VNV Nation no good IMO
JasonTroy
> Solitary:anyone else annoyed by the complete lack of
> cohesion between the pounding beat and sappily delivered vocals in the
> beginning of the track (this applies here, this is not TG). Honour(i
> think): it's fucking stupid how he sings "a-total-stranger"!; Examples
> of the cheap vibe I got from the album. ughhhh. THIS IS MY OPINION.
Your not alone. Thats exacly how i felt. Praise the Fallen just sounds
like bad Funker Vogt, Covenant, or Apoptygma Berzerk to me. (all of which
are quite awefull imo-if you like these bands thats cool, no hard feelings)
But you have to admit. The legions of fans they have aquired view them as
the greatest thing since......well....they probably like Covenant too. So
you have to give Vnv Nation credit for attracting attention to themselves
somehow. We both bought the albums thinking it would be great. So whos the
real loser? We are! They got some $.
Whats a real shame is that a band like VNV nation will get all sorts of
praise for their shitty drum programming and pathetic synth melodies (the
vocals were fine imo hehe go figure), when other bands like Heavy Water
Factory and Index with far greater creativity and complexity get little
attention at all. Its sad.
Take a song like "The Dove" off of Index's-Black Light Twilight. That one
song has more creativity then both VnV Nation albums combined imo. But 9
out of 10 rmi readers dont own that album for some reason.
Oh well. To each their own.
JasonTroy
JasonTroy
> Take a song like "The Dove" off of Index's-Black Light Twilight. That one
> song has more creativity then both VnV Nation albums combined imo. But 9
> out of 10 rmi readers dont own that album for some reason.
Add the track "Vesperal" to that! And the ambient piece Iconoclast! Damn
this Index cd im listening to is great! Very haujobbish at times.
JasonTroy
np: Index: "Black Light Twilight" (wow)
ma...@student.umass.edu
store before it actually came out commercially in the US. The monotony
and useless repetition of the album drove me to sell the thing. How
y'all could tolerate the mind-numbing repetitious techno beats for
minutes on end while the same god-damned chorus reiterates itself over'n
over leaves me confused about the tastes of rmi! Of course, the band
HAS SOMETHING TO SAY, as opposed to most others, but still... the
delivery of the lyrics is too damned pretentious; the delivery mocks the
emotion... the potential for some beautiful tracks is there, most
definitley. Solitary:anyone else annoyed by the complete lack of
cohesion between the pounding beat and sappily delivered vocals in the
beginning of the track (this applies here, this is not TG). Honour(i
think): it's fucking stupid how he sings "a-total-stranger"!; Examples
of the cheap vibe I got from the album. ughhhh. THIS IS MY OPINION.
--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==--
---Share what you know. Learn what you don't.---
Apparratus
did to me. It's a shame that some people cant accept the fact that others dont
like them.
np: pansonic 'vapina 2' b
® Zach Forbes - Doctor Polymer - CENTYL - z...@acpub.duke.edu
® INVEIN Records / Scythe & Limb Radio - http://www.invein.com
® www.interfacemagazine.com
® Senior Editor - Aural Fixation - http://www.aural-fixation.com
® Delayed:Invein 001 "Operational"
JasonTroy
> i sure hope that ronan gets on and flames you guys for disliking PTF like
he
> did to me. It's a shame that some people cant accept the fact that others
dont
> like them.
Ya i remember that. I was going to stick up for ya but lost track of that
thread after a while. Sorry!
VnV arent a total waste in my eyes. As i said, i actually "did" like the
vocals. I never really checked out the lyrics, but people say that they are
good too.
JasonTroy
Mr. Tangent
forced "JasonTroy" <nosa...@seatac.net> to write:
>Take a song like "The Dove" off of Index's-Black Light Twilight. That one
>song has more creativity then both VnV Nation albums combined imo. But 9
>out of 10 rmi readers dont own that album for some reason.
I do, but most of the "rappish" vocals completely ruin any potential
that "Black Light Twilight" has. For a similar feel, T.H.D.'s
"Outside In" is a much better and superb disk, imo (and doesn't have
the same vocals, thank dog!). T.H.D. have gotten some recent acclaim
with "Under a Statik Sky" and "Watz your program?" but "Outside In" is
a woefully under-appreciated disk. It has elements of Lassigue
Bendthaus and some other idm-flavored electro, but still has a fairly
original vibe. The only one that I don't recommend is "Mechanical
Disadvantage" which is basically a FLA clone. If you like FLA then
pick it up, but otherwise, stay away. I think Index has plenty of
potential - if he changes his vocal style. It just grates on my
nerves for some reason.
Covenant and VNV Nation are alright bands, but the thing I've said for
a couple years now is, "why do we need another Front 242"? Granted
they're not exactly like Front 242, but close enough to warrant the
statement (especially Covenant).
--
Mr. Tangent [the binary police]
no .sig, no design
JasonTroy
> >Take a song like "The Dove" off of Index's-Black Light Twilight. That
one
> >song has more creativity then both VnV Nation albums combined imo. But 9
> >out of 10 rmi readers dont own that album for some reason.
> I do, but most of the "rappish" vocals completely ruin any potential
> that "Black Light Twilight" has.
I think there is only one track like that. And ya its lame.
> For a similar feel, T.H.D.'s
> "Outside In" is a much better and superb disk, imo (and doesn't have
> the same vocals, thank dog!). T.H.D. have gotten some recent acclaim
> with "Under a Statik Sky" and "Watz your program?" but "Outside In" is
> a woefully under-appreciated disk.
The only T.H.D disk that did anything for me was "Under a Statik Sky".
Watz Your Program was ok, but tracks like Days Of Ahead are filled with
"getto" and "hip-hop" rythms that bug me. Tracks like Floating Corpse are
great though.
And ill have to give "Outside In" another spin (if i can find it, my
appartments a mess) before i can post judement on it.
> Covenant and VNV Nation are alright bands, but the thing I've said for
> a couple years now is, "why do we need another Front 242"? Granted
> they're not exactly like Front 242, but close enough to warrant the
> statement (especially Covenant).
Yup.
Has anyone posted a review of the new Wave Worker Foundation: In The
Whirlpool?
The online sound files show potential.
JasonTroy
benjers
Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in the
universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
JasonTroy
> Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
> Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in the
> universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
uh.....ya. I bet VnV nation are real glad to have fans like you.
"Cos" me and my gang are from da hood! An in da hood we be bumpin uglies to
da Vnv nation possie! Word up foo! You down whit it homie?
Something like that right?
And i thought my grammar sucked. Talk about a use for hooked-on-phonics.
(take the course......THEN come back to rmi and tell us why you liked Praise
the Fallen)
JasonTroy
nec...@visi.com
benjers <ben...@breathemail.net> wrote:
>Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
>Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in the
>universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
Suckas betta recognize!
--
neckro @ yuck.net <------> http://www.visi.com/~neckro/
previously unyielding but now compelled to bend [f242]
Dayv!
ma...@student.umass.edu announced that:
> Solitary:anyone else annoyed by the complete lack of
> cohesion between the pounding beat and sappily delivered vocals in the
> beginning of the track (this applies here, this is not TG).
You might prefer the EP version of Solitary if you have a chance to
hear it. The vocals and music mesh a lot more fluidly.
-Dayv!
"The flesh is weak, the asshole is strong, bitch."
Dayv!
appar...@aol.comeonbaby (Apparratus) announced that:
> i sure hope that ronan gets on and flames you guys for disliking PTF like he
> did to me. It's a shame that some people cant accept the fact that others dont
> like them.
IIRC, he didn't flame you for not liking his music, he made a
couple of corrections to factual errors in your post, such as what
equipment he uses and your labelling of him as a Britich nationalist.
Todd Clayton
>
> I was "lucky" enough to find a copy of Praise the Fallen at a used disc
> store before it actually came out commercially in the US. The monotony
> and useless repetition of the album drove me to sell the thing. How
<.. snip valid opinion ..>
Even though this was only posted 9 hours ago, I'm kinda suprised a Jihad
hasn't broken out over this. Is it possible (with the exception of
Benjers) that we're growing up? Naaah.
I disagree, and feel it's a very strong album, but to each his own.
--
+---------------------------+----------------------------+
| Todd Clayton aka DJ Todd | Real Synthetic Audio and |
| http://www.synthetic.org/ | Synthetic Saturdays at |
| http://www.djtodd.com/ | The Sanctuary. |
| djt...@djtodd.com | 732 Queen St. W, Toronto. |
+---------------------------+----------------------------+
Join the Real Synthetic Audio mailing list.
Email: synthetic...@listbot.com
Eschaton
the lyrics, and the melodies, while nothing special and mostly
arpegiated, do at least sound nice and 'bright'. On the other hand,
every track on the album sounds too close to each other. The beginnings
to solitary and honour for example...the first time I listened to the
album I checked the track listing just to check to see if I hadn't
pressed the rewing button. Basically, it sounds like they are doing
different versions of the same song on the whole album. The percussion
is pretty weak as well...I pretty much hate thud-thud drums anyway. The
non vocal songs are pretty weak as well, they sound like unfinished
ideas pretty much...good melodies, but no development. And they need to
use more than one string patch on an album. And the biggest problem is
in their poppy songs...half the song is unpoppy. I mean, they fall into
that pop-music trap where the chorus is extremely catchy, but they don't
fill the verse with as many layers, so the verse is comparatively less
well done, and kinda just seems to drag on as you wait for the chorus.
This is especially true in the songs Joy and Honour.
Still, I have to say I absolutely love the track Procession. Unlike the
other songs, all the elements fit together pretty well in it, and there
is no clashing between the drums and bassline and the melodies. And I
can still listen to Solitary and like it pretty well (if only for the
emotion in the vox), but you are right Marc...it sounds like such a
fused song. The drums and bassline sound completly out of place with
the strings and shimmery leads and vox. I almost think they might have
finished a shimmery song, then added a thud-thud to it once completed to
make it more poppy. The opening track is pretty good if I am in the
correct mood as well. VNV nation has promise, but I think they need an
extra band member who is more into varied drum patterns and has better
production skills...they sound like a half-ass project.
Eye
> I was "lucky" enough to find a copy of Praise the Fallen at a used disc
> store before it actually came out commercially in the US. The monotony
> and useless repetition of the album drove me to sell the thing
I have always considered VNV Nation to be "pop" electronics for the most part. I
own their full length and the EP and I consider it aggressive synthpop.
I enjoyed it for about a week and became bored with it quickly after, but I
don't dislike the music. . .I merely moved on. I enjoy the "Pet Shop Boys"
passion that VNV Nation pour into their music. I don't consider VNV to be
"industrial" or any subset of industrial. VNV is too flimsy to be EBM, so I file
them next to Ultravox. They're a revamp of "new romantic" pop with a hyper club
feel. I put VNV on when I feel like cotton.
now playing: neighbor mowing his lawn.
--
Eye
--
If voting could really change things, it would be illegal.
Tom Shear
end-all, be-all certainly, but Ronan writes strong, hooky melodies, his vocals
are good, and his lyrics are well written, and there aren't too many bands in
this scene that you can say all three (or even two) of those things about. No,
his drum programming isn't the most creative in the world, but it's DANCE
music, and for that it works well. I personally am looking forward to hearing
what he does next since he seems to improve with each release.
-t/a23
You will visit the Assemblage 23 website. NOW.
http://www.synthetic.org/a23 and http://www.gashed.com
"Trying is just the first step towards failure." - Homer Simpson
Apparratus
>On 15 May 1999 07:04:12 GMT, the artist formerly known as
>appar...@aol.comeonbaby (Apparratus) announced that:
>
>> i sure hope that ronan gets on and flames you guys for disliking PTF like
>he
>> did to me. It's a shame that some people cant accept the fact that others
>dont
>> like them.
>
> IIRC, he didn't flame you for not liking his music, he made a
>couple of corrections to factual errors in your post, such as what
>equipment he uses and your labelling of him as a Britich nationalist.
>
I guess you missed the thread a couple of months ago....but if you hop on
dejanews you'll notice he refers to me as a 'fool' or something of the sort.
Again, never did I use the word "British." VNV Nation sucks. Like I said, i
hope they dont quit their day jobs.
victory not vengeance, dude!
np: mother destruction
Todd Clayton
>
> I guess you missed the thread a couple of months ago....but if you hop on
> dejanews you'll notice he refers to me as a 'fool' or something of the sort.
> Again, never did I use the word "British." VNV Nation sucks. Like I said, i
> hope they dont quit their day jobs.
>
> victory not vengeance, dude!
...must resist...temptation...must...fight...
AAARGH!
;)
C. Adam Kuhn
Perhaps you are thinking of Blümchen. Now THERE'S some sappy club-fodder. Not
that it's bad, it's just ultra-dumb.
I think this brings up an important issue among music-lovers. Personally, I
file my "likes" into two sumcategories - 'good' or 'fun'. Stuff like Swans,
Radiohead, Depeche Mode, Tom Waits, Firewater, C$C, all my assorted pop albums
(REAL POP, not mariah carey and shit like that. I'm talking about stuff like
Beulah, Neutral Milk Hotel, Olivia Tremor Control, etc) are filed under 'good,'
while stuff like VNV, Covenant, Wumpscut, Croc Shop, most other metro stuff,
KMFDM, etc etc I consider 'fun.'
Keep in mind, however, that this doesn't detract from the quality of any band; I
just like them in a different way.
C. adam kuhn
np: And One - Sweety Sweety [fun]
And One - Nordhausen [good]
MT
>
> Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
> Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in
> the universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
What was that Dr. Industrial said? "Ya better recaNIZE, niggaz!"?
Fitting.
As far as PtF being the greatest album in the world, HA! It's good, but
double HA! Now come over here so I can slap you silly children.
--
"RMI is a bunch of good people......with lots of opinions...thats a
beautifal thing." - Tommy T, 08/27/98
Visit Grinding into Emptiness: <http://www.emptiness.net>
Visit Base Asylum: <http://www.angelfire.com/on/asylum/>
*** Remove the 'MT' to reply. ***
DreamUNIT
>file my "likes" into two sumcategories - 'good' or 'fun'.
<snip>
I wholly agree with this. For me, fun is VNV Nation, Birmingham 6, etc. ...
but good is Banco de Gaia, Trancedental Anarchists, Heavenly Music Corp. ... I
listen to wholly different things for different moods, and I agree with the
fun/good philosophy.
------
< DJ Nameless >
------
"I don't claim that our personalities pass on to any other existance
or sphere. I don't claim anything because I don't know anything about
the subject; for that matter, no human being knows." -T.A. Edison
nec...@visi.com
>> Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
>> Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in
>> the universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
>
> What was that Dr. Industrial said? "Ya better recaNIZE, niggaz!"?
>Fitting.
I'm being mistaken for Dr. Industrial now? Wonders never cease...
Mr. Tangent
forced Eschaton <Ka...@NOSPAM.student.umass.edu> to write:
>I would rate VNV nation as average. <snip> The beginnings
>to solitary and honour for example...the first time I listened to the
>album I checked the track listing just to check to see if I hadn't
>pressed the rewing button.
Weird, my cd player only has the dreaded "chickenwing" button. I wish
I had the money to pay for such illustrious and much coveted "rewing"
features. :(
Oh, what it is to dream!
--
Mr. Tangent [the binary police]
垂<<Recursive Technologies>>遙
"Welcome to the infinite loop."
Eschaton
>
> On Sat, 15 May 1999 10:58:19 -0400, with raygun in hand the aliens
> forced Eschaton <Ka...@NOSPAM.student.umass.edu> to write:
>
> >I would rate VNV nation as average. <snip> The beginnings
> >to solitary and honour for example...the first time I listened to the
> >album I checked the track listing just to check to see if I hadn't
> >pressed the rewing button.
>
> Weird, my cd player only has the dreaded "chickenwing" button. I wish
> I had the money to pay for such illustrious and much coveted "rewing"
> features. :(
>
> Oh, what it is to dream!
>
typo. At least I know now how I can be mucxh mire poplurar aroudn herw!
> --
>
> Mr. Tangent [the binary police]
>
Doktor Industrial
MT wrote:
> benjers wrote:
> >
> > Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
> > Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in
> > the universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
>
> What was that Dr. Industrial said? "Ya better recaNIZE, niggaz!"?
> Fitting.
i've said it, and i will no doubt continue TO say it, but this particular instance
of urban vernacular lapse isn't mine. i haven't had the pleasure of VNV nation
exposure. though with all of the covenant parallels that were drawn when praise the
fallen came out, i'll probably pass. i already have _europa_, after all; what do
i need another copy for?
dr. industrial.
JasonTroy
> >I think this brings up an important issue among music-lovers.
Personally, I
> >file my "likes" into two sumcategories - 'good' or 'fun'.
>
> <snip>
>
> I wholly agree with this. For me, fun is VNV Nation, Birmingham 6, etc.
...
> but good is Banco de Gaia, Trancedental Anarchists, Heavenly Music Corp.
... I
> listen to wholly different things for different moods, and I agree with
the
> fun/good philosophy.
Well said. I cant agrue that people find Vnv nation "fun."
Often times i get so carried away with music, that i feel all
tense/nervous/exhasted after listening to an album (gridlock further, Yen
pox blood music, decree wake of devestation etc) that i forget to "just
chill."
And if i had to choose between "chillin" to Vnv nation or any other MTV
poser, id go with the electro vnv nation boys. I see their appeal now.
(same goes for funker vogt, covenant etc)
JasonTroy
np: Velvet Acid Christ: Decypher Single (talk about cheezy fun. hehe. a
couple tracks are ok on this one though)
N.Scott Kozyra
>I was "lucky" enough to find a copy of Praise the Fallen at a used disc
>store before it actually came out commercially in the US. The monotony
>and useless repetition of the album drove me to sell the thing. How
>y'all could tolerate the mind-numbing repetitious techno beats for
For all intents and purposes, "Praise the Fallen" didn't really do
much for me. I'm still searching for some electro that sounds like
XMTP's "Drawback." ::sigh::
n.scott kozyra
.erik gloom.
.2000.
Wayn R
"JasonTroy" <nosa...@seatac.net> wrote:
<major snippage>
> Has anyone posted a review of the new Wave Worker Foundation: In The
> Whirlpool?
>
> The online sound files show potential.
>
I posted a pseudo review of it when I first got it,I will troll
dejanews and dig it up again and fwd it to you....
Its been a month now and the disc is still in decent rotation here at
home! =) I am eager to see what other suprises PendragonRecords has!!!
tschiao!
Wayn R
The online-magazine for electronic music:
"The New Empire"
http://www.newempire.com
C. Adam Kuhn
Check out Infam, Beborn Beton, and some of the heavier synthpop groups.
C. adam kuhn
np: Xymox - Dreamhouse
Happy Fun KittenLady: ACCEPT NO SUBSTITUTES!
toms...@aol.comspamsux opened up hir mouth and spewed:
> No,
> his drum programming isn't the most creative in the world, but it's DANCE
> music, and for that it works well. I personally am looking forward to hearing
> what he does next since he seems to improve with each release.
I would agree that it is good *dance* music, but to me so is :W: and I
don't like them much. VNV Nation isn't really useless, I think...they're
just kinda boring and I am not interested in picking up any of their
material as of now.
I do hope it improves, because there is always the worry that after
someone finds a 'successful' sound they will stagnate. I guess we'll have
to see ;>
-Leonora
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
| she carries this head around in her pocket | http://www.kittenlady.com|
| and she would gladly show you |--------------------------|
| all the damage that was done | wench[@]kittenlady.com |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bardolph
we...@kittenlady.com wrote:
> I would agree that it is good *dance* music, but to me so is :W: and I
> don't like them much. VNV Nation isn't really useless, I think ...
> they're just kinda boring and I am not interested in picking up any of
> their material as of now.
I wonder why people don't seem to connect to the deeper message being
sent by these two. VNV Nation is trying to say something about the need
to hold on to some core rebellious values, despite the malaise about our
ability to change anything. And :W: is an unparalleled apocalyptic
vision. There's gray-matter stuff going on here. At least, that's what
attracts me. It's not just old conspiracy theory (Holocaust Theory), and
it's not just fun beats and music (SPOCK).
- Bardolph
Ryan N Miller
Mr. Tangent <tan...@mntvernon.net> wrote in message
news:378e33b2...@news.beachaccess.com.au...
> On Fri, 14 May 1999 23:40:58 -0700, with raygun in hand the aliens
> forced "JasonTroy" <nosa...@seatac.net> to write:
>
> >Take a song like "The Dove" off of Index's-Black Light Twilight. That
one
> >song has more creativity then both VnV Nation albums combined imo. But 9
> >out of 10 rmi readers dont own that album for some reason.
>
> I do, but most of the "rappish" vocals completely ruin any potential
> "Outside In" is a much better and superb disk, imo (and doesn't have
> the same vocals, thank dog!). T.H.D. have gotten some recent acclaim
> with "Under a Statik Sky" and "Watz your program?" but "Outside In" is
> a woefully under-appreciated disk.
I bought that album used...listened to it twice and never picked it up
again. The lyrics are just dumb...and it was one of the few times I
couldn't get over it...Under a Statik Sky is a gorgeous album though...one
of the best to come out this year...and it doesn't have any vocals... :)
Ryan
Ryan N Miller
>
> i've said it, and i will no doubt continue TO say it, but this particular
instance
> of urban vernacular lapse isn't mine. i haven't had the pleasure of VNV
nation
> exposure. though with all of the covenant parallels that were drawn when
praise the
> fallen came out, i'll probably pass. i already have _europa_, after all;
what do
> i need another copy for?
HA! Good call!
Ryan
nec...@visi.com
Bardolph <ejb...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>I wonder why people don't seem to connect to the deeper message being
>sent by these two. VNV Nation is trying to say something about the need
>to hold on to some core rebellious values, despite the malaise about our
>ability to change anything. And :W: is an unparalleled apocalyptic
>vision. There's gray-matter stuff going on here. At least, that's what
>attracts me. It's not just old conspiracy theory (Holocaust Theory), and
>it's not just fun beats and music (SPOCK).
SPOCK is about our deep-seated intellectual need to join Starfleet
and explore strange new worlds, and to seek out new life and new
civilizations -- to boldly go where no man has gone before.
That's pretty heavy, man.
Aphonik
>nation
>> exposure. though with all of the covenant parallels that were drawn when
>praise the
>> fallen came out, i'll probably pass. i already have _europa_, after all;
>what do
>> i need another copy for?
VNV Nation sounds nothing like "Europa"... I'm not sure where all of these
"covenant clone" people are coming from, except to say that the comparison is
erroneous at best.
..Eric
Mr. Tangent
forced "Ryan N Miller" <mil...@rpi.edu> to write:
>> I do, but most of the "rappish" vocals completely ruin any potential
>> that "Black Light Twilight" has. For a similar feel, T.H.D.'s
>> "Outside In" is a much better and superb disk, imo (and doesn't have
>> the same vocals, thank dog!). T.H.D. have gotten some recent acclaim
>> with "Under a Statik Sky" and "Watz your program?" but "Outside In" is
>> a woefully under-appreciated disk.
>
>I bought that album used...listened to it twice and never picked it up
>again. The lyrics are just dumb...and it was one of the few times I
>couldn't get over it...Under a Statik Sky is a gorgeous album though...one
>of the best to come out this year...and it doesn't have any vocals... :)
That's funny, because I thought the lyrics and general aesthetic of
"Outside In" were superb. Again, we differ in opinion, but I'm amazed
that "Outside In" is rarely mentioned as it's definitely a recommended
disk. I would easily recommend it to any post-"Freeze Frame Reality"
haujobb fan.
np: haujobb - Cleaned Vision
"i'm going to give you a taste of the future... a preview of things to
come..."
--
Mr. Tangent [the binary police]
"The man who lit his farts on fire is standing
trial for attempted murder."
- Jarkko, relating a true story of
a man's butt gone bad. Very bad.
Kids, don't try *this* at home.
J. Wood
>
> In article <MPG.11a95d7be...@enews.newsguy.com>,
> we...@kittenlady.com wrote:
>
> > I would agree that it is good *dance* music, but to me so is :W: and I
> > don't like them much. VNV Nation isn't really useless, I think ...
> > they're just kinda boring and I am not interested in picking up any of
> > their material as of now.
>
> sent by these two. VNV Nation is trying to say something about the need
> to hold on to some core rebellious values, despite the malaise about our
> ability to change anything. And :W: is an unparalleled apocalyptic
> vision. There's gray-matter stuff going on here. At least, that's what
> attracts me. It's not just old conspiracy theory (Holocaust Theory), and
> it's not just fun beats and music (SPOCK).
>
>
I agree about VNV's bleak but hopeful lyrical content; Ronan is a last
bastion of hope in an otherwise tragically vast sea of shitty-ass ESL
lyrics (ie Jens Kastel, et al: the vocals are basically just the human
equivalent of a metal riff. All punch, little substance). However, as
much as I like :W: (I should, I have 6 albums), I have to say that Rudi
doesn't strike me as much of a visionary. I get the impression he
writes about death and war and plagues and raging tooth decay and such
simply because it's "expected" for the kind of music he does. He has
been getting a bit better lately, with stuff like Angel.
J
Locust Boy
wrote:
>>For all intents and purposes, "Praise the Fallen" didn't really do
>>much for me. I'm still searching for some electro that sounds like
>>XMTP's "Drawback." ::sigh::
>
>Check out Infam, Beborn Beton, and some of the heavier synthpop groups.
I don't think I could say Infam or Beborn Beton compare to Drawback...
Though Infam's english certainly compares...
ed duffy
spi...@obscure.org
------------------------------------------
"I didn't know the devil could get jiggy."
------------------------------------------
GodboY
"benjers" <ben...@breathemail.net> wrote:
> Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
> Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in
the
> universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
The GREATEST album? - I guess i need to listen to it a few more times -
i justy bought it the other day and have to say that I wasn't that
impressed. I enjoy the modern trend of bands with a synthpop ethic
(neuroactive comes to mind) but PTF just didn't do it for me.
GodboY
Happy Fun KittenLady: ACCEPT NO SUBSTITUTES!
> > sent by these two. VNV Nation is trying to say something about the need
> > to hold on to some core rebellious values, despite the malaise about our
> > ability to change anything.
VNV Nation's lyrics make me laugh, sorry. I am not one for all that
rah!rah! stuff.
And I *don't* like the music much, so I don't see why I should be so
impressed because of a "deeper meaning." I don't listen to music because
it has a deeper meaning, oops.
> > And :W: is an unparalleled apocalyptic
> > vision.
:W: also has lyrics that bore me to death and make me laugh at times.
Oh, and I don't really care for the music :P
> > There's gray-matter stuff going on here. At least, that's what
> > attracts me. It's not just old conspiracy theory (Holocaust Theory), and
> > it's not just fun beats and music (SPOCK).
I love SPOCK's lyrics because they are _fun_ and have a _sense_of_humor_.
Covenant also has decent lyrics though they are not "deep."
I dunno, I read books and poetry when I want to find deep inner meanings.
My idea of good lyrics is something like Erasure's "Run to the Sun"
because it has more personal meaning than any VNV Nation or :W: song will
for me. I'm sure people could argue about this for eons, but that's just
my two cents.
protophon
Tom Shear wrote:
> Ah well, to each his own. I personally think VNV is quite good... not the
> end-all, be-all certainly, but Ronan writes strong, hooky melodies, his vocals
> are good, and his lyrics are well written, and there aren't too many bands in
> this scene that you can say all three (or even two) of those things about. No,
> his drum programming isn't the most creative in the world, but it's DANCE
> music, and for that it works well. I personally am looking forward to hearing
> what he does next since he seems to improve with each release.
> -t/a23
> You will visit the Assemblage 23 website. NOW.
> http://www.synthetic.org/a23 and http://www.gashed.com
>
> "Trying is just the first step towards failure." - Homer Simpson
yes, its a good album, i agree, though i honestly think that the new direction
you've taken in your music actually offer a much stronger take on that kind if
sound, and i love forward to hearing your album.
TIMOTHY!
look /sound like a real dolt.
TIMOTHY
Happy Fun KittenLady: ACCEPT NO SUBSTITUTES! wrote in message ...
Apparratus
>trying to compare brilliance like VNV, to shit/crap, like erasure, makes you
>look /sound like a real dolt.
>
No, calling VNV brilliance without hard factual information *why* it is so
brilliant, makes you look/sound like a real dolt.
np: codec 'gremlin' subcon.01
® Zach Forbes - Doctor Polymer - CENTYL - z...@acpub.duke.edu
® INVEIN Records / Scythe & Limb Radio - http://www.invein.com
® www.interfacemagazine.com
® Senior Editor - Aural Fixation - http://www.aural-fixation.com
® Delayed:Invein 001 "Operational"
The KittenLady Stalks At Midnight
>look /sound like a real dolt.
Trying to act like a musical expert/opinion maker for the masses, makes you
look/sound like a real genius, on the other hand?
-Leonora
- love and hate tattooed across the knuckles of his hands -
- the hands that slap his kids around cause they don't understand -
- http://www.kittenlady.com wench[at]kittenlady.com -
- http://www.gothic.net/~azygous/nygoth - nygoth list! -
Mr. Tangent
forced "TIMOTHY!" <ele...@iserv.net> to write:
>trying to compare brilliance like VNV, to shit/crap, like erasure, makes you
>look /sound like a real dolt.
Trying to say that VNV Nation is better than Erasure makes you look
like both a dolt, and an ignorant fool. Just how can you say that any
band is better than any other? I'd love to hear it. I don't like
Erasure, but I'm sure quite a few synth-pop/pop fans would disagree
with your assertion wholeheartedly.
np: Lassigue Bendthaus - Jealous Guy (video)
--
Mr. Tangent [the binary police]
垂<<Recursive Technologies>>遙
jfennA...@mindspring.com
>I was "lucky" enough to find a copy of Praise the Fallen at a used disc
>store before it actually came out commercially in the US. The monotony
>and useless repetition of the album drove me to sell the thing. How
>y'all could tolerate the mind-numbing repetitious techno beats for
>minutes on end while the same god-damned chorus reiterates itself over'n
>over leaves me confused about the tastes of rmi!
Seconded! I do not think I was able to play it more than three times.
I prudently sold it before I destroyed it. That this release receives
as much laud on this ng is either (1) utterly bewildering, or (2)
proof positive of the efficacy of MK Ultra.
joe
Marc Van der pol
ma...@prodigy.com... confused yet.
VNV Nation: What I said about the "delivery" wasn't referring to the
vocals themsleves, more of a synthesis between the vocals and actual
music, the way the two were fused together. It seems many people aggree,
which is quite suprising as I haven't heard anyone mention the point
before, that the album is suffering from a horrid lack of cohesion and
from what seems to me to be: filler. I was attracted to some 20 sec. or
so mp3s that i d/led... the straying from the typical hopeless (with
inner strength of course) lyrical and musical metaphors were intriguing,
but I hadn't counted on hearing the same segments repeated until my skull
was inevitably filled and tortured with monotony (exageration, you get
the point..). It might be good at a dance club, but for home listening I
find it pointless. Anyway, this topic's been killed, especially by me...
i shall cease.
Good/Fun philosophy: I am totally down with variation. But I'd say only
using good and fun is far too limiting. While many other industrial (or
any other dark music) fanatics probably stare at there collection and try
to decide which shade of black to listen to, they forget that there is
quality music outside of the realm of indust. If you take an objective
viewpoint to certain music, the reason that the music is of quality might
be able to take shape in your mind. Many times I do like my tunes to be
of a dark,powerful, intelligent,altering, nature. I get more of a rise
out of music fitting that quo than most others, but moods and experiences
(and thus... _people_) are varied, music should reflect that to some
extent. While some are so completley obsessed with the electronic sound,
they'll find an industrial "fun" band, and one that is enrapturing.
There is nothing wrong with that. But to me, the electronic sound is
appealing, but not one that is the beginning and end. When I listen to
industrial, I want _industrial_, not a sappy, wattered down, poppier
version of other bands, just so I can have something a bit easeir to
listen to. If I want easier, I grab quality easy music. If I want poppy,
I grab quality pop music. kmfdm is exluded from this; they have great
nostaligic value to me, and I find their music generally unique and fun
to listen to minus the foible of too many albums w/o any creative
exploration (but then again, thats not their point to me) I'm out...
xkomm...@my-dejanews.com
ma...@student.umass.edu wrote:
> How
> y'all could tolerate the mind-numbing repetitious techno beats for
> minutes on end while the same god-damned chorus reiterates itself
over'n
> over leaves me confused about the tastes of rmi!
You're absolutely right. I agree with most all of what you said. I
can't give an absolute opinion of the CD, "Praise the Fallen", or the
"Solitary EP", because I never bothered to buy them. I've heard enough
of the songs from both of them to prompt me NOT to run out and buy
the CDs. To me, it just sounds like what I would call Bubblegum
Industrial. It's definetly nothing of real creative measure, though
the music is made for the dancefloor. When I'm on the dancefloor,
that's where I might give a damned about it, but as far as midnight,
headphone meditations go, I don't see it appearing in my CD player
anytime in the near future. I have heard that the first album is
better, so I may look it up. My $.02
> HAS SOMETHING TO SAY, as opposed to most others, but still... the
> delivery of the lyrics is too damned pretentious; the delivery mocks
the
> emotion...
I can't stand his vocals either. Terrible. Even the voice remixes I've
heard, where he even attempting to TRY to sing sound absolutely
terrible IMO. I'd rather listen to a cat dying slowely.
>>Michie<<
--
ASHES OF DAVID - poetry, music, opinions, art
http://www.dclink.com/vivilab
xkomm...@my-dejanews.com
"JasonTroy" <nosa...@seatac.net> wrote:
> Whats a real shame is that a band like VNV nation will get all sorts
of
> praise for their shitty drum programming and pathetic synth melodies
(the
> vocals were fine imo hehe go figure), when other bands like Heavy
Water
> Factory and Index with far greater creativity and complexity get
little
> attention at all.
Heavy Water Factory and Index definetly deserve praise. Hell yea.
I don't have "Blacklight Twilight", but I own "Faith in Motion", and
the programming on that CD is fucking genius. I think it really
depends on what label the band happens to be on. I mean, TVT has
great distribution. I wonder how much royalities VNV is actually
getting from them. Hell, might even end up a meager percentage, but
the fact that record stores like Tower Records and every other large
scale record store under the sun automatically buy 20 zillion of
TVT or WaxTrax CDs will well make up the difference. Hell, I'm sure
TVT garanteed VNV Nation that they'd make this EXACT amount of money
when the record store chains bought boxloads for their new release
shelves. It's all a matter of marketing. And I mean, shit, if I
was in VNV Nation, I'd try to get as much money as I could too,
because, face it, there's not a big profit to be made making this
kind of music, and when you get that chance to actually make a lot
of money before everyone forgets your name, yah might as well.
xkomm...@my-dejanews.com
"JasonTroy" <nosa...@seatac.net> wrote:
> Has anyone posted a review of the new Wave Worker Foundation: In The
> Whirlpool?
Wave Worker Foundation is pretty cool, but it's a little too
techno-ee for me. It does have some great drop-beat loops and
fill-ins. If you like Architect, THD "Under A Statik Sky", etc,
then you'll like WWF (hehehe... WWF)
Corey Haim Feldman
>
> I would rate VNV nation as average. The vocals are pretty good, as are
> the lyrics, and the melodies, while nothing special and mostly
> arpegiated, do at least sound nice and 'bright'. On the other hand,
> every track on the album sounds too close to each other.
OK. I can't even BEGIN to tell you what's wrong with that! But I will,
of course, tell you step by step, day by day...
> The beginnings
> to solitary and honour for example...the first time I listened to the
> album I checked the track listing just to check to see if I hadn't
> pressed the rewing button. Basically, it sounds like they are doing
> different versions of the same song on the whole album.
Are you nuts?!!! If you actually BELIEVE that why the hell did you
bother buying the album? You must have heard nearly all of PTF between
myself and Eric playing it for you when you were in the car. I suggest
you give it another listen before making such statements and jumping on
the "I'm too cool for electro" band-wagon. Dood. Seriously. Whattafuck?
> The percussion
> is pretty weak as well...I pretty much hate thud-thud drums anyway.
OK. For the last time. VNV Nation is essentially a "dance" act meant to
be played in clubs. Therefore, "thuds" are necessary. Complex drums
don't go hand in hand with clubs (there are exceptions, Das Ich's
"Egodram" has fairly complex drums and is still danceable) and for the
most part that type of music requires "thuds". And again, you _knew_ the
drums were like that, so I ask again, if you hate "thuds", WHY THE HELL
DID YOU BUY IT?!!!
> The
> non vocal songs are pretty weak as well, they sound like unfinished
> ideas pretty much...good melodies, but no development.
Here's where you start getting REAL nutty. "Ascension" is a well-thought
out instrumental track that DEFINITELY goes somewhere and has good
development...very layered and such. Give it another listen!
> And they need to
> use more than one string patch on an album.
I don't think YOU of ALL people have ANY right to SAY ANYTHING in this
area! Knowhatimsayin'?
> And the biggest problem is
> in their poppy songs...half the song is unpoppy. I mean, they fall into
> that pop-music trap where the chorus is extremely catchy, but they don't
> fill the verse with as many layers, so the verse is comparatively less
> well done, and kinda just seems to drag on as you wait for the chorus.
> This is especially true in the songs Joy and Honour.
This is a totally subjective and I really cannot argue it. But I will
say you're dumb. That's it. Dumb. Actually, I can say one other thing- A
lot of people, other than myself, think you're dumb.
> Still, I have to say I absolutely love the track Procession.
Great song, but definitely not one of the strongpoints of the album.
Though my favourite VNV Nation song isn't even on PTF...I love
"Solitary- Signals Version" on the Solitary EP. That songs brings me to
orgasm everytime. I just want to make fuck to that song someday! But I
think the "thuds" may complicate things...
> Unlike the
> other songs, all the elements fit together pretty well in it, and there
> is no clashing between the drums and bassline and the melodies.
Hmmm. Do me a favor, Karl. Next time we're out, sit down and point out
to me exactly what clashes on songs like "Joy". I'd be interested in
hearing an analysis from someone who "knows pretty much everything about
music theory".
> And I
> can still listen to Solitary and like it pretty well (if only for the
> emotion in the vox), but you are right Marc...it sounds like such a
> fused song. The drums and bassline sound completly out of place with
> the strings and shimmery leads and vox. I almost think they might have
> finished a shimmery song, then added a thud-thud to it once completed to
> make it more poppy.
I think you have a shitty stereo. Or your deaf. Wait. You ARE deaf! In
all honesty, I actually _can_ see your point here. The version of
Solitary on PTF _does_ seem a bit sloppy, but like I said before, the
Signals Version will gettcha everytime. At least in my non-eLiTe
opinion. :)
> The opening track is pretty good if I am in the
> correct mood as well.
Ahhh. So we come to the truth at last! I guess you're not in the mood
for it as you write this very poor analysis.
> VNV nation has promise, but I think they need an
> extra band member who is more into varied drum patterns
already spent enough time on this...
> and has better
> production skills...they sound like a half-ass project.
OK. They themselves will admit they are unhappy with the production of
their work at times BUT that can be explained by "a good artist is never
satisfied". Again, I would have to suggest you buy a better stereo or
buy a hearing aid or something, 'cause there are some serious flaws in
your arguments. Not that I'm the all-knowing but...
BTW, none of this is directed toward Marc, since from what you said, it
doesn't seem that VNV Nation would be up your alley...
"I just wanna say somethin'. KARL ZIMMERMAN looks stank, a'ight!"
-Corey Haim Feldman, sex symbol for the millenium
Per
>
> -Corey Haim Feldman, sex symbol for the millenium
Post proof! Oh, and BTW, you rocked in Goonies.
--
«««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««««
Per puncture AT flash DOT net
MHM 24x23 www.angelfire.com/tx/defektor/sig.html
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www.angelfire.com/tx/MegaBlast/images/yoda.jpg
escha...@my-deja.com
phalae...@worldnet.att.net wrote:
> Eschaton wrote:
> >
> > I would rate VNV nation as average. The vocals are pretty good, as
are
> > the lyrics, and the melodies, while nothing special and mostly
> > arpegiated, do at least sound nice and 'bright'. On the other hand,
> > every track on the album sounds too close to each other.
>
> OK. I can't even BEGIN to tell you what's wrong with that! But I will,
> of course, tell you step by step, day by day...
To start out my response...chrissakes, its only a fucking CD! Not only
that, but I didn't say I disliked it, only I thought it was average.
For the first 3 weeks I had the album I loved it, and then I got sick of
listening to it over and over again and again...now I can only listen
regularly to the intro track, procession, and solitary. I don't see
whats wrong with that...alot of people said much worse things about this
album in this thread.
> > The beginnings
> > to solitary and honour for example...the first time I listened to
the
> > album I checked the track listing just to check to see if I hadn't
> > pressed the rewing button. Basically, it sounds like they are doing
> > different versions of the same song on the whole album.
>
> Are you nuts?!!! If you actually BELIEVE that why the hell did you
> bother buying the album? You must have heard nearly all of PTF between
> myself and Eric playing it for you when you were in the car. I suggest
> you give it another listen before making such statements and jumping
on
> the "I'm too cool for electro" band-wagon. Dood. Seriously.
Whattafuck?
I listened to the album like 40 times all the way through chris...I am
burnt out on it, and I moved on. And yes, the first time I heard the
album, I thought the intro's to solitary and honour sounded a bit alike,
and I don't think I ever heard honour before that...but something about
them, even though the patches are different, makes them sound alike...I
dunno, I guess we just disagree on this.
> > The percussion
> > is pretty weak as well...I pretty much hate thud-thud drums anyway.
>
> OK. For the last time. VNV Nation is essentially a "dance" act meant
to
> be played in clubs. Therefore, "thuds" are necessary. Complex drums
> don't go hand in hand with clubs (there are exceptions, Das Ich's
> "Egodram" has fairly complex drums and is still danceable) and for the
> most part that type of music requires "thuds". And again, you _knew_
the
> drums were like that, so I ask again, if you hate "thuds", WHY THE
HELL
> DID YOU BUY IT?!!!
As I said, I liked what I heard before I bought it, I liked it for the
first few weeks, then it started to get a bit on my nerves. Its not
like I said it was bad...I would say that VNV nation are much better
than funker vogt, alot better than evil's toy even...hell, they are just
about as good as pure dancefloor industrial can get...its just not
enough to keep my attention for long periods of time, I want I guess
more emotion and less agression in my music.
> > The
> > non vocal songs are pretty weak as well, they sound like unfinished
> > ideas pretty much...good melodies, but no development.
>
> Here's where you start getting REAL nutty. "Ascension" is a
well-thought
> out instrumental track that DEFINITELY goes somewhere and has good
> development...very layered and such. Give it another listen!
I dunno, I don't like that track, as to the instrumentals, I like
somewhat forsaken and burnout and the unnamed last track, but that track
is one of my least favorite actually (along with voice and joy)
> > And the biggest problem is
> > in their poppy songs...half the song is unpoppy. I mean, they fall
into
> > that pop-music trap where the chorus is extremely catchy, but they
don't
> > fill the verse with as many layers, so the verse is comparatively
less
> > well done, and kinda just seems to drag on as you wait for the
chorus.
> > This is especially true in the songs Joy and Honour.
>
> This is a totally subjective and I really cannot argue it. But I will
> say you're dumb. That's it. Dumb. Actually, I can say one other thing-
A
> lot of people, other than myself, think you're dumb.
You are really taking this personal...sheesh, its just an album...if
someone was to insult something I liked, I wouldn't insult them
personally...seperation of intellectual discussion and personal
feelings, you know.
>
> > Still, I have to say I absolutely love the track Procession.
> Great song, but definitely not one of the strongpoints of the album.
> Though my favourite VNV Nation song isn't even on PTF...I love
> "Solitary- Signals Version" on the Solitary EP. That songs brings me
to
> orgasm everytime. I just want to make fuck to that song someday! But I
> think the "thuds" may complicate things...
>
> > Unlike the
> > other songs, all the elements fit together pretty well in it, and
there
> > is no clashing between the drums and bassline and the melodies.
>
> Hmmm. Do me a favor, Karl. Next time we're out, sit down and point out
> to me exactly what clashes on songs like "Joy". I'd be interested in
> hearing an analysis from someone who "knows pretty much everything
about
> music theory".
My problem with Joy isn't the clashing elements, its that the verses are
completely uncatchy, and I dislike his vocals in that song. It sounds
like VNV nation without that extra symphonic sound that makes them
distinctive, its easilly (after voice) the worst song on there
While I am at it, let me list the songs in the order I like them:
Procession
Solitary
Chosen
Forsaken
the 'hidden' 13th track
Burnout
Honour
PTF2012
Ascension
Joy
Voice
> > And I
> > can still listen to Solitary and like it pretty well (if only for
the
> > emotion in the vox), but you are right Marc...it sounds like such a
> > fused song. The drums and bassline sound completly out of place
with
> > the strings and shimmery leads and vox. I almost think they might
have
> > finished a shimmery song, then added a thud-thud to it once
completed to
> > make it more poppy.
>
> I think you have a shitty stereo. Or your deaf. Wait. You ARE deaf! In
> all honesty, I actually _can_ see your point here. The version of
> Solitary on PTF _does_ seem a bit sloppy, but like I said before, the
> Signals Version will gettcha everytime. At least in my non-eLiTe
> opinion. :)
>
> > The opening track is pretty good if I am in the
> > correct mood as well.
>
> Ahhh. So we come to the truth at last! I guess you're not in the mood
> for it as you write this very poor analysis.
Ever heard of differing opinions there...hey I think the new Mentallo
album is pretty good if I am in the right mood as well...whereas you
think it sucks...and you don't like autechre much either...guess I
better flame you :)
> > and has better
> > production skills...they sound like a half-ass project.
>
> OK. They themselves will admit they are unhappy with the production of
> their work at times BUT that can be explained by "a good artist is
never
> satisfied". Again, I would have to suggest you buy a better stereo or
> buy a hearing aid or something, 'cause there are some serious flaws in
> your arguments. Not that I'm the all-knowing but...
Really...seemed like you were under that impression.
Look, I don't see what your problem is Chris, I didn't say they sucked,
I just said they could improve in alot of ways. Even my favorate bands
I can admit flaws in. M&FT remixes pretty shittilly, and Autechre has
at times way too repetitive percussion for me. I have to admit (just so
you know) I have never discovered an album that I love unconditionally,
I always listen to everything with a critical ear...music is more
intelectual than emotional for me. There is no album out there actually
I can listen too all the way through, invariably one track or another
will piss me off, and some tracks, while good, I will want to skip past
to get to the really good tracks. So I guess saying that PTF was an
average album for me is a bit of a contridiction, because I rate just
about every album as average at best (eg, I like and hate some songs).
I just don't think its the coolest thing since sliced bread, ok?
Sheesh...
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Andrew Robinson
escha...@my-deja.com <escha...@my-deja.com> wrote:
[snip motivationn for list of fave tracks from PTF]
>
>Procession
>Solitary
>Chosen
>Forsaken
>the 'hidden' 13th track
>Burnout
>Honour
>PTF2012
>Ascension
>Joy
>Voice
How could you have forgotten schweigeminute?
Brilliant, brilliant work there... ;-) very complex layering and
intricate structures.
Drew
--
"There is not the slightest indication that [nuclear energy]
will ever be obtainable. It would mean that the atom would have
to be shattered at will."
- Albert Einstein, 1932.
MultiTasker Systems
nec...@visi.com wrote:
> In article <373d...@news2.vip.uk.com>,
> benjers <ben...@breathemail.net> wrote:
> >Do you like anything at all in the world ever?
> >Cos you should reconsider your feelings about the GREATEST album in the
> >universe bar none, before me and the gang reconsider your face.
>
> Suckas betta recognize!
MultiTasker Systems
Eschaton wrote:
> Mr. Tangent wrote:
> >
> > On Sat, 15 May 1999 10:58:19 -0400, with raygun in hand the aliens
> > forced Eschaton <Ka...@NOSPAM.student.umass.edu> to write:
> >
> > >I would rate VNV nation as average. <snip> The beginnings
> > >to solitary and honour for example...the first time I listened to the
> > >album I checked the track listing just to check to see if I hadn't
> > >pressed the rewing button.
> >
> > Weird, my cd player only has the dreaded "chickenwing" button. I wish
> > I had the money to pay for such illustrious and much coveted "rewing"
> > features. :(
> >
> > Oh, what it is to dream!
> >
> Hmm...well as usual, all RMI finds of note is one of my posts is the one
> typo. At least I know now how I can be mucxh mire poplurar aroudn herw!
> > --
> >
Wow!!!!! I worship the ground you walk on!! Please wipe your nose on this
handkerchief so I can treasure it forever!!!
MultiTasker Systems
> I would agree that it is good *dance* music, but to me so is :W: and I
> just kinda boring and I am not interested in picking up any of their
> material as of now.
>
Finally! My thoughts exactly... I feel that it sounds too similar... the tracks are
fade into one big long mess.... I get bored by this (same with wumpscut, in the
whole time I had MFAST, I doubt I ever listened to it al the way through)
That's why I listen to (technical) metal (urgh urgh urgh YAHHHHHH!!!1) I find the
constant changing time signatures and drum patterns, etc. keep me interested in the
music.... any "industrial" you guys could recommend that's built on the same basic
concept???
JT
MultiTasker Systems
nec...@visi.com wrote:
> In article <7hpfs1$lb8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Bardolph <ejb...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>
> >I wonder why people don't seem to connect to the deeper message being
> >sent by these two. VNV Nation is trying to say something about the need
> >to hold on to some core rebellious values, despite the malaise about our
> >ability to change anything. And :W: is an unparalleled apocalyptic
> >vision. There's gray-matter stuff going on here. At least, that's what
> >attracts me. It's not just old conspiracy theory (Holocaust Theory), and
> >it's not just fun beats and music (SPOCK).
>
> SPOCK is about our deep-seated intellectual need to join Starfleet
> and explore strange new worlds, and to seek out new life and new
> civilizations -- to boldly go where no man has gone before.
>
> That's pretty heavy, man.
>
MultiTasker Systems
> > HAS SOMETHING TO SAY, as opposed to most others, but still... the
> > delivery of the lyrics is too damned pretentious; the delivery mocks
> the
> > emotion...
>
> I can't stand his vocals either. Terrible. Even the voice remixes I've
> heard, where he even attempting to TRY to sing sound absolutely
A cat that ate chili?
Corey Haim Feldman
> To start out my response...chrissakes, its only a fucking CD! Not only
> that, but I didn't say I disliked it, only I thought it was average.
> For the first 3 weeks I had the album I loved it, and then I got sick of
> listening to it over and over again and again...now I can only listen
> regularly to the intro track, procession, and solitary. I don't see
> whats wrong with that...alot of people said much worse things about this
> album in this thread.
I think we located the heart of the problem...you listened to it too
much. Fine. That would be fine if you didn't go on any further...
> I listened to the album like 40 times all the way through chris...I am
> burnt out on it, and I moved on.
So your saying you can move beyond something in 3 weeks? OK. You must
have _quite_ the collection of music...
>
> As I said, I liked what I heard before I bought it, I liked it for the
> first few weeks, then it started to get a bit on my nerves. Its not
> like I said it was bad...I would say that VNV nation are much better
> than funker vogt, alot better than evil's toy even...hell, they are just
> about as good as pure dancefloor industrial can get...its just not
> enough to keep my attention for long periods of time, I want I guess
> more emotion and less agression in my music.
>
This too would be fine, but your analysis wasn't about your personal
likes. You ATTEMPTED to pick it apart from a completely different angle.
So I picked you apart. It's that simple. If you had said this before I
wouldn't be arguing your taste.
>
> My problem with Joy isn't the clashing elements, its that the verses are
> completely uncatchy, and I dislike his vocals in that song. It sounds
> like VNV nation without that extra symphonic sound that makes them
> distinctive, its easilly (after voice) the worst song on there
>
I wasn't just talking about Joy. I just used it as an example,
obviously. You made a GENERALIZED statement about the album. So I think
my response was valid.
>
> Ever heard of differing opinions there...hey I think the new Mentallo
> album is pretty good if I am in the right mood as well...whereas you
> think it sucks...and you don't like autechre much either...guess I
> better flame you :)
>
Yes, I actually HAVE heard of that concept. But, again, you tried to
analyze from an almost technical standpoint. I was just merely
suggesting you reconsider your conclusions. I didn't flame you. Not on
purpose anyway. Honestly, I was sick of your "authoritative" answers. I
mean, that thing about the NYC scene. You were at the Pyramid ONCE!!!!
> > your arguments. Not that I'm the all-knowing but...
>
> Really...seemed like you were under that impression.
Ouch. It's funny what they say..."Takes one to know one..." How ironic
YOU saying that to ME.
> Look, I don't see what your problem is Chris, I didn't say they sucked,
> I just said they could improve in alot of ways. Even my favorate bands
> I can admit flaws in. M&FT remixes pretty shittilly, and Autechre has
> at times way too repetitive percussion for me.
See above rebuttal.
I have to admit (just so
> you know) I have never discovered an album that I love unconditionally,
> I always listen to everything with a critical ear...music is more
> intelectual than emotional for me. There is no album out there actually
> I can listen too all the way through, invariably one track or another
> will piss me off, and some tracks, while good, I will want to skip past
> to get to the really good tracks. So I guess saying that PTF was an
> average album for me is a bit of a contridiction, because I rate just
> about every album as average at best (eg, I like and hate some songs).
> I just don't think its the coolest thing since sliced bread, ok?
> Sheesh...
See above rebuttal with one note- Then stop posting your "analysis"
without giving some background...
-Supercool Industrial Dood
Eschaton
> This too would be fine, but your analysis wasn't about your personal
> likes. You ATTEMPTED to pick it apart from a completely different angle.
> So I picked you apart. It's that simple. If you had said this before I
> wouldn't be arguing your taste.
Ok, heres a better explanation of what I mean. When I first got the CD,
I liked it alot. Then I listened to it over and over again, and the
more I listened to it the more both the catchy elements and the flawed
elements popped out at me, until finally the flaws that I saw that were
stopping the music from being perfect were on the whole just too obvious
for me to continue listening to alot of the songs.
> > Ever heard of differing opinions there...hey I think the new Mentallo
> > album is pretty good if I am in the right mood as well...whereas you
> > think it sucks...and you don't like autechre much either...guess I
> > better flame you :)
> >
>
> Yes, I actually HAVE heard of that concept. But, again, you tried to
> analyze from an almost technical standpoint. I was just merely
> suggesting you reconsider your conclusions. I didn't flame you. Not on
> purpose anyway. Honestly, I was sick of your "authoritative" answers. I
> mean, that thing about the NYC scene. You were at the Pyramid ONCE!!!!
But I have heard enough shit about NYC to generalize, both from people I
know IRL and you guys...hmm, maybe I would be in NYC more often if the
car didn't 'fill up' so much huh? :) Seriously, secondhand info is just
as good as actual experience right? It gives me an excuse not to leave
my house anyway.
> > > your arguments. Not that I'm the all-knowing but...
> >
> > Really...seemed like you were under that impression.
>
> Ouch. It's funny what they say..."Takes one to know one..." How ironic
> YOU saying that to ME.
Hey, no one is innocent
> See above rebuttal with one note- Then stop posting your "analysis"
> without giving some background...
In the future I will include a IMO every third sentance OK?
> -Supercool Industrial Dood
Corey Haim Feldman
>
> Ok, heres a better explanation of what I mean. When I first got the CD,
> I liked it alot. Then I listened to it over and over again, and the
> more I listened to it the more both the catchy elements and the flawed
> elements popped out at me, until finally the flaws that I saw that were
> stopping the music from being perfect were on the whole just too obvious
> for me to continue listening to alot of the songs.
>
Yeah, but see all of the "flaws" you found are totally stupid! :) It's
almost as if we're listening to different albums. Also, the "flaws" you
found were subjective and yet you tried to use them to prove the album
was technically bad. That's essentially it. That's what was wrong.
That's what's wrong with a lot of the more arrogant posters on RMI.
>
> But I have heard enough shit about NYC to generalize, both from people I
> know IRL and you guys...hmm, maybe I would be in NYC more often if the
> car didn't 'fill up' so much huh? :) Seriously, secondhand info is just
> as good as actual experience right? It gives me an excuse not to leave
> my house anyway.
>
No. Also, no. And in conclusion, THAT IS THE STUPIDEST ARGUMENT I HAVE
EVER HEARD!!
> > > > your arguments. Not that I'm the all-knowing but...
> > >
> > > Really...seemed like you were under that impression.
> >
> > Ouch. It's funny what they say..."Takes one to know one..." How ironic
> > YOU saying that to ME.
>
> Hey, no one is innocent
>
So you admit you are NOT the all-knowing? You sure don't refelct that in
your posts!
>
> In the future I will include a IMO every third sentance OK?
>
In the phuture, state opinion as opinion. State fact as fact. And leave
no room to interpret them incorrectly, even if you want people to...
-The All-Knowing (oops!)