Best and Worst
bhav...@gmail.com
discussion on the merits of the singers. It would be interesating to
know what the connoisseurs here think are the best five and the worst
five songs of the following masters. Purely on the merit of singing.
1.Lata Mangeshkar
2.Asha Bhosle
3.Kishore Kumar
4.Mohd Rafi
Thanks,
Bhavana
Chetan Vinchhi
This is an interesting question that will generate no interesting
answers, except for song lists :) All these singers have sung so many
different types of songs with MDs with such disparate styles and over
such a long period that it is difficult to nail down 5 or 50 or 500
best songs for them. I will let you guess which of the 3 is the
hardest number to nail down :)
For Lata, someone may throw up a Pt.Amarnath song, which many, er,
younger listeners may not be able to relate to. At the other end of
the spectrum (well, not really, but the spectrum of interest
anyway :) ) I am sure many people think very highly of "rasiika
balamaa". I know of very knowledgeable folks - Lata fans! - who can't
stand the song. In the portion of spectrum outside the region of
interest, some late-80s / early-90s songs of Lata are her best-selling
and hence considered to be her best songs. Sacrilege!
C
Srinivas Ganti
As many of us have singer, era and composer preferences, a
list based on liking would be a more appropriate choice.
However the prolific nature of these singers makes it impossible to
zero in on 5 most liked or least liked songs.
Here's a sampling of my current favorites (most played in ipod).
dekho ji mera jiyaa churaaye liye jaaye (Lata, Naubahaar)
madhukar shyaam hamare chor (Saigal, Bhakta Surdas)
chaand hai vohii ( Geeta, Parineeta)
phaili huii hai sapnon ki baahen (Lata, House No.44)
devta tum ho mera sahara (Rafi & Mubarak Begum, Daera)
dekh to dil ke jaan se uThta hai ( Mehdi Hassan, non-film)
zindagi dene waale sun (Talat, dil-e-naadaan)
kaali ghata chaaye (Asha, Sujata)
jyoti kalash chalke (Lata, Bhabhi ki Chudiyaan)
tere mandir kaa huun diipak jal rahaa (Pankaj Mullick, non-film)
None of these may be among the most played a few weeks form now.
Thats
a testimony to the hundreds of great songs they have sung.
Srinivas.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> This is an interesting question that will generate no interesting
> answers, except for song lists :)
I still stand by this :) but....
> All these singers have sung so many
> different types of songs with MDs with such disparate styles and over
> such a long period that it is difficult to nail down 5 or 50 or 500
> best songs for them.
...I am ready to eat my words on this one.
I had a long discussion with Arunabha about the possibility of coming
up with such a list. And we did come up with our separate lists (some
overlap inevitable). With due note that these lists are subject to
change without notice and that your top-5 are probably not included
here, my choices (in no specific order) would be as follows. Please
sprinkle IMOs wherever appropriate.
Also, as it turned out "purely on the merit of singing" was not really
satisfied. Singing is impeccable in these songs, but the choices are
more sentimental than cerebral.
Lata
------
The thought process organically veered towards seeking her best work
with specific MDs!
1. ruuTh ke tum to chal diye
There were several Anil Biswas candidates (notably, "ik pal ruuk
jaanaa"). I pick this as a sentimental favorite. The wistful lingering
on ruuTh, the gait of the song, the returning to home after starting
in the uttarang and especially the way Lata has delivered it has made
this the golden standard for "this type" of songs!
2. tum kyaa jaano
The same story for CR. This one pipped "ye zindagii usii kii hai" and
others to the finish line, solely because the song brings tears to my
eyes every time I hear it. And only partly because a very
knowledgeable and passionate music lover once said he'd rather listen
to this song than Ramayan/Gita recitation when he is on his death-
bed,
3. jal ke dil khaak hu_aa
This song nearly killed me once :) I had just acquired it and was
driving on the freeway after popping the tape in. The saki (vocal
prelude) had already grabbed my attention, but the mukhada nearly made
me veer off into the next lane! I just love the emotion and the
singing in this song. And if you have information about bad
picturization or anything, please don't share it with me...
This is partly a tribute to the less prolific and lesser-known MDs who
have adorned the Lata bouquet with unparalleled melodies.
4. lag jaa gale
What can I say? MM is not (at least no longer lest Ketan should pull
out an 11 year old post of mine :) ) on my top-5 MDs list. But I find
this song to be irresistable. The tune is beautifully crafted, but the
song belongs to the singer all the way.
5. wo to chale gaye ey dil
This is merely to spite Jay :) No, but seriously, there are several
songs in this category. But the restrained dejection (maut kaa
intazaar kar) and resignation in this one is unparalleled. And yes, I
like sad songs more than happy ones :)
Asha
--------
(Did not make this list yet....)
Rafi
------
1. man re tuu kaahe na dhiir dhare
One of the best Rafi songs! How can this not make it?
2. bhuul jaaye.n saare Gam
A surprise entry from CR! But not by design. This is my way of saying
Rafi's duets are at least as great as his solos. And he has delivered
with several co-singers. I used this song merely to sneak Lata in :)
3. ba.ndaa parawar thaam lo jiigar
The intoxicating Rafi-OP combination will crowd this space! But I
picked a representative. To be honest, there are other songs of theirs
which are as good (might even be better!)
4. TooTe hu_e khaabo.n ne
Another surprise entry. The much maligned (mostly by me :) ) lower
range of Rafi is stretched in this song. And he sings those notes with
panache. The highs are good too. And the song is an absolute killer.
5. watan kii raah me.n watan ke
Rafi's silken voice, along with a great overall package brought this
in. I know this is also a duet, but the song belongs to Rafi.
Kishore
-----------
1. ba.Dii suunii suunii hai
KK has several lovely songs with SD. But here the old men deliver a
rare sentimental beauty for that time period. KK's voice had matured
nicely and fit the song like a glove. Honestly, there is no room for
improvement in this song.
2. wo shaam kuchh ajiib thii
In spite of some minor enunciation problems, this is a winner. I like
the tune, I love the singing.
3. beqaraar-e-dil tuu gaaye jaa
Partly a tribute to KK the composer. There is a slight tendency
towards high entropy, but I love the change in pace throughout the
song. The piano work complements the voices beautifully.
4. zindagii kaa safar
How can one ignore the KK-Kaka-RD phenomenon? One of my favs from
their stables.
5. nakharewaalii
Surprise! The lilt, the low vocal range work, the yodelling, all KK
trademarks come to the fore in this song.
C
prakash...@gmail.com
>
> Kishore
> -----------
>
> 4. zindagii kaa safar
>
> How can one ignore the KK-Kaka-RD phenomenon? One of my favs from
> their stables.
>
Are you sure? I think this is a KA song from Safar. Or you wanted to
type 'zindagii ke safar' from Aap Ki Kasam?
Regards,
Prakaash
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Are you sure? I think this is a KA song from Safar. Or you wanted to
> type 'zindagii ke safar' from Aap Ki Kasam?
Right. The latter (although I do like the Safar song as well). Thanks,
Prakash!
C
Shalini Razdan
> On Apr 23, 8:01 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > This is an interesting question that will generate no interesting
> > answers, except for song lists :)
>
> I still stand by this :) but....
>
> > All these singers have sung so many
> > different types of songs with MDs with such disparate styles and over
> > such a long period that it is difficult to nail down 5 or 50 or 500
> > best songs for them.
>
> ...I am ready to eat my words on this one.
>
> I had a long discussion with Arunabha about the possibility of coming
> up with such a list. And we did come up with our separate lists (some
> overlap inevitable). With due note that these lists are subject to
> change without notice and that your top-5 are probably not included
> here, my choices (in no specific order) would be as follows. Please
> sprinkle IMOs wherever appropriate.
>
> Also, as it turned out "purely on the merit of singing" was not really
> satisfied. Singing is impeccable in these songs, but the choices are
> more sentimental than cerebral.
>
Chetan, you're both braver and a better sport than moi.:-) I still
can't (or more accurately, won't) contemplate making a list of my top
favorites, let alone *best* songs, for these four singers. Of course,
that won't prevent me from making comments on your list.:-)
Lata
> ------
>
> The thought process organically veered towards seeking her best work
> with specific MDs!
>
> 1. ruuTh ke tum to chal diye
>
> There were several Anil Biswas candidates (notably, "ik pal ruuk
> jaanaa"). I pick this as a sentimental favorite. The wistful lingering
> on ruuTh, the gait of the song, the returning to home after starting
> in the uttarang and especially the way Lata has delivered it has made
> this the golden standard for "this type" of songs!
>
Great pick, but I have a sentimental preference for "ik pal ruk
jaanaa" (slow version) for some of the same reasons you gave for this
song - the wistful, melancholy rendition by Lata.
> 2. tum kyaa jaano
>
> The same story for CR. This one pipped "ye zindagii usii kii hai" and
> others to the finish line, solely because the song brings tears to my
> eyes every time I hear it. And only partly because a very
> knowledgeable and passionate music lover once said he'd rather listen
> to this song than Ramayan/Gita recitation when he is on his death-
> bed,
>
Given it's exalted status, I'm almost afraid to say this, but this
song does NOTHING for me. :-( "Ye zindagi usii ki hai" on the other
hand moved me to tears as a toddler and still does, decades later -
every single time.
> 3. jal ke dil khaak hu_aa
>
> This song nearly killed me once :) I had just acquired it and was
> driving on the freeway after popping the tape in. The saki (vocal
> prelude) had already grabbed my attention, but the mukhada nearly made
> me veer off into the next lane! I just love the emotion and the
> singing in this song. And if you have information about bad
> picturization or anything, please don't share it with me...
>
This song or more precisely, Lata's singing, gives me goose
bumps....she's mesmerizingly disturbing.
> 4. lag jaa gale
>
> What can I say? MM is not (at least no longer lest Ketan should pull
> out an 11 year old post of mine :) ) on my top-5 MDs list. But I find
> this song to be irresistable. The tune is beautifully crafted, but the
> song belongs to the singer all the way.
>
Agree on all counts.
> 5. wo to chale gaye ey dil
>
> This is merely to spite Jay :) No, but seriously, there are several
> songs in this category. But the restrained dejection (maut kaa
> intazaar kar) and resignation in this one is unparalleled.
Completely agree here too.
> Rafi
> ------
>
> 1. man re tuu kaahe na dhiir dhare
>
> One of the best Rafi songs! How can this not make it?
Wouldn't make my list. "Aaj ki raat badi shokh badi natkhat hai" from
Nai Umar Ki Nai Fasal is hands down my favorite Rafi for Roshan
number.
> 3. ba.ndaa parawar thaam lo jiigar
>
> The intoxicating Rafi-OP combination will crowd this space! But I
> picked a representative. To be honest, there are other songs of theirs
> which are as good (might even be better!)
>
Yes! - to your entire line of reasoning.
> Kishore
> -----------
>
> 1. ba.Dii suunii suunii hai
>
> KK has several lovely songs with SD. But here the old men deliver a
> rare sentimental beauty for that time period. KK's voice had matured
> nicely and fit the song like a glove. Honestly, there is no room for
> improvement in this song.
>
> 2. wo shaam kuchh ajiib thii
>
> In spite of some minor enunciation problems, this is a winner. I like
> the tune, I love the singing.
>
> 3. beqaraar-e-dil tuu gaaye jaa
>
> Partly a tribute to KK the composer. There is a slight tendency
> towards high entropy, but I love the change in pace throughout the
> song. The piano work complements the voices beautifully.
>
> 4. zindagii kaa safar
>
> How can one ignore the KK-Kaka-RD phenomenon? One of my favs from
> their stables.
>
> 5. nakharewaalii
>
> Surprise! The lilt, the low vocal range work, the yodelling, all KK
> trademarks come to the fore in this song.
>
I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
would be just replacing one gem with another.
Shalini
> C
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Chetan, you're both braver and a better sport than moi.:-)
Thanks, Shalini! You are a sport :)
> > 1. ruuTh ke tum to chal diye
>
> Great pick, but I have a sentimental preference for "ik pal ruk
> jaanaa" (slow version) for some of the same reasons you gave for this
> song - the wistful, melancholy rendition by Lata.
I was torn between the two songs, hence mentioned Rahi. Actually that
song is a sentimental favorite of mine as well. It was one of the
first "rare" AB songs I was exposed to (some 25 years back!) and I
still love it. But Jalti Nishani makes something go click inside me,
which I cannot quite exlain.
> > 2. tum kyaa jaano
>
> Given it's exalted status, I'm almost afraid to say this, but this
> song does NOTHING for me. :-( "Ye zindagi usii ki hai" on the other
> hand moved me to tears as a toddler and still does, decades later -
> every single time.
You need to check if you are dead inside :) Yes, Anarkali was a top
contender and will make it to my top-20 or top-50 type of list.
> > 3. jal ke dil khaak hu_aa
>
> This song or more precisely, Lata's singing, gives me goose
> bumps....she's mesmerizingly disturbing.
Well put!
> > 5. wo to chale gaye ey dil
>
> Completely agree here too.
Including the spiting-Jay part? ;)
> > 1. man re tuu kaahe na dhiir dhare
>
> Wouldn't make my list. "Aaj ki raat badi shokh badi natkhat hai" from
> Nai Umar Ki Nai Fasal is hands down my favorite Rafi for Roshan
> number.
I knew this was coming. But I like the Chitralekha song too much...
> > Kishore
>
> I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
> would be just replacing one gem with another.
This song, I find KK faltering here and there. The poetry is nice but
the words are not as tightly coupled to the contours of the tune as a
good filmi song should be. I am not sure whether the weakness lies
with Neeraj, SDB or KK!
(It is usually a bad idea to dissect someone's favorite song like
this, but am taking the liberty. Sorry about that!)
C
AR
> On Apr 23, 8:01 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Asha
> --------
>
> (Did not make this list yet....)
>
Let me make my Asha's best list. Five songs are too few (and this
remark is a cliche! :-)), but I'll still put it down. I doubt many
people will agree with my choice, but still :-). My criteria for the
best five are: (1) the complexity of the song (which showcases the
ability of the singer to handle difficult compositions) OR (2)
emotional content.
1. aankhon se jo utri hai dil mein (Phir Wohi Dil Laya Hoon)
2. aage bhi jaane na tuu (Waqt)
3. sooni sooni saans ke sitaar par (Lal Pathhar) and "re man sur
mein.." (if duets were allowed)
4. o meri jaan maine kahaa.. (The Train)
5. saathi re bhool na jaana meraa pyaar. (Kotwaal Sahab)
6. jhoothhe nainaa... (Lekin)
7. jaane kya haal ho kal sheeshe kaa (Maa ka Aanchal)
8. aaiye meherbaan (Howrah Bridge)
As you see, five songs was really too few for me :-).
Archisman Mozumder
Great list. Especially the Kotwaal Saab & the 'Maa Ka Aanchal'
numbers .
My list of 25 stunning Asha-tai numbers. (Solos & hindi film songs).
Trying to cover as many composers as possible.
1. ab ke baras bhej - bandini
2. mere dil mein teri tasveer - ek hans ka joda
3. daiyyan yeh main kahaan aa phansi - caravan
4. naina hain pyaase mere - aavishkaar
5 thandi thandi saawan ki puhaar - jaagte raho
6. amabar ki ek paak suraahi - kadambari
7. aayi pari - do phool
8. naa main hoon main - umang
9. nigaahen milaane ko - dil hi to hai
10 balma khuli hawaaen - kashmir ki kali
11 o dilruba - teesra kaun
12 path-bhulaa ek aaya musaafir - door gagan ki chhaaon mein
13 ek ajnabi teri baahon mein rahe - shera daaku
14. jaane kyun preetam - ek thi rita
15. maar daalega dard-e-jigar - pati patni
16 sona roopa laayo re - joshila
17 bheegi bheegi faza - anupama
18 paan khaayen saiyaan - teesri qasam
19. kal thaa mera - room no 203
20 koyi dekhen to dekhe tujhko - aparadhi kaun
21. takraa gaye do - mazaaq
22 chori chori solah sringaar - manoranjan
23. zindagi ki rang kayi re - aadmi aur insaan
and the 2 songs for Kotwaal Saab & Maa Ka Aanchal.
Enough to make her my choice as the most comprehensive playback
singer, ever, in HFM. Add to it, her non film songs (mostly of
Jaidev), her bengali songs (primarily by Sudhin Dasgupta & R D Burman)
and her stunning marathi renditions and she come across as an awe
inspiring legend.
Apologies for breaking the rules of this thread (of selecting 5 songs
per singer).
Regards.
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
Yes sir! Add "Sabaa Se Ye Kehdo" and the tandems of "Pyaar Par Bas To
Nahin Hai" and "Ae Gham-e-Dil Kya Karoon" (probably more, but then
I'll be here for a while)...
Sanjeev
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
*Nice* call (I like the Chitralekha song, but like this one better)!!
Two other Rafi-Roshans from me - "Tum Ek Baar Mohabbat Ka Imtihaan To
Lo" (Babar) and "Maayoos To Hoon Vaade Pe Tere" (Barsaat Ki Raat).
Sanjeev
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
>
>
> > 3. ba.ndaa parawar thaam lo jiigar
>
> > The intoxicating Rafi-OP combination will crowd this space! But I
> > picked a representative. To be honest, there are other songs of theirs
> > which are as good (might even be better!)
>
> Yes! - to your entire line of reasoning.
Second that!
Sanjeev
Arunabha
> Let me make my Asha's best list. Five songs are too few (and this
> remark is a cliche! :-)), but I'll still put it down.
Thanks Ajit for taking the first shot at the Asha list (and some
interesting choices !)
Between your and Archisman's list I found a lot of entries to my own.
Overall, I found the exercise of selecting Asha and Kishore songs
easier and more interesting than that of choosing LM and Rafi songs.
LM's list was difficult because firstly there were too many equals,
and by the time Chetan and I moved through a few composers, it almost
became a given kind of song we were looking for. In contrast, with
Kishore and Asha it seemed one could accomodate a wider variety of
songs of a commensurate level. (With LM it almost became a hidden
requirement for the song to evoke "ruuThake tum to chal diye" not only
in excellence but also in restraint and mood)
Here are some Asha choices:
For the less-prolific composers:
chalii re chalii re mai.n to (Saranga)
ambar kii ek paak suraahii (Kadambari)
chaa.Nd tuu yahaa.N hai aur (Bhabhi Ki Chooriyan)
One of Vish's spot-on observations about Asha's singing is the
simplicity and lack of artifice with which she delivers songs "of
children, for children, and with children". I personally feel this is
one category where no other singer delivers the goods the way Asha
does:
ye duniyaa rahe naa rahe kyaa pataa (Mitti Mein Sona)
khoyaa khoyaa chandaa (Door Gagan Ki Chhanv Mein)
laalii laalii Doliyaa me.n (Teesri Kasam)
aayii parii ra.ng bharii (Do Phool)
Asha has sung a few, but very special songs for the composers who gave
their best to Lata:
kahii.n se shaam hote hii (Shatranj ?) - CR
dil lagaakar ham ye samajhe (Zindagi Aur Maut)
shoK nazar kii bijaliyaa.N (Wo Kaun Thi) - MM
koii dekhe to kahe tujhako - (Apradhi Kaun) - Salil Chowdhury
nigaahe.n milaane ko jii chaahataa hai (Dil Hi To Hai) - Roshan
For the Asha loyalist composers:
kyaa dekhaa naino.n waalii - Dharmputra (N Dutta)
nadii naare na jaao shyaam (Mujhe Jeene Do) - Jaidev
zindagii ham tere haal par (Wohi Baat) - Jaidev
diiwaanaa huaa baadal (Kashmir Ki Kali) - just for one stanza, but a
tour de force - OPN
do buu.Nde.n saavan kii (Phir Subah Hogi) - Khaiyyaam
For the family: (far too many choices !, have to make do with one or
two representatives)
koii aayaa dha.Dakan kahatii hai (Lajwanti)
dil lagaake qadar gayii pyaare (House No 44)
khaalii haath shaam aayii hai (Ijaazat)
dil sajan jalataa hai (Mukti)
Kishore for another day !
-- Arunabha
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Apologies for breaking the rules of this thread (of selecting 5 songs
> per singer).
Thanks for your list, Archie. No rules! That is the only rule :)
I am not familiar with some of your choices - should go an listen to
them! I was discussing Asha songs with Arunabha yesterday and many of
the songs we talked about showed up on your and AR's list! Is this an
RMIM thing or are these songs the absolute best ones :)
One point of contention. I do not like daiyya ye mai.n kahaa.N aa
pha.nsii. I find it too gimmicky. Not enough musical value (for me).
C
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Here are some Asha choices:
>
> For the less-prolific composers:
I want to mention an unusual song here. "man aanand aanand chhaayo"
from Vijeta. Asha has sung it with authority. And I like her voice
from that era.
From Ravi's baton, "jiivan jyot jale" would make it to my list, maybe
not top-5 but nobody else seems to be talking about top-5 :)
> ye duniyaa rahe naa rahe kyaa pataa (Mitti Mein Sona)
> khoyaa khoyaa chandaa (Door Gagan Ki Chhanv Mein)
> laalii laalii Doliyaa me.n (Teesri Kasam)
> aayii parii ra.ng bharii (Do Phool)
I know you have picked another Lajwanti song, but from that great
soundtrack my choice would be "cha.ndaa re...", which falls in this
category. You have picked the KK song - also great - over this!
> Asha has sung a few, but very special songs for the composers who gave
> their best to Lata:
> shoK nazar kii bijaliyaa.N (Wo Kaun Thi) - MM
Wanted to second Sanjeev on "sabaa se ye kah do" with MM.
> do buu.Nde.n saavan kii (Phir Subah Hogi) - Khaiyyaam
Good choice, but I would pick something from Umrao Jaan for Khayyam,
partly because of Asha's matured vocals. Probably "ye kyaa jagan hai
dosto".
> dil sajan jalataa hai (Mukti)
Don't know/remember this last one. Would pick Manoranjan a la Archie.
C
Srinivas Ganti
> On Apr 24, 11:08 pm, Arunabha <roy.aruna...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Here are some Asha choices:
>
> > For the less-prolific composers:
>
> I want to mention an unusual song here. "man aanand aanand chhaayo"
> from Vijeta. Asha has sung it with authority. And I like her voice
> from that era.
>
> From Ravi's baton, "jiivan jyot jale" would make it to my list, maybe
> not top-5 but nobody else seems to be talking about top-5 :)
Yes !!!
Some more that I consider among Asha's best
yahii vo jagah hai (Ye raat phir na aayegi)
baansuriyaa man har le gaii (tumhare liye)
leharon men jhuluun (Society)
The discussion of *best* songs seems to be on expected lines.
yeh bhii achha hai, vo bhii achha hai, aap ka choice to baDiya hai :)
Any takers for the worst songs ?
Srinivas.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> yeh bhii achha hai, vo bhii achha hai, aap ka choice to baDiya hai :)
:)
> Any takers for the worst songs ?
Yeah, I copped out on that one. Why don't you give it a shot? One
rule: keep Lata/Asha's recent work out of the reckoning. There is no
point in saying "diidii teraa devar diiwaanaa" is one of Lata's worst.
Let us say the cut-off is 1980 for her.
C
Kali Hawa
Actually such a list will keep changing with time, at least for me. As
you can see I don’t understand technical aspect of songs, just love
the intensity of emotions.
Lata:
Kuch dil ne kahaa (Anupama)
Lag ja gale se phir ye mula…(Who Kaun Thi)
KahiN deep jale kahiN dil ( Bees Saal B’aad)
Aap ki nazroN se smajhaa ( AnpaRH)
Dil-e-nadaaN ko sanbhaalooN to chale jaaiyegaa (Faraar)
Asha
Jaaiye aap kahaaN jayeNg (Mere Sanam)
In anKhon ki masti( Umrao Jaan)
Ankhn se jo utri hai dil meN(Phir Wahi Dil layaa Hun)
Saqiaa aaj mujhe neeNd nahi aayegi (Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam)
Jalwa churaane ko jee chata hai
Kishore
HawaaoN pe likh do hawaaoN ke naam( Do duni Chaar)
Ajnabi tum jaane pahchane se lagte ho(?)
Choti si ye duniye pahchane raaste haiN( Rangoli)
Payalwali dekhna yahiN pe kahin dil hai( Ek Raaz)
Ye jo mohobbat hai ye unka hai kaam( Kati Patang)
Rafi
Tumne mujhe dekha, ho kar meharbaaN (Teesri Manzil)
Sau baar Janam leNge sau baar fanaah honNge (UstaadoN ke UstaaD(?))
ChaudveeN ka chaaNd ho ( Chaudveen Ka Chaand)
Jaane kya dhoNdti rahti haiN ankeN mujh men(Shola Aur Shabnam)
Koi saaGar dil ko bahlataa nahiN (Dil Diya Dard Liyaa)
If duet is allowed then
PaaNv cho lene do phooloN ko inaayat (Taj Mahal)
Will replace Koi saaGar…
ani...@gmail.com
> On Apr 22, 9:47 pm, bhavan...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > A recent thread on tasveer teri dil mein has seen a lot of heated
> > discussion on the merits of the singers. It would be interesating to
> > know what the connoisseurs here think are the best five and the worst
> > five songs of the following masters. Purely on the merit of singing.
>
> > 1.Lata Mangeshkar
> > 2.Asha Bhosle
> > 3.Kishore Kumar
> > 4.Mohd Rafi
>
I guess it is easier for me to pick 5 Asha favorites than Rafi and
Kishore. I won't even try and attempt this for the Great Lady.
My 5 Asha picks:
Aayi parii rang bhari (vasant desai)
Prem lagan man mein basa le (roshanlal)
Saba se yeh kehdo (madan mohan)
Nigahen milane ko jii chahta hai (roshanlal)
More mandir ab log nahin (duet with Manna Dey) (anil biswas)
Cheers
Shalini Razdan
I was thinking the same thing - surely it's more fun to compile the
"worst" lists. :-) Agree on excluding the sisters' recent work, but I
would move the cut-off for Lata/Rafi to 1970 and Asha/Kishore to
1980. Lata continued to produce gems in the 70s, but IMHO, the voice
degredation was significant enough to handicap her in that decade. As
for Rafi, if he hadn't sung a single song in the 70s I wouldn't have
missed him!
Interestingly enough, I can't think of a Lata song from the 50s,
except for maybe "tum kyaa jaano" :-), that would make my "worst"
list, but from the 60s, I offer "Main kya karoon Ram" as a contender
for the top (or is it bottom) spot. :-)
Shalini
> C
Shalini Razdan
> On Apr 24, 8:43 pm, AR <aji...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> For the Asha loyalist composers:
> nadii naare na jaao shyaam (Mujhe Jeene Do) - Jaidev
Great Asha lists from everyone. Virtually every song mentioned
features among my favorites as well, except for the above from Mujhe
Jeene Do. For some reason I find it very grating. "Maang mein bhar
de rang" would be my pick for Jaidev, or moving a bit outside their
well known ouvere, "Main jaanu nahi piya ko milan kaise hoye rii" from
Andolan. Asha seems to put her soul into the meera bhajan and comes
up with a searing rendition. One of my all time favorite devotionals.
Shalini
> -- Arunabha
AR
> their best to Lata:
> kahii.n se shaam hote hii (Shatranj ?) - CR
> dil lagaakar ham ye samajhe (Zindagi Aur Maut)
> shoK nazar kii bijaliyaa.N (Wo Kaun Thi) - MM
> koii dekhe to kahe tujhako - (Apradhi Kaun) - Salil Chowdhury
> nigaahe.n milaane ko jii chaahataa hai (Dil Hi To Hai) - Roshan
>
>
A role reversal here would be an interesting discussion, i.e. Lata's
output for composers such as Ravi, Ravindra Jain and possibly Bhappi
Lahiri who reserved their best for Asha (I wonder whether this topic
has ever been discussed on RMIM). Lata has sung some really nice songs
for Ravi, though they are quite few, such as "sab kuchh lutaa ke" (I
know most people hate this one, but I just LOVE it :-)), and more so
for Lata's singing), "milti hai zindagi mein.." or songs from Ek Mahal
Ho Sapnon Kaa. For Ravindra Jain, "chitthiye" from Henna is a
wonderful song (which would have been even more wonderful had it been
sung 15-20 years earlier). In fact, I would have placed it up there
with "saathi re bhool na jaanaa meraa pyaar". Lata has some nice
(maybe not great) songs for Bappi Lahiri. I do love the songs from
Lahu ke Do Rang, for instance. It's not quite clear whether we should
include R D Burman here.
Shalini Razdan
> On Apr 24, 8:07 pm, Shalini Razdan <shaliniraz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > 2. tum kyaa jaano
>
> > Given it's exalted status, I'm almost afraid to say this, but this
> > song does NOTHING for me. :-( "Ye zindagi usii ki hai" on the other
> > hand moved me to tears as a toddler and still does, decades later -
> > every single time.
>
> You need to check if you are dead inside :) Yes, Anarkali was a top
> contender and will make it to my top-20 or top-50 type of list.
>
Since I'm already in the doghouse for my lack of appreciation for the
Shin Shin Ka Babla Boo number, let me commit a further sacrilege and
propose a replacement for it. :-) Unlike you, I prefer happy songs to
sad ones, so the suggested substitute is "yehi bahar hai duniya ko
bhool jaane ki" from Raag Rang. It's a sublime representative from my
favorite category of Lata songs - songs of "muted exuberance." "Kissi
ne apna bana ke mujhko muskuarana seekha diya" from Patita is another
fine example. These songs make me want to waltz around thinking happy
thoughts of my fellow man/woman.:-)
Shalini
>
> C
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
Strongly disagree - not a great song or anything, but I actually am
taken by what she's done with the situation and can't for the life of
me understand why she's so *mortified* that she sang that song...
Sanjeev
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> I was thinking the same thing - surely it's more fun to compile the
> "worst" lists. :-) Agree on excluding the sisters' recent work, but I
> would move the cut-off for Lata/Rafi to 1970 and Asha/Kishore to
> 1980. Lata continued to produce gems in the 70s, but IMHO, the voice
> degredation was significant enough to handicap her in that decade. As
> for Rafi, if he hadn't sung a single song in the 70s I wouldn't have
> missed him!
Agree for the most part, but I was ready to include a couple of 1980s
Asha songs in my top-N list!
> Interestingly enough, I can't think of a Lata song from the 50s,
> except for maybe "tum kyaa jaano" :-), that would make my "worst"
> list, but from the 60s, I offer "Main kya karoon Ram" as a contender
> for the top (or is it bottom) spot. :-)
LOL. Yes, Sangam should make it. If the cut-off was a bit later I
would propose "ik baat kahuu.N gar maano tum" from Golmaal. And how
about "sayonaaraa saayonaaraa", where she sounds like a far lesser
singer trying to sound like Lata trying to sound like an oriental
singer :)
I have an unusual contender for the worst list. The longer version of
"chham chham naachat aa_ii bahaar"! Lata sounds extremely
uncomfortable and even goes besur in some of the later sargam
passages. Totally unlike her! And totally unlistenable!
BTW, have you noticed that some of these "worst" songs could very well
be in someone's "best" list? :)
C
Ritu
> On Apr 24, 2:03 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 23, 8:01 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > This is an interesting question that will generate no interesting
> > > answers, except for song lists :)
>
> > I still stand by this :) but....
>
> > > All these singers have sung so many
> > > different types of songs with MDs with such disparate styles and over
> > > such a long period that it is difficult to nail down 5 or 50 or 500
> > > best songs for them.
>
> > ...I am ready to eat my words on this one.
>
> > I had a long discussion with Arunabha about the possibility of coming
> > up with such a list. And we did come up with our separate lists (some
> > overlap inevitable). With due note that these lists are subject to
> > change without notice and that your top-5 are probably not included
> > here, my choices (in no specific order) would be as follows. Please
> > sprinkle IMOs wherever appropriate.
>
> > Also, as it turned out "purely on the merit of singing" was not really
> > satisfied. Singing is impeccable in these songs, but the choices are
> > more sentimental than cerebral.
>
> Chetan, you're both braver and a better sport than moi.:-) I still
> can't (or more accurately, won't) contemplate making a list of my top
> favorites, let alone *best* songs, for these four singers. Of course,
> that won't prevent me from making comments on your list.:-)
It is amazing on how many times one does this exercise (of choosing a
top 'n') or a particular artist and how one never tires of it. I think
these lists are a wonderful way to renew your vows with your favourite
songs.
>
> Lata
>
> > ------
>
> > The thought process organically veered towards seeking her best work
> > with specific MDs!
>
> > 1. ruuTh ke tum to chal diye
>
> > There were several Anil Biswas candidates (notably, "ik pal ruuk
> > jaanaa"). I pick this as a sentimental favorite. The wistful lingering
> > on ruuTh, the gait of the song, the returning to home after starting
> > in the uttarang and especially the way Lata has delivered it has made
> > this the golden standard for "this type" of songs!
>
> Great pick, but I have a sentimental preference for "ik pal ruk
> jaanaa" (slow version) for some of the same reasons you gave for this
> song - the wistful, melancholy rendition by Lata.
I agree too... this song hits me deep deep inside. It is as enigmatic,
mysterious and alluring as the deep forests of the North East where
this film is based. 'Ruth ke tum to chal diye' is also very enigmatic.
With these songs, I always get a feeling that there are unfathomable
depths waiting to be discovered. But like Shalini, my vote also goes
to 'Ik pal ruk jaana', mainly because the mysticsm of nature that
seeps through in this song. So my reasons are very different but the
choice is the same :)
>
> > 2. tum kyaa jaano
>
> > The same story for CR. This one pipped "ye zindagii usii kii hai" and
> > others to the finish line, solely because the song brings tears to my
> > eyes every time I hear it. And only partly because a very
> > knowledgeable and passionate music lover once said he'd rather listen
> > to this song than Ramayan/Gita recitation when he is on his death-
> > bed,
>
> Given it's exalted status, I'm almost afraid to say this, but this
> song does NOTHING for me. :-( "Ye zindagi usii ki hai" on the other
> hand moved me to tears as a toddler and still does, decades later -
> every single time.
I must say Shalini, you were a quite a profound toddler to have 'Yeh
Zingagi Usi Ki Hai' moving you to tears. The only thing that moved me
to tears as a toddler was the sight of my mother running after me with
a glass of milk :). It is a little wonder you like happy songs now.
You spent your tears as a toddler!
I second Chetan on that one. I am not much of a CR fan, but the
delicacy of this song is like a fine vintage wine. It lingers on long
after the song has stopped playing. I don't think of it as a sad song
though. It appeals more to my sense than to my emotions.
>
> > 3. jal ke dil khaak hu_aa
>
> > This song nearly killed me once :) I had just acquired it and was
> > driving on the freeway after popping the tape in. The saki (vocal
> > prelude) had already grabbed my attention, but the mukhada nearly made
> > me veer off into the next lane! I just love the emotion and the
> > singing in this song. And if you have information about bad
> > picturization or anything, please don't share it with me...
>
> This song or more precisely, Lata's singing, gives me goose
> bumps....she's mesmerizingly disturbing.
Never heard this one. Would someone be kind to oblige?
>
> > 4. lag jaa gale
>
> > What can I say? MM is not (at least no longer lest Ketan should pull
> > out an 11 year old post of mine :) ) on my top-5 MDs list. But I find
> > this song to be irresistable. The tune is beautifully crafted, but the
> > song belongs to the singer all the way.
>
> Agree on all counts.
Disagree... The song has not withstood the test of time for me. The
tune seems very stale now. If we go with MM I would go with 'Mai ri'
or 'Baiyan na dharo'
>
> > 5. wo to chale gaye ey dil
>
> > This is merely to spite Jay :) No, but seriously, there are several
> > songs in this category. But the restrained dejection (maut kaa
> > intazaar kar) and resignation in this one is unparalleled.
>
> Completely agree here too.
Again, disagree. I too have never understood the RMIM fascination for
Sajjad. Unique, yes. But there is too much happening in this song for
it really to reach anywhere close to me. If I had to pick Sajjad I
would pick 'Dil mein sama gaye sajan' and 'Darshan Pyasi' by Geeta
Dutt. The only songs that really come on my radar from Sajjad. So I
agree with Jay there :)!
>
> > Rafi
> > ------
>
> > 1. man re tuu kaahe na dhiir dhare
>
> > One of the best Rafi songs! How can this not make it?
>
> Wouldn't make my list. "Aaj ki raat badi shokh badi natkhat hai" from
> Nai Umar Ki Nai Fasal is hands down my favorite Rafi for Roshan
> number.
Roshan-Rafi : 'Man re' makes it more for the lyrics than for the tune
or singing. I can't seem to recall too many Roshan-Rafi songs. Can
someone jog my memory?
>
> > 3. ba.ndaa parawar thaam lo jiigar
>
> > The intoxicating Rafi-OP combination will crowd this space! But I
> > picked a representative. To be honest, there are other songs of theirs
> > which are as good (might even be better!)
>
> Yes! - to your entire line of reasoning.
A big Yes! from this side too. OPN-Rafi was indeed a magical
combination. I daresay the best. And this song come high on my list as
a representative of the genre. The same lingering smoothness
accompanied by robustness in Rafi's voice that set him apart (IMO) is
ah! so beautifully apparent here.
>
>
>
>
>
> > Kishore
> > -----------
>
> > 1. ba.Dii suunii suunii hai
>
> > KK has several lovely songs with SD. But here the old men deliver a
> > rare sentimental beauty for that time period. KK's voice had matured
> > nicely and fit the song like a glove. Honestly, there is no room for
> > improvement in this song.
>
> > 2. wo shaam kuchh ajiib thii
>
> > In spite of some minor enunciation problems, this is a winner. I like
> > the tune, I love the singing.
>
> > 3. beqaraar-e-dil tuu gaaye jaa
>
> > Partly a tribute to KK the composer. There is a slight tendency
> > towards high entropy, but I love the change in pace throughout the
> > song. The piano work complements the voices beautifully.
>
> > 4. zindagii kaa safar
>
> > How can one ignore the KK-Kaka-RD phenomenon? One of my favs from
> > their stables.
>
> > 5. nakharewaalii
>
> > Surprise! The lilt, the low vocal range work, the yodelling, all KK
> > trademarks come to the fore in this song.
>
> I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
> would be just replacing one gem with another.
KK-SDB never appealed to me that much. Esp. in the solos (could also
be because I started out with that genre and have suitably over-played
them. Whatever be the case the combo has not withstood the test of
time for me apart from a few songs)
>
> Shalini
>
>
>
> > C- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Asif
>
> It is amazing on how many times one does this exercise (of choosing a
> top 'n') or a particular artist and how one never tires of it. I think
> these lists are a wonderful way to renew your vows with your favourite
> songs.
Hmmm .. so the repeats of this exercise over and over is wonderful to
you and you love to renew your vows thus, but you feel sick when one
adds a to one's vows a new discovery that others already added over
the "donkey's years". Great contradiction!
Ritu
er?
I am sorry this one totally escaped me. Could you care to elaborate?
AR
>
>LOL. Yes, Sangam should make it. If the cut-off was a bit later I
>would propose "ik baat kahuu.N gar maano tum" from Golmaal. And how
>about "sayonaaraa saayonaaraa", where she sounds like a far lesser
>singer trying to sound like Lata trying to sound like an oriental
>singer :)
>
I have no problems with this one. She certainly doesn't screech or
shout anywhere. I agree with "ik baat kahor gar maano tum".
> I have an unusual contender for the worst list. The longer version of
> "chham chham naachat aa_ii bahaar"! Lata sounds extremely
> uncomfortable and even goes besur in some of the later sargam
> passages. Totally unlike her! And totally unlistenable!
>
> BTW, have you noticed that some of these "worst" songs could very well
> be in someone's "best" list? :)
>
"Chham chham naachat aayi bahaar" would be in my "close to best" list,
but I haven't heard this "longer version". Could you post a link to it
(or send me an mp3 file :-))?
BTW, in general, I find that the instances of bad singing by Asha are
rarer than those by Lata. Also Asha's worst is better/more tolerable
than Lata's worst, in general.
I am facing quite a hard time in making an "Asha worst" list (time
frame is 50s to 1992) - I can think of nothing other than Navrang.
Likewise, Kishore's worst is more bearable than Rafi's worst, which is
also highly embarassing. But the singer, amongst the legends of Hindi
film music, whose worst is indeed the worst (and in the insufferable
category) is Lata. Rafi gives her a tough competition, though. I have,
in the past 1-2 years, met at least ten people (each in a different
place) who actually feel that Lata was so terrible a singer that she
should never have come within a 20 mile radius of any microphone. And
these are people weaned on old Hindi film music. If that is the case,
I wonder what the majority of the present or later generations would
have to say about Lata, when it is quite likely that their image of
this lady would be mainly based on her songs sung after 1990.
> C
Asif
Search the forum with your highly degrading words "donkey's years",
and you will know what thread (and your post) I am talking about.
Ritu
What is 'highly degrading' about the phrase 'Donkey's years' ?
Let me suggest you do a google search that could enlighten you on the
meaning of the same. And then while you are at it get a crash course
is reading comprehension as well. There is a remote possibility that
then you might understand that what I said in the 'Donkey's Years'
thread is in the same vein as what I said it the portion you quoted.
All the best!
Cheers
Ritu
Asif
>
> What is 'highly degrading' about the phrase 'Donkey's years' ?
>
> Let me suggest you do a google search that could enlighten you on the
> meaning of the same. And then while you are at it get a crash course
> is reading comprehension as well. There is a remote possibility that
> then you might understand that what I said in the 'Donkey's Years'
> thread is in the same vein as what I said it the portion you quoted.
>
> All the best!
> Cheers
> Ritu
>
Wah! Bahut khoob! You degraded others on that thread and did not
participate, and here you are marveling about the wonders of renewing
one's vows and adding your own "fresh" views here. And you call it
"saying the same thing in same vein". I think you badly need to a
crash course in comprehending your own quotes.
Shalini Razdan
> On Apr 25, 6:31 pm, Shalini Razdan <shaliniraz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I was thinking the same thing - surely it's more fun to compile the
> > "worst" lists. :-) Agree on excluding the sisters' recent work, but I
> > would move the cut-off for Lata/Rafi to 1970 and Asha/Kishore to
> > 1980. Lata continued to produce gems in the 70s, but IMHO, the voice
> > degredation was significant enough to handicap her in that decade. As
> > for Rafi, if he hadn't sung a single song in the 70s I wouldn't have
> > missed him!
>
> Agree for the most part, but I was ready to include a couple of 1980s
> Asha songs in my top-N list!
>
The era cut-off suggestion was only for the "worst" lists. For the
"favorites" exercise, one should be allowed to choose from the
singer's full career span.
> > Interestingly enough, I can't think of a Lata song from the 50s,
> > except for maybe "tum kyaa jaano" :-), that would make my "worst"
> > list, but from the 60s, I offer "Main kya karoon Ram" as a contender
> > for the top (or is it bottom) spot. :-)
>
> LOL. Yes, Sangam should make it. If the cut-off was a bit later I
> would propose "ik baat kahuu.N gar maano tum" from Golmaal. And how
> about "sayonaaraa saayonaaraa", where she sounds like a far lesser
> singer trying to sound like Lata trying to sound like an oriental
> singer :)
>
Vigorous nodding of the head for "sayonaara" (and the Golmaal song).
As to Sanjeev's point about the Sangam song, Lata has plenty of
delightfully cheesy, cheeky songs, but in this one, I find her singing
too self-conscious and contrived. Her mortification comes through *in
the song* and that is counter to the mood/attitude of the situation.
I have a two-fer candidate - the title song of "Pyar Ki Pyaas." Rafi
and Lata both sound like chipmunks in this one to me.
> BTW, have you noticed that some of these "worst" songs could very well
> be in someone's "best" list? :)
>
Yup....I believe "sayonaara" features in *Lata's* favorites list. And
I'm pretty sure the Pyar Ki Pyaas song is high on many folks' Top X
list as well. That's what makes the "worsts" list more fun.;-)
Shalini
> C
Ritu
Phew... we are in a mood for picking a fight aren't we? Anyway, what I
said then and what I said now is all in public domain. The matter is
so silly that I don't feel like entertaining it further. Make your own
conclusions. I would rather discuss the merits of my favourite songs.
Regards
Ritu
P.S You can check this out :)
http://www.yourdictionary.com/donkey-s-years
Arunabha
> > For the Asha loyalist composers:
> > nadii naare na jaao shyaam (Mujhe Jeene Do) - Jaidev
>
> Great Asha lists from everyone. Virtually every song mentioned
> features among my favorites as well, except for the above from Mujhe
> Jeene Do. For some reason I find it very grating. "Main jaanu nahi piya ko milan kaise hoye rii" from
> Andolan. Asha seems to put her soul into the meera bhajan and comes
> up with a searing rendition. One of my all time favorite devotionals.
Looks like you are not alone - one venerable gentleman claimed that
"nadii naare na jaao" is an example of why Asha should never be
allowed to sing a thumri/light-classical song. I've always loved the
song however. I am partial to the Asha voice of this timeframe and
especially all the SDB songs she has sung with lightness and
crispness, This is one of the Jaidev songs that fits that verve.
I have no quarrel with your replacement choice however - in fact it
was on my mind as *the* Jaidev representative when I mentally made a
list, and somehow escaped me when I got to writing the post. And I
thought you had completely written off Jaidev of the 70s :-)
As a side-note, I'd like to thank the compilers of the East Coast and
West Coast commemoratives on Asha which both have a tremendous
selection of excellent singing by Asha. I was first exposed to "piyaa
ko milan kaise hoye rii" in the East Coast commemorative. Many of my
selections/thought processes have actually been strongly conditioned
by those beautiful selections.
-- Arunabha
Vinay
> On Apr 25, 12:49 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Apr 25, 9:15 am, Srinivas Ganti <sga...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > yeh bhii achha hai, vo bhii achha hai, aap ka choice to baDiya hai :)
>
> > :)
>
> > > Any takers for the worst songs ?
>
> > Yeah, I copped out on that one. Why don't you give it a shot? One
> > rule: keep Lata/Asha's recent work out of the reckoning. There is no
> > point in saying "diidii teraa devar diiwaanaa" is one of Lata's worst.
> > Let us say the cut-off is 1980 for her.
>
> I was thinking the same thing - surely it's more fun to compile the
> "worst" lists. :-) Agree on excluding the sisters' recent work, but I
> would move the cut-off for Lata/Rafi to 1970 and Asha/Kishore to
> 1980.
Some of Asha's (and Kishore's) songs from 80s would surely be in my
favorite list. Why, her 'ye saaye hai.n' from Sitara would probably be
in my all-time top 5 on most days. Even as late as 87 I find her
fascinating in albums like Ijaazat and Dil Padosi Hai. But I agree
with you that for a worst songs list of Asha (actually of any kind)
80s should be excluded. Having it in will make the list just way too
long.
Vinay
>
> Interestingly enough, I can't think of a Lata song from the 50s,
> except for maybe "tum kyaa jaano" :-), that would make my "worst"
> list, but from the 60s, I offer "Main kya karoon Ram" as a contender
> for the top (or is it bottom) spot. :-)
>
> Shalini
>
>
>
> > C- Hide quoted text -
>
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
> On Apr 25, 11:09 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I am facing quite a hard time in making an "Asha worst" list (time
> frame is 50s to 1992) - I can think of nothing other than Navrang.
What, for "Aa Dil Se Dil Milaale" (purposely sung that way)? At the
very least, the song "Tum Mere, Main Teri" is nicely done IMO.
Sanjeev
Ritu
>
> Overall, I found the exercise of selecting Asha and Kishore songs
> easier and more interesting than that of choosing LM and Rafi songs.
I agree, I too find it far easier to select lists of these artists. I
think my reason is that with Kishore and Asha I either like a song
very very much or I am totally indifferent to it. There is no dilly
dallying as with LM and Rafi. The the latter two artists my favourites
list changes constantly. With the former two it is mostly fixed.
> One of Vish's spot-on observations about Asha's singing is the
> simplicity and lack of artifice with which she delivers songs "of
> children, for children, and with children". I personally feel this is
> one category where no other singer delivers the goods the way Asha
> does:
> laalii laalii Doliyaa me.n (Teesri Kasam)
I agree.. this is one of the most winsome songs from Asha's song book.
I love the way the song just suddenly starts and the off-key chorus.
This one counts in my top list too.
> aayii parii ra.ng bharii (Do Phool)
Unusual choice... a fine song. Though somehow it never evokes a 'child
song' feeling in me.
>
> Asha has sung a few, but very special songs for the composers who gave
> their best to Lata:
> dil lagaakar ham ye samajhe (Zindagi Aur Maut)
Aha!!.... at last someone mentioned, the song that probably is the
strongest contender for the number 1 Asha songs in my scheme of
things. What a beautiful rendition, the same lingering feel of 'Tum
kya jano' but with a far richer voice the experience is richer. I wish
Asha had done more such stuff with CR. (I must mention here that the
Mahendra Kapoor tandem to this song is akin to someone hitting you on
the head with a club. I always knew the MK version, the Asha version
was one of my best discoveries)
For N Dutta I would go with 'Main jab bhi akeli hoti hoon' or 'Jhukti
ghata gaati hawa'
> shoK nazar kii bijaliyaa.N (Wo Kaun Thi) - MM
I too would go with 'Sabah se yeh kehdo'
> koii dekhe to kahe tujhako - (Apradhi Kaun) - Salil Chowdhury
Haven't heard this one. My favourite would be 'Thandi thandi sawan ki
phuhaar'
> nigaahe.n milaane ko jii chaahataa hai (Dil Hi To Hai) - Roshan
Ditto.. not in my top 5 though.
> nadii naare na jaao shyaam (Mujhe Jeene Do) - Jaidev
Really? You like this one? This is such an antithesis of what one
identifies as Asha-Jaidev. My choice with Jaidev would be between
'Bansuriya man har le gayi' and 'Jaa ri pawaniya' with 'Mujhko bhi
radha banale nandlal(sad version)
> diiwaanaa huaa baadal (Kashmir Ki Kali) - just for one stanza, but a
> tour de force - OPN
Interesting.... to me this is a Rafi song out and out. Asha's presence
in the song only makes Rafi sound even better (not in an
uncomplimentary way). Asha-OPN is going to be a tough choice. These
days I am enamoured by 'Jaaye jahan meri nazar' from Kalpana.
> do buu.Nde.n saavan kii (Phir Subah Hogi) - Khaiyyaam
>
> For the family: (far too many choices !, have to make do with one or
> two representatives)
> koii aayaa dha.Dakan kahatii hai (Lajwanti)
My favourite from Lajwanti is 'Chanda mama mere dwar aana'. The same
purity of expression, that is rare for Asha to achieve in all other
genres, is something she seems to summon so easily and so charmingly
for kiddy songs. I love the way she sings 'aaaaa......na' . Also the
way she hits that high note in the first line 'Chanda mamaaaaaaa'.
So to consolidate, my top few Asha songs
1. Dil laga kar ham yeh samjhe (Zindagi aur Maut, CR) - Already waxed
eloquent on it above
2. Thandi Thandi Saawan ki Phuhaar (Jaagte Raho, SC). As I said,
before there are very few Asha songs, esp. sad ones that seem genuine
in their expression (strictly my opinion). But the ones that come
through, come through with a searing intensity that probably only
Geeta Dutt achieves at times. This is one of those songs. Asha is in
there 100%. Lovely tune. Only thing jarring at times is the
orchestration.
3. Jaaye jahan meri nazar (Kalpana, OPN) - The bass in her voice is
exploited beatifully in this Nayyer beauty.
4. Aali ri mere naina baan pade (non-film, Jaidev) - There is soul and
energy in this song. Quite like the Sufi genre, yet not much like it.
A unique song. The Asha-Jaidev synergy at it's very best.
5. Main pankh laga ke ud jaun( Armaan, SDB) : The qunitessential SDB.
A very different Asha and an absolutely in form Sahir.
6. Justju jiski thi (Umrao Jaan, Bazaar) : I like Khayyam's experiment
to make her sing in a lower pitch in Umrao Jaan the effect is
marvellous. Beautiful lyrics and genuine singing.
7. Laali Laali doliya mein (Teesri Kasam, SJ) : Waxed eloquent above
8. Tu Jahan Mile Mujhe (Doosra Aadmi, RDB): I am quite smitten by this
song for some time now. This is the era when Asha's voice quality was
at it's mellow, rich best. A simple tune, a charming play of words.
9. Raaton ko chori chori (?, OPN) : OPN makes a double entry in the
list. But this song is too good to be left out.
Shall stop here...
Rafi, Kishore later
Ritu
P.S With Asha, one would have to recount her duets, esp. the female-
female ones to really come to a top list. Some of her best output lies
in the realm of duets.
Asif
>
> Phew... we are in a mood for picking a fight aren't we? Anyway, what I
> said then and what I said now is all in public domain. The matter is
> so silly that I don't feel like entertaining it further. Make your own
> conclusions. I would rather discuss the merits of my favourite songs.
>
> Regards
> Ritu
>
> P.S You can check this out :)http://www.yourdictionary.com/donkey-s-years
I do not need to know the definition of donkey's years. I just asked
you to search your post by those words. My point was: on that thread
you mocked everybody for discussing things that you and others already
discussed. Now you are discussing some other beaten things and find
them wonderful. Phew!
Here is what you said about others then:
Vinay
Asif:
I hope 'ki phaTe me.n Taa.ng nahii.n Daal rahaa huu.N' but to me Ritu
seems to be actually on the same side as you in that thread. In
response to a typical sarcastic remark by the good Professor, which
actually *was* discouraging, she said,
"Yes and I am sure there are many who would like to hear about it
too :) ! I know we've been here for donkey's years and have discussed
and discovered everything, but there are many RMIMers who would like
to take the same pleasure we did when we first discussed and
discovered these facts. No? "
To me it seems that she is encouraging the discussion to go on rather
than trying to stop them.
Vinay
Asif
To me, the smiley gave away the mocking intent.
surjit singh
Here is one of Lata's top ten lists
http://members.rediff.com/lata/art16.html
For me only number 1 will make the best list, perhas 2. And numbers
7-10 will be in the worst list.
Ritu
Thanks Vinay...for making an attempt :). Though I doubt it has had any
effect. This whole thing is really amusing. My writing skills really
must be bad. I thought my intention was quite clear in that post.I
don't subscribe with the 'Search of the archives' view of many
RMIMers. I genuinely feel that just because veteran RMIMers have
discussed certain topics to death, there is no reason a fresher cannot
go down the same road again on RMIM.
Anyway, history tells me that it's useless to go down this road. Asif
has decided that I meant otherwise, and shall find smileys, commas and
quotes to support his assumption. So be it.
Cheers
Ritu
>
> Vinay- Hide quoted text -
Srinivas Ganti
there's no point in going beyond say 70's for Rafi and 80's for
others.
Before going to the songs consider this.
Obscure song that is bad. You listen to it, ignore it and forget it.
Popular song that is bad. You cant ignore it because it keeps being
played on TV, Radio and so forth and
it stays in your mind. I won't be surprised if these rank high on some
peoples lists but I am sure there are
*like minded people* here who agree.
To begin with here's one for each singer.
Lata: dil vil pyaar vyaar main kya jaanu re
..aiyaaaaaa...... can some one switch off the radio please !
Rafi: # April fool banaaya #.
Good that April is coming to an end !
Kishore: Naach meri bulbul ke paisaa milega
Paise ki baat chhoDo yaar kahiin chappal na mil jaaye !
Asha: Na mila too nazar (Patthar aur paayal)
Srinivas.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> As a side-note, I'd like to thank the compilers of the East Coast and
> West Coast commemoratives on Asha which both have a tremendous
> selection of excellent singing by Asha.
You are welcome :)
C
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> I have a two-fer candidate - the title song of "Pyar Ki Pyaas." Rafi
> and Lata both sound like chipmunks in this one to me.
<thinking> I am not particularly fond of listening to this song but a
worst list candidate?
> Yup....I believe "sayonaara" features in *Lata's* favorites list. And
> I'm pretty sure the Pyar Ki Pyaas song is high on many folks' Top X
> list as well. That's what makes the "worsts" list more fun.;-)
I didn't know the LoveInTokyo abomination was on Lata's list! Yes,
worst lists are fun :)
C
Saket
> Now onto the more controversial topic of worst songs. I agree that
> there's no point in going beyond say 70's for Rafi and 80's for
> others.
>
> Before going to the songs consider this.
>
> Obscure song that is bad. You listen to it, ignore it and forget it.
>
> Popular song that is bad. You cant ignore it because it keeps being
> played on TV, Radio and so forth and
> it stays in your mind. I won't be surprised if these rank high on some
> peoples lists but I am sure there are
> *like minded people* here who agree.
>
> To begin with here's one for each singer.
>
> Lata: dil vil pyaar vyaar main kya jaanu re
>
> ..aiyaaaaaa...... can some one switch off the radio please !
Sadly, Shankar-Jaikishan managed to master this category ......... as
early as Arzoo ('65), incidently same year as dil vil pyar,
>
> Rafi: # April fool banaaya #.
> Good that April is coming to an end !
For Rafi, I'd like to throw in complete soundtrack of 'An Evening in
Paris' in this category !
This album should come with a warning 'listening to it can be
injurious to your ears/soul' :)
>
> Kishore: Naach meri bulbul ke paisaa milega
> Paise ki baat chhoDo yaar kahiin chappal na mil jaaye !
>
Saala main to saahab ban gayaa & Pyaar ke is khel me.n (both SDB :
( alas )
> Asha: Na mila too nazar (Patthar aur paayal)
>
Was this a popular/famous/chart-topper ?
Kat likh de saa.Nvariyaa ke naam baabuu
Also, if it can be considered famous, kaare kaare badaraa (Mera Naam
Joker)
> Srinivas.
Arunabha
worst list:
C. Ramchandra: About 70 % of their songs belong in her worst list.
Just a sampling:
ye hawaa ye samaa (Shagufa),
abhii shaam aayegii nikale.nge taare (Samadhi),
tuu aaye na aaye magar jaane waale (??),
ai chaa.Nd pyaar meraa (Khazana)
It's not even a variety of bad songs, it's a sheer monotony of bad,
listless featureless songs.
Madan Mohan: A lot of the songs that have popped up with frightening
regularity on their Best of, Greatest hits, Rare Gems, Legends etc .
anthologies. All rank bad songs.
bairan nii.nd na aaye (Chacha Zindabaad)
un aa.Nkho.n me.n nii.nd kahaa.N (Minister ?)
vo bhuulii daastaa.N (Sanjog)
sajanaa lagan terii sone na de (?)
maane naa, maane naa haay balam paradesiyaa (Yuck !!)
merii aa.Nkho.n se koii nii.nd liye jaataa hai (Pooja Ke Phool)
RDB:
le lo baabuu pii lo naariyal paanii (Apna Desh)
ab ke saavan me.n jii Dare (and many similar RDB-composed Kishore
duets of the 70s)
With other 50s-70s composers (Roshan, Salil Chowdhury, Hemant Kumar,
Naushad, SDB and so on) it's a little bit more difficult to perform
this exercise. There are plenty of indifferent and mediocre songs with
them, but it's hard to come up with songs that are unqualifiably bad.
-- Arunabha
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> > BTW, have you noticed that some of these "worst" songs could very well
> > be in someone's "best" list? :)
>
> "Chham chham naachat aayi bahaar" would be in my "close to best" list,
> but I haven't heard this "longer version". Could you post a link to it
> (or send me an mp3 file :-))?
The usual version (e.g. on musicindiaonline) is quite short. The
longer version I am referring to has a bunch of sargams which are
executed (and perhaps even designed) so badly the song goes to the
worst list for me. Download this version at
http://www.mediafire.com/?z9my9mn21ln
Have fun :)
C
Chetan Vinchhi
> The following songs/song categories offhand will make it to my Lata's
> worst list:
Heat shields on, Arunabha? :)
> With other 50s-70s composers (Roshan, Salil Chowdhury, Hemant Kumar,
> Naushad, SDB and so on) it's a little bit more difficult to perform
> this exercise. There are plenty of indifferent and mediocre songs with
> them, but it's hard to come up with songs that are unqualifiably bad.
I did propose one Salil song. See the other post for a link to the
"longer" version of the Chhaya song.
I have another candidate for Lata's worst list. It is "hai kahii.n par
shaadamaanii" from Aandhiyan. Either Ali Akbar Khan did not know what
he was doing or Lata simply didn't "get" the tune. The singing is so
disconnected, especially in the antaras, that it does not hold
together as a song at all. To top it off, there are 3 parts to this
song, all almost equally bad!
C
Shalini
"Arunabha" <roy.ar...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:3e9b9977-9724-4e2c...@q27g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> The following songs/song categories offhand will make it to my Lata's
> worst list:
>
> C. Ramchandra: About 70 % of their songs belong in her worst list.
*Gasp* Better watch your back the next time you're around Herr Dhareshwar.
:-)
> Madan Mohan: A lot of the songs that have popped up with frightening
> regularity on their Best of, Greatest hits, Rare Gems, Legends etc .
> anthologies. All rank bad songs.
I like Madan Mohan quite a bit, but for me, his combo with Lata is not the
last word in Hindi film music that it's almost always portrayed to be.
There are other MDs whose music (both overall and Lata output) resonates
more deeply with me than MM.
> bairan nii.nd na aaye (Chacha Zindabaad)
> merii aa.Nkho.n se koii nii.nd liye jaataa hai (Pooja Ke Phool)
These two songs are prime examples of why Madan Mohan doesn't make it to my
sentimental favorites list. IMO, he has too many of these very mannered,
affected, stretching-Lata's-voice-to it's-breaking-point type songs, and too
few of the "chand madham hai" kind.
>
> RDB:
> le lo baabuu pii lo naariyal paanii (Apna Desh)
> ab ke saavan me.n jii Dare (and many similar RDB-composed Kishore
> duets of the 70s)
>
I almost feel guilty in saying this, but a 70s Lata-Kishore duet, that I
unconditionally enjoy is a rarity for me. Lata almost always brings down
their duets for me, and all too often I find myself wishing another singing
partner had been chosen.
> With other 50s-70s composers (Roshan, Salil Chowdhury, Hemant Kumar,
> Naushad, SDB and so on) it's a little bit more difficult to perform
> this exercise. There are plenty of indifferent and mediocre songs with
> them, but it's hard to come up with songs that are unqualifiably bad.
>
Just to show that I *can* be critical of Roshan, here's one by him that sets
my teeth on edge - "sari sari raat teri yaad saatey." All that strained,
whiny sweetness....almost sounds like a Madan Mohan number! :-)
Now, for a entry in the highly-regarded-but-would-make-it-to-my-worsts-list
for Asha, I offer "raat ke pichale paharon mein" from Anjali. A lovely,
nuanced composition ruined by the overt emoting by Asha.
Shalini
> -- Arunabha
>
>
AR
> On Apr 25, 8:59 pm, AR <aji...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > > BTW, have you noticed that some of these "worst" songs could very well
> > > be in someone's "best" list? :)
>
> "chham chham naachat aa_ii bahaar"! Lata sounds extremely
> uncomfortable and even goes besur in some of the later sargam
> passages. Totally unlike her! And totally unlistenable!
>
>
> > but I haven't heard this "longer version". Could you post a link to it
> > (or send me an mp3 file :-))?
>
> The usual version (e.g. on musicindiaonline) is quite short. The
> longer version I am referring to has a bunch of sargams which are
> executed (and perhaps even designed) so badly the song goes to the
> worst list for me. Download this version at
>
> http://www.mediafire.com/?z9my9mn21ln
>
> Have fun :)
>
> C
Hi Chetan,
Thanks a lot for this song. And I really mean it. I didn't really find
anything annoying in those sargams. In fact those sargams are a beauty
spot in the song, especially when she hits the taar madhyam and rolls
downwards at top speed (Ga Re Ma Ga Re Sa ni Sa, Sa ni dha pa ma ga re
sa ). Yes, the bit "ga ma dha ni Sa sa Sa" is clumsy, but that's more
for the way it's been composed than for Lata's rendition. Salil seems
to be trying a little too hard to make the song unduly complex. There
is a similar bit "Ni ni Ni" somewhere later on. Nowhere did I find
Lata besur or uncomfortable. IMHO, her breath control was quite
amazing. So this song still remains in my "close to the best"
category. As an aside, the song has an amazing instrumental prelude,
one of the very best I've heard in Hindi film music.
Instances of Lata totally losing it would probably include something
"dil teraa deewana hai sanam" or "ae mere shah-e-khubaan", but IMHO
not this one.
Thanks again!
----Ajit
Srinivas Ganti
> The following songs/song categories offhand will make it to my Lata's
> worst list:
>
> C. Ramchandra: About 70 % of their songs belong in her worst list.
> Just a sampling:
> ye hawaa ye samaa (Shagufa),
> abhii shaam aayegii nikale.nge taare (Samadhi),
> tuu aaye na aaye magar jaane waale (??),
> ai chaa.Nd pyaar meraa (Khazana)
> It's not even a variety of bad songs, it's a sheer monotony of bad,
> listless featureless songs.
I wudn't put those 70% on my worst list but I would call them as
average.
While on CR it was a struggle to get 15 tracks and with great
diffculty
I was able to get a dozen after lowering the bar.
The songs will sound better if you remove that high pitched prelude :)
Srinivas.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Thanks a lot for this song. And I really mean it.
You are welcome, Ajit!
> I didn't really find
> anything annoying in those sargams. In fact those sargams are a beauty
> spot in the song, especially when she hits the taar madhyam and rolls
> downwards at top speed (Ga Re Ma Ga Re Sa ni Sa, Sa ni dha pa ma ga re
> sa ).
I should have added a YMMV tag explicitly. I find the sargam to be
totally out of place with the overall flow of the song.
> Yes, the bit "ga ma dha ni Sa sa Sa" is clumsy, but that's more
> for the way it's been composed than for Lata's rendition. Salil seems
> to be trying a little too hard to make the song unduly complex.
I agree that part of the blame lies with the composition. It is almost
as if the whole song was concieved and then the sargam passages were
force-fitted. There is no room for the singer to breathe, take the
sargams and then come back naturally to the mukhada. It sounds
inorganic.
> There
> is a similar bit "Ni ni Ni" somewhere later on. Nowhere did I find
> Lata besur or uncomfortable.
To my ears the climb to the madhya-saptak Ni is a bit off and the fall
back to the mandra Ni is also, er, imperfect. Maybe I am turning into
a tin-eared philistine (where is Ashok these days? :) )
> IMHO, her breath control was quite
> amazing.
On the contrary Lata sounds out-of-breath throughout the sargam bit.
As a result, sur lagaav suffers.
> Instances of Lata totally losing it would probably include something
> "dil teraa deewana hai sanam" or "ae mere shah-e-khubaan", but IMHO
> not this one.
These songs are obvious aberrations. They are tuned beyond her comfort
range - we have talked extensively about how unfair key selection has
been to female singers in general and Lata in particular.
With the Chhaya song, there is little excuse. Lata is supposed to be
in (or close to) her prime. The song is probably pitched a bit high
for her. But the complexity and the genre are her home ground. She
should have delivered. I know you think she did :) Let us say the jury
is still out on this one ;)
C
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
> On Apr 26, 9:00 am, Srinivas Ganti <sga...@gmail.com> wrote:
> For Rafi, I'd like to throw in complete soundtrack of 'An Evening in
> Paris' in this category !
>
> This album should come with a warning 'listening to it can be
> injurious to your ears/soul' :)
You'd have to go a little later into the Rafi-SJ anthology IMO for
that. I still like the Rafi energy in this album (though I do think
the song "Mera Dil Hai Tera" is particularly indicative of SJ running
out of ideas for Shammi songs) .
Sanjeev
shooganpr...@yahoo.co.in
> A recent thread on tasveer teri dil mein has seen a lot of heated
> discussion on the merits of the singers. It would be interesating to
> know what the connoisseurs here think are the best five and the worst
> five songs of the following masters. Purely on the merit of singing.
>
> 1.Lata Mangeshkar
> 2.Asha Bhosle
> 3.Kishore Kumar
> 4.Mohd Rafi
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bhavana
Five or for that matter 10, 15, 20 is not sufficient to pick the best
from such a vast repertoire.
Here is my list of 10 best solos for each.
A) Mohammad Rafi
01) SHAHEED = watan ki raah
02) BHABHI = chal uDD jaa re panchhi
03) EK PHOOL CHAR KANTE = o o meri baby Doll
04) KALA BAZAAR = apni to har aah
05) GUIDE = tere mere sapne
06) CHAKRADHARI= bolo hai zameen
07) PAAPI = teraa kaam hai jalnaa parwaane
08) MR & MRS 55 = aji dil par huaa aisaa jaadoo
09) NAQLI NAWAB = chheDaa jo dil ka fasaanaa
10) SHOLA AUR SHABNAM = jaane kayaa DhoonDti hai
B) Lata Mangeshkar
01) ANARKALI = yeh zindagi usiiki hai
02) BAHAANA = jaa re badraa bairi jaa re
03) DEVDAS = ab aage teri marzi
04) LADLI = tumhare bulaane ko ji chaaahtaa hai
05) MUGHAL-E-AZAM = pyaar kiyaa to darnaa kyaa
06) MUJHE JEENE DO = raat bhi hai kuchh bheegi bheegi
07) NAGIN = meraa dil yeh pukaare aajaa
08) SAWAN = kaanhaa chheDo baa.n.suri
09) SEEMA = sunno chhotisi guDiyaa ki lambi kahaani
10) YASMIN = mujh pe ilzaam hai
C) Asha Bhosle
01) AMAR = ek baat kahoo.n
02) ASHA = inaa minaa dikaa
03) MANGU = mann more gaa jhoom ke
04) BANDINI = ab ke baras
05) CHAALIS DIN = baithe hai.n reh huzar
06) KALPANA = bekasi hadd se guzar
07) MITTI MEN SONA = poochho naa hame ham
08) LIGHT HOUSE = tang aa chuke
09) PHIR WOHI DIL LAYA HOON = aankho.n se jo uttari
10) TALAAQ = nayi umar ki kaliyo.n
D) Kishore Kumar
01) AAP KI KASAM = zindagi kaa safar
02) BEGUNAH = aaj naa jane paagal
03) CHALTI KA NAAM GADI = ek laDki bheegi bheegi
04) DO DOONI CHAR = hawaao.n pe likh do
05) DO RAASTE = mere naseeb mei.n
06) GOLMAAL = aane waala pal
07) JHOOMROO = matt waale ham
08) NEW DELHI = nakhre waali
09) PAYING GUEST = maanaa janaab
10) SHRIMANJI = iss duniyaa pe pyaar
Regards
Sukesh
Abhijit
> A recent thread on tasveer teri dil mein has seen a lot of heated
> discussion on the merits of the singers. It would be interesating to
> know what the connoisseurs here think are the best five and the worst
> five songs of the following masters. Purely on the merit of singing.
>
> 1.Lata Mangeshkar
> 2.Asha Bhosle
> 3.Kishore Kumar
> 4.Mohd Rafi
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bhavana
I have not gone through the entire thread yet. But let me try and add
my 5 best for Rafi "purely on the merit of singing". Need I add that
this list can change with time just as Lata's favorites keep changing?
* bastii-bastii parbat-parbat gaataa jaaye
* kahaa.N jaa rahaa hai tuu ai jaanewaale
* jaag dil-e-diiwaanaa
* aapane yaad dilaayaa to mujhe yaad aayaa
* aap ke pahaluu me.n aakar ro diye
For me, Rafi's magic works best for "medium soft" songs. His range of
emotions is rather limited compared to Kishore's. That's why some of
his worst songs are outside this "medium soft" category:
* kaan me.n jhumakaa, chaal me.n Thumakaa
* kyaa huaa teraa waadaa
* phir wo bhuulii sii yaad aa_ii hai (over-emoting)
* mai.n wahii, wahii baat
* jaanewaalo zaraa hoshiyaar (and other similar Shammi Kapoor craps)
More later...
Manish Kumar
music can be. Debating will accomplish nothing. The best you can do is
exchange opinions.
I tried to refrain from this interesting thread because it requires a
select audience. One must have heard a good number of songs by all
four legends (>15,000 up to 1980). It'll take me at least 10 yrs
before I do that. Listening always comes before discussing. However, I
can't resist responses on some songs that were mentioned in this
thread and I have indeed heard. I will not give my *own* lists save
for Kishore's best.
"Raat Ke Humsafar" is one of my favorite Rafi-Asha duets. Can't see
anything glaring in that song. Loved the Western influenced beginning
part of this SJ composition.
Title songs of April Fool and Evening in Paris: Both have English
lyrics that are pronounced with an accent and stick out like sore
thumbs. I can see people objecting to that. The lyrics are what they
are - no singer can change that. The singing itself was quite good.
Difference between judging a song and a singer's performance. These
songs were very informal, composed for cinema fun, and not intended
for music purists.
SJ catered to different audiences. Some say SJ were a blend of class
and mass. In the same movie, Ehsan Tera Hoga Mujhpe was the epitome of
class and Chahe Koi Mujhe Junglee Kahe was the epitome of mass. The
two songs appeal to different audiences. Originally, there was to be
only a male version of Ehsaan Tera Hoga Muchpe. When Lata heard it,
she loved it, and asked Jaikishan to have her sing it too!
Banda Parwar Mein: There's a part where Dharmendra literally screams
into Saira Bano's ears. Rafi acts it out. I don't like that and it
gives me reasons to pick other songs. When I was 10 yrs old my dad
would play boring bhajans on full volume in the entire home. Every now
and then, "Aana Hai To Aa" would play. Man did I love that song! Even
at that age I could immediately relate to the singer's perfectly
executed emotions! This is before I even knew who Mohammed Rafi was.
Oustanding song from the Rafi-OP combo.
Kya Hua Tera Wada: Categorizing this as worst was a real bouncer. It
is a decent song. The only part I didn't like was the middle with
children singing. The voice and emotions were both 4/5 (for this
particular performance).
Even by mid 70s when Rafi's poor health resulted sporadic voice
quality - his iniitable taan and harkatein remained intact.
Here are ten songs of Rafi from that period that are past 1970 and I
would give 8/10 at least. They may not be your "Zindagi Bhar Nahin" or
"Tere Mere Sapne" because they are from a different era. It's possible
that people interested in only 50s or 60s music are trying to evaluate
70s songs by the same criteria (just a guess).
Yeh Raat Hai Pyasi Pyasi (1971)
Teri Bindiya Re (1973)
Tum Jo Mil Gaye Ho (1973)
Yeh Maana Meri Jaan (1973)
Nafrat Ki Duniya (1973)
Chura Liye Hai Tumne (1973)
Barbaad E Mohabbat (1976) (those who say Rafi sounds "tired" - I think
that was the design of the ghazal - just see the picturisation)
Aaj Mausam Bada Beimaan Hai (1973)
Mujhe Ishq Hai Tujhise (1971)
Shirdwale Sai Baba (1977)
Aadmi Musafir Hai (1977)
Here is one of many songs where Rafi's voice was clearly past his best
but the emotions were so wonderfully executed: Tu Ne Mujhe Bulaya
Sherawaliye (who but Rafi & Chanchal could render this wonderful
bhajan?). I'm very appreciative of Rafi's 70s works.
My top 5 Kishore Kumar songs:
1. Meri Bheeghi Bheeghi Se
2. Rhim Jhim Gire Sawan
The above two have excellent voice & hauting emotions behind every
word. Kishore and loRD REALLY understood each other.
3. Tere Bina Zindagi Se Koi Shikwa
4. Mera Naina Sawan Bhadon Mein
5. Zindagi Ke Safar Mein
I feel guilty not including SD Burman or LP. loRD was Kishore's best
MD. SD took too much of a "second serve" approach with Kishore. loRD
challenged Kishore to maximum heights with all types of compositions.
Kishore's holistic ability as an artist allowed him to take classical
compositions and modify them to his own style. That's what he did with
#4 and the song from Kudrat. Had the latter been rendered in
traditional classical form as Parveen Sultana did, it wouldn't have
reached the same heights of popularity. Truth is, only 5 songs is a
great great injustice to Kishore Kumar - but I was feeling lazy
anyway.
Abhijit
>
> Kya Hua Tera Wada: Categorizing this as worst was a real bouncer. It
> is a decent song. The only part I didn't like was the middle with
> children singing. The voice and emotions were both 4/5 (for this
> particular performance).
>
I went "purely on the merit of singing" rather than composition to
include this song as one of the worsts. Really I find it hard to
tolerate "yaad hai mujhako"/"o kahane waale" parts, just as I find
"tumhaarii reshamii zulfo.n me.n dil ke phuul khilate hai.n" in
"suhaanii chaa.Ndanii raate.n". Both are nice compositions
'barbaadified' by poor singing, maybe because of ageing of the singers
concerned. Just hear Mukesh in the early 70s "jis galii me.n teraa
ghar na ho baalamaa". Great rendition! BTW, if I were to choose Best
and Worst of Mukesh, the Satyam Shivam Sundaram song "cha.nchal
shiital nirmal" would feature among the worst for similar reasons.
Manish Wadhane
> Roshan-Rafi : 'Man re' makes it more for the lyrics than for the tune
> or singing. I can't seem to recall too many Roshan-Rafi songs. Can
> someone jog my memory?
Ritu,
Here are a few of the Roshan-Rafi gems which might interest you:
1. Ek Haseen Sham ko..Dil Mera Kho Gaya..
2. Paao Chhoo Lene Do, Phoolon ko Inayat Hogi..
3. Jo Baat Tujh mein Hai..
4. Aapne Yaad Dilaya to Mujhe Yaad Aaya.. (I love it and someone here
has rightly included it in his list of favourites)
-Manish
On 25 Apr, 20:31, Ritu <rituchandra0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Apr 24, 11:07 am, Shalini Razdan <shaliniraz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Apr 24, 2:03 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Apr 23, 8:01 am, Chetan Vinchhi <vinc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > This is an interesting question that will generate no interesting
> > > > answers, except for song lists :)
>
> > > I still stand by this :) but....
>
> > > > All these singers have sung so many
> > > > different types of songs with MDs with such disparate styles and over
> > > > such a long period that it is difficult to nail down 5 or 50 or 500
> > > > best songs for them.
>
> > > ...I am ready to eat my words on this one.
>
> > > I had a long discussion with Arunabha about the possibility of coming
> > > up with such a list. And we did come up with our separate lists (some
> > > overlap inevitable). With due note that these lists are subject to
> > > change without notice and that your top-5 are probably not included
> > > here, my choices (in no specific order) would be as follows. Please
> > > sprinkle IMOs wherever appropriate.
>
> > > Also, as it turned out "purely on the merit of singing" was not really
> > > satisfied. Singing is impeccable in these songs, but the choices are
> > > more sentimental than cerebral.
>
> > Chetan, you're both braver and a better sport than moi.:-) I still
> > can't (or more accurately, won't) contemplate making a list of my top
> > favorites, let alone *best* songs, for these four singers. Of course,
> > that won't prevent me from making comments on your list.:-)
>
> It is amazing on how many times one does this exercise (of choosing a
> top 'n') or a particular artist and how one never tires of it. I think
> these lists are a wonderful way to renew your vows with your favourite
> songs.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Lata
>
> > > ------
>
> > > The thought process organically veered towards seeking her best work
> > > with specific MDs!
>
> > > 1. ruuTh ke tum to chal diye
>
> > > There were several Anil Biswas candidates (notably, "ik pal ruuk
> > > jaanaa"). I pick this as a sentimental favorite. The wistful lingering
> > > on ruuTh, the gait of the song, the returning to home after starting
> > > in the uttarang and especially the way Lata has delivered it has made
> > > this the golden standard for "this type" of songs!
>
> > Great pick, but I have a sentimental preference for "ik pal ruk
> > jaanaa" (slow version) for some of the same reasons you gave for this
> > song - the wistful, melancholy rendition by Lata.
>
> I agree too... this song hits me deep deep inside. It is as enigmatic,
> mysterious and alluring as the deep forests of the North East where
> this film is based. 'Ruth ke tum to chal diye' is also very enigmatic.
> With these songs, I always get a feeling that there are unfathomable
> depths waiting to be discovered. But like Shalini, my vote also goes
> to 'Ik pal ruk jaana', mainly because the mysticsm of nature that
> seeps through in this song. So my reasons are very different but the
> choice is the same :)
>
>
>
> > > 2. tum kyaa jaano
>
> > > The same story for CR. This one pipped "ye zindagii usii kii hai" and
> > > others to the finish line, solely because the song brings tears to my
> > > eyes every time I hear it. And only partly because a very
> > > knowledgeable and passionate music lover once said he'd rather listen
> > > to this song than Ramayan/Gita recitation when he is on his death-
> > > bed,
>
> > Given it's exalted status, I'm almost afraid to say this, but this
> > song does NOTHING for me. :-( "Ye zindagi usii ki hai" on the other
> > hand moved me to tears as a toddler and still does, decades later -
> > every single time.
>
> I must say Shalini, you were a quite a profound toddler to have 'Yeh
> Zingagi Usi Ki Hai' moving you to tears. The only thing that moved me
> to tears as a toddler was the sight of my mother running after me with
> a glass of milk :). It is a little wonder you like happy songs now.
> You spent your tears as a toddler!
>
> I second Chetan on that one. I am not much of a CR fan, but the
> delicacy of this song is like a fine vintage wine. It lingers on long
> after the song has stopped playing. I don't think of it as a sad song
> though. It appeals more to my sense than to my emotions.
>
>
>
> > > 3. jal ke dil khaak hu_aa
>
> > > This song nearly killed me once :) I had just acquired it and was
> > > driving on the freeway after popping the tape in. The saki (vocal
> > > prelude) had already grabbed my attention, but the mukhada nearly made
> > > me veer off into the next lane! I just love the emotion and the
> > > singing in this song. And if you have information about bad
> > > picturization or anything, please don't share it with me...
>
> > This song or more precisely, Lata's singing, gives me goose
> > bumps....she's mesmerizingly disturbing.
>
> Never heard this one. Would someone be kind to oblige?
>
>
>
> > > 4. lag jaa gale
>
> > > What can I say? MM is not (at least no longer lest Ketan should pull
> > > out an 11 year old post of mine :) ) on my top-5 MDs list. But I find
> > > this song to be irresistable. The tune is beautifully crafted, but the
> > > song belongs to the singer all the way.
>
> > Agree on all counts.
>
> Disagree... The song has not withstood the test of time for me. The
> tune seems very stale now. If we go with MM I would go with 'Mai ri'
> or 'Baiyan na dharo'
>
>
>
> > > 5. wo to chale gaye ey dil
>
> > > This is merely to spite Jay :) No, but seriously, there are several
> > > songs in this category. But the restrained dejection (maut kaa
> > > intazaar kar) and resignation in this one is unparalleled.
>
> > Completely agree here too.
>
> Again, disagree. I too have never understood the RMIM fascination for
> Sajjad. Unique, yes. But there is too much happening in this song for
> it really to reach anywhere close to me. If I had to pick Sajjad I
> would pick 'Dil mein sama gaye sajan' and 'Darshan Pyasi' by Geeta
> Dutt. The only songs that really come on my radar from Sajjad. So I
> agree with Jay there :)!
>
>
>
> > > Rafi
> > > ------
>
> > > 1. man re tuu kaahe na dhiir dhare
>
> > > One of the best Rafi songs! How can this not make it?
>
> > Wouldn't make my list. "Aaj ki raat badi shokh badi natkhat hai" from
> > Nai Umar Ki Nai Fasal is hands down my favorite Rafi for Roshan
> > number.
>
> Roshan-Rafi : 'Man re' makes it more for the lyrics than for the tune
> or singing. I can't seem to recall too many Roshan-Rafi songs. Can
> someone jog my memory?
>
>
>
> > > 3. ba.ndaa parawar thaam lo jiigar
>
> > > The intoxicating Rafi-OP combination will crowd this space! But I
> > > picked a representative. To be honest, there are other songs of theirs
> > > which are as good (might even be better!)
>
> > Yes! - to your entire line of reasoning.
>
> A big Yes! from this side too. OPN-Rafi was indeed a magical
> combination. I daresay the best. And this song come high on my list as
> a representative of the genre. The same lingering smoothness
> accompanied by robustness in Rafi's voice that set him apart (IMO) is
> ah! so beautifully apparent here.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > > Kishore
> > > -----------
>
> > > 1. ba.Dii suunii suunii hai
>
> > > KK has several lovely songs with SD. But here the old men deliver a
> > > rare sentimental beauty for that time period. KK's voice had matured
> > > nicely and fit the song like a glove. Honestly, there is no room for
> > > improvement in this song.
>
> > > 2. wo shaam kuchh ajiib thii
>
> > > In spite of some minor enunciation problems, this is a winner. I like
> > > the tune, I love the singing.
>
> > > 3. beqaraar-e-dil tuu gaaye jaa
>
> > > Partly a tribute to KK the composer. There is a slight tendency
> > > towards high entropy, but I love the change in pace throughout the
> > > song. The piano work complements the voices beautifully.
>
> > > 4. zindagii kaa safar
>
> > > How can one ignore the KK-Kaka-RD phenomenon? One of my favs from
> > > their stables.
>
> > > 5. nakharewaalii
>
> > > Surprise! The lilt, the low vocal range work, the yodelling, all KK
> > > trademarks come to the fore in this song.
>
> > I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
> > would be just replacing one gem with another.
>
> KK-SDB never appealed to me that much. Esp. in the solos (could also
> be because I started out with that genre and have suitably over-played
> them. Whatever be the case the combo has not withstood the test of
> time for me apart from a few songs)
>
>
>
>
>
> > Shalini
>
> > > C- Hide quoted text -
>
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Srinivas Ganti
> Here are a few of the Roshan-Rafi gems which might interest you:
> 1. Ek Haseen Sham ko..Dil Mera Kho Gaya..
This is by Madan Mohan
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
> regularity on their Best of, Greatest hits, Rare Gems, Legends etc .
> anthologies. All rank bad songs.
> bairan nii.nd na aaye (Chacha Zindabaad)
> vo bhuulii daastaa.N (Sanjog)
Overrated, yes, but not the travesties you describe IMO.
> un aa.Nkho.n me.n nii.nd kahaa.N (Minister ?)
> sajanaa lagan terii sone na de (?)
What in particular do you find so offensive about these?
> maane naa, maane naa haay balam paradesiyaa (Yuck !!)
> merii aa.Nkho.n se koii nii.nd liye jaataa hai (Pooja Ke Phool)
More aligned with you on *these* - I am not fond of "Nainon Men Pyaar
Dole" (Sheroo) either.
Sanjeev
Arunabha
<sanjeev.ramabhad...@gmail.com>
> > regularity on their Best of, Greatest hits, Rare Gems, Legends etc .
> > anthologies. All rank bad songs.
> > bairan nii.nd na aaye (Chacha Zindabaad)
> > vo bhuulii daastaa.N (Sanjog)
> Overrated, yes, but not the travesties you describe IMO.
>
> > un aa.Nkho.n me.n nii.nd kahaa.N (Minister ?)
> > sajanaa lagan terii sone na de (?)
> What in particular do you find so offensive about these?
Sanjeev,
You've asked a good question that is difficult to answer.
Some of these Madan Mohan songs do play well inside one's head (basic
melody, singer's delivery etc) But they are songs that I have
consistently fast forwarded whenever they occur in the course of some
collection of songs that I am playing. "sajanaa lagan terii" and
"bairan nii.nd na aaye" are very unappealing to me because of the
Thekaa used. "un aa.Nkho.n me.n" I have a very vague recollection of .
As for "vo bhuulii daastaa.N" now that you put a gun to my head I
can't explain why I don't like it - I think the antaras are very
monotonous and it is a very long song. I'll concede your point about
it not being as bad as I "made it out to be. it was.
But this general thing of songs that you like to hum but
not listen to is something I find very intriguing.
-- Arunabha
Archisman Mozumder
> > Roshan-Rafi : 'Man re' makes it more for the lyrics than for the tune
> > or singing. I can't seem to recall too many Roshan-Rafi songs. Can
> > someone jog my memory?
>
> Ritu,
> Here are a few of the Roshan-Rafi gems which might interest you:
> 1. Ek Haseen Sham ko..Dil Mera Kho Gaya..
> 2. Paao Chhoo Lene Do, Phoolon ko Inayat Hogi..
> 3. Jo Baat Tujh mein Hai..
> 4. Aapne Yaad Dilaya to Mujhe Yaad Aaya.. (I love it and someone here
> has rightly included it in his list of favourites)
>
> -Manish
Dear Manish, Ritu,
Some more Rafi-Roshan beauties
ab kya misaal doon - aarti
tum ek baar mohabbat ka imtihaan - babar (an absolute beauty)
hum intezaar karenge - bahu begum
dil jo na keh saka - bheegi raat
chaa gaye baadal - chitralekha (with Asha-tai)
mehfil se uth jaane waalon - dooj ka chaand (100% justice done to
Sahir's poetry)
gham-e-hasti se - wallah kya baat hain
Except, perhaps, for the song from 'bheegi raat', all others showcase
Roshan's rare greatness of composing soothing, un-hurried but divine
compositions. Completely non-jarring, be it the tonal quality of the
singers or the preludes & interludes. His songs (specially sung by
Rafi-saab) were like pristine, flowing brooks.
To continue my Roshan-admiration further, if one were to make an audio
CD of about 15 odd songs of Lata solos composed by Roshan, it will
stand as luminous as any other similar CD of Lata - Madan, Lata- CR,
Lata - SDB, or Lata - Salil, Lata - Anil B etc.
Regards.
Sathya Sekar
a lot of Madan's songs for Lata unappealing for me. They may all be
good songs, but they just dont stand out. You can predict exactly the
interlude music, the orchestration and even the tune at times. There
are few songs that surprise you or make you rush to the "Repeat"
button on your music player. "chaa.Nd madham hai", "hamaare baad ab
mehafil me" are such melodies for me, with "Aashiyaanaa" being one of
my favorite Lata-Madan tracks overall.
For a CR-bhakt like me, the 70% figure of Arunabha on CR-Lata is
flabbergasting - but I can see where he may be coming from. The
problem with Madan recurs with CR too but then for me, Lata's extra
sweetness in CR's compositions makes even the most mundane songs rise
above their ordinariness. There is also always the anticipation that
you would hear something out of the ordinary with CR.In percentage
terms, my split of CR-Lata melodies would be 30-50-20 (great-good-
average or bad).
Roshan's Lata compositions during the 50s - or the early 50s to be
more specitic- are of such a calibre that his more popular
compositions during the 60s are quite lame in comparison. Of course,
there are the occasional gems as in "Taj Mahal" and "Chitralekhaa" but
then I cant recall a single song during this period to remotely match
"kisakii nazar kaa mast ishaaraa" and "dekhojii meraa jiyaa". The
songs of "Devar", "Noorjehan" and a couple other tracks during the
later 60s would walk into my most-disliked list of Lata.
There are quite a few Salil compositions for Lata that I find really
terrible - "beTaa wow wow wow" is a song that I just cant bear to hear
- but they are never boring :)
Barring a few top-notch beauties like "phailii huii hai" and "chaa.Nd
phir nikalaa", S.D.Burman's songs for Lata have never appealed much to
me. Their songs from "Guide" fall into my worst songs list !!
But finally, the one Lata song that I find ever-unendurable is "maine
kab tumase kahaa" from "Ram aur shyaam" - totally flat and dull,
illustrating all that was wrong with Naushad's music during the 60s.
Manish Wadhane
Oops... Thanks Srini. Sorry for the goofup Ritu.
kcp
> > I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
> > would be just replacing one gem with another.
>
> This song, I find KK faltering here and there.
Pray tell me what was that !! If it is too cerebral, forget it :-)
kcp
Manish Kumar
On Apr 30, 3:18 am, Sathya Sekar <sathya.se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>S.D.Burman's songs for Lata have never appealed much to
> me. Their songs from "Guide" fall into my worst songs list !!
Let me guess - you didn't like the opening lines of Aaj Phir Jeene Ki
Tamana Hai. You thought it was too shrill on the ears. That's
reasonable.
The emotions in that song will bring you back to life even if you're
coming from the gutter. The personality that Lata puts into it will
attract listeners and impose itself on the actress to give her greater
presence. Lata sings with such energy that the song will have
immediate impact (usually positive) on any listener who must take
notice. Aaj Phir Jeene Ki Tamanah had such a lively effect on me
during the first time I heard it. You don't need to be an experienced
listener or actively ponder on the song to fully enjoy it. This last
quality doesn't make the song better than others but it is a
remarkable trait.
This song alone must have done wonders for the success of Guide. Dev
Anand's greatest accomplishment in his entire career was delaying the
production ofthe film by at least 6 months - just to wait for SD to
recover his health and finish the score. I would still say that the
song should be judged as a whole rather than a few parts and with that
measure - this song as the worst of Lata is a bouncer. Of course - we
have different ways of looking at things and that's cool.
Srinivas Ganti
>
> On Apr 30, 3:18 am, Sathya Sekar <sathya.se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >S.D.Burman's songs for Lata have never appealed much to
> > me. Their songs from "Guide" fall into my worst songs list !!
>
> Let me guess - you didn't like the opening lines of Aaj Phir Jeene Ki
> Tamana Hai. You thought it was too shrill on the ears. That's
> reasonable.
>
> The emotions in that song will bring you back to life even if you're
> coming from the gutter. The personality that Lata puts into it will
> attract listeners and impose itself on the actress to give her greater
> presence. Lata sings with such energy that the song will have
> immediate impact (usually positive) on any listener who must take
> notice. Aaj Phir Jeene Ki Tamanah had such a lively effect on me
> during the first time I heard it. You don't need to be an experienced
> listener or actively ponder on the song to fully enjoy it. This last
> quality doesn't make the song better than others but it is a
> remarkable trait.
Very well said. Wile this song is good "piya tose naina laage re" is
even better.
Abhijit
> In my own view, it is the predictability of compositions that renders
> a lot of Madan's songs for Lata unappealing for me. They may all be
> good songs, but they just dont stand out. You can predict exactly the
> interlude music, the orchestration and even the tune at times.
I am with you on this. This commonality makes a CD of MM-Lata
combination (which I unfortunately possess) too boring to play. I
might like the songs individually when played with other songs. But
when they all play one after the other, I find same pattern is being
repeated.
>
> Barring a few top-notch beauties like "phailii huii hai" and "chaa.Nd
> phir nikalaa", S.D.Burman's songs for Lata have never appealed much to
> me. Their songs from "Guide" fall into my worst songs list !!
>
I have to differ here. As Manish pointed out, "aaj phir jiine kii
tamannaa" has the power to create an environment full of energy out of
nothing. I like songs that create a mood they are intednded to while
listening even though you may be in a different mood. "ra.ngilaa re"
and "jaise raadhaa ne maalaa japii" are other similar songs. But I
would give more credit to SDB than Lata for these.
Manish Kumar
> On Apr 29, 8:05 am, Manish Kumar <mkum...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Kya Hua Tera Wada: Categorizing this as worst was a real bouncer. It
> > is a decent song. The only part I didn't like was the middle with
> > children singing. The voice and emotions were both 4/5 (for this
> > particular performance).
>
> I went "purely on the merit of singing" rather than composition to
> include this song as one of the worsts. Really I find it hard to
> tolerate "yaad hai mujhako"/"o kahane waale" parts, just as I find
> "tumhaarii reshamii zulfo.n me.n dil ke phuul khilate hai.n" in
> "suhaanii chaa.Ndanii raate.n". Both are nice compositions
> 'barbaadified' by poor singing, maybe because of ageing of the singers
> concerned.
I understand where you are coming from with the lines that you pointed
of Kya Hua Tera Vaada. Some people don't like the high pitch approach
to a sad song. Just a matter of different tastes. I liked it very
much. It added the dramatic touch to a turning point scene. I
especially sensed the sadness and suffering of the character in the
way those lines were rendered. Our 180 views just show how subjective
music can be. However, since you faulted the singer, perhaps you don't
object to high pitch (MD's design) but Rafi's singing itself. If that
is the case - I subjectively disagree. HKKN was one of Rafi's better
performances in the late 70s.
Abhijit
Well, I know he won National Award for that, but that was more
honorary than anything. Yes, I have no problem with composition of the
song, only singing. And I am talking only about this song, not the
whole album. He sounds good in "ye la.Dakaa haay allaa", "chaa.Nd
meraa dil" and "hai agar dushman".
Manish Kumar
Filmfare Awards, National Awards, or the Binaca Geet Mala mean zilch
to me (no kidding). None of them are reliable indicators of quality.
As I said, I definitely understand where you're coming from. Each to
his own different tastes. It's all good.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> > > I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
> > > would be just replacing one gem with another.
>
> > This song, I find KK faltering here and there.
>
> Pray tell me what was that !! If it is too cerebral, forget it :-)
I said that KK did not sing the Prem Pujari song perfectly. Remember
that in spite of all the sentimental choices that we all make this
thread was about best, perfectly-sung songs. Yes, some of that
assessment is cerebral. You need to tell me what is "too cerebral" for
you :)
C
kcp
> On Apr 30, 6:46 pm, kcp <kcpin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > > > I would subsitute "phoolon ke rang se" for one of the above, but that
> > > > would be just replacing one gem with another.
>
> > > This song, I find KK faltering here and there.
>
> > Pray tell me what was that !! If it is too cerebral, forget it :-)
>
> I said that KK did not sing the Prem Pujari song perfectly.
just tell me about this. ...rest we have given enough crap to the
world of internet :D
Sathya Sekar
> I have to differ here. As Manish pointed out, "aaj phir jiine kii
> tamannaa" has the power to create an environment full of energy out of
> nothing. I like songs that create a mood they are intednded to while
> listening even though you may be in a different mood. "ra.ngilaa re"
> and "jaise raadhaa ne maalaa japii" are other similar songs. But I
> would give more credit to SDB than Lata for these.
I love atmospheric songs too - a "chaa.Nd madham hai" or numerous
Jaidev songs including "tuu sach batalaa mujhe jogii" and the Chetan-
maligned "hai kahii.n par shaadamaanii" do it for me. The "Guide"
songs dont do so. I find Lata too shrill and the music too loud for my
hearing in the "aaj phir jiine kii tamannaa hai" song while "piyaa
tose" I find too boring :) For a SDB classical piece, I would stick
with "ghaayal hiraniyaa", "saajan bin ni.nd naa aaye" or "pavan
diivaanii".
I know that "Guide" commands enormous popularity and has a cult
following as evidenced by it turning up tops amongst SDB's albums in
Vinay's poll. Unfortunately, I just find it totally unendurable from a
Lata perspective. Burmanda's "yahaa.N kaun teraa" and Rafi's "din Dhal
jaaye" are the songs worth multiple hearings for me.
- Sathya
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> just tell me about this. ...rest we have given enough crap to the
> world of internet :D
"We"?? :)
As an example of imperfection (which can be understood without too
much cerebral activity :) ) is the way he sings likhii. He
mispronounces it as "liikhii". He could have taken a brief pause
before the word, sort of llike between "pal pal" and "mujhe tuu
sataatii". That could have helped him overcome this imperfection.
There might have been other ways of solving this problem...
C
kcp
ok got it !! as usual we all added some more cerebral crap :P
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> ok got it !! as usual we all added some more cerebral crap :P
We again??
What did you expect KCP? You asked me for clarification on
imperfections I perceived. I gave a clarification. You can either
agree or disagree and we can debate on the virtue of my allegation. If
you are not willing to get into this debate, well, you should not have
asked for it! You know, it isn't necessary for you to put your finger
into every KK discussion :)
C
AR
> kab tumase kahaa" from "Ram aur shyaam" - totally flat and dull,
> illustrating all that was wrong with Naushad's music during the 60s.
>
I dont' recall this particular song, but I disagree with the assertion
that Naushad's music was dull during the 60s. All or most of the songs
of films such as Mere Mehboob, Leader, Dil Diya Dard Liya, Saaz aur
Awaaz, Ganga Jamuna and Palki are wonderful works of art. Mere
Mehboob has songs such as "Ae husn zaraa jaag tujhhe", "hum to izhaar-
e-haal kar baithhe" and "yaad mein teri jaag jaag ke hum" which rank
amongst Rafi's finest. These songs are replete with beautiful
interludes and Rafi's singing is simply outstanding.
Leader has two beautiful Rafi-Lata duets, of which "ek shahenshah
ne.." is nothing but a masterpiece. It's a confluence of excellent
music direction, lyrics and singing. The prelude and the interludes of
this song are marvels. I really wonder what part of songs such as
"saawan aaye ya na aaye", "rasiya tuu badaa bedardi", "koi saagar dil
ko behlaataa nahin" and "kya rang-e-mehfil hai dildarum" (all from Dil
Diya Dard Liya) one would find dull. And the film Palki has the
choiciest ghazals such as "dil ki kashti", "jaanewaale tera khuda
haafiz" and "dil-e-betaabi ko seene se lagaana hogaa". Coming to Ram
aur Shyam, I consider "aaj ki raat mere.." to be one of Rafi's finest
again.
Continuing further, I can never tire of listening to Lata gems such as
"kaari badariyaa" and "kal ke sapane aaj bhi aanaa", just for their
simplicity.
To characterize such a wide variety of songs as dull is a bit of a
stretch, but then each to his own.
kcp
> On May 1, 4:40 pm, kcp <kcpin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > ok got it !! as usual we all added some more cerebral crap :P
>
> We again??
Ofcourse :-)
>
> What did you expect KCP? You asked me for clarification on
> imperfections I perceived. I gave a clarification.
Ofcourse a cerebrally confused ( self confessed ) Chetan gives a
clarification !!! wow !!
>You can either
> agree or disagree and we can debate on the virtue of my allegation.
Ofcourse I disagree ( it is not a rocket science like you , or some
other RMIMers always intend it to be, by posting crap on pitch, sur,
taal, etc, especially in Kishore songs ) It is simply the way Hindi/
Devnaagri is written and understood and perceived. And I dont think
you are qualified enough to understand the exact way of pronunciation
of "Kishore" in this "likhii". He has pronounced "likhii" and the
joining of "ko" in the "tujhako" to ""li" in the "likhii" is a
typical Kishore pronumciation, which your "thick head" ( sorry for
repeating the same terminology again for you but you forced me to use
it with lack of any other word in this Kishore-discussion ) will NEVER
understand.
>If
> you are not willing to get into this debate, well, you should not have
> asked for it!
I just wanted to avoid more crap but you thought that you were
qualified in this matter of Hindi/Devnaagri , so wanted to let you
know that you are not.
>I asked for some meaningful
>You know, it isn't necessary for you to put your finger
> into every KK discussion :)
Hahaha !! look who is saying it !! It is not necessary to put your
finger when I put my finger in a Kishore discussion.
KCP
Hema
> A recent thread on tasveer teri dil mein has seen a lot of heated
> discussion on the merits of the singers. It would be interesating to
> know what the connoisseurs here think are the best five and the worst
> five songs of the following masters. Purely on the merit of singing.
>
> 1.Lata Mangeshkar
> 2.Asha Bhosle
> 3.Kishore Kumar
> 4.Mohd Rafi
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bhavana
There are so many good and bad songs by these singers that it is
impossible to come up with five best and worst songs. But these days
there is so much of "itsy bitsy spider" crawling through my head that
its really refreshing to think about even "ruk ja ae hawa" for
example. From what I can remember right now my list for KK would
include "thandi hawa ye chandni suhani" and "aaj mujhe kuch kehna
hai". KK's expression in these songs is just extraordinary IMO. I
agree with others about atleast one Rafi-OPN song in Rafi's list. I
would pick "bahut shukriya". Rafi is at his flirtatious best. :) For
Asha my top 5 would be all marathi. And as for Lata, I had a rmim
commemorative tape (the first one? I think it was called "atmjh") that
was a very cherished treasure for me. Unfortunately, that tape was
among the few that got destroyed a few years ago by accident in my
car. Atleast a couple of those songs would have made it in the Lata
list for me. My mind is so taken over by the twinkling little stars
and black sheeps that I can't even remember those songs right now.
Hema.
UVR
Hema,
Speaking of twinkling stars, here's a superlative Lata song
that'll fit right into your current "life" :) --
ha.Nse Tim Tim Tim chhoTe chhoTe taare
Lata-Shailendra-Roshan in Sanskaar
It's been in the forefront of *our* lives for 3+ years and there's
no reason it won't be there for a few more!
-UVR.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Ofcourse a cerebrally confused ( self confessed ) Chetan
Excuse me? Self-confessed??
> Ofcourse I disagree ( it is not a rocket science like you , or some
> other RMIMers always intend it to be, by posting crap on pitch, sur,
> taal, etc, especially in Kishore songs )
Well, this entire discussion was about perfection in singing. Pray why
do you think KK and KK alone is above the bounds of sur-taal? On
second thoughts, don't tell me. It is pointless to try talking reason
with fundamentalists.
> I just wanted to avoid more crap but you thought that you were
> qualified in this matter of Hindi/Devnaagri , so wanted to let you
> know that you are not.
Thanks for the edification, o exalted one!
> Hahaha !! look who is saying it !! It is not necessary to put your
> finger when I put my finger in a Kishore discussion.
What have you been smoking? You asked me a pointed question on this
thread! And I responded to it! <sheesh>
C
Sathya Sekar
Well, those last few words sum this whole thread all up. Celebrated
numbers as "tum kyaa jaano", "hai kahii.n par shaadamaanii" and tracks
as "Guide" and an overall output of CR have falled into the "Worst"
bucket :)
While I concede that there were occasional old sparks in "Mere
Mehboob" and songs from a few other films during the 60s, IMO
Naushad's music during the decade missed the vibrance of his
compositions during the 40s through the early 50s. The "Ram aur Shyam"
song is available on MIO:
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/p/x/IAmmctF4o9.As1NMvHdW/
Give it a hear only if you are brave enough :)
- Sathya
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> And as for Lata, I had a rmim
> commemorative tape (the first one? I think it was called "atmjh") that
> was a very cherished treasure for me.
Too bad you lost the tape! This was the second East coast
commemorative. Abhi To Main Jawan Hun, June 1997, Washington DC meet.
Here is the song list:
Side A:
1. va.nde maatarm, Anand Math (52), Trad (Bankim Chandra), Hemant
Kumar
2. abhii to mai.n jawaan huu.N, Afsana (51), Ghafil Harnalvi, Husnalal-
Bhagatram
3. haaye cha.ndaa gaye parades, Chakori (49), Mulkraj Bhakhri, Hansraj
Behl
4. ik pal ruk jaanaa (both versions), Rahi (53), Prem Dhawan, Anil
Biswas
5. aa.Nsuu_o.n kii chhaa.Nv me.n, Parichay (54), Akhtar Yusuf,
Shailesh
6. o duur ke musaafir (brief), Uran Khatola (55), Shakeel, Naushad
7. mat samajho niir bahaatii huu.n, Naata (55), Tanvir Naqvi,
S.Mohinder
8. teraa dard dil me.n basaa liyaa, Rukhsana (55), Khumar Barabankvi,
Sajjad
9. jogiyaa se priit kiye dukh hoye, Garm Coat (55), Trad (Meera),
Pt.Amarnath
10. pyaar kii ye talaKiyaa.N, Sardar (55), Kaif Irfani, Jagmohan
'Sursagar'
11. cha.ndramaa madabharaa, Patrani (56), Shailendra, Shankar-
Jaikishen
12. havaa hai sard sard (both versions), Shatranj (56), Rajinder
Krishan, C.Ramchandra
Side B:
1. dil jalegaa to zamaane me.n ujaalaa hogaa, Yeh Basti Yeh Log (50s),
Prem Barabartani, Bhola Shreshtha
2. laagii nahii.n chhuuTe raam (brief), Musafir (57), Shailendra,
Salil Chowdhury
3. morii paayal giit sunaaye, Baap Bete (59), Rajinder Krishan, Madan
Mohan
4. mai.n tumahii se puuchhatii huu.N (brief), Black Cat (59), Jaan
Nisar Akhtar, N.Dutta
5. maa.njhii merii qismat ke, Hum Hindustani (60), Rajinder Krishan,
Usha Khanna
6. sajanaa kaahe bhuul gaye din pyaar ke, Chan Mere Aaja (60), Prem
Dhawan, Chitragupta
7. cha.ndaa Dhale pa.nkhaa jhale, Pyar Ki Pyas (61), Bharat Vyas,
Vasant Desai
8. piyaa milan kii aas, Piya Milan Ki Aas (61), Bharat Vyas,
S.N.Tripathi
9. khudaa-e-baratar terii zamii.n par, Taj Mahal (63), Sahir, Roshan
10. har aas ashkabaar hai, Kinare Kinare (63), ,Nyay Sharma, Jaidev
11. n abaaz aayaa muqaddar, Sunehra Kadam (66), Mahendra Pran, Bulo C.
Rani
12. sun man ke miit mere prem giit, Mrig Trishna (75), Shambhu Sen,
Shambhu Sen
13. barase ghan saarii raat, Tarang (84), Raghuvir Sahay, Vanraj
Bhatia
C
Srinivas Ganti
> On May 2, 1:10 am, Hema <h...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > And as for Lata, I had a rmim
> > commemorative tape (the first one? I think it was called "atmjh") that
> > was a very cherished treasure for me.
>
> Too bad you lost the tape! This was the second East coast
> commemorative. Abhi To Main Jawan Hun, June 1997, Washington DC meet.
> Here is the song list:
>
> Side A:
> 1. va.nde maatarm, Anand Math (52), Trad (Bankim Chandra), Hemant
> Kumar
Thanks for the list Chetan. You missed a very important component
though that it begins
with AIR signature tune :)
This tape is very dear to me as it is one of those that converted me
from a Lata fan to a Lata bhakt !
Srinivas.
Chetan Vinchhi
>
> Thanks for the list Chetan. You missed a very important component
> though that it begins
> with AIR signature tune :)
Its nice of you to remember! Just to let you into a little secret,
that is not the original tune as played on the airwaves but was
reproduced by a friend (an RMIMer actually).
> This tape is very dear to me as it is one of those that converted me
> from a Lata fan to a Lata bhakt !
I suppose that is a good thing :) Anyway, the point of commemoratives
was to expose people to good/great songs they might otherwise have
been deprived of! I am glad at least two folks in this thread have
identified these efforts to have contributed to the evolution of their
musical tastes!
C
Prithviraj Dasgupta
I recently got an LP titled "From Lata with Love" from 1960-s that has
the very popular songs of Lata (Yaad rakhna, tum na jaane, rasik
balma, saajan ki galiyan, ye zindagi, etc.) Amidst these songs, there
is this lesser-heard Garam Coat gem 'jogiya se preet lagi'. I knew
for sure I had heard this song somewhere before, but was unable to
find it...and many of us know how that feeling is. So, thanks for
posting this track listing - now I know where I have/heard it.
-pdg/
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
> On Apr 30, 3:18 am, Sathya Sekar <sathya.se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > But finally, the one Lata song that I find ever-unendurable is "maine
> > kab tumase kahaa" from "Ram aur shyaam" - totally flat and dull,
> > illustrating all that was wrong with Naushad's music during the 60s.
I found this song in my iPod (it came pre-loaded by a friend with some
songs) and had the same reaction. With the exception of "Aaj Ki Raat
Mere Dil Ki Salaami Lele" which is not bad, the Ram Aur Shyaam
soundtrack is a tired one.
> I dont' recall this particular song, but I disagree with the assertion
> that Naushad's music was dull during the 60s. All or most of the songs
> of films such as Mere Mehboob, Leader, Dil Diya Dard Liya, Saaz aur
> Awaaz, Ganga Jamuna and Palki are wonderful works of art. Mere
> Mehboob has songs such as "Ae husn zaraa jaag tujhhe", "hum to izhaar-
> e-haal kar baithhe" and "yaad mein teri jaag jaag ke hum" which rank
> amongst Rafi's finest. These songs are replete with beautiful
> interludes and Rafi's singing is simply outstanding.
I am fond of Mere Mehboob (the song is "Tumse Izhaar-e-Haal..."). I am
okay with rest of your list except for Palki, which is typified for me
by the seemingly never-ending "Kal Raat Zindagi Se"...Naushad seemed
to be trying to repeat Mere Mehboob without success. I like the
composition of "Dil-e-Betaab" but I listened to it after many years
when I played it on "Swaraanjali" a few weeks ago. Rafi's voice has
not hit a steep decline, but the singing is quite belabored IMO, which
seems to be a major source of ire against the Naushad of the 60s.
Sanjeev
Srinivas Ganti
> On May 2, 8:25 pm, Srinivas Ganti <sga...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Thanks for the list Chetan. You missed a very important component
> > though that it begins
> > with AIR signature tune :)
>
> Its nice of you to remember! Just to let you into a little secret,
> that is not the original tune as played on the airwaves but was
> reproduced by a friend (an RMIMer actually).
Whats the scoop on the instrumental music of "o nirdayi priitam" ?
It fades in and out giving the impression that it was recorded from a
shortwave channel like Radio ceylon !
Another thing I love about this tape is the dialgoues before "havaa
hai sard sard".
When I try to imitiate Ashok Kumar before my friends I keep using
those words
" *huffing and puffing*......main bahut pareshaan huuN" :)
> > This tape is very dear to me as it is one of those that converted me
> > from a Lata fan to a Lata bhakt !
>
> I suppose that is a good thing :) Anyway, the point of commemoratives
> was to expose people to good/great songs they might otherwise have
> been deprived of! I am glad at least two folks in this thread have
> identified these efforts to have contributed to the evolution of their
> musical tastes!
Yes. I will have to say that they have influenced him more than me. He
has even
switched camps :)
Srinivas.
UVR
> On May 2, 8:25 pm, Srinivas Ganti <sga...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for the list Chetan. You missed a very important component
> > though that it begins
> > with AIR signature tune :)
>
> Its nice of you to remember! Just to let you into a little secret,
> that is not the original tune as played on the airwaves but was
> reproduced by a friend (an RMIMer actually).
>
Why the secrecy? Wasn't it Balaji?
-UVR.
Chetan Vinchhi
No secrecy. Just checking if anyone actually reads the inlays :) Yes,
Balaji on the keyboard as mentioned in the credits.
C
Manish Kumar
very good or one that are commercially very popular - but have some
kind of short coming. I'm surprised no one mentioned Rafi's Babul Ki
Dua (perhaps it was "too obvious"). I'm sure most of you are aware but
I'll mention again: As Rafi was putting his heart into the song during
the recording, he remembered his own daughter whom he gave away just 2
days ago. Of course, the song was exactly for the occasion of a father
wishing away his daughter. So as he remembered that he actually cried.
After this take, he offered music director Ravi to do another take
where he would control his own memories / emotions - but Ravi insisted
on keeping exactly that take! This is the only time this has happened.
Given the special circumstances, I can't hold this song against Rafi.
Excellent composition from Ravi!