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naa to kaaravaa.N kii talaash hai

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pramod

unread,
Feb 12, 2004, 10:26:27 AM2/12/04
to
Hi!
Can anybody explain this qawaali form barsaat ki raat.
It has turned to one of my favs. As I was small , they brought this
qawaali in Chhaya Geet (not Chitrahaar) and this song was the third
and last song
and my brother, sister, cousins and I were really frustrated, that on
that day only three songs were played!!!
And it formed the major topic next day in school!
Well, in those days we enjoyed songs like "my name is anthony
gonsalves" more.

Now, thank god, my taste has changed.

So, i hope to understand this song soon as well!

best regards Pramod

naa to kaaravaa.N kii talaash hai, naa to hamasafar kii talaash hai
mere shauq-e-khaanaa kharaab ko, terii rahaguzar kii talaash hai

mere naamuraad junuun kaa hai ilaaj koI to maut hai
jo davaa ke naam pe zahar de usii chaaraagar kii talaash hai

teraa ishq hai merii aarazuu, teraa ishq hai merii aabaruu
dil ishq jism ishq hai aur jaan ishq hai
Imaan kii jo puuchho to Imaan ishq hai
teraa ishq hai merii aarazuu, teraa ishq hai merii aabaruu,
teraa ishq mai.n kaise chho.D duu.N, merii umra bhar kii talaash hai

ishq ishq teraa ishq ishq ...

ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

jaa.Nsoz kii haalat ko jaa.Nsoz hii samajhegaa
mai.n shamaa se kahataa huu.N mahafil se nahii.n kahataa kyo.nki
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

sahar tak sabakaa hai a.njaam jal kar khaak ho jaanaa,
bharii mahafil me.n koI shammaa yaa paravaanaa ho jAe kyo.nki
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

vahashat-e-dil rasm-o-diidaar se rokii naa gaI
kisii kha.njar, kisii talavaar se rokii naa gaI
ishq majanuu kii vo aavaaz hai jisake aage
koI lailaa kisii diivaar se rokii naa gaI, kyo.nki
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

vo ha.Nsake agar maa.Nge.n to ham jaan bhii dede.n,
haa.N ye jaan to kyaa chiiz hai Imaan bhii dede.n kyo.nki
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

naaz-o-a.ndaaz se kahate hai.n ki jiinaa hogaa,
zahar bhii dete hai.n to kahate hai.n ki piinaa hogaa
jab mai.n piitaa huu.N to kahate.n hai ki marataa bhii nahii.n,
jab mai.n marataa huu.N to kahate hai.n ki jiinaa hogaa
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

mazahab-e-ishq kii har rasm ka.Dii hotii hai,
har kadam par koI diivaar kha.Dii hotii hai
ishq aazaad hai, hi.nduu naa musalamaan hai ishq,
aap hii dhama.r hai aur aap hii Imaan hai ishq
jisase aagaah nahii shekh-o-barahaaman dono,
us haqiiqat kaa garajataa huA ailaan hai ishq

ishq naa puchchhe diin dharam nuu, ishq naa puchchhe jaataa.N
ishq de haatho.n garam lahuu vich, Dubiyaa.n lakh baraataa.N ke ...
de ishq
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

raah ulfat kii kaThin hai ise aasaa.N naa samajh
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

bahut kaThin hai Dagar panaghaT kii
ab kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
dekho sakhii jii mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
na.ndakishor mohe roke jhaa.Do.n to
kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
ab laaj raakho more ghuu.nghaT paT kii

jab jab kR^ishhN kii ba.nsii baajii, nikalii raadhaa saj ke
jaan ajaan kaa maan bhulaa ke, lok laaj ko taj ke
janak dulaarii ban ban Dolii, pahan ke prem kii maalaa
dasha.rn jal kii pyaasii miiraa pii gaI vishh kaa pyaalaa
aur phir araj karii ke
laaj raakho raakho raakho, laaj raakho dekho dekho, laaj raakho
raakho, he he he, laaj raakho raakho, he he he, laaj raakho raakho
ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq

allaah rasuul kaa faramaan ishq hai
yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai
gautam kaa aur masiih kaa aramaan ishq hai
ye kaayanaat jism hai aur jaan ishq hai
ishq saramad, ishq hii ma.nsuur hai
ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-nuur hai
Kaaq ko but, aur but ko devataa karataa hai ishq
intahaa ye hai ke ba.nde ko Kudaa karataa hai ishq

haa.N ishq ishq teraa ishq ishq
teraa ishq ishq, ishq ishq ...
%

V S Rawat

unread,
Feb 12, 2004, 2:03:38 PM2/12/04
to
pramod wrote:
>
> Hi!
> Can anybody explain this qawaali form barsaat ki raat.
> It has turned to one of my favs. As I was small , they brought this
> qawaali in Chhaya Geet (not Chitrahaar) and this song was the third
> and last song
> and my brother, sister, cousins and I were really frustrated, that on
> that day only three songs were played!!!
> And it formed the major topic next day in school!
> Well, in those days we enjoyed songs like "my name is anthony
> gonsalves" more.
>
> Now, thank god, my taste has changed.
>
> So, i hope to understand this song soon as well!

could you not understand entire qawwali? very bad.

who is going to explain it to you line by line, word by word?

just point out the lines/phrases which you could not get, and
someone may add to that.

-Rawat

Sudhir

unread,
Feb 13, 2004, 5:09:14 AM2/13/04
to
Mr. Pramod:

It is extremely difficult for anyone to explain the lyrics of this song,
because it involves in-depth knowledge of Muslim, as well as Hindu
religions, and not to say the least, about things which happened to lovers,
who were not even in India.

Please re-post your request when you have finished your doctorate
(any subject) and may be by that time, someone would have gained
enough knowledge to cover the first few lines. In the interim, just
listen to the qawwali and enjoy it.


Sudhir


P.S.: Don't you think that it is somewhat odd that while you are
using abbreviations, you expect the other party to type in
long passages for you ? I am refering to favs, instead of .....


---------------------


harv...@hotmail.com (pramod) wrote in message

UVR

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Feb 15, 2004, 8:47:31 PM2/15/04
to
pramod wrote:
>
> Can anybody explain this qawaali form barsaat ki raat.
> It has turned to one of my favs.
>
> So, i hope to understand this song soon as well!

It's good to know that you like this song. It is disappointing
to note that your query has thus far gone unanswered.

To start things off, I'll attempt to correct a few errors that
have crept into the transcription below. Hopefully, that will
coax and cajole someone into giving a detailed interpretation
of the song's philosophical (and Sufistic?) content.

> vahashat-e-dil rasm-o-diidaar se rokii naa gaI
> kisii kha.njar, kisii talavaar se rokii naa gaI

wahashat-e-dil *rasan-o-daar* se rokI na ga_ii
kisI Ka.njar, kisI talawaar se rokI na ga_ii

[rasan-o-daar = rope and gallows. Rafi says "rasn" for "rasan"]

> ishq majanuu kii vo aavaaz hai jisake aage
> koI lailaa kisii diivaar se rokii naa gaI, kyo.nki

ishq *majanuu.N* kI wo aawaaz hai jisake aage
koI lailaa kisI diiwaar se rokI na ga_ii

> [...]


>
> bahut kaThin hai Dagar panaghaT kii
> ab kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
> mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
> dekho sakhii jii mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
> na.ndakishor mohe roke jhaa.Do.n to
> kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
> ab laaj raakho more ghuu.nghaT paT kii

mai.n jo chalii jal jamuna bharan ko
dekho sakhii *rii*
mai.n jo chalii jal jamuna bharan ko
nand *ko chhoro* mohe roke ... *chhaa.Do* to
kyaa bhar laaU.N mai.n jamunaa se maTakii ...

> [..]


>
> allaah rasuul kaa faramaan ishq hai
> yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai
> gautam kaa aur masiih kaa aramaan ishq hai
> ye kaayanaat jism hai aur jaan ishq hai
> ishq saramad, ishq hii ma.nsuur hai
> ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-nuur hai

*allaah-o-rasuul* kaa farmaan ishq hai
[...]
ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-*tuur* hai


-UVR.

Nimish Pachapurkar

unread,
Feb 15, 2004, 10:40:27 PM2/15/04
to
in article 1030899...@corp.supernews.com, UVR at u...@usa.net wrote on
2/15/04 5:47 PM:

>
> mai.n jo chalii jal jamuna bharan ko
> dekho sakhii *rii*
> mai.n jo chalii jal jamuna bharan ko
> nand *ko chhoro* mohe roke ... *chhaa.Do* to

Isn't it '... mohe roke Thaa.Do/Thaaro'?

- Nimish

Tadatmya Vaishnav

unread,
Feb 16, 2004, 1:07:42 AM2/16/04
to

"UVR" <u...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:1030899...@corp.supernews.com...

Shouldn't this line:

"yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai"

read:
"yaane *hadiis* ishq hai, quraan ishq hai" (Hadiis being another
religious book(s)?)
?

Regards,
Tadatmya.


Tadatmya Vaishnav

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Feb 16, 2004, 2:16:21 AM2/16/04
to

"pramod" <harv...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:7ad9dfe2.04021...@posting.google.com...

> Hi!
> Can anybody explain this qawaali form barsaat ki raat.

Here is a humble attempt at line-by-line translation. Doubtless, it must be
riddled with numerous errors (though I hope not innumerable :)) in
translation, grammar & interpretation (even punctuation). But I hope the
learned people here will correct it.

Basically, the qawwali talks about the power of love. It starts off with
describing personal anguish in love, and then goes on to enumerate what is
possible by the power of love, and how all the religions in the world have
love as a common element. Sahir uses the Krishna-Radha, Meera, and Seeta
examples to show ecstatic love or sacrifice. It also slips into Punjabi for
a short while, and then talks about the significance of love with reference
to Islamic and other religious people/symbols.

My basic Urdu vocabulary is very limited and I have looked up the Ascii Urdu
dictionary by Dinesh Prabhu, and the Urdu dictionary by John T. Platts
(http://dsal.uchicago.edu/dictionaries/platts/). In spite of this, I have
several doubts and have been unable to find the meanings of these words:

1. 'dhama.r'
2. 'barahaman'

while the doubtful ones (marked by a ? in the translation) are:
1. Kaanaa Karaab - destructive/self-destructive
2. naamuraad - disillusioned
3. chaaraagar - physician (I have no idea on the meaning of this one, but
just used 'physician' because of the context)
4. a.ndaaz - style ('style' sounds a bit odd in the context)
5. shekh/shaikh - saint
6. chhaDo.n - teases (like 'chheDanaa'?)
7. sar-amad - crown ('love is like a crowing emotion'?)
8. laaj raakho - maintain the dignity (couldn't think of anything more
appropriate)

So after all disclaimers, here is the translation:

--begins--

- naa to kaaravaa.N kii talaash hai, naa to hamasafar kii talaash hai
I am in search neither of a caravan, nor of a co-traveller
- mere shauq-e-khaanaa kharaab ko, terii rahaguzar kii talaash hai
(but) my self-destructive(?) desire is on the lookout for your passing by

- mere naamuraad junuun kaa hai ilaaj koI to maut hai
If there is any cure for my disillusioned(?) madness, it is death
- jo davaa ke naam pe zahar de usii chaaraagar kii talaash hai
I'm in search of a physician(?) who will give me poison in the name of
medicine

- teraa ishq hai merii aarazuu, teraa ishq hai merii aabaruu
Your love is my desire, your love is my honour
- dil ishq jism ishq hai aur jaan ishq hai
The heart is love, the body is love, and the soul is (also) love
- Imaan kii jo puuchho to Imaan ishq hai
(and) if you ask about faith, that is also love
- teraa ishq hai merii aarazuu, teraa ishq hai merii aabaruu
Your love is my desire, your love is my honour
- teraa ishq mai.n kaise chho.D duu.N, merii umra bhar kii talaash hai
How can I stop loving you? It's been the search of my lifetime

- ishq ishq teraa ishq ishq ...
love, love, your love, your love

- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- jaa.Nsoz kii haalat ko jaa.Nsoz hii samajhegaa
"The state of the passionate can only be comprehended by one who is
similarly passionate",
- mai.n shamaa se kahataa huu.N mahafil se nahii.n kahataa kyo.nki
I tell the (burning) lamp, and not this assembly, because
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- sahar tak sabakaa hai a.njaam jal kar khaak ho jaanaa
By morning, the end of all those lies in getting burnt to ashes,
- bharii mahafil me.n koI shammaa yaa paravaanaa ho jAe kyo.nki
(who) choose to become a lamp or a moth in a filled assembly, because
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- vahashat-e-dil rasan-o-daar se rokii naa gaI
The heart is not afraid of the gallows,
- kisii kha.njar, kisii talavaar se rokii naa gaI
Neither of a dagger, nor of a sword
- ishq majanuu.N kii vo aavaaz hai jisake aage
Love is that call of a Majanuu before which
- koI lailaa kisii diivaar se rokii naa gaI, kyo.nki
no Lailaa can be stopped by any barrier, because
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- vo ha.Nsake agar maa.Nge.n to ham jaan bhii dede.n
If she smilingly asks for my life, I am ready to give it up
- haa.N ye jaan to kyaa chiiz hai Imaan bhii dede.n kyo.nki
yes, what is mere life, when I am ready to give up even my faith, because
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- naaz\-o\-a.ndaaz se kahate hai.n ki jiinaa hogaa,
They tell me life must be lived with pride and in style(?)
- zahar bhii dete hai.n to kahate hai.n ki piinaa hogaa
(but) when they give me poison, they tell me I must drink it
- jab mai.n piitaa huu.N to kahate.n hai ki marataa bhii nahii.n
(and) when I drink it, they say, "Why doesn't he die?"
- jab mai.n marataa huu.N to kahate hai.n ki jiinaa hogaa
(but) when I die, they say I must live
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- mazahab\-e\-ishq kii har rasm ka.Dii hotii hai
Every custom of the religion of love is difficult
- har kadam par koI diivaar kha.Dii hotii hai
There is a barrier at every step
- ishq aazaad hai, hi.nduu naa musalamaan hai ishq
Love is free, it is neither Hindu nor Muslim
- aap hii dhama.r hai aur aap hii Imaan hai ishq
It is itself 'dhama.r' and itself faith
- jisase aagaah nahii shekh\-o\-barahaaman dono
Of that fact of which both the saint(?) and the 'barahaman' are unaware,
- us haqiiqat kaa garajataa huA ailaan hai ishq
Love is the thundering proclamation

- ishq naa puchchhe diin dharam nuu, ishq naa puchchhe jaataa.N
Love does not ask for your religion, nor is it concerned with caste
- ishq de haatho.n garam lahuu vich, Dubiyaa.n lakh baraataa.N
(and) lakhs of wedding processions have drowned in warm blood at the hands
of love
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- raah ulfat kii kaThin hai ise aasaa.N naa samajh
The path of love is difficult, don't consider it easy
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- bahut kaThin hai Dagar panaghaT kii
The path to the river-bank is very difficult
- ab kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
How am I to fill my pot from the Jamunaa?
- mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
As I set out to fill water from the Jamunaa,
- dekho sakhii rii mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
Look, my friend, as I set out to fill water from the Jamunaa
- na.nd ko chhoro mohe roke chhaa.Do.n to
Nand's boy stops and teases me
- kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
so how am I to fill my pot from the Jamunaa?
- ab laaj raakho more ghuu.NghaT paT kii
now, please maintain the dignity(?) of my veil

- jab jab kR^ishhN kii ba.nsii baajii, nikalii raadhaa saj ke
Whenever Krishna's flute has sounded, Raadhaa has come out in all
splendour
- jaan ajaan kaa maan bhulaa ke, lok laaj ko taj ke
forgetting the distinction of the known and the unknown, indifferent to
societal shame
- janak dulaarii ban ban Dolii, pahan ke prem kii maalaa
Janak's beloved (daughter) went from forest to forest, wearing the garland
of love
- dasha.rn jal kii pyaasii miiraa pii gaI vishh kaa pyaalaa
(and) Meera, thirsting for a vision, drank up the glass of poison
- aur phir araj karii ke
and then said,
- laaj raakho raakho raakho, laaj raakho dekho dekho,
'Please maintain dignity, look, maintain dignity'
- ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
this is love, yes this is love

- allaah rasuul kaa faramaan ishq hai
Love is the order of Allaah and of the Prophet
- yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai (note: should be 'hadiis', not
'hafiiz')
so the Hadiis is love, and so is the Quraan
- gautam kaa aur masiih kaa aramaan ishq hai
Love is the dream of Gautam (Buddha) and the Masiih (Jesus)
- ye kaayanaat jism hai aur jaan ishq hai
This material world is the body, while the soul is love
- ishq saramad, ishq hii ma.nsuur hai
Love is a crown(ing emotion?), and love is always triumphant
- ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-tuur hai
Muusaa (Moses) is (the embodiment of) love, love is like the (peak of)
Mount Sinai
- Kaaq ko but, aur but ko devataa karataa hai ishq
Love makes a statue out of ashes, and a deity out of (the) statue
- intahaa ye hai ke ba.nde ko Kudaa karataa hai ishq
and the climax is when love makes a common man a God

--ends--

I hope it conveys at least the basic intent of the lyrics.

Regards,
Tadatmya.


pramod

unread,
Feb 16, 2004, 5:42:53 AM2/16/04
to
> could you not understand entire qawwali? very bad.
>
> who is going to explain it to you line by line, word by word?
>
> just point out the lines/phrases which you could not get, and
> someone may add to that.
>
> -Rawat


Dear Rawat!

You are completely right. I should have known, people have better
things to do than explain me things from A to Z. Really very
preposterous of me.

You know what? I will try to explain the qawaali as I think it is
(this will be quite hilarious) and if I make some mistakes. Kind
hearted persons out there will correct me!

What say?

Pramod

UVR

unread,
Feb 16, 2004, 9:38:32 AM2/16/04
to
Tadatmya Vaishnav wrote:

> "UVR" <u...@usa.net> wrote in message
>

>>pramod wrote:
>>
>>>[...]


>>>allaah rasuul kaa faramaan ishq hai
>>>yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai
>>>gautam kaa aur masiih kaa aramaan ishq hai
>>>ye kaayanaat jism hai aur jaan ishq hai
>>>ishq saramad, ishq hii ma.nsuur hai
>>>ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-nuur hai
>>
>>*allaah-o-rasuul* kaa farmaan ishq hai
>>[...]
>>ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-*tuur* hai
>>

> Shouldn't this line:
> "yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai"
> read:
> "yaane *hadiis* ishq hai, quraan ishq hai" (Hadiis being another
> religious book(s)?)

Yes, you're right. It's 'hadiis'.

I don't believe they're religious *books*, though. AFAIK,
they're narratives that are supposed to inspire and guide
the listener through life.

-UVR.

UVR

unread,
Feb 16, 2004, 9:52:14 AM2/16/04
to
Nimish Pachapurkar wrote:

I'm not sure it is. My recording is not very clear at this
point, but I think here the woman has turned her attention
directly to the nand kaa chhoraa, saying: "let go of me!"

chhaa.Do = chho.Do

-UVR.

V S Rawat

unread,
Feb 16, 2004, 12:31:44 PM2/16/04
to
pramod wrote:
>
> > could you not understand entire qawwali? very bad.
> >
> > who is going to explain it to you line by line, word by word?
> >
> > just point out the lines/phrases which you could not get, and
> > someone may add to that.
> >
> > -Rawat
>
> Dear Rawat!
>
> You are completely right. I should have known, people have better
> things to do than explain me things from A to Z. Really very
> preposterous of me.

that is a big word, that I did not intend when I wrote that.

Anyway, some people have already come up to help you in that songs.
It is really encouraging to see that your request has moved one
person, a self-declared "NOT-HELPING-BEYOND-A-POINT" to explain
that song.

Your request has inculcated a new life in some of RMIM's old heads.

> You know what? I will try to explain the qawaali as I think it is
> (this will be quite hilarious) and if I make some mistakes. Kind
> hearted persons out there will correct me!
>
> What say?

In that you will find that you already understand about 80% of song,
and only few things needs to be explained.

I have full lyrics,
I have song in mp3 as well as in cassette,
I have isb's standard urdu dictionary,
I have quite some knowledge of urdu,
I have quite some knowledge of poetry,

I shall be happy to help you in whatever part you
find difficulty.

Actually, I heard the song and checked its lyrics in
isb after your request. And for the first time, I could
understand what those punjaabii lines are in female voice.

ishq naa puchchhe diin dharam nuu, ishq naa puchchhe jaataa.N
ishq de haatho.n garam lahuu vich, Dubiyaa.n lakh baraataa.N

Thanks to you.

-Rawat
-------------------


Amit Malhotra

unread,
Feb 16, 2004, 2:24:26 PM2/16/04
to
UVR <u...@usa.net> wrote in message news:<1031lfc...@corp.supernews.com>...

from what I understand, they are the sayings of the Prophet Mohammad.
hadiis is also pronounced "hadiith" i think (i have heard it like that
sometimes). I was also listening to this qawaali just a few days ago,
it really is one of the best of its kind.

Amit
Sahir FAN_atic :D

pramod

unread,
Feb 17, 2004, 7:27:36 AM2/17/04
to
Tadmatyaji!
Wah! Kya baat hai!
Wow!!
Thanks for the translation.
that was a major effort.
I had sent my translation yesterday under the title "meaning of qawaali" I think.
But your translation is more precise and has cleared many doubts.
Thank you
I owe you one

Pramod

"Tadatmya Vaishnav" <tavai...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<c0pqo2$19omhc$1...@ID-192702.news.uni-berlin.de>...

@bollyvista.com Amit Malhotra

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 12:17:58 AM2/18/04
to
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:46:21 +0530, "Tadatmya Vaishnav"
<tavai...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>"pramod" <harv...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:7ad9dfe2.04021...@posting.google.com...
>> Hi!
>> Can anybody explain this qawaali form barsaat ki raat.
>
>Here is a humble attempt at line-by-line translation. Doubtless, it must be
>riddled with numerous errors (though I hope not innumerable :)) in
>translation, grammar & interpretation (even punctuation). But I hope the
>learned people here will correct it.
>

hey great job :) just wanted to help you out a bit.

>
>My basic Urdu vocabulary is very limited and I have looked up the Ascii Urdu
>dictionary by Dinesh Prabhu, and the Urdu dictionary by John T. Platts
>(http://dsal.uchicago.edu/dictionaries/platts/). In spite of this, I have
>several doubts and have been unable to find the meanings of these words:
>
>1. 'dhama.r'
>2. 'barahaman'

1. dharma = i guess that's a philosophic word to explain :) but it
would normally denote: religion.
2. barahaman = Braahman (maybe you will recognize this transliteration
better). The priests in Hindu temples? :)

both are obviously sanskrit words and not Urdu words. I'm not sure,
but they should have been in Platts as it's a classic hindi/urdu
dictionary. "barahman" is a normal pronounciation of the word
"Braahman" in urdu poetry.

>
>while the doubtful ones (marked by a ? in the translation) are:
>1. Kaanaa Karaab - destructive/self-destructive

Kaanaa-Karaab would mean more like: "good for nothing"

>2. naamuraad - disillusioned

naa-muraad should be more like "unfortunate or unlucky"

>3. chaaraagar - physician (I have no idea on the meaning of this one, but
>just used 'physician' because of the context)

you are right, thats what it means. Doctor, or Healer, often used in
Urdu poetry as someone who helps ease the pain of love, or heal to say
otherwise.

>4. a.ndaaz - style ('style' sounds a bit odd in the context)

andaaz can also be termed more like "way, manner"...

>5. shekh/shaikh - saint

i think it would be wrong to call "shaikh" a saint.. but i'm not sure,
i'd rather call it religious men in Islam, or as my dictionary calls
it.. "venerable old man" :)

>6. chhaDo.n - teases (like 'chheDanaa'?)

no clue here!

>7. sar-amad - crown ('love is like a crowing emotion'?)

i think the word is "sarmad" which means "eternal, ever lasting"

>8. laaj raakho - maintain the dignity (couldn't think of anything more
>appropriate)

sounds good to me also :)

I hope wherever you had a question mark in your translation, my
confirmations or corrections in your understanding of the above words
will help you and the original poster.

Once again, great job in putting a LONG translation together.

Amit Malhotra

Zafar

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 6:45:01 AM2/18/04
to
Please accept my congratulations on undertaking a great project.

A few suggestions:



> > - naa to kaaravaa.N kii talaash hai, naa to hamasafar kii talaash hai
> > I am in search neither of a caravan, nor of a co-traveller
> > - mere shauq-e-khaanaa kharaab ko, terii rahaguzar kii talaash hai
> > (but) my self-destructive(?) desire is on the lookout for your passing by

self-destructive for "Khaana-Kharaab" is very appropriate here.

> > - mere naamuraad junuun kaa hai ilaaj koI to maut hai
> > If there is any cure for my disillusioned(?) madness, it is death

muraad = desire, so naa-muraad, one whose desires are left
unfulfilled; unlucky.

> > - jo davaa ke naam pe zahar de usii chaaraagar kii talaash hai
> > I'm in search of a physician(?) who will give me poison in the name of
> > medicine

yes, chaara-gar = physician, but also a general helper.

She tells me *coquettishly* (=with "naaz o andaaz") that you will have
to live

> > - zahar bhii dete hai.n to kahate hai.n ki piinaa hogaa
> > (but) when they give me poison, they tell me I must drink it
> > - jab mai.n piitaa huu.N to kahate.n hai ki marataa bhii nahii.n
> > (and) when I drink it, they say, "Why doesn't he die?"
> > - jab mai.n marataa huu.N to kahate hai.n ki jiinaa hogaa
> > (but) when I die, they say I must live
> > - ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
> > this is love, yes this is love
> >
> > - mazahab\-e\-ishq kii har rasm ka.Dii hotii hai
> > Every custom of the religion of love is difficult
> > - har kadam par koI diivaar kha.Dii hotii hai

har *qadam*

> > There is a barrier at every step
> > - ishq aazaad hai, hi.nduu naa musalamaan hai ishq
> > Love is free, it is neither Hindu nor Muslim
> > - aap hii dhama.r hai aur aap hii Imaan hai ishq

dharm

> > It is itself 'dhama.r' and itself faith
> > - jisase aagaah nahii shekh\-o\-barahaaman dono
> > Of that fact of which both the saint(?) and the 'barahaman' are unaware,

shaiKh (sheikh) = maulvi, preacher. Often used disparagingly in
Urdu/Persian poetry.

> > - us haqiiqat kaa garajataa huA ailaan hai ishq
> > Love is the thundering proclamation

... of that reality

> > - ishq naa puchchhe diin dharam nuu, ishq naa puchchhe jaataa.N

... na puchchhe *zaataaN*

> > Love does not ask for your religion, nor is it concerned with caste
> > - ishq de haatho.n garam lahuu vich, Dubiyaa.n lakh baraataa.N
> > (and) lakhs of wedding processions have drowned in warm blood at the hands
> > of love
> > - ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
> > this is love, yes this is love
> >
> > - raah ulfat kii kaThin hai ise aasaa.N naa samajh
> > The path of love is difficult, don't consider it easy
> > - ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
> > this is love, yes this is love
> >
> > - bahut kaThin hai Dagar panaghaT kii
> > The path to the river-bank is very difficult

panghaT is not necessarily a river bank. Can mean any place where
people can fetch water from.

> > - ab kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
> > How am I to fill my pot from the Jamunaa?
> > - mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
> > As I set out to fill water from the Jamunaa,
> > - dekho sakhii rii mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
> > Look, my friend, as I set out to fill water from the Jamunaa
> > - na.nd ko chhoro mohe roke chhaa.Do.n to
> > Nand's boy stops and teases me
> > - kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii
> > so how am I to fill my pot from the Jamunaa?
> > - ab laaj raakho more ghuu.NghaT paT kii
> > now, please maintain the dignity(?) of my veil

yes!

> > - jab jab kR^ishhN kii ba.nsii baajii, nikalii raadhaa saj ke
> > Whenever Krishna's flute has sounded, Raadhaa has come out in all
> > splendour
> > - jaan ajaan kaa maan bhulaa ke, lok laaj ko taj ke
> > forgetting the distinction of the known and the unknown, indifferent to
> > societal shame
> > - janak dulaarii ban ban Dolii, pahan ke prem kii maalaa
> > Janak's beloved (daughter) went from forest to forest, wearing the garland
> > of love
> > - dasha.rn jal kii pyaasii miiraa pii gaI vishh kaa pyaalaa
> > (and) Meera, thirsting for a vision, drank up the glass of poison
> > - aur phir araj karii ke
> > and then said,
> > - laaj raakho raakho raakho, laaj raakho dekho dekho,
> > 'Please maintain dignity, look, maintain dignity'
> > - ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq, ye ishq ishq hai ishq ishq
> > this is love, yes this is love
> >
> > - allaah rasuul kaa faramaan ishq hai
> > Love is the order of Allaah and of the Prophet
> > - yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai (note: should be 'hadiis', not
> > 'hafiiz')
> > so the Hadiis is love, and so is the Quraan

Since "Hadiis" is written with a "saa", instead of a normal seen, it
is pronounced with the tip of the tongue, very similar to English "th"
sound (as in "thin"). Therefore, the more common spellings are
"Hadith." It means the sayings of the prophet, preserved in seven
books.

> > - gautam kaa aur masiih kaa aramaan ishq hai
> > Love is the dream of Gautam (Buddha) and the Masiih (Jesus)
> > - ye kaayanaat jism hai aur jaan ishq hai
> > This material world is the body, while the soul is love

kaa'inaat = Universe

> > - ishq saramad, ishq hii ma.nsuur hai
> > Love is a crown(ing emotion?), and love is always triumphant

both Sarmad and Mansoor are proper nouns.

Mansoor (actual name Hassan bin Mansoor Hallaaj) was an Irani saint
who was sent to the gallows by the clergy because of his allegedly
blasphemous proclamation, "innal Haq" = I am the True One. Often
appears in Urdu/Persian poetry.

Sarmad (Sarmad Shaheed) was a saint in Shah Jahan/Aurangzeb's era. He
was beheaded on account of uttering only the half of the kalima,
"There is no God," and didn't complete it "There is no God but Allah."
Appears frequently in Urdu poetry.

> > - ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-tuur hai
> > Muusaa (Moses) is (the embodiment of) love, love is like the (peak of)
> > Mount Sinai
> > - Kaaq ko but, aur but ko devataa karataa hai ishq

Kaaq --> Kaak.

> > Love makes a statue out of ashes, and a deity out of (the) statue

Khaak is plain dust.

> > - intahaa ye hai ke ba.nde ko Kudaa karataa hai ishq
> > and the climax is when love makes a common man a God
> >
> > --ends--
> >
> > I hope it conveys at least the basic intent of the lyrics.

yeah, it did that, and more!

Zafar

Rirfan6

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 9:24:32 AM2/18/04
to
>Sarmad (Sarmad Shaheed) was a saint in Shah Jahan/Aurangzeb's era

Sarmad was a Sufi Poet who used
Rubaiyat as vehicle of expression in
Farsi(Persian).
His mazar is in Delhi.

http://www.zahuri.dircon.co.uk/sarmadshrine.htm

Zafar Saheb has given an excellent explanations of different words.
Thanks much Zafar Saheb.

Warm regards,

Irfan

Zafar

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 11:29:00 AM2/18/04
to
> Mansoor (actual name Hassan bin Mansoor Hallaaj) was an Irani saint
> who was sent to the gallows by the clergy because of his allegedly
> blasphemous proclamation, "innal Haq" = I am the True One. Often
> appears in Urdu/Persian poetry.

A correction:

Mansoor's Proclamation was "an al-Haq", not "innal Haq." "an al-Haq"
means "I am the True One" (an = first person pronoun singular; rhymes
with Hindi words "man", "tan", etc.), whereas "inn al Haq" means,
"Verily, *we* are the True Ones."

My mistake!

Zafar

UVR

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 12:22:54 PM2/18/04
to
Zafar wrote:
>
> A correction:
>
> Mansoor's Proclamation was "an al-Haq", not "innal Haq." "an al-Haq"
> means "I am the True One" (an = first person pronoun singular; rhymes
> with Hindi words "man", "tan", etc.), whereas "inn al Haq" means,
> "Verily, *we* are the True Ones."
>
> My mistake!

Mansoor said: "anA'l Haqq".

*anA*, not 'an', is the first person singular to which you refer
(spelling: alif+noon+alif; Nagari: a, na-me.n-aa-kI-maatraa).
The terminal "a" of 'anA' merges with the initial "a" of 'al',
producing "anA'l". This is similar to what happens, say, in the
French "c'est la vie".

One translation of Mansoor's words (into Sanskrit) is: 'so.aham'
(I am That). The difference is, nobody was lynched for saying
the latter ;)

-UVR.

Afzal A. Khan

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 4:06:03 PM2/18/04
to

"An-al-Haq" carries two meanings. It can mean simply
"I am the Truth". But "Haq" is also an attribute or
title for the Almighty. So the second meaning can be
taken as "I am the Almighty". And the religious
heirarchy understood it in the second sense and
Mansoor had to pay for it with his life.

Also, "inn-al-Haq" is an incomplete expression. It just
means "Verily, the Truth.....". I don't think there
is any connotation involving "we are the True Ones".

There are differing opinions about Sarmad. It is said
the ostensible reason for his beheading was that he
was always without clothes, even in public and that was
offensive to the populace. When all persuasions
proved futile, he was ordered to be executed. It is
said that the execution took place on the stairs leading
to Delhi's prinicipal mosque "Jaame' Masjid".


Afzal

UVR

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 7:53:43 PM2/18/04
to
Time for the dreaded self-follow-up:

UVR <u...@usa.net> wrote:
>
> One translation of Mansoor's words (into Sanskrit) is: 'so.aham'
> (I am That).

so.aham = I am He.

-UVR.

Surjit Singh

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 9:12:57 PM2/18/04
to
UVR wrote:

so.aham asi

tat tvam asi

Conformity to ITRANS not climed!

>
> -UVR.

--
Surjit Singh, a diehard movie fan(atic), period.

Visit my home page at
http://hindi-movies-songs.com/index.html

UVR

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 11:14:44 PM2/18/04
to
Surjit Singh wrote:

> UVR wrote:
>
>> so.aham = I am He.
>
> so.aham asi
>
> tat tvam asi
>
> Conformity to ITRANS not climed!

Looks like conformity to Sanskrit is also not claimed ;)
"so.aham asi" is not a grammatically correct statement.

-UVR.

Surjit Singh

unread,
Feb 18, 2004, 11:33:00 PM2/18/04
to

Is there anything you don't know?

asmi, of course!

>
> -UVR.

Tadatmya Vaishnav

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Feb 18, 2004, 11:54:16 PM2/18/04
to

"pramod" <harv...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:7ad9dfe2.04021...@posting.google.com...
> Tadmatyaji!
> Wah! Kya baat hai!
> Wow!!
> Thanks for the translation.
> that was a major effort.
> I had sent my translation yesterday under the title "meaning of qawaali" I
think.
> But your translation is more precise and has cleared many doubts.
> Thank you
> I owe you one
>
> Pramod

You're most welcome.
This is a Thanksgiving post :). The corrections by M/s. Zafar-sahab,
UVR-sahab, Irfan-sahab, and Shri Amit Malhotra are most welcome. They
clarify a lot of things. Needless to say, I didn't know about Sarmad and
Mansuur being proper nouns (as used in the qawwali). Also, it was rather
stupid of me to discount Sanskrit-origin words, and I never thought of
'dharma' and 'braahman'.

Thanks again,
Tadatmya.


Nimish Pachapurkar

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 3:17:19 AM2/19/04
to
in article 1031m92...@corp.supernews.com, UVR at u...@usa.net wrote on
2/16/04 6:52 AM:

I think "na.nd ko chhoro moho roke Thaa.Do to kyaa bhar laa_uu.N mai.n
jamunaa se maTakii" makes more sense. She is narrating an incident and I
don't think she (Sahir,actually) would suddenly jump to addressing directly
to "nand kaa chhoraa" like you suggest.

It is, of course, open to interpretation. I have a clear recording, I
believe, but do not have access to it.

- Nimish

Nimish Pachapurkar

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 3:35:24 AM2/19/04
to
in article c11639$1d79q6$1...@ID-159547.news.uni-berlin.de, Surjit Singh at
surjit...@yahoo.com wrote on 2/18/04 6:12 PM:

> UVR wrote:
>
>> Time for the dreaded self-follow-up:
>>
>> UVR <u...@usa.net> wrote:
>>
>>> One translation of Mansoor's words (into Sanskrit) is: 'so.aham'
>>> (I am That).
>>
>>
>> so.aham = I am He.
>
> so.aham asi
>

so.aham asmi sounds better, somehow! Doesn't it?

- Nimish

Ket...@att.net

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 11:39:37 AM2/19/04
to

Does anyone know the names of the actors who sing on the losing side, i.e:
Manna's and S D Batish's voice? Did they appear/sing in any other movies?

Ketan


PS: Someone had asked about info regarding Qawwali's. There was a thread back in
August 1997, posted by Satish Subramaniam, which one can access thru a Google
search thru its "Groups" section. There is also an artice by Irfan Moinuddin on
April 22, 2002 which can be accessed thru the same method.

Afzal A. Khan

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 12:49:24 PM2/19/04
to

Ket...@att.net wrote:
>
> Does anyone know the names of the actors who sing on the losing side, i.e:
> Manna's and S D Batish's voice? Did they appear/sing in any other movies?
>
> Ketan

The man in the black cap (the main singer on the
losing side) was character actor Balam. He used to
appear in bit roles and seems to have "specialised"
in qawwali sequences. I think he was the guy in the
"Azad" (Dilip Kumar) qawwali song "Marna bhee mohabbat
men kisi kaam na aaya". I recall at least one more
film where he sang a qawwali, but right now I am unable
to remember the film's name.


Afzal

Zafar

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 1:06:22 PM2/19/04
to
>
> "An-al-Haq" carries two meanings. It can mean simply
> "I am the Truth". But "Haq" is also an attribute or
> title for the Almighty. So the second meaning can be
> taken as "I am the Almighty". And the religious
> heirarchy understood it in the second sense and
> Mansoor had to pay for it with his life.
>
> Also, "inn-al-Haq" is an incomplete expression. It just
> means "Verily, the Truth.....". I don't think there
> is any connotation involving "we are the True Ones".

inn = particle for stress (verily)
naa = first person pronoun plural objective case (as in "maulaanaa,"
"nazzalnaa," "saGheerinaa", etc.)

--> inn+naa = inna = verily we



> There are differing opinions about Sarmad. It is said
> the ostensible reason for his beheading was that he
> was always without clothes, even in public and that was
> offensive to the populace. When all persuasions
> proved futile, he was ordered to be executed. It is
> said that the execution took place on the stairs leading
> to Delhi's prinicipal mosque "Jaame' Masjid".
>

There are various theories. The political one says that since Sarmad
was close to Dara Shikoh, Aurangzeb could't tolerate him.

Sarmad was a poet also and the legend has it that when his head was
cut off, he took it in his hand and started walking down the stairs of
the Jami'e Mosque, reciting this couplet:

sar judaa kard az tanam shauqe k baa maa yaar bood
qisa kotah gasht varna dard e sar bisiyaar bood

[The passion, that was my beloved, chopped the head off my body
A blessing in disguise, as I had a terrible headache!]

Incidentally, Mir writes, "sar ko kaaT ke haath pe rakkhe, aap-hee
milne jaa'ooN gaa!"

Zafar

Surjit Singh

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 2:14:57 PM2/19/04
to
Zafar wrote:
>
> [The passion, that was my beloved, chopped the head off my body
> A blessing in disguise, as I had a terrible headache!]
>
> Incidentally, Mir writes, "sar ko kaaT ke haath pe rakkhe, aap-hee
> milne jaa'ooN gaa!"

Interesting! Guru Nanak, the 1st Sikh guru also said,

http://www.sikh.net/publications/MasterFt/Ftstp01.htm

Jau Tau Prem Khelan Ka Chao
Sir Dhar Tali Gali Meri Aao
Itt marag Pair Dhareeje
Sir Deeje Kaan Na Keeje

(If you want to play the game of love for the Lord, put your head
on the palm, then come to me. On this path, take the first step with the
commitment that you have no hesitation to lay down your life for
righteousness.)

I wonder where the original expression comes from.

>
> Zafar

Animesh Kumar

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 3:49:05 PM2/19/04
to

Ket...@att.net wrote:
> Does anyone know the names of the actors who sing on the losing side, i.e:
> Manna's and S D Batish's voice? Did they appear/sing in any other movies?
>

I saw Ustad Jhande KhaaN saahib of Ajmersharif (Barsaat ki raat) in
another B R Chopra Production.

QUIZ: Name the film.

Hint: This time Rafi playbacks for him

> Ketan
>
>
> PS: Someone had asked about info regarding Qawwali's. There was a thread back in
> August 1997, posted by Satish Subramaniam, which one can access thru a Google
> search thru its "Groups" section. There is also an artice by Irfan Moinuddin on
> April 22, 2002 which can be accessed thru the same method.
>

--
PS: reply to animesh AT eecs.berkeley.edu

Save Thyself from Spam

Srinivas Ganti

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 4:30:00 PM2/19/04
to

"Nimish Pachapurkar" <nim...@hotmail.com> wrote

> so.aham asmi sounds better, somehow! Doesn't it?


That reminds me of my Sanskrit classes and the various tenses we
used to learn.

And it flows so well ...

bhavati, bhavataha, bhavanti
bhavasi, bhavataha, bhavata
bhavami, bhavavaha, bhavamaha

:)

sg.


Animesh Kumar

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 5:06:01 PM2/19/04
to

Srinivas Ganti wrote:
> "Nimish Pachapurkar" <nim...@hotmail.com> wrote
>
>
>>so.aham asmi sounds better, somehow! Doesn't it?
>
>
>
> That reminds me of my Sanskrit classes and the various tenses we
> used to learn.
>

These are not various tenses used. These forms (3 X 3) are for singular,
dual, or plural forms (3) of first, second, or third (3) persons, for
the present tense.


> And it flows so well ...
>
> bhavati, bhavataha, bhavanti

bhavati bhavataH bhavanti

> bhavasi, bhavataha, bhavata

bhavasi bhavathaH bhavatha

> bhavami, bhavavaha, bhavamaha

bhavaami bhavaavaH bhavaamaH

>
> :)
>
> sg.
>
>
Above are the forms for present tense.

The past tense starts with abhavataH; the future tense with bhaviShyati.

Best regards
Animesh

--
PS: reply to animesh AT eecs.berkeley.edu

Saving Thyself from Spam

Sudhir

unread,
Feb 19, 2004, 10:14:46 PM2/19/04
to
Me and my classmates learned Sanskrit the hard way, which was:

Jalm, Jale, Jalani
Sanskrit Kabhi Na Aani

Aani To Bhool Jani
Sanskrit Ki Mar Jaye Nani


And that is still relevant.


Sudhir

---------------------

"Srinivas Ganti" <gant...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

Sushil Sharma

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Feb 20, 2004, 3:10:17 AM2/20/04
to
Surjit Singh <surjit...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<c131vj$1e8bc8$1...@ID-159547.news.uni-berlin.de>...

> Zafar wrote:
> >
> > [The passion, that was my beloved, chopped the head off my body
> > A blessing in disguise, as I had a terrible headache!]
> >
> > Incidentally, Mir writes, "sar ko kaaT ke haath pe rakkhe, aap-hee
> > milne jaa'ooN gaa!"
>
> Interesting! Guru Nanak, the 1st Sikh guru also said,
>
> http://www.sikh.net/publications/MasterFt/Ftstp01.htm
>
> Jau Tau Prem Khelan Ka Chao
> Sir Dhar Tali Gali Meri Aao
> Itt marag Pair Dhareeje
> Sir Deeje Kaan Na Keeje
>
> (If you want to play the game of love for the Lord, put your head
> on the palm, then come to me. On this path, take the first step with the
> commitment that you have no hesitation to lay down your life for
> righteousness.)
>
> I wonder where the original expression comes from.

References for images of chopped-off heads and headless bodies,
in various different contexts such as extreme bravery, ultimate
sacrifice, selflessness, even demonic spirits etc, are very
common, and ancient. Tantrik legends of chhinnamastaa, the
demon Kabandha in Ramayana, the Rajasthani legend of
Jujhaar jii, are some examples. So, it would be nearly
impossible to find the "original" source. In Hindi/Urdu
literature, however, Kabir (circa 1399-1519 AD) is one
of the earliest to invoke this image, and the following
examples will show that he has used it very frequently.

First, a quote from the verses of Kabir sahib included in
the aadi granth, Sri Guru Granth Sahib:
kabiir jau tuhi saadh piramm kii siis kaaT kari goya
khelat khelat haal kari jo kichhu hoya ta hoya
(see http://www.sikhnet.com/sggs/translation/1377.html)

Now some more examples:

kabiir yahu ghar prem kaa, khaalaa kaa ghar naahi.n
sees utaarai haathi kari, so paise ghar maahi.n

kabiir nij ghar prem kaa, maarag agam agaadh
sees utaari pagatali dharai, tab nikaTi prem kaa swaad

saa.N_ii se.nta na paa_iye, baataa.N milai na koy
kabiir saudaa raam sau.n, sir bin kadai na hoy

suurai siis utaariyaa, chhaaDii tan kii aas
aagethai.n hari mulakiyaa, aavat dekhyaa daas

bhagati duhelii raam kii, nahi.n kaayar kaa kaam
siis utaarai haathi kari, so lesii hari naam

prem na khetau.n niipajai, prem na haaT bikaay
raajaa parajaa jis ruche, sir de so le jaay


Sushil

Afzal A. Khan

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Feb 20, 2004, 1:50:17 PM2/20/04
to

Since the discussion has taken a "gory" turn,
let me mention a historical legend (I hope this
would not be termed an oxymoron !).

In Central India (Maharashtra), there is a small
town called Ellichpur. The name has now been
changed to Achalpur. In earlier times, it was
the capital of a small kingdom ruled by Raja El.
Some centuries back (circa 1400), a great battle was
fought here. A young Muslim warrior (who was also
a spiritual figure) by the name of Abdur Rehman
fought very bravely, but was ultimately surrounded
by the enemy, one of whom beheaded him. Legend has
it that he took his severed head in one hand and
continued to fight valiantly for some more time.
His mausoleum is still there in Achalpur and there
is an annual Urs when people from the town and nearby
villages throng his "mazaar". He had got married
just before the battle. Accordingly, he is commonly
referred to as "Shah Doolha Rehman".


Afzal

DBurch7672

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Mar 15, 2004, 6:07:58 PM3/15/04
to
ishq majanuu kii vo aavaaz hai jisake aage

koI lailaa kisii diivaar se rokii naa gaI, kyo.nki

ishq *majanuu.N* kI wo aawaaz hai jisake aage
koI lailaa kisI diiwaar se rokI na ga_ii

[...]



bahut kaThin hai Dagar panaghaT kii

ab kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii

mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko

dekho sakhii jii mai jo chalii jal jamunaa bharan ko
na.ndakishor mohe roke jhaa.Do.n to


kyaa bhar lAU.N mai jamunaa se maTakii

ab laaj raakho more ghuu.nghaT paT kii

mai.n jo chalii jal jamuna bharan ko
dekho sakhii *rii*
mai.n jo chalii jal jamuna bharan ko
nand *ko chhoro* mohe roke ... *chhaa.Do* to

kyaa bhar laaU.N mai.n jamunaa se maTakii ...

[..]



allaah rasuul kaa faramaan ishq hai

yaane hafiiz ishq hai, quraan ishq hai

gautam kaa aur masiih kaa aramaan ishq hai

ye kaayanaat jism hai aur jaan ishq hai

ishq saramad, ishq hii ma.nsuur hai

ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-nuur hai

*allaah-o-rasuul* kaa farmaan ishq hai
[...]
ishq muusaa, ishq koh-e-*tuur* hai


-UVR.

English?

DBurch7672

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Mar 15, 2004, 6:12:21 PM3/15/04
to
Jalm, Jale, Jalani
Sanskrit Kabhi Na Aani

Aani To Bhool Jani
Sanskrit Ki Mar Jaye Nani

What is this in English? Reads to me like a cheer!


DBurch7672

unread,
Mar 15, 2004, 6:15:16 PM3/15/04
to
First, a quote from the verses of Kabir sahib included in the aadi granth, Sri
Guru Granth Sahib: kabiir jau tuhi saadh piramm kii siis kaaT kari goya
khelat khelat haal kari jo kichhu hoya ta hoya
(see http://www.sikhnet.com/sggs/translation/1377.html)

Now some more examples:

kabiir yahu ghar prem kaa, khaalaa kaa ghar naahi.n
sees utaarai haathi kari, so paise ghar maahi.n

kabiir nij ghar prem kaa, maarag agam agaadh
sees utaari pagatali dharai, tab nikaTi prem kaa swaad

saa.N_ii se.nta na paa_iye, baataa.N milai na koy
kabiir saudaa raam sau.n, sir bin kadai na hoy

suurai siis utaariyaa, chhaaDii tan kii aas
aagethai.n hari mulakiyaa, aavat dekhyaa daas

bhagati duhelii raam kii, nahi.n kaayar kaa kaam
siis utaarai haathi kari, so lesii hari naam

prem na khetau.n niipajai, prem na haaT bikaay
raajaa parajaa jis ruche, sir de so le jaay


Sushil

English?

Netcop

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Mar 15, 2004, 7:01:05 PM3/15/04
to

"DBurch7672" <dburc...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20040315181516...@mb-m20.news.cs.com...
.
<post from Sushil snipped>
> English?
You seem to have an acute case of verbal diarrhea ...


V S Rawat

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Mar 16, 2004, 12:09:42 AM3/16/04
to

It is. Mocking at the complexity of the language.

the first like is just mentioning three forms (singular, duo, plural)
of a word in sanskrit.

then
"i will never be able to grasp sanskrit".
"whatever I manage to understand, I end up forgetting".
"may the granny of sanskrit die".

-Rawat

V S Rawat

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Mar 16, 2004, 12:18:08 AM3/16/04
to

It is. Mocking at the complexity of the language.

the first line is just mentioning three forms (singular, duo, plural)
of a word in sanskrit. sanskrit has different rules when two persons
are there, apart from singular/ plural.

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