it...you know, publishing rights?!!
> TR can sing and change and whine all he wants...BUT what he doesn't do (and
> should) is throw a bone to Pigface...it is rightfully theirs...


okay. . . just wondering, if trent wrote the damn thing, how could it be
somebody elses, especially when the nin version is sooo damn different.
also, to make you happy he just tossed atkins name on the credits of nin's
suck, though he really didn't do anything. he just played drums. the credits
reflect whatever trent wants. not atkins, and martin knows this, and has
stated it in an ap interview i read a long time ago.
and for some odd reason, nin's suck is published on leaving hope/tvt
music. hm?


-downfall

downfall

unread,
Feb 22, 1996, 3:00:00 AM2/22/96