A Melodic Low-pitched & High pitched TFM song for enlightenment !
Jay
of 1959 composed in Raaga: Abheri (Carnatic music) or Bhimpalas
( North Indian music) in yr IBs. The song is sung by Bhanumati ( on
low pitch ) while T.R.Mahalingam ( on high pitch ) under the great MD:
G.Ramanathan
I reproduce below a brief description quoted by the famous historian/
critic Manisekharan about this duet for the purposes of study-n-
enlightenment.
" Kannadasan(lyricist) was very satisfied the way this scene turned up
in the movie. There is yet one more unique feature in this song. When
SG Kittappa used to sing without the assistance of the PA system,his
voice could be heard one mile away. But TRM's voice could reach at
least three quarter of a mile when he sang in high pitch. TRM sang
almost all his songs in high pitch. the great G Ramanathan tailored a
song to make TRM sing in both high and low pitch. In the film:
Manimegalai ('59) TRM was made to sing with Bhanumathy who never could
sing in high pitch. In the song 'Kankalin Vennilave...; TRM sings on a
high pitch while Bhanumathy sings on a low pitch. In the tail end of
the song both TRM & Bhanumati sing in a very low pitch."
During the entire 3.00 - 3.15 mins of the song notice the slow-swaying
mesmerising melodic appeal in the song.
Comments invited of any type.
19/3
naniwadekar
>
> When SG Kittappa used to sing without the assistance of the PA
> system,his voice could be heard one mile away.
>
a piece of writing or a piece of singing. Nobody's voice can be heard
a mile away any more than a powerful jet taking off can be heard on
the moon. Especially Kittappa had a very mellow, sonorous voice not
suited to be carried over huge distance.
"Comments invited of any type." --> Once again you have managed to
come across as a clueless listener.
- dn
Chetan Vinchhi
> Today's/19th enlightening feature is a very popular TFM romantic duet
> of 1959 composed in Raaga: Abheri (Carnatic music) or Bhimpalas
> ( North Indian music) in yr IBs.
What are the aroh-avroh and chalan of Bhimpalas?
> I reproduce below a brief description quoted by the famous historian/
> critic Manisekharan about this duet for the purposes of study-n-
> enlightenment.
Don't rely on printed material about music - instead, hone your
listening skills and learn to make judgments for yourself.
C
Jay
Your opinions are not valid since you explicitly stated that you are
not in the biz of enlightening. Fine.
Thus neither can you ask any questions - People like Manisekharan
have a very huge ethical followers like Harminder has - you put your
questions to Manisekharan and see what reply you get.
That too, if you really are interested.
The aim of this forum do not accept realities when presented to them
in an aural form. Why?
I am no authority on Carnatic music nor classical music as stated many
a times. Perhaps you are a qualified in this respect and thus you are
putting this querry since you know well, I am unaware. Whats the big
deal then !
19/3
Jay
At times I begin to feel:
What if the above duet were (presumed ) to have sung by Lataji / TRM.
For a moment, let us remove Bhanumati from the scene and replace her
by LM or Asha Bhosle during 1958/59)
What happens then - how are the RMimers going to react then !
The emoting part/portion of any song has already been 'predetermined'
by Nani as Lata's emoting has no parallels. Thats his dogma, but in
the process he has not explicitly stated even now with illustrations.
He recounts Anokha Pyar songs and Toote huwe arman.... as cut above
class.
Which other songs you have in your Lata-list that you vouch as
unassailable and in which context
==============================================================
Lata has her own limitations. Her best outputs in terms of voice-n-
rendition were from 1948-54 = 7 yrs only
(ubharti jawani) !954 was the peak followed by a little saturation and
the DECLINE begin to be discernable. Songs continued to be melodious
in the general sense, but her larynx began to show wear the moment she
had to raise her voice.
How is Nani going to prove me wrong or otherwise - provide
illustrations to support your version.
19/3
Am I rite, Nani
Jay
Are u trying to prove that info of S.G Kitappa as mentioned by
historians is meaningless?
Commit yourself to a pin pointed answer.
How do you know that SGK had a mellow, sonorous voice in the first
place. He passed away in 1928 itself.
Tell me how ?
19/3
dn.usenet
"Jay" <sjhhhtm@ gmail.com> wrote :
>
> How do you know that SGK had a mellow, sonorous voice
> in the first place. He passed away in 1928 itself.
>
access to old material on 78s, deluded that nobody has any inkling about MD
of a 1942 Marathi film song by Vatsala Kumthekar when anybody with info to
documents knows it, deluded that just because Kittappa died early others may
not even know how he sounded.
Get your facts correct and get your brain in order by good therapy. Zohra of
Agra died in 1913, Keshavrao Bhosale died in 1921/22; so fucking what? Their
voice is available. Same with Kittappa and his brother Kasi Iyer. Many
rmim-ers have heard lots of Kittappa music; his voice was mellow without a
doubt. Your history is also all wrong, picked up from sources misremembering
things. Kittappa married Sundarambal in 1927, and after 5-6 years of
marriage he died in 1933, not 1928. If you are interested in hearing his
voice, attend an rmim meet where appropriate samples of Kittappa's music
will be made available.
- dn
Jay
My question: Have you heard?
Many have heard that I knw. How did you know that SGK had a brother
called Kasi Iyer?
Lets go one by one.
Who told you that SGK had a brother Kasi Iyer. Either you must have
met him in person or you are reproducing info from Google. If thats
the case, you are depending upon Google for sensitive issue-info.
Why are you trusting Google only for specific info ? Google has
abundance of info provided by so many well known people of expertise -
why don't you trust that also?
Neither you nor I have seen SGK singing. 78rpm records are the VERY
SOURCE OF info for Google by their individual writers.They too have
heard only from CDs or Tapes or 78rpms. So, whats wrong in that.
Why is BP going up while replying to my posts?
===================================
20/3
Pls confine your answer
dn.usenet
"Jay" <sjh...@gmail.com> wrote :
>
> During the entire 3.00 - 3.15 mins of the song notice the slow-swaying
> mesmerising melodic appeal in the song.
>
Jayaram-jeey : Just heard the Mahalingam - Bhanumati duet. It seems to me
(based on just this one song, which of course may not represent any correct
picture) like Ramanathan was a reasonably competent but a second-rate
composer, who used to steal Naushad's tunes, and uses a frivolous beat in
this song. This frivolous beat is the undoing of all modern songs. You have
to be exceptionally stupid to like the sound. Luckily for R D Burman and A R
Rahman, being exceptionally stupid is nothing exceptional for a vast
multitude of populace.
If the same tune is transported to 1945 sound and a bit more gravitas is
added to it, it would sound much better. As it is, the duet is good but
'filmi'. A student of Bharatiya Cine Sangeet cannot understand these nuances
because it is the rogueish God who is making His children (even old ones
born in 1941) act like monkeys. A friend of God can perhaps tell what the
God has been smoking since 1955, which has shot up God's BP. Why does God
have hard feelings towards His children? It is beyond Jayaraman's scope of
aural analysis.
I also heard the other Tamil duet sent by you as part of 3-songs email. Your
collection is very good. I don't know its words or stats, but that is a
truly phenomenal song, untouched by cheapo gimmicks. I heard it continuously
8-10 times. I will find its stats soon from a Tamizh Hamraaz. Many thanks
for sharing the song.
- dn
Chetan Vinchhi
> not in the biz of enlightening. Fine.
Why? You mean to say that only people in the business of enlightenment
have (or should have - how brazen of you!) opinions? My suggestion is
that you pluck your head out of the clouds before it is too late.
> Thus neither can you ask any questions - People like Manisekharan
> have a very huge ethical followers like Harminder has
Presumably including Jay? Wow! It looks like you have a newfound
respect for Hamraaz! Looks like I have inadvertently contributed to
some enlightenment :)
> Whats the big deal then !
The big deal is that you are not being completely honest about what
you know/don't-know until you are cornered (as in this case). For
example you have been shouting from rooftops about Lata's besurapan.
It was only later that you admitted you rely on somebody else's
opinions for matters of sur, voice, notes etc. That too is not such a
big deal, but then it looks like a lot gets lost in translation, e.g.
you do not know the difference between shrillness and besurapan.
C
Jay
At some point of her shrillness it does collapse - dint u notice.
You may so many things against me, fine ..carry on. . I am the least
affected.
== LOVE-n-TRUTH always suffer and will continue to suffer===
But I go by my EARS which I have pointed out.
In the process, one can always brand me ANYTHING - kya farak padta hai
- No regrets-
I do not expect anything in return - but the wagging tongues cannot
keep quiet ...inside their systems it is fuming : Blow hot, blow cold.
I have explicitly stated earlier:
====================
My job is to only present the song to the listener with LOVE . It is a
recorded music which I have not manufactured nor you and sung by a
VOICE named Lata during 1956 alongwith the diagnosis from a sangeet
premi. The same has been further put up to the listening ears of the
forum consisting of Pandits and Maha Pandits who know much, much than
me.
The song in question has been composed 'surila' . Lata's rendering of
Pt I also is unblemished. But the song isn't yet complete...and in the
process Lata has to RAISE HER VOICE 'INSTANTANEOUSLY'.
Am I rite upto this point?
===============
Touch your hearts sincerely and tell : don't you find something
'unpleasant' in the soprano that POLLUTES the incomplete bhajan at the
critical moment.Its not her fault at all. She has delivered the best
she could " on a soprano voice wherein her larynx discernably reveals
wearing off . In PARDES (50) : Kismet banane waley ... during the alto
climax , there is no such wear off of her larynx disernable. Its
perfectly smooth.
Did you listen to AMARA KAVI('51) duet by P.Leela & MKT carefully. If
not listen again to MKT's male soprano portion.
MKT has to 'instantaneously raise his voice in a split second'. Was
there any unpleasantness during the split second take off. The entire
melodic value of the song wrested on that MKT's split second raise.
How his vocal chords were never affected from 1944 to 1951 with NO
SINGING AT ALL during his 3 yrs jail term and as perfect fettle
pos1948 to 1957 till his death in 1959 ??
This is not my version - but everybody's.
==========================
It is my humble suggestion / request to go on Google and type: 'The
Poemusimathesopher's Miscellany' by S. Maheshkumar.
Do you think it as bogus or a propaganda gimmick !
================================
21/3
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> At some point of her shrillness it does collapse - dint u notice.
What collapses? You are making vague references. It looks like you are
clutching at straws. Give it up.
> Do you think it as bogus or a propaganda gimmick !
Like I said, you do not know the difference between besurapan and
shrillness. Unpleasantness and other artifacts are also distinct from
besurapan. Admit it - you are totally out of your depth here. If you
do admit this, you might actually manage gain some respect.
C
Jay
> "Jay" <sjhh...@gmail.com> wrote :
You still have not answered my basic question to the point
==========================================
Everything in this world is a 2-way process
===============================
You keep on rattling only your side - why?
-------------------------------------------------
You are an educated person !
You have never disclosed your biodata on the forum honestly - why?
Any person capable of rattling so much in idaological defence in crux,
why is that same person so scared/freaked to disclose his personal
details pertaining to his study of cine music.
Have I not disclosed everything on the forum openly - Why can't you
also do that ?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I may have said so many things to/about Profji and Hamraz. That is not
the point of issue. Why do you get pissed off 'every now and then
deviating from the topic concerned.
As Dr. Aziz points out in one of his written letters to me, only
EQUALS can have a dialogue. In what way are you trying to prove
yourself .
Use a simple language - using a high flown language does not prove
that you are Mr. Right
Why don't you reply my questions to the point asked?
21/3