Do Sitaare : SHAMSHAD BEGUM aur SURAIYA (Results of RJGK 51)
neha...@hotmail.com
Subject: Do Sitaare : SHAMSHAD BEGUM aur SURAIYA (Results of RJGK 51)
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 11:35:19 -0700
From: Neha K Desai <nde...@nms.fnc.fujitsu.com>
DO SITAARE : SHAMSHAD BEGUM aur SURAIYA
RmIM JHIM GEETON KI : 51
June 15th was the birth day of one of our 'do sitaare'. Suraiya. This
post was delayed to coincide with that day. Kalyan promised to post
the results, but Kalyan being Kalyan:), wasn't able to compile and
post the results. Finally, here are the results on this quiz. We are
sorry for the delay.
We received entries from:
Vijay Kumar
Roopa Dhawan and Saleem
Sami Mohammed
Apurva Jain
Snehal Oza
Hrishi Dixit(Non-competitive)
Arunabha Roy
Narendra Joshi
Ashok Dhareshwar
Surajit Bose
Preeti Ranjan Panda
Thanks to you guys, we atleast have something to post:)).
General Comments:
Vijay Kumar>
Should say that this is one of the tougher RJGKs I have seen. Usually,
in an
RJGK, we have 3-4 esoteric songs. With two virtual RJGKs combined in one
real one, we have 7-8 "tough" songs. As you mention in your introductory
post, not enough of the 40s songs are easily available or regularly
heard.
So, even though the song itself may be known, even well-known, the
lyrics of
the stanzas may be unfamiliar and the p-stats equally so.
Roopa Dhawan and Saleem>
Thanks, Neha/Kalyan, for a delightfully nostalgic quiz!
Snehal> What songs of Roshan and Madan Mohan were on your mind?
Neha: I will make another post on songs I wanted to include, but
couldnt.
Arunabha Roy>This one's sure to go down in the annals of RJGK for
setting a
new low for RJGK scores :-) Anyway I liked the songs that I could nail.
Neha: I hope not:) And I hope when you see the answers, you will think,
'oh I know this song':).
Narendra Joshi> Many of the clues made it too easy to guess. The
"radeef" and "kafiya" of some clues simply gave away the answers.
Anyways.
Ashok> Very good quiz idea, very good combination of artists. Able
selection of songs to represent the artiststs. It was good of you
to step up to maintain the continuity in RJGK series. I hope your
timely
action helps save it.
Surajit Bose> I don't have too many comments on the songs etc. except
that I really enjoyed the quiz and thanks for putting it together!
SHAMSHAD BEGUM:
SOLOS
1)
mera jeevan pal pal jaaye re
rahun kab tak aas lagaye..
koi jaake usey samjhaaye re
o meri maut se pehle aaye re...
Papiha, Mor and Koyal are three birds that find their name being
mentioned in many songs. Our lyricists are very fond of them it
seems:). Generally their chirping reminds people of their loved ones.
Sometimes that is welcome, sometimes not. Seems like in this song
too the lady doesnt seem to appreciate the bird's song cause it reminds
her of someone she loves. This movie has 3 heroines with Raj Kapoor
two of them being Kamini Kaushal and Nargis. His debut in Hindi films
as a director and producer.
Song: kaahe koyal shor machaaye re
mera nanha sa dil ghabraaye re
Movie: AAG
Composer: Ram Ganguly
Writer: Behzad Lucknowi
Roopa>Lovely song; I seem to think it's a familiar Pujabi folk tune,
though
the words of the original escape me at the moment
Ashok> How do mor's chirpings sound? :)
You have ignored more interesting birds, like chakor, hans, totaa,
mainaa, and most importantly, the lowly kaagaa!
Neha: Mor chirps - Tehooooon...Tehooon:)
Well, maybe I should have included chakor/i, it certainly finds
a lot of mention in our songs. As for the "lowly kaaga", I know
only 2 songs "kaaga re jaa re..ja re" and "jhooth bole kauwa kaate".
Surajit> AAG is a wonderful soundtrack. I know that Raj Kapoor is
supposed to have replaced Ram Ganguly with S-J after this movie,
but I don't see why Ram Ganguly needed replacing! Every song is a
delight.
2)
This song is supposed to have been quite popular in its time,
according to Ameen Sayani on one of his GeetMala tapes.
I wont disagree. Music is by Nashad (not Naushad) and the lyrics
are written by Nakshab. In this 'song' the lady is wondering
about the magic of love...
ooo~~oo~~
phir wohi dhun suna..phir wohi geet ga~..
oo~~o~~
phir wohi geet ga..
aisa naghma thha seene se dil khinch gaya
haay dil khinch gaya...
mujhko tadpaanewaale ho tera bhala..
(hint, the name of the movie figures in the antara given above:)
Song: kaisa jaadu kiya mujhko itna bata
jaadugar baalma jaadugar balma
Movie: NAGHMA
Composer: Naashad
Writer: Nakshab
3)
na jaane kyun badalti jaa rahi hai zindagi meri...
na jaane zindagi meri
main dil se bekhabar dil mujhse gaafil hota jaata hai..
Naushad probably gave Shamshad the best among all her composers.
Most of her songs with Naushad are the popular ones. Nargis and Dilip
Kumar had many films together which had music by Naushad and
Shamshad's voice. This is one of them. Of course that changed with
ANDAAZ.
Song: chaman mein rehkar veerana
mera dil hota jaata hai
Movie: DEEDAR
Composer: Naushad
Writer: Shakeel Badayuni
Snehal> I love this song. Naushad's piano is really good.
Ashok> Which are the others?
Neha: Babul and Mela are two others I can think of (for Nargis, Dilip,
Naushad and Shamshad together). I havent looked at the GEETKOSH, but
it might help. The Nargis and Dilip films together that I remember are:
Babul, Mela, Deedar, Andaaz.
Maybe I should have written 'Of the Nargis-Dilip Kumar films, many had
music by Naushad and Shamshad's voice. This is one of them.' and ended
there. Would that have been okay?
Ashok> Have you got the timings right? When was Andaz and when
was Deedar?
Neha: I am sorry. You are right, ANDAAZ came before DEEDAR. When I wrote
the last statement, what I had read(about Naushad's major use of
Shamshad
in his films, before ANDAAZ and how he switched to Lata after ANDAAZ),
in
Raju Bharatan's book on Lata Mangeshkar, was in my memory. I know you
have
the book, so you will find it on Page 9, 10. For others, I will try to
type it out later.
4)
pos ka mahina ho milun tere baap se
tera mera pyar hai main kehdun tere baap se
main kehdun tere baap se
male chorus : hoy hoy hoy hoy..
maagh mein taiyaari piya phagun mein...phagun mein....phagun mein...main
kaise kahun
phagun mein sagaai ho
tera dil karta ho yun yun...aankh meri sharmaayi ho
jee aankh meri sharmaayi ho...
phir dekh maza...
Here is one of the many such fun songs that Shamshad shone in.
They totally suited her. In this Filmistan movie, the music is by
S D. Burman. The tragedy king, disguised with a huge mustache, sings
as a part of the chorus in this song. The film was a big musical hit of
the late 40's. Jeevan established himself as a villain from this film,
which was among the earliest with a backdrop of the refugees after the
country's partition. Also, in this song, the lyricist goes thru
teaching the names of all the months in the Hindu calendar.
Song: ek baat tu ban ja mera o pardesi
phir dekh maza
Movie: SHABNAM
Composer: Sachindeb Burman
Writer: Qamar Jalalabadi
Ashok> Was it really? (a big musical hit of the late 40's)
Neha: As per Satish Kalra, it is. And as per Surjit Singh's post on
1949 - year in Hindi films(?).
5).
ho dekh mere~~~..ho~~
dekh mere matwaale naina...duniya pukaare haay..
duniya pukaare haay...
chalun mein jis dam patli kamariya lachak lachak balkhaaye...(2)
meri thumak thumak chaal...ho raaja
thumak thumak chaal...
dil mein umangein aankh mein jaadoo..
sar pe sunehra jaal..ho raaja
sar pe sunehra jaal... ho raaja..more raaja
In the 50s, Shamshad was the voice associated with Cuckoo. Here is
one of those, composed by Ghulam Mohammed. Cuckoo was probably
the best dancer they had then. She didnt always have very curly hair
now did she? Or maybe she did, at least in this song:))
Song: mere ghungharwaale baal raaja ghungharwaale baal
dil mein umangen lab pe tarana
sar pe sunehra jaal..o raja more raja..
Movie: PARDES
Composer: Ghulam Mohammed
Writer: Shakeel Badayuni
6).
kyun tu mujhe Thukraata hai
mujhe nazar kyun churata hai
loot le duniya teri hai...
pyarse kyun ghabrata hai...
It is a typical Cuckoo song, which means she is dancing in a club
with men joining her as a part of the chorus. There is significant
use of 'khanjari' I think it is called. The one that looks like a dafli
generally used during bhajans. Can't not take her only Shankar
Jaikishan song for this quiz, even if only for variety:)(Not to mention,
Ashok must be given something to be displeased about:))
Song: ek do teen aaja mausam hai rangeen
Movie: AAWARA
Composer: Shankar Jaikishan
Writer: Shailendra
Ashok> Variety in quality? Not a good idea!
If it is your judgement that it is one of the 15 most popular/important
or greatest songs of Shamshad, say so. By including (or excluding) a
song just because it is composed by a favourite (or by someone
disliked),
all you prove is you have no respect for the artist you are covering,
for RMIM, and for music.
I have no major quarrel with you exercising your rights as the quizzer.
It is just that your other choices were good and why waste a precious
slot on an inferior song. Its inclusion gives the lie to your own
noble-
sounidng words:
"Regrettably, some of her good work with Naushad, OP Nayyar, Roshan,
Madan Mohan, and many others could not be included."
The worst aspect of this song is RPG. I don't mind minor extra-
musical noise in songs, if they add to the atmosphere of the song.
There is so much party noise here that the song can barel be heard.
It was totally wrong to chose the the soundtrack version for this
song in the CD. You can make amends for your sin of including this
song in the quiz by locating a clean copy. :)
Neha> Your highness, I will try my best:). And the song is a club song,
so the party noise does add to the atmosphere of the song. Response to
the
the other comments will follow in a separate post.
7).
How many times have we found ourselves going back in time to remember
stuff we have forgotten. One of vintage hits from a 1947 film. 'Second
marriages' were in vogue then too it seems. The music is by Pt.
Gobindram and the lyricist is Mr. Ishwar Chand. Kapoor. Lovely lyrics
and very well sung by Shamshad Begum.
phir aasha rang dikhaayegi
phir kali phool ban jaayegi
man chaahega so paayega
tere beetey din phir aayenge...
Song: man bhooli kathaayein yaad na kar
phir saawan ke din aayenge
Movie: DOOSRI SHAADI
Composer: Pt. Gobindram
Writer: I C. Kapoor
DUETS:
8).
shamshad:
dil pe chhayi khushi hai...labon par hansi hai
khili hai tere pyar ki chandni..
kishore:
jhoomti hai nigaahein...nasha chhaa raha hai
ke dil gaa raha hai teri raagini...
shamshad:
hole hole sajan mera kehta hai man
ab to laagi lagan...
Lovely, waltzy tune with one of the finest use of piano in the mukhada
and interludes while the antaras showoff tabla. In my opinion the best
Shamshaad and Kishore duets. Here we have Shamshad playbacking
for Meena Kumari...
Song: meri neendon mein tum mere khwaabon mein tum
ho chuke ham tumhaari mohabbat mein gum
Movie: NAYA ANDAZ
Composer: O P. Nayyar
Writer: Jan Nisar Akhtar
Vijaykumar> This is a suitable subject for an FITB posting. See ISB for
incomplete song.
Neha: Dr. Bose, please note.
Roopa>What a divine song. What's unusual about this song is the fact
that
Shamshaad is singing a tune like this one. Post-Lata, she was generally
typecast into singing the more chatpataa songs, or the ones with folksy
ethnic tones. This one is more westernized, and has a lilting romantic
sound which the "knee-jerk" MD brigade would associate with gentler
female voices (roughly translated to mean childlike, and therefore
"feminine"!) But here's Shamshaad singing it, and how wonderfully too.
9).
A ghoda-gaadi song(not by OPN, for all you pavlovian dogs), by
Hansraj Behl. Both Rafi and Shamshad do so well in this song. Shamshad
actually says 'sajNA' at times in this song giving it a very punjabi
touch. The movie has another good song set in two-paces "nain dwaar
se man mein wo aake' a mukesh-lata duet. This song starts and ends
with both of them humming in unison. Since I like this song a lot,
I will give both the Rafi and Shamshad part in the clue.
Rafi:
mud ke na dekhe kabhi dilwaale chhodi huyi manzil ko
chhodi huyi manzil ko
Shamshad
chal hi diye to rukna kaise ab jo ho so ho..
ab jo..ho...so ho..
Shamshad:
tu hai meri kaaya main hun teri chhaaya
jahan tu hai main bhi hun wahan...
ke tere bina jaana hai kahan...balleya...
Song: bheega bheega pyar ka sama
bata de tujhe jaana hai kahan balliye bata de tujhe...
Movie: SAAWAN
Composer: Hansraj Behl
Writer:
10).
aankhein kholo...
aankhein kholo badal gaya india ka map
badla india ka map..
bhaag gayi angrezi topi reh gayi gaandhi cap
bhaag gayi angrezi topi reh gayi gaandhi cap
reh gayi gaandhi cap
reh gayi apni gaandhi cap
down down angrezi topi~~~
down down angrezi topi~~~
up up gandhi cap
up up gandhi cap
khaddar pehno
aji tum khaddar pehno
khaddar pehno gentleman
Be an Indian if you can. Probably another song from post-independence
era. Here we have a duet with Lalita Dewoolkar where both of them sing
together almost all the time, but with Shamshad's voice coming up
prominently in the antaras. Music is by Shyam Sunder who later defected
to the Lata-devotees club.
Song: Hello Hello Gentleman milate kyun nahi hamse nain
tabiyat kaisi hai kaisi hai kaisi hai
Movie: ACTRESS
Composer: Shyam Sunder
Writer:
Ashok>It is an unacceptable statement, Neha. This quiz is about
Shamshad.
It is the wrong occasion to parade your Lata devotion. You are also
insulting the memory of a great composer by such inappropriate,
childish language. He was one of the artists because of whom
Lata grew as a singer. Remember that he was the person who
introduced Rafi to playback singing. Even after he started using
Lata, he continued to look for other talents. For example, he gave
a very good break to Sulochana Kadam in Dholak.
In a Shamshad quiz, if you are interested in historical analysis at
all (you need not be; but if you are), it is a very good question to
ask if it was right on the part of the various music directors
(especially C. Ramchandra and Naushad, who had good chemistry with
Shamsahd) to have cut off Shamshad totally, to "defect" as you put it.
Neha: Ashok, response will come in my separate response post.
11).
The following song is a duet with Ghulam Haider who also composed the
song. It is from one of her first films as early as 1941. This film can
be called a milestone in her career. She became an overnight sensation
with this movie.
nain se nikale nain mein aayein..
nainon se hriday mein samaayein
ek baan se aag laga kar
ek baan se aag bujhaayein..
zaalem din aur rain na dekhe
baan chalein aur nain na dekhe
Song: nain ko baan ki reet anokhi
baan chale aur nain ne dekhe
Movie: KHAZANCHI
Composer: Ghulam Haider
Writer: Wali Sahab
or:
jo taara..dooba...chamkega(2)
jo taara..dooba...chamkega
jo shama..bujhi...haan...jal jaayegi
jo shama..bujhi...haan...jal jaayegi
shab guzregi din niklega
aur gayi khushi phir aayegi
kyun gham ki andheri raaton mein
kyun gham ki andheri raaton mein
tum din ka nikalna bhool gaye...
The mukhada of this line is a beautiful play of words where 'yaad' is
used both as a noun and as a verb. Lovely song, music is by Master
Ghulam Haider. This is duet with G M. Durrani, though only Shamshad's
part is used here. He is disappointed and she seems to be encouraging
him with the hopeful lines. Another of the 40s songs,1946 to be precise.
Song: ek yaad kisi ki yaad rahi
aur saari duniya bhool gaye
Movie: SHAMA
Composer: Ghulam Haider
Writer: Ehzaan Rizwi
Ashok>"yaad" as verb? Where? In "ek yaad kisi ki yaad rahi", both uses
of
the word "yaad" appear to be nouns to me. The Urdu variant of
Hindustani
is a particularly pathetic dialect in terms of verbs. I don't know
whether it inherits this feature from Persian or Arabic, but it looks
to me like a steroid-loaded adolescent, who becomes old without going
through adulthood. It doesn't have scope for such interesting usages
as you claim to see here.
12).
talat:
hanste hi na aa jaaye kahin aankhon mein aansu
aankhon mein aansu...
shamshad:
hanste hi na aa jaaye kahin aankhon mein aansu
aankhon mein aansu...
talat:
bharte hi chhalak jaaye na paimana kisi ka...
shamshad:
bharte hi chhalak jaaye na paimana kisi ka...
(no hints)
Song: milate hi aankhein dil hua deewana kisi ka
afsana mera ban gaya afsana kisi ka
Movie: BABUL
Composer: Naushad
Writer: Shakeel Badayuni
Sami>is it paimaana kisika or paimaana KHushi ka ?
Neha: I always heard it as 'kisika' but now that you say 'khushi' also
fits properly. ppl?
or
mohabbat karnewaalo ka hai bas itnaa hi afsana
tadapna chupke chupke aahein bharna ghuT ke mar jaana
tadapna chupke chupke haan haan
tadapna chupke chupke aahein bharna ghuT ke mar jaana
kisi din ye tamasha muskura kar ham bhi dekhenge
Keeping in mind the recent Qawaali's thread, here is the Shamshad
part of a Shamshad-Lata Qawaali. One of the best of its kind. Here
Shamshad's voice is lent to Nigar on whom song # 14 is picturised:).
Song: teri mehfil mein kismat aazmaakar ham bhi dekhenge
ghadi bhar ko tere nazdeek aaker ham bhi dekhenge
Movie:
MOGHUL-E-AZAM
Composer: Naushad
Writer: Shakeel Badayuni
Snehal> Why not pick up 'Kisi Ke Dil Me Rehana Tha' from Babul
instead? This M-e-A song is just OK.
Neha: I like this song and it well-known. Plus it was recently discussed
in the
Qawaalis thread, so I thought it would make the quiz easy. I do like the
duet from BABUL also.
Arunabha>:( Reminds me of exams in which the tough questions would be
compulsory and the "choice" questions would be the easy ones to which I
knew the answers.
Neha: :-)
Ashok> One of the best of what kind? Among Shamshad-Lata qawaalis? Is
there
another? If not, it is the best and the worst of its kind!
Neha: One of the best of the kind 'Qawaali'. I hope now it is not
ambiguous.
13).
Duet with Asha, only the part sung by Shamshad is in the clue. This song
has a heavy punjaabi flavour to it.
moTar na bangla maangu...jhumkha na haar maangu
dil ko jalanewaale dil ka qaraar maangu
saiyaan bedardi mere thoda sa pyaar maangu
kismat bana de meri...duniya basa se meri
kar le sagaai meri jaan!
hay re main tere qurbaan!
Song: kajra mohabbatwala ankhiyon mein aisa daala
Movie: KISMAT
Composer: O P. Nayyar
Writer: S H. Bihari
Arunabha> I guess everyone will be mentioning this
quote by OPN about this song . He was talking in retrospect about
Shamshad
whose voice he likened to the crystal clear "khanak" of a brand new
silver
rupee. He said of her prowess in "kajaraa mohabbat waalaa" :" A 55 year
old singer outshone a talented singer like Asha "
(Not that I agree , of course !)
Roopa> Very nice song. But it does confirm a the stereotype,
doesn't it? Asha gets to sing for Babita-disguised-as-a-man,
but who's still acting very much the woman, and Shamshaad
gets to sing for Biswajeet-dressed-as-a-woman. I suppose
we're meant to assume that Asha's voice sounds the way women
are supposed to sound, and Shamshaad sounds, well, more like
a eunuch!
14).
meri bhookh pyas bhi kho gaye gham ke maare
gham ke maare
main adhmuyi si ho gayi gham ke maare
gham ke maare
tum bin saajan janwari farwari ban gaye may aur june
tumhaari yaad sataati hai
For this song, no hints!
Song: mere piya gaye rangoon wahan se kiya hai telephoon
tumhaari yaad sataati hai
Movie: PATANGA
Composer: C. Ramchandra
Writer: Rajinder Krishan
Surajit> No hints needed!
15).
mukesh:
ek dil...dukh zamane bhar ke
haay re zamane bhar ke
shamshaad:
ham to bharose re rasiya hain bas tumhare dar ke
haay re tumhare dar ke
ho~~~ mere bhole bhaale dil pe sajan kya jaado kar gaye
Another duet, with Mukesh this time. Lovely song. The pace doesnt seem
to indicate that this is sad song, but we have Raj Kapoor talking about
his disappointment with the world. The picturisation is interesting. He
is singing it as a radio broadcast. The heroine Rehana is singing with
the radio broadcast at home on her friends insistence. Cool, no?:)
I realise that this song is a repeat in two of my own quizzes, but it
is the best Mukesh and Shamshad had to offer together, so couldnt
resist it.
Song: maine dekhi jag ki reet meet sab jhoote pad gaye
o~~ mera baalam itna dosh ke tum sang naina lad gaye
Movie: SUNEHRE DIN
Composer: Gyaan Dutt
Writer: D N. Madhok
Ashok> A strong contender would be "dharti ko aakaash pukaare" from
Mela.
That is a lovely song also, although Naushad doesn't deserve much credit
for it; he was inspired by an earlier non-film song of Ghulam Haider.
Neha: What? And give you another chance to complain about overdose of
Naushad?:) I have 2 songs from a Naushad-Dilip-Nargis-Shamshad combo
already in this quiz.
Roopa>I love Shamshaad's clear, crisp voice. And with what technical
precision
she sings.
SURAIYA:
Suraiya is one of the greatest singing stars to grace Hindi films.
Probably better known as a star than as a singer, she did get to
sing some great songs. She was fortunate to have worked with a
number of legendary composers (such as Anil Biswas, Ghulam
Mohd, Khurshid Anwar etc) who made good use of her abilities
(melodious voice, flawless pronunciation), keeping in mind her
limitations (limited vocal range). Unfortunately, owing to her
insistence on not doing playback for others (for most of her career),
her output is rather limited. There'll be a separate post featuring
articles on Suraiya and her filmography.
Ashok>Didn't she start her film career as a playback singer? Isn't
that what you mean by adding "for most of her career"? And what is
the basis for saying "owing to her insistence"? And at what stage
of her career? Once she became a leading heroine, was there ever
a question of her returning to playback singing?
16.
milane kii gha.Diyaa.N chhoTii hai.n,
aur raat judaaii kii lambii
jab saarii duniyaa sotii hai,
ham taare ginate rahate hai.n
Song: wo paas rahe yaa door rahe nazaron mein samaye rehate hain
itna to bata de koi hamein kya pyaar isi ko kehte hain
Movie: BADI BEHAN
Composer: Husnalal Bhagatram
Writer:
Snehal> Lata pales in comparison, doesn't she ?
17.
ai dil naa ro, hairaan naa ho
honaa thaa jo vo ho gayaa
rone se ab kyaa faayadaa
kyaa ho gayaa, kyaa ho gayaa
One of the Suraiya hits from a Noorjehan dominated soundtrack.
Song: socha thha kya kya ho gayaa..
kya ho gaya..
Movie: ANMOL GHADI
Composer: Naushad
Writer:
18.
aa.nkh na milaaye mose, bairan nindiya
bairan nindiya
piya kahaa.n, piya kahaa.n
pooch rahi nindiya, pooch rahi nindiya
rooth raha mujhse mera hi singaar X 2
aaja ek baar
A slower and solo version of the song, which has a more popular
duet version set to a different tune. Based on Rabindra Sangeet
by the legendary Anil Biswas.
Song: raahi matwaale..tu aaja ek baar..
sooni hai sitaar..mere man ki sitaar
Movie: WAARIS
Composer: Anil Biswas
Writer:
19.
dil jo har qaid se ghabaraataa thaa, ghabaraataa thaa
khud hii giraftaar huaa jaataa hai
One of the 3 Suraiya solos in the Ghulam Mohd soundtrack, considered
by many to be his best. The wonderful music is enhanced by superb
lyrics from Kaifi Azmi.
Song: aapse pyaar hua jaata hai
Movie: SHAMA
Composer: Ghulam Mohammed
Writer:
Arunabha> Doesn't the prelude music simply take your breath away ? Same
holds for
"dha.Dakate dil kii tamannaa " . Lovely tune and lyrics.
20.
awaaz de rahee.n hain , shaam-e-bahaar tumko
shaam-e-bahaar tumko
daaman mai.n muskaraate, phoolo.n ke haar lekar
And the refrain of the lovely song follows. Composer Hansraj Behl
made good use of Suraiya's potential in this song - and in the
four soundtracks they worked together.
Song: raste pe ham khade hain...dil-e-beqaraar lekar
guzroge kab idhar se apni bahaar lekar
Movie: RAJPUT
Composer: Hansraj Behl
Writer:
Ashok> Which are they?
21.
aankho.n mai.n tum leke pyaar aa gaye
gulshan mai.n bankar bahaar aa gaye
dekho vo kaliyo.n ko aayi ha.nsi
baadal ki chaaya mein naache khushi
tu hai to phir kya hai gum, tara ram pam
Unlike most Rafi-Suraiya duets, this one is a happy one.
And unlike most Naushad songs, this one has a lot of
western influence.
Song: ta ra ri a ra ri a ra ri
ye saawan rut hum aur tum
ta ra ram pam
Movie: DAASTAN
Composer: Naushad
Writer:
Ashok> Are most Rafi-Suariya duets sad ones?
22.
ham ne maanaa ke taGaaful na karoge lekin
khaak ho jaae.nge ham tum ko khabar hone tak
This song exemplifies Ghulam Mohammed's excellent ghazal
compositions. They are melodious without de-emphasizing the
lyrics. There are quite a few well-known renditions (by other
singers) of this Ghalib ghazal.
Song: aah ko chaahiye ek umr asar hone tak
Movie: MIRZA GHALIB
Composer: Ghulam Mohammed
Writer:
23.
hoga tere bas mein jahaa.n
apne to dil khil na sake
mujhko to hai itna pata
bichde hue dil mil na sake
This song has a less popular version sung by Rafi and is
from a Suraiya-Shammi Kapoor starrer. Music is by a composer
duo who gave Suraiya some of her best songs.
Song: o mera dildaar na milaya main kya jaanu teri ye khudaayi
Movie: SHAMA PARWANA
Composer: Husnalal Bhagatram
Writer:
Ashok> What is the basis for your determining which of the two
was more popular?
24.
jiiwan belii kare aTkhelii
mahake man ke bakul
priit phul phuule jhuula jhuule
chahke man bulbul, mahake man ke bakul
man kyaa jAne kyaa hogaa kal
dhaar samay kii bahatii kal kal
jiiwan chanchal jiiwan chanchal
din jaake phir aaye.n naa aaye naa aaye naa
Yet another song based on Rabindra Sangeet. This time the
composer is S.D Burman. One of the seven Suraiya-Dev starrers.
Song: nain deewane ek nahin maane karey manmaani maane na
Movie: AFSAR
Composer: Sachindeb Burman
Writer:
Snehal> Any Suraiya quiz should have this!
Arunabha> The SDB version is unnecessarily orchestrated , taking away
from the
sombreness. Anyone who has heard "she din dujone" by either Hemanta or
some other good exponent of RS will agree that the original is far
better.
Ashok> It is "aane naa". Kalyan, you are more careless than
HMV in your transcriptions, in many places in the quiz!
25.
aashao.n ne li angdaai, tan man mai.n baji shehnai
dil doob gaya masti mai.n, ek lehar khushi ki aayi
dil haath se nikla jaaye re, maalom nahii.n kyo.n
The great chemistry that Suraiya had with both Ghulam Mohd
and Talat can be seen in this melodious Talat-Suraiya duet
from a GM soundtrack and a Talat-Suraiya starrer.
Song: man dheere dheere gaaye re maalum nahi kyun
Movie: MAALIK
Composer: Ghulam Mohd
Writer:
26.
ud jaau.n piya, tera leke jiya
maine baadal ko aa.nchal mai.n thaam liya
mai.n aaj phooli na samaun, banake mai.n
banake mai.n tara.ng sama jaau.n ....
One of the last Hindi films of this popular 40s composer who
went on to achieve even greater heights in Pakistani film music.
Song: mere man mein uthey umang balam
Movie: MASHUQA
Composer: Roshan
Writer:
27.
dil pe to naaz thaa hame.n X2
ghuu.NT lahuu ke pii gayaa X2
kissaa-e-Gam sunaa diyaa
diidaa-e-ishq baar ne
This Jamal Sen soundtrack has gems from Lata, Suraiya and
Talat. Suraiya talks of her sleepless nights in this haunting
melody.
Song: raaton ki neend chheen li is dil-e-beqaraar ne
Movie: SHOKHIYAAN
Composer: Jamal Sen
Writer:
Snehal> Lata matches her now after a year, but just matches!
Surajit> I like the Suraiya-Lata duet from this movie too:
"duur desh se aajaa re" is very peppy and lively. Is it the only
Suraiya-Lata duet?
Neha: No. I know atleast one duet from BAALAM 'pardesi musaafir
arey pardesi musaafir'. ppl?
28.
koyi pyaar ki meethi boli se,
sapno.n mein aan.kh micholi se X 2
tarasaa hi gayaa, bharmaa hi gayaa
haaye mera jiyaa, meraa jiyaa
There is not one but two reasons for including this Anil Biswas
gem in the quiz. One, it's a Suraiya solo, and two, is the quiz
topic.
Song: o o mere, dil, ki, dhaDakan mein ye kaun sama gaya
Movie: DO SITAARE
Composer: Anil Biswas
Writer:
29.
shabnam se hum siikhe.nge, fariyad na karnaa ro lena
fariyad na karna ro lena
phoolo.n se siikhenge hum, kaanto.n ki nok par muskaana
phir duniya ko yaad rahega ........
A Bulo C Rani soundtrack dominated by Suraiya gems. The lyrics,
by D.N Madhok, talk of various things on which love should be
modelled so that it becomes immortal.
Song: parwaane se preet seekh le shama se seekhein jal jaana
Movie: BILWAMANGAL
Composer: Bulo C. Rani
Writer:
Surajit> Darn! and golly gee! I can SING the antaraa for you but I just
can't remember the mukha.Daa....
Neha: Dont you just hate it when that happens:).
30.
bujhaa do bujhaa do, bujhaa do sitaaro.N ki shammey bujhaa do
chhupaa do chhupaa do, chhupaa do hasee.N chaand ko bhii chhupa do
yahaa.N roshni mehmaa.N ho gayii hai
Suraiya's last film song. Coincidentally this is also the last film
for the composer.
Song: ye kaisi ajab dastan ho gayi hai
Movie: RUSTOM SOHRAAB
Composer: Sajjad Hussain
Writer:
Snehal> Will Lata be able bid farewell as mellow as this?
Arunabha> Love the way the tune and her voice carry into the high
notes in the antaraas.
Roopa> Suraiyya wasn't half as accomplished a singer as Shamshaad, but
what a voice. I found it very introspective and intimate, like someone
singing in a private space, for a private audience.
Now for the verdict:).
The 2nd runners up award goes to:
Vijay Kumar (25)
The 1st runners up are:
Surajit Bose (26)
Preeti Panda (26)
And the winners are:
Apurva Jain (30)
Ashok Dhareshwar (30)
Roopa & Saleem (30)
Congratulations all!
Hope you enjoyed the quiz. And now on to Ashok Dhareshwar's next RJGK.
--
Neha Desai
---------------------------------------------------------------
ye hansta hua caarvaan zindagi ka...na poochho chala hai kidhar...
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
neha...@hotmail.com
vijay...@my-deja.com
neha...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Neha: Mor chirps - Tehooooon...Tehooon:)
> Well, maybe I should have included chakor/i, it certainly finds
> a lot of mention in our songs. As for the "lowly kaaga", I know
> only 2 songs "kaaga re jaa re..ja re" and "jhooth bole kauwa kaate".
What about "more munder na bol, kaagaa jaa"? Then there is MeenaKapoor
with "mori aTariya pe kaagaa bole"? A much more recent addition to this
- maai ni maai munDer pe tere bol rahaa hai kaagaa. On kauwa, doesn't
the Kishore song in Half-Ticket go "cheel cheel kauwa bhi kajarii
sunaaye"? I remember there was one song which used the phrase "kauwa
chale hans ki chaal" Can't recall off-hand.
> 6).
> kyun tu mujhe Thukraata hai
> mujhe nazar kyun churata hai
> loot le duniya teri hai...
> pyarse kyun ghabrata hai...
>
> It is a typical Cuckoo song, which means she is dancing in a club
> with men joining her as a part of the chorus. There is significant
> use of 'khanjari' I think it is called. The one that looks like a
> dafli generally used during bhajans. Can't not take her only Shankar
> Jaikishan song for this quiz, even if only for variety:)(Not to
> mention, Ashok must be given something to be displeased about:))
>
> Song: ek do teen aaja mausam hai rangeen
> Movie: AAWARA
> Composer: Shankar Jaikishan
> Writer: Shailendra
>
> Ashok> Variety in quality? Not a good idea!
> The worst aspect of this song is RPG. I don't mind minor extra-
> musical noise in songs, if they add to the atmosphere of the song.
> There is so much party noise here that the song can barel be heard.
> It was totally wrong to chose the the soundtrack version for this
> song in the CD. You can make amends for your sin of including this
> song in the quiz by locating a clean copy. :)
>
A clean copy DOES exist. IIRC, all Awara tapes have the overlay of party
sounds. IIRC, I heard the clean copy on a "Best of Shamshad" kind of HMV
release.
> 16.
> milane kii gha.Diyaa.N chhoTii hai.n,
> aur raat judaaii kii lambii
> jab saarii duniyaa sotii hai,
> ham taare ginate rahate hai.n
>
> Song: wo paas rahe yaa door rahe nazaron mein samaye rehate hain
> itna to bata de koi hamein kya pyaar isi ko kehte hain
> Movie: BADI BEHAN
> Composer: Husnalal Bhagatram
> Writer:
>
> Snehal> Lata pales in comparison, doesn't she ?
Vested interest. Hear Hear!
> 23.
> hoga tere bas mein jahaa.n
> apne to dil khil na sake
> mujhko to hai itna pata
> bichde hue dil mil na sake
>
should have been "bichha.De hue mil na sake". Adding the "dil" in this
line makes for the agility of a vocal contortionist in singing the words
and maintaining the rhythm.
> 27.
> dil pe to naaz thaa hame.n X2
> ghuu.NT lahuu ke pii gayaa X2
> kissaa-e-Gam sunaa diyaa
> diidaa-e-ishq baar ne
>
> This Jamal Sen soundtrack has gems from Lata, Suraiya and
> Talat. Suraiya talks of her sleepless nights in this haunting
> melody.
>
> Song: raaton ki neend chheen li is dil-e-beqaraar ne
> Movie: SHOKHIYAAN
> Composer: Jamal Sen
> Writer:
>
> Snehal> Lata matches her now after a year, but just matches!
Will ignore that. Does not suit my vested interests :-)
Vijay
PS:Obviously, I have snipped large posts of the original in my response.
Add "(snip)" at appropriate places.
Sami Mohammed
> The mukhada of this line is a beautiful play of words where 'yaad' is
> used both as a noun and as a verb.
> Song: ek yaad kisi ki yaad rahi
> aur saari duniya bhool gaye
> Ashok>"yaad" as verb? Where? In "ek yaad kisi ki yaad rahi", both
>uses of the word "yaad" appear to be nouns to me.
Is it the nit picking season already ? As you know "yaad rehna" is one
of the verb forms for the noun yaad. I'm sure Neha meant precisely that
when she wrote the clue. If the second yaad is indeed a noun (and it can
be so), then the lyrics will have to be by Gulzar :-)
Eg: In "Yaad reh jaati hai aur waqt guzar jaata hai", yaad is indeed a
noun. But not the second yaad in "Ek yaad kisiki yaad rahi".
>The Urdu variant of Hindustani is a particularly pathetic dialect in
terms of verbs.
Is (are) the other "variant(s)" less "pathetic dialect(s)" in terms of
verbs ?
>It doesn't have scope for such interesting usages as you claim
Sure it does. But for that you'd have to treat it as a language and
judge it on the basis of its own grammar and not that of other
languages. The above accusation is similar to saying that you can't
score a goal in cricket.
I had made a short list of songs with such interesting usage and will
post it later. For the time being, here's an interesting non-filmi
couplet:
Maang ne dil maang liya
ChoTi kyun peechhe paRi hai
I find the play on "maang" as well as "peechhe paRna" very interesting.
Sami Mohammed (A Naushad fan)
Hrishi Dixit
> mera jeevan pal pal jaaye re
> rahun kab tak aas lagaye..
> koi jaake usey samjhaaye re
> o meri maut se pehle aaye re...
>
> Papiha, Mor and Koyal are three birds that find their name being
> mentioned in many songs. Our lyricists are very fond of them it
> seems:). Generally their chirping reminds people of their loved ones.
> Sometimes that is welcome, sometimes not. Seems like in this song
> too the lady doesnt seem to appreciate the bird's song cause it reminds
> her of someone she loves. This movie has 3 heroines with Raj Kapoor
> two of them being Kamini Kaushal and Nargis. His debut in Hindi films
> as a director and producer.
>
> Song: kaahe koyal shor machaaye re
> mera nanha sa dil ghabraaye re
My memory might be failing me here, but shouldn't this be:
"kaahe koyal shor machaaye re
mohe apna koi yaad aaye re"
and not "mera nanha sa dil ghabraaye re" ??
I think the obfuscator here is the pahaaDi tune from Roshan's "Baraati"
(1954) :
kahiin duur koyaliya gaaye re
mera chhotaasa dil ghabraaye re
sung by Lata and Sudha.
The birds are mixing things up.
..Hrishi
--
____________________
Hrishi Dixit
hri...@excite.com
Snehal B. Oza
>Song: ek baat tu ban ja mera o pardesi
> phir dekh maza
>Movie: SHABNAM
>Composer: Sachindeb Burman
>Writer: Qamar Jalalabadi
>Ashok> Was it really? (a big musical hit of the late 40's)
>Neha: As per Satish Kalra, it is. And as per Surjit Singh's post on
>1949 - year in Hindi films(?).
Yes. I have heard from the "lucky" generation and have read in articles that
it was a big hit. Now I will also concede that Dilip Kumar and Kamini Kaushal
must have played a role too.
>Song: ek do teen aaja mausam hai rangeen
>Movie: AAWARA
>Composer: Shankar Jaikishan
>Writer: Shailendra
>Ashok> Variety in quality? Not a good idea!
>The worst aspect of this song is RPG. I don't mind minor extra-
>musical noise in songs, if they add to the atmosphere of the song.
>There is so much party noise here that the song can barel be heard.
>It was totally wrong to chose the the soundtrack version for this
>song in the CD. You can make amends for your sin of including this
>song in the quiz by locating a clean copy. :)
I suppose Awaara LP had song without the party "noise". BTW, I like "noise"
version just for change.
>Song: maine dekhi jag ki reet meet sab jhoote pad gaye
> o~~ mera baalam itna dosh ke tum sang naina lad gaye
>Movie: SUNEHRE DIN
>Composer: Gyaan Dutt
>Writer: D N. Madhok
>Ashok> A strong contender would be "dharti ko aakaash pukaare" from
>Mela.
Also Ja Parwaane Ja.
>That is a lovely song also, although Naushad doesn't deserve much credit
>for it; he was inspired by an earlier non-film song of Ghulam Haider.
Which song is this, Ashok ?
On Suriya....
>Ashok>Didn't she start her film career as a playback singer? Isn't
>that what you mean by adding "for most of her career"? And what is
>the basis for saying "owing to her insistence"? And at what stage
>of her career? Once she became a leading heroine, was there ever
>a question of her returning to playback singing?
Did she act in Inaam ? (MD SN Tripathi). Perhapes not.
>made good use of Suraiya's potential in this song - and in the
>four soundtracks they worked together.
>Song: raste pe ham khade hain...dil-e-beqaraar lekar
> guzroge kab idhar se apni bahaar lekar
>Movie: RAJPUT
>Composer: Hansraj Behl
>Writer:
>Ashok> Which are they?
Rajput (1951), Moti Mehal (1953), Shan (1950). Don't know fourth one.
>Ashok> Are most Rafi-Suariya duets sad ones?
Hopefully not.
>Song: raaton ki neend chheen li is dil-e-beqaraar ne
>Movie: SHOKHIYAAN
>Composer: Jamal Sen
>Writer:
>Surajit> I like the Suraiya-Lata duet from this movie too:
>"duur desh se aajaa re" is very peppy and lively. Is it the only
>Suraiya-Lata duet?
>Neha: No. I know atleast one duet from BAALAM 'pardesi musaafir
> arey pardesi musaafir'. ppl?
They sung four duets. There is one Sanam and one more that I don't remember now.
>Song: parwaane se preet seekh le shama se seekhein jal jaana
>Movie: BILWAMANGAL
>Composer: Bulo C. Rani
>Writer:
Is 'Jake Nain Pyaare Pyaare Hain' from this film available ?
Snehal
Afzal A. Khan
neha...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Ashok> How do mor's chirpings sound? :)
> You have ignored more interesting birds, like chakor, hans, totaa,
> mainaa, and most importantly, the lowly kaagaa!
>
> Neha: Mor chirps - Tehooooon...Tehooon:)
> Well, maybe I should have included chakor/i, it certainly finds
> a lot of mention in our songs. As for the "lowly kaaga", I know
> only 2 songs "kaaga re jaa re..ja re" and "jhooth bole kauwa kaate".
I seem to remember one more :
"Bhor hote kaaga tu kaahe...". Again a Punjabi tune. From Madan
Mohan
in "Chiraagh" stg. Asha Parekh and Sunil Dutt.
Afzal
Hrishi Dixit
> Song: raaton ki neend chheen li is dil-e-beqaraar ne
> Movie: SHOKHIYAAN
> Composer: Jamal Sen
> Writer:
>
> Snehal> Lata matches her now after a year, but just matches!
>
> Surajit> I like the Suraiya-Lata duet from this movie too:
> "duur desh se aajaa re" is very peppy and lively. Is it the only
> Suraiya-Lata duet?
>
> Neha: No. I know atleast one duet from BAALAM 'pardesi musaafir
> arey pardesi musaafir'. ppl?
Another one I can think of is "bedard shikaari arey bedard shikaari" from
HB's "Sanam", I think a 1950 release. Very nice song.. I think I posted this
in the recent Meena Kumari tribute on ATMJH.
Gee, I just noticed a pattern here:
pardesi musaafir arey pardesi musaafir from BAALAM
bedard shikaari arey bedard shikaari from SANAM
<adjective><noun> arey <adjective><noun> from <sweetheart-synonym>
and both Lata Suraiya duets
Quaint, very quaint.
..Hrishi
pvyas
"Afzal A. Khan" wrote:
> I seem to remember one more :
>
> "Bhor hote kaaga tu kaahe...". Again a Punjabi tune. From Madan
> Mohan
> in "Chiraagh" stg. Asha Parekh and Sunil Dutt.
>
> Afzal
Couple of more..
Kauva Chala Hans Ki Chal AAkhir Bhula Apni Chal
A Rafi- SJ song. Dont' remember the film. Probably a Shammi or
Shashi Kapoor song
Another line from Padosan comedy number (Ek chatur Naar)
Kaaga re ja re ja re
Pankaj
Surajit A. Bose
> Most of her songs with Naushad are the popular ones. Nargis and Dilip
> Kumar had many films together which had music by Naushad and
> Shamshad's voice. This is one of them. Of course that changed with
> ANDAAZ.
>
> Song: chaman mein rehkar veerana
> mera dil hota jaata hai
>
> Ashok> Which are the others?
> Neha: Babul and Mela are two others I can think of (for Nargis, Dilip,
> Naushad and Shamshad together).
I don't know about MELA, but in BABUL, if I remember correctly, Shamshad
sings for Munawar Sultana--not Nargis at all. Lata gets the Nargis songs.
> Song: meri neendon mein tum mere khwaabon mein tum
> ho chuke ham tumhaari mohabbat mein gum
> Movie: NAYA ANDAZ
> Composer: O P. Nayyar
> Writer: Jan Nisar Akhtar
> Roopa>What a divine song. What's unusual about this song is that
> Shamshaad is singing a tune like this one. Post-Lata, she was generally
> typecast into singing the more chatpataa songs, or the ones with folksy
> ethnic tones. This one is more westernized, and has a lilting romantic
> sound which the "knee-jerk" MD brigade would associate with gentler
> female voices (roughly translated to mean childlike, and therefore
> "feminine"!) But here's Shamshaad singing it, and how wonderfully too.
Actually, Shamshad is not at her best in this song; her voice is very
strained and does not quite reach all the high notes in the antaraas.
> Song: milate hi aankhein dil hua deewana kisi ka
> afsana mera ban gaya afsana kisi ka
> Movie: BABUL
> Composer: Naushad
> Writer: Shakeel Badayuni
>
> Sami>is it paimaana kisika or paimaana KHushi ka ?
>
> Neha: I always heard it as 'kisika' but now that you say 'khushi' also
> fits properly. ppl?
It is "kisii kaa." "Khushii kaa" would destroy the Gazal form.
> Song: mere piya gaye rangoon wahan se kiya hai telephoon
Shouldn't that be "Tailiiphuun"? I am utterly, hopelessly, totally, and
desperately in love with this song, by the way, if anybody cares.
>
> 26.
> ud jaau.n piya, tera leke jiya
> maine baadal ko aa.nchal mai.n thaam liya
> mai.n aaj phooli na samaun, banake mai.n
> banake mai.n tara.ng sama jaau.n ....
>
> One of the last Hindi films of this popular 40s composer who
> went on to achieve even greater heights in Pakistani film music.
>
> Song: mere man mein uthey umang balam
> Movie: MASHUQA
> Composer: Roshan
Roshan a popular 1940s film composer who achieved greater heights in
Pakistani film music? MASHUQA one of his last soundtracks? Either I'm
woefully uninformed (entirely possible) or Kalyan has Roshan mixed up with
Ghulam Haider. As Neha so fetchingly says, "ppl?"
> Roopa> Suraiyya wasn't half as accomplished a singer as Shamshaad, but
> what a voice. I found it very introspective and intimate, like someone
> singing in a private space, for a private audience.
I am not sure why you say Suraiya "wasn't half as accomplished a singer."
Shamshad Begum isn't noticeably better trained vocally than Suraiya, and
her singing, particularly in the high registers, can sound very strained.
Shamshad sings with great panache, but then Suraiya sings with finesse.
Her voice is sweet without being cloying--if Lata's voice is syrup,
Suraiya's is honey. In terms of sheer musicianship, of course, Lata is in
a different class altogether--not only from Suraiya, but from Shamshad as
well. As far as musicianship goes, Shamshad is not clearly better than
Suraiya.
One difference between Shamshad and Suraiya is that Suraiya's voice
exploits the microphone. Shamshad produces her voice full-throatedly and
with little modulation of volume. Suraiya's singing style, in this regard,
is more modern--as you say, "intimate, like someone singing in a private
space." Shamshad's voice could hold up for a public performance sans
mike--it's doubtful whether Suraiya's could. However, Roopa, in the light
of your comments about stereotypical feminine/childlike voices above (re:
"mere nii.ndo.n me.n tum"), it's amusing that you should find Suraiya's
voice so praiseworthy!
Seriously, though, a clarification of your "not half as accomplished"
remark would be nice. Enquiring minds want to know...
> Song: parwaane se preet seekh le shama se seekhein jal jaana
> Movie: BILWAMANGAL
> Composer: Bulo C. Rani
> Writer:
>
> Surajit> Darn! and golly gee! I can SING the antaraa for you but I just
> can't remember the mukha.Daa....
>
> Neha: Dont you just hate it when that happens:).
I meant to write "gosh darn! and golly gee!" but I guess I censored out
the "gosh." Yes, I do hate it when that happens.
Can the quizmeisters do us readers a flavor and indicate available
recordings of the songs in the quiz?
-Surajit
Ashok
>
>
>> The mukhada of this line is a beautiful play of words where 'yaad' is
>> used both as a noun and as a verb.
>
>> aur saari duniya bhool gaye
>
>>uses of the word "yaad" appear to be nouns to me.
>
When is it NOT that season? :) But, it looks to be an interesting
conceptual issue.
>As you know "yaad rehna" is one
>of the verb forms for the noun yaad.
Not as far as I know! Verb form? It looks like a juxtaposition
of a noun, yaad, and a verb rehanaa. "Have a nice time" is not
a verb form of time or nice!
>I'm sure Neha meant precisely that
>when she wrote the clue. If the second yaad is indeed a noun (and it can
>be so), then the lyrics will have to be by Gulzar :-)
gar yaad rahe!
>Eg: In "Yaad reh jaati hai aur waqt guzar jaata hai", yaad is indeed a
>noun. But not the second yaad in "Ek yaad kisiki yaad rahi".
All these usages are nouns. In the former line, "yaad" is the
subject. In the latter line, the first instance of "yaad" is
the subject and the second instance of "yaad" is the object. No?
>>The Urdu variant of Hindustani is a particularly pathetic dialect in
>terms of verbs.
>
>Is (are) the other "variant(s)" less "pathetic dialect(s)" in terms of
>verbs ?
The two other variants I know at least a little about (the one used
in most mainstream social films; and the AIR one) are considerably
better. Proof: your examples below!
>>It doesn't have scope for such interesting usages as you claim
>
>Sure it does. But for that you'd have to treat it as a language and
>judge it on the basis of its own grammar and not that of other
>languages. The above accusation is similar to saying that you can't
>score a goal in cricket.
It is possible to criticize some feature of one game by comparing
to another game. For example, take baseball and cricket, with respect
to batting. I can blame baseball for the way it has reduced what can
be a magnificent performance to a ludicrous one-dimensional affair.
Similarly, I would have liked to see, for example, more possibilities
of usages like "pehchaan/pehchaananaa".
>I had made a short list of songs with such interesting usage and will
>post it later. For the time being, here's an interesting non-filmi
>couplet:
>
>Maang ne dil maang liya
>ChoTi kyun peechhe paRi hai
>
>I find the play on "maang" as well as "peechhe paRna" very interesting.
>
>
>Sami Mohammed (A Naushad fan)
Your examples come from other variants! Of course, you can argue that
they are all one language; not even different dialects; at their most
different they are contextual variants. If you do, I'll concede. :)
Your example reminds me of a Shankar-Jaikishan song:
. chaar dino.n ki chhuTTi hai, (aur?) un se jaa ke milanaa hai
is maang ne dil ko maang liyaa, (ab?) maang me.n taare bharanaa hai
Rafi in 'Aas Ka Panchhi', I think. A film with three male singers:
in order of importance, Subir Sen, Mukesh, and Rafi!
Ashok
rdha...@my-deja.com
sb...@saintmarys.edu (Surajit A. Bose) wrote:
> > Song: mere piya gaye rangoon wahan se kiya hai telephoon
>
> Shouldn't that be "Tailiiphuun"? I am utterly, hopelessly, totally,
and
> desperately in love with this song, by the way, if anybody cares.
:-) Yes, yes, Surajit, we care! It really is a cute song, but I guess
your devotion to it goes way beyond "cute"! I must listen to it again.
> > Roopa> Suraiyya wasn't half as accomplished a singer as Shamshaad,
but
> > what a voice. I found it very introspective and intimate, like
someone
> > singing in a private space, for a private audience.
>
> I am not sure why you say Suraiya "wasn't half as accomplished a
singer."
> Shamshad Begum isn't noticeably better trained vocally than Suraiya,
and
> her singing, particularly in the high registers, can sound very
strained.
> Shamshad sings with great panache, but then Suraiya sings with
finesse.
> Her voice is sweet without being cloying--if Lata's voice is syrup,
> Suraiya's is honey. In terms of sheer musicianship, of course, Lata is
in
> a different class altogether--not only from Suraiya, but from Shamshad
as
> well. As far as musicianship goes, Shamshad is not clearly better than
> Suraiya.
>
> One difference between Shamshad and Suraiya is that Suraiya's voice
> exploits the microphone. Shamshad produces her voice full-throatedly
and
> with little modulation of volume. Suraiya's singing style, in this
regard,
> is more modern--as you say, "intimate, like someone singing in a
private
> space." Shamshad's voice could hold up for a public performance sans
> mike--it's doubtful whether Suraiya's could. However, Roopa, in the
light
> of your comments about stereotypical feminine/childlike voices above
(re:
> "mere nii.ndo.n me.n tum"), it's amusing that you should find
Suraiya's
> voice so praiseworthy!
>
> Seriously, though, a clarification of your "not half as accomplished"
> remark would be nice. Enquiring minds want to know...
>
Perhaps my use of the word "accomplished" is misleading, Surajit.
Clarification coming up!
My comment, in this context, was focused on an accomplishment that
doesn't have all that much to do with vocal training. Broadly speaking,
I think Shamshad is the more sophisticated singer in terms of the way in
which she interprets songs, and I'm speaking particularly of songs that
you might put in categories like "serious" or "emotional" or even
"tender." Now it's true that Shamshad singing is full-throated, which by
itself oughtn't to imply lack of modulation. When I look at the less
public/street/collective/festive songs Shamshad has sung, I find that,
along with being full-throated, as always, she also puts across the mood
of a song with a lot more intensity than Suraiyya does. I'm thinking of
songs like "maine dekhi jag ki reet," "mera dil todne vaale," "gham ka
fasaana," "chandni aayi banke pyaar," "kisi ke dil mein rehna thaa," and
my all-time Shamshad favourite "duniya badal gayi." AND "meri neendon
mein tum"! [You're right about her voice sounding strained on the high
notes, in this as well as in other songs that are pitched very high. But
the manner in which she uses (yes!) modulations in this song invests it
with a wonderful sweetness.]
Suraiyya, while she scores miles over Shamshad in the voice-quality
department, doesn't sing with as much emotional attention to the mood as
Shamshaad does (and of course we need to compare similar kinds of songs
sung by both singers; it's no use picking up, say, "kajraa muhabbat
vaala" and "nuktacheen hai" and then saying Suraiyya sounds more
subtle). And speaking of the word "finesse" that you use, Surajit, let
me make a distinction. I think Suraiyya's VOICE has more finesse, but
she doesn't SING with more of it than Shamshaad. Suraiyya tends to
simply sings the tune, and the tenderness of her voice does the rest.
She's a fine singer, and a careful one, and has the most divine voice
I've ever heard, but she's not an intense singer; and though I don't
expect intensity in every song, I certainly think the lack of it is the
lack of a certain accomplishment in a singer.
> (snip)... However, Roopa, in the light of your comments about
> stereotypical feminie/childlike voices above....it's amusing that you
> should find Suraiya's voice so praiseworthy!
:-). Did I ever say I don't like feminine, childlike voices? Now what on
earth could I ever have said to give that impression? :-) As you so
"fetchingly" say, [gosh] darn and golly gee!
But really, Suraiyya certainly has a feminine voice, which isn't
surprising, seeing as she's a woman; but she quite definitely has an
adult voice, which is also normal, seeing as she's an adult. So I don't
expect women not to sound like women (whatever that means), but I do
prefer the grown-up ones to sound like grown-ups.
Roopa
> Writer:
> >
> > Surajit> Darn! and golly gee! I can SING the antaraa for you but I
just
> > can't remember the mukha.Daa....
> >
> > Neha: Dont you just hate it when that happens:).
>
> I meant to write "gosh darn! and golly gee!" but I guess I censored
out
> the "gosh." Yes, I do hate it when that happens.
>
> Can the quizmeisters do us readers a flavor and indicate available
> recordings of the songs in the quiz?
>
> -Surajit
>
rdha...@my-deja.com
ADhar...@WorldBank.Org (Ashok) wrote:
"Ek yaad kisi ki yaad rahi
Aur saari duniya bhool gaye"
> In the former line, "yaad" is the
> subject. In the latter line, the first instance of "yaad" is
> the subject and the second instance of "yaad" is the object. No?
How about this: [mujhe][sirf] kisi ki yaad yaad rahi
There is what we used to call a "silent" or "implied" subject, in which
case, the first "yaad" is the object, and the second "yaad" is the verb.
I used "sirf" as what I think is the implication of the word "ek" here;
not "one" but "only" or "just". Neha's and Sami's interpretation makes
more sense to me in the context of the second line, though standing by
itself, the first line certainly works with both "yaads" as nouns. Both
lines together seem to draw attention to the opposition between
remembering and forgetting (both verbs). So, a weak translation in
English might read: "I remember (yaad #2) only the memory (yaad #1) of
someone, and have forgotten everything else."
Anyone? ppl?
Roopa
Ashok
>
>>Song: ek do teen aaja mausam hai rangeen
>>Movie: AAWARA
>>Composer: Shankar Jaikishan
>>Writer: Shailendra
>
>>Ashok> Variety in quality? Not a good idea!
>
>>musical noise in songs, if they add to the atmosphere of the song.
>>There is so much party noise here that the song can barel be heard.
>>It was totally wrong to chose the the soundtrack version for this
>>song in the CD. You can make amends for your sin of including this
>>song in the quiz by locating a clean copy. :)
>
No, it does not.
>BTW, I like "noise"
>version just for change.
Perhaps your attitude is the best. Party noise drowning out
Shankar-Jaikishan noise does decrease the entropy of the world.
>>Song: maine dekhi jag ki reet meet sab jhoote pad gaye
>> o~~ mera baalam itna dosh ke tum sang naina lad gaye
>>Movie: SUNEHRE DIN
>>Composer: Gyaan Dutt
>>Writer: D N. Madhok
>
>>Ashok> A strong contender would be "dharti ko aakaash pukaare" from
>>Mela.
>
>Also Ja Parwaane Ja.
Hold it. If you mean the great Bulo C. Rani composition for
'Rajputani', Mukesh's co-singer there is Hameeda Banu.
>>That is a lovely song also, although Naushad doesn't deserve much credit
>>for it; he was inspired by an earlier non-film song of Ghulam Haider.
>
>Which song is this, Ashok ?
Will post about it one of these days.
In article <sbose-22069...@sbose.saintmarys.edu>, sb...@saintmarys.edu says...
>
>> Song: milate hi aankhein dil hua deewana kisi ka
>> afsana mera ban gaya afsana kisi ka
>> Movie: BABUL
>> Composer: Naushad
>> Writer: Shakeel Badayuni
>>
>> Sami>is it paimaana kisika or paimaana KHushi ka ?
>>
>> Neha: I always heard it as 'kisika' but now that you say 'khushi' also
>> fits properly. ppl?
>
>It is "kisii kaa." "Khushii kaa" would destroy the Gazal form.
>
>-Surajit
Destroy the ghazal form? Sounds grim! But why? It doesn't do anything
drastic. It'd make the current radeef/kaafiyaa template ("--aanaa kisii kaa")
into a less demanding and less interesting "--ii kaa".
Ashok
Kolachala Kalyan
thought
of dropping out of the quiz but she helped out with half the clues (Shamshad
part),
responded to entries and compiled the results. I hope she (and future hosts)
are
not disappointed by the low turnout. Thanks also to all the ten participants
for
keeping the quiz alive.
I'll soon respond to some of Ashok's questions and comments on the Suraiya
part.
Surajit A. Bose wrote:
>
>
> > Song: meri neendon mein tum mere khwaabon mein tum
> > ho chuke ham tumhaari mohabbat mein gum
> > Movie: NAYA ANDAZ
> > Composer: O P. Nayyar
> > Writer: Jan Nisar Akhtar
>
> > Roopa>What a divine song. What's unusual about this song is that
> > Shamshaad is singing a tune like this one. Post-Lata, she was generally
> > typecast into singing the more chatpataa songs, or the ones with folksy
> > ethnic tones. This one is more westernized, and has a lilting romantic
> > sound which the "knee-jerk" MD brigade would associate with gentler
> > female voices (roughly translated to mean childlike, and therefore
> > "feminine"!) But here's Shamshaad singing it, and how wonderfully too.
A reputed RMIMer told me that around the "Naya Andaaz" time, OPN had been
unofficially boycotted by the music industry (I think based on some complaint
by
Lata to the MD association) and most singers wouldn't sing for him and so he
had
to use Shamshad and KK (both agreed). I didn't ask him about the Rafi-Asha
duet
in the film.
>
> > 26.
> > ud jaau.n piya, tera leke jiya
> > maine baadal ko aa.nchal mai.n thaam liya
> > mai.n aaj phooli na samaun, banake mai.n
> > banake mai.n tara.ng sama jaau.n ....
> >
> > One of the last Hindi films of this popular 40s composer who
> > went on to achieve even greater heights in Pakistani film music.
> >
> > Song: mere man mein uthey umang balam
> > Movie: MASHUQA
> > Composer: Roshan
>
> Roshan a popular 1940s film composer who achieved greater heights in
> Pakistani film music? MASHUQA one of his last soundtracks? Either I'm
> woefully uninformed (entirely possible) or Kalyan has Roshan mixed up with
> Ghulam Haider. As Neha so fetchingly says, "ppl?"
It is mostly my fault. In the initial post, I mistakenly posted an extract of
this
Mashuqa song while intending to post "Naya nainon mein rang" from Singaar by
Khurshid Anwar.
In the repost I changed the MD description in the clue to describe Roshan.
The
above hint is the wrong one from the first post. The error is regretted.
More than
that, I regret leaving out Khurshid Anwar who gave Suraiya some very good
songs.
>
>
> > Roopa> Suraiyya wasn't half as accomplished a singer as Shamshaad, but
> > what a voice. I found it very introspective and intimate, like someone
> > singing in a private space, for a private audience.
>
> I am not sure why you say Suraiya "wasn't half as accomplished a singer."
I leave it to Roopa to defend her comments. Shamshad certainly is among the
most versatile singers we have had. She was good in a wide range of songs
- from serious (Kaahe koyal shor, Man bhooli kathayen etc) to the better
known
fun songs. And IMO she was better (and at her peak) in her 40s songs, which
are
not that popular. And being one of the top singers for well over a decade,
she got
to sing some very good songs with a number of composers.
I agree she sounds strained (like Suraiya) in the higher notes. This reminds
me of
a song from Ada where KK and Shamshad have a contest as to who can go higher
and Shamahad wins it.
There was this recent discussion (initiated by VandanaI) about the preference
for
"thin" voices. I think it is more a preference for restrained voices (like
Lata's) over
full-throated voice (like Shamshad's and many 40s singers like Noorjehan).
Shamshad
was probably the last full-throated mainstream singer in Hindi films.
Fortunately this
trend didn't move on to the south where many leading female singers (e.g
Bhanumati)
continued singing in a full-throated style.
Suraiya mostly did playback for herself, except in the beginning. It is
debatable whether
it was by choice. In an interview (with Nalin Shah) Naushad mentioned that he
used to
(later) ask Suraiya to do playback for others but she wouldn't agree.
Clearly for many
singer-stars (Suraiya, KK) , their acting career was more important to them
than singing.
Even Mukesh and Talat suffered as singers when they started giving more
importance
to their acting (in case of Mukesh, for a short time).
> Can the quizmeisters do us readers a flavor and indicate available
> recordings of the songs in the quiz?
Many of the Suraiya songs in the quiz are available in the Suraiya GC (4
cassette pack).
It is a great compilation and is commonly available. The rest are from two
cassette packs
by HMV on Husnlal Bhagatram, Ghulam Mohd, Anil Biswas, Sajjad-Shyam Sunder
and
movie soundtracks of Dastaan, Shama Parwana, Shama, Mirza Ghalib etc. One
can find
quite a few Rafi-Suraiya duets (mostly sad) in these tapes. I'll list them
soon.
Kalyan
>
>
> -Surajit
U.V. Ravindra
ADhar...@WorldBank.Org (Ashok) writes:
> In article <sbose-22069...@sbose.saintmarys.edu>, sb...@saintmarys.edu says...
> >
> >>
> >> Neha: I always heard it as 'kisika' but now that you say 'khushi' also
> >> fits properly. ppl?
> >
> >
> >-Surajit
>
> Destroy the ghazal form? Sounds grim! But why? It doesn't do anything
> drastic. It'd make the current radeef/kaafiyaa template ("--aanaa
> kisii kaa") into a less demanding and less interesting "--ii kaa".
Theoretically speaking, I'm not sure "--ii kaa" is any less
demanding OR less interesting a radeef than "--aa kisii kaa".
Another way to look at this particular song/Ghazal, had the "paimaanah
Khushii kaa" phrase been used, is as a Ghair_muraddaf lyric.
(muraddaf is to radeef as musaafir is to safar. You do the math.)
Just wanted to throw that into the scheme of things here.
--
Ravindra.
vijay...@my-deja.com
ADhar...@WorldBank.Org (Ashok) wrote:
> In article <7knf86$i...@scel.sequent.com>, sne...@sequent.com says...
> >>Mela.
> >
>
> Hold it. If you mean the great Bulo C. Rani composition for
> 'Rajputani', Mukesh's co-singer there is Hameeda Banu.
>
> >>credit for it; he was inspired by an earlier non-film song of
> >>Ghulam Haider.
> >
>
> Will post about it one of these days.
aakaash pukaare" sound a lot like the overture to Gounod's Faust. I wish
I had heard that overture often enough to be able to determine if the
similarity ends there, or runs further.
Naushad is said to have composed that song in anguish over his wife's
demise.
Vijay
Snehal B. Oza
>Perhaps your attitude is the best. Party noise drowning out
>Shankar-Jaikishan noise does decrease the entropy of the world.
:-)
>>>Ashok> A strong contender would be "dharti ko aakaash pukaare" from
>>>Mela.
>>
>>Also Ja Parwaane Ja.
>Hold it. If you mean the great Bulo C. Rani composition for
>'Rajputani', Mukesh's co-singer there is Hameeda Banu.
Thanks for correcting this. I was indeed referring to Rajputani song. There
are many songs that come to mind but none seema to surpass Mela song. Following
Mukesh-Shamshad Begum duets come to mind:
Kya Jaadu Hai Tere Paas Piya
Soorat Dekhi Dil Haar Diya Ji Maine Haar Diyaa - Chehra (1946)
I would place this in same league as Sunehare Din song.
Kismat Me Bichhadanaa Tha, Hui Kyun Unse Mulakaat Re
and
Tu Mehal Me Rehane Waali, Main Kutiya Me Rehane Waala
and
Tumhaare Liye Hue Badnaam, Na Bhule Phir Bhi Tumhaara Naam
All from S D Burman's "dhamaakedaar" Shabnam (1950). I like them all but they
are good to very good, the last being my favourite. I am told that first two
along with one other Mukesh-Geeta Roy duet were more popular then.
Then we have Grahasthi (1948) duet 'Tumhe Aazmaane Ko Jee Chahataa Hai' which
is good too. Also comes to mind is Ankhe (1950) duet: 'Hum Se Nain Milana B.A.
Pass Kar Ke' which has it's own charming moments, but that's it. Other duets
came from Naushad's Mela & Anokhi Ada and from Aag - all in 1948.
Are there any more ?
Snehal
il_...@yahoo.com
Kolachala Kalyan <kal...@fnc.fujitsu.com> wrote:
I do not know how far this story is true. In 1956, OPN
had the tremendous hit "C.I.D.". "Hum Sab Chor Hain"
and "Tum Sa Nahin Dekha" came around the same time as
"Naya Andaz". So it is difficult to believe that there
was a boycott of OPN around this time. I think the
time-frame of this may be around 1959, when Sheikh
Mukhtar's "Do Ustaad" was released. Its songs climbed
the chartbuster list in Binaca Geet Mala. There was
strong reason to believe that the quick climb of these
songs was manipulated. Earlier, Shankar-Jaikishan had
already made known their musical protest through the
song "Teen kanastar peet peet kar gala phaar kar
chillaana" in "Love Marriage". Then, all of a sudden,
the songs of "Do Ustaad" vanished from Binaca Geet Mala.
And there was a definite (though unannounced) ban on
OPN songs on Radio Ceylon. I do remember that once,
during this period, Gopal Sharma (well-known Radio
Ceylon broadcaster) made an oblique reference to this
by saying that "ab hamaare station se hulla-gulla qism
ke gaane bajna band ho gaye hain". So, I believe, the
story of the boycott really belongs to the period fol-
lowing "Do Ustaad". In actual fact also, OPN suffered
a virtual decline and his career was resurrected only
when "Ek Musafir Ek Hasina" was released in 1962.
Although he continued to give some outstanding music in
films like "Phir Wohi Dil Laya Hoon", "Mere Sanam" and
"Pran Jaye Par Vachan Na Jaye", the old magic was gone
forever. This alternative view is offered with due
apologies to the "prominent RMIMer" referred to earlier.
>
> >
> > > 26.
> > > ud jaau.n piya, tera leke jiya
> > > maine baadal ko aa.nchal mai.n thaam liya
> > > mai.n aaj phooli na samaun, banake mai.n
> > > banake mai.n tara.ng sama jaau.n ....
> > >
> > > One of the last Hindi films of this popular 40s composer who
> > > went on to achieve even greater heights in Pakistani film music.
> > >
> > > Song: mere man mein uthey umang balam
> > > Movie: MASHUQA
> > > Composer: Roshan
> It is mostly my fault. In the initial post, I mistakenly posted an
extract of
> this
> Mashuqa song while intending to post "Naya nainon mein rang" from
Singaar by
> Khurshid Anwar.
> In the repost I changed the MD description in the clue to describe
Roshan.
> The
> above hint is the wrong one from the first post. The error is
regretted.
> More than
> that, I regret leaving out Khurshid Anwar who gave Suraiya some very
good
> songs.
"Naya nainon men rang" is indeed a great song beautifully
sung by Suraiyya. I believe the song was re-used and
included in a subsequent Pakistani film and it was sung
by its elegant leading lady Musarrat Nazir. Like Noor-
jahan and Suraiyya, Musarrat Nazir too was a singing star.
Of course, excluding the present time when we have
singers like Jaspindar Nirula.
Shamshad Begum gave very few live concerts and it was my
good fortune to attend almost all of them. If the expres-
sion "belting out a song" suited a singer, it did Shamshad.
Her singing had a unique charm all its own. RMIMers will
have their own list of songs which they missed in the
quiz. I can think of two :
(a) "Ik Tera Sahaara". This is an invocation to God.
Shamshad began all her concerts with this song.
(b) "Ik Baar Phir Kaho Zara". I think this was a
non-filmi song and was all the rage in the '40s.
Afzal
> Kalyan
Ashok
>
>In article <7kr8f0$1u...@news2.newsguy.com>,
> ADhar...@WorldBank.Org (Ashok) wrote:
>> In article <7knf86$i...@scel.sequent.com>, sne...@sequent.com says...
>> >>Mela.
>> >>That is a lovely song also, although Naushad doesn't deserve much
>> >>credit for it; he was inspired by an earlier non-film song of
>> >>Ghulam Haider.
>Dunno about Ghulam Haider. To me, the opening bars of "dharatii ko
>aakaash pukaare" sound a lot like the overture to Gounod's Faust. I wish
>I had heard that overture often enough to be able to determine if the
>similarity ends there, or runs further.
>
>Vijay
I don't understand technical terminology of music like "bars." So, let
me ask in plain language. Are you suggesting that the melody to which
the words "dharati ko aakaash pukaare" comes from Gounod, analogous to
"itanaa na mujh se tu pyaar ba.Dhaa"? Or the that the orchestration
of the 'Mela' song is inspired from Gounod? The Mela song has extended
instrumental music toward the close (what Surendra calls end-lude" and
I hear some Western classical music touches there (of the symphonic
bombast variety, with mass assault of violins on the eardrums).
Ashok
vijay...@my-deja.com
ADhar...@WorldBank.Org (Ashok) wrote:
>
> I don't understand technical terminology of music like "bars." So,
> let me ask in plain language. Are you suggesting that the melody to
> which the words "dharati ko aakaash pukaare" comes from Gounod,
> analogous to "itanaa na mujh se tu pyaar ba.Dhaa"? Or the that the
> orchestration of the 'Mela' song is inspired from Gounod? The Mela
> song has extended instrumental music toward the close (what Surendra
> calls end-lude" and I hear some Western classical music touches there
> (of the symphonic bombast variety, with mass assault of violins on the
> eardrums).
>
"opening bars" phrase from Quiz time's Siddharth Basu who would play the
instrumental prelude for a song, and then ask the team to identify the
song from the "opening bars." I just assumed that was a standard phrase.
The Mela song may not have extended opening bars (in the above sense),
but it sounds almost exactly the same as the starting of the Faust
overture. Point is, I do not remember enough of the overture to see if
the tune to which the words are sung, is also reflected from the same
overture. I will try and get a copy of this overture and give you my
impressions after I have heard it again.
I am surprised that you find only the end-lude to be of the "symphonic
bombast variety", I find the orchestration of the whole song to be so.
BTW, I do not find it to be so revolting as to be called a "mass assault
of violins". Let me hazard a guess, you are not in love with much of
western classical music, are you?
Vijay
Richard Turner
>In article <7ktmho$j...@news1.newsguy.com>,
> ADhar...@WorldBank.Org (Ashok) wrote:
>>
>> I don't understand technical terminology of music like "bars." So,
>> let me ask in plain language. Are you suggesting that the melody to
>>
>"opening bars" phrase from Quiz time's Siddharth Basu who would play the
>instrumental prelude for a song, and then ask the team to identify the
>song from the "opening bars." I just assumed that was a standard phrase.
If I may offer a general point of information, it really isn't at all
"technical" in the sense of being difficult to understand. If you think
of a piece of music in Kherwa (?sp) taal, commonly used in filmi songs,
the rhythm may loosely be notated in this way:
4 / 1 2 3 4 / 1 2 3 4 / 1 2 3 4 / 1 2 3 ...
(although here, there is an emphatic "off" beat which slightly
anticipates beat 3, and a pause or "rest" on beat 2, but not to worry,
because) this equates to western "common time" or "four-four time" as
follows:
1 2 3 4 / 1 2 3 4 / 1 2 3 4 / 1 2 3 4 /
That, mere dosto.n, is four "bars" of music. Placed at the beginning of
the piece, they would be the "opening bars". Does that help?
>
> Let me hazard a guess, you are not in love with much of
>western classical music, are you?
>
>Vijay
Me neither. I have a preference for folk music, myself.
Richard, sharing what he knows, and learning what he doesn't!
--
Richard Turner
Hemlata N. Khemani
> I know even less of technical terminology of music. I picked up this
> "opening bars" phrase from Quiz time's Siddharth Basu who would play the
> instrumental prelude for a song, and then ask the team to identify the
> song from the "opening bars." I just assumed that was a standard phrase.
From what I know (and that is quite negligible), bars are the vertical
lines that divide the musical notes into different measures and double
bars end the music. Based on that info I think that "opening measures"
seems to be a more appropriate term to describe the first few musical
notes. But I do agree that I have heard the colloquial use of the
term "opening bars" a lot.
> I am surprised that you find only the end-lude to be of the "symphonic
> bombast variety", I find the orchestration of the whole song to be so.
> BTW, I do not find it to be so revolting as to be called a "mass assault
> of violins". Let me hazard a guess, you are not in love with much of
> western classical music, are you?
What sort of a guess is that! Do you mean that western classical music is
not much more than orchestras playing violins agonizingly or the dramatic
sonatas?
Hema.