- Sambit
----------------------------
Kishorekumar in Bangla songs
Kishorekumar's stint in bangla songs started with singing for films. His first
Rabindrsangeet was also featured in a film (Satyajit Ray's "Charulata"). He
ventured in basic ("adhunik") songs much later and finally he cut a couple of
disks of Rabindrasangeet late in his career. I don't know if Kishore sang any
other type of songs in bangla other that these three.
Kishore's Rabindrsangeet evoked a sense of anger from the purist section. And
that is not surprising at all considering the antiseptic way this section
treats anything related to Rabindranath.
But then Kishore's Rabindrsangeet is forgettable, at best. The hardcore Kishor
fans did not care about Rabindrsangeet, the purists would never listen to
Kishore's Rabindrsangeet (and rightly so, because Kishore neither had the
right training nor could he introduced anything new intellectually or
aesthetically into those renditions). So that leaves the casual Rabindrsangeet
listeners, and surely enough, from the business point of view, they were the
target listeners as far as the record-company was concerned. This is the
section who buys Sagar Sens to Asha Bhonsles. These people do not care about
the purity of Rabindrasangeet, all they care is whether they like it or not.
These people bought the records mostly for the novelty and the media-hype it
created, and also because they liked Kishore's other types of songs. To these
people, the target listeners, Kishore's Rabindrasangeet wasn't a flop, but it
was nothing extra-ordinary either. Probably this was the only genre of songs
that Kishorekumar tried to sing commercially and ended up remaining a member
of the "also sang" group.
A lot has been said and written to prove Kishore's competence as a singer,
especially as a Rabindrasangeet singer, by citing that Satyajit Ray used him
as the playback singer for two of his movies. For both the cases, the choice
was more from a cinematic point than from a musical point. The characters in
both the movies were portraying some free spirit, which Satyajit thought would
be best represented by Kishore's voice. The musical aspect of the choice was
in that that Satyajit was appreciative of the full throat singing of
Rabindrsangeet (as opposed to crooning). Kishore's style of singing thus
fitted both the requirements. But, one must remember, Satyajit was sort of a
purist in his taste for Rabindrsangeet singing and biased towards trained
voices. He never considered Hemanta Mukherjee's as a serious representative of
Rabindrasangeet singing. I'll strongly doubt if anybody thinks he would give
Kishore's Rabindrsangeet a clean chit.
When it comes to the basic songs ("adhunik" as termed by the Bengalis, ie.
"modern" but not from films), Kishore could carve his own niche out of the all
pervasive domains of Hemanta Mukhopadhyay, Manna Dey, Shyamal Mitra et al even
with his limited repertoire of songs compared to these singers. For these
basic songs, at least during the initial phase when he started singing this
type, he himself or Rahul Dev Burman composed the songs. Both of them being
Bengalis from Bombay and new to the Bengali scene with their enormous musical
talents, they set bangla lyrics to fresh and different tunes from the regular
composers of bangla songs. This is the first time when Mumbai lent its
successful musicians to Kolkata. Till this time, it was the oppposite.
Kishore's pujo-songs started becoming very popular during 1970s. His
free-spirit as a singer and a extrovert style of singing were healthy
deviations from the styles of the other established singers. And his followers
were also the newer generation who grew up more with Raj Kapur than with
Uttamkumar. Hemanta and Uttam - both were on their downhills. So, Kishore was
fortunate to get unadulterated group of followers. To the previous age-group,
Kishore's image was sort of a "chyangDa" (lafanga) who does more yelling than
singing. They never considered Kishore as a serious singer. But they also took
note of the few finest bangla songs that Kishore produced during seventies.
His "aakaash kano daake" (same tune as that of the hindi "yeh shaam mastaani"
from "Kati Patang") and "she to elona" are two wonderful songs under Rahul
Dev's music direction. Kishore's own composition "nayon shoroshi kano" can be
marked as one of Kishor's best compositions. But it was not till late
seventies that Kishore attained an iconic stature in bangla as a musical
personality for bangla songs.
But long before these, Kishore introduced himself as a singer of bangla songs
in his own bangla production "Lukochuri" with Hemanta Mukherjee as the music
director. The songs became tremendously popular as well as the movie. But even
after this success Kishore had never seriously tried his luck as a playback
singer of the bangla movies - not till late seventies. (Some of his
early-seventies playbacks flopped commercially) For approximately last ten
years of his life he produced hit film songs one after another for bangla. And
those were mostly under the baton of younger music directors like Ajay Das or
Mrinal Bandopadhyay.
I don't think Kishore had ever managed the responsibility of a music director
in a bangla film. Even though, he composed most of his own bangla songs
himself, I don't think he ever composed for others, except once when as a
token of reciprocity he and Lata Mangeshkar composed each others pujo songs.
Kishore composed another of his memorable tunes "bhalobaashaar aagun jele"
which Lata sang beautifully. Unfortunately these songs were not as popular as
Kishor's renditions of Lata compositions, which in my opinion, were not as
good as Kishore's compositions.
Kishore's bangla pronunciation was clear and good, but he suffered from the
same problem that almost all the non-native bangla speakers suffer from. That
was the pronunciation of composite letters ("juktakkhor"). For example, in the
song "ei je nadi jaay saagore", Kishore pronounced "kaaro kapaal BHAN.GE
jemon, nadi BHAN.GE taar kul" etc. The pronunciation of "bhange" was not like
a typical native speaker. But then Kishore was not a typical native speaker of
bangla.
Except the last few years of his life, I don't think, Kishore ever took the
his bangla-singing-career seriously. In return, the mainstream bangla music
industry also did not run after him, or took him seriously. During his late
years, with Hemanta, Manna fading out, Kishore's bacame the only choice for
the hero's playback voice. Those days, Kishore also, for some reason, became
more receptive to the offers from kolkata. So, ironically, he impacted the
bangla industry more during his twilight years than during his heydays.
(c) Sambit Basu 2001
Sambit Basu <sambi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1df3ae06.01081...@posting.google.com...
Whether Kishore was fit for RabindraSangeet , is a totally subjective call.
In
Charulata, Kishore took some liberties in rendering "Ami chini go chini
tomare" .
He definitely did not sing it in a pure form that others have while singing
the
song. But it might well have been because of Ray's direction. And most
importantly, Vishwabharati, who have the official authority over Rabindra-
sangeets, did not object. In contrast, they lynched Debabrata Biswas.
>
> A lot has been said and written to prove Kishore's competence as a singer,
> especially as a Rabindrasangeet singer, by citing that Satyajit Ray used
him
> as the playback singer for two of his movies. For both the cases, the
choice
> was more from a cinematic point than from a musical point. The characters
in
> both the movies were portraying some free spirit, which Satyajit thought
would
> be best represented by Kishore's voice. The musical aspect of the choice
was
> in that that Satyajit was appreciative of the full throat singing of
> Rabindrsangeet (as opposed to crooning). Kishore's style of singing thus
> fitted both the requirements. But, one must remember, Satyajit was sort of
a
> purist in his taste for Rabindrsangeet singing and biased towards trained
> voices. He never considered Hemanta Mukherjee's as a serious
representative of
> Rabindrasangeet singing. I'll strongly doubt if anybody thinks he would
give
Did he say anywhere that he did not like Hemanta's Rabindrasangeet or is it
your guess ? After all Rabindrasangeet would not be as popular as it is
today
had Hemanta not popularized it with his splendid voice.
This was probably intentional. I have heard Kishore speaking Bengali and I
did
not find any non-Bengali accent. The song " ei je nodi" had a folk song like
language , partly Bangal . So, the lyricist ( Mukul Datta ? ) must have told
him
to keep in mind that the song is Bangal. As a result he pronounced BHANGE
like a Bangal .
A nice write up. One correction and one comment.
> His first
> Rabindrsangeet was also featured in a film (Satyajit Ray's "Charulata").
Charulata was a 1964 release. KK sang his first Rabindrasangeet in
"Lukochuri"(1955) - 'maya bana biharini horini.' His second Rabindrasangeet
was 'ektuku chhnoa lage ekuku katha shuni' from the 1961 movie
"Ektuku chhnoa lage" - sort of an ill-made Lukochuri sequel with a
triangular love theme thrown in. "Charulata"(1964) would then be the third
instance of KK singing a Rabindrasangeet.
> Kishore's Rabindrsangeet evoked a sense of anger from the purist section.
Pronunication did it for him possibly. As it did for Manna De's Rabindrasangeet.
<snip>
> But even
> after this success Kishore had never seriously tried his luck as a playback
> singer of the bangla movies - not till late seventies. (Some of his
> early-seventies playbacks flopped commercially) For approximately last ten
> years of his life he produced hit film songs one after another for bangla.
The much needed breakthrough to reintroduce KK as a playback singer
in Bengali movies and also to make him the last 'voice' that Uttamkumar
would have, were the two consecutive Hindi-Bengali bilingual hits (bengali
hit movies at least, not sure about the Hindi box office results of
these movies) 'Anand Ashram' and 'Amanush'.
-Prithviraj
>> But even
>> after this success Kishore had never seriously tried his luck as a playback
>> singer of the bangla movies - not till late seventies. (Some of his
>> early-seventies playbacks flopped commercially) For approximately last ten
>> years of his life he produced hit film songs one after another for bangla.
>
>The much needed breakthrough to reintroduce KK as a playback singer
>in Bengali movies and also to make him the last 'voice' that Uttamkumar
>would have, were the two consecutive Hindi-Bengali bilingual hits (bengali
>hit movies at least, not sure about the Hindi box office results of
>these movies) 'Anand Ashram' and 'Amanush'.
Was it a conscious decision on the part of Uttam Kumar to switch to Kishore from
Hemant/Manna or was it more a matter of the MD choosing Kishore for UttamK?
Ketan
>The much needed breakthrough to reintroduce KK as a playback singer
>in Bengali movies and also to make him the last 'voice' that Uttamkumar
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Didn't Bhupendra sing for Uttam Kumar in Dooriyaa.n (mere ghar aanaa zindagii),
unless Dooriyaan was made before Amanush or you are talking about only Bengali
movies. I thought Dooriyaan was a late 70's or early 80s movie with Anuradha P
and Bhupendra as the playback singers for Sharmila and Uttam K.
- Malini
> > But, one must remember, Satyajit was sort of a
> > purist in his taste for Rabindrsangeet singing and biased
> > towards trained voices. He never considered Hemanta
> > Mukherjee's as a serious representative of Rabindrasangeet
> > singing.
> Did he say anywhere that he did not like Hemanta's Rabindrasangeet or is it
> your guess ?
He didn't express his dislike for Hemanta's RS in so many words.
But he mentioned Hemanta's name in one of the in-depth interviews
he had with Subhash Chowdhury, which was published in "Dhrubapad"
around 1997-98, to illustrate that Hemanta's renditions
lack some aspect of RS which Satyajit expects. This interview
was a followup on Satyajit's article on Rabindrasangeet he wrote
in late 1960s. If one reads these two, one can get a definitive
idea on Satyajit's view on RS singing.
> > Kishore's bangla pronunciation was clear and good, but he
> > suffered from the
> > same problem that almost all the non-native bangla speakers
> > suffer from. That
> > was the pronunciation of composite letters ("juktakkhor").
> > For example, in the
> > song "ei je nadi jaay saagore", Kishore pronounced "kaaro kapaal BHAN.GE
> > jemon, nadi BHAN.GE taar kul" etc. The pronunciation of "bhange" was not
> like
>
> This was probably intentional. I have heard Kishore speaking Bengali and I
> did
> not find any non-Bengali accent. The song " ei je nodi" had a folk song like
> language , partly Bangal . So, the lyricist ( Mukul Datta ? ) must have told
> him
> to keep in mind that the song is Bangal. As a result he pronounced BHANGE
> like a Bangal .
Possible, but unlikely. A similar misproninciation of the same
composite letter can be found in "she to elona", where he sings
"chokher duyaar theke maner AN.GINA ... ". But apart from a few
like these, his bangla proninciation was quite good, IMO.
- Sambit
> > His first
> > Rabindrsangeet was also featured in a film (Satyajit Ray's "Charulata").
>
> Charulata was a 1964 release. KK sang his first Rabindrasangeet in
> "Lukochuri"(1955) - 'maya bana biharini horini.' His second Rabindrasangeet
> was 'ektuku chhnoa lage ekuku katha shuni' from the 1961 movie
> "Ektuku chhnoa lage" - sort of an ill-made Lukochuri sequel with a
> triangular love theme thrown in. "Charulata"(1964) would then be the third
> instance of KK singing a Rabindrasangeet.
You are absolutely right. It was my bad. Thanks.
> > Kishore's Rabindrsangeet evoked a sense of anger from the purist section.
>
> Pronunication did it for him possibly. As it did for Manna De's Rabindrasangeet.
I would think, it was more from prejudice than pronunciation,
especially in the case of Manna.
> The much needed breakthrough to reintroduce KK as a playback singer
> in Bengali movies and also to make him the last 'voice' that Uttamkumar
> would have, were the two consecutive Hindi-Bengali bilingual hits (bengali
> hit movies at least, not sure about the Hindi box office results of
> these movies) 'Anand Ashram' and 'Amanush'.
That's right. these were followed by a big musical hit "Mother"
with Bireshwar Sarkar as the MD. Around that time, another
Kishore song from "Kabita" bacame quite popular.
The difference beween this stint and the eighties-stint was that
all these films had strong Mumbai flavor - For "Rajkumari"
it was Tanuja and RD, for "Kabita" Salil Chowdhury, Kamal Hasan
and Mala Sinha, "Ananda Ashram" and "Amanush" were Shakti Samanta's
bi-linguals with Sharmila, "Mother" had Amol Palekar and Sharmila.
But compare these with his eigties' playback, where he was
playbacking for Sukhen Das in Sukhen's low-budget movies like
"Protishodh".
- Sambit
Why are we Indians so obsessed with pronounciations? We don't hear
that there is a "correct" way of speaking English. A southern or
mid-western or Boston or Australian or Indian accent is easily
accepted in the US. What matters really is the thought! The exception
to this is the "stuck-up" Englishmen who think that only the "queen's
English is correct". Who knows... may be our obsession with accents
and pronounciations is a vestige of the British rule.
Seriously, we should learn something from a freer society like the US,
and look beyond accents, and pay attention to what the person is
really saying. The obvious extension to music would be to focus on the
singer's bhava and shruti instead of getting caught up in the nitty
gritty of accents. Sometimes I feel so fortunate that I don't
understand Telugu. There is a friend of mine who constantly focuses on
the "mistakes" that T V Sankaranarayanan (the carnatic vocalist) makes
in singing Telugu songs, and compares against Balamurali Krishna's
"perfect" accent. My reaction: I could care less.. I absolutely enjoy
both the singers.. both their knowledge domains are worthy of worship;
who the hell am I to poke fun at such Masters? Ignorance in this case
is bliss IMO!
Best,
Ramesh
> Seriously, we should learn something from a freer society like the US,
> and look beyond accents, and pay attention to what the person is
> really saying. The obvious extension to music would be to focus on the
> singer's bhava and shruti instead of getting caught up in the nitty
> gritty of accents. Sometimes I feel so fortunate that I don't
> understand Telugu. There is a friend of mine who constantly focuses on
> the "mistakes" that T V Sankaranarayanan (the carnatic vocalist) makes
> in singing Telugu songs, and compares against Balamurali Krishna's
> "perfect" accent. My reaction: I could care less.. I absolutely enjoy
> both the singers.. both their knowledge domains are worthy of worship;
> who the hell am I to poke fun at such Masters? Ignorance in this case
> is bliss IMO!
I don't know about others but I cannot enjoy the "bhava" of a song if the
singer is murdering the language I know. I don't know how to define
"murdering the language" but most languages usually have some
rules/conventions for pronounciation of sounds. For example the "zh" as in
tamizh if pronounced as "l" as in tamil, most tamilians (I mean tamizhians!)
would not find it pleasing, just as hindi speaking folks might not digest a
SPB or a MG Shreekumar pronouncing "k" instead of "kh" (likna vs "likhna")
in hindi. I enjoy most of SPB's kannada, tamizh and telugu output but I just
cannot enjoy his hindi songs mainly because of his accent. IMO, accent is
very important for a singer or a speaker.
Then again, you can argue which tamizh accent (Tanjavur, Madurai, Madras,
Nagerkoil etc) is "perfect". I don't know. Somehow all of those seem ok but
when you hear Lata sing in tamizh, you can easily say that her pronunciation
is not correct (as opposed to perfect).
A
>> Seriously, we should learn something from a freer society like the US,
>> and look beyond accents, and pay attention to what the person is
>> really saying. The obvious extension to music would be to focus on the
>> singer's bhava and shruti instead of getting caught up in the nitty
>> gritty of accents. Sometimes I feel so fortunate that I don't
>> understand Telugu. There is a friend of mine who constantly focuses on
>I don't know about others but I cannot enjoy the "bhava" of a song if the
>singer is murdering the language I know. I don't know how to define
So what you are saying is that the 'bhava' of a song is entirely dependent on
the pronunciations of the singer(s). Does it not matter that the singer manages
to convey any or all of the possible 9 'rasas' that are needed even if he is
butchering the language? We do have multiple instances of singers who have one
mother tongue singing for other languages.
Example : I don't think Geeta murders Gujarati when she sings in it. Infact she
sounds very sweet despite having no connection to the language(to the best of my
knowledge)in any way, unlike Lata-Asha.
Or, take the case of SDB--a singer who according to Kaifi knew barely 40 words
in Hindi. Can you say that his "Meri duniya hai maa" from Talash, fails to
convey the moods. More so, because the song appears twice in the movie, once
conveying love/respect for a mother and the second time conveying
sadness/anguish. Yet here is a guy, who is butchering the language and yet
managing to convey both those set of emotions depending on the mood of the song.
Lastly, if pronunciations are so important to get the 'bhava' of a song, can one
really blame the Chetan's for insisting that the lyrics be spelled correctly?
Can he not cringe at the sight of badly spelt/written lyrics? Why blame someone
else for getting caught up in something that we ourselves do too?
Ketan
Well, that depends on how important the words are in the form of
music in question. Your calling accent a "nitty-gritty" shows your
own bias. Somebody else might regard shruti to be unimportant
as far as the bhaava and the meaning of the poetry are conveyed
effectively. (Come to think of it, why not? Shruti adherance, like
pronunciation, is also an acquired skill.)
Direct comparison between light songs and classical music is not
entirely appropriate in this context. In film songs, ghazals etc. the
poetry is of primary importance. In Hindustani classical music,
words take a back-seat to melodic ideas. I suspect Carnatic music
lies somewhere in between.
In Hindustani classical, there *is* a role played by pronunciation
is a slightly different manner. Sounds are treated as carriers of
swara and not meaning. This dictates the way the singer says -
rather, sings - the words. However, this discussion does not
belong here...
>Ignorance in this case is bliss IMO!
Why in this case? It is always bliss! To quote Sanjeev Kumar in
Angoor, "jo hotaa hai, *duusaro.n* ko hotaa hai" :)
C
Sanjeev
:> Charulata was a 1964 release. KK sang his first Rabindrasangeet in
:> "Lukochuri"(1955) - 'maya bana biharini horini.' His second Rabindrasangeet
:> was 'ektuku chhnoa lage ekuku katha shuni' from the 1961 movie
:> "Ektuku chhnoa lage" - sort of an ill-made Lukochuri sequel with a
:> triangular love theme thrown in. "Charulata"(1964) would then be the third
:> instance of KK singing a Rabindrasangeet.
: You are absolutely right. It was my bad. Thanks.
As I remember, "Ektuku chhnoa lage" was after Charulata, more like in 1965.
A horrible movie. I went to see it only for the Kishore songs. Heroin was a
Bombay girl called Azra. This movie had another RS, "Prangane more shirish
shakhay"
I read somewhere at that time that Satyajit took Kishore for the Charulata
song because of Ruma who was his niece. (Not for any "free spirit" etc.)
Wonderful article. Was something worth reading in SCB after years. Do it for
other singers.
Samar
>A horrible movie. I went to see it only for the Kishore songs. Heroin was a
>Bombay girl called Azra. This movie had another RS, "Prangane more shirish
>shakhay"
Did not know Azra was a drug? :)
Anyway, I have this song on a video, that has Azra and another actor(I forget
who) dresses in the usual king-queen garb. They are singing a song, with clouds
drifting around them, then another scene when they are in a garden, swinging on
a jhoola, etc etc. Problem is--the song that is playing is "Aa neele gagan tale"
from Badshah (Hemant/Lata/SJ) and that too with jhankar beats. So someone, did a
cut and paste job over the actual Azra song is what I am thinking. Why, they
would do that is a mystery. Anyway, can anyone identify the Azra song? Guess,
this is what a Chitrahaar quiz would be like.
Ketan
I agree with you Arun .. an extreme mispronunciation where the meaning
of word is lost is usually not what I am talking about. Perhaps I
should clarify what is paining me...
Aside from the posting, an event that triggered my follow-up was the
reaction of our Indian crowd to a presentation by a social service
organization called "Guri" who made a presentation with song, speech
and music for Boston's August 15th celebration.. the sad part was that
the their philanthropic message (they collect money to build schools
for children in Indian villages) was completely lost and all my
"friends" only landed up discussing how ugly their accent was, instead
of contributing money, spreading the word or thinking of volunteering
for them! Very painful experience! I may be confusing several
different things at the same time (music, social work, sociology,
etc.), and only purging my frustrations! Thanks for hearing me out!
> cannot enjoy his hindi songs mainly because of his accent. IMO, accent is
> very important for a singer or a speaker.
I am sorry Arun .. this assesment of what is "correct" very much
depends on the frame of reference. We all get biased by our past
influences and mental susceptibility in defining the reference.
Aside from this minor disagreement, I fully agree with the statements
made by the other posters such as Chetan, Arun and Sanjeev....the
point about changing with the type of music makes a lot of sense
(light-music to carnatic to hindustani). Another factor is the type of
listener. I tend to focus on the tune before I latch on to the words,
but I know the "gazalers" among us (no pun intended) do exactly the
opposite.
Best,
Ramesh
A relevant issue struck me as I was going thru this posting. In recent
film songs(particularly Hindi) there appears to be no weightage given
to lyric. I am concerned as most songs are becoming sort of
instrumental music. And the lyric writers seem to be running short of
phrases and lack originality.
In a song "Ek ho gaye hum aur tum... humma humma humma...", if someone
replaces the words with "Kal aana tu mere ghar... valla valla
valla...", will it matter? No. Musicians are using singer's voice as
just another instrument. There is no link with lyric and music. Even
there is a growing trend of composing music first and then filling up
the gaps with lyric and a voice.
Compare that with an old song like "Dheere dheere machal ae dile
bekarar koi aata hai...". See how the bhava of the lyric is expressed
by the tune.
On 23 Aug 2001 01:00:13 -0700, deo...@hotmail.com (Abhijit Deonath)
wrote:
But the lyrics made sense.
Abhay Jain