SDB's Bengali / Hindi songs.
Srinivas Ganti
> Which followed a
> distribution of a collection of SD Burman numbers. For any SDB fan
> this is a treasure. Incidentally Srinivas I found another gem of SDB
> in Bengali 'Mono dere' in Guri's collection that is sung by him it's
> got a hindi version in 'Jaane kya tune kahi'. In SDB's voice the song
> really sounds delightful..
I hope people liked the tape on SDB. His Bengali songs can be heard
at two web sites.I excluded all of them from the tape
The only exception "Ghum bhulechi" is one of my all time favourites.
Listed below are those songs that have Hindi adaptations.
Debu's site:
http://members.nbci.com/debu/sachin.htm
4)o jaani bhonvraa / Jaani tum to Dole (Dr.Vidya)
5)kii jaas re / sun ri pavan purvaiyya (Anuraag)
6)Ghum bhulechini nashibe /ham bekhudi me.n(Kaala Paani)
8)takdum takdun /takdum takdum baaje(Bambai Ka Babu)
11)duur koii parabashe / wahan kaun hai teraa (Guide)
12)na amaare soshi / ja ja ab na mujhe yaad aa(Premnagar)
14)borne gondhe chonde /phuulon ki rang se(Prem Pujari)
16)baanshi shune aar / niind churaaye (Anuraag)
18)mono dilo na / jaane kyaa tuu ne kahii (Pyaasa)
20)shono go dakhin haoa / khai re hamne kasam (Talash)
Ferdous's site:
http://www.ferdous.org/sachin.htm
Third from Bottom:
tumii eschechhile / title song of Ishq Par Zor nahii
Last song:
nishite jaaiyo phuuloboney / dhiire se jaa na bagiyan men
Some more:
prem jamunoi / pyaar banke mujh pe chaagaya (Vidya)
jhan jhan jhan manjira / jhan jhan jhan paayal (Buzdil)
rongila rongila re / aan milo shyaam saavare (Devdas)
haay ki je kori / tuu ne o rangile (Kudrat, RDB)
aalo chaya Dola / pavan diwaani (Dr.Vidya)
meghla nishi bore/ Partial resemblance with
main albeli (Buzdil)and roz akeli aaye(Annadata, Salil)
HMV has a compilation of SDB's hindi songs and one on Bengali songs.
Two more of SDB's Bengali CD's are available at a Madras Based
company, www.saigan.com.
Bhajo Man Bhav Se CD has SDB's Hindi Bhajan's along with Saigal's.
I think this is available at Saigan.com as well as Shrimatis
in Berkley. However it has only 3 of the 10 songs in the SD tape,
that I distributed. Lots of SDB's songs are listed on Hindustan
Records/Inreco website but there's no info as to how to order them.
SG.
Ritu
Thanks Srinivas.. this is really very helpful in locating these songs.
SDBs singing style in my opinion comes out the best in Bengali songs.
Phonetically the language supports his voice and style.
I was wondering if you have p-stats on these songs. It would be
interesting to know whether they were composed before or after their
hindi versions. It's pretty amazing to note how many MDs rehash their
own work in other languages. Salil Chowdry seems to be a master at
that.. what does that mean.. limited creativity ? Though I wouldn't
really say that about SDB but still why would a MD use their own
previously composed tune as opposed to creating their own new stuff ?
Srinivas Ganti
>"Ritu" wrote:
> SDBs singing style in my opinion comes out the best in Bengali songs.
> Phonetically the language supports his voice and style.
>
> I was wondering if you have p-stats on these songs. It would be
> interesting to know whether they were composed before or after their
> hindi versions.
Whatever Pstats I know I have put them on the inlaid card of the tape.
The lyricists info for many songs on debu's site are available cos they
came from a HMV CD. Most of the songs I put in the meet tape came
from Inreco/Hindutan Records, which have no lyricist info.
There are two film songs in the tape. "sun mere bandhu", Sujata (1959)
and "uD gayaa bhanvaraa", Aath Din (1946).
I can only estimate the years for the other songs. The following songs shud
be either from 30's or 40's.
Side A:
1.pii le pii le harii naam kaa pyaala
2. mere priitam pyaare
3. mere shyaam suno merii vinatii
4. nazaria.priit me hue badnaam
5. chale chalo prem ke saathii
6. baalam mujhse ruuTh ke
7. mere jauvan kii phulavaarii
8. o saiyyan phuul gendva na maaro
9. kaun nagariya jaao
Side B:
1. dhiire se jaana bagiyan men
2. ummiid bhara panchii
3. prem ka pinjraa ho gayaa suunaa
5.koii gaaye re paiiha gaaye re
(with Meera Dev Burman)
As far as Bengali / Hindi tadems are concerned;
AFAIK SDB didn't sing much in bengali for about 15(or even more) before
coming back in 1969. Even in Hindi Films SDB didn't sing from 1946
to 1959.
From orchestrisation and the way SDB's voice sounds I can give a rough
estimate. For example,these two bengali songs (from Debu's site) must
have been recorded more or less the same time as the Hindi songs
i.e early 70's.
12) na amaare soshi / ja ja ab na mujhe yaad aa (Premnagar)
14) borne gondhe chonde /phuulon ki rang se (Prem Pujari)
You may want to get this CD.
The Incomparable Sachin Dev Burman (Modern Songs)
price: $9.99 EMI [3416]
Language: Bengali
track listing:
1.Takdum takdum bajai by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Mira Dev Burman
2.Ghum bhulechhi by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Gauri Prasanna Mazumdar
3.Bone phagun mone agun by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Roby Guha Mazumdar
4.Shono go dakhin haoa by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Mira Dev Burman
5.Barne , gandhe , chhande geete by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Mira Dev Burman
6.Tumi esechhile parashu by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Roby Guha Mazumdar
7.Dur kon parabashe by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Gauri Prasanna Mazumdar
8.Na na amar sashi cheyo na by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Mira Dev Burman
9.Tumi ar nei se tumi by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Roby Guha Mazumdar
10.Baje Banshi Go by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Gauri Prasanna Mazumdar
11.Ami saite pari by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Roby Guha Mazumdar
12.Biraha baro bhalo lage by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Mira Dev Burman
13.Ke jashre bhati gang baiya by Sachin Dev Burman
Music: Sachin Dev Burman Lyrics: Mira Dev Burman
Hope this helps.
SG.
Ket...@att.net
rc0...@rediffmail.com says...
>> Ritu wrote:
>I was wondering if you have p-stats on these songs. It would be
>interesting to know whether they were composed before or after their
>hindi versions. It's pretty amazing to note how many MDs rehash their
I don't know the exact time line but most of them were before, from what little
I know.
>own work in other languages. Salil Chowdry seems to be a master at
>that.. what does that mean.. limited creativity ? Though I wouldn't
>really say that about SDB but still why would a MD use their own
>previously composed tune as opposed to creating their own new stuff
Do you cook your daal-roti differently in someone else's kitchen from the way
you do in your kitchen? Why not? Limited creativity?
Do you expect one poet who is describing the beauty of a sunrise scene--to write
differently in different languages?
Rather than it being limited creativity, it probably shows versatility in the
SDBs and Salil's, that no matter what the language was and the lyrics were, they
could adapt their tunes to fit the mood, actors, movies. By changing a few
instruments, using different singers, and tweaking the tune here/there, they
could change the whole mood of the song. They did not have to work hard, they
worked smart, and saw no point in reinventing the wheel every time they sat down
in the recording room.
Ketan
Ritu
Ok then look at it this way... Plagarism is more or less the same..
using someone else's tunes and tweaking them here and here and lo
behold we have a new song ! The only difference being picking from
your own previous repertoire as opposed to someone else's work.
I look at it this way.. the kinds of situations in Hindi Films(lets
forget other languages for a while) per se are limited. So if a MD
encounters the same situation twice should he simply take the essence
of his previous composition rework on it and produce the same number ?
Isn't creativity about being able to respond to the same situations in
various ways at various points in time. Isn't creatvity about
reinventing the wheel in various ways as your own form of expression
at various points in time ? And then music per se or rather a tune
does not have language barriers as do situations.
To speak in favour this trend. I think one motivating factor for these
MDs could have been experimentation. I mean wanting to know what a
change in language and setting could do to a tune. Phonetics of
different languages add different hues to the same tune.
Ashok
>Phonetically the language supports his voice and style.
>
I am not sure what you mean. What phonetic features of Bengali
as opposed to Hindi have that effect?
One good thing about SDB singing in Bengali is that while
at it he can't be murdering a Hindi song!
Ashok
Ket...@att.net
>Ket...@att.net wrote in message news:<9ntdj...@drn.newsguy.com>...
>> >hindi versions. It's pretty amazing to note how many MDs rehash their
>> >own work in other languages. Salil Chowdry seems to be a master at
>> >that.. what does that mean.. limited creativity ? Though I wouldn't
>>
>>Do you expect one poet who is describing the beauty of a sunrise scene--to write
>> differently in different languages?
>Ok then look at it this way... Plagarism is more or less the same..
>using someone else's tunes and tweaking them here and here and lo
>behold we have a new song ! The only difference being picking from
>your own previous repertoire as opposed to someone else's work.
Only difference? That word "someone else's" in your above sentence applies a
whole new dimension to the situation. If you go to work for a new employer
tomorrow and apply the management principles that you learnt in your ex-job, are
you then plagiarising, since you are after all picking from your own experience
and repertoire, right?
>I look at it this way.. the kinds of situations in Hindi Films(lets
>forget other languages for a while) per se are limited. So if a MD
>encounters the same situation twice should he simply take the essence
>of his previous composition rework on it and produce the same number ?
Your argument would be right IF the songs had been composed twice for
situations. AFAIK, when SalilC, SDB, RDB usually composed in Bengali and then
used their tunes for Hindi songs, the Bengali versions were non-film songs,
hence no situations to apply them to.
>Isn't creativity about being able to respond to the same situations in
>various ways at various points in time.
Yes, but isn't creativity also about responding to two different situations with
the same answer that makes both end products sounding equally plausible? There
is a Jeffery Archer novel in which the hero, takes part in a debate, takes one
stand and wins the debate, and later on switches sides, takes the opposite side
and still wins the debate.
Where the same tune has been used for movies in two languages, MD's have taken
the essence of their earlier tune and fitted it into a completely different
situation. Check out the Bengali song "Bondho karer..." sung by Kishore/Asha in
Rajkumari. Very moving/touching tune and the way they have sung it, with some
amazing emotions thrown in, it really tugs the heart-strings. Come to the Hindi
version "Aap ke kamre main" from Yaadon Ki Baarat and the whole situation is
different, and yet with a minor tweak of the tune, and big tweak in the way
Kishore/Asha emote here, the whole mood of the song changes. It looks as
plausible on Uttam Kumar and Tanuja as it does on Tariq, Vijay Arora and Zeenat
Aman.
>Isn't creatvity about reinventing the wheel in various ways as your own form >of
>expression at various points in time ?
Yes, but reinventing the wheel does take time. I am sure if these MD's were
given that kind of time they would have produced the new tunes. When you are a
programmer on a time related deadline, you don't go reinventing the wheel,
looking for new ways to debug your program, if you know that a particular line
of code will work just as well. Sure you would if you had the time to spare.
Most likely you never do. Doing otherwise might make you look creative, but
would be foolish, and suicidal to your career too.
But I suppose since you would be taking from your own repertoire it would be
plagirising according to you right? :)
Ketan
Sambit Basu
> Ok then look at it this way... Plagarism is more or less the same..
> using someone else's tunes and tweaking them here and here and lo
> behold we have a new song ! The only difference being picking from
> your own previous repertoire as opposed to someone else's work.
>
> I look at it this way.. the kinds of situations in Hindi Films(lets
> forget other languages for a while) per se are limited. So if a MD
> encounters the same situation twice should he simply take the essence
> of his previous composition rework on it and produce the same number ?
> Isn't creativity about being able to respond to the same situations in
> various ways at various points in time. Isn't creatvity about
> reinventing the wheel in various ways as your own form of expression
> at various points in time ? And then music per se or rather a tune
> does not have language barriers as do situations.
>
> To speak in favour this trend. I think one motivating factor for these
> MDs could have been experimentation. I mean wanting to know what a
> change in language and setting could do to a tune. Phonetics of
> different languages add different hues to the same tune.
Plagiarism is related ethics. I don't think it has much to do
with creativity or lack of it in a direct sense.
Salil Chowdhury used the leitmotif of the first movement of
Beethoven's Pastoral to make a interlude music for one
of his Bangla songs. And it gelled with the song extremely well.
Plagiarism - yes, lack of creativity - no. He used the same tune
to create a Hindi song, not the interlude but the mukhDa.
Plagiarism - yes, lack of creativity - probably.
Take another example. He turned the feel-good tune of "Happy
Birthday" into a not-so-happy tune of "klanti naame go". He
changed the metre, the tempo and created almost a new song out
of those two lines (of course added other phrases to make a
complete song). Plagiarism - probably, lack of creativity - no
way.
- Sambit
Ritu
> In article <8777cccd.01091...@posting.google.com>,
> rc0...@rediffmail.com says...
>
> >Ket...@att.net wrote in message news:<9ntdj...@drn.newsguy.com>...
>
> >> >hindi versions. It's pretty amazing to note how many MDs rehash their
> >> >own work in other languages. Salil Chowdry seems to be a master at
> >> >that.. what does that mean.. limited creativity ? Though I wouldn't
>
> >>
> >>Do you expect one poet who is describing the beauty of a sunrise scene--to write
> >> differently in different languages?
>
> >Ok then look at it this way... Plagarism is more or less the same..
> >using someone else's tunes and tweaking them here and here and lo
> >behold we have a new song ! The only difference being picking from
> >your own previous repertoire as opposed to someone else's work.
>
> Only difference? That word "someone else's" in your above sentence applies a
> whole new dimension to the situation. If you go to work for a new employer
> tomorrow and apply the management principles that you learnt in your ex-job, are
> you then plagiarising, since you are after all picking from your own experience
> and repertoire, right?
True, But the basic fact is that you are not creating anything new.
Putting the ethics issue aside if are reusing your own/ other's tune
the fact is that you are recycing. You are not creating anything new.
Yes, sometimes the same tune can be embellished and given a new
dimension(which requires a level of creativity) but at most times the
same tune is picked up an adapted without much change. That basically
indicates, IMO,either a) Laziness b) Lack of Creativty c) outside
pressure... producer wanting to cash on a 'hit' song. I have a whole
cassette full of Salil Chaudhry numbers of that kind.
You have a point there but that would only have credence if the
situations are diametrically opposite. If they are somewhat similiar
then again I would put it under the 'recycling' category.
>
> >Isn't creatvity about reinventing the wheel in various ways as your own form >of
> >expression at various points in time ?
>
> Yes, but reinventing the wheel does take time. I am sure if these MD's were
> given that kind of time they would have produced the new tunes. When you are a
> programmer on a time related deadline, you don't go reinventing the wheel,
> looking for new ways to debug your program, if you know that a particular line
> of code will work just as well. Sure you would if you had the time to spare.
> Most likely you never do. Doing otherwise might make you look creative, but
> would be foolish, and suicidal to your career too.
That's the precise reason why some MDs sounded fresh while a lot of
others produced tunes that sounded out of an assembly line..
Unfortunately in the artistic world the examples applied to the
business world don't work. And music directors like SDB as Dev Anand
had said in an interview were never overworked. He was selective in
films but gave his 100% and I think he had a pretty fruitful career.
>
> But I suppose since you would be taking from your own repertoire it would be
> plagirising according to you right? :)
>
:-).. Nopes.. My point is both Plagarism and Recycling have one common
origin.. lack of creativity !
>
>
> Ketan
Ritu
> Plagiarism is related ethics. I don't think it has much to do
> with creativity or lack of it in a direct sense.
>
> Salil Chowdhury used the leitmotif of the first movement of
> Beethoven's Pastoral to make a interlude music for one
> of his Bangla songs. And it gelled with the song extremely well.
> Plagiarism - yes, lack of creativity - no. He used the same tune
> to create a Hindi song, not the interlude but the mukhDa.
> Plagiarism - yes, lack of creativity - probably.
>
> Take another example. He turned the feel-good tune of "Happy
> Birthday" into a not-so-happy tune of "klanti naame go". He
> changed the metre, the tempo and created almost a new song out
> of those two lines (of course added other phrases to make a
> complete song). Plagiarism - probably, lack of creativity - no
> way.
>
>
You have demonstrated very aptly by the two examples the subtle
difference. IMO this is also the line b/w plagarism and inspiration.
An MD can be inspired by a musical piece but if he value-adds to that
piece and creates something different and new it's creatvity. But if
an MD picks up a tune (even if it's his own) and changes the language
and orchestration a wee bit and creates another song then I term it as
lack of creativity He might have created that tune in the past but for
the given situation he's not offered anything new. An e.g that comes
to my mind right now is Salil Chaudry's 'Jiya Lage na'. There is no
value addition to this song from the Bengali version.
> - Sambit
Ritu
> In article <8777cccd.01091...@posting.google.com>, rc0...@rediffmail.com says...
> >
> >SDBs singing style in my opinion comes out the best in Bengali songs.
> >Phonetically the language supports his voice and style.
> >
>
> I am not sure what you mean. What phonetic features of Bengali
> as opposed to Hindi have that effect?
IMO Phonetics play a very important part in the overall effect of the
song. Some words compliment the tune while other's pull it down. And
each language sounds different to the ears. Bengali is a very soft
language hindi is not as soft ..again this is overall. SDB's voice is
sharp and thin.. it's got a unique quality about it. Also he has a
nasal voice. I guess the softer sounds in Bengali help to tone down
these effects.
>
> One good thing about SDB singing in Bengali is that while
> at it he can't be murdering a Hindi song!
It's my opinion only.....I think he sounds really delightful in his
hindi songs also with his heavy bangla accent and quaint
pronunciations. That's precisely the reason I like this songs.
>
>
> Ashok
Ket...@att.net
rc0...@rediffmail.com Ritu says...
>:-).. Nopes.. My point is both Plagarism and Recycling have one common
>origin.. lack of creativity !
>An MD can be inspired by a musical piece but if he value-adds to that
>piece and creates something different and new it's creatvity. But if
>an MD picks up a tune (even if it's his own) and changes the language
>and orchestration a wee bit and creates another song then I term it as
>lack of creativity He might have created that tune in the past but for
>the given situation he's not offered anything new.
You seem to imply that "just changing the language and orchestration a wee bit"
is NOT value addition even if the base melody is the same. Listen to the Bengali
original of "Aye dil kahan teri manzil" and then listen to the Hindi one with
its violins and choral effects. Is that value addition?
Ketan
Sandy
What do you say of SPB then? Replace Bangla with south Indian in the
above statement and see what yo end up with!
Sandeep
Ritu
Good one !! :-) I'm stumped.
Ritu
> Sandeep
Ritu
manees...@gmail.com
Knadebone fagun= ab ke na sawan barse